View Full Version : Plans to build my hypothetical "dream" AR...
PatrioticDisorder
11-20-13, 13:30
AXTS Lower
VLTOR MUR Upper
Noveske light contour SS barrel, 14.5" with AAC Blackout FH PA
BCM Gunfighter Mod 0 grip
Magpul UBR Stock
BCM ION BONDED M16 BCG
Giessele SD-E
BCM Keymod rail 13"
Magpul PRO BUIS (front and rear)
Raptor Charging handle
BAD-ASS
Noveske QD Endplate
LPK I'm open to suggestions if anyone has any.
For an optic I'll probably go with a T1 with ADM 1/3 lower cowitness mount. God willing if I could build a second dream build I think I'd go with an 18" Noveske light contour SS barrel and put a high quality 1-6 on it with offset irons. For a light I think I'd go with a surefire M600 Ultra with SRO7.
Without optic and light pricing out parts it will easily go $2,200 if not a bit more. So any thoughts or suggestions?
With regard to the LPK, the AX556 comes with a number of parts. Assuming you are going to provide trigger, grip, selector, here is a list of Colt brand ala cart parts you'll need with Brownells part numbers:
2x Colt Detent Pin, PN 160-308-115WB, $4.49 ea. (8.98)
2x Colt Take down Pin Detent Spring, PN 160-308-114WB, $5.99 ea. (11.98)
1x Colt Buffer Retainer, PN 160-308-110WB, $8.99 ea.
1x Colt Buffer Retainer Spring, PN 160-308-111WB, $5.99 ea.
1x Colt Bolt Catch Plunger, PN 160-308-103WB, $3.99 ea.
1x Colt Bolt Catch Spring, PN 160-308-104WB, $5.99 ea.
1x Colt Takedown pin, PN 160-308-140WB, $11.99 ea. *
* The AX556 needs a longer pivot pin, which they provide. While the above Colt takedown should work fine, optimally I'd use the Battle Arms pin set, but it is fairly expensive considering you probably won't use the pivot due to the length issue. BAD says they will produce an AX556 pin set which would be perfect. In the mean time, I'd use the Noveske takedown (which is what I did). Note the Noveske pins do NOT come with detent pins or detent springs, so you still need those parts as noted above.
Also note I've seen a report or two about fitment issues with the VLTOR MUR and the Raptor on this site, you might want to look into that.
-john
Why that barrel? What do you intend to do with this build?
Where did you find a BCM Ion bonded BCG? I recommend the Bobro T1 mount.
AXTS Lower
VLTOR MUR Upper
Noveske light contour SS barrel, 14.5" with AAC Blackout FH PA
BCM Gunfighter Mod 0 grip
Magpul UBR Stock
BCM ION BONDED M16 BCG
Giessele SD-E
BCM Keymod rail 13"
Magpul PRO BUIS (front and rear)
Raptor Charging handle
BAD-ASS
Noveske QD Endplate
LPK I'm open to suggestions if anyone has any.
For an optic I'll probably go with a T1 with ADM 1/3 lower cowitness mount. God willing if I could build a second dream build I think I'd go with an 18" Noveske light contour SS barrel and put a high quality 1-6 on it with offset irons. For a light I think I'd go with a surefire M600 Ultra with SRO7.
Without optic and light pricing out parts it will easily go $2,200 if not a bit more. So any thoughts or suggestions?
Also note I've seen a report or two about fitment issues with the VLTOR MUR and the Raptor on this site, you might want to look into that.
That report was from me and Vltor is trying to determine the cause of the issue. They said it's the first time they've ever had a customer have fitment issues with any charging handle in a MUR, so I wouldn't be too worried about it happening to you.
That report was from me and Vltor is trying to determine the cause of the issue. They said it's the first time they've ever had a customer have fitment issues with any charging handle in a MUR, so I wouldn't be too worried about it happening to you.
Interesting Vltor said that. My brand new MUR is currently at Vltor because none of my standard or BCM charging handles fit it.
PatrioticDisorder
11-21-13, 07:35
Why that barrel? What do you intend to do with this build?
I want it to be dead nuts accurate, same reason I think anyone would want a SS Novekse no? I intend to do with it the same as my other 2 AR's (both close to stock DDM4s) and that is HD, carbine classes and general range use.
PatrioticDisorder
11-21-13, 07:38
Where did you find a BCM Ion bonded BCG? I recommend the Bobro T1 mount.
In stock? None at the moment, is there something I should know about this BCG? I'd be buying it simply because of the reported extra slickness and ease of cleaning. I suppose any BCG including standard BCG with a good rep would do. It's just with this rifle I'm going to piece it together over the next several months and want to build as well built a rifle as I can.
Eurodriver
11-21-13, 08:31
I want it to be dead nuts accurate, same reason I think anyone would want a SS Novekse no? I intend to do with it the same as my other 2 AR's (both close to stock DDM4s) and that is HD, carbine classes and general range use.
Dead nuts accurate = more weight, shorter life, and more expensive.
Can you shoot to the accuracy potential of a Noveske SS barrel? Or rather, can you outshoot a BCM LW barrel? If you're using a T1 and not using match grade ammunition (and in carbine classes, I hope you're not) then the answer is no.
A BCM 14.5" LW Middy barrel is $220 cheaper, 9 oz lighter, and will probably last longer than a Noveske SS barrel.
Buy a Noveske SS barrel if you plan on stretching it's legs and maximizing accuracy with good ammunition.
Of course, it's your money and Noveske is a great company. So do what you wish...
Edit: What's up with the Blackout flash hider? That's expensive and heavy. Do you suppress it?
I'm only trying to help you not make the same mistakes I did. I wanted a dead nuts accurate "jack of all trades" rifle so I bought a 12.5" SS from BCM. It shoots great out to 565 yards but it's heavy (even unsuppressed) for close in work considering it's an SBR. It does everything, but it's excellent at nothing. There's no free lunch. Best to sit down, think about exactly what you want this rifle to do - and then go in that direction.
http://i1328.photobucket.com/albums/w521/6234987u02/ResizedImage_1374247727267_zps81e492ad.jpg
Don't ever consider it the end all be all. New gear will be out next week and you'll want to change something. That's one of the main reasons I wish I hadn't gone 14.5" pinned on one of my guns. I've also found, like the above poster, most of the time you won't be able to shoot to the potential of the gear anyway. I shoot "tactical precision rifle matches" and most shooters won't shoot MOA or even 1 1/2 MOA through the course of fire, despite owning $3500 optics and $5000 1/4 MOA rifles. People just simply aren't as good a shooter in real life as they like to think they are on the internet. I've been humbled multiple times myself missing 2 MOA targets in field positions the week after taking first in F-Class.
I think your choices are great. My personal preference aside.
For the LPK I'd look at getting some parts from LMT, Spikes, etc. By the time you put this together AXTS may have their uppers out.
I'd consider changing that UBR stock. Your gun will be very rear heavy. The UBR gives me the most comfortable cheekweld I've found, but I go for a CTR because of the weight. Another thing to consider is the AX556 was made to fit Magpul grips. That BCM grip will work fine but it'll feel like you mounted it on a normal lower.
I think the weight difference between a BCM LW and that Noveske is closer than 9oz. I'm a big fan of 14.5" barrels and the Blackout flash hiders. If you do decide to go to a cheaper barrel, then wait for a complete BCM upper since you seem to be a BCM fan.
Sounds like a nice build, but it may be a very heavy 14.5". Your build will be about 8lbs not counting optics, light, magazine and ammo. The parts you've listed are probably gonna run you closer to $2,600 if you can find some of them parts.
They quit making them about 2 years ago as I recall so I doubt you will get one. You will be just as happy with a standard one. The tail of the bolt is where most carbon builds up.
In stock? None at the moment, is there something I should know about this BCG? I'd be buying it simply because of the reported extra slickness and ease of cleaning. I suppose any BCG including standard BCG with a good rep would do. It's just with this rifle I'm going to piece it together over the next several months and want to build as well built a rifle as I can.
PatrioticDisorder
11-21-13, 16:33
Dead nuts accurate = more weight, shorter life, and more expensive.
Can you shoot to the accuracy potential of a Noveske SS barrel? Or rather, can you outshoot a BCM LW barrel? If you're using a T1 and not using match grade ammunition (and in carbine classes, I hope you're not) then the answer is no.
A BCM 14.5" LW Middy barrel is $220 cheaper, 9 oz lighter, and will probably last longer than a Noveske SS barrel.
Buy a Noveske SS barrel if you plan on stretching it's legs and maximizing accuracy with good ammunition.
Of course, it's your money and Noveske is a great company. So do what you wish...
Edit: What's up with the Blackout flash hider? That's expensive and heavy. Do you suppress it?
I'm only trying to help you not make the same mistakes I did. I wanted a dead nuts accurate "jack of all trades" rifle so I bought a 12.5" SS from BCM. It shoots great out to 565 yards but it's heavy (even unsuppressed) for close in work considering it's an SBR. It does everything, but it's excellent at nothing. There's no free lunch. Best to sit down, think about exactly what you want this rifle to do - and then go in that direction.
http://i1328.photobucket.com/albums/w521/6234987u02/ResizedImage_1374247727267_zps81e492ad.jpg
Good point about putting a T-1 on the rifle, maybe if/when I get to a 2nd custom build I could put an 18" noveske SS barrel on with a quality 1-6 like the Leupy Mk6. Perhaps it would be wasted barrel, if I was to cut the noveske SS out I'd probably cut the UBR out as well as I only wanted that to balance the rifle... Regarding the AAC Blackout FH, no cans yet but because of the stupid NFA I was trying to think ahead. I'm a resident doc, so I've been on a budget but I anticipate I'll be moonlighting by the spring and when that happens I'm looking to start my stamp collection. Maybe I'll go with a griffin armament, surefire or KAC muzzle device but seems the consensus on cans for most people is AAC is a good way to go.
They quit making them about 2 years ago as I recall so I doubt you will get one. You will be just as happy with a standard one. The tail of the bolt is where most carbon builds up.
Thank you, I didn't realize these we're no longer made, so standard BCM BCG it is.
^^That's what I was trying to get at. I dont know how your DD's are config'ed but since you have those already, how about planning for an SBR instead?
I want it to be dead nuts accurate, same reason I think anyone would want a SS Novekse no? I intend to do with it the same as my other 2 AR's (both close to stock DDM4s) and that is HD, carbine classes and general range use.
PatrioticDisorder
11-21-13, 18:59
^^That's what I was trying to get at. I dont know how your DD's are config'ed but since you have those already, how about planning for an SBR instead?
I do want to get into the NFA game, however with our current scumbag in chief wanting to change the rules, I'll be waiting until spring to make a move. I still don't have a trust in place and I'm worried even if I had a trust and NFA items in the pipeline I'll still have to go through further bullshit and living in Palm Beach County, I'm pretty sure the PBSO sheriff isn't going to sign off on anything NFA related.
DD Mk18 is a rifle on my want list assuming the NFA rules don't get totally screwed. If they do get screwed I'll have to wait till I'm done with residency and carefully pick which county I reside in... Maybe I'll even build an AR similar to what ive described but in SBR 10.5" configuration.
Oh ok. I see your point. If it were me in your shoes, though, I would just do the 18" build. Like I said, I don't know how your current DD's are config'ed, just speaking from my own experience. Some years back, I settled for a couple of builds. I first ended up with a quality version of my first 2 shitty ARs which I later realized didn't quite fit my needs. After that, I built what I knew I wanted but settled for the wrong barrel all because I couldn't wait. I still have those 2 to this day but neither have seen any use since.
PatrioticDisorder
11-21-13, 20:13
Oh ok. I see your point. If it were me in your shoes, though, I would just do the 18" build. Like I said, I don't know how your current DD's are config'ed, just speaking from my own experience. Some years back, I settled for a couple of builds. I first ended up with a quality version of my first 2 shitty ARs which I later realized didn't quite fit my needs. After that, I built what I knew I wanted but settled for the wrong barrel all because I couldn't wait. I still have those 2 to this day but neither have seen any use since.
I agree with the 18" build if I go with the Noveske SS Barrel after thinking it through, that is why I started the thread, good to get feedback. Can't wait to start this build and post up some pics when it's complete!
I agree with the 18" build if I go with the Noveske SS Barrel after thinking it through, that is why I started the thread, good to get feedback. Can't wait to start this build and post up some pics when it's complete!
Shorter barrels are more accurate due to more rigidity. I'd stick with 16" if accuracy at range and terminal ballistics up close (home defense) are your primary goals. I wouldn't go shorter unless you have a SBR or MG lower, as pinning is a pain.
Noveske SS barrels also have very long barrel lives for a SS barrel. I still repeat what a0cake suggest though: if you can't afford to constantly feed it match-grade ammo, don't bother with SS.
I have a very similar build but was trying to make a lightweight gun. One thing I have noticed is that the mur upper and my axts lower is an extremely tight fit. The front pivot pin would not slide through the holes on the lower and required greasing up. I tried installing the mur upper and axts lower on other corresponding uppers/lowers and they all fit fine but tight.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4
Shorter barrels are more accurate due to more rigidity. I'd stick with 16" if accuracy at range and terminal ballistics up close (home defense) are your primary goals. I wouldn't go shorter unless you have a SBR or MG lower, as pinning is a pain.
Noveske SS barrels also have very long barrel lives for a SS barrel. I still repeat what a0cake suggest though: if you can't afford to constantly feed it match-grade ammo, don't bother with SS.
Your planned build is along the lines of my recce-inspired rifle. I went back and forth between 16" and 18" and ended up with BCM SS410 16". I love my rifle and have no regrets, but I can tell you my next rifle will be a lightweight profile chrome-lined barrel. Scoped it's a heavy MF and needs match ammo to show off.
Sounds like a nice build, but it may be a very heavy 14.5". Your build will be about 8lbs not counting optics, light, magazine and ammo. The parts you've listed are probably gonna run you closer to $2,600 if you can find some of them parts.
I bet he"ll be closer to 7lbs since my 14" afghan medium contour SS with UBR comes in at 7lbs 5.5oz. without optic or extra crap on it.
PatrioticDisorder
04-30-14, 17:54
I'm going to bump this thread, I am now finally in possession of 4 AX556 lowers, 3 of which I think I'm going to Form 1 (just in case 41p happens)...
So let me discuss my plans for the 1 lower I don't plan to SBR...
I'm thinking DD LPK, SSA, BAD-ASS 45 degree version, BCM mod 2 or Mapul K2 (input on this choice would be nice), battle arms enhanced pin set. Part of me likes the idea of a VLTOR A5 RE but IDK if it is really necessary (IG if you're reading maybe you can help me out here), if I went A5 I'd get a springco green spring, if not BCM RE with Blue spring and H2 buffer? For a stock I was leaning towards the STR if I go A5 but maybe the new MOE-SL or BCM stock. If I go with BCM RE I was thinking maybe B5 Bravo, Imod or CTR stock...
Upper is easy, my heart is set on BCM upper with BFH ELW-F barrel (14.5 or 16" mid length) when it becomes available. If I go 14.5" I'll also go KMR 13 and if 16" KMR 15. I'd also add a Raptor CH, LMT enhanced BCG with enhanced bolt (and NiB cam pin), Magpul MBUS PRO front and rear. I'll be putting a SilencerCo Trifecta RS flash hider on it as well.
For Optics I want to get a Leupold Mk6 1-6 on ADM mount, Aimpoint T-1 with I/O cover on LaRue 30 degree offset QD mount. For a light I want to go with Inforce WMLX on keymod thorntail mount... And I'd add BCM gunfighter Keymod VFG, BCM rail panels and a QD mount to the KMR as well.
So there you have the updated version of what I have in mind for a dream rifle if you were able to read through all of that. Lol
Main questions I guess I have at this point are:
1. LMT enhanced BCG w/ enhanced bolt and VLTOR A5 on BCM mid length gas system, should I expect any reliability issues (too much of a good thing maybe)? My goal is to create an ultra soft shooting, ultra reliable and ultra durable system.
2. Any thoughts on BCM Mod 2 grip vs. Magpul K2? I kinda like that you can neatly store a spare bolt and firing pin in the K2, but I have not felt either grip in hand yet.
3. Any thoughts on proposed stocks?... If I go A5 I really want something that will collapse all the way and give me the shortest LOP possible with the A5 (as an option).
4. Any thoughts on A5 vs. standard carbine RE?
SilverBullet432
04-30-14, 17:59
one question: why spend $100 on a lpk just to replace most of the parts? why not buy quality parts separate?
PatrioticDisorder
04-30-14, 18:06
one question: why spend $100 on a lpk just to replace most of the parts? why not buy quality parts separate?
Great question, I'm glad you asked it. Honestly, I don't even know where I would shop to buy individual quality components to an LPK, if I did I would go that route...
Found this link:
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?142312-LPK-Recommendations-for-a-quality-lower-build
Looks like I can thank member bzdog for making it easy and looks like I can save about $50 per lower using the parts he listed.
Ha. Looks like you and I are thinking pretty much alike.. I've got three AX556s and similar parts selections. I'd like one more at some point (two 16", two SBR).
So far I've built one, and got parts for the other. I used:
- Colt ala cart LPK parts from Brownells
- SSA-E
- BAD-ASS 90 degree (std + hybrid)
- BAD EPS takedown and provided AXTS pivot (EPS pivot is too short)
- BCM milspec buffer tube, carbine spring an H2 buffer
- Magpul MIAD
- Magpul STR stock + extra QD cup for both side coverage and the enhanced pad
- Noveske QD endplate
This is mated to a complete Noveske 16" 300 BLK NSR upper with H1 on LT660, AAC 51T FH, Troy BUIS (HK style front), Raptor CH, X300U at 12 oclock and Vickers padded QD sling.
I'm very happy with these selections. Today I'd prefer the KMR, but not enough to replace the NSR.
My second set of parts is the same except a Phase 5 pistol tube until I can form 1. I plan to use a 9" BCM KMR + Noveske 8.2" 300 BLK barrel, BCM milspec BCG and Knights MAMS with this one.
Just not sure about the upper. Gonna check out the BAD stuff they are releasing.
Am going to try to make some G10 panels.
http://www.cmmginc.com/product_p/55da207.htm
-john
PatrioticDisorder
07-31-14, 15:28
I figured I'll update this... I've decided to build 3 "dream" AR's and the components I'm thinking about using have evolved since this past November when I originally came up with the idea.
I ordered 4 AX556 lowers which I've been in possession of for a while now, I sent in a form 1 for 3 of them back in May (plan to keep the 3rd SBR'd lower as a spare, will live with spare SBR upper on it, basically used as parts). I want to build a 16" "Recce" style mid length build, 14.5" mid length SBR general purpose build and an 11.5" CQB build.
Build 1 (16"):
Lower:
AX556 lower
Geissele SD-E trigger
Ala cart Colt LPK
Battle Arms Takedown pin
BAD-ASS short throw
LWRC Ambi rear reciever QD sling mount
VLTOR A5 tube w/ David Tubb flatwire CS buffer spring (will experiment with weight, but will likely stay stock H2 or maybe go H3)
BCM Mod 2 Gunfighter pistol grip
Magpul STR stock
Upper:
VLTOR MUR-1A
BCM 16" BFH ELW-F barrel (when it becomes available, please hurry BCM!) (mid length)
SLR Sentry 6 adjustable gas block (would like to have this pinned), w/ SLR black nitride gas tube
BCM KMR 15
LMT Enhanced BCG (including enhanced bolt, will also be using McFarland gas rings)
Surefire SOCOM flash hider (for can attachment)
Raptor Ambi charging handle
LWRC front & rear skirmish sights
BCM angled & 1 sided KMR rail covers
BCM keymod VFG
Build 2 will use all the above except 14.5" BCM BFH ELW-F Mid length barrel & KMR 13
Build 3 will use all above except 11.5" BCM BFH carbine length barrel, KMR 10 & Geissele SD3G
Color:
I want to hydrodip lower, upper, rail, pistol grip, rail covers, VFG & stock in multicam on all (then clear coat with cerakote) & have barrel, sights, buffer tube & sling plate cerakoted FDE. I'd like to do this for all 3 rifles.
Lights:
I plan to use the thorntail keymod offset mount to be able to quickly attach/detach Inforce WML/WMLX on all 3 rifles. At some point down the road, I'd also like to add a DLI DBAL I2 to one, two or all three rifles at some point in the next few years (when I can afford NVG).
Optics:
Build 1 Leupold Mk6 will be primary optic, I'd also like to put an Aimpoint T-1 on the Larue QD offset mount for instant 1x
Build 2 I'd like 2 set ups, first would be a T-1 on 1/3 QD mount (LaRue or ADM) and the second would be a TR24G 1-4 as the primary on Larue or ADM QD mount and possibly with the second set up have the T-1 on the LaRue offset mount.
Build 3 T-1 on 1/3 WD mount.
I plan to run all 3 suppressed and unsuppressed and will be treating all 3 with fireclean. When I first shoot the rifle I will be using brass max ammo (weakest ammo I use) and gradually closing the gas click by click until the rifle will no longer lock back, then I will move it back 1 click. I'm ok if it doesn't lock back 100% of the time with the weak .223 as all of the ammo I have for defensive purposes is 5.56 and on the flip side I want it to remain a smooth shooter like I envision it will be using 5.56 suppressed. With any kind of serious ammo I want it to be 100% reliable, I've also picked components to also provide durability while being reasonably accurate, ergonomic, light recoiling and well balanced. So there you have it, my 3 dream builds, feel free to critique.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.