View Full Version : School me on the .308 AR!
I am contemplating adding a .308 AR to the safe, especially with the prospect of "CHANGE" coming soon. I'm looking for advice on how to go about it.
Some thoughts I have - Do I want to buy a complete rifle, or do I want to buy a lower and then pick up an upper?
If I go with the complete rifle, do I go Armalite or DPMS? Or do I go with something like the Fulton Armory rifle? I've heard varying reports on the quality of all these rifles (mostly it depends on who is trying to talk me into buying their rifle). Or am I about to dump so much into a rifle that I might as well say up and buy a Noveske (their 18 inch 7.62 rifle looks along the lines of what I'm thinking).
Who wins on accuracy?
Reliability?
Magazine availability (and cost)?
Price?
Aftermarket support?, for instance....
I can see wanting to one day pick up an upper from a good builder. Noveskes fit Armalites, they don't fit DPMS, correct? Who builds uppers for the DPMS lowers?
If I spring for a Noveske, am I going to now enter the realm of worrying what I feed the rifle since they recommend no commercial ammunition?
Which path should I set off on?
School me, please! :)
Robb Jensen
06-15-08, 14:13
The Fulton Armory is a DPMS just assembled by Fulton with a few better parts. The Fulton is marked as a Fulton even though you can tell it's a DPMS. We had a 2K some dollar one in the shop a few days ago. It had Bennie Cooley/JP brake on it and was pretty lightweight. If I shot He Man or wanted to make Major power factor for 3gun I would get one in a NY minute. Fulton makes some nice stuff. The factory DPMS that we've been selling for the last few years are running very well too.
Thanks for the info. What would be the better parts on a Fulton? Are they something that I'd want to swap right out if I went the standard DPMS route?
Let me add a question about suggested barrel lengths too. What do you all think about splitting the difference between a carbine and a rifle (18 inch)? Is there a reliability issue with a shorter length gas system on a carbine?
What are you looking to spend? I have a DPMS that is a first rate (1/4 at 100) shooter. Lot of work done but that is essential IMO. They are great guns. I may be getting rid of mine. I can give you a ton of info on them either way. email me gishooter@gmail.com
Robb Jensen
06-15-08, 19:37
I would go .308 with a 18" barrel if it were me......
Littlelebowski
06-15-08, 19:41
FYI, at our last class (http://longrangeinternational.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=261&p=2533) an 18" .308 AR did not have the legs to get to a thousand yards.
Robb Jensen
06-15-08, 19:44
FYI, at our last class (http://longrangeinternational.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=261&p=2533) an 18" .308 AR did not have the legs to get to a thousand yards.
What scope?
Littlelebowski
06-15-08, 20:39
Think it was the NF 5.5-22x. I'll find out for certain. Elevation was about 5K.
Yeah, I've been thinking about "change" too and how to be prepared for it. I'm an AR novice but I like the idea of a 308 AR. I don't want to get into a caliber pissing contest but a 5.56 just doesn't have sufficient downrange energy. And I'm not impressed with the ballistics of the 6.8 SPC. Personally, I think the military should replace the 5.56 with something along the lines of a 6mm cartridge.
Anyway, I was thinking about getting a Bushmaster ACR with a 16 inch barrel in 5.56 and then later getting an 18 inch 308 barrel if they became available for the ACR platform.
If you really want a semi auto 7.62 NATO battle rifle it is hard to beat a FN FAL...
For the same $$$, I think you will get a better return from a current production DSA than any of the knock of AR-10s I have seen...
DSarms.com
Just my .02
B
I would have to agree with Buck, you would probably be far better off with a FAL.
If you truly want a .308 AR you could also wait for the civilian HK417's or try to find a KAC SR25 battle rifle. One is not even out yet, and the other is extremely rare. Which would lead me right back to buying a DSA FAL.
See my sigline!
I haven't followed the 6.8-6.5 debate alot. To my knowledge the 6.8 was never intended for the long range role. With the proper loading, the 6.5 may be a better choice. If you are looking at a .308 AR based rifle, it's tuff to say from my limited knowledge of them. I've considered one for a while now, but haven't been impressed with the spotty reports on all of them.
If wanting a .308 battle rifle--18" full stocked DSA FAL
Mark
What about an M14 variant in 308? Who makes a good one?
I just saw this threadf and would like to throw in my 2cents worth. I have 2 m14's,one is a springfield scout 18.5" barrel and the other is an LRB18.5" with h&r parts. Mil-spec components are hard to beat. Lots of quality control. The Srpingfield's come with a life time warranty which also has value. Many people will buy a Chinese m14 with the forged receiver and have a GI bolt ,sight, and stock upgrade added. A lot of good info on m14 forums The Firing Line. Bigger bullits are better.
What about an M14 variant in 308? Who makes a good one?
The only current production M-14 type rifle I would bet my life on is a LRB Arms or a Smith Enterprises... That will give you a forged steel receiver with all USGI parts...
For the most part Springfield makes a good rifle, but they can be hit or miss on the quality of the parts they use in the build... Their pile of USGI parts ran out of some key components quite a wile ago...
Just my .02
B
If choosing between an M14 variant and a FN FAL, which one would have better parts availability in a SHTF scenario?
If choosing between an M14 variant and a FN FAL, which one would have better parts availability in a SHTF scenario?
At the risk of derailing the thread even further.....the FAL would be better in that respect.
GWOT ate up most of the affordable M14 parts.
Federale, if you're looking for a hyper accurate semi auto .308 then yes, I'd go with an AR system, and if you had the cash, a Noveske Leonidas.
If you're looking for more of a semi auto battle rifle that's still more than accurate enough for off hand shooting, it would be damn near impossible to beat a DSA SA-58 Carbine.
After doing some reading it looks like the Bushmaster ACR won't be available in 308. Magpul has a 308 rifle called the Massoud which is similar to the ACR and apparently the Massoud is in the test stages. But it has not been licensed for anyone to manufacture yet. I'm assuming Bushmaster would also license the Massoud.
Federale, if you're looking for a hyper accurate semi auto .308 then yes, I'd go with an AR system, and if you had the cash, a Noveske Leonidas.
If you're looking for more of a semi auto battle rifle that's still more than accurate enough for off hand shooting, it would be damn near impossible to beat a DSA SA-58 Carbine.
I'm looking for a very accurate semi auto. The AR platform is what I'm interested in right now.
I'm already got some M1As and a HK91, and not interested in adding a FAL to the collection at the moment.
I'm looking for a very accurate semi auto. The AR platform is what I'm interested in right now.
I'm already got some M1As and a HK91, and not interested in adding a FAL to the collection at the moment.
Fair enough.
Against all expectations, the DPMS rifles have actually been better performers than the majority of out of the box Armalites.....
Again though, if I had the cash, I'd get a Noveske.
I'm looking for a very accurate semi auto. The AR platform is what I'm interested in right now.
In that case, look into getting a Noveske...
LINK (http://noveskerifleworks.com/cgi-bin/imcart/display.cgi?cat=55)
B
In that case, look into getting a Noveske...
LINK (http://noveskerifleworks.com/cgi-bin/imcart/display.cgi?cat=55)
B
As a proud owner of this 18 inch Noveske AR15.....
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c270/dspipes/AR15/Noveske/IMG_08922.jpg
I can see myself leaning that way. ;)
Alaskapopo
06-20-08, 04:14
If you really want a semi auto 7.62 NATO battle rifle it is hard to beat a FN FAL...
For the same $$$, I think you will get a better return from a current production DSA than any of the knock of AR-10s I have seen...
DSarms.com
Just my .02
B
Last three gun match I was at there were two DSA FAL's there and both malf'd a bunch. May have been an ammo issue but it did not inspire confidence.
Pat
How about a Robinson Arms XCR in a .308? They are supposed to be out this fall.
Also, can I get some opinions on Robinson Arms? From what I have read so far, they are kind of hit and miss on customer service, quality, doing what they say they will do, etc.
How about a Robinson Arms XCR in a .308? They are supposed to be out this fall.
Also, can I get some opinions on Robinson Arms? From what I have read so far, they are kind of hit and miss on customer service, quality, doing what they say they will do, etc.
I'd recommend starting another thread in the "Other Assault Rifles" section so as not to further derail this thread. :cool:
wild_wild_wes
08-23-08, 15:14
Against all expectations, the DPMS rifles have actually been better performers than the majority of out of the box Armalites.....
"Better performers", in what respect...Accuracy? Reliability?
mechanicus
09-03-08, 19:42
Last three gun match I was at there were two DSA FAL's there and both malf'd a bunch. May have been an ammo issue but it did not inspire confidence.
Pat
http://images.photo.walgreens.com/232323232%7Ffp4324%3A%3Enu%3D324%3A%3E6%3A2%3E699%3EWSNRCG%3D323393%3C3%3B737%3Bnu0mrj
I wouldn't recommend standing in front of mine and counting on a malf :D .
Seriously, I've owned them all. FN's rock, but I understand OP doesn't want one. DPMS makes a good rifle now. I think DPMS is winning the Beta vs VHS war w/Armalite.
Voodoochild
09-04-08, 02:08
Fed if you have the $$ give the folks at GAP a shout they can build you what you want.
I actually went with a Fulton Armory Titan. It was delivered just last week. first impression is that it is one heavy mother!
I considered GAP, but Fulton offered a quick build time and a little cost savings. Fulton was actually much better with their responses to my queries. I have two Noveske rifles and strongly considered going that route again, but ultimately chose to save some money and some significant build time and went with the Fulton Armory rifle. I haven't read a lot about the Titan, but what I could find was totally positive, so I decided that where I'd spend my money.
I was on the fence as to whether to go with an Armalite or DPMS base rifle, but decided that I had heard enough good things about DPMS .308s (as opposed to their .223s) that I would go with them. It didn't hurt that it was easier for me to obtain DPMS mags than Armalites. Fulton builds off of DPMS.
I went with an 18 inch barrel and scoped it with a Leupold Mark IV. I added a UBR stock and the rifle balances pretty well and feels rock solid. It is a big rifle, but despite its weight, I don't feel it to be all that unwieldy. It, in fact, feels an awful lot like the Noveske pictured below when I pair it with a UBR'd lower. Just a little lighter, but same scope and basic set up.
Pics after I take them. :)
High Tower
08-08-09, 19:56
I hope ya don't mind my resurrecting an old thread. But I did a search of Fultan Armory and ran across this.
I've been looking for a replacement for my Socom 16 I sold before deploying. I'm strongly considering an AR 308 platform and was looking into the Fulton armory. So I'm curious Federale how you like the Fulton Armory?
It seems Fulton generally has a favorable reputation and I'm just considering options at this point.
FWIW - I have a standard Springfield M1A and the bolt roller fell off at a little over 200 rounds. I've never really trusted it since then. For that and other reasons, I've been on the lookout for other .308 options.
Is the SCAR Heavy still in the pipeline? If so, that might be worth waiting for.
Edit: Sorry, I got caught up in the thread. I realize that this post is pretty off topic for the tread in its resurrected form.
Have any of you try to build an 308 AR with an Iron ridge or POF 308 lower. I like the POF for the ambi features and the Iron Ridge for the finish. Any info is helpful, thanks.
Subscribing to see if any responses about RRA LAR-8 shows up.
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