View Full Version : Re-Stakin an Improperly Staked Key
No Bananas
06-16-08, 14:30
I've got a bunch of chisels, hammers, roll-pin punches, punches, and access to a vise (thanks, Dad). I've checked out a few sites, and done some searches here. My Stag rifle kit and the CMT/Stag BCG. Which means that it'll look like this:
http://skuophoto.com/images/ar/DSC_0132.JPG
:eek: :confused: :mad: :mad:
So, now I am tasked with staking it properly so it will look like this:
http://skuophoto.com/images/colt/DSC_0089.jpg
How do I do this if it's already been improperly staked?
I don't wann screw this up. Normally (from what I've read) I would lock the BCG in the vise side ways and stake w/ a 1/16 punch. Can I stake over the already improperly stakes sections (first picture)? Or do I need to find a different angle or method of staking. Should I just buy a new gas key and screws? Experts, please advise.
Proper way would be to use MOACKS or you can send it to Grant if you don't want to buy the MOACKS tool.
Just do it! Put the correct dimple next to the crap staking if you can't get a good stake directly on it. Perfect symetry isn't necessary... just get it done!:cool:
No Bananas
06-16-08, 15:05
The MOACKS is right out. I'm sure it works wonders and all, but it's just too darn pricey at $70 plus shipping (pocket MOAKS). Lots of folks stake the key themself. I'll buy a back-up key and screw, just incase i screw up :o . Plus, part of the fun of putting this all together, is doing it myself. Yes, I do understand how crucial a properly staked key is, and I'm taking it seriously.
I think you've got it right demigod. From what I've seen, I just don't know how the key can be properly staked OVER the incorrect stake marks. The metal on the key itself is marred down. However, I think I'll stake it right next to the improper marks.
Geez, I feel like a kid waiting for a Birthday gift or something waiting on these parts to get in.:D I'll try and post pics.
The MOACKS is right out. I'm sure it works wonders and all, but it's just too darn pricey at $70 plus shipping (pocket MOAKS).
Many have found that providing a service for a suggested donation of $5, or in services in kind, at an event full of "good-as", offsets your purchase price.
Bananas,
You can either purchase a new key or you can create alternate staking points. Take a look in the military TM as to how they do it. I restake the Bushamsters in a triangle shape like similar to the TM and I have no issues.
The MOACKS is right out. I'm sure it works wonders and all, but it's just too darn pricey at $70 plus shipping (pocket MOAKS). Lots of folks stake the key themself. I'll buy a back-up key and screw, just incase i screw up :o . Plus, part of the fun of putting this all together, is doing it myself. Yes, I do understand how crucial a properly staked key is, and I'm taking it seriously.
I think you've got it right demigod. From what I've seen, I just don't know how the key can be properly staked OVER the incorrect stake marks. The metal on the key itself is marred down. However, I think I'll stake it right next to the improper marks.
Geez, I feel like a kid waiting for a Birthday gift or something waiting on these parts to get in.:D I'll try and post pics.
You don't use a 1/16" punch. Atleast twice you won't. :p rofl
Get a center punch. The intent is to create an interference of metal to prevent it from spinning CCW. One hammer whack and your a pro. Two your an amatuer but we'll let you slide. Three, please remove your tools from the vicinty of your rifle and refrain from ever using the two in combination. ;)
No Bananas
06-16-08, 23:11
I only get two whacks with the hammer and I'm out!? Aggghhh! The Pressure!!!!!!!!!
http://www.starksilvercreek.com/photos/uncategorized/2007/07/04/nervous.gif
Check out the job I did below, I already ordered a new key and bolts, but I am not sure if this is all that bad; it was done to an already improperly staked key (anyone with a MOACKs in the New Orleans Louisiana area)? Take a look at the following and throw some opinions my way. How are y'all vice mounting these things without fear of crushing or breaking them?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/bufit323/PICT0022-1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/bufit323/PICT0023-1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/bufit323/PICT0024-1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/bufit323/PICT0025-1.jpg
How are y'all vice mounting these things without fear of crushing or breaking them?
You won't crush it. You probably won't break it, either. Just put it in there with something semi soft on the sides so you don't rough it up too much.
Then whack the hell out of it!:D
How are y'all vice mounting these things without fear of crushing or breaking them?
It's been years, but... I put mine in the vise as though the carrier was listing at about 45 degrees. The key was actually against the top of one of the vise edges. Then I flipped it over to do the other side. This prevents it from popping out of the vise jaws when you impact it.
No Bananas
06-17-08, 10:13
oh, man. Those pics are not making me feel better about this.
http://www-psychology.concordia.ca/fac/dugas/Pictures/Stressed%20Man.jpg
However, it does look like it'll hold the screws in there. Anybody got more pics of a corrected staking?
BTW: big question for if I need to put on the new key and screws. How much do I tighten the screws? I don't have one of those torque wrench thingies that tells you how many inch-pounds you've put on the screws. Any advice?
No Bananas
06-17-08, 10:45
Ok, If I'm correcting CMT/STag's crappy stakes could I do it like the BCG at the top of this photo?
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y41/boltcatch/carriers.jpg
Just wondering. Also, still wondering how to know when the new screws are tight enough.
In my professional opinion (:D), it is better to use the pocket MOACKS VS the standard one when staking already staked gas keys. The reason is that the pocket version pushes more material over the screws.
C4
Ok, If I'm correcting CMT/STag's crappy stakes could I do it like the BCG at the top of this photo?
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y41/boltcatch/carriers.jpg
Just wondering. Also, still wondering how to know when the new screws are tight enough.
By a calibrated torque wrench (in lbs).
If you want, send me your bolt carriers and I will stake them so you do not have to stress out about it any more.
C4
It's been years, but... I put mine in the vise as though the carrier was listing at about 45 degrees. The key was actually against the top of one of the vise edges. Then I flipped it over to do the other side. This prevents it from popping out of the vise jaws when you impact it.
Yep. I just did another one this week. You use the vise as more of a rest than to squeeze it. You want the jaws open just enough to allow the edge of the key to set on the vice without the carrier falling through. Use a rag or old t-shirt to keep the carrier from getting scratched up on the vise when you stake it.
I find that it's better to use a small chisel ground down dull, than a round punch.
You're alive!
Still kickin, fr00t!:p
I just now got around to registering here.
Great! You'll like it here. It's an actual gun forum! :p
Great! You'll like it here. It's an actual gun forum! :p
Awesome! Where is the dedicated KNS pins forum?
spamsammich
06-17-08, 13:02
Cold chisel ok? I only have one set of chisels right now besides the cold chisel and punches. I don't really want to beat up my small chisel.
Cold chisel ok? I only have one set of chisels right now besides the cold chisel and punches. I don't really want to beat up my small chisel.
Just make sure to grind it off dull so you don't cut the key.
Awesome! Where is the dedicated KNS pins forum?
As good as this site is, there's still KNS pins in many of the gun pics. :mad:
Robb Jensen
06-17-08, 14:18
As good as this site is, there's still KNS pins in many of the gun pics. :mad:
You believe when you don't know.
Recognition obscures awareness.
Some can feel the consistency that the KNS pins provide, some don't.........
No Bananas
06-17-08, 14:20
You guys don't like KNS pins? I don't know anything about em. I just figured that I'd see if I had issues with the pins sneaking out before I splashed the cash.
As good as this site is, there's still KNS pins in many of the gun pics. :mad:
I think this issue has been covered enough and should be put to pasture.
Now I'm not stating if I like or dislike K&S pins. ;)
Some can feel the consistency that the KNS pins provide, some don't.........
This is the only legit reason I've heard for why people use them. And I won't tell someone they're wrong since I can't say what they're feeling.
But I bet 95 percent of the people who buy them aren't shooting precision shots were this might make a difference, and aren't even aware that these things could make an impact on trigger pull.
No Bananas
06-17-08, 15:22
Whoa! I didn't know I was stepping on a land-mine of a subject there. Anyway, let's get back to the staking Q & As. :D
No Bananas
06-18-08, 22:54
Got my Stag Kit today. Pheww was staking the key easy. My camera stinks, so I don't have a good photo, but it looks like a combo of the two pictures in my original post. Talk about Psyching yourself out. I just used a center punch.
http://www.peoplespressnews.com/blog/images/happy-face.gif
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v699/bufit323/IMG_0150.jpg
Camera would not cooperate, but thanks to advice around here, my BCG is now far improved.
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