View Full Version : P Mag problem in cold weather.
Alaskapopo
06-13-08, 02:58
I just got back from a 3 gun shoot in Fairbanks Alaska. I like P mags and was talking to one of the shop owners up there who was at the shoot. He showed me 2 P mags with busted feed lips. He said they got broken in -40 below weather. I grew up in Fairbanks and I have seen it -60. I also know how hard cold weather is on plastics in general. This is a concern for anyone using P mags in sub 0 weather. I intended to keep all 45 of my P Mags as it does not get that cold in the southern part of the state. But my go to mags in the winter are going to remain HK. I hope MagPul can get this issued worked out. The shop owner is going to bring the mags to the next shot show. I am a huge P Mag fan but this is an area of concern for me. It is not going to be a concern for most of you down in the lower 48.
Pat
Hmmm... that is good info. Don't think I'll ditch my P-mags, as I live in Idaho, but It does get cold in the mountains here. I wonder what the threshold for risk of breakage is. Anything below 0 deg? -20 deg?
Perhaps Drake or NickB will chime in?
dwhitehorne
06-13-08, 08:38
-60 wow. I think everything man made has its temperature limits. I missed cold weather training in my unit years ago. I do remember everyone switching from CLP to LSA for the weapons. I wonder how anything works including humans in -60 degrees. I can't image that type of cold. David
We're lucky if it gets down to 40 above here! :p
"I hope MagPul can get this issued worked out. The shop owner is going to bring the mags to the next shot show."
First off. do we know this to be the issue? for sure
did they crack when dropped loaded in the cold. how did they crack
I have run mine pretty hard down to -10 then with windchill a bit more.
why wait till shot show why not send them back? or call magpul if he hasnt done so
i know anything is possible we need abit more info here.
To me, this is a non issue.
What kind of fighting is realistic in 40 below weather anyway?
"I hope MagPul can get this issued worked out. The shop owner is going to bring the mags to the next shot show."
First off. do we know this to be the issue? for sure
did they crack when dropped loaded in the cold. how did they crack
I have run mine pretty hard down to -10 then with windchill a bit more.
why wait till shot show why not send them back? or call magpul if he hasnt done so
i know anything is possible we need abit more info here.
This is all true. The shop owner might have had the early gen I's.
Tech Expos, SS, etc are generally the worst place to contact a manufacturer about a problem (as they are very busy). Much better to call them.
C4
I just got back from a 3 gun shoot in Fairbanks Alaska. I like P mags and was talking to one of the shop owners up there who was at the shoot. He showed me 2 P mags with busted feed lips. He said they got broken in -40 below weather. I grew up in Fairbanks and I have seen it -60. I also know how hard cold weather is on plastics in general. This is a concern for anyone using P mags in sub 0 weather. I intended to keep all 45 of my P Mags as it does not get that cold in the southern part of the state. But my go to mags in the winter are going to remain HK. I hope MagPul can get this issued worked out. The shop owner is going to bring the mags to the next shot show. I am a huge P Mag fan but this is an area of concern for me. It is not going to be a concern for most of you down in the lower 48.
Pat
Pat, I would not keep HK as my "Go To Mag." They have all sorts of fleas and while they may work right now, once their springs become weaker, they will not feed. They are also heavy, will rust and generally do not do well in SBR's (even when new). There is a GEN II version out to fix some of these issues, but do not think it has really fixes anything.
If you need an a trusted mag, NHMTG or BCM with Magpul followers is the best game in town (for alum.).
C4
thetallengineer
06-13-08, 10:10
"I hope MagPul can get this issued worked out. The shop owner is going to bring the mags to the next shot show."
First off. do we know this to be the issue? for sure
did they crack when dropped loaded in the cold. how did they crack
I have run mine pretty hard down to -10 then with windchill a bit more.
why wait till shot show why not send them back? or call magpul if he hasnt done so
i know anything is possible we need abit more info here.
Wind chill is a "felt" temperature on skin. A PMag in -10 deg F conditions is still -10 deg F regardless of the wind chill factor.
I would love to speak with the shop owner to get details. We have tested the PMAG up to -30 and have seen very minimal problems. Without talking directly to the guy with the issues I can't comment. drake@magpul.com please.
The Dumb Gun Collector
06-13-08, 10:47
I have some Magpuls, one of which was sort of given to me, and they are fine. Still, the number of -60 degree days in Georgia are limited until the sun goes out, so I won't be tossing my plastic mags away yet.
But I really think the D&H mags at $9.99 are a great choice.
Heavy Metal
06-13-08, 12:29
-60 wow. I think everything man made has its temperature limits. I missed cold weather training in my unit years ago. I do remember everyone switching from CLP to LSA for the weapons. I wonder how anything works including humans in -60 degrees. I can't image that type of cold. David
I think you mean Lubricating Oil, for Aircraft Weapons, Specification MIL-L-14107B commonly referred to as LAW. Used also as a small arms lubricant at very low temps.
IIRC, LSA's temp range does not go as low as even CLP's.
Heavy Metal
06-13-08, 12:32
To me, this is a non issue.
What kind of fighting is realistic in 40 below weather anyway?
Well, if you are David Soul and Cathy Crosby trying to save the Alaskan pipeline and prevent the Soviets from starting WWIII...............
Alaskapopo
06-13-08, 15:14
This is all true. The shop owner might have had the early gen I's.
Tech Expos, SS, etc are generally the worst place to contact a manufacturer about a problem (as they are very busy). Much better to call them.
C4
They are dark earth colored mags and are not generation 1. As for the poster who said what type of fighting is realistic at -40 well that is a a fact of life in the Fairbanks area. Their SWAT guys have had to sit outside of houses in those temperatures quite often.
Pat
Their SWAT guys have had to sit outside of houses in those temperatures quite often.
Pat
I think I'd explore a career change to southern law enforcement. :eek:
Alaskapopo
06-13-08, 15:20
I would love to speak with the shop owner to get details. We have tested the PMAG up to -30 and have seen very minimal problems. Without talking directly to the guy with the issues I can't comment. drake@magpul.com please.
I sent you an email with his contact info. I love P mags and I hope this can get worked out and like I said it does not apply to most of the world just the cold regions.
Pat
They are dark earth colored mags and are not generation 1. As for the poster who said what type of fighting is realistic at -40 well that is a a fact of life in the Fairbanks area. Their SWAT guys have had to sit outside of houses in those temperatures quite often.
Pat
Got the email. I'll be following up with him. Thanks.
toddackerman
06-14-08, 09:55
To me, this is a non issue.
What kind of fighting is realistic in 40 below weather anyway?
That's right...every one of the BG's is in their igloo having a "Cold One".
toddackerman
06-14-08, 10:05
Grant,
How are D&H magazines?
Cheers,
NoBody
Not Grant, but I believe they are the same manufactured off of the old LaBelle tooling which was USGI. I swear by the D&H Teflon Mags as my go to Mags. I also have some Mil Spec Coated ones.
Grant...am I correct? There's so many people stamping the LaBelle tooled Mags these days that I can't keep track. I,e., D&H, LaBelles, Brownell's etc.
Who is the company that owns the tooling now???
Not Grant, but I believe they are the same manufactured off of the old LaBelle tooling which was USGI. I swear by the D&H Teflon Mags as my go to Mags. I also have some Mil Spec Coated ones.
Grant...am I correct? There's so many people stamping the LaBelle tooled Mags these days that I can't keep track. I,e., D&H, LaBelles, Brownell's etc.
Who is the company that owns the tooling now???
You are correct.
C4
To me, this is a non issue.
What kind of fighting is realistic in 40 below weather anyway?
Just wait until the next ice age and the zombie hordes are at your door to top it off. :D
I just got back from a 3 gun shoot in Fairbanks Alaska. I like P mags and was talking to one of the shop owners up there who was at the shoot. He showed me 2 P mags with busted feed lips. He said they got broken in -40 below weather. I grew up in Fairbanks and I have seen it -60. I also know how hard cold weather is on plastics in general. This is a concern for anyone using P mags in sub 0 weather. I intended to keep all 45 of my P Mags as it does not get that cold in the southern part of the state. But my go to mags in the winter are going to remain HK. I hope MagPul can get this issued worked out. The shop owner is going to bring the mags to the next shot show. I am a huge P Mag fan but this is an area of concern for me. It is not going to be a concern for most of you down in the lower 48.
Pat
I know the shop owner too. I also know the cops that owned these mags. They busted while shooting and caused double feed. They were the green ones. The shop owner said he is not sure if it is a color thing, he uses the tan ones in the cold with no problem but has suggested the ones he uses aren't cold soaked for hours prior to shooting. There is no reason to disbelieve their stories. They are all serious shooters.
I have not experienced P-Mag problems and own several. But don't use them in the extream cold. All sorts of plastic break up here in the cold, Car manufactures have all sorts of problems when the temp heads downward of -40.
No problem with HK mags for a serious bullet dispenser. They work the best I have used in sub -40 weather. As any mag, toss them if they quit working.
By the way fighting in cold weather is not for pussies. US Troops got their ass kick by Mother Nature Alaska while trying to free us from Japs in WWII. They were saved and the mission a success due to a group of Alaskan trappers & Natives............
lanceriley
06-19-08, 06:56
thats very cold!!!!!
By the way fighting in cold weather is not for pussies.
You aren't kidding. I'd just take my toys and go home instead! :p
decodeddiesel
06-19-08, 12:00
Well, if you are David Soul and Cathy Crosby trying to save the Alaskan pipeline and prevent the Soviets from starting WWIII...............
LOL, haven't seen that movie in a very long time.
You aren't kidding. I'd just take my toys and go home instead! :p
Me too.....I am a South Floridian temporarily relocated to North Carolina. It gets too cold here for me in the winter. Been here 7 years and I still am miserable all winter long.
rifleshooter
06-19-08, 15:40
I have been reading about this Lancer Systems L5 Mag. And from what they have posted on their Web. site they claim their Mags have with stood droping fullyload at -50 F and +180 F without any damage.
Could this be a better choice in real cold weather? I have never had my Magpul P-Mags in any real cold weather but it would not make me happy if they would fail.
http://www.lancer-systems.com/L5.html
Translucent Magazine & Accessories
The L5 is a translucent 30 round magazine developed for the 5.56mm M16/M4/AR15 rifle. It has an impact resistant translucent polymer body, corrosion resistant steel feed lips and a removable, patent pending, rubber coated bottom. The L5 was designed to be used with the existing magazine pouches and carriers.
CLICK HERE - Distributor List
Features:
Made in the USA
Translucent polymer body that is impact resistant through a wide range of temperatures
Can be dropped onto the feed lips without damage
Withstands 5’ drop,fully loaded onto concrete at -50F and +180F
Withstands 5’ drop, fully loaded dropped with rifle
Body and component materials that are corrosion and chemical resistant
Steel feed lips with a corrosion resistant coating, permanently molded into the body.
Round Count Markers at 20 and 30 rounds
Body texture, contour and rubber coated bottom are designed to provide positive gripping and improve retrieval from magazine pouches.
Body design incorporates a constant radius geometry that facilitates follower/spring travel.
Same basic design envelop as the USGI aluminum magazine, can be used with existing pouches and carriers.
Easy to disassemble and maintain
Benefits:
Ability to visually inspect rounds:
• Reduces Pre & Post operation inspection time
• Increases overall operational tempo
• Increase safety for range operations
• Reduces maintenance time
Corrosion resistant
Permanent color retention
Can be stored loaded for extended periods of time with no lip creep
Designed to maximize grip for quick access and loading
Durable - impact, drop and crush resistant
Reliable:
• Steel feed lips provide consistent, positive feeding
• Body and follower engineered for maximum reliability
• The magazine's readiness can be determined visually
• Tested and proved with over 30,000 rounds
Specification:
Weapon Type: AR15 / M4 / M16
Caliber: 5.56 x 45 mm NATO
Capacity: 30-rounds
Weight: Unloaded: 4.1 oz
Dimensions:
• Total Height: 7.35 ”
• Width, Body: .94”
• Width, at support rib: 1.07”
• Width, Bottom: .99”
• Length, Body: 2.56“
• Length, at support rib: 2.6”
• Length, Bottom: 2.69”
decodeddiesel
06-19-08, 16:24
In all honesty unless you're doing some type of extended operations outdoors (e.g. out of a heated police cruiser for hours) in the Arctic circle, I really don't see how this is an issue. I mean honestly, who here with possibly the exception of Alaskapopo can say they sat outside with their P-mags in -40F weather long enough for them to "cold soak" and become brittle enough to fail? Seriously, there's simply a matter of understanding the limitations of ones equipment and dealing with it.
"I want to be assured my M4 will function in deep space at -454F!"
there's simply a matter of understanding the limitations of ones equipment and dealing with it.
"I want to be assured my M4 will function in deep space at -454F!"
True... But if you have a rifle that works in below zero temperatures, then you may as well have mags that also work.
Alaskapopo
06-19-08, 16:46
In all honesty unless you're doing some type of extended operations outdoors (e.g. out of a heated police cruiser for hours) in the Arctic circle, I really don't see how this is an issue. I mean honestly, who here with possibly the exception of Alaskapopo can say they sat outside with their P-mags in -40F weather long enough for them to "cold soak" and become brittle enough to fail? Seriously, there's simply a matter of understanding the limitations of ones equipment and dealing with it.
"I want to be assured my M4 will function in deep space at -454F!"
It is an issue for SWAT and patrol officers who may have to sit on a barricade gun man call for hours in sub zero weather. Been there and done that. I agree this is not an issue for most people. Heck not even me now that I no longer live in Fairbanks. But its still an issue.
Pat
Failure2Stop
06-19-08, 16:57
". . .every clime and place. . ."
-From some Hymn :eek:
It's pretty hard to find a single item that works from extreme to extreme. Extreme cold sucks in all ways imaginable, and if a product I have great confidence in in 99% of my application doesn't work in that 1%, well, I won't take it into that environment. It's fairly self-centric to diminish the issue raised by the OP just because you don't live in that environment.
Obviously there are people that need to work in those environments. If not, the issue would have never been raised.
While I prefer PMAGS for my use, I have a sizeable stockpile of personal OKay mags with MagPul followers. Now I know that when I find myself headed to an area that could potentially expose me and my gear to nearly absolute-zero, I will take my OKays with me in lieu of PMAGS. Thanks for the info. Should this turn out to be a fluke, great, but until then I will simply utilize another MagPul product anyway.
Pat, I would not keep HK as my "Go To Mag." They have all sorts of fleas and while they may work right now, once their springs become weaker, they will not feed. They are also heavy, will rust and generally do not do well in SBR's (even when new). There is a GEN II version out to fix some of these issues, but do not think it has really fixes anything.
If you need an a trusted mag, NHMTG or BCM with Magpul followers is the best game in town (for alum.).
C4
OK, new guy here. While reading this post I could not decipher what the acronyms "NHMTG or BCM" stand for. Please advise.
If your aluminum USGI magazines and carbine are truly at sub -40 degrees Fahrenheit; you likely will not want to touch them, or the metal parts of your carbine, with you bare skin...
Just a FYI...
B
P.S. Brings a whole new meaning to the phrase "nose to charging handle"...
lanceriley
06-19-08, 23:29
I have to agree that no equipment can satisfy extremes.
but consider this... at those -60 temperatures... I won't worry about my equipment malfunctioning... I might not be functioning myself at that temperature :D :D :D
Alaskapopo
06-20-08, 00:00
If your aluminum USGI magazines and carbine are truly at sub -40 degrees Fahrenheit; you likely will not want to touch them, or the metal parts of your carbine, with you bare skin...
Just a FYI...
B
P.S. Brings a whole new meaning to the phrase "nose to charging handle"...
Yes that is true that is what gloves are for lol.
Pat
OK, new guy here. While reading this post I could not decipher what the acronyms "NHMTG or BCM" stand for. Please advise.
NHMTG in Hartford, CT - Makes magazines for Colt & others
and
Bravo Company. http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/AR15-Magazines-p/magazines%20dh%20bt30mf%2010pack.htm
No Bananas
06-20-08, 09:59
:eek: :eek: :eek: -60!!! -60???!!!!! For a guy out in AZ, that is well beyond my comprehension (it was 111 here yesterday). I didn't know that anything, guns, plastics, mags, animals, people, cars, electricity, light or any other force could exist in -60. But, If Magpul wants a gov't contract maybe that's something they need to consider. I haven't had my Pmags out in the summer heat, yet.
I have to agree that no equipment can satisfy extremes.
but consider this... at those -60 temperatures... I won't worry about my equipment malfunctioning... I might not be functioning myself at that temperature :D :D :D
Gear changes with the mission for the most part. Lots of folks up here change from summer to winter tires.
I change the lube I use in my weapons to match the season. Nothing wrong with changing mags for the season.
Although the jury is not quite in with the p-mags. As stated only 2 green ones have cracked to date that I know of due to cold.
I might add that lots of us snowmachine in cold weather here trapping and hunting. There are many times where I would have to dig in cause temps dropped below -40 which made riding a pain. I have left my rifle outside on the machine as not to cause condensation bringing it in and out from the heat. Like I said I have never fired p-mags in those temps after a cold soak. Animals & such tend to dig in for the real cold spells.
I still use p-mags the most as 75% of my shooting is done at 30 above or warmer.
Has anybody gotten Dr.Drake the contact info so he can confirm this?
If not, this thread may have a short life span.
Detective_D
06-20-08, 16:08
Has anybody gotten Dr.Drake the contact info so he can confirm this?
If not, this thread may have a short life span.
that is kinda what I was thinking....making magpul look like on here that they are making subpar equipment & could be hurting business over something they were not even contacted about.
Of course I just bought a couple more pmags so it didnt change my mind. :D
But I dont think I would survive in -60 weather so it wouldnt matter about my pmags.
decodeddiesel
06-20-08, 16:11
I really think most everyone here is blowing this thing way way out of proportion. In realty it does not get that cold in the mountains of Afghanistan, yes it will get to sub-zero which when you are a grunt toughing it out on patrol feels like straight death, but the OP stated he spoke with another individual who had 2 mags, both fail at temps below -40F after an extended cold soak. Not going to happen in Afghanistan. If everyone here wants to believe that their P-mags will fail at below freezing temperatures and therefor discount it as a viable piece of equipment for anything that may involve cold temperatures then be my guest.
I distinctly remember reports of individuals who placed the PMags in a deep freezer overnite and used them. I do believe they were even dropped. Now most freezers don't get set to -40 degrees, so I don't know to what temp level Magpul has been able to test these at this time.
To my mind, if the plastic on the body of a PMag is going to have issues, then so is that plastic follower in my aluminum mag.
I don't know to what temp level Magpul has been able to test these at this time.
-30 degrees (from pg 1 of this thread)
-30 degrees (from pg 1 of this thread)
Roger that! Thanks, Mark!
I doubt that it's the green color of the polymer used in the PMAG that's the problem, and the temperature may only be part of the issue. The very first time I attempted to chamber a round from a brand new Flat Dark Earth Magpul Maglevel PMAG in my LE6920, I got a double feed. Immediate action, same result. Inspection of the mag showed that the right feed lip had cracked front to back, leaving a large hinge-like flap of plastic, resulting in the malfunction. The magazine had been loaded with 28 rounds, with the Pop-off storage dust cover in place, for about a month prior to my first attempt to use it. This was this past October in Maine, so it was probably 50 degrees Fahrenheit or so.
I have seen at least one other Internet post, with photo, of a black PMAG with the same feed lip failure. That's why I say it's probably not the color of the polymer or the ambient air temperature that's the problem.
This doesn't appear to be a pervasive problem, and the overwhelming majority of shooters appear to satisfied with the PMAG's performance. Many folks here and elsewhere have put thousands of rounds through their PMAGs without a hiccup.
Nevertheless, my confidence in the PMAG was shaken. Magazines are a key component of a "weapon system", and the feed lips are a key component of the magazine. Frankly, you are much more likely to drop a magazine on its feedlips, than your are to drive over one in a deuce and a half. Compare the feed lips of the PMAG with those of the AK, for instance, and the PMAG's appear almost delicate, in comparison. I'm not raggin' on Magpul here, and I understand that there are dimensional limitations and challenges in manufacturing a polymer magazine to fit in the 1957 Stoner AR15 magwell that was designed for metal magazines. And I definitely am a Magpul fan, as I own plenty of their stuff, including CTR stocks on my Colt, SIG 556, and Bushmaster, and Magpul followers and floorplates on my GI aluminum magazines, and of course, 20 or so PMAGs. But I am saying thae feed lip issue may not just be an isolated incident related to cold and/or color!
rifleshooter
06-20-08, 19:09
I doubt that it's the green color of the polymer used in the PMAG that's the problem, and the temperature may only be part of the issue. The very first time I attempted to chamber a round from a brand new Flat Dark Earth Magpul Maglevel PMAG in my LE6920, I got a double feed. Immediate action, same result. Inspection of the mag showed that the right feed lip had cracked front to back, leaving a large hinge-like flap of plastic, resulting in the malfunction. The magazine had been loaded with 28 rounds, with the Pop-off storage dust cover in place, for about a month prior to my first attempt to use it. This was this past October in Maine, so it was probably 50 degrees Fahrenheit or so.
I have seen at least one other Internet post, with photo, of a black PMAG with the same feed lip failure. That's why I say it's probably not the color of the polymer or the ambient air temperature that's the problem.
This doesn't appear to be a pervasive problem, and the overwhelming majority of shooters appear to satisfied with the PMAG's performance. Many folks here and elsewhere have put thousands of rounds through their PMAGs without a hiccup.
Nevertheless, my confidence in the PMAG was shaken. Magazines are a key component of a "weapon system", and the feed lips are a key component of the magazine. Frankly, you are much more likely to drop a magazine on its feedlips, than your are to drive over one in a deuce and a half. Compare the feed lips of the PMAG with those of the AK, for instance, and the PMAG's appear almost delicate, in comparison. I'm not raggin' on Magpul here, and I understand that there are dimensional limitations and challenges in manufacturing a polymer magazine to fit in the 1957 Stoner AR15 magwell that was designed for metal magazines. And I definitely am a Magpul fan, as I own plenty of their stuff, including CTR stocks on my Colt, SIG 556, and Bushmaster, and Magpul followers and floorplates on my GI aluminum magazines, and of course, 20 or so PMAGs. But I am saying thae feed lip issue may not just be an isolated incident related to cold and/or color!
===
If it's one item that also worries me with my P-Mags it's them non metal lips. This is why I have yet to use them when on duty.:rolleyes: Other then that they are good Mags.;)
lanceriley
06-20-08, 19:28
i think the problem isn't that bad. has anybody tested the aluminum mags @-60? what about the follower?
Alaskapopo
06-20-08, 20:06
i think the problem isn't that bad. has anybody tested the aluminum mags @-60? what about the follower?
Actually yes (-40 not -60) and they work fine. But I still like Pmags and I have more Pmags than anything else. But if I moved back to Fairbanks i would be using HK or USGI mags in the winter.
Pat
I doubt that it's the green color of the polymer used in the PMAG that's the problem, and the temperature may only be part of the issue. The very first time I attempted to chamber a round from a brand new Flat Dark Earth Magpul Maglevel PMAG in my LE6920, I got a double feed. Immediate action, same result. Inspection of the mag showed that the right feed lip had cracked front to back, leaving a large hinge-like flap of plastic, resulting in the malfunction. The magazine had been loaded with 28 rounds, with the Pop-off storage dust cover in place, for about a month prior to my first attempt to use it. This was this past October in Maine, so it was probably 50 degrees Fahrenheit or so.
I have seen at least one other Internet post, with photo, of a black PMAG with the same feed lip failure. That's why I say it's probably not the color of the polymer or the ambient air temperature that's the problem.
This doesn't appear to be a pervasive problem, and the overwhelming majority of shooters appear to satisfied with the PMAG's performance. Many folks here and elsewhere have put thousands of rounds through their PMAGs without a hiccup.
Nevertheless, my confidence in the PMAG was shaken. Magazines are a key component of a "weapon system", and the feed lips are a key component of the magazine. Frankly, you are much more likely to drop a magazine on its feedlips, than your are to drive over one in a deuce and a half. Compare the feed lips of the PMAG with those of the AK, for instance, and the PMAG's appear almost delicate, in comparison. I'm not raggin' on Magpul here, and I understand that there are dimensional limitations and challenges in manufacturing a polymer magazine to fit in the 1957 Stoner AR15 magwell that was designed for metal magazines. And I definitely am a Magpul fan, as I own plenty of their stuff, including CTR stocks on my Colt, SIG 556, and Bushmaster, and Magpul followers and floorplates on my GI aluminum magazines, and of course, 20 or so PMAGs. But I am saying thae feed lip issue may not just be an isolated incident related to cold and/or color!
I stopped by to look at the cracked OD mags........They look as you describe so its good to hear that its not only the green, but them breaking in higher temps is very interesting. Oh I see old habits die hard, 28 rds in a p-mag?
The shop owner was/is not in any way putting P-Mags down. Said he sells more of them then any other mag and has a hard time keeping them in stock. He informs his serious shooters/customers about experiences with any equipment he sells when they ask.
I personally use p mags and will continue to do so. Just not in 0 or colder temps. I can tell that I will be testing more of the p-mags this next winter.
usaffarmer
06-20-08, 23:37
556, with the way this summer is going we might get the chance to run them in cold weather sooner than we want to.
I plan on trying them is sub zero temps and also trying the L5 mags, so i guess we shall see. (hopefully not soon)
556, with the way this summer is going we might get the chance to run them in cold weather sooner than we want to.
I plan on trying them is sub zero temps and also trying the L5 mags, so i guess we shall see. (hopefully not soon)
Yep Alaskans for Global Warming is not working quite right eh......
lanceriley
06-21-08, 00:01
everybody is so concerened with the -40 performance of pmag. I just thought we should compare a test with gi mags at -40
Failure2Stop
06-21-08, 08:05
Nevertheless, my confidence in the PMAG was shaken. Magazines are a key component of a "weapon system", and the feed lips are a key component of the magazine. Frankly, you are much more likely to drop a magazine on its feedlips, than your are to drive over one in a deuce and a half. Compare the feed lips of the PMAG with those of the AK, for instance, and the PMAG's appear almost delicate, in comparison.
Check out this thread (https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?)
And this one (http://www.weaponevolution.com/forum/showthread.php?t=312) (awesome pictures and another link).
These threads have nothing to do with extreme cold, but rather address the concern brought up by ArmyDoc. PMAGs will take abuse that would absolutely shut-down any aluminum or steel mag, including feed-lip damage.
And while you are more likely to drop the mag on it's feed-lips than drive over it, you are more likely to step on your mag (esp during SOM) than drop it on your feed lips, though both are going to happen at some point.
ArmyDoc- it sucks that you got a bad mag, but its pretty difficult to chalk that issue up to anything else other than a QC slip or unknown damage once it got into your hands. I have about 10 PMAGS that have been filled with 30 rounds, no cover, since late Feb. No issues.
Failure2Stop
06-21-08, 08:13
Alaskapopo-
Could you describe the event(s) that caused the failures in the mags?
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.