View Full Version : PA may be the next to fall
Phillygunguy
05-22-14, 03:45
From the Times Herald Where Rob McCord, Katie McGinty, Allyson Schwartz and Tom Wolf stand on the issues, ( although we now know Tom Wolf won the democrat nod for governor) Pennsylvania Democratic Gubernatorial Primary Debate, Thursday, May 8, 2014, in Philadelphia
"GUN RIGHTS
All four candidates would sign legislation to enact universal background checks, ban sales of assault weapons, require that gun owners report lost or stolen guns and grant municipalities the ability to enact gun control ordinances.
McCord and Schwartz would sign legislation to limit the number of handguns that one person could buy in an effort to deter straw purchases. McGinty would not sign legislation to limit handgun purchases. Wolf wouldn’t say whether he would sign that legislation."
http://www.timesherald.com/general-news/20140515/where-rob-mccord-katie-mcginty-allyson-schwartz-and-tom-wolf-stand-on-the-issues
Not only do they plan a "Assault weapon ban" They would grant municipalities the ability to enact gun control ordinances, which I take it to mean IF you travel in PA, what is legal in one township or countyh maybe illegal in another.And with the recent Ban on DOMA in PA I dont see any constitutionality from our state legislators or Judicial system. Also take into consideration Tom Corbertt has the lowest approval rating of all governors. and is failing in the polls.
PA is in danger of becoming NY. NJ and CT, grave danger, and I dont see any gun owners standing up to fight like they should.
I agree that this is a serious issue that needs to be addressed BUT, as far as the democratic candidates, Wolf is the best of the group.
Also, PA has always been a largely democratic run state that has been noted for staying away from gun control.
I suggest that we start firing off letters and emails to our representatives.
Phillygunguy
05-22-14, 07:04
I don't know, things are different this time. Ever since Obama didn't get his way with gun control, Every democrat has pushed for the same thing, limiting to 10 rounds, banning assault weapons and I haven't heard any different from Wolf. I agree we need to write letters and emails, but its got to be more than just a couple guys on a gun forum There's lots of gun owners who vote democrat in Pa and don't see their rights as being threatened. much less care about black rifles
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I agree.
I was at the NRA show in Harrisburg and a guy walked by our stand and said out loud, "There's no reason to own a gun like that".
I put chills down my spine that a guy at an NRA show said this.
I was at the NRA show in Harrisburg and a guy walked by our stand and said out loud, "There's no reason to own a gun like that".
The retort that comes to mind:
"Well sir, then you should have no problem being refused service if you decide later that you want one."
-or-
"We don't sell guns like this to people like you."
PA has some ****ed up laws and people. Some of the complete shit explanations and things I have heard have boggled my mind up here. Even run into shit at some gun clubs who want to have more restrictive rules than NYC as to what you can shoot even one banning more than 3 rounds per mag. :nono::suicide2: What is baffling is that I have seen more gun clubs here than in other states that I have lived in. I live within 15 minutes of like five, and within 30 minutes I think I can get up to 10-12 including the public ranges. They have some of the largest trap shoots in the country with the PA state shoot rivaling the National shoot. There are a lot of pro gun people, but as has already been said there are a lot of gun owners who will vote Dem in a heart beat and have run into several who will spout that same shit as the Dems. "You don't need that!" "There is no need for semi auto." "If you allow semi auto rifles for hunting people will be getting shot left and right." (Sure just like in every other state where semi auto is legal. And what about semi auto shotguns that are legal here? A lot of people getting shot? No. but they will still get pissed about you bringing it up) "ARs/AKs/ect are only for killing children/babies/ect." And then there are more. Of course I have also run into people who are more paranoid and nutty than the Dems who were pro gun up here. And there are a lot of people who could use a good reading of the state and federal gun laws and what things actually mean and what is actually legal, the cops included to some degree at times.
Would be a nice idea of focus on the big cities since most of your democratic base are in the big cities up here with a lot of the rural areas being pretty staunch Republican. I live about two hours from Philly and an hour from Allentown and Harrisburg and I rarely see anti gun or pro Dem bumperstickers unless I am actually in the city and driving around my AO I do see a shit ton of NRA and gun stickers so there is hope. Still need to stay on the top of things though and educate people.
BoringGuy45
05-22-14, 11:27
I don't think both state houses are going to fall far enough into Democrat hands for them to enact any new gun control legislation, if the Dems even take any majority at all. Things seem worse in Philadelphia and Harrisburg, but anywhere outside of those cities and the immediate suburbs is pretty red and pretty pro gun. I'm only about 45 minutes north of Philly and it's a pretty gun friendly area even here. PA is fine for now.
Also remember, like the president, the governor's opinion doesn't mean squat, and this is not yet a deep blue state. In NY, CT, CA, etc, the Dems could declare a day honoring Hitler celebrated by the mandatory eating of babies and they'd still win with 99% of the vote. PA is still a swing state, and votes, especially at for state and local government, still count. Thus, both parties have to be careful in what they try to pass. I don't think the Democrats will really try to ram through an AWB at this time if by some miracle they get a supermajority in the legislation.
Phillygunguy
05-22-14, 14:51
Pittsburgh is another Anti city. Philly is the worst I went to a rally in Harrisburg Last year to protest cease fire, lets just say I was the only one from Philly who was pro gun
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There are plenty of pro-gun people in PA (all guns, not just cuddly friendly looking ones) but it does not pay to let our guard down. We are a target for lots of folks with piles of money and political horsepower from within and outside the Commonwealth. Keep your eyes and ears open and stay in touch with your legislators.
SeriousStudent
05-22-14, 20:36
I agree.
I was at the NRA show in Harrisburg and a guy walked by our stand and said out loud, "There's no reason to own a gun like that".
I put chills down my spine that a guy at an NRA show said this.
Why does he need an elephant gun, then? Any elephants in South Philly?
Ugh, I'm from PA and there is a large gun culture here, but to use that cliche term, there are an awful lot of "fudds" that don't fully support 2A rights and don't care what happens as long as they can keep their Bambi shooter. They're frankly almost as bad as the straight up antis.
I've experienced this first hand at a really nice club I belonged to. The officers decided that "their" club was for "sportsmen" only and banned more than 6 rounds in any semi auto and banned "rapid" fire.
I told them that I couldn't even practice the courses of fire for another local club's military shoot with an M1 Garand or carbine due to their asinine rules. I asked them why that didn't make me a "sportsmen" and was met with blank stares... I dropped my membership right then.
A lot of these people are truly brainless and/or don't understand the "slippery slope". Once they outlaw black rifles, etc and then start gunning for stuff like the semi-auto shotguns the waterfowl hunters use, then they'll be up-in-arms but it will also be too late.
Voodoo_Man
05-22-14, 21:32
Why does he need an elephant gun, then? Any elephants in South Philly?
Depends on your definition of elephant.
SeriousStudent
05-22-14, 21:50
Depends on your definition of elephant.
Thanks for the setup:
"I ain't talking about the dude's wife!"
Thank you, thank you, I'll be here all week. And don't forget to tip the bartender and wait staff! :cool:
(all guns, not just cuddly friendly looking ones)
You see, this is something I never understood. How is one gun more more cuddly than the other? I mean sure a high gloss stock with royal bluing is pretty, but my BCM with ACOG, DD rail, and Scout light is just as pretty in it's own way, and I promise you it gets handled and loved on a hell of a lot more than some 20K showpiece. If people want to consider rap music than I consider my BCM a work of high art.
I do a lot of gun shows in the Philly, York, Harrisburg and Pittsburgh area. There is such a large concentration of FUDDS there it's crazy. I also believe that general lack of knowledge is an issue in this area too.
This area breeds the "I have a gun so I know everything there is to know" attitude.
I dropped our department's membership at gun club in our town because we were getting yelled at for "rapid firing". The irony of a drunk "board member" running out of the bar and telling the police that they are shooting too fast and going to ruin the back stops.
I also see the same attitude in local gun shops. I have quit working in gun shops due to the general lack of knowledge or stubbornness of the owners and other employees.
Heavy Metal
05-22-14, 22:54
Why does he need an elephant gun, then? Any elephants in South Philly?
I always ask them if they primarily are a Hunter? When they proudly affirm this, I ask them if they have grocery store near where they live... If they mention Game Management, I say that is a job best left to Government Wildlife Professionals than a bunch of bloodlusty dangerous amateurs and yahoos.
A few may get what you are doing, the rest will delightfully go away pissed.
BoringGuy45
05-22-14, 23:27
The good thing is that the majority of the fudds are the "softcore" variety. They only like the "old stuff" and "gentleman's" guns and get REAL snotty with anyone who owns an AR or any pistol made of polymer. However, they are still mostly conservative and libertarian types who still strongly oppose any further gun legislation if for no other reason than they don't want any more government interference in anything. They may not give a damn about semi-auto rifles and 10+ round magazines, and they may even look down on those of us who do, but when push comes to shove, they still tend to side with us. The fudds who actively support an AWB or universal checks are actually becoming fewer and fewer I've found.
Heavy Metal
05-22-14, 23:50
And before the OP breaks out the cyanide pills, the Republicans control both houses in PA, the House by a substantial margin.
The good thing is that the majority of the fudds are the "softcore" variety. They only like the "old stuff" and "gentleman's" guns and get REAL snotty with anyone who owns an AR or any pistol made of polymer. However, they are still mostly conservative and libertarian types who still strongly oppose any further gun legislation if for no other reason than they don't want any more government interference in anything. They may not give a damn about semi-auto rifles and 10+ round magazines, and they may even look down on those of us who do, but when push comes to shove, they still tend to side with us. The fudds who actively support an AWB or universal checks are actually becoming fewer and fewer I've found.
Perhaps. But a damn large number still get pissed and pull some random shit out of their asses about body counts, blood running on the hunting grounds, and everything when you bring up legalizing semi auto rifles for hunting. The seem to think that as soon as you let your average hunter be able to hunt with a rifle that is semi auto they will be shooting at anything that moves. :rolleyes:
One step at a time I suppose.
Phillygunguy
05-23-14, 10:00
Why does he need an elephant gun, then? Any elephants in South Philly?
Yeah we have elephants they are the 2 legged kind
Phillygunguy
05-23-14, 10:01
And before the OP breaks out the cyanide pills, the Republicans control both houses in PA, the House by a substantial margin.
I was going with arsenic actually ;)
Phillygunguy
05-23-14, 10:05
The good thing is that the majority of the fudds are the "softcore" variety. They only like the "old stuff" and "gentleman's" guns and get REAL snotty with anyone who owns an AR or any pistol made of polymer. However, they are still mostly conservative and libertarian types who still strongly oppose any further gun legislation if for no other reason than they don't want any more government interference in anything. They may not give a damn about semi-auto rifles and 10+ round magazines, and they may even look down on those of us who do, but when push comes to shove, they still tend to side with us. The fudds who actively support an AWB or universal checks are actually becoming fewer and fewer I've found.
Yeah I get a couple snotty guys at one range I shoot at, and its outside of Philly. I actually had a Vietnam vet tell me My rifle jams a lot cause his did in Nam and that it was just a weapon for war, blah blah blah. I just smiled and bit my tongue.
You see, this is something I never understood. How is one gun more more cuddly than the other? I mean sure a high gloss stock with royal bluing is pretty, but my BCM with ACOG, DD rail, and Scout light is just as pretty in it's own way, and I promise you it gets handled and loved on a hell of a lot more than some 20K showpiece. If people want to consider rap music than I consider my BCM a work of high art.
No doubt. That street seems to only run one way. I can admire an heirloom piece for the craftsmanship even though I would never consider owning one. On the other hand, I have offered to allow a Fudd to shoot one of my ARs to understand what an ergonomic and easy platform it is to shoot. I explained that I would consider hunting with one even if it were limited so a singe shot in the mag due to the ergonomics and how well it stands up to the elements. You can imagine the response I got.
DreadPirateMoyer
05-23-14, 13:07
PA will be fine, even with Wolf. We survived 8 years of Fast Eddie, who was more anti-gun than even Wolf, and we will still hold both houses in the legislature, the house itself by a big margin.
PA will be fine. It won't fall. It won't progress forward for 8 years either, though. :\
BoringGuy45
05-23-14, 15:20
PA will be fine, even with Wolf. We survived 8 years of Fast Eddie, who was more anti-gun than even Wolf, and we will still hold both houses in the legislature, the house itself by a big margin.
PA will be fine. It won't fall. It won't progress forward for 8 years either, though. :\
Agreed. Fast Eddie was this state's answer to Michael Bloomberg or Mumbles Menino, that is, he was very active in his quest for gun control, and he failed. Most Dems, after last year's failure to pass another national AWB and the current opposition in most states that did, are only going to pay lip service to any further bans.
Ohio doesn't look so bad now eh boys? ;)
Our gun laws have been improving for some time now. Come on over, the water is fine!
C4
Ohio:
Yuengling's (https://www.yuengling.com/) last stop before Indiana :p
PA still has some of the best gun laws in the country. There are a lot of Fuds in this state, but nothing ever changes. I live near Cabelas, and the gun area always packed. People are mostly looking at modern hand guns and AR rifles. Hopefully the old "hunters" idea of what you need is going away. In central Pa, guns are a part of growing up. How does it look to keep the house and senate?
What we need to do is get rid of the ban on semi auto rifles for hunting and nuke Fuddism to oblivion. Is there someone in the NRA or similar who has a formulated solution to convert Fudds? Can American Hunter and other magazines that they listen to run articles telling to get with the program already? I don't know why this hasn't been a priority for the last decade.
There is a bill right now to allow varmint hunting with semi autos. Also, I don't think LaPierre really cares about hunting with AR's. Most of those magazines are run by fudds.
Phillygunguy
05-25-14, 10:07
we also have lots of New Yorkers moving to Pa. lots of yellow and black license plates lately not a good sign
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BoringGuy45
05-26-14, 15:02
we also have lots of New Yorkers moving to Pa. lots of yellow and black license plates lately not a good sign
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Yeah but does that mean they are moving here, or just visiting? Also perhaps if they are moving out of NY, maybe they are non-libs who got sick of NY. The good thing is that PA hasn't been gerrymandered so that Philly and Pittsburgh have every seat and the entire remaining state has only 1, and most libs move to already liberal areas anyway.
Phillygunguy
11-04-15, 08:00
Well looks like Pennsylvania is toast
Supreme sweep
BoringGuy45
11-04-15, 11:28
Nah, we still have the legislature and a good gun culture outside Philly and Pittsburgh. Nothing's going to happen anytime soon.
Phillygunguy
11-04-15, 11:30
Nah, we still have the legislature and a good gun culture outside Philly and Pittsburgh. Nothing's going to happen anytime soon.
A gun culture that stayed home on election day
I still think we are OK. My biggest concern is Wolf and his sneakeyness.
Phillygunguy
11-04-15, 14:43
I'm worried that these slimy bastards will try and overturn castle doctrine, and support ban on "assault rifles' and ' high capacity" magazines
BoringGuy45
11-04-15, 15:21
A gun culture that stayed home on election day
That is a problem. This whole "Don't vote, it makes no difference" bullshit is what's killing us. At any rate, nothing is going to pass with this legislature. Gun control is a losing battle, especially in a swing state like PA. Even the liberal media admits that.
platoonDaddy
11-04-15, 20:33
Nah, we still have the legislature and a good gun culture outside Philly and Pittsburgh. Nothing's going to happen anytime soon.
If good gun culture outside of Pittsburgh, how did the Democrats gain majority on board of commissioners in Westmoreland Co?
sevenhelmet
11-04-15, 20:50
That is a problem. This whole "Don't vote, it makes no difference" bullshit is what's killing us.
I pointed that out in another thread and got told to shut up and color. I agree, it's frustrating.
DreadPirateMoyer
11-04-15, 21:17
I'm an ardent defender of PA and usually very optimistic. Check my post history and even stuff in this thread. I've been anti-doom-and-gloom forever.
That said, after yesterday, I'm convinced PA is now toast. Guaranteed D majority in SCOPA screws not only gun laws that get challenged, but also redistrcting in 5 years, which the Ds will take full advantage of to make sure Rs never see the light of day in this state. The voting trend has also gone more and more D over the last 2-3 years at a staggering pace.
Good game, PA. Time to move South.
I
I'm an ardent defender of PA and usually very optimistic. Check my post history and even stuff in this thread. I've been anti-doom-and-gloom forever.
That said, after yesterday, I'm convinced PA is now toast. Guaranteed D majority in SCOPA screws not only gun laws that get challenged, but also redistrcting in 5 years, which the Ds will take full advantage of to make sure Rs never see the light of day in this state. The voting trend has also gone more and more D over the last 2-3 years at a staggering pace.
Good game, PA. Time to move South.
Yep I don't think anything will happen short term but the wife and I just bought land in Texas, I have a good business here but we are planning our out for when things go sideways.
platoonDaddy
11-05-15, 07:53
As I have been saying for years: we aren't united, when you have hunters who believe in gun control and limiting the size of magazines. Go into a local PA barbershop (at least in Western Pa), you will hear conversations about why would anyone need a 30 round magazine and hunt with assault-style firearms (their use of the word assault-style, not mine).
cut & pasted:
The focus began to change in the 1970s, when the NRA moved to “cater to a more mainstream audience, with less emphasis on the technicalities of firearms, and a more general focus on self-defense and recreational use of firearms.”
There are now some 4 million members in the NRA, and their ability to organize, write elected officials and rally together is something their opponents stand in awe of. Yet because of the group’s continued embrace of Second Amendment issues, and seeming growing distance from what some hunters consider to be issues that matter most to them, the NRA is no longer seen as their greatest advocate in Washington.
“I would say on the record they are absolutely not working for the interests of hunters,” says Ross Lane, an Air Force veteran and director of the conservation group Western Values Project.
In 2007, Zumbo, a respected hunting journalist, suggested in a column that semiautomatic weapons were not appropriate for hunting and that game departments should ban them. "Excuse me, maybe I'm a traditionalist, but I see no place for these weapons among our hunting fraternity," he wrote in his column for Outdoor Life magazine. "I'll go so far as to call them 'terrorist' rifles ... We don't need to be lumped into the group of people who terrorize the world with them."
Phillygunguy
11-05-15, 09:08
The thing that sucks is I just bought a new home last year have a steady job for over10 years and now I may have to move, plus leave my family behind.
The only problem is the Ds are metastasized all over, and voting with your feet only goes for so long
wilson1911
11-05-15, 09:35
Agreed Phill. I takes trying to balance having a good job, while trying to live close enough to a decent town, but not in a metro area. Almost all big cities aka metro areas are ruled by the dems. They are in each state.
I always feel like the NRA forgets what the second amendment is about most of the time. Hunting is a good thing, but not the focus of 2A. There are a couple of good documentaries out, but most do not go into the history of the people who founded this country and how they felt. I have not ever seen or read anywhere we should be banned from weapons. The 2A is about arms, not guns.
Infringe means cancel or abolish or tresspass. That means the gov has no right or authority to put anything before it, for it would cancel the 2A.....
Phillygunguy
11-05-15, 09:46
I'm about an hour away from Philadelphia. I work in an area in Philly that's close to the suburbs its almost like a suburb itself. I don't have to go into the city except to visit family, but were I live it's quite peaceful, and mostly republican. But when they start redistricting, that can all change. Taxes could go up . Neighborhood could change, etc and when you have a limited magazine capacity, it's a recipe for disaster.
I already made up my mind if they ban ARs in PA I'm buying a DP 12
BoringGuy45
11-05-15, 16:40
The thing that sucks is I just bought a new home last year have a steady job for over10 years and now I may have to move, plus leave my family behind.
The only problem is the Ds are metastasized all over, and voting with your feet only goes for so long
That's why we stand our ground. We vote with our feet, then the people left over destroy the place and follow us, take it over, destroy it, we move, they follow, rinse, repeat.
Phillygunguy
11-05-15, 19:22
That's why we stand our ground. We vote with our feet, then the people left over destroy the place and follow us, take it over, destroy it, we move, they follow, rinse, repeat.
I actually agree with this. We have to stand our ground but how many are willing ?
BoringGuy45
11-06-15, 10:52
I actually agree with this. We have to stand our ground but how many are willing ?
At this point, we have no choice really. With the exception of the Deep South and the sparsely populated Big Sky states like Wyoming, Montana, Idaho, etc, just about every state that hasn't yet fallen permanently blue is in severe danger of doing so. I include Texas, Arizona, and many of the Atlantic Southern states (NC, SC, GA, etc.) in that statement. The reason being that too many are convinced refusing to vote and retreating and giving the liberals everything they want is a good form of protest.
Phillygunguy
11-06-15, 11:00
I'm sure ill get flack for saying this, but I'd rather there be another civil war than give this country up to a bunch of socialist/ communist. Once gun control takes over, what's to stop the government from murdering it's political rivals?
wilson1911
11-06-15, 11:33
I'm sure ill get flack for saying this, but I'd rather there be another civil war than give this country up to a bunch of socialist/ communist. Once gun control takes over, what's to stop the government from murdering it's political rivals?
Who is to say they don't already ? You do not need a gun for that. How can one politician get a free pass, while others get "assassinated" for doing one small thing wrong.
None of us are willing to stand our ground.....well at least when it will cost us greatly. Who is willing to give up what they have to take on the govt ?
Even when Republicans control the house and senate they do not reverse what has been done. It simply gets stacked on top of what the dems did. Voting and writing your congressman does nothing. Only when they get caught and public opinion gets too stirred up do they back down, and then go around.
I am from Texas, and I can tell you most people in general do not care what the govt does. Only the rural areas are conservative. Get near a big city and it's lib central. People watch the news and form an opinion just like any other state. The sad thing is, most actually believe the news.
Phillygunguy
11-06-15, 11:54
They aren't out in the open like a full blown genocide yet,
As far as taking on the government, I think the slime bags will run an hide when the country collapses.I mean a real collapse at that point, it won't matter because foreign invaders, ie " refugees" will already be here.
wilson1911
11-06-15, 11:59
I'm just waiting for the mexicans to watch the news and realize they can do the same thing to us as the "refugees" are doing to europe. lol
Being a Commiefornia native (5 generations) I can tell you that you folks in PA need to fight any new gun control laws with everything you've got. And do not trust the Republicans to save you. The fight is incremental. In CA we are one step forward fighting for our rights and two steps back for the antis. Bloomberg and his buddies are funneling money into organizations and political campaigns by the bucket load.
You also need to help the "Sporting Shooter" types who are against Black Rifles to see the wisdom of defending the rights of EVERY firearms owner because they don't just want to ban "assault rifles" the antis want to ban all firearms. The Sport Shooting types don't get it sometimes.
Fight the good fight.
Phillygunguy
11-06-15, 14:48
Being a Commiefornia native (5 generations) I can tell you that you folks in PA need to fight any new gun control laws with everything you've got. And do not trust the Republicans to save you. The fight is incremental. In CA we are one step forward fighting for our rights and two steps back for the antis. Bloomberg and his buddies are funneling money into organizations and political campaigns by the bucket load.
You also need to help the "Sporting Shooter" types who are against Black Rifles to see the wisdom of defending the rights of EVERY firearms owner because they don't just want to ban "assault rifles" the antis want to ban all firearms. The Sport Shooting types don't get it sometimes.
Fight the good fight.
The problem is for what ever reason, gun owners stay home and think someone else will do it. Plus the Fudds are stubborn as hell many are democrats too
I'm just waiting for the mexicans to watch the news and realize they can do the same thing to us as the "refugees" are doing to europe. lol
They already do the new media doesn't report the problems and the illegals get first choice at the jobs
Spent two yrs. in northern WV and spent a good amt. of time in PA.
Plenty of gun owners, but a large percentage, from my experience which could be wrong, were Fudds that will not stop new restrictive laws.
Unfortunately, PA will, most likely, pass more restrictive legislation within 10yrs. Doesn't mean don't fight. I have watched my home state of NC pass laws in the past several yrs., not gun related, that I would have never thought possible due to the changing demographics of the state. However, I feel this was the 65 and up crowd getting out in large percentages and overwhelming the Yankees.
Same thing in PA. The old guys may get fired up and vote, but eventually they will die off and be replaced with MSM breathing, non-independent thinkers.
Phillygunguy
11-08-15, 22:17
I refuse to give up
**** whatever legislation they pass. What I'm hoping and praying for is that we get a conservative back in the white house, or at least someone pro 2A. With that I hope there's a strong momentum across the country, to stop liberals or slow them down.
What Pennsylvania really needs, is to become a Right to work state. Put a halt to unions, and hurt the democrats influence. We need a governor with balls like Scott Walker.
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Spent two yrs. in northern WV and spent a good amt. of time in PA.
Plenty of gun owners, but a large percentage, from my experience which could be wrong, were Fudds that will not stop new restrictive laws.
Unfortunately, PA will, most likely, pass more restrictive legislation within 10yrs. Doesn't mean don't fight. I have watched my home state of NC pass laws in the past several yrs., not gun related, that I would have never thought possible due to the changing demographics of the state. However, I feel this was the 65 and up crowd getting out in large percentages and overwhelming the Yankees.
Same thing in PA. The old guys may get fired up and vote, but eventually they will die off and be replaced with MSM breathing, non-independent thinkers.
Oh crap, was planning to retire NC in a couple of years with the gf, spent military time at Bragg and vacation at obx! Anything I should be concerned about?
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