View Full Version : Some ramblings on my H&K VP9
The Dumb Gun Collector
07-13-14, 18:52
Being a gun nerd and an unabashed H&K fanboy, there was zero chance I wasn’t going to pick one of these up ASAP. I picked up one at Clyde’s Armory in Bogart GA on Friday. It was $619, which seemed fair considering Glock 17s run around $530in the same area. An H&K quality product for $70 or so extra bucks is a no-brainer for anyone but the deepest drinker of Gaston flavored Kool-aid.
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3913/14645850754_3a6af92998_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/ojcPbb)image (https://flic.kr/p/ojcPbb) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people//), on Flickr
I took the gun out to the range when I got back home and picked up some 9mm. 100 rounds of WWB, 50 rounds of Blazer aluminum, 50 rounds of 115grain Remington JHP, 25 rounds of Hornaday “Critical Defense” and 15 rounds of Gold dots. Today I followed up with 350 more rounds, 300 WWB and 50 more Blazer Aluminum for a total of 590 rounds for the weekend.
Ergonomics.
The gun’s ergonomics are nearly perfect. The grip, as with the P30, is the best in the business. I prefer the small inserts, but no autoloader, other than the 1911, matches the P30/VP9s grip adjustability. Further, the mag paddle is faster than any other design. If you have monkey hands, use your thumb. If you have medium, small hands, use your trigger finger. Either way, it is fast as hell, and totally ambidextrous. I was really sad when Walther bent to popular will and switched to the single sided button release. A real step back from a functional standpoint.
H&K has improved the slide release levers. Both Walther and HK went overboard designing ambidextrous slide levers on their designs, which has lead to a lot of grouching from people who ride the lever hard and keep the slide from locking back (which also happened to folks using extended Glock levers). They made it harder, but not impossible to ride the levers (as demonstrated by the “MAC” dude in his video and the NRA yo-yo in the early video). It now takes a little more push to drop the levers. Some have found this to be a problem but since actually drop the slide with my strong hand thumb and trigger finger getting leverage is not an issue. For someone like me who thinks “sling shot” reloads are unnecessarily slow, I consider this a win. Other than a P7, no gun drops its slide quicker than a Vp9/P30.
https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2938/14461433208_e720ca0643_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/o2UCgj)image (https://flic.kr/p/o2UCgj) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people//), on Flickr
Shooting characteristics….
The trigger is excellent. Basically, it is better than any Glock or M&P trigger I have ever felt, including Apex and other aftermarket triggers I have fooled around with over the years. Essentially, it is in the same class as a PPQ. I feel that the HK is better, but at this point it is a Mercedes vs. BMW type argument. The weight feels to be at least two pounds lighter than a standard Glock trigger, and much smoother. Frankly, the Glock trigger is so overmatched here it feels like it is a completely different class of gun. Let’s not even talk about the M&P. There is very little chatter in the take-up and the trigger only moves a short distance after a true surprise break. The reset is extremely positive (audible and tactile) although I still think Glock will remain king for the bump humpers.
This is a gun that needs to be shot more than a mag through to get a proper feel for it. The recoil is not the same as a Glock. It isn’t the same as a 9mm 1911 either. Once I had a few mags through it I acclimated to the recoil characteristics and my split times during Bill drills are as good or better than I can do with a Glock or my Springfield 9mm Range officer. This is impressive to me since I was never able consistently do this with my P30 or even my M&P. I think this is where the trigger starts to show its’ stuff.
Accuracy is outstanding. Again, this has come to be expected from H&K guns. Even people who hated the USP/P30 etc usually grudgingly acknowledged the H&K’s mere “mechanical” accuracy. I shot the gun at 21f, 30f, 25 yards and 50 yard gongs. The gun is POI/POA from 30f to 25 yards. Basically, the bullet hits exactly as listed in the manual.
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3895/14461625277_70083b20b1_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/o2VBmR)image (https://flic.kr/p/o2VBmR) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people//), on Flickr
Miscellany
It appears that HK may have solved the trigger return spring breakage issue that haunts Glock and their own LEM guns by putting a relatively large, AK style, braided trigger spring in the right grip wall. I will be surprised if we ever see one of these break.
The VP9 seems to be a steel framed gun with a large plastic shell. The frame insert is huge, and it appears replaceable. This means, as far as I can tell, the VP9 will be fixable forever. If you break off a frame rail get a new block. The frame itself, which is serialized, basically is just a shell that you push roll pins through.
Ejection is very constant and proper. The brass is ejected forceful at 4 o’clock, as God intended. No BTF.—not that I expected it. H&K has always seemed to know how to do this.
I like the charging handles. It makes working the slide a snap, and I didn’t see them in my sight picture after the first few mags. Frankly, they are a hell of a lot more useful to me than forward serrations. Still, it was wise of HK to make the removable for folks who can’t use them. As pointed out in another forum, I foresee these slots being used as a part of a RDS mount for some enterprising soul. I also imagine some fool will install an enormous AR gamer style handle at some point.
Obvioulsy I am happy with the gun. How happy? My M&P’s can be found on consignment at Oakridge customs and I will be selling my holsters and other doodads on the EE shortly.
Looks like another regular for the stable...
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3847/14644796881_9d1876cd2e_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/oj7pTX)image (https://flic.kr/p/oj7pTX) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people//), on Flickr
Nice write up. I'm in love with my VP9 as well. I'm having some serious separation anxiety since mine is off having a custom kydex holster made for it.
Waiting on mine as we speak. Thanks for your thoughts. They seem to mirror those who have spent much time with the pistol. I'm tempted by the Botach $399 M&P's w/ 3 mags & NS, but have forced myself to hold off and pay the extra for the VP9. I keep telling myself that by the time I add a barrel and texture the grips I'll have the same in it as the VP9. I patiently await my VP9........:)
Thanks for your review. Enjoy it! I impatiently await my VP9... :cool: Nice pics, better firearms. What camera or phone do you use for those photos?
The Dumb Gun Collector
07-13-14, 19:41
Good old iPhone.
Thanks for the great write-up! I am afraid to shoot one because I'm so heavily invested in Glocks (can't use anything else on duty).
If they sell a longside version I may have to snap one up anyway.
I'm seriously thinking of picking one of these up, I love HK guns but I don't have he budget for them. This being only a little more than a Glock fits the bill. When you go to sell those holsters let me know I'm in need of one.
Good old iPhone.
An useful collectors item! Thanks.
If possible, I'd like to see a more detailed VP9/PPQ comparison.
I can't wait to get one. Love my P30s, so likely will love this too.
oh christ. Am I just an everyone? Well, I really like my Walther pistols, but I'm looking for
favorable excuses to be able to justify my VP9 purchase. :happy:
shutup&shoot
07-13-14, 20:52
oh christ. vickers posts about it and everyone rides his coat tails?
Please explain. Which part of the post was riding on coat tails?
Please explain. Which part of the post was riding on coat tails?
Apparently gun reviews on brand new guns can only be done prior to the LAV's review.
Thanks for the write up Greg! I am really looking forward to trying one out for myself.
Great write up Greg, thanks. I'm going to have to start tracking one of these down soon. The only question is which handgun will be sacrificed after I get it? We'll see, I suppose. This fellow GA boy is curious, what range were you shooting at?
The Dumb Gun Collector
07-13-14, 22:40
Marion Road gun range in Macon. It is a members only range but he yearly fee is super reasonable.
I am shipping the slide off to tool tech tomorrow for green front sight (with white ring) and plain yellow rears.
This gun may just bring me into the world of polymer.
G34Shooter
07-13-14, 23:00
Nice writeup!
Based on my experience, thinner/lighter HK trigger return spring is more durable than thicker/heavier one. I hope your prediction in that regard is accurate.
Phillygunguy
07-13-14, 23:25
nice job, in his video MAC said it needed a break though period did you find that to be the case?
I didn't find a break in period necessary in any of the 5 different VP9s I have experience with.
Mac said he shot Wolf Steel cased ammo, which as well as being underpowered, erratic quality, and dirty is not recommended by the HK VP9 manual.
In personally firing over 1400 rounds through 5 different VP9s, I only encountered one malfunction: a failure to feed. This occurred when I was shooting weak hand only with Blazer Brass 115 grain FMJ. This was within the first 200 rounds through tone particular gun. I later fired over 100 rounds of the same ammo through the same VP9 shooting weak-hand only without a single recurrence of this malfunction. This was the only malfunction I observed over the course of the ammo I fired and an additional 1000 rounds fired by other people. This includes at least 300 rounds of Winchester white box and a similar amount of Blazer Brass, as well as Federal, Remington, and Privi Brass 115 grain FMJ; Winchester Ranger JHPs, Federal HST, Black Hills FMJ & Tac-XP.
We did not fire any Wolf or steel cased ammo through any of the guns.
Greg,
Please bring this gun to the Ernest Langdon class in September. We'll shoot it head to head with my PPQ.
Looks like za Fatherland has come through again. Very nice :D
Thanks for the review. I went to a local gun show and two LGSs yesterday and no one had these yet. So…. I shall wait.
The Dumb Gun Collector
07-14-14, 08:26
"Based on my experience, thinner/lighter HK trigger return spring is more durable than thicker/heavier one. I hope your prediction in that regard is accurate."
Yeah, this is a completely different setup than the old springs. Instead of a single piece of looped wire this is a much longer heavily braided spring. It is reminiscent to the braiding they do at the mounting point of a guitar string to add strength. Again, just speculation on my part, but it looks like the engineers decided they weren't going to hear about this issue anymore.
As far as break-in, I haven't noticed anything. But I ALWAYS, no matter what gun, shoot full-power ball through my guns at first. I have owned way too many guns (I am serious, too many) to shoot limp Fiocchi or wolf/tula/monarch through a gun in the first 500 or so rounds.
That being said, my mini "torture test" is to shoot a mags through the gun weak handed while rotating the gun from side to side (as close as possible to covering all 360). My gun was able to do this with the blazer aluminum and the weirdly shaped Hornaday critical defense.
Gary1911A1
07-14-14, 08:47
Thanks for the review. Your review makes me want to buy one and sell my two M&Ps' too. Are you going to be doing a "Break My VP9" endurance tests? LOL
I want this now. Not that I need to spend the money, but...I mean...that's pure sex appeal....
Beat Trash
07-14-14, 08:57
You guys are killing me. Mine is supposed to ship to my dealer on Friday.
I planned on putting full power 124 gr and 147 gr ammunition through it for the first 200-300 rounds.
Anxiously awaiting the arrival of my VP9...
Great write up, Greg.
Thank you kindly.
-------------------------------------
"One cannot awaken a man who pretends to be asleep."
mrosamilia
07-14-14, 12:33
I am very happy with mine as well. I haven't posted in quite some time, but this gun truly is going to turn heads. I purchased the NS 3 mag model for myself and the standard model for my wife and her scores have been greatly improved over her G19.
I was on the fence about this, because I want another striker fired handgun. I need it.
I'd love to get one of these, but the mag release is a no-go for me. Every other gun I carry has the button release, not the HK lever. If I've ever had a "training scar" it's from the damned lever release. My first pistol was a USP45, and it took me a LONG time to de-train myself from that manual of arms. Whenever I pick one up for a range session, I have to unlearn it again.
You guys are killing me. Mine is supposed to ship to my dealer on Friday.
I planned on putting full power 124 gr and 147 gr ammunition through it for the first 200-300 rounds.
Anxiously awaiting the arrival of my VP9...
Few things are better in life than waiting for that new gun you wanted for a long time to arrive. Still gives me butterflies. :happy:
I'd love to get one of these, but the mag release is a no-go for me. Every other gun I carry has the button release, not the HK lever. If I've ever had a "training scar" it's from the damned lever release. My first pistol was a USP45, and it took me a LONG time to de-train myself from that manual of arms. Whenever I pick one up for a range session, I have to unlearn it again.
The closest you'll ever get, would be a PPQ with the button release... You'll never see a button release on a HK...
Just got my two day shipping notice!
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
The closest you'll ever get, would be a PPQ with the button release... You'll never see a button release on a HK...
Thank goodness...
DreadPirateMoyer
07-14-14, 17:16
Thank goodness...
Seriously. The paddle release is the best thing to happen to handguns.
The closest you'll ever get, would be a PPQ with the button release... You'll never see a button release on a HK...
I use both mag release systems indiscriminately, but I prefer the paddle release.
Seriously. The paddle release is the best thing to happen to handguns.
This.
Greg,
Please bring this gun to the Ernest Langdon class in September. We'll shoot it head to head with my PPQ.
And if you fine gentlemen would do a write up, I would GREATLY appreciate it.
The PPQ is real nice, and I was seriously considering the P30 UNTIL the VP 9 came out.
The closest you'll ever get, would be a PPQ with the button release... You'll never see a button release on a HK...
Never say never.
Fanboys said there would never be a newer striker gun from H&K too.
m1a_scoutguy
07-15-14, 01:19
Outstanding review Greg and I second the motion,I picked my VP9 up last Friday and flew home so I would have time to put some rds through it before work. I only had time for 40 Rd's but it was awesome for sure ! I put a box of Hornady Critical Defense through it & WOW,,,I'm a puss,LOL that stuff rocked, I am so use to shooting my wimpy reloads, shooting full house defensive ammo is a hoot ! I also put 20 or so of my 124 grn plated reloads,,all went fine. Slide did not stay back on the first mag,I figured I was riding the release a bit,had no other problems after that. I had a chance to put 150 through it on Sunday,ran like a top to say the least. I did some basic stuff/drills getting use to the trigger and grip,I did some Dot Torture some Chase drill targets and the Bar target. Here are some links for the targets if you guys wanted to check them out.
http://www.mdtstraining.com/Fundamental%20&%20Chase%20Drill.pdf
http://pistol-training.com/drills/dot-torture
http://mdtstraining.mdtsllc.netdna-cdn.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Trigger.png
I have some pics of the targets but will post them up later,,,for having less than 200 rds though this gun,,I am very happy with it. I plan on getting a bunch more through this gun this week,I have a IDPA match on Saturday and really want to use this gun,but only have the 2 mags at the moment,,I have 7 new inbound,,:o LOL,,I got a bit carried away to say the least, but hey ya gotta have mags right ! I am hoping they show up before Saturday. :D For what's its worth I love the ears on the back of the slide,I don't even notice them when shooting, but I think they work just as the HK guys figured they would, very positive feel and grip & I would guess in a high stress situation they would work just as well, especially in wet crappy/cold conditions more grip is normally better ! I'll post more later but also wanted to let you guys know that this gun fits "almost" perfect in my Crossbreed holster that I bought for my CZ07 !!! :happy: I was going through all my stuff and grabbed my 07 holster and tried the VP9 and it clicked right in,,WOW I thought,it could be a tad tighter,but I wore it at the range on Sunday and it seemed pretty darn good. If I didn't have a Galco inbound I would heat it up a bit and tighten things up a tad but I will wait and see how the Galco one goes,,,I'll keep ya posted.
Never say never.
Fanboys said there would never be a newer striker gun from H&K too.
You're right, I was one of them...But I don't think HK is going to cave-in to a minority, who simply can't learn to push a lever instead of a button. Anyone who uses the lever, after using a button, usually ends up admitting that's it's a better system than a button...
brickboy240
07-15-14, 10:28
Great reviews....thanks for sharing.
I am soooo getting one of these when I get back from summer vacation.
-brickboy240
The Dumb Gun Collector
07-15-14, 20:57
I shipped off my slide to tool tech today. Green trits with white ring up front. Yellow unringed rears. I hope they are having a slow week.
I have been running it in an old Mitch Rosen holster that works ok. Next I need to find a proper holster for it.
Thanks for the target links scout guy. Good stuff.
You're right, I was one of them...But I don't think HK is going to cave-in to a minority, who simply can't learn to push a lever instead of a button. Anyone who uses the lever, after using a button, usually ends up admitting that's it's a better system than a button...
Yep. I wasn't sure how I would adapt to the lever (P30S and HK45T at the moment, likely to add the VP9 soon) after using nothing but standard buttons since the late '80s, but it grew on me fast. I'm as (possibly more) comfortable with the HK lever after just a few months vs. years with a Glock and 1911s.
m1a_scoutguy
07-17-14, 13:04
Hey guys,,went to the range the other day with my VP9 the gun ran boringly "perfect" no hick-ups of any kind. I had 2 fail to lock backs on the slide,,but that's all me. As I got use to the feel of the gun I continued to get better and no more problems. I have the Large grip panel on the left side with the small on the right with the medium back strap,,even though I have large hands,,it really feels about perfect. When I grap the gun I can feel the top of the side panel cuz it sticks out a bit, I know when I hit that my grip is about right and I will be good to go. I have my 1st IDPA match this weekend with it & we all know that when that buzzer goes off out minds go blank LOL,,so we will see ! :) As Greg stated about the mag release in relationship to hand size I found that even though I have big hands I still use my trigger finger, I see multiple plus's for me ,it's wicked fast, finger is off the trigger (as it should be) and I don't have to rotate the gun and my grip dose not change, all good in my book.
Well here is a target I shot at 50 ft from a decent rest, bad part was I had the wrong glasses, target was clear but front site was pretty blurry but I think I did OK,for a Combat/Duty style pistol its pretty darn accurate,,but we knew that already. I will have one of my buddies shoot it and it should do even better. Anyways here it is.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v59/m1ascoutguy/th_VP950ftTarget002_zps32357a2c.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/m1ascoutguy/media/VP950ftTarget002_zps32357a2c.jpg.html)
I'm seriously considering picking one of these up once the initial hoopla dies down and I don't have to know somebody to get my mitts on one. Shot a friend's P30L a while back, and was seriously impressed by how effortlessly accurate it was compared to my G17 that I constantly had to concentrate on to keep from printing left.
That said, I've discovered that the M&P line is pretty darn accurate for me, and I have a huge stash of mags and holsters for mine, so won't be ditching them any time soon.
Greg, outstanding thread.
You're right, I was one of them...But I don't think HK is going to cave-in to a minority, who simply can't learn to push a lever instead of a button. Anyone who uses the lever, after using a button, usually ends up admitting that's it's a better system than a button...
I think it's probably a majority here in the US.
I don't really have a preference either way, just as long as I don't have to shift my grip. Grips with the paddle have to be bigger since my fingers are long. Not a problem on the HK45s, on the smaller models, it's an issue (never have tried a large back strap however). Big old buttons like Gen 4 Glocks (especially with the Vickers), CZ P-07 and P-09, PPQ M2, etc work surprisingly well. Wouldn't be surprised to see H&K make a future gun like that. They would probably find a way to use the same mags however.
I think it's probably a majority here in the US.
I don't really have a preference either way, just as long as I don't have to shift my grip. Grips with the paddle have to be bigger since my fingers are long. Not a problem on the HK45s, on the smaller models, it's an issue (never have tried a large back strap however). Big old buttons like Gen 4 Glocks (especially with the Vickers), CZ P-07 and P-09, PPQ M2, etc work surprisingly well. Wouldn't be surprised to see H&K make a future gun like that. They would probably find a way to use the same mags however.
There's a few things one can do..On my P-2000 for example, I installed larger levers, from a 45c, they fit perfectly and are a lot better than the stock levers. For my P-07, I switched the mag release button to the right side, and use my trigger finger to drop a mag with, This seems to work well, and is HK like in operation, I don't have to roll the pistol to get to the button.. As far as buttons go, the P-07/09's are about perfect...If HK was to bring out a button release model that shared the same mags as it's release lever counterpart, They, at that point would be about a lightyear ahead of Walther...Two models of the same pistol with different methods of releasing the mags, and the mags themselves don't interchange, always seemed like a dumb idea to me...
The_Watcher
07-19-14, 11:29
Based on my experience, thinner/lighter HK trigger return spring is more durable than thicker/heavier one. I hope your prediction in that regard is accurate.
It looks like the same spring that is in the MK23, so yeah- he is probably right about that.
So as not to gum up this thread with so many pictures, I shot a lot of pics of my new VP9, lots of detailed close ups, and started a new thread.
You can view it here. (https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?155396-HECKLER-amp-KOCH-VP9-HANDGUN-DETAILED-PHOTO-TOUR)
It looks like the same spring that is in the MK23, so yeah- he is probably right about that.
Check that photo thread and look at the area of a locking block, just below it, see what you think.
Thank goodness...
Oh Goodness yes X3.....
Nice writeup!
Picked mine up today and cleaned it up really well. Haven't shot it yet, but agree on the charging lips, they give you a very nice bit of leverage on the slide. Everything else is just about what you'd expect from any other HK you picked up.
Hope you don't mind me adding some pictures to your thread of my newest HK......
http://hkguns.zenfolio.com/img/s6/v135/p197116466-5.jpg
http://hkguns.zenfolio.com/img/s6/v148/p138513301-5.jpg
The Dumb Gun Collector
07-19-14, 23:14
You guys keep torturing me with me with pics. With my slide gone I have to make do. I did order a holster from Minuteman Defense. Hopefully it will be here by the time my slide makes it back.
The reviews have been amazingly positive so far. I can't wait for someone to have a problem so all the haters can cite it over and over for years as a reason why they don't want one. We should take bets on what it will be. A busted striker? Trigger bar? Sheared off barrel lug?
Jokes aside, HK appears to have a winner here.
You guys keep torturing me with me with pics. With my slide gone I have to make do. I did order a holster from Minuteman Defense. Hopefully it will be here by the time my slide makes it back.
The reviews have been amazingly positive so far. I can't wait for someone to have a problem so all the haters can cite it over and over for years as a reason why they don't want one. We should take bets on what it will be. A busted striker? Trigger bar? Sheared off barrel lug?
Jokes aside, HK appears to have a winner here.
I have a problem with mine, but it's cosmetic so not really worth bitching about. My biggest problem is not having the time or the ammo to take it to a class right now and run it through its paces.
Those sure are nice looking handguns.
Might have to check one out.
I'm definitely wanting one now, but I think I'll wait for supply to catch up with demand somewhat. Went to a gun show yesterday, only one guy had a VP9. He was asking the low, low price of $850...
The_Watcher
07-20-14, 07:34
Check that photo thread and look at the area of a locking block, just below it, see what you think.
Good catch. What i should have stated is that the coiled trigger bar spring will assist the trigger return spring, same set up as the MK23 if i remember correctly. I sold my MK23 over 5 years ago so i am going off of my aging memory.
Anyway, looking at my VP9 right now the trigger bar spring provides some resistance to the trigger pull and it assists with the return of the trigger to reset. The trigger return spring around the trigger pin does not appear to be as stressed as it is on my HK45 and if memory serves me well my long sold P30's. In all appearances it looks as if either the TRS or TBS break, the other will pick up the slack and provide a useable firearm until service can be had. Interesting setup. I am really liking this VP9- a lot.
ETA- in looking at Paul's pictures, there is no direct photo of the trigger bar spring inside the mag well on the starboard side.
PatrioticDisorder
07-20-14, 07:38
I'm definitely wanting one now, but I think I'll wait for supply to catch up with demand somewhat. Went to a gun show yesterday, only one guy had a VP9. He was asking the low, low price of $850...
http://www.cdnnsports.com/just-in/hk-vp9-9mm-4-striker-w-rail-ambi-3-dot-sgt-2-15rd.html#.U8u4LRC9KSN
PatrioticDisorder
07-20-14, 07:39
You guys keep torturing me with me with pics. With my slide gone I have to make do. I did order a holster from Minuteman Defense. Hopefully it will be here by the time my slide makes it back.
The reviews have been amazingly positive so far. I can't wait for someone to have a problem so all the haters can cite it over and over for years as a reason why they don't want one. We should take bets on what it will be. A busted striker? Trigger bar? Sheared off barrel lug?
Jokes aside, HK appears to have a winner here.
It is an HK, we might be waiting a long... Long time to hear about the first part breaking...
I shipped off my slide to tool tech today. Green trits with white ring up front. Yellow unringed rears. I hope they are having a slow week.
I have been running it in an old Mitch Rosen holster that works ok. Next I need to find a proper holster for it.
Thanks for the target links scout guy. Good stuff.
You may not get that slide back before the shoot off with my ghetto PPQ in the class. :)
What gun was the old Rosen holster for?
The Dumb Gun Collector
07-20-14, 14:51
It should be back by then! If not, my Wilson Combat is ready for another vacation weekend!
The Rosen Hoster was for my HK45c with Laser. I don't recommend buying one for this purpose, but it works with just a little bit of back to front play.
The Dumb Gun Collector
07-26-14, 10:01
Looky here! I have a holster. The guys at Minuteman Defense had the molds and got it to me in a week. That's service! Now I need my slide back from tool tech.
https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2899/14562721898_6eb43ada3e_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/obRKS3)image (https://flic.kr/p/obRKS3) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people//), on Flickr
Now I need my slide back from tool tech.
https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2899/14562721898_6eb43ada3e_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/obRKS3)image (https://flic.kr/p/obRKS3) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people//), on Flickr
I did a double take when I saw this....thanks for the clarification!
Looky here! I have a holster. The guys at Minuteman Defense had the molds and got it to me in a week. That's service! Now I need my slide back from tool tech.
https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2899/14562721898_6eb43ada3e_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/obRKS3)image (https://flic.kr/p/obRKS3) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people//), on Flickr
Very nice
The Dumb Gun Collector
08-15-14, 20:43
FINALLY got my slide back from Tooltech yesterday. Without a doubt the slowest they have ever turned around anything for me. And I paid for the fast shipping. Woof.
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3881/14931143235_67963728cd_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/oKq1G4)image (https://flic.kr/p/oKq1G4) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people/52942291@N00/), on Flickr
I went with my usual setup, green front with white rings and yellow, unringed rears. I find that the sole white ring picks up the light rather well, and the differing colors help me distinguish the front sight at night. I have the same setup on my Hk45c and P7M8. The reason I go with custom sights from tool tech is it allows me to preserve the factory zero, which I tend to prefer over most aftermarket options.
I took the Vp9 and fired another 250 rounds downrange. 100 WWB, 50 Federal, 50 Blazer Brass, 50 Blazer Aluminum. I actually fired a few more but I split that box up with a friend's G19 and my P7M8 to do some comparison Bill drills.
As a sort of comparison, I decided to do some Bill drills. This drill, as I do it, starts from a draw, I fire 6 shots as fast as I can into a sheet of paper. Technically this should be done into the A-zone of a IDPA target or something but I am lazy and cheap when it comes to targets. What I did was shoot each gun three times, then switch guns so I could rule out "warming up" or chance.
Start VP9 (cold)
TOTAL /DRAW/2/3/4/5/6
2.84/1.31/.36/.35/.25/.23/.34 (Clean)
2.81/1.41/.28/.3/.29/.26/.27 (Clean)
2.69/1.4/.29/.28/.27/.19/.36 (Clean)
G19 (Gen 3, 3.5 pound connector/Factory NS)
2.51/1.42/.16/.25/.21/.22/.25 (Dropped 1 shot off target--barely!)
2.27 1.26/.13/.23/.26/.27/.13 (Dropped 2 shots)
2.29 1.34/.12/.21/.31/.15/.17 (Dropped 2 shots)
VP9 Second String
2.29 1.16/.21/.27/.18/.19/.28 (Clean)
2.25 1.09/.2/.29/.2/.18/.29 (Clean)
2.19 1.05/.31/.16/.21/.27/.19 (Clean)
So, I was able to build up speed throughout the drill although I felt like I was hitting a wall after this. I shot the G19 a little more but my times started to slip because of fatigue (I am old and fat).
I felt like I was able to run the Glock slightly faster, although the numbers didn't bear this out overall. I also had a tendency to "outrun" the sights with the Glock and pull my shots. This might of had something to do with the Glock having a lighter trigger. Either way, both guns ran great and I have to say I have a hell of a lot more trigger time on Glocks through the years, but I much prefer the VP9's trigger--even with an additional pound or so over the competition connector. Another issue with the Glock, and one of my biggest Pet Peeves, was the occasional piece of brass bouncing off my head. The Vp9, like every HK I have ever had, launches the brass hard and fast to the right. Glocks seem to have a problem with the slide smacking the brass back at the shooter--at least they always have for me. With a G17 I have found this to be less of an issue.
Also, I shot my P7M8 once just for old time's sake....
2.27/1.25/.16/.18/.29/.19/.21
I LOVE MY P7. WHY DID I EVER START SHOOTING THIS PLASTIC CRAP??
Also, I ran my X200 on the front of the gun for the rest of my drills (shooting on the move, 25 yards, 50 yards, general screwing around). No issues whatsoever.
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3908/14744528438_cd1a8ae065_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/osVyBy)image (https://flic.kr/p/osVyBy) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people/52942291@N00/), on Flickr
Thanks, for sharing. Great pics and write up.
FlyAndFight
08-16-14, 15:47
Fantastic review. It just confirmed my next handgun purchase.
Fantastic review. It just confirmed my next handgun purchase.
Mine too! Thanks Greg (really)! Can't wait for a compact model.
Skip
Glad to see this Hk is quality. Trigger too? That's a hard one to believe so I might need to get one and try it out. Too bad Army Chief wasn't here to comment.
I really need to get my hands on one soon. My G19 may end up as a glove box gun. May have to get 2, one for concealment and the other for duty use.
The Dumb Gun Collector
08-16-14, 20:01
Javelin,
The trigger is great. Basically like the PPq, but a bit heavier and smoother. Almost no over travel. A real shooters' trigger. But let me be clear, if you like your G19, nothing is going to blow you away about the VP9. It is basically a Gen 5 Glock (that works) 10 years early. An evolutionary, not revolutionary upgrade. For me it is a no-brainer because I have a major hang-up about erratic ejection and accuracy. But if I was the chief of a police department I wouldn't dump all my G17s unless we were at the end of life for them or they were giving me trouble.
The Dumb Gun Collector
08-17-14, 16:13
Performance notes from today. 200 rounds down range. All Blazer Brass 115
Did "El Pres" drills as taught to me by Ken H three targets at 7 yards. 2x2x2 then start over with the first target 2x2x2. I mix up 15 rounds in two mags and insert them randomly to engineer a random mag change in the drill.
9.45 (COLD) 1.45 draw. (clean)
8.23 1.52 draw (Clean)
7.66 1.48 draw (2 dropped shots)
8.84 1.68 draw (Clean)
I was not able to pull off any fast (for me) draws today. Honestly, I was a little fatigued from about 5 hours of sleep. Plus it was hot. Plus I was distracted thinking up excuses. It was interesting to see that I was able to drop 2 seconds in speed primarily by shaving off times between transitions.
These threads are not making it any easier staying away from buying one. HK's are my favorite handguns. Love my P30's like no other. I handled one in the store yesterday and pried the gun out of my hand safely only to be taunted by Greg, who has all the nice toys.
Nice thread.
Maybe one day.
Great info Greg. I need to get one of these soon!
The Dumb Gun Collector
09-01-14, 13:16
Another Update.
I did some more practice with the VP9 in anticipation of the Earnest Langdon class I have coming up next week. Over the long weekend I have taken in out three times. Although it was not done out of any purpose other than laziness, I never bother to clean it (although I will before the class). Anyway, here was the Ammo tally...
100 rounds 124 Grain Nato Winchester
200 Rounds 147 grain RN
50 rounds UMC 115 HP
50 rounds Blazer brass
250 rounds Monarch Brass 115
So, 650 down the pipe this weekend. I tried to use a wild variety of bullets to see if the gun had any quirks. I even tried using different types of bullets in one mag to see if I could break the Vp9s stride during Bill drills, etc.
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3894/14921770628_6ca212e183_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/oJzYxo)image (https://flic.kr/p/oJzYxo) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people/52942291@N00/), on Flickr
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3900/14921699190_be6aa27320_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/oJzBiG)image (https://flic.kr/p/oJzBiG) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people/52942291@N00/), on Flickr
Lots of fun drills including.
1. Bill drills,
2. El Press
3. Shooting on the move
4. Turn and shoot two rounds on the beep.
5. Barricade practice/shooting from a knee.
6. Shooting from prone.
7. Transition drills with light attached.
8. Weak hand drills with light attached.
I have now fired about 200 rounds through the VP9 with light attached. It doesn't seem to care.
https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5555/15085332026_93b246affa_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/oZ3gDu)image (https://flic.kr/p/oZ3gDu) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people/52942291@N00/), on Flickr
Fantastic gun so far. Let's see if anything pops up during next week's class.
Looking forward to the AAR
The Dumb Gun Collector
09-07-14, 21:29
Just finished up a two day advanced pistol class taught by Ernest Langdon
Here is his bio from his website.
Ernest Langdon has 12 years active duty as a U.S. Marine and 17 years in the firearms industry. His duties in the Marine Corps include participation in military operations all over the world to include Panama, Cuba, Philippines, and the Persian Gulf. He served as the Chief Instructor of the Second Marine Division Scout Sniper School and the High Risk Personnel Course as well as the Platoon Sergeant of a Close Quarters Battle (CQB) and Designated Marksman (DM) teams and a Scout Sniper Platoon.
Ernest is a graduate of 20 formal shooting schools and 4 anti-terrorism schools with instructor certifications from the FBI, NRA, US Army and US Marine Corps. He is also a graduate of US Army Ranger School, Navy SCUBA School, US Army Airborne School, US Army HALO School and both USMC Scout Sniper School and Scout Sniper Instructor School.
After leaving the Marine Corps and entering the private sector, he has been shooting competitively for over 15 years and has acquired a Grand Master Class rating from the United States Practical Shooting Association. He is one of the few Distinguished Masters in the International Defensive Pistol Association with 10 National Championship Shooting titles and 2 World Speed Shooting titles.
So, the dude is a badass. This guy is a freaky good shot, and fast. Basically, he can blast poker-chip sized groups at 20 yards faster than I can shoot a clean bill drill at 7 (and that is barely an exaggeration).
Day 1 was fairly typical. A lot of skill assessment/skill builder drills (Dot torture variations, etc). We worked a fair amount of steel as well. There was a strong emphasis on speed as well as accuracy. We worked at 21, 30 and occasionally out to 20/25 yards. We worked on building up our split times and our transitions (between target times). One of the great things about Langdon is that he demos everything--and not all trainers do that. Not only does he do it because he loves to shoot and is obviously good at it--but because it is easier to learn something when someone shows you rather than just telling you.
Day 2 involved a lot of shooting on the move (forwards, backwards, side to side, etc), snake drills, shooting from cover (horizontal and vertical). We spent a decent amount of time working on weak and strong hand shooting and of course a bit of time on malfunction clearing. Towards the end of the day we all did a lot of El Pres drills, and what I am calling the "Collateral" drill which involved shooting three IDPA targets from around 5 feet away. Sounds easy, but it ain't. Basically you shoot one to the body of targets 1 and 2, then 2 shots to number three, go back and fire one easy in targets 2 and three, then shoot each one in the face--as fast as hell. The trick here is you aren't supposed to look at your sights, you sort of look at the target with a silhouette of the gun in view. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K9HeUjr6R-A. I screwed this one up big time the first time through, I forgot to shoot the 3rd target twice and went back to shoot it--and then shot the targets in the head a few extra times for good measure! Fortunately, a lot of other folks messed this up and I largely redeemed myself the second time through. This is a weirdly tough drill the first time through. We followed this up with an El-Pres drill. All of this stuff was done with all the class looking on and on a timer.
Obviously, there was tons of stuff in this class. And I am not going to list everything we did because you should sign up for a class with E.L. yourself. But here are a few BIG takeaways....
1. Trigger control, trigger control, trigger control. This is 95% of everything. Gun selection, sight alignment, foot position, canting, weak hand, strong hand, shooting on the move--all that stuff is nothing next to controlling your press.
2. Do not incorporate techniques that you are unlikely to be able to perform subconsciously. Everything from stance to your movement while shooting should be as close to "startle response" as possible. This makes a lot of sense but is not necessarily what is being taught everywhere.
3. DA/SA is FAR from a hinderance in competition--despite the internet. Langdon teaches that the DA first shot actually allows you to be prepping the trigger far earlier than you would on a striker gun--which allows a bit of an advantage. Hard to argue with the results.
4. Practice shooting on the move. That's what you are going to be doing in a gunfight.
He is a BIG Beretta guy. And when I say big, I mean he has hands like ET. As far as I can tell he could operate the mag release with his right finger hooked through the trigger guard. But man, that dude is a wizard with that gun.
He prefers appendix carry. He believes that hammer-fired guns are best suited for this type of carry for safety reasons.
The weather was pretty brutal (bright sun high 90s, rain, etc), but Langdon was careful to make sure we had lots of water breaks. Still, everyone was pretty beat down by the end of the day. I was so out of it the first day I locked my damn keys in the trunk (also, I was running on about 4 hours of sleep). Speaking of safety, Langdon is a stickler about safety. I myself ran afoul of the safety rules a few times, but all of his rules were sensible and enforced without fanfare.
Fantastic class. I recommend Langdon to shooters of any skill level.
The VP9 ran perfectly, as expected. One other guy in the class had a VP9 and a guest brought one for some testing. Another guy had a P2000.
800 rounds (all either Federal or Blazer brass).
Great review Greg and it was great to meet you this afternoon. Hope to see you at a class in the future.
The Dumb Gun Collector
09-07-14, 22:14
It was great to meet you too and thanks for the tip on those suppressors!
It was great to meet you too and thanks for the tip on those suppressors!
Give Jake a call and let him know I sent you his direction. He'll take care of you!
Greg,
Very nice to see you and awesome AAR on the class. Both students' VP9 ran flawlessly. But as I told mtdawg169, my mind has not changed about the gun. I'm keeping my PPQ and my CZ P07. The 07 ran flawlessly in the class (850 rounds for me), and 500 previous rounds prior. The reduced power hammer spring worked great.
As for the "collateral" drill, my first run was 3.89 clean, not bad for an old, fat blind guy. I screwed up the second run and got a 4.25.
As for Ernest's Beretta, I will be rejoining my Italian family next year.
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/20140908_112811.jpg
By the way, I can't believe you had the mind and time to post last night. I was so worn out after I got home. Clean gun, put stuff away, clean my smelly self and then just sat on the couch stuffing my face with pizza.
The Dumb Gun Collector
09-08-14, 15:05
I am a big time night owl. I HATE the morning. That's why I was zombiriffic until lunch both days. Yeah, on my first run when I had to back up and fire extra bullets I topped 5 seconds. On the second run I ran it in the mid 3s. I have a terrible short term memory but I was speeding up as I caught onto the drill. I was very happy with my El Pres time (relatively speaking). While no where near my best, everybody seemed to be dragging and screwing up towards the end of the day. Too damn hot. You need to get us an air conditioned range dude.
The calendar was screwed up. Labor day came a week early. Usually a week after Labor day, the weather would cool off. I see next weekend's high will be 80.
Thanks for the AAR Greg.
Ernest will be here in Indianapolis Oct.11-12, have been looking forward to this class for some time. Can't decide whether to use a Beretta 92A1 or my VP9. After finishing a 3000rd challenge I have gotten pretty comfortable with the HK but seems a shame not to use a TDA for the class.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
The Dumb Gun Collector
09-12-14, 00:07
For me personally the Vp9 would be an easier gun to run the class with. But the Beretta would win on awesome points. Landgon identified the Beretta 92 and the H&K line up as the guns on the market he would trust out of the box.
He posted quite an indepth and positive review of FN FNS in March as well.
The Dumb Gun Collector
09-12-14, 17:53
I tell you, the FN line of pistols deserves more love than it gets. I had an FNX a year or two back and it was excellent. Even the sights were well thought out. I ended up giving it to my brother in law as a wedding gift. It is like they have a "disinterest" ray on them or something and I have no idea why.
I tell you, the FN line of pistols deserves more love than it gets. I had an FNX a year or two back and it was excellent. Even the sights were well thought out. I ended up giving it to my brother in law as a wedding gift. It is like they have a "disinterest" ray on them or something and I have no idea why.
Agreed. The deal-killer for me on the FNP-45T I had for a while was the location of the safety. If they ever made a striker-fired variant without that obnoxious safety, I'd probably re-buy it.
I tell you, the FN line of pistols deserves more love than it gets. I had an FNX a year or two back and it was excellent. Even the sights were well thought out. I ended up giving it to my brother in law as a wedding gift. It is like they have a "disinterest" ray on them or something and I have no idea why.
I own a lot of different brands of pistols, not one of them is an FN. But not for a lack of looking or fondling. Most of the models I've handled are really large and the controls don't really work for me.
Had a FNS, liked it, shot great, almost impossible to miss the magwell at speed but it started choking at 800rds. Sent it back to the factory, got it back and sold it. Guy who bought it sent it back twice more. No thanks.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I717 using Tapatalk
The Dumb Gun Collector
09-13-14, 10:43
Well, that's why I have always liked H&K: low-drama.
3300 rounds as of Sunday. Zero malfunctions, ever.
The Dumb Gun Collector
09-21-14, 18:18
3800 rounds (500 rounds over Fri and Sat). Vp9 is flat-out as good a combat autoloader as you can buy.
I was tinkering around today and watched a guy have a fairly scary sqib with a brand new 3rd gen Glock. He was shooting WWB and I ended up having to drive it out of the barrel with a pencil (fortunately the bullet itself had traveled so little that it actually prevented the follow up round from fully chambering. He later had another case get stuck in the chamber--upon review the case was swollen and peeled back a little as it went into the chamber. The scariest thing was that these were two separate boxes of WWB. I seem to be seeing more crappy ammo these days.
Ouroborous
09-21-14, 18:23
3800 rounds (500 rounds over Fri and Sat). Vp9 is flat-out as good a combat autoloader as you can buy.
I was tinkering around today and watched a guy have a fairly scary sqib with a brand new 3rd gen Glock. He was shooting WWB and I ended up having to drive it out of the barrel with a pencil (fortunately the bullet itself had traveled so little that it actually prevented the follow up round from fully chambering. He later had another case get stuck in the chamber--upon review the case was swollen and peeled back a little as it went into the chamber. The scariest thing was that these were two separate boxes of WWB. I seem to be seeing more crappy ammo these days.
Color me impressed. What ammo are you using?
Looking forward to picking up mine that I've had on layaway this week--not sure I have enough ammo on hand to even get close to your round count though:)
The Dumb Gun Collector
09-21-14, 18:32
This weekend I shot Federal Aluminum and brass, and, sadly a lot of WWB. In defense of my blasting lots o' ammo--I don't watch sports so I have to do something to get away from my family!
Mauser KAR98K
09-21-14, 19:51
This weekend I shot Federal Aluminum and brass, and, sadly a lot of WWB. In defense of my blasting lots o' ammo--I don't watch sports so I have to do something to get away from my family!
I'd invest in reloading equipment if you haven't. A good Dilion would go far. I shoot the WWB and others so i can get more brass to make better and more reliable loads (operator prudent, of course). The only thing that I'm having a hard time getting for components is pistol powder. Primers, brass, and bullets are back, thank God.
I can't wait to get a VP9.
I had an awful experience with Tula brass maxx. The cases were trimmed so poorly that they were sticking in the chamber and preventing the VP9 from going into battery. Other than that ammo related issue, it has run like a top for about 1k rounds so far.
I had an awful experience with Tula brass maxx. The cases were trimmed so poorly that they were sticking in the chamber and preventing the VP9 from going into battery. Other than that ammo related issue, it has run like a top for about 1k rounds so far.
With all due respect...why buy a quality firearm and not feed it quality ammo?
The Dumb Gun Collector
09-21-14, 21:58
Hahah, I shot thousands and thousands of Monarch Steel through my P2000. If it will eat it I could care less. It did, but I think even the steel stuff is slipping in quality (and that is saying something).
The quality and consistency of manufactured ammo these days is probably at an all-time low. It doesn't matter what gun you're using. Keep track of lot numbers at the range if you want to have a chance with the manufacturers in the case of a catastrophic ammo failure.
With all due respect...why buy a quality firearm and not feed it quality ammo?
Give me a break! I shoot all kinds of brass cased 9mm. I average about 1k rounds per month, so over the last two years, I've had to take what I could get sometimes. But I can assure you that I won't be using the Tula brass again. Lesson learned on that one.
Hahah, I shot thousands and thousands of Monarch Steel through my P2000. If it will eat it I could care less. It did, but I think even the steel stuff is slipping in quality (and that is saying something).
I resisted steel cases ammo for years; until that was all that I could find during the draught. And as training ammo I've been pretty impressed with the accuracy of Monarch brass or steel and Tula steel (3-4" offhand 5 shot groups at 25 yds, sometimes better). I've found a quite a few Monarch steel that had hard/bad primers that would not detonate in multiple Glocks but that's good training in an of itself.
Ouroborous
09-22-14, 20:40
In defense of my blasting lots o' ammo--I don't watch sports so I have to do something to get away from my family!
Preaching to the choir friend.
We're getting range reports with a solid round count from your habit to boot!
I'll do what I can to catch up when I pick mine up and take it to the range:)
Greg,
Thanks for the review and AAR. I've been waiting on the sidelines to see the feedback and reviews before I proceed on making a purchase.
Nice thread, thanks for the write up. I've got a PPQ that I really like and I've been planning to get a VP9 based on many of the reports here. But because Commiefornia law will make it impossible as of Jan. 1 I might not make it. We are getting screwed out here.
Looks like a great pistol hope I can get one before the deadline.
MikeDawg46L
09-25-14, 08:47
I've been watching the VP9 for a while and hesitated on getting one since I love my P30s. I don't see the VP9 replacing the P30 as my EDC but it would be a great bedside gun or "leave in the car/truck" option.
Glock and XD that I've owned and shot have seriously steered me away from striker guns, but it seems HK got this one right. I'm thinking I NEED one now.
Thanks for the great thread and continuing updates, Greg.
Sent from my awesome iPhone using Tapatalk
DiabhailGadhar
09-26-14, 22:43
So which would you choose between the vp9 and the USP 9? And why???
The Dumb Gun Collector
09-26-14, 23:45
At this point the VP9. Mainly due to the much improved ergonomics and trigger. Also, the USP is locked into a now obsolete rail system (although it can be worked-around).
No doubt though, the USP is a beast. A true "end of the world" tanker.
The Dumb Gun Collector
09-28-14, 19:59
Passed the 4k mark this weekend and the gun still looks new. I got a RCS holster for the gun with X400 Ultra and I have that permanently mounted now. I am going to keep an additional running tally of rounds with the X400 mounted to torture test 1. Zero, 2. Reliability, 3. Reliability of the gun with a substantial light on it. Up until now I had been practicing with a X200 which is a little smaller, and without the hanging laser doodad.
I actually think the viridian design with the laser closer to the bore is better in theory, but I am not a fan of the mounting method and the green laser fades out fast if it gets even a little hot. X400, pricey (*#&*(#, seems to be the best available. now.
Anyway, my drills consisted mainly of....
1. Bill drills.
2. El Prez drills.
3. Walking Forward and backwards shooting.
4. Walking from side to side and turning around while shooting drills.
I have transitioned from typically loading 5 rounds to 10 rounds per mag. That keeps me from flubbing my el pres drills and gets the weight of the mag close while still allowing me to do a fair number of reloads.
AGAIN, when you drop the mag press both levers, one with your thumb, one with your trigger finger. Fast as hell and keeps your finger off the trigger.
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3867/15199706608_9708fe9c3d_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/pa9te3)Untitled (https://flic.kr/p/pa9te3) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people/52942291@N00/), on Flickr
https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2946/15385990052_3c57537fdc_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/prBdNy)Untitled (https://flic.kr/p/prBdNy) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people/52942291@N00/), on Flickr
Humorously, I have been trying to hang my steel from the wire by various methods. Twine, zip ties, etc. Anything to keep my lazy but from putting up target stands. Nope, need stands. LOL
Yeah, Greg i've found it's just to much force not to use some heavy duty material for all but a .22. Plus, jacket and lead spalling will cut most things in a horizontal plane to the plate.
beschatten
09-29-14, 05:23
At this point the VP9. Mainly due to the much improved ergonomics and trigger. Also, the USP is locked into a now obsolete rail system (although it can be worked-around).
No doubt though, the USP is a beast. A true "end of the world" tanker.
Plus Jack Bauer. Okay maybe not. The USP just looks right though...
How would you compare it's shooting characteristics to the PPQ? Does their recoil spring actually do what it claims?
Plus Jack Bauer. Okay maybe not. The USP just looks right though...
How would you compare it's shooting characteristics to the PPQ? Does their recoil spring actually do what it claims?
I found the recoil to be softer than the PPQ, but I think that has more to do with slide weight and velocity than anything else and I never thought the PPQ was unpleasant to shoot anyway.
beschatten
09-29-14, 15:04
I found the recoil to be softer than the PPQ, but I think that has more to do with slide weight and velocity than anything else and I never thought the PPQ was unpleasant to shoot anyway.
Good to know. Are we talking like the .00Xth difference in split times?
I agree, kind of hard to complain about a 9mm's muzzle flip.
I found the recoil to be softer than the PPQ, but I think that has more to do with slide weight and velocity than anything else and I never thought the PPQ was unpleasant to shoot anyway.
The PPQ's recoil is so hard, it made the rocks inside my head rattle.
The PPQ's recoil is so hard, it made the rocks inside my head rattle.
Yeah right! You know you love the Q!
Yeah right! You know you love the Q!
I luv sum Jim and Nick's BBQ.
The Dumb Gun Collector
09-29-14, 18:27
We all know the Vp9 is Coke and the PPQ is Sam's cola. Some say Sam's is good enough, but those people have bad taste.
mikebenedict
09-29-14, 18:52
The right side slide release on my VP9 was most annoying as it was right where my left thumb wanted to be (i'm left handed) so i had .400" cut out of it and welded back together.
Came out great. the slide release is not i the way of my left thumb and is easier to drop the slide with my right thumb when i reload.
28800
The right side slide release on my VP9 was most annoying as it was right where my left thumb wanted to be (i'm left handed) so i had .400" cut out of it and welded back together.
Came out great. the slide release is not i the way of my left thumb and is easier to drop the slide with my right thumb when i reload.
28800
Nice job Mike!
By the way, what's the wait time on a VP9 owb holster and dual mag carrier?
The right side slide release on my VP9 was most annoying as it was right where my left thumb wanted to be (i'm left handed) so i had .400" cut out of it and welded back together.
Came out great. the slide release is not i the way of my left thumb and is easier to drop the slide with my right thumb when i reload.
28800
That's the right side lever HK should make the standard. Nice.
Outlander Systems
09-29-14, 19:04
I luv sum Jim and Nick's BBQ.
Dude, those little cornbread cheese muffin things are my drug!
mike benedict
09-29-14, 19:42
Nice job Mike!
By the way, what's the wait time on a VP9 owb holster and dual mag carrier?
less than two weeks
Mike
We all know the Vp9 is Coke and the PPQ is Sam's cola. Some say Sam's is good enough, but those people have bad taste.
Only a lawyer can kick you in the nuts without actually do it.
By the way, I used disappearing ink on that check. Ha.
less than two weeks
Mike
It would be a shorter wait if you buy him chicken wings.
Dude, those little cornbread cheese muffin things are my drug!
They put crack in those cheese muffins.
The Dumb Gun Collector
09-29-14, 20:58
Hahah I thought you would like that. Just kidding, I had a P99 back during the ban and it was awesome.
Heavy Metal
09-29-14, 21:14
I didn't find a break in period necessary in any of the 5 different VP9s I have experience with.
Mac said he shot Wolf Steel cased ammo, which as well as being underpowered, erratic quality, and dirty is not recommended by the HK VP9 manual.
In personally firing over 1400 rounds through 5 different VP9s, I only encountered one malfunction: a failure to feed. This occurred when I was shooting weak hand only with Blazer Brass 115 grain FMJ. This was within the first 200 rounds through tone particular gun. I later fired over 100 rounds of the same ammo through the same VP9 shooting weak-hand only without a single recurrence of this malfunction. This was the only malfunction I observed over the course of the ammo I fired and an additional 1000 rounds fired by other people. This includes at least 300 rounds of Winchester white box and a similar amount of Blazer Brass, as well as Federal, Remington, and Privi Brass 115 grain FMJ; Winchester Ranger JHPs, Federal HST, Black Hills FMJ & Tac-XP.
We did not fire any Wolf or steel cased ammo through any of the guns.
Wolf is stouter than I though it was. It reliably worked a friends luger this weekend. Still didn't make the sights any more visible.
lazerblazer
10-04-14, 10:41
I just got a vp9 yesterday and the locking block tooling marks look less than desirable. Is this going to be a functional issue down the road? what does everyone else's look like
http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14/10/04/0b966dc96b81c5662c8e30e16f1c2e88.jpghttp://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14/10/04/0abf9eb77f641af8130308aec50c31ca.jpg
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-04-14, 10:50
Standard. That's how it looks. Quit worrying and shoot!:neo:
If you really want to worry yourself, look closely at a P7. Lots of laser welds, machine tool swirls, etc. Very German/Skynet aesthetic.
lazerblazer
10-04-14, 10:52
Thanks for the encouragement I was just a little bummed that my new toy wasn't as shiny as expected. I'll shoot on and let hk take care of any problems.
Thanks for the encouragement I was just a little bummed that my new toy wasn't as shiny as expected. I'll shoot on and let hk take care of any problems.
There won't be any problems. It's not a handfit $3k 1911.
teutonicpolymer
10-04-14, 23:31
I don't think those are marks from machining just based on those pics
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-05-14, 16:45
300 rounds through the Vp today. As usual, no malfunction or drama of any kind.
The weather was extra nice so I finally got my targetmeister stands up. I set up two steel plates (still experimenting with how to attach to the 2x1) and I was ring-a-dinging the targets like a MF. I set the steel plates (each around 10x8 or so) at about 6 feet apart. I ran movement drills, timed drills, etc. Steel is where it is at for building speed. Next week I am going to set up 3 plates in el press format and one at 10 yards. I think that, and a dot trorture target are going to be my go-to practice setup from here on out.
Also happy to report that the X400 has run another 300 rounds without losing zero despite many speed draws and reholsterings in a hard RCS holster.
https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5597/15452190595_699c20b0fd_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/pxsvVe)image (https://flic.kr/p/pxsvVe) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people/52942291@N00/), on Flickr
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3935/15451848832_fa23932b65_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/pxqLjL)image (https://flic.kr/p/pxqLjL) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people/52942291@N00/), on Flickr
GHB
Wild Geese 1
10-05-14, 20:34
Anyone have a line on magazines, at the best price.
MountainRaven
10-05-14, 20:38
Anyone have a line on magazines, at the best price.
I got some from Midway. Might not have had the best prices, but I was surprised they (or anyone) had them.
Got mine from G&R Tactical
Plumber237
10-06-14, 10:09
Got mine from G&R Tactical
Yup...Grant's are the cheapest that I've found, which is why they go fast
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-12-14, 13:30
550 round this weekend--5050 round without issue.
Returned to shooting steel this weekend. Now have 4 steel plates in addition to the plates hanging at 50-75 yards). The Vp9 is a made for speed. Once you get into a rhythm you can build up so much speed you need to download your mags. Soon I will be the the Bill drill/el prez master!
teutonicpolymer
10-12-14, 19:12
People who have shot both the ppq and vp9, if you were starting fresh which would you get? They seem extremely similar in features, price, and possibly even quality but the ppq has a 5" version which is attractive to me since I already wouldn't use either of these for concealed carry anyways due to the size. I haven't been able to check out a vp9 in person yet but I have messed with the M1, M2, and M2 longslide ppq's.
People who have shot both the ppq and vp9, if you were starting fresh which would you get? They seem extremely similar in features, price, and possibly even quality but the ppq has a 5" version which is attractive to me since I already wouldn't use either of these for concealed carry anyways due to the size.
Good luck getting replacement parts for your PPQ. My friend has a gen1 PPQ and cannot not get a guide rod spring. Logistical support from walther is nil. HK will have plenty of logistical support for this weapon as I am sure they are trying to target the LEO market.
whatthepuck
10-12-14, 19:37
People who have shot both the ppq and vp9, if you were starting fresh which would you get? They seem extremely similar in features, price, and possibly even quality but the ppq has a 5" version which is attractive to me since I already wouldn't use either of these for concealed carry anyways due to the size. I haven't been able to check out a vp9 in person yet but I have messed with the M1, M2, and M2 longslide ppq's.
VP9 without a doubt is the better gun, IMHO.
Good luck getting replacement parts for your PPQ. My friend has a gen1 PPQ and cannot not get a guide rod spring. Logistical support from walther is nil. HK will have plenty of logistical support for this weapon as I am sure they are trying to target the LEO market.
Replacement parts are not a problem at all in my experience. Earl's had everything I needed, in stock, and shipped immediately. No issue's whatsoever.
As far as I can tell, getting parts for the VP9 is a bigger problem.
/
VP9 without a doubt is the better gun, IMHO.
Do you own both a PPQ and a VP9? I ask because I do, have several thousand rounds through both pistols and I can declare the VP9 the superior pistol only by the slimmest of margins and I attribute that simply to personal preference. I see nothing about the design, the engineering, or the ergonomics of one vs the other that would support your claim or superiority. My personal preference is for the VP9, but I have lots of doubt about which of the two is the better gun.
/
whatthepuck
10-12-14, 20:26
Do you own both a PPQ and a VP9? I ask because I do, have several thousand rounds through both pistols and I can declare the VP9 the superior pistol only by the slimmest of margins and I attribute that simply to personal preference. I see nothing about the design, the engineering, or the ergonomics of one vs the other that would support your claim or superiority. I have lots of doubt about which of the two is the better gun.
/
Had an m1 and m2, gladly rid myself of both of them. The HK just fits me better. Walther is way too flaky of a company for me, and the Hk just feels better made.
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-12-14, 20:29
If you need a long slide then the Walther is the obvious choice between the two.
I have a fair amount of time on both platforms (mostly P99) and starting from scratch the Vp9 would be my choice. They are very similar guns but I simply trust H&K to do things right.
Also, check out the damage to the finish of the X400 from hammering all these rounds down range.
https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2946/15331178980_a5af042308_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/pmLio5)image (https://flic.kr/p/pmLio5) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people/52942291@N00/), on Flickr
Beat Trash
10-13-14, 08:55
My issued M&P9 has a X300U on it with similar finish issues. I just think of it as character marks on the light. I do keep the lens coated with Chap Stick prior to practice sessions. Works wonders for protecting the lens from carbon buildup.
Once I retire and no longer have to carry an issued pistol, my VP9 will most likely become my retirement gun.
dieselgeek
10-13-14, 13:31
Just finished a 2 day class with mine over the weekend, reaching the 3000 round mark. Very impressed with this pistol. I did use some grip tape during the class, and stilted the rear and left panel when I got home. Very small stippling that followed the lines nicely. It's hard to even notice.
https://i.imgur.com/rkTdiKi.jpg
Just finished a 2 day class with mine over the weekend, reaching the 3000 round mark. Very impressed with this pistol. I did use some grip tape during the class, and stilted the rear and left panel when I got home. Very small stippling that followed the lines nicely. It's hard to even notice.
https://i.imgur.com/rkTdiKi.jpg
You lost your charging supports as well? Mine departed the gun on TD1. Kind of a bummer that they came out so easy, I liked them. HK customer service is going to send some more but they are out of stock at the moment.
I finally completed my review of the VP9 on my site, see it here (http://www.blackfinmp.com/blog/). Bottom line is that I'm very happy with this pistol. I'm going to stick with it for a year and see how things shake out. But for now it has finally retired my fifteen year old G17.
mikebenedict
10-13-14, 19:42
I have 2 PPQ M2s and the Vp9
both pistols are really pretty good
I would say the PPQ is a bit more accurate while the VP9 feels a bit better
This past weekend I set up a drill Sith 5 plates in a zigzag pattern and shot both pistols along with a Glock 17 and my normal IDPA pistol a M&P Pro
I was the fastest with the M&P. next the Walther then the Glock and the VP9 were pretty much the same
I have over a 100k rounds through a M&P so it did not surprise me that I was the fastest with that . The PPQ just seemed to point a bit quicker.
I like the VP9 and I'm certainly going to shoot it a lot more. Then I think I will try the same test again
Mike
number1olddog
10-13-14, 20:47
I lost my left side charging support last weekend. I just put on a set of HD sights and left them off. Until someone comes out with aftermarket supports be it aluminum or Steel they'll stay off my VP9.
VP9 looks like a winner to me. I need to check one out at the lgs. I have a feeling that if I like the ergo's I'll be getting one. Its too bad about the little charging things flying off. I think thats the only big flaw I've heard mentioned about it so far.
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-13-14, 22:40
Hey, folks who have had them come off, do you sling shot or do you use the slide release?
Hey, folks who have had them come off, do you sling shot or do you use the slide release?
I use the slide release. We were doing a lot of immediate and remedial action drills when the first came off.
I use the overhand method to rack the slide.
Hey, folks who have had them come off, do you sling shot or do you use the slide release?
I sense sarcasm :)
I have 2 PPQ M2s and the Vp9
both pistols are really pretty good
I would say the PPQ is a bit more accurate while the VP9 feels a bit better
This past weekend I set up a drill Sith 5 plates in a zigzag pattern and shot both pistols along with a Glock 17 and my normal IDPA pistol a M&P Pro
I was the fastest with the M&P. next the Walther then the Glock and the VP9 were pretty much the same
I have over a 100k rounds through a M&P so it did not surprise me that I was the fastest with that . The PPQ just seemed to point a bit quicker.
I like the VP9 and I'm certainly going to shoot it a lot more. Then I think I will try the same test again
Mike
Thanks for the comparisons Mike. Any other standardized drills that materialize would be neat.
Standard drills with high round counts should give a fair comparison between different types of handguns. Course of fire like the IDPA classifier (90 rounds) is a good one. Shoot one with type A gun then immediately shoot it with type B for a quick comparison. Keeping records of drills over the long run is an even better way to truly compare performances.
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-19-14, 18:37
250 Friday, 250 today.
Both days my drills pretty much worked out like this....
1. Shoot simplified Dot drills (six dots, 5 rounds each)
2. Shoot 3-4 steel plates from concealment, reload and work way back ( mags loaded with 4 rounds each)
3. Shoot 3-4 steel plates while moving.
4. Shoot 3-4 steel plates while performing a modified "snake drill" shooting around a post.
5. A fair amount of strong and weak handed shooting. Steel has improved my single handed shooting immensely--being able to hear the ring takes away the "trying too hard" that often screws up my shots. It should be noted that all of these are done with my X400 mounted. The Vp9s is absolutely insensitive to weak-handed shooting, and limp writing. Just a beast.
Plus miscellaneous shots at plates at 50-75 yards.
Steel EATS AMMO.
Laser is still dead zero.
A friend of mine brought out his VP9 which he reported as having a bad trigger. After tinkering with it I determined that different people just have different ideas about bad triggers. The trigger on his VP9 felt MUCH better than the crunchy mess on his G17, but that was what he perceived as good. In fact, other than being slightly heavier, I think his trigger was otherwise identical to mine which is obviously pretty broken in at this point.
I got to dry fire a competition shooters newish VP9. I think he has a good number of rounds through it. I liked the trigger a lot.
I thought it a little on the light side for the threat management role that some LE SME's have endorsed it for; what with the short take up and the break out earlier in the pull, and as light as it felt.
All six of my Glocks with minus connectors tip the scale at 5.25 to 5.5 lbs and a Gen 4 G26 with it's orginal "dot" is an anomaly and about the same. This VP9 felt dramatically lighter; and if many are like this one, it's no wonder many shooters say they are more accurate with them. Lighter usually translates to accurate shooting.
The reset was fine. Although I've been 90% on Glocks for over 15 years, I didn't have reset issues with my M&P across 2400 rounds and I can't imagine the VP9 reset being a problem for anyone.
I thought it a little on the light side for the threat management role that some LE SME's have endorsed it for; what with the short take up and the break out earlier in the pull, and as light as it felt.
All six of my Glocks with minus connectors tip the scale at 5.25 to 5.5 lbs and a Gen 4 G26 with it's orginal "dot" is an anomaly and about the same. This VP9 felt dramatically lighter; and if many are like this one, it's no wonder many shooters say they are more accurate with them. Lighter usually translates to accurate shooting.
My VP9, with 600 rounds through it, measured at 6 lb 4 oz trigger pull (Lyman guage, average of 10 pull. I suspect the one you played with felt lighter because it's so crisp by comparison to the usual gritty, creepy, mushy Glock trigger.
whatthepuck
10-20-14, 08:38
I don't have any means of testing actual trigger pull weights, but I did recently take my gen 4 g19 and vp9 out to the range for 200rds this weekend. I agree with the above poster about the difference in the glock and hk trigger. The hk has much less take up , and the takeup is very smooth. The glock takeup is rather mushy in comparison, but I find the breaks similar to me at least. My g19 is bone stock and has seen about 600rds or so.
I shot the vp9 accurately (for me) without much effort. I had to concentrate on fundamentals much more so with my g19 that I hadn't shot in a while to achieve the same level of accuracy. This is probably due to me really only shooting the hk over the past few wks, but also I think it can definitely be attributed to the superior trigger on the hk.
My VP9, with 600 rounds through it, measured at 6 lb 4 oz trigger pull (Lyman guage, average of 10 pull. I suspect the one you played with felt lighter because it's so crisp by comparison to the usual gritty, creepy, mushy Glock trigger.
Could be. My guns have quite a few rounds on them. Can't say they have any grit in the take up and no mush. They break similiarly clean but stack harder. I've seen reported weights from 4.25 to 6.5 in VP9 reviews. That's quite a range.
Could be. My guns have quite a few rounds on them. Can't say they have any grit in the take up and no mush. They break similiarly clean but stack harder. I've seen reported weights from 4.25 to 6.5 in VP9 reviews. That's quite a range.
I've found that a nice crisp break more-or-less makes trigger pull irrelevant. I was surprised at the measured trigger pull difference between my PPQs and my VP9 (5 lb 6 oz vs. 6 lb 4 oz) because they felt pretty much the same. The advantage of a pre-cocked striker (true single action), I suppose, compared to the semi-double action pull of the Glocks.
Good point about pre-cocked vs semi-DA.
Hmm so now that H&K has a decent single action trigger, where's all the people who call a 1911 trigger a crutch??
Hah! Calling a decent trigger a crutch is like calling a decent steering system in a car a crutch
MountainRaven
10-20-14, 14:11
Hah! Calling a decent trigger a crutch is like calling a decent steering system in a car a crutch
Hey, if you can't offensively drive with the floaty steering of a 1970 Cadillac, you clearly need to spend more time in training!
;)
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-20-14, 14:20
Hmm so now that H&K has a decent single action trigger, where's all the people who call a 1911 trigger a crutch??
LOL. Totally agree. 1911 folks should start calling out modern automaker guys for using the "crutch" of reliable handguns.
Yeah, pistols like that finicky Wilson you had......
Hah! Calling a decent trigger a crutch is like calling a decent steering system in a car a crutch
Getting your compression and rebound damping properly dialed-in will just give you a bunch of bad habits
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-20-14, 17:15
Yeah, pistols like that finicky Wilson you had......
Absolutely! Approximately 8000 rounds with about 3 malfunctions. And it fed every type of ammo I thew at it. Of course, a Wilson Combat Elite is hardly a standard 1911.
MountainRaven
10-20-14, 23:27
Yeah, pistols like that finicky Wilson you had......
Let me know when they get the price down to $650. Or even $950.
;)
Has anyone determined which Surefire DG switch works best with the VP9?
A thread on another site said the DG-11, 12, 14, 18, and 19 were a no go. Anyone have any luck trying other ones?
Has anyone determined which Surefire DG switch works best with the VP9?
A thread on another site said the DG-11, 12, 14, 18, and 19 were a no go. Anyone have any luck trying other ones?
Definitely not the 11. The DG 11 from my G21 worked acceptably with the p30, but there is a HUGE gap between the grip and the switch on the VP9.
Hah! Calling a decent trigger a crutch is like calling a decent steering system in a car a crutch
I love this quote!
kantstudien
10-22-14, 00:59
Has anyone determined which Surefire DG switch works best with the VP9?
A thread on another site said the DG-11, 12, 14, 18, and 19 were a no go. Anyone have any luck trying other ones?
I think we'll need to email Surefire and pester them about this. The more annoying the better the chances of them making one.
If they don't make a DG switch for the VP9, I might be swayed from using an X300U.
Great review of the VP9. Been itching to get my hands on one for the past few months even though I don't need it.
As for the 1911 comments, I may have traded a PPQ 1st edition and goodies for an old Kimber with a superb custom job on the trigger and slide... There's just something about a good old 1911 that places it in the same realm as a fine Scotch, a roaring fire in a stone hearth and the smell of Hoppes Number 9.
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-22-14, 20:08
I agree. In my opinion, a well-sorted 1911 is as good as a handgun can get. The VP9 is about as good as a mass-manufactured combat autoloader can get.
Greg,
Extremely well said. The key there is the words "well-sorted 1911" as the tolerances that I have seen come out of some manufacturers leaves much to be desired. It seems like HK really payed a lot of attention to minor details in the VP9 design, especially the compatibility of magazines with the P30 platform.
In my opinion, this was one of Walther's minor blunders- with the PPQ M1 and M2 magazines being incompatible, many PPQ owners got pretty frustrated when they couldn't find the right PPQ (M1 or M2) magazines in their local shop.
I'm a fan of the Walther PPQ, but the concept of "minor blunders" does tend to characterize their marketing plan over the last few years that I've owned firearms from that company.
Have to chime in that I appreciate that hard chrome P7M8 in the OP. Good stuff. I have it's kissing cousin the PSP in matching hard chrome. :D
I'm doing a little research and pondering nabbing a VP9 out here in CA while we still can (due to our draconian laws, off-roster handguns like this will be unavailable, for the most part, after 1 Jan 2015).
Is there any functional difference between the "standard" version with 2 magazines and the "LE" version with 3 magazines other than factory night-sights? I'm looking at a delta of approx. +$100 if I opt for the "LE" version.
The_Watcher
10-24-14, 06:55
Have to chime in that I appreciate that hard chrome P7M8 in the OP. Good stuff. I have it's kissing cousin the PSP in matching hard chrome. :D
I'm doing a little research and pondering nabbing a VP9 out here in CA while we still can (due to our draconian laws, off-roster handguns like this will be unavailable, for the most part, after 1 Jan 2015).
Is there any functional difference between the "standard" version with 2 magazines and the "LE" version with 3 magazines other than factory night-sights? I'm looking at a delta of approx. +$100 if I opt for the "LE" version.
The LE version earns you an extra mag and night sights only.
I was excited for the CCP, until I noticed that the frame only had a right hand thumb safety... Oops! It seems like an interesting concept but poor development that overlooks what in 2014 is now the standard: ambidextrous controls. Aside from that little issue, all the Walther's that I have owned have been very reliable, dead accurate and a joy to carry and shoot.
I am sure that once the VP9 becomes more widely supported by holster makers, it will be taking a large bite out of the Glock, XD and Walther market, although I have heard that a P30 holster fits well enough for a VP9 that it can be carried safely in one.
I had an awful experience with Tula brass maxx. The cases were trimmed so poorly that they were sticking in the chamber and preventing the VP9 from going into battery. Other than that ammo related issue, it has run like a top for about 1k rounds so far.
Seconded. I purchased 5 of the 100-round cylinders from Wallyworld and about 6% would cause this issue for me too.
ETA: your G19 says hello!
Seconded. I purchased 5 of the 100-round cylinders from Wallyworld and about 6% would cause this issue for me too.
ETA: your G19 says hello!
LOL! You don't know how glad I am that you have it and that it's serving you well!
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-26-14, 14:09
600 rounds of blazer aluminum this weekend (fri/sun).
The steel continues to eat my ammo at a rapid rate:cool:
In honor of John wick I blew through 100 rounds shooting in the central axis relock style. Waste of time but all in good fun.
I also shot an assload of rounds strong and weak handed. Shooting steel at thirty feet week handed makes you feel like a damn AMERICAN!!
Lots of shooting on the move.
Vp9ers who ride the slide levers! If you mount an x series surefire you can rest your thumb on the rocker switch and never have the issue again.
I can shoot the vp9 faster than any gun I have ever owned.
https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5601/15448086819_e5fc9c4cd2_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/px6u1t) (https://flic.kr/p/px6u1t) by stoiclawyer (https://www.flickr.com/people/52942291@N00/), on Flickr
I ran another 200 rounds today through my VP9 on a quick range trip; WWB. This brings the total round count to right around 900. Yet again, no FTF or stovepipes. Just a consistently 100% functional gun. The grip continues to impress and I do not get any trigger finger soreness; the shallow groove is not an issue. It's climbed the ladder to being my 2nd favorite. I still enjoy my M&P FS with APEX FSS kit and shoot it best due to the lighter and shorter trigger travel.
My only complaint is I keep riding the slide release and it fails to lock back on last round.
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-26-14, 23:11
Either slap an X200-400 on it or pretend one is on it. If you aim your thumb for the lever the problem is cured.
Either slap an X200-400 on it or pretend one is on it. If you aim your thumb for the lever the problem is cured.
Maybe I've had a few too many IPA's this evening...
How would a rail mounted light help the issue when you activate said light with your left hand thumb and most people (I assume) are riding the slide stop lever with their right hand thumb?
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-27-14, 21:07
Most of the folks I have seen are actually riding up hard and high with their support hand palm. It gives great support and lowers effective bore axis but it basically freezes the lever. Riding the light lever with your support thumb repositions your palm and angles your grip along the lines favored by shooters like E. Langdon. Try it out if it is an issue. I used to get it BAD with my P30 and Hk45c.
kantstudien
10-28-14, 20:41
Not really good news regarding a DG switch in development from Surefire:
I have not heard or seen anything to suggest that one will be produced for the VP9.
Best regards,
Jeffrey
Technical Support
SUREFIRE, LLC
My article on the VP9 is the cover article for the December 2014 issue of SWAT magazine. It should be available at retail stores by the first week in November. Subscribers should be receiving this issue right now.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i232/eds-stuff/vp9swat_zps16abb376.jpg
I played with one at Cabelas tonight. They had the standard version for $700 and the Tru-Glo night sight version for $800.
One thing I noticed was the triggers were both really great, but they were distinctly different from one another. The standard version felt slightly heavier. The guy said they hadn't been in long, since they sell out as soon as they arrive.
I've got $200 in Cabelas points sitting on my credit card. Might have to pick me up a $500 VP9...
I played with one at Cabelas tonight. They had the standard version for $700 and the Tru-Glo night sight version for $800.
One thing I noticed was the triggers were both really great, but they were distinctly different from one another. The standard version felt slightly heavier. The guy said they hadn't been in long, since they sell out as soon as they arrive.
I've got $200 in Cabelas points sitting on my credit card. Might have to pick me up a $500 VP9...
Georgia gun store has the regular for 545$ and le for 625$
teutonicpolymer
10-30-14, 13:44
Georgia gun store has the regular for 545$ and le for 625$
I've been looking at this and really want an LE model for that price, are they legit?
I've been looking at this and really want an LE model for that price, are they legit?
If you are a resident, yes. I've seen those prices at a couple of stores in the Atlanta area.
Georgia gun store has the regular for 545$ and le for 625$
Nice price... but it sounds like it's not useful for any out-of-state purchasers. :(
Our very own G&R is showing the LE model for $699 + shipping at this point.
I just received a $625 LE version from them...I'm not in Georgia...
I've been looking at this and really want an LE model for that price, are they legit?
Its where i got mine. Had it shipped to my ffl in charleston sc
teutonicpolymer
11-02-14, 08:02
Its where i got mine. Had it shipped to my ffl in charleston sc
May order one then. I final was able to check one out in person and whoever described it as like a gen 5 glock was right. It is nice but noit so nice that I would rush out to sell anythin so I could buy it. I was also expecting more from the trigger based on all the hype but it was still good, I think the PPQ trigger is just slightly better.
All that aside, if I were looking for a new handgun, I would be buying a PPQ or VP9 now, Glocks and others just seem slightly outdated by comparison and the LE VP9 package is actually a pretty good deal.
Not really good news regarding a DG switch in development from Surefire:
I have not heard or seen anything to suggest that one will be produced for the VP9.
Best regards,
Jeffrey
Technical Support
SUREFIRE, LLC
I wonder if any of the existing models are close enough?
YukonGlocker
11-02-14, 16:20
How is the trigger reach with small grips on a VP9 in comparison to a M&P with the small backstrap?
Either slap an X200-400 on it or pretend one is on it. If you aim your thumb for the lever the problem is cured.
I have big hands and my biggest problem with my VP9 is my support hand thumb hangs halfway off the front of the forward flat and slides off as I shoot due to the extended picatinny rail. I don't think aggressive stippling will help much. I've tried resting my thumb on the X300 Ultra but I won't always have that on there.
Texpatriate
01-12-15, 16:37
I'm ordering a VP9 and I was surprised to find out that it uses P30 magazines. Anybody know what other accessories are interchangeable? I'm specifically interested in finding out if night sights for the P30 will work with the VP9, but other info on the interchangeability of other P30 accessories would be welcome as well. Thanks.
I believe that they will.
masternave
01-12-15, 18:10
Has anyone stippled underneath their VP9 trigger guard? I've become pretty fond of it on other handguns, and haven't seen a good example of it done on a VP9 or any HK with the HK style magazine release yet.
Wild Geese 1
01-12-15, 19:23
I'm ordering a VP9 and I was surprised to find out that it uses P30 magazines. Anybody know what other accessories are interchangeable? I'm specifically interested in finding out if night sights for the P30 will work with the VP9, but other info on the interchangeability of other P30 accessories would be welcome as well. Thanks.
I do not know about the P30 sights working, but I put the HEINIE EZ fit on mine, IMHO they are the way to go take a look at them, and anyone can install, and adjust them, 2,500 rounds and they have not moved they hold their zero perfectly.
I'm ordering a VP9 and I was surprised to find out that it uses P30 magazines. Anybody know what other accessories are interchangeable? I'm specifically interested in finding out if night sights for the P30 will work with the VP9, but other info on the interchangeability of other P30 accessories would be welcome as well. Thanks.
VP9=P30=HK45 sights. That and magazines, to my knowledge, is the extent of the interchangeability. They not only interchange but POI is said to be consistent as well, which doesn't "always" happen with aftermarket.
Texpatriate
01-13-15, 14:40
VP9=P30=HK45 sights. That and magazines, to my knowledge, is the extent of the interchangeability. They not only interchange but POI is said to be consistent as well, which doesn't "always" happen with aftermarket.
Just to clarify, you are saying that HK45 sights work on the VP9, correct? Thanks.
Just to clarify, you are saying that HK45 sights work on the VP9, correct? Thanks.
Yep...........
I agree. In my opinion, a well-sorted 1911 is as good as a handgun can get. The VP9 is about as good as a mass-manufactured combat autoloader can get.
And there it is.
To me the 1911 is a "cheater pistol", tongue-in-cheek. It surely flatters my ability to hit accurately at distance and at speed. Love well-built samples. By that I mean going over the pistol; shooting it for reliability and then re-going over the components modifying or replacing what is not deemed correct.
They are the "perfect" pistol.
The VP9 is as good a mass produced pistol to be found, I believe. And that's saying a helluva lot.
-------------------------------------
"One cannot awaken a man who pretends to be asleep."
Texpatriate
02-01-15, 16:09
I've seen 2 or 3 VP9/P30 mags advertised as being 10 round mags that are 15 rounders blocked to 10 rounds like this: http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=361203431320. Not that I have any plans to buy a $105 mag, but is this the case with all 10 round VP9 mags, that they can be unblocked to a full cap 15 round mag?
Sorry if this is common to all 10 rounders, but I've always been fortunate to live in a free state and I don't think I've even seen in person a reduced cap mag since the ban sunset. Thanks.
I've seen 2 or 3 VP9/P30 mags advertised as being 10 round mags that are 15 rounders blocked to 10 rounds like this: http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=361203431320. Not that I have any plans to buy a $105 mag, but is this the case with all 10 round VP9 mags, that they can be unblocked to a full cap 15 round mag?
Sorry if this is common to all 10 rounders, but I've always been fortunate to live in a free state and I don't think I've even seen in person a reduced cap mag since the ban sunset. Thanks.
Nope, they are USP9 compact 10 round mag bodies with a different spring and an extended floor plate.
m1a_scoutguy
02-01-15, 17:40
Nope, they are USP9 compact 10 round mag bodies with a different spring and an extended floor plate.
Luckily for saps like me that live behind enemy lines most of the gun company's think of us & offer "real" 10 rd factory mags & for that I thank them ! I bought a few from Grant @ G&R when I first bought my VP9, his prices were very fair considering HK mags are expensive. I also got a few from Buds Gun Shop @ a good price. I have considered buying a few 15 rd mags and blocking them but I have 8 factory 10 rd mags so I am good to go at the moment,as time goes on I will grab more I am sure. I haven't looked hard in awhile but seems like no one has 10 rd mags at the moment !! Maybe tax time or so,,LOL ;)
I've got to say Greg, you were right.
The VP9 is where it's at. I picked mine up and put a very variety of ammo through it and it's one accurate, easy shooting pistol. I'm even giving it the edge over the PPQ.
I've got to say Greg, you were right.
The VP9 is where it's at. I picked mine up and put a very variety of ammo through it and it's one accurate, easy shooting pistol. I'm even giving it the edge over the PPQ.
Greg said good bye to the VP9 many months ago.
Greg said good bye to the VP9 many months ago.
What!? M4C's biggest VP9 advocate has jumped ship? [emoji6]
Just kidding. What did he move on to?
What!? M4C's biggest VP9 advocate has jumped ship? [emoji6]
Just kidding. What did he move on to?
Dude, where have you been? He sold that VP9 a month after the Langdon class that you came by. A friggin month ! He's back to his old FNX or something.
Greg said good bye to the VP9 many months ago.
It's been to long since I've been here. Can ya tell?
That's disappointing, I'm very impressed with it.
It's been to long since I've been here. Can ya tell?
That's disappointing, I'm very impressed with it.
He was impressed with it too, I think he got bored that he couldn't break it. He's working on breaking the FN, maybe it's easier.
Dude, you forgot about the new baby! I've not had alot of time to keep up lately. ;)
Dude, you forgot about the new baby! I've not had alot of time to keep up lately. ;)
You're forgiven.
The Dumb Gun Collector
05-20-15, 18:16
The Vp9 is fantastic. In my opinion there is no better striker gun out there. I dumped everything to focus on my fnx when my suppressor came in. I had planned to stick it out with my hk but at the time there were no suppressor sights available.
The Dumb Gun Collector
05-20-15, 18:17
I'll pick up another if the ever make a p2000 sized one.
I'll pick up another if the ever make a p2000 sized one.
Now, that is what I hope they do!
I'll pick up another if the ever make a p2000 sized one.
That would probably be the tipping point for me. I'd seriously have to think about ditching the M&P9 & 9C for a VP9 / 9c combo platter.
I'm sticking with my M&P with a couple of Apex parts as far as the striker fired gun. No grocks, just sold my PPQ.
I do have a few DA/SA guns though.
I'm sticking with my M&P with a couple of Apex parts as far as the striker fired gun. No grocks, just sold my PPQ.
I do have a few DA/SA guns though.
Same here. My 9FS with the Apex FSS is hard to beat. And the 9c with DCAEK has been a trusted carry piece for several years now.
Beat Trash
05-21-15, 09:11
I'll pick up another if the ever make a p2000 sized one.
In a New Your Second!
I was always a Sig guy and still am, but after handling my first M&P FS I bought one from Grant, then another. I had all of the M&P's in 9mm.
Never warmed to the 9c so it is gone. Still with the Shield and FS. More than likely will get a 320c. Never owned an HK anything. Maybe a VP9 would be nice.
WickedWillis
05-22-15, 18:23
I was always a Sig guy and still am, but after handling my first M&P FS I bought one from Grant, then another. I had all of the M&P's in 9mm.
Never warmed to the 9c so it is gone. Still with the Shield and FS. More than likely will get a 320c. Never owned an HK anything. Maybe a VP9 would be nice.
I am a die-hard Glock, Sig and HK fan. The VP9 is my favorite striker-fired handgun that I own. It makes me look good at the range.
I am a die-hard Glock, Sig and HK fan. The VP9 is my favorite striker-fired handgun that I own. It makes me look good at the range.
How long does it take you to detail strip, clean and reassemble? It may be an excellent platform but it's like every other HK pistol. Way over engineered. And parts aren't easy to get nor affordable.
Phillygunguy
05-23-15, 21:03
How long does it take you to detail strip, clean and reassemble? It may be an excellent platform but it's like every other HK pistol. Way over engineered. And parts aren't easy to get nor affordable.
VP9 is easier to field strip than a glock way more engineered and yet no btf
The Dumb Gun Collector
05-23-15, 21:34
The VP9 is well-engineered. Lots of good thought went into that design.
The VP9 is well-engineered. Lots of good thought went into that design.
Good looking to boot.
VP9 is easier to field strip than a glock way more engineered and yet no btf
Detail strip it. Not field strip. Total disassembly and reassembly. Comprehension is a skill.
Nightstalker865
05-24-15, 09:41
Detail strip it. Not field strip. Total disassembly and reassembly. Comprehension is a skill.
My question is, why do you feel the need to detail strip it often? I can't imagine needing to detail strip it for cleaning, but maybe every 10K rounds or so.
My cleaning schedule is:
Field strip and clean every 1K rounds.
Detail strip and clean every 10-15K rounds.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
How long does it take you to detail strip, clean and reassemble? It may be an excellent platform but it's like every other HK pistol. Way over engineered. And parts aren't easy to get nor affordable.
That's all you got? Move along quietly, that is noise. There is precious little reason to detail strip any firearm.
There is precious little reason to detail strip any firearm.
Now that statement is hilarious!
Phillygunguy
05-24-15, 11:12
Detail strip it. Not field strip. Total disassembly and reassembly. Comprehension is a skill.
If you want to totally disassemble the gun one would take an armorers class
m1a_scoutguy
05-24-15, 11:28
My question is, why do you feel the need to detail strip it often? I can't imagine needing to detail strip it for cleaning, but maybe every 10K rounds or so.
My cleaning schedule is:
Field strip and clean every 1K rounds.
Detail strip and clean every 10-15K rounds.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
If you want to totally disassemble the gun one would take an armorers class
That's why they make Gun Blaster Powder Solvent. ;)
Phillygunguy
05-24-15, 11:57
That's why they make Gun Blaster Powder Solvent. ;)
I get why he's talking about detail stripping a gun. Parts break, need replacement etc. But if you take a course certified one at that you can do it for the VP 9
DreadPirateMoyer
05-24-15, 13:31
The VP9 could be perfect in every way and mayo would still have a problem with it. It's not a Glock.
Don't bother wasting your time on this discussion.
Dionysusigma
05-24-15, 13:36
Eh. It's a rainy Sunday. :)
A question: I've heard that to remove the plate at the rear of the slide, one follows much the same steps as on a Glock. My issue is that the material used for the striker assembly "sleeve" seems unusually soft, and acts like it wants to deform rather than move forward. Is something awry here?
m1a_scoutguy
05-24-15, 14:00
I get why he's talking about detail stripping a gun. Parts break, need replacement etc. But if you take a course certified one at that you can do it for the VP 9
Eh. It's a rainy Sunday. :)
A question: I've heard that to remove the plate at the rear of the slide, one follows much the same steps as on a Glock. My issue is that the material used for the striker assembly "sleeve" seems unusually soft, and acts like it wants to deform rather than move forward. Is something awry here?
I hear ya,,that makes sense to want to know how to detail strip,I just don't do it very often so I don't worry about it much. Its been awhile now and I can't remember but I know its easier depending on how the Striker is set,whether under tension or released,,I know with my Glock and FNS the back plate slips out very easy once the Striker is set the correct way,could be worth checking to see which way works for ya. As usual Youtube is great for most things,,even though the VP9 has been out for awhile I don't know if there is something on there yet or not about detail stripping the VP.
Dionysusigma
05-24-15, 14:26
Good news: I fiddled a bit with it just now and got it out okay.
Bad news: The material used for the Support Sleeve (http://www.hkparts.net/shop/pc/Support-Sleeve-VP9-367p16830.htm) does indeed feel really soft. As in, there's got to be a damn good reason somewhere - I hope - that HK used this stuff. It's definitely deformed. Anyone have any input as to why this is going on? Is it a safety issue (pierced primers, maybe)?
I've only got 600 rounds (fully documented) through this, and now I'm worried. :sad:
33371
Phillygunguy
05-24-15, 14:31
Good news: I fiddled a bit with it just now and got it out okay.
Bad news: The material used for the Support Sleeve (http://www.hkparts.net/shop/pc/Support-Sleeve-VP9-367p16830.htm) does indeed feel really soft. As in, there's got to be a damn good reason somewhere - I hope - that HK used this stuff. It's definitely deformed. Anyone have any input as to why this is going on? Is it a safety issue (pierced primers, maybe)?
I've only got 600 rounds (fully documented) through this, and now I'm worried. :sad:
33371
You know detail stripping your gun may void the warranty.
Now that statement is hilarious!
Hardly. Keep digging.
Dionysusigma
05-24-15, 14:39
You know detail stripping your gun may void the warranty.
If it's a part I can replace myself (which this is), I don't mind. I can't remember the last time I used a warranty anyway (repairing complicated, expensive equipment is what I do for a living and hobby). It's run just fine so far, and has been my most favorite pistol I've ever owned (magazine availability aside).
I'm just wondering if this is something to be concerned about.
Phillygunguy
05-24-15, 14:41
If it's a part I can replace myself (which this is), I don't mind. I can't remember the last time I used a warranty anyway (repairing complicated, expensive equipment is what I do for a living and hobby). It's run just fine so far, and has been my most favorite pistol I've ever owned (magazine availability aside).
I'm just wondering if this is something to be concerned about.
If your gun hasn't had any problems, why look for them?
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