View Full Version : battle belt decisions
I need to get some gear together for a class I plan on attending this summer. I've decided that a battle belt will work best for my needs but I can't decide which to get. I've pretty much narrowed it down to two, the Vtac brokos belt and the HSGI sure grip belt. The Vtac appeals to me because of how you can weave your belt through to attach your gear to it. The HSGI appeals to me because of the quality, based upon the reviews, and the cheaper price. I plan on attaching a Raven holster for my Glock 19, a IFAK, dump pouch, and pistol and AR mag carriers. I also would like to attach a hydration carrier so I plan on attaching some suspenders. So if someone could give me some input I would really appreciate it.
Both are excellent. I had the VTAC Brokos belt but sold it here having found that the 5.11 Brokos belt was more comfortable and currently use that with an HSGI/cobra belt. The HSGI belt is also nice, really can't go wrong Brokos vs HSGI. If you're using a drop/offset holster, I'd get the HSGI. I gave my HSGI to my son, fabricated a kydex mount for a DOH BladeTech with TMMS system for quick change of holsters on the Brokos. I found the TMMS easier and cheaper than RTI hangers.
I am personally looking at a ICE Tactical padded battle belt. Mostly because I a wanting something more low profile, 2-4 mags total, maybe a small defensive blade, handgun, and a flashlight, no dump pouch. Now I have run the ATS War belt before and when I was running that I had lets see, My glock 17, 2 pistol mags, another 2 mag pouch for a multi tool and flashlight, knife, ifak, 3 ar mags, rolly polly dump pouch, and I think I might have had some plumbing on there. I stripped it and sold it after about six months and build a chest rig and was much happier with just a belt holster and some simple mag pouches on my weak side for reloads than having about six inches increased girth. If you are wanting to have a hydration carrier on attached and wanting all of those items as well I would seriously consider grabbing a chest rig as it is likely going to be much more comfortable, more so with the hydration carrier.
I have a Blackhawk STRIKE commando recon chest harness and I really don't think it has the real estate to attach everything I want and be comfortable for a carbine class. I may be wrong though, maybe I'll get all the gear I plan on attaching to the belt and see if I can make it work on the chest rig.
calicojack
01-21-14, 19:39
I am personally looking at a ICE Tactical padded battle belt.
for your sake i really hope hobby has actually started shipping product. I have a pair of suspenders on order that i gave up on getting from two years ago. People used to chastise and bash John willis for supposedly not delivering on orders, but hobby is worse. He doesn't even deliver to his distributors. and he never gets the same flack that john got.
skd_tactical
01-21-14, 20:13
I'm torn between the VTAC brokos belt and the Velocity Systems OUB. They are almost the same belt, both mesh, bombproof and great for a pistol or sub load. They Brokos is double the height of the OUB, so basically all you have to choose between is how much support/ MOLLE real estate you want. You can't go wrong with either one.
SOS
for your sake i really hope hobby has actually started shipping product. I have a pair of suspenders on order that i gave up on getting from two years ago. People used to chastise and bash John willis for supposedly not delivering on orders, but hobby is worse. He doesn't even deliver to his distributors. and he never gets the same flack that john got.
Last I heard his shipping was under control, at least from the research I did prior to looking at the items hard. Haven't order anything as of yet since I have been busy and putting cash towards other items that I deem to be higher up the list, like more mags, ammo, and weapon lights since I have a chest rig that I can work just fine. With that said, if you know of a lower profile padded(even lightly padded) battle belt around the same price range, a little more is fine, I would welcome it. More so if one of the better retailers carry them since I can then pick up more gear :D
Back at the OP. I don't mean to kill the entire battle belt, just to suggest that having everything listed on the belt may not be exactly an idea or comfortable set up. Would try setting up the chest rig and then figure handgun on hip, maybe with a couple pistol mags, maybe a couple other things. Just try to avoid mine and others mistakes of loading it up with an entire combat load out, because we have done it and it is not a good thing.
I have the HSGI Sure Grip with Cobra belt and I am very pleased, the padded portion is super comfortable. The HSGI gear is top notch and I find it hard to believe that there is much better out there. I am going to be running a G-Code drop leg holster with the RTI attached to my battle belt for my sidearm.
I am also running the HSGI AO Light weight chest rig with four double taco mounts, it keeps it light and well balanced and the bulk of the weight off of my battle belt.
I'm torn between the VTAC brokos belt and the Velocity Systems OUB. They are almost the same belt, both mesh, bombproof and great for a pistol or sub load. They Brokos is double the height of the OUB, so basically all you have to choose between is how much support/ MOLLE real estate you want. You can't go wrong with either one.
SOS
Another vote for the Operator Utility Belt. You can weave your inner belt like on the Brokos, but much lower profile. The contour on it makes it very comfy, and I had mine loaded down and it didn't slip. Great belt.
The OUB does look nice but it doesn't have attachment points for suspenders.
The OUB does look nice but it doesn't have attachment points for suspenders.
True, personally I don't see how they'd help with attaching a hydration carrier.
an old saying but true nonetheless - mission drives the gear. if you look at the guys who wear plates, they load up the belt to keep the weight up top manageable but it's undeniable that the trend is to lighter belts altogether. I think belts are a bit like packs in that if you have a large one, you'll find a way to fill it up.
I started out with pistol and 2 mags on a duty belt, with folding knife and handheld light in my pocket. then I wanted to be able to carry a couple AR mags and another pistol mag and dump pouch, so I moved to a 5.11 VTAC belt which, sadly, isn't made anymore...
but I didn't stop there. I moved the handheld light to the belt, added a cool tool and a BOK w/TQ but that overloaded this belt so I moved up to the HSGI which was taller and thicker and comfortable with the increased load. but lo and behold, I had some room left over so I added a water bottle pouch and a knife and another pistol mag and a little Maxpedition 3x5 pouch for batteries and snivel gear and now I look like the Michelin man...
PC is already heavy so I keep it pretty bare - no IFAK, no chest desk (big Admin pouch), etc., just three AR mags and a second TQ on the front with a water bladder behind to balance the load. I also started to reduce the load on the belt - I took off 1 AR mag, and 1 pistol mag, ditched the knife and bottle pouch and thinking of moving the Maxped 3x5 to the PC. it's going to be a balancing act to see which piece of gear carries what but I'd like to get the belt back down to manageable size.
personal recommendation - start with less than you think you need and make it work. chances are, you never really needed it in the first place...
The OUB does look nice but it doesn't have attachment points for suspenders.
suspenders on belts suck...
an old saying but true nonetheless - mission drives the gear. if you look at the guys who wear plates, they load up the belt to keep the weight up top manageable but it's undeniable that the trend is to lighter belts altogether. I think belts are a bit like packs in that if you have a large one, you'll find a way to fill it up.
I started out with pistol and 2 mags on a duty belt, with folding knife and handheld light in my pocket. then I wanted to be able to carry a couple AR mags and another pistol mag and dump pouch, so I moved to a 5.11 VTAC belt which, sadly, isn't made anymore...
but I didn't stop there. I moved the handheld light to the belt, added a cool tool and a BOK w/TQ but that overloaded this belt so I moved up to the HSGI which was taller and thicker and comfortable with the increased load. but lo and behold, I had some room left over so I added a water bottle pouch and a knife and another pistol mag and a little Maxpedition 3x5 pouch for batteries and snivel gear and now I look like the Michelin man...
PC is already heavy so I keep it pretty bare - no IFAK, no chest desk (big Admin pouch), etc., just three AR mags and a second TQ on the front with a water bladder behind to balance the load. I also started to reduce the load on the belt - I took off 1 AR mag, and 1 pistol mag, ditched the knife and bottle pouch and thinking of moving the Maxped 3x5 to the PC. it's going to be a balancing act to see which piece of gear carries what but I'd like to get the belt back down to manageable size.
personal recommendation - start with less than you think you need and make it work. chances are, you never really needed it in the first place...
Word.
For many people, including many LEO/SWAT and some military types, MOLLE belts can be almost too much of a good thing. I've worn a MOLLE belt (ATS) for my part time SWAT gig for the last 6 years. Because my belt had to serve as my only line for one of my roles, and a 1st line for another, it was pretty loaded up. If I was staying longer, I'd be looking at different options. Now that I'm leaving the team, I'm putting together a simpler set up for training. I never got the point of setting up a belt for training, that included cool guy tools and/or med kits. I carry those items in either a backpack or a range bag (or *oh horrors* pockets). Training can take you to some remote places, but I haven't been far removed from my range bag, if not my car, at least for range work.
If you load up your belt, you're going to pay a weight and mobility penalty that may not mimic your working environment, and may in fact hinder your learning process (fighting your gear or missing a point b/c you can't do xyz in your class only equipment). If you don't wear a MOLLE belt in the real world scenario you're training for, I'd give serious consideration to passing it up.
For class, you don't really need to have an IFAK on your person. You can keep it with your stuff, plus the instructors probably have first aid supplies for the class. The hydration carrier is also not necessary. Water breaks should be enough, and you can keep a small bottle in your dump pouch if you need to drink all the time. Hopefully you can lighten your load this way.
I ran a HSGI at my last class, with two rifle mag pouches, a dump pouch, a boo boo pouch, and a double pistol mag pouch. No suspenders for me, and it was comfy and stayed put for 9+ hours.
For class, you don't really need to have an IFAK on your person. You can keep it with your stuff, plus the instructors probably have first aid supplies for the class. The hydration carrier is also not necessary. Water breaks should be enough, and you can keep a small bottle in your dump pouch if you need to drink all the time. Hopefully you can lighten your load this way.
I ran a HSGI at my last class, with two rifle mag pouches, a dump pouch, a boo boo pouch, and a double pistol mag pouch. No suspenders for me, and it was comfy and stayed put for 9+ hours.
I don't have an IFAK on mine but I do have the HSGI Improved Bleeder/Blowout Pouch with gloves, gauze, tape, NPA, and a small sharpie pen inside in a zip lock bag and shears in the back slot with snap loop. I also have a TQ in a Marz Tactical holder on the side pals. you're right, with a good instructor you don't need a complete ER on your hip but having seen it, a gunshot wound has a special kind of magic to make even smart people go stupid. I'd rather have something right on me if the guy next to me ganks one into my calf.
and you're right, you can get by really well with a bottle of water in your dump pouch (or pocket even) so I don't really need the camelback on my carrier but it helps balance the weight off the front.
IMO, the HSGI belt is great for securing a lot of stuff in comfort but I'm going to try the next class with just my pistol and mags on an instructor belt and the rest in my pockets and on the carrier. and I may even dump the PC in favor of my lightweight Eagle chest rig (ah, those were the days...)
Word.
For many people, including many LEO/SWAT and some military types, MOLLE belts can be almost too much of a good thing. I've worn a MOLLE belt (ATS) for my part time SWAT gig for the last 6 years. Because my belt had to serve as my only line for one of my roles, and a 1st line for another, it was pretty loaded up. If I was staying longer, I'd be looking at different options. Now that I'm leaving the team, I'm putting together a simpler set up for training. I never got the point of setting up a belt for training, that included cool guy tools and/or med kits. I carry those items in either a backpack or a range bag (or *oh horrors* pockets). Training can take you to some remote places, but I haven't been far removed from my range bag, if not my car, at least for range work.
If you load up your belt, you're going to pay a weight and mobility penalty that may not mimic your working environment, and may in fact hinder your learning process (fighting your gear or missing a point b/c you can't do xyz in your class only equipment). If you don't wear a MOLLE belt in the real world scenario you're training for, I'd give serious consideration to passing it up.
yup. I originally set up my molle belt to be my "only" line in that it had everything needed to supply both pistol and carbine so I could run my carrier as slick as possible. that's why I loaded it up and have actually run classes without a chest rig but 3 AR mags, 3 pistol mags, and all the other stuff I was running is just too much on a belt. I really get a kick out of seeing pictures of these guys with all these mags and subloads, etc., on their belt. I wonder how they can move...
True, personally I don't see how they'd help with attaching a hydration carrier.
I was planning on using something like an h-harness that has molle on panel in the back. I believe this is possible? Also wouldn't they help distribute the load and make it more comfortable?
Vote for the HSGI rig. My duty rig weighs approximately 23 pounds with loaded mags and we wear them from 12 to 18 hours in a go and man it gets old. There is a reason that all the guys retiring out of this have back problems. That weight hanging around your hips inevitably has something to do with that. My HSGI with 20 pounds of gear is much more comfortable than my regular 2" duty belt by a long shot. And I do think you should wear suspenders if you are going to wear your rig for long periods. Your back will thank you. Get a good pair, adjust them correctly.
SOE and maybe EMDOM make the suspenders being asked about with the ability to run a hydration pack on the back. No experience with either, and I am sure many others make the same thing.
Not going to get into the do or don't wear the TQ thing.
I was planning on using something like an h-harness that has molle on panel in the back. I believe this is possible? Also wouldn't they help distribute the load and make it more comfortable?
There are some suspenders that can integrate a hydration pouch. Some chest rigs, as well. The question is: are you going to be that far from your support gear that you need to carry your water on your back.
Maybe a better question is: what type of class are you planning on attending where a basic belt loadout won't be sufficient?
I don't think anyone's saying to not carry a TQ. Its small and unobtrusive. What puzzles me is when folks show up with large IFAKs that get in the way of their mechanics, slow them down on movement or positional drills, and are stuffed with items that the wearer doesn't know how to use. More-so when folks' cars are a few yards away.
Apricotshot
01-23-14, 08:27
Might want to look at US Grunt Gear as well. I've had good luck with his gear. http://www.usgruntgear.com/tapamobe.html
Sorry I forgot to mention that this would be for a carbine class, if it was just a pistol class I would use my EDC belt and equipment plus a couple extra mag carriers. I would still like to have the convenience of the hydration on my back regardless of the type of class. As for the IFAK I'm in the mindset of rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it.
I started out with an ICE Tactical War Belt (many years ago before all of the drama) and then switched to the ATS war Belt in 2008. I used that for several years. I had a Jones Tactical pistol belt with a Cobra buckle in it. It was a nice set up. When I first got to see a HSGI belt I immediately switched to it. It just plane ROCKS! I still use my Jones Tactical pistol belt in it and I see no reason to change anytime soon.
If the plan is to run anything for a holster which sits below the beltline, the HSGI can't be beat. The UBL/6094 kit is seriously unbeatable if you want a slight drop on a retention holster, and the HSGI is the right belt for it. Other combinations, especially if you're looking for real estate and being able to run a hip height OWB type kydex unit, the OUB looks like the best option - but for me as soon as I'm running battle belt, I want the 6094 retention, and those work better with a slight drop, hence the HSGI belt being unparalleled for awesome. My one-off version is a neat one too, Gene built it to run off a climbing harness (contingency, not rated for much), but that setup was a huge improvement being in a turret.
+1 for HSGI, and some Tacos.
Love my HSGI with cobra riggers belt. I run a combo of Tactical Tailor rifle pouches and HSGI pistol tacos, a TT dump bag, and a TT modular holster. Rig has never failed me, and as such, I've seen no need to change.
Well it's pay day and I plan on ordering my belt today. I'm still uncertain but I'm starting to lean more towards the HSGI due to price. I can get the belt and a taco for the price of the Vtac belt. The only thing holding me back from the HSGI is the inability to attach the kydex gear I already have. I actually might save money by buying the more expensive belt and not having to purchase a new holster.
As much as I love the OUB, many people say that using zip ties to attach kydex to MOLLE works very well.
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There's an adapter out there that replaces the paddle on some holsters as well. I debated ordering one, but just opted to get the TacTailor holster instead.
The only thing holding me back from the HSGI is the inability to attach the kydex gear I already have. I actually might save money by buying the more expensive belt and not having to purchase a new holster.
I was able to attach my Raven holster using the belt loops to the MOLLE on the HSGI belt. I did switch the belt loops out for Malice clips and prefer that as it pulls the holster tighter into the belt/body.
Both are excellent. I had the VTAC Brokos belt but sold it here having found that the 5.11 Brokos belt was more comfortable and currently use that with an HSGI/cobra belt. The HSGI belt is also nice, really can't go wrong Brokos vs HSGI. If you're using a drop/offset holster, I'd get the HSGI. I gave my HSGI to my son, fabricated a kydex mount for a DOH BladeTech with TMMS system for quick change of holsters on the Brokos. I found the TMMS easier and cheaper than RTI hangers.
I always thought the 5.11 brokos was just a rebadged vtac brokos.
I currently use a vtac brokos with HSGI cobra belt, DSG Alpha series kydex holster, TT magna mag pistol pouches (one on each side of the front), and two Emdom/MM IAPs for my AR mags. I generally don't run an IFAK nor a dump pouch although I have space for both on the back of the belt. I can't say enough good things about the Brokos belt, TT Magna Mag pistol pouches, and Emdom/MM Immediate Access Pouches for rifle mags.
My duty rig weighs approximately 23 pounds with loaded mags and we wear them from 12 to 18 hours in a go and man it gets old.
THAT'S where suspenders make complete sense to me. That kind of weight, those kinds of durations. Since we're talking A class.....hell, even if we're talking about 2-6 classes over the calendar year, and nothing else, one has to ask if suspenders are a need, instead of a want, for no better reason than because the belt has attachment points for them. That's a worthwhile question, not a judgement; you wnat suspenders, get suspenders because "'Murica....!" My belt doesn't even HAVE suspender attachment points, but the only reason I noticed that was because I went looking to cut off suspender attachment points....and ended up blinking at the thing for a moment or two with a soldering iron in my hands like an idiot, once I figured out it.
Water? What's the disadvantage of a simple Camelback? You're after a one-piece affair, and I understand the desire for that, but I also know that I benefit, in terms of cramming such gear into a drag-bag or case, from having a belt alone, or a belt and a separate water-source. For a class, usually means water bottles; I can grab a bottle without removing gear faster than I can remove gear to fill a water bladder; more time to jam mags, piss, talk with fellow students, make/confirm notes. Ultimately got water > not got water, no matter how it happens.
Just food for thought, given your stated usage; the $$$ you want to spend on special suspenders might be better used elsewhere....but is still your $$$ to spend, no matter what.
RE: attaching kydex to MOLLE, one relatively simple way.....
-Screw holes in Malice clips of appropriate length (available practically anywhere) in such a way as to net you the ride-height you want, given the locations of the rivet holes in your kydex.
-Attach Malice to kydex with supplied hardware, or get longer screws if what you may already have isn't long enough to make up for the thinckness of the Malice. Loctite that crap.
-Feed malice into MOLLE.
Zip-ties can work, but one has to be careful with the cut ends. They can be sharp enough to at least wear nylon quickly, if not cut it altogether. If you point them away from cloth, they may be wearing/cutting YOU. Pay attention to the cut ends....
Does anyone find the HSGI to be hot. Trying to decide between that and the Infidel. I have been looking for a good comparison from someone who has used both
If the Infidel offered the side loops in 1.5" it would seal the deal as I could used the Ready tac pouches I usually run off of an instructors belt for most classes and matches. Trying to have a simple solution to wear over a jacket with out re buying a ton of pouches and loops
Does anyone find the HSGI to be hot. Trying to decide between that and the Infidel. I have been looking for a good comparison from someone who has used both
If the Infidel offered the side loops in 1.5" it would seal the deal as I could used the Ready tac pouches I usually run off of an instructors belt for most classes and matches. Trying to have a simple solution to wear over a jacket with out re buying a ton of pouches and loops
I would say the mesh lining of the HSGI makes it specifically not hot. no more than any other and better than some...
Mesh lining? HSGI has a neoprene lining, and it doesn't breathe. You can count on it getting hot in warm weather. On the other hand, it's the best for wear over a jacket because it doesn't slip. I had an Infidel, and it's a terrific belt when used with the inner belt. With nothing but loop Velcro and cordura on the inside, it could slide around quite a bit over a jacket.
Mesh lining? HSGI has a neoprene lining, and it doesn't breathe. You can count on it getting hot in warm weather. On the other hand, it's the best for wear over a jacket because it doesn't slip. I had an Infidel, and it's a terrific belt when used with the inner belt. With nothing but loop Velcro and cordura on the inside, it could slide around quite a bit over a jacket.
Good info.
I was considering the HSGI only because I could use the inner belt over Velcro under belt or use the whole setup. That way I would have a warm weather option that is easily removable and an over the jacket option.
Well after much head scratching and double guessing I ordered the Vtac belt from SKD Tactical, along with a double taco, and a esstac dst blowout med pouch which I will be putting a tourniquet, z pak dressing, Israeli bandage and a pair of emt shears in. Thanks for the input guys.
I'm very impressed with the HSGI stuff.
SureGrip and Cobra
http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/ae18/tejasmtb_photo/A8FF932A-717C-48B1-B4EE-3D1687B8A151_zpsqclgywsr.jpg (http://s953.photobucket.com/user/tejasmtb_photo/media/A8FF932A-717C-48B1-B4EE-3D1687B8A151_zpsqclgywsr.jpg.html)
http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/ae18/tejasmtb_photo/D348E4A7-AE5A-40A8-B2F2-7FA65D0C755B_zpshagknaup.jpg (http://s953.photobucket.com/user/tejasmtb_photo/media/D348E4A7-AE5A-40A8-B2F2-7FA65D0C755B_zpshagknaup.jpg.html)
AO Light Weight chest rig w/Double Tacos and Blowout
http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/ae18/tejasmtb_photo/15541281-EC15-4DE4-8600-59D3D045690A_zpsjuzagwx8.jpg (http://s953.photobucket.com/user/tejasmtb_photo/media/15541281-EC15-4DE4-8600-59D3D045690A_zpsjuzagwx8.jpg.html)
Well after much head scratching and double guessing I ordered the Vtac belt from SKD Tactical, along with a double taco, and a esstac dst blowout med pouch which I will be putting a tourniquet, z pak dressing, Israeli bandage and a pair of emt shears in. Thanks for the input guys.
Mesh lining? HSGI has a neoprene lining, and it doesn't breathe. You can count on it getting hot in warm weather. On the other hand, it's the best for wear over a jacket because it doesn't slip. I had an Infidel, and it's a terrific belt when used with the inner belt. With nothing but loop Velcro and cordura on the inside, it could slide around quite a bit over a jacket.
DOH! you're right, that neoprene is why it is "SUREGRIP"!..
I was thinking of something else when I wrote that but to start over, I never noticed that I sweated badly in the HSGI here in ATL. that's probably because I wear it over, rather than above, my pants and BDU belt. I've used this over a Massif soft shell and it stays put even though the jacket would be the weak link of the chain...
Well after much head scratching and double guessing I ordered the Vtac belt from SKD Tactical, along with a double taco, and a esstac dst blowout med pouch which I will be putting a tourniquet, z pak dressing, Israeli bandage and a pair of emt shears in. Thanks for the input guys.I would suggest Olaes bandage instead of Israeli from tac med solutions (look up comparison of two) and while your there go ahead and order med gear from them.
I'll check them out. Thanks
LOL. I have been reading threads on multiple forums for days trying to decide between a belt and chest rig for carbine classes. I have read so many opinions that I am no closer to an answer than when I started.
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LOL. I have been reading threads on multiple forums for days trying to decide between a belt and chest rig for carbine classes. I have read so many opinions that I am no closer to an answer than when I started.
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You don't need a chest rig just for class. Only get one if you actually plan on using it.
Actually, don't buy a belt just for class either. The end state isn't class, the end state is real world use. Class helps you decide on gear and test gear, but buying stuff for class doesn't seem productive. If you foresee yourself running mags out of your pockets in the real world, do that.
My only real world use is running through the house going "pew pew pew", so my gear requirements are mostly imaginary.
I was under the impression you needed one or the other for the classes to hold mags, but if I don't . . .
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My only real world use is running through the house going "pew pew pew", so my gear requirements are mostly imaginary.
I was under the impression you needed one or the other for the classes to hold mags, but if I don't . . .
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You can attach mag pouches to your actual belt.
OK. I have a kydex pistol holster and double mag holder that I wear for idpa. I didn't think I could fit both pistol and m4 mags on my regular belt, but I will look into that option now.
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The OUB does look nice but it doesn't have attachment points for suspenders.
I run my suspenders on my pants belt (which is a The Wilderness reinforced instructors belt), not the battle belt.
when i ran suspenders on the battle belt my pants had a tendency to fall down, or the battle belt rode up, or both.
with the suspenders on the pants belt, everything stays where it should.
My only real world use is running through the house going "pew pew pew", so my gear requirements are mostly imaginary.
I was under the impression you needed one or the other for the classes to hold mags, but if I don't . . .
an oldie but a goodie:
http://www.tacticalyellowvisor.net/concepts/load-carriage-for-training-classes
an oldie but a goodie:
http://www.tacticalyellowvisor.net/concepts/load-carriage-for-training-classes
Good summary. Thank you.
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My only real world use is running through the house going "pew pew pew", so my gear requirements are mostly imaginary.
I was under the impression you needed one or the other for the classes to hold mags, but if I don't . . .
Having a padded belt and comfortable chest rig makes life a lot simpler and more comfortable at training courses IMHO. They can be long days. I take at least a couple of courses every year. Worth it to me to invest in equipment that makes life more convenient. I'm not a believer in "train as you fight". I don't fight. Only exceptions are specific concealed carry and self defense courses. In those, all the participants are on the same page. We don't have several guys with good 1st and 2nd line gear, with one or two other guys fumbling mags out of their pocket.
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