Question about Glocks

[remington79]

OK I have a question about Glocks. We have all heard about the BTF issues and how this applied to both Gen 3 and Gen 4. I know it was so bad some of you changed platforms all together. I'm not trying to rehash old threads or issues. I have a GSSF certificate for a reduced price Glock. I'm only interested in the G19 and we all know how those have been.

So my question is what is the latest word on the new Glocks. I'm looking for new information, especially about the Glocks from late last year. I also want to know if the model is Gen 3 or Gen 4. Also what is the preference now the Gen 3 or the Gen 4. I like my wife's Gen 3 G19. I've held a 4 with no back strap. I liked the grip texture but I would put a strap on it making it as big as a Gen 3.

Sorry if the last paragraph is poorly worded I'm still drinking my morning coffee.

[C4IGrant]

OK I have a question about Glocks. We have all heard about the BTF issues and how this applied to both Gen 3 and Gen 4. I know it was so bad some of you changed platforms all together. I'm not trying to rehash old threads or issues. I have a GSSF certificate for a reduced price Glock. I'm only interested in the G19 and we all know how those have been.

So my question is what is the latest word on the new Glocks. I'm looking for new information, especially about the Glocks from late last year. I also want to know if the model is Gen 3 or Gen 4. Also what is the preference now the Gen 3 or the Gen 4. I like my wife's Gen 3 G19. I've held a 4 with no back strap. I liked the grip texture but I would put a strap on it making it as big as a Gen 3.

Sorry if the last paragraph is poorly worded I'm still drinking my morning coffee.

It is still up in the air. Buy the one that best fits your hand and give it a go. If you do get a problematic one, Glock should support you.



C4

[platoonDaddy]

I would go with either one and never look back.

[Failure2Stop]

The grip size of the Gen4 G19 fits a much wider array of people than the Gen3.
Unless you have really big hands, I would recommend no backstrap on the Gen4, but that's a personal thing.
9mm Gen4 guns seem to shoot slightly more accurately and softer than the Gen3s.
The reversible mag release is a plus, and the button size is better on the Gen4.
If you do have an issue with ejection, the knowledge and parts exist to resolve your issue pretty easily.

[filthy phil]

My gen 3's 30s and 26, and my g4-17 have zero btf and all feed even tula great. The 30s is a particular joy to shoot. The short frame fits my hand great. In the 45/10mm I wouldnt even consider a non sf or gen3. Just too fat, imo. I will likely get a gen 4 21 or 41 next.
in gen 3 the 9 or. 40 feel fine. Considering they can readily be found in the mid $400 range they are a great buy. Can easily get your money back if you dont like them or just need the money back.
I finally shot this one I found on arfcom. I have $430 in it. Even has night sights. Was flawless. Used some 33rd mags
http://i57.tinypic.com/egwtw5.jpg

[remington79]

Thanks for everyone's answers so far. I like the feel of my wife's G19. I help a Gen 4 and without the backstrap I get too much trigger finger on the trigger. I have heard some others say that the Gen 4s seem to be a little more accurate. I also like the larger mag release. It doesn't matter what Gen or model all 9mm and 40 cal Glocks are $425 with the certificate. The downside is night sights are extra. Another bonus is the gun store has a lifetime warranty on all new and used firearms they sell.

phil when was your 17 made?

[R0CKETMAN]

If you're concerned about BTF, why not get another older gen 3? Maybe even a gen 2 if you don't require a light.

My two gen 4 19s have been flawless for me, although I grabbed an apex just in case.

[GTF425]

I have two Gen 3's (17 and 26) from the same manufacturing timeframe (Aug 2012) and they've been flawless. Consistent, strong ejection and I've never had a malfunction with either pistol.

I only have 500 rounds through a Gen 4 22 and about 1,600 through a 19 I borrowed from a friend at work and they were both great to shoot. I agree with the comments on the ergos of the Gen 4 and me having baby girl hands found the smaller grip profile much easier to shoot. The G22 also cycled reliably with an X300 mounted, which was a good surprise given their reputation with WMLs.

Go with the Gen 4 and if you start to develop issues, call Glock and they'll square you away.

[SPDGG]

My vote:

G19 Gen4

"If" you get a copy that exhibits BTF:
- Solution: APEX Tactical Extractor & Spring, Non-LCI Load Bearing, & 30274 Ejector [If it doesn't already have this PN ejector]

[filthy phil]

Thanks for everyone's answers so far. I like the feel of my wife's G19. I help a Gen 4 and without the backstrap I get too much trigger finger on the trigger. I have heard some others say that the Gen 4s seem to be a little more accurate. I also like the larger mag release. It doesn't matter what Gen or model all 9mm and 40 cal Glocks are $425 with the certificate. The downside is night sights are extra. Another bonus is the gun store has a lifetime warranty on all new and used firearms they sell.

phil when was your 17 made?
Serial number uvm2##
3/28/13 test fire

[WickedWillis]

The grip size of the Gen4 G19 fits a much wider array of people than the Gen3.
Unless you have really big hands, I would recommend no backstrap on the Gen4, but that's a personal thing.
9mm Gen4 guns seem to shoot slightly more accurately and softer than the Gen3s.
The reversible mag release is a plus, and the button size is better on the Gen4.
If you do have an issue with ejection, the knowledge and parts exist to resolve your issue pretty easily.


Summed up very well here. I will add my own personal opinion though. I love the Gen4 frames on the full size handguns better than on the Gen3's. I prefer the Gen 3 frames on the compact and subcompact Glocks though. The hump just hits my hand funny. I prefer the less aggressive Gen 3 frames for those. I will say though, the larger mag release is a godsend for those of us that have smaller hands. I own two Gen 4's currently, a 17, and a 19 and the 19 is my EDC.

[ST911]

Several gen4 G17, 19, and 26s under my purview that are late 2013 production (~12). They are all Austrian, and I believe are all ~W serials. No gun related malfunctions or issues to date. One of these is my 2014 shooter, started early Jan, with about 2k rounds through it now.

I'm seeing very few new gen3 purchases. What demand there is for them seems to be those buying the first-available.

[remington79]

Several gen4 G17, 19, and 26s under my purview that are late 2013 production (~12). They are all Austrian, and I believe are all ~W serials. No gun related malfunctions or issues to date. One of these is my 2014 shooter, started early Jan, with about 2k rounds through it now.

I'm seeing very few new gen3 purchases. What demand there is for them seems to be those buying the first-available.

That's good to hear about the 2k rounds. The general consensus seems to be that they either don't work right out of the box or they start doing it around the 1k mark.

[ST911]

That's good to hear about the 2k rounds. The general consensus seems to be that they either don't work right out of the box or they start doing it around the 1k mark.

Too many posts lack sufficient information to conclude much of anything, and folks over-extrapolate the information. See previous threads for further discussion of that. Just buy one and shoot it.

[SouthPaw970]

I prefer the Gen 4's. I like the grip texture because it almost "sticks" to your hand. Also being able to reverse the magazine button was very helpful to me because I am left handed. Other than that either will be just fine.

[remington79]

Too many posts lack sufficient information to conclude much of anything, and folks over-extrapolate the information. See previous threads for further discussion of that. Just buy one and shoot it.

I figured I'd ask here instead of some fanboy site. I knew I'd get more information asking here.

[samuse]

I like the Gen4 Glocks because of the size/shape/texture of the grip. They also seem to be consistently very accurate.

I've had from Gen2-4 Glocks and they all had erratic ejection. Never much BTF, but always pitched brass everywhere.

[xjustintimex]

Too many posts lack sufficient information to conclude much of anything, and folks over-extrapolate the information. See previous threads for further discussion of that. Just buy one and shoot it.

I have been super unlucky with the new glocks and my problems were very real. Aside from weak ejection, btf, my gen 4 made in USA AA prefix g19 had 11 FTE in the first 400 rounds before I sent it back. I have also had numerous other problem guns that started having stovepiping issues after 1-3k. I really love the platform, just prefer using the older models now.

the btf issue to me is an underlying problem that points to something wrong with extraction as all of the guns I have that had btf problems eventually ended up stovepiping frequently. Luckily it does seem fixable if it is not too bad. I just had one pass 2k without issue after numerous problems thanks to the hred/apex extractor and the new ejector. (it was the only gun that the hred and apex worked together on which also shows some weird tolerance problems in the newer glocks imho)

[RMiller]

I own a G26 and G17. The 19 just doesn't fit my hand that great as my pinky seems to not have a spot, just kinda hangs in limbo between the grip and air. The G17 offers a full grip and I can comfortably tuck my pinky under the G26. I shoot both really well and have yet to have a problem with either. They are both Gen 3 guns. The only thing I do to mine are replace the sights and modify/stipple the grip.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk (http://tapatalk.com/m?id=1)

[EzGoingKev]

I have read to avoid any pistol with a serial # that starts with an R.

[Cagemonkey]

Thanks for the thread. I've been wondering the same thing. Things seem to have quitted down.

[SpeedRacer]

My two Gen 4 19's have run without a hitch, they have approximately 5K and 2.5K rds through them.

[remington79]

I'd like to thank everyone for chiming in. I just ordered a G19 Gen 4 with night sights. I got lucky yesterday the wholesaler only had Gen 3 with night sights in stock and that was it. Today a Gen 4 with night sights came in.

[attrapereves]

I have read to avoid any pistol with a serial # that starts with an R.

I've got a Glock 29 with an RUT serial and I've had a few problems with it. I kept getting failure to feeds on just about every mag. I replaced the RSA with a newer gen3 style and also replaced the mags with the newest versions. Seems to have cleared it up. Luckily I haven't had any problems in a while.

My SDB Glock 19 has also had a few issues. They seem to have cleared up.

[lightestfighter]

After how many rounds would you feel the gun is "trustworthy?" I ask because I've got a new VTC serial Glock 26 that I want to stipple, but I don't want to preclude Glock factory support if I need it later.

[ST911]

After how many rounds would you feel the gun is "trustworthy?" I ask because I've got a new VTC serial Glock 26 that I want to stipple, but I don't want to preclude Glock factory support if I need it later.

Great thread started by Grant:
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?144441-How-many-rounds-until-a-malfunction-is-deemed-quot-acceptable-quot

[Piston10]

After how many rounds would you feel the gun is "trustworthy?" I ask because I've got a new VTC serial Glock 26 that I want to stipple, but I don't want to preclude Glock factory support if I need it later.

On a glock, excluding the 42, it would be a 100 rounds for me. I also have carried several before ever firing them at all.

[kest_01]

Have a gen3 19 serial number starts LML, have about 4000rrs through it, about half witha TLR-1 attached, no issues at all, with every kind of ammo you can think of. You need to get what fits your hand run a few hundred Malf free rounds through it and see what you really like. If you have friends that'll let you shoot their blasters cool, if not go to a range that rents them. Renting guns let me know that as soon as I return CONUS I'll be getting. A S&W M&P

[JHC]

I like the Gen4 Glocks because of the size/shape/texture of the grip. They also seem to be consistently very accurate.

I've had from Gen2-4 Glocks and they all had erratic ejection. Never much BTF, but always pitched brass everywhere.

Yeah pretty much. Same here.

[JHC]

After how many rounds would you feel the gun is "trustworthy?" I ask because I've got a new VTC serial Glock 26 that I want to stipple, but I don't want to preclude Glock factory support if I need it later.

I'm not aware that stippling has any bearing on Glock supporting other mechanicals. Is that the case?

200-300 rounds does it for me.

[Surf]

I prefer the Gen 4's. I had one of the first run Gen4 G17 models that developed the issue over time. Ran it purposely that way for about 25K+ when I made the fix. About 6K since that time and running great. I have a couple Gen4 19's from about 8 months ago production dates and they are working great. I am going to be seeing 80 new serial number Gen4 17's per week for the next 6 months straight at least. If I survive that time frame I should not only be hating life, but I should have some solid information on the latest Gen4 17's at least. Sometimes being the "Glock guy" gets you assigned to help bail out those who had piss poor planning from the get go, even though they had been warned. Sorry about my little rant, but I prefer the Gen4's for mostly the reasons mentioned by F2S.

[jb7304]

I have both and prefer the Gen 4.

[Ark1443]

I voted to go with either one. I currently have a Gen3 19, however my next purchase will be Gen4, various reasons but also because it comes with an extra mag & the backstraps.

[JeremyVG]

Have both. Either would be fine, but I prefer the grip texturing on the Gen4.

jvg

[Hmac]

If you read the posts from the Glock fanboys and apologists, you'd think that brass-to-face was simply a figment of ignorant pistoleros' imaginations. If you read posts from the afflicted, you'd think that every single Glock ever made ejected badly. The truth obviously lies somewhere in between.

Me? I was one of the afflicted. Bought a PPQ so I'd have a functional pistol while I was diddling with the Glock trying to make it work. I ultimately succeeded, thanks to Randy Lee and no thanks to Glock. As soon as I was satisfied that the gun was functional, I sold it...got $500 for it this past weekend and used the money to fund a second Walther PPQ. Thus endeth my own personal Glock experiment. Never again.


(click on image for video)


http://SSEquine.net/glockbtf.jpg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xzmop7PlUxQ)

[hatidua]

If you read the posts from the Glock fanboys and apologists, you'd think that brass-to-face was simply a figment of ignorant pistoleros' imaginations. If you read posts from the afflicted, you'd think that every single Glock ever made ejected badly. The truth obviously lies somewhere in between.

Sounds a good bit like those who love 1911's vs those who hate 1911's. It's difficult to convince a diehard 1911 fan that they ever hiccup, and equally difficult to convince the opposite crowd that they can run every bit as reliably as a plastic pistol.

[remington79]

After how many rounds would you feel the gun is "trustworthy?" I ask because I've got a new VTC serial Glock 26 that I want to stipple, but I don't want to preclude Glock factory support if I need it later.


I usually go with 250 to 500 rounds before I feel good about it. If I can I try to do 500. I'll do the first 250 all at once to get it a little dirty. Then the next time I go out I'll shoot half a box of defensive ammo to see how it runs clean. Then I'll run 250 through the pistol and get it dirty again. Then I run the other half (50 round boxes of defensive ammo) of the carry ammo when the pistol is dirty. The method for that madness is I want to see the carry ammo work when the pistol is clean like it normally would be but I also want to make sure it runs dirty. Yes 50 rounds isn't a lot but so far in the past I've been able to find some ammo that doesn't work. In addition it can be hard and expensive to find Federal HSTs.

[remington79]

Update: I thought I'd post an update. I picked up and shot my blue label Gen 4 G19 yesterday and put 250 rounds through it so far. (that's all I had time for plus 50 through a USPC 40) I did a quick breakdown and quick lube job at the range. I brought a couple of patches, q tips, and SLP 2000 EWP.

My trigger pull is slightly heavier than my wifes G19 from 2009. However, my wife's has a 1500 round trigger job so I'm sure that plays a part in it. Mine still has the dipped extracter. I noticed the ejection was erratic. I'm sure some of it was the brass bouncing off of the divider but I could see others. I had some bounce off of my forearm and some just go about a foot to the right. I had one bounce off of the top of my head and one hit the top of the brim of my hat. This may have been caused by the divider as most of the brass was behind me despite some rounds going right. None went to the face though so that's a good start. I'm going to shoot a few hundred more of course.

The erratic ejection did seem to get slightly better by the end of the 250 rounds. I also noticed it wasn't as bad with a used Gen 4 mag (didn't come with the pistol is a spare that has the dual notches) as opposed to the new mags. I was using 115 grain Blazer Brass and the G19 was test fired in mid January of this year. This is the same ammo that was run flawlessly by my wife and I when we went shooting on Valentine's Day. (it was our date) Her G19 hasn't had erratic ejection. For what ever reason I seem to shoot mine more accurately at 25 yards than my wife's.

All in all not too bad. The erratic ejection is still more than normal but not as bad as some have experienced. it may have even improved a little so I'm going to put more rounds through it before I mess with anything. I definitely need to put a backstrap on it.

edit: I forgot to mention it is Austrian made in case that makes a difference.

[mayonaise]

edit: I forgot to mention it is Austrian made in case that makes a difference.

It doesn't.

[CTI]

I have a Gen 3 and for me its a perfect fit so I have no need for the gen 4 but its gonna vary for each user so then gen 4 will fit a larger variety of people then the 3 will but Im a gen 3 fan

[PaLEOjd]

I have Gen2, Gen3, and Gen4 Glocks and haven't had a problem with any of them, ever. I switched over to the Gen4 G22 for my duty pistol 2 years ago without issue. It's an early Gen4 model with unmarked recoil spring. My Gen4 G19 is also an early model with the original unmarked recoil spring. Never had weak case ejection or BTF issue with it. I have witnessed it happen at the range to others but it never happened to me. A woman that was having BTF issues with her Gen4 G19 did allow me to fire the pistol but I did not have the same issue she was having. Gave it back to her and she got BTF again. Not sure what the problem is but I have not experienced it wit hany Glocks.

[sva01]

Surf,
Any feedback on the reliability of the pistols you're seeing come through your trainings?



I prefer the Gen 4's. I had one of the first run Gen4 G17 models that developed the issue over time. Ran it purposely that way for about 25K+ when I made the fix. About 6K since that time and running great. I have a couple Gen4 19's from about 8 months ago production dates and they are working great. I am going to be seeing 80 new serial number Gen4 17's per week for the next 6 months straight at least. If I survive that time frame I should not only be hating life, but I should have some solid information on the latest Gen4 17's at least. Sometimes being the "Glock guy" gets you assigned to help bail out those who had piss poor planning from the get go, even though they had been warned. Sorry about my little rant, but I prefer the Gen4's for mostly the reasons mentioned by F2S.

[brickboy240]

Like Hmac, I too had a troublesome 3rd gen G19.

However...I think I got lucky and the Apex 3rd gen specific extractor 100% fixed my BTF issues.

Going on 2400 rounds after installing the Apex part last year. The thing ejects about like my old 2nd gen G17...perfectly.

The newer 3rd gen and 4th gen guns do seem to be MUCH better...maybe Glock quietly fixed this issue?

I'd buy a new 4th gen Glock 9mm with confidence.

-brickboy240

[remington79]

brickboy240 I didn't luck out with the Gen 4. I bought it in February and it was test fired in mid January of this year. It has the dipped extractor. I thought I read they did away with that last year. I'm getting erratic ejection. I'm not sure if they fixed them or not but my blue label wasn't.

the first 250 rounds I fired through it it seemed like it was getting a little better. I posted earlier in this thread on what was going on with the ejection. I just fired 50 through it for a GSSF match and it seemed like every round was a weak ejection that was verticle and would land on my wrists/forearms with a couple landing on my hat brim.

[brickboy240]

I'd try Apex's extractor. It seems as if Mr. Lee really started his extractor testing WITH the gen 4 9mm Glocks...so the Apex unit seems to work better with 4th gen guns than 3rd gen guns.

My 3rd gen gun was made in April 2012 and it started with weak ejection and turned into BTF after about 6-800rds or so. It would literally throw 2-3 pieces of hot brass right at the center of my forehead, every 15rd mag! The Apex extractor and their provided spring upgrades totally fixed my gun.

Some have not been as lucky as me with the "Apex fix" but I'd roll the dice on another Glock if I needed one.

-brickboy240

[SpecWired]

I have nothing against the Gen4's, but when it came time to replace my high round count and flawless Gen3 G23 I opted for a blue label Gen3 G19. I trust and know the platform and didn't want to risk much deviation from what is proven for a main CCW.

In about 3-4 years, when I'm ready to replace my Gen3 G19, I'll probably end up getting a Gen4 G19.

[Surf]

Surf,
Any feedback on the reliability of the pistols you're seeing come through your trainings?
So far I have been through 160 new serial # Gen4 G17's. Ammo being used for the transition courses are cheap 115gr UMC FMJ rounds. So far the Glocks are eating up the lightweight ammo well, no erratic ejection or other similar related issues. All pistols are gone over and inspected prior to being put in use. We have seen 3 factory Glock night sights come lose and 2 that I have peened personally. Also have seen 1 pistol where where the locking block pin started walking out under fire. Pin and hole spec'd out correct when I mic'd them. I reset the same pin and it held without further issue. We have just under another couple thousand more pistols to go through. I am tracking everything. As of right now I am very very pleased.

[Artifact]

No problem with my Gen4 23.

[steve462x0]

No problems yet with my Gen4 G19. I didn't like the serrated trigger or how the bump felt so I put the smooth gen3 trigger in it.