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VA_Dinger
09-11-06, 20:30
A friend of mine from Florida just sent me these. I thought they were more than a little interesting. They seem to be from some Russian CT unit. It's not often that you see an Aimpoint & Surefire equipped AK-74M.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/va_dinger/Russian1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/va_dinger/Russian2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/va_dinger/Russian3.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/va_dinger/Russian4.jpg

LOKNLOD
09-11-06, 20:49
I'm more intrigued by the ACOG on the short one in the back. I also notice that it's magazine looks to have a lot more curvature -- I'm not fully up to speed on my modern AKs, but isn't that indicative of it being 7.62x39? Seems odd to see them "intermingled". Either way, interesting shots.

What do the Ruskies carry as a sidearm these days? That's not a Makarov, is it?

Nitrox
09-11-06, 20:50
It's not often that you see an Aimpoint & Surefire equipped AK-74M.



I wonder if that has anything to do with the way they mount them?

Jay Cunningham
09-12-06, 00:02
The guy on the upper right is using an Izhmash AK-104 in 7.62x39mm - funny that it has no mag dimples like the Saiga series. I think the lines between these receivers are very blurred. Supposedly the 7.62x39mm round regained its dignity in Chechnya - good material penetration characteristics.

Looks like he has a compact ACOG on a tri-rail dustcover mount - not my first choice. He has a SureFire M900A on a TDI LHV 47 lower HG. I think the Russians have copied this originally Israeli HG.

The other guy has an AK-74M - standard issue. Same TDI lower HG w/ a SureFire light and an AimPoint on a weaver siderail mount. Also looks like a modified single-point sling arrangement around the buttstock.

Interesting indeed.

SuicideHz
09-12-06, 08:28
Interesting...

bigbore
09-12-06, 09:21
Are those side folders?

Jay Cunningham
09-12-06, 10:22
Are those side folders?

Yes, they are both sidefolders.

VA_Dinger
09-12-06, 11:17
What pistol is that?

Jay Cunningham
09-12-06, 11:31
That pistol looks like it might be either a APB / 6P13 or a Stechkin APS.

TOrrock
09-12-06, 16:54
Yup, Stechkin 9x18mm machine pistol.

I want one.....:D

VA_Dinger
09-12-06, 19:19
Yup, Stechkin 9x18mm machine pistol.

I want one.....:D


Now that's coooool.

Auto?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/va_dinger/STECHKIN_02.jpg

shooter521
09-12-06, 19:50
I wonder if that has anything to do with the way they mount them?

The mount in the pic actually seems like it would work... throw-lever side mount for stability, with angled rings to center the Aimpoint over the gun and get it low enough that you can co-witness the iron sights (unless the last pic is an illusion caused by the perspective). Only problem is that the stock can't be folded w/o first removing the optic mount.

TOrrock
09-12-06, 20:14
Now that's coooool.

Auto?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/va_dinger/STECHKIN_02.jpg


Yup, sure is. Developed as a type of PDW back before that was in vogue....but the Makarov was better suited for mass issue.

I also noticed the lack of mag well dimples in the AK-104 carbine. Interesting......

Great pics Dinger and thanks for posting them! :cool:

Voodoochild
09-13-06, 07:41
Nicest looking AK's I have seen in a while. Wouldnt mind having one of those in my collection.

VA_Dinger
09-13-06, 11:46
throw-lever side mount for stability, with angled rings to center the Aimpoint over the gun.

That's a good observation.

Who makes Aimpoint compatible rings like that?

I'm assuming the mount is a Russian BP-02 low mount. Is that correct?

shooter521
09-14-06, 09:40
[/B]
That's a good observation.
Who makes Aimpoint compatible rings like that?
I'm assuming the mount is a Russian BP-02 low mount. Is that correct?

The mount and rings are those used with the PK-01 red dot. You can still find the PK-01 package for sale at several on-line vendors, even though it's "old tech" and has been replaced by the PK-A, PK-AS and PK-02. Kalinka Optics carries just the mount, but not the angled rings.

The BP-02 low mount is more or less centered over the gun to begin with, so you can just use standard rings with it.

What I like about the pictured setup is that unlike the BP-02,
1) the angled rings appear to situate the Aimpoint low enough that you can co-witness the iron sights, and
2) the offset rail doesn't occlude the irons when the scope/rings are removed.

VA_Dinger
09-14-06, 12:01
Damn, you AK guys are good.

:D

You can see the AK detachable rail & offet rings in this picture.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/va_dinger/pk-01_3_600.jpg

omega53513
09-20-06, 15:01
Guys I am from Russia (currently reside in US), and these photos seem extremly weird, and suspicious for these reasons:
1. Why would the unit be given differently equipped weapons.
a. They are privatly own by some security company (there alot of privatly owned security companies in Russia. Every big company, like a bank, has their own security).
b. The team was given permission to personalise their weapons? which is still very weird.

2. Most of the units in Russia don't have the funds to use US made optics and tactical lights (considering they market price here + like 20%-30% for higher Russian prices). In most cases Russian Special forces use what ever they have, Russian made optics, and its usually not ACOG.
3. It is very weird that they have TDI handguards, and tri-rail top cover mount, plus considering that tri-rail mount is a very poor choice.

But yes I have to say that the gun definetly looks like Stechkin, which is Russian made, and is not imported in to the US.

TOrrock
09-20-06, 16:36
Omega, I agree with you, mostly because of the lack of a dimple on the 7.62x39mm rifle......I'm thinking it's a SAIGA sold in Europe...

I know that the Russians are now producing a copy of the TDI handguards, the Russian versions are now available here in the US.

I think you're guess on these guys being some type of private security (obviously very well funded) is spot on.

VA_Dinger
09-20-06, 17:21
I have no idea what it means (Never bothered to look it up), but the friend who sent them to me titled the email "Russian Alpha Photos".

He sent them to me after I told him I had just purchased an AK. He just said I would find them interesting.

I have no idea were he got the photos, but I can ask.

omega53513
09-20-06, 18:13
Well, from what I heard "Alpha" is a group "A" of Russian "FSB".
FSB is a government based organization which dial with Russian internal security. Kind of like "NSA".
Well the group "A", which later became know as group "Alpha" is the top ranked team of the FSB.
From what I have read online only best of the best get in there, and get the best weaponry. I have also read that since 1991 none of the hostegies were killed in the operations which were led by group "A".
I couldn't find any more information, nor pictures (which were worthy of putting here).

TOrrock
10-07-06, 16:40
I wonder if this mount is low enough and sits over the dustcover in line with the barrel/sights.....

I don't necessarily need it to co-witness, just be low enough for a decent cheek weld and in line.

I'd like to see one mounted on a rifle.

http://www.kalinkaoptics.com/detail.aspx?ID=475

http://www.kalinkaoptics.com/graph/images/sighting_devices/accessories/molot_ak_extra_1inch_1_600.jpg

VLTOR
10-07-06, 18:40
Even though the accessories look like they are made by CCA/TDI/First Samco, they probably aren’t.

I received a crude email the other day from Russia. The email was from a company that manufactures all of these knock off item. They wanted to see if I was interested in selling their product. Vltor declined the offer.

There are a few interesting ideas such as the collapsible/folding buttstocks for the AK74 and/or AK100 series Kalashnikovs. They also sell stocks, pistol grips, railed fore ends and bipods for the Vepr, Saiga, Tiger series rifles and carbines.

I guess you can no longer blame Tapco for destroying the looks of the legendary AK. Now the Russians are doing it.

Side-fold collapsible stock
http://img464.imageshack.us/img464/3571/akstockfs5.jpg
AK with folded stock and railed handguard
http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/7385/modern74go8.jpg

TOrrock
10-07-06, 19:27
I've never minded practical, high quality additions to the Kalashnikov design, it is, and always has been, an evolving system.

What most of us who hate "Tapco-****ed" rifles object to is the cheapness of the product, and the fact that it looks like people pimping out a '86 Escort because they couldn't afford a M4.

I've owned Galils and Valmets, those are practical, well thought out improvements on the overall design.

Marc Krebs does a hell of a nice job with the KTRS-03.

VLTOR
10-07-06, 20:01
I've never minded practical, high quality additions to the Kalashnikov design, it is, and always has been, an evolving system.

What most of us who hate "Tapco-****ed" rifles object to is the cheapness of the product, and the fact that it looks like people pimping out a '86 Escort because they couldn't afford a M4.

I've owned Galils and Valmets, those are practical, well thought out improvements on the overall design.

Marc Krebs does a hell of a nice job with the KTRS-03.

I totally agree with you, especially about Marc Krebs! :)

http://www.krebscustom.com/MainPhoto-800.jpg

Akoni
10-13-06, 20:55
Does anyone have a US source for the mount and rings that would allow an Aimpoint to sit low enough to see the irons thru?

TOrrock
10-14-06, 11:22
Does anyone have a US source for the mount and rings that would allow an Aimpoint to sit low enough to see the irons thru?


Not that I know of, the sights on an AK are VERY low.

Akoni
10-14-06, 15:59
Not that I know of, the sights on an AK are VERY low.

Roger that but shooter521 mentions something about this type of system earlier in the thread. Not sure if it was conjecture on his part or if such an animal exists in the US. The pictures certainly make it look like you can see the irons thru that red dot sight. I know the Ultimak is supposed to allow use of the irons thru an Aimpoint but I already find Ak's sufficiently nose heavy as is.

K.L. Davis
10-14-06, 18:27
Guys I am from Russia (currently reside in US), and these photos seem extremly weird, and suspicious for these reasons:
1. Why would the unit be given differently equipped weapons.
a. They are privatly own by some security company (there alot of privatly owned security companies in Russia. Every big company, like a bank, has their own security).
b. The team was given permission to personalise their weapons? which is still very weird.

2. Most of the units in Russia don't have the funds to use US made optics and tactical lights (considering they market price here + like 20%-30% for higher Russian prices). In most cases Russian Special forces use what ever they have, Russian made optics, and its usually not ACOG.
3. It is very weird that they have TDI handguards, and tri-rail top cover mount, plus considering that tri-rail mount is a very poor choice.

But yes I have to say that the gun definetly looks like Stechkin, which is Russian made, and is not imported in to the US.

omega...

I am not at all up to speed on this stuff lately, but see what you are saying... correct me if I am wrong, but what you say might suggested that the guys in the photo are GROM "ab Alfa"? Not the Polish, but the Grom/Zenith split thing?

As I understand, their situation leaves them well funded and allowed to make the ad hoc hardware choices? Anyway, just an thought...

TOrrock
10-14-06, 18:45
The 7.62x39mm rifle is a civillian SAIGA, not military.

VA_Dinger
11-19-06, 20:28
My friend sent me a few more of these photos. Two of them seem to be from the same series as the others I posted.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/va_dinger/222c0249358126c262a1c9f84537a5.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/va_dinger/aa81b0926053deab8b8315c46959c6.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/va_dinger/440.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/va_dinger/68Foto_35-med.jpg

GastonG-NoVa
11-21-06, 21:39
Damn those airsofters to HELL!!

j/K

They look like the real deal.

Nice photos,
G

VA_Dinger
11-22-06, 08:12
Damn those airsofters to HELL!!

j/K

They look like the real deal.

Nice photos,
G

I do wonder if these are just airsoft guys.

Akoni
11-22-06, 09:31
I do wonder if these are just airsoft guys.

That would be my vote.

Grendelizer
11-22-06, 13:00
Off-topic, but relates to the posted photos: in the last photo, the guy in the lower right is using a handheld periscope.

Do we use "tactical" periscopes like that? I've always thought that they would be extremely handy in MOUT to keep from getting shot in the head.

John

Akoni
11-22-06, 14:58
Do we use "tactical" periscopes like that? I've always thought that they would be extremely handy in MOUT to keep from getting shot in the head.

John

Yessir, we do.