View Full Version : As if prices for gas weren't bad enough
Gunfighter.45
12-04-13, 18:29
What the hell is this BS!! Really!?
http://nbcpolitics.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/12/04/21759739-gas-tax-increase-may-be-packaged-as-user-fee?lite
Moose-Knuckle
12-04-13, 18:44
Tax on gasoline is one thing, tax on diesel will be passed on to consumers considering 100% of everything they purchase is trucked over land. So when the price (due to tax) rises for petrol so will the price of everything else.
Belmont31R
12-04-13, 19:04
I don't think its hybrids....its that gas is way more expensive now than it was in the last 10 years, and with a shitty economy people aren't driving as much. The massive lower amount of people working is going to lower consumption way more than hybrids. Before all the safety standards and such went into effect we have 40MPG vehicles. Compact cars today are as big and heavier than mid size 80's and 90's japanese cars like the accord and camry. Lots of people skipping that vacation where they end up driving 1500 miles or whatever. Just go somewhere closer and spend less.
Really the same old song and dance government people like to do every time there is a dip in spending/consumption....just raise taxes to fill in the shortfalls, and in turn makes the economic situation worse. Rarely will they cut spending to match lower consumer consumption. And if they don't get away they'll cut the most visible things they do like cops, FF's, and teachers...never the waste we don't see.
I listened to Neil Cavuto grill a democrat senator over this same thing. The senator wanted to increase the gas tax by 33 cents per gallon. When asked about where the $46B per year that is already collected and allocated for roads, bridges, etc. has gone, the senator of course couldn't answer the question. Cavuto ripped into him saying that maybe the senator should find out where that money is going first, (meaning it was most likely spent some place else other than what its supposed to be used for) before trying to raise the gas tax.
Does the government think we poop money?
Eurodriver
12-05-13, 08:49
Can someone please explain the following quotes, spoken by the same man, to me?
“Americans hate the gas tax… I don’t like the gas tax,” the Oregon Democrat told reporters. “It doesn’t work very well, it’s not fair, and it doesn’t reflect true road use and it doesn’t produce enough revenue to meet the current needs, much less the future demand.”
And
Rep. Earl Blumenauer, D-Ore., has a solution: increase the federal tax on gasoline and diesel by 15 cents per gallon,
What?
Eurodriver
12-05-13, 08:51
Does the government think we poop money?
Between SS, Medicare, Federal Income tax, State income tax, sales tax, property tax, Obamacare tax, tolls, gasoline taxes and the Firearms and Ammunition Excise Tax...it's amazing we have any money left to eat.
NJ has some of the lower fuel prices around... and sucks even here. My cousins who live in NY fill up every time they come here lol. This is just crazy.
"For a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket trying to lift himself up by the handle"
brickboy240
12-05-13, 10:10
The trucking companies and owner operators will not be eating that tax....YOU will.
It will be passed along to the consumer or end user in the way of fuel surcharges or higher shipping rates.
Corporations do not pay taxes....individuals pay taxes.
-brickboy240
For what it is worth, there is going to be a huge reduction in fuel consumption in this country because of the increased fleet MPG mandates over the next several years. Fewer gallons per 100 miles, lower overall consumption, and less tax revenue. I am on the fence of the per mile tax because while it sounds bad on the surface, it is reflective of who uses the roads the most and also taxes plug-in vehicles that will be hitting the roads in the next several years, ie Nissan Leaf. The Leaf currently pays no gas taxes but uses the same roads that the gas burning vehicles do. While those cars are a very small portion of the vehicle population now, they won't be in the future. Read: plug ins do not currrently pay road taxes. Gas users are paying for the free loading electric cars currently.
If a per mile tax was implemented, I would almost require an abolishment of the gas tax to compensate. It would be beyond unfair to tax via a per gallon and a per mile. I could also see some type of algorithm for using a vehicles curb weight, gallons per 100 miles, and type of vehicle to calculate the per mile tax.
brickboy240
12-05-13, 10:43
The "per mile" tax will hurt many of us that travel long ways to work each day. Many people cannot afford to live close to where they work.
The electric cars pay registration and inspection fees and that is supposed to be for road improvements and maintenance.
-brickboy240
The "per mile" tax will hurt many of us that travel long ways to work each day. Many people cannot afford to live close to where they work.
The electric cars pay registration and inspection fees and that is supposed to be for road improvements and maintenance.
-brickboy240
Or those of us who don't want to live close to work because we don't want to have to sling our ARs to go check our mail.
Tax tax tax. Tax some more. Steal everyone's money legally the tax way said no founding father ever.
The "per mile" tax will hurt many of us that travel long ways to work each day. Many people cannot afford to live close to where they work.
The electric cars pay registration and inspection fees and that is supposed to be for road improvements and maintenance.
-brickboy240
Your argument is that because you chose to live in a certain area, and you drive on roads maintained by these taxes, it will hurt you more? The gas tax is exactly the same way except they based the gas tax on 1993 usage and gallons per 100 miles rates. These rates are much lower now, ie less tax revenue, and usage has increased.
Or those of us who don't want to live close to work because we don't want to have to sling our ARs to go check our mail.
This one is really easy. When you pay your taxes, you can sign a form saying you used x number of miles on private property.
This one is really easy. When you pay your taxes, you can sign a form saying you used x number of miles on private property.
My point was more that if I wanted to live closer to work it would be in an area that I did not want to live because it was shitty. Now, if I could afford to have a few miles of private dirt road living to my house I would and would do that for my taxes trust me. Though to be honest my ultimate goal is to have some land where I can have at least a 100 meter range, if not a 2-300 meter range and shoot when I want. Have to have goals after all, though more taxation ain't helping me any.
My home is in MN. I work 500 miles away in the ND oil patch. I drive home every month for a week to see my wife. I drive drive 45 minutes to the shop I work at in ND to maintain my dad's fleet of 4 peterbuilts with belly dumps and repair/modify trucks and trailers for my own customers. Needless to say I've learned a thing or two about gas prices and taxes. Truckers used to actually make a living before all the bullshit prices they pay for taxes. About an average of $1000 a day to fuel up a typical semi. Then they get taxed monthly by the irs for another fuel tax. Then they also get charged for a heavy Highway use tax (my dad tried to fight that one on the grounds that he rarely goes on the interstate and loggers get a reduced rate for that reason but they told him to Piss off). Then there's a tax for making money off the roads. $5000 a year per truck for the license plates. The dot bends these guys over about 10 ways from Sunday for money. These are just some of the fees and taxes a trucker pays. There building a new refinery near me in ND and the government restrictions there are retarded. They're only letting them produce deseil fuel. No gas allowed. Don't even get me started on the taxes levied every step of the way to extract the oil. In the end I'm shocked I can get gas for less than $5 a gallon.
Sent from my SGH-T999 using Xparent BlueTapatalk 2
brickboy240
12-05-13, 11:43
You left out IFTA and the fact that you pay property taxes on the semi and trailer AFTER you have already paid sales tax when you bought the thing.
Yes, the barrage of taxes, fees and extra expenses OUTSIDE of fuel on commercial vehicles is dizzying and I bet most have no freaking idea how expensive it is to operate any commercial heavy vehicle on America's roadways.
Let's not even get into commercial truck insurance (especially if you haul hazmat like we do) that cost also is why your shipping rates are so high.
-brickboy240
You left out IFTA and the fact that you pay property taxes on the semi and trailer AFTER you have already paid sales tax when you bought the thing.
Yes, the barrage of taxes, fees and extra expenses OUTSIDE of fuel on commercial vehicles is dizzying and I bet most have no freaking idea how expensive it is to operate any commercial heavy vehicle on America's roadways.
Let's not even get into commercial truck insurance (especially if you haul hazmat like we do) that cost also is why your shipping rates are so high.
-brickboy240
Let's not forget the racket that Highway patrol has made out of BS rules and regulations for commercial vehicles. I make a living almost solely on modifying and repairing trucks to comply with or beat dot regulations. Kinda funny how a commercial truck can only be licensed for 84,000 pounds with tandem axles and a truck with farm plates is allowed to go to 92k for only $500 a year.
Sent from my SGH-T999 using Xparent BlueTapatalk 2
How will they enforce a "per mile tax"? tracking devices in the cars? F THAT!
How will they enforce a "per mile tax"? tracking devices in the cars? F THAT!
Only way I can think of, besides the above, is an extra box on your car registration where you put your odometer reading. How they would collect, I don't know.
How much is a gallon of gas and diesel?
Only way I can think of, besides the above, is an extra box on your car registration where you put your odometer reading. How they would collect, I don't know.
NJ does not ask for the mileage of the car when renewing your reg every year...
A mileage tax would require a crazy amount of oversight and infrastructure...
Moose-Knuckle
12-05-13, 16:13
How will they enforce a "per mile tax"? tracking devices in the cars? F THAT!
There called EDRs (Event Data Recorders).
NJ does not ask for the mileage of the car when renewing your reg every year...
A mileage tax would require a crazy amount of oversight and infrastructure...
I never said it would mesh well with the current system. I just proposed one possibility that may happen if a per mile tax were enacted.
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