View Full Version : Feedback, user experience on 20 in. with A5 stock
decodeddiesel
04-08-14, 16:41
I've had a spare LRB lower sitting in my safe for 6 years now that I built with a G&R Tactical parts kit (yeah it was that long ago), and aside from hosting a 14.5 in. M4 clone for a short time, it's been unused. I tossed around the idea of building a lightweight 16 in. middy GP whatever build with a fancy 12-14 inch rail and blah blah blah. I already have a 10.5 MK18-type SBR for home defense, and I'm not fighting out of a vehicle or anything like that.
Recently I have been fascinated by the thoughts of an M16A5 type rifle. Like many on the forum, I started my military career on the M16A2 rifle and have always had an affinity for how the 20 in. rifles run. The sight radius is killer, the recoil is almost nothing, and the 5.56 ballistics out of a 20 in. barrel is impressive. I've made some great shots with M16s and aside from the ridiculous length stock, I like the form factor a lot. For a range toy, possible carbine classes, and amateur 3-gun stuff, I think it might be pretty cool. I'm thinking of a 20 in. flattop with a fixed FSB, KAC M5 rail, Vickers sling, and a Vltor A5 EMOD stock. I have a KAC 600 meter micro sight which I would be using for the time being, possibly adding an optic later.
What are people's thoughts and experiences with the M16A5(ish) rifles?
I've run a 20" HBAR upper on an A5 lower.
It ran fine.
I like the shorter barrels these days, so I wouldn't go over 16", but feel free to rock a 20" if you like.
decodeddiesel
04-08-14, 18:33
I've run a 20" HBAR upper on an A5 lower.
It ran fine.
I like the shorter barrels these days, so I wouldn't go over 16", but feel free to rock a 20" if you like.
I've been running barrels 14.5" and under on ARs for 10 years now. I guess I'm just looking for something new. I know they run well, that's the crux of my argument for wanting one :p
Rainier has an 18" gov't barrel with a rifle length gas system. That might be worth messing around with.
BufordTJustice
04-08-14, 20:25
I've been running barrels 14.5" and under on ARs for 10 years now. I guess I'm just looking for something new. I know they run well, that's the crux of my argument for wanting one :p
Rainier has an 18" gov't barrel with a rifle length gas system. That might be worth messing around with.
Uh....i am currently using that barrel with a kmr for my patrol carbine. A5H3 buffer works perfect.
You can turn the gas volume down on a 16" barrel via an adjustable gas block, but you can't match the overall lower port pressure of a rifle gas system. It's just SO SMOOTH.
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Have you looked at any of my posts?
I've had a spare LRB lower sitting in my safe for 6 years now that I built with a G&R Tactical parts kit (yeah it was that long ago), and aside from hosting a 14.5 in. M4 clone for a short time, it's been unused. I tossed around the idea of building a lightweight 16 in. middy GP whatever build with a fancy 12-14 inch rail and blah blah blah. I already have a 10.5 MK18-type SBR for home defense, and I'm not fighting out of a vehicle or anything like that.
Recently I have been fascinated by the thoughts of an M16A5 type rifle. Like many on the forum, I started my military career on the M16A2 rifle and have always had an affinity for how the 20 in. rifles run. The sight radius is killer, the recoil is almost nothing, and the 5.56 ballistics out of a 20 in. barrel is impressive. I've made some great shots with M16s and aside from the ridiculous length stock, I like the form factor a lot. For a range toy, possible carbine classes, and amateur 3-gun stuff, I think it might be pretty cool. I'm thinking of a 20 in. flattop with a fixed FSB, KAC M5 rail, Vickers sling, and a Vltor A5 EMOD stock. I have a KAC 600 meter micro sight which I would be using for the time being, possibly adding an optic later.
What are people's thoughts and experiences with the M16A5(ish) rifles?
I think that sounds like a pretty solid idea, particularly if you're just looking to try something different. I've often thought that the only real drawback to the A4's is the fixed full length stock. Its a non-issue when you're shooting for accuracy on the range, but when wearing full body armor or attempting to maneuver in tight spaces its often a hindrance. Post pics of the build if you decide to go that route.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?134656-My-M16A5-Rifle
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSHlofN5EAU
The A5 is basically a rifle recoil system. This recoil system is IMO the most flexible/reliable available for the AR rifle. I tried an 18" barrel with a rifle gas system and recoil system. Because of the reduced dwell time it was not as reliable/flexible with different types of ammo as either a 20" barrel with rifle gas or a 16" barrel with middy gas.
Such a system could probably be tuned but I don't think the rifle gas system with an 18" barrel is one of the best combos notwithstanding the recoil system. I also don't think the benefit (if any) justifies the effort and compromises for general purpose use.
Eurodriver
04-09-14, 06:24
Have you looked at any of my posts?
Hah! This was my first thought. IG has been posting he merits of an A5 with a 20" barrel weekly for at least 3 years.
Personally, I would love a 20" A5 setup. I plan on getting one as soon as I get my kino, 16" with KMR, 11.5" LW, etc...
The A5 is basically a rifle recoil system.
End of story.
End of story.
That's what I was thinking...that the original purpose of the A5 was for use on rifles.
That's what I was thinking...that the original purpose of the A5 was for use on rifles.
With the additional benefit of carbine gas guns being able to utilize the smoother rifle spring and buffer system. The only downside is that I didn't think of it first.
decodeddiesel
04-09-14, 12:43
Have you looked at any of my posts?
No, I must have missed it during my searching. Apologies.
ETA: OK I'm dumb sometimes. I posted in that thread when you started it IG!
Any long term thoughts or observations you'd like to add?
decodeddiesel
04-09-14, 12:44
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSHlofN5EAU
Yeah, this video is what got the bug going.
decodeddiesel
04-09-14, 13:08
The A5 is basically a rifle recoil system. This recoil system is IMO the most flexible/reliable available for the AR rifle. I tried an 18" barrel with a rifle gas system and recoil system. Because of the reduced dwell time it was not as reliable/flexible with different types of ammo as either a 20" barrel with rifle gas or a 16" barrel with middy gas.
Such a system could probably be tuned but I don't think the rifle gas system with an 18" barrel is one of the best combos notwithstanding the recoil system. I also don't think the benefit (if any) justifies the effort and compromises for general purpose use.
I had concerns over dwell time with the 18 in. configuration. Although I typically shoot only 5.56 spec ammo, I would like the proposed rifle to be able to handle whatever ammo I threw at it and therefore will stick to a 20 inch barrel.
I haven't had much time to shoot lately, but I would be just as happy using it as anything else. It certainly shoots well and I have no doubts as to it's effectiveness with some good ammo. I use a Battle Comp and the A5H3 with Sprinco spring and it shoots like melted butter.
No, I must have missed it during my searching. Apologies.
ETA: OK I'm dumb sometimes. I posted in that thread when you started it IG!
Any long term thoughts or observations you'd like to add?
I haven't had much time to shoot lately
Well the snow on the Cacti is melting... so it's a good time to start shooting.
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