Reloading CFE223

[Clemonsds]

Does anyone have experience with CFE223

[Coal Dragger]

A little. I really like it for .223/5.56mm. The only load I've used it in is 24.0gr under a 77gr Matchking which has done really well for me through a DD 1/7 S2W barrel. I will also tell you that the copper fouling eraser works. Barrel doesn't copper up much at all.

[Clemonsds]

Have you measured your group sizes? 100,200,300 plus yards?

[markm]

I shot it with SS109 bullets, and it made great running ammo. I only tried a pound before the panic hit however.

[Steel head]

I've had very good results with it and 75 and 77's.

[Coal Dragger]

Have you measured your group sizes? 100,200,300 plus yards?

Only at 100 yards, and I was seeing .5-.75" for 5 shots at 100 with that load. It may be a smidge too warm though since I was seeing some loose primers in previously fired LC brass. Could be just already loose pockets.

As an experiment to get the gas block dialed in I shot a 15 round group periodically getting up and adjusting the gas block or otherwise screwung up my position and the load still went under 1" for a 15 shot group.

[Onyx Z]

I still have a little less than a pound of it that I bought before the panic, but I only dabbled in it a very small amount. Is this stuff very temperature stable?

[Coal Dragger]

Good question, it's not advertised as such though.

I have about 9.5 pounds of it so I'll find out this summer.

[markm]

I've gone away from ball powder, but CFE is one that I will buy more of as the frenzy dies out.

[Coal Dragger]

I also have mixed feelings about ball powder. I usually get better results with extruded powders in most of my rifles, but for some reason CFE is the exception to that. I really like it so far, and the fact it meters well is a plus since I am now in possession of a Dillon XL 650 that will be shortly set up to run large amounts of .223/5.56mm. Hopefully I can maintain good quality control reloading rifle ammo progressively, at least I should be OK on throwing consistent powder charges. Controlling run out, and other possible tolerances will be more of a challenge. Then again I am not getting rid of my Redding T7, and I have more than one set of dies for .223/5.56mm so I could always just assemble match grade ammo on the Redding if the Dillon can't produce the quality I want and run practice ammo on the Dillon.

The combination of CFE and 77gr Matchkings were one of the few times I have ever just pulled a load off of a powder manufacturer web site, reduced it a bit, and then immediately had a load that would go sub MOA with no other development. So maybe I am more attached to this powder than logic would dictate based on limited results that are just really good.

[Clemonsds]

Thanks to the information.

[markm]

I also have mixed feelings about ball powder. I usually get better results with extruded powders in most of my rifles, but for some reason CFE is the exception to that.

Yeah... I wouldn't have even messed with it, but I heard some Old Timer on the High Power range talking it up a little bit.

[Coal Dragger]

I hear you. About the only other ball powder I use a lot of is H110 for .454 Casull loads although I'm looking for a replacement that is more consistent lot to lot and more temperature stable.

I also bought a one pound can of Magpro to load my .280 AI with during the "panic" but haven't even tried it yet. I didn't know it was a ball powder until I opened the can. Watch it prove me wrong and shoot better than any other powder I've tried.

[markm]

Hey... is 454 Casull brass prized? I have like 25 pieces of CBC (I think) brass that I just tossed into the recycle bucket because I was sure I wouldn't find anyone who loaded it. PM me if you want it.

[yellowfin]

I've been loading it for the last year or so and it's been absolutely wonderful. I'm working my way through a 8lb jug and will definitely get another one soon to stay ahead. If I have any choice in the matter I'd like to stick with it for .223 from here on out.

[Alaska3006]

AR Comp and TAC are two other powders that I have excellent results with using the 77gr Sierra MK.

I like the CCI 41 primer in LC brass and mild crimp with Lee Factory Crimp Die.

[markm]

and mild crimp with Lee Factory Crimp Die.

I did a crimp/no crimp test with a light LEE FCD crimp and the results were stunning. Crimp was around 3/4 MOA, No crimp was about 2 MOA with all else equal.

I don't know why. My guess is it equalizes neck tension on mixed brass with varying degrees of case neck hardness.

[Alaska3006]

I did a crimp/no crimp test with a light LEE FCD crimp and the results were stunning. Crimp was around 3/4 MOA, No crimp was about 2 MOA with all else equal.

I don't know why. My guess is it equalizes neck tension on mixed brass with varying degrees of case neck hardness.

Your right on target with the mild crimp guess!

[markm]

I'd be interested to try no crimp ammo with annealing to see if that helped.

[Alaska3006]

I'd be interested to try no crimp ammo with annealing to see if that helped.

Shooting a Semi Auto I think Light Crimp makes good sense. I really like shooting the AR over the years.
My Dad bought 2 Colt SP1 back in the early 70's when only avaiable thru Law Enforcment. I was lucky I grew up with a AR 15 as a teenager.

After 26 years in Service and even now my job requires a AR.

My personal rifle a MK 12 Mod 0 Colt that I have spent 2 Years building.

[B52U]

Just tested with 69SMK's. 25.4gr netted really nice sub moa groups and very low SD. Almost zero copper fouling (had one slightly blue patch that may have been a false positive from my jag). It leaves more carbon on everything than most other ball powders I've used. That may be part of how the copper elimination formula works. The extra carbon isn't terrible but definitely noticeable.

[yellowfin]

Use Froglube. It laughs at carbon.

[Failure2Stop]

Use Froglube. It laughs at carbon.

Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see how that's germaine to the conversation.

Sent from my VS980 4G using Tapatalk

[yellowfin]

Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see how that's germaine to the conversation.

Sent from my VS980 4G using TapatalkSorry, I should have done a quote+reply of the prior post to clarify context. The post above my previous noted elevated carbon buildup from the use of CFE, hence my recommendation of Froglube to mitigate the issue as that's what I do myself as I use CFE for loads I run in my AR's. That problem solved makes it the perfect powder IMO.

[Coal Dragger]

Another day, another test load run with CFE 223. Today's experiment and goal was to try 55gr Nosler ballistic tips in my 1/7 Daniel Defense 18" S2W barreled upper. Using mixed Lake City brass and Winchester small rifle primers, with 27.5gr of CFE 223 under the above mentioned Nosler. Results were promising, although my set up for shooting off of a bench was not ideal. I used my Harris bipod on a concrete bench top, with a rolled up puffy jacket in a stuff sack as a rear bag. Not exactly ideal, since the bipod feet wouldn't stay planted as well as I would like and the rear end support was honestly a crap shoot. Plus it was windy, blowing in gusts.

At 100 yards I was able to get one five shot group right around .75", and a ten shot group to just over 1" although there was a reload in between two magazines of five rounds. At 200 yards when I could do my part I was seeing right around 1.25". I think this combination has more potential, I just need to get a proper bench rest and bag for the rear and work on bench rest technique since I usually shoot positions. In fact I probably should have shot prone. Either way it's zeroed at 200 yards, and ready for prairie dogs.

I will also note that there were no excessive pressure signs on the brass so this might have a bit more room to play with in my rifle.

[TomMcC]

Coal Dragger

Have you tried a load less than max, I believe 27.5 is max? Maybe in the 25-26g range. Any chrono data?

Thanks

T

[Arkansas Bob]

Any truth to the rumor that this is the same powder as Leverevolution? They are numbers 104 and 105 on Hodgdon's burn rate chart.

[TomMcC]

While researching this powder I came across a thread in which a fellow called Hodgdon and they said it was Blc-2 with an anti-copper fowling additive. Take it for it is, a guy knew a guy etc.

[Arkansas Bob]

I found a pound of this a while back and was going to try it in my 308s. I scored a pound of Varget and several pounds of 4064 a few weeks ago so I kind of forgot about it. After reading this I think I may try it with some 75gr hornadys this weekend.

[Coal Dragger]

Coal Dragger

Have you tried a load less than max, I believe 27.5 is max? Maybe in the 25-26g range. Any chrono data?

Thanks

T

Sorry no chronograph data, according to Hodgdon's load data center 27.4gr is a max load under a Barnes all copper bullet. Keep in mind that those are long for caliber and have a longer bearing surface, both of which will contribute to pressure. Their other data is for a generic run of the mill 55gr soft point, showing a max load at 27.8gr, this is the data I feel is probably closer to the 55gr Nosler with it's thinner jacket and shorter length.

I did not try any loads under 27.5gr, my previous experience with the powder with 77gr SMK's seemed to indicate that this particular barrel with this particular powder likes pressures towards the upper end of the scale. If I get a chance I might try to tweak this load down a little and up maybe .1-.2gr but probably not at least not up.

[Steel head]

CFE223 gives me good accuracy with 75/77's and some pretty impressive speeds also.
It is also maybe the best powder I've found to go through a measure.

[Colt guy]

I have been loading CFE223 for my Colt and it groups well but did not find a load that worked better then H322.