View Full Version : How many of y'all carry extra magazines on your person?
If you do, let us know.
If not, why not?
Always; at least 1, usually 2. I feel naked without'em - like driving without a seatbelt on...
zombiescometh
10-06-14, 21:40
Usually at least 1 and a couple in my bag.
G19 Driver
10-06-14, 21:41
If wearing 5.11 pants I have three spare Mags. Two in single mag holders and one in that pocket that they put on the front of the left leg.
Crap... I don't even have my gun on me most of the time. I used to be a fanatical carry guy. I think I've put a belt holster on 2 times in the last year or two. I'm mostly a home body... and my pistol is on the seat of my truck when I'm out.
Icedaddy56
10-06-14, 21:47
One magazine in case.
whatthepuck
10-06-14, 21:54
You guys must plan on really getting into some intense firefights with 2-3 reloads necessary. The only time I carry an extra mag is when I carry my LCP because the extra mag is so small and unobtrusive. I feel very adequately armed for any situatIon I may encounter in everyday life when carrying a g19 or g26 with no reload.
It's cliche, but one is none...
With that said, I'm guilty of most of the time only carrying a G27 and no spare mag on my body. In the truck I've got the AR, plate carrier, 4 glock mags and 4 AR mags, and med kit.
G19 Driver
10-06-14, 22:00
I carry three because I can comfortably do it. I'm used to carrying stuff anyway. Besides no one ever suffered because of carrying two or three spare mags. I don't know if I am going to actually need them. All I know is that if I do need them then it's going to suck. If I don't have them it's going to suck more.
Replacing the magazine with a fresh one is the fastest way to resolve a malfunction, so I carry a spare one.
EricTheRed
10-06-14, 22:07
I carry a shield 9mm, with one spare mag. It's really so easy to carry, and the ammo capacity of the Shield is so relatively small, that I like having the reload. Because my jobs entail me being looked at by a lot of people a lot of the time, and a lot of moving, bending, and twisting (bartender and brewer, not stripper :cool:) carrying a smaller gun is easier for me. I just can't effectively conceal bigger guns while working without wearing a tent for a shirt. Out and about I may or may not carry a larger gun (G19 or PPQ), but FWIW I usually have an extra mag with me for those as well. Overall I EDC so much stuff on me that putting an extra mag into the mix isn't going to really affect me; so imo why not have one just in case, especially since as noted above it is a fast way to resolve a malfunction?
ETA I was thinking about this the other night while watching Hank's final episode in Breaking Bad. Who thinks he would have minded having another mag or three?
Replacing the magazine with a fresh one is the fastest way to resolve a malfunction, so I carry a spare one.
^^^^^^^^^ THIS, not because I'm anticipating getting into a prolonged off duty firefight, but because most malfunctions are going to be ammo related (as in running dry) or ammo/magazine related (an actual physical problem with the ammunition and/or the magazine itself). And often the best way to resolve the malf is with a spare magazine... I've been carrying a semi-auto pistol on and off duty now for most of my 30+ years of service and can remember less than a handful of times I did not have a spare magazine(s) with me.
Renegade04
10-06-14, 22:26
One 8-rounder in the Kimber and one in a paddle-type mag holder. If I need any more than that for EDC, I am having a really bad day.
Revolver has 1 speed strip and semis 1, sometimes 2 mags.
The beauty of a firearm and a reload is you won't need it, until you need it. Then you'll really need it.
Not generally. Sometimes I get a little streak of paranoia and grab extras, though. For instance, when carrying large sums of cash to private sales situations. Cars, guns, bicycles. It's just the perfect time to rob someone. You'll likely be relatively alone, and you know they have a lot of money on them. I still don't think it's likely, but, as many like to point out: being prepared is better than not being prepared.
I strongly believe I could live ten lifetimes unarmed and never need a firearm. But someone out there is going to roll snake eyes. Could be me, someday.
We definitely had a thread on this not too long ago.. may be worth looking at that for additional responses.
I carry a spare G19 mag horizontally (in a magholder.com magholder) whether I'm carrying a G17 cut to G19 grip, a G19, or a G26. As other's have said, for me it's not as much about the rounds as it is about having a spare mag to use in clearing a malfunction if necessary.
I run one spare with my G19 and 2 spare when I carry my 1911.
2 spare mags, a pineapple and a 50! Or for reals: just my shield. If I feel like more I carry a 15 rd P30
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-07-14, 01:07
I carry a J-frame, typically with no reload.
If I am "in the mood" I might carry an autoloader with one mag in my left front pocket. That is really rare these days.
Nothing wrong with carrying spare mags though.
G19 and always two spare mags in front pants pocket.
Apricotshot
10-07-14, 06:20
I carry a shield 9mm, with one spare mag. It's really so easy to carry, and the ammo capacity of the Shield is so relatively small, that I like having the reload. Because my jobs entail me being looked at by a lot of people a lot of the time, and a lot of moving, bending, and twisting (bartender and brewer, not stripper :cool:) carrying a smaller gun is easier for me. I just can't effectively conceal bigger guns while working without wearing a tent for a shirt. Out and about I may or may not carry a larger gun (G19 or PPQ), but FWIW I usually have an extra mag with me for those as well. Overall I EDC so much stuff on me that putting an extra mag into the mix isn't going to really affect me; so imo why not have one just in case, especially since as noted above it is a fast way to resolve a malfunction?
ETA I was thinking about this the other night while watching Hank's final episode in Breaking Bad. Who thinks he would have minded having another mag or three?
I do G26 and a 19 mag when I'm working the brewery. Usually wear a Dickies shirt so they are baggy.
I rarely carry, but if I do it's a PPS with 7 rounds and no spare magazine.
I carry every day, Glock 23 or 27, but I normally do not carry a spare magazine. I do however keep one in the car.
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alvincullumyork
10-07-14, 07:01
When I do carry, which hasn't been for a while, I'd always have a spare. As other said most malfs are ammo or mag caused and most can be quickly with a fresh mag. Plus if I was putting on the holster the mag pouch was just one more easy step and it wasn't any harder to conceal.
I carry a G20, with 1 spar mag. If 30 rounds of 10mm will not be enough, I'm in very deep shit. I will be working my way to my vehicle for a rifle.
I used to carry a reload. Got tied of the Fricke Archangel mag pouch shifting. Waiting on a DSG AIWB mag pouch. Those new JMs look pretty cool too.
In reality I'm not worried about it. Carrying a fixed blade is way more important, and I'm carrying that where my reload was. You're not going to do a reload with someone on top of you anyways.
Street Dog
10-07-14, 07:42
I carry every day. If the mag for the pistol I'm carrying that day holds 10 rounds or more, I carry one spare, if less than 10, then I carry two.
walker2713
10-07-14, 07:52
I carry everyday, and don't typically carry a spare mag when I'm around town here at home. Usually it's a G19, a PPQ or P2000, and there's a spare mag of each in the console of the car.
When I'm on a road trip to visit the kids/grandkids or a hunting trip, I'll always carry a spare in a mag holder on my belt, with more in the car.
You never know.....
Alpha Sierra
10-07-14, 08:13
Replacing the magazine with a fresh one is the fastest way to resolve a malfunction, so I carry a spare one.
This is the main reason why I carry one reload with a semi auto. I seriously doubt I will ever need more than the 15 to 17 already in the pistol. But I always carry a reload just in case.
I don't understand the point of having a spare mag and leaving it in the car. Makes absolutely zero sense. May as well leave it at home.
I also always carry a speedloader in a belt pouch when I carry a revolver instead of a semi.
Alpha Sierra
10-07-14, 08:15
You're not going to do a reload with someone on top of you anyways.
If all gunfights ended with someone on top of you, you would have a point. But they don't.
You guys must plan on really getting into some intense firefights with 2-3 reloads necessary. The only time I carry an extra mag is when I carry my LCP because the extra mag is so small and unobtrusive. I feel very adequately armed for any situatIon I may encounter in everyday life when carrying a g19 or g26 with no reload.
So agree!!
This may also be of interest:
"Who carries extra mags while CCW?", 12 pages
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?134624-Who-carries-extra-mags-while-CCW
When I carried a 15-18 round pistol I did not carry a spare, should have but I didn't. With a revolver I always do. Currently I have 8+1 9mm pistol so I do carry a spare in my left pocket.
Beat Trash
10-07-14, 09:10
I carry either a Glock 19 with a Glock 17 magazine as a spare, or a M&P9c with a 17 rd full size M&P magazine when off work.
When at work, my BUG is a M&P Shield, there is a 8 rd spare magazine for it in a life pocket.
I carry everyday as well. With my 9mm Shield, I carry two extra mags. With my FS 9mm M&P, I carry one extra 17 rd mag & with my Colt 1911 I carry two extra mags. I can carry all of them with no discomfort or "printing.
If all gunfights ended with someone on top of you, you would have a point. But they don't.
I've gotten over the "gun guy fantasies" of shoot outs and what not.
I carry a J-frame, typically with no reload.
If I am "in the mood" I might carry an autoloader with one mag in my left front pocket. That is really rare these days.
Nothing wrong with carrying spare mags though.
I was a bit surprised to read that you don't carry a reload for your J-Frame. At a minimum I carry a speed strip in a pocket on the strong side.
Carry one extra mag or one speed strip if carrying a j frame
I carry a J-frame, typically with no reload.
If I am "in the mood" I might carry an autoloader with one mag...
Same here.
Outlander Systems
10-07-14, 11:13
Yup. Two 17 round spares.
I always carry at least one spare. Not looking at total ammo count, looking at magazine failures. Or if I start trying to fix a malfunction and need a new mag I'm covered.
The logic of "I'd rather have it and not need it" that applies to carrying a gun applies to mags for me as well.
A local guy in my area recently got attacked and surrounded by 15+ gang bangers downtown. Armed with only a pocket 380 and a folding knife. After he shot the first attacker and was still facing down a lot of guys he wished he had brought a gun with more bullets.
(Long story short, he's OK now. No personal injury)
6920_enthusiast
10-07-14, 11:44
I usually carry 1 spare mag, as stated previously for malfunctions.
Alpha Sierra
10-07-14, 12:00
I've gotten over the "gun guy fantasies" of shoot outs and what not.
Whatever
Hardly ever carry a spare....... prob should just never have. That being said I feel my yhreat level is very low.
Sent from phone (tappa talk)... excuse errors.
Typically the 10 round mag in my M&p9c. Use the 12 rounder as a spare. Though on a recent trip to Atlanta,mI carried 3 full size mags as spares...
Fasstasheck
10-07-14, 15:44
I carry a Glock 19 with a spare G17 mag. For South Texas and our oppressive heat it's what I've found works best for capacity vs sweating too bad.
When traveling anywhere out of my AO I also keep my G17 with a Surefire X300U in a Raven holster in the pocket of my truck door with a 33rd G18 mag next to it. Usually bring an AR and 4 mags too. Aid bag is usually in the truck and I keep a plussed up CLS bag under the seat always too
Outlander Systems
10-07-14, 17:06
...Though on a recent trip to Atlanta,mI carried 3 full size mags as spares...
....Aaaaaand that's why I carry two spares.
It was a lot easier carrying multiples with a 1911 than it is with a CZ double stack with a pointy baseplate.
You guys must plan on really getting into some intense firefights with 2-3 reloads necessary. The only time I carry an extra mag is when I carry my LCP because the extra mag is so small and unobtrusive. I feel very adequately armed for any situatIon I may encounter in everyday life when carrying a g19 or g26 with no reload.
I carry any extra in case of malfunction, not because I think I need 30 rounds for CCW.
A lot can go wrong with a magazine. It's typically good practice to have the extra mag. Sometimes tap rack bang doesn't work. What if you drop the mag?
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I always carry a spare and always ride my friends to do the same. In fact, I tend to carry 3 spares, unless I carry a backup, in which case I carry 1 reload each.
But I personally am not worried about being mugged. My concern is, as a young man growing up in this Post-Columbine age, is repelling an active shooter, either at workplace or school environment, or in public. (I know I'm probably more likely to be mugged, though.)
Personally, I think it's foolish to not carry a reload. Obviously, this can get crazy with the "how much is enough" issue. That is to say, if 2 mags is better than 1, 3 must be better than 2. If it worked for me I would carry 6, but I would look ridiculous. Still, I like to have 1 or 2 spares. If ISIS or some other terror group, foreign or otherwise, decide to do a Mumbai or Westgate Mall attack, which aren't beyond the realm of possibility, I would definitely like as much ammo as I can.
I carry an extra for my g19 mostly just because I carry appendix and the extra mag in an appendix position makes the grip of the gun print less for some reason.
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luckybychoice
10-07-14, 19:10
Personally, I think it's foolish to not carry a reload. Obviously, this can get crazy with the "how much is enough" issue. That is to say, if 2 mags is better than 1, 3 must be better than 2. If it worked for me I would carry 6, but I would look ridiculous. Still, I like to have 1 or 2 spares. If ISIS or some other terror group, foreign or otherwise, decide to do a Mumbai or Westgate Mall attack, which aren't beyond the realm of possibility, I would definitely like as much ammo as I can.
This^^^^^. It's my gun guy fantasy, and I'm ready to play. I carry a G26 and two mags.
I carry an extra gun instead...A LCR.
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When I do carry, I tend to have one. Primarily an artifact of carrying pistols with 7-8rd magazine capacity... Also one double feed and I'm having to figure out if that pistol is going to have more than one round coming out even after fixing it.
MountainRaven
10-07-14, 21:44
My minimums are 20 rounds of ammunition and two ways of getting them where they need to go - whether guns or magazines.
So a G19 (14+1) and a J-frame (another 5) works. Or a G19/17 backed by a G26. As does a full-size H&K HK45 or S&W M&P45 with a spare mag (10+1+10). Or a full-size 1911 with two spare magazines (I prefer ETMs, but 7-rounders work fine, too). A full-size 1911, HK45C, or M&P45C with a spare 10-rounder are barely inadequate. But I would probably give a 6-shot K- or L-frame with two speed loaders or quick strips a pass. Generally, though, it's something like a G19, G17, P30, or VP9 and a spare magazine for me.
I feel this is sufficient for most "typical" deadly force encounters (involving 1-3 aggressors). If I were expecting a Mumbai- or Westgate-like attack, I would probably want more ammunition and more guns... and probably a carbine.
Off duty, I usually carry one spare magazine, or if I am carrying my J frame, a speed strip. If my clothing supports the extra bulk, I usually have a weaponlight mounted as well.
Working, plain clothes, two spare magazines. Almost always a weaponlight. I figure with my radio going I am more likely to become involved in shenanigans.
Los Angeles? Guess?
JohnJasonChun.Com
Almost never carry an extra mag, sometimes a single if I happen to be carrying a 1911. Usually I'm carrying something with 15+1 so I don't feel the need for a backup mag. Yes I understand failures happen but with modern guns and high quality defensive rounds the probability is minimal. I carry so much crap on my belt at work I have to lighten the load in my off time for back relief. Even with a G27 and no extra mag I don't feel horribly under gunned. I often will keep an extra mag in my center console in a clip on belt pouch for times I may feel the need (traveling mostly). With J-frames I always will throw a speed strip in the watch pocket of my jeans, which often get washed and dried (but always fire).
I think carrying 40-50 rounds is pretty extreme.
MountainRaven
10-08-14, 00:57
Almost never carry an extra mag, sometimes a single if I happen to be carrying a 1911. Usually I'm carrying something with 15+1 so I don't feel the need for a backup mag. Yes I understand failures happen but with modern guns and high quality defensive rounds the probability is minimal. I carry so much crap on my belt at work I have to lighten the load in my off time for back relief. Even with a G27 and no extra mag I don't feel horribly under gunned. I often will keep an extra mag in my center console in a clip on belt pouch for times I may feel the need (traveling mostly). With J-frames I always will throw a speed strip in the watch pocket of my jeans, which often get washed and dried (but always fire).
I think carrying 40-50 rounds is pretty extreme.
One goes, I've never met anyone who has been in a firefight who said, "I wish I brought less ammunition." Another, You can never have too much ammunition. Unless you're on fire or trying to swim.
Or the other side, I don't see why anyone needs to have more than ten bullets in a clip, And, You must be paranoid if you want to carry a gun all the time.
;)
I should clarify, IMHO for the average armed citizen carrying concealed 40-50 rounds is a lot of ammo. For people that go into harms way even that may not be enough. We carry 46 rounds on duty but that's in uniform and you're a visible target at that point. I'm not knocking you if you do, I can fully understand a spare for dealing with mag/gun malfunctions or topping off the gun in the event of shots were fired. I should carry a spare, no doubt.
I know I should carry at least one spare mag but usually I don't unless I'm wearing a shoulder holster them it's just one. And that only during winter.
Sent from...... . . .
Carry every day HK 45c or a HK P30L with 1 spare mag.
One goes, [i]I've never met anyone who has been in a firefight who said, "I wish I brought less ammunition."
I've never met anyone (civilian, especially in the area where I live) who has been in a firefight.
I've never met anyone (civilian, especially in the area where I live) who has been in a firefight.
I've never met an officer that has. Should everybody disarm? I don't see how your comment is related to the topic.
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I carry my G19 with an extra G17 mag, and usually have a couple extra in my vehicle.
TexasAggie2005
10-08-14, 10:57
Most days I have my G19 on me, a few G17 mags in my backpack. If wardrobe permits, I'll carry a G17 mag as a spare when I don't have my backpack handy.
PKendall317
10-08-14, 12:08
I carry a Glock 19 plus a backup G19 mag with a Pierce +2 extension. I'll probably never need all those rounds but you never know if you may have to fight off a horde of zombies
I might be an anomaly here, but very often I don't carry a spare magazine. Lately, I have been carrying two spares though because I have been carrying OWB a lot with an overgarmet. I am in the Southeast and two extra mags in the summer makes the difference between comfort and misery.
It really depends on the capacity of the sidearm I am carrying. I know it is not the best SOP, because magazine failure can and does occur and redundancy is important. If I am carring a G26, I am less likely to carry an extra mag than with a G42, etc. The biggest issue with carrying multiple mags is that it more annoying for me. I have mitigated this by carrying one G17 mag if I am carrying my G26.
In an ideal world, I would carry two spare mags. The only exception is when I am open carrying my G20 with taclight--I carry 3 spare mags with that (for those just in case woods settings).
In summary: two spares is ideal, unless it means you are less likely to carry because of it.
I saw this thread pop up originally and as it has been updated with responses, but I hadn't actually opened it to read until now because I figured it would be made up of a very small number of responses saying, "No, I don't carry an extra magazine" followed by almost a dog pile of responses explaining why that's incorrect. The number of "No, I don't carry an extra magazine" responses in this thread is actually surprising.
I carry concealed as much as I possibly can (G19 or 9mm Shield) and always carry at least one spare magazine for either platform based on my understanding that a spare magazine may often be the quickest solution to a magazine/ammo induced malfunction. While I have no expectations about becoming involved in a running gun battle, I also understand that it's better to have extra ammo and not need it than need it and not have it...
Depends. Always have a spare in the car. Often one on my person. Sometimes no reload on me. Rarely, I have 2 mags, but it does happen on occasion.
I fully understand that the chances of me needing 45rds of ammo(M&P40 FS) is pretty much zilch.
In the rare event I carry the shield, I stuff a spare mag in the pants 90% of the time.
wilson1911
10-08-14, 21:36
When I carry my 1911 its 4 mags. When I carry my M&P its 2 extra mags which all have TTi floor plates on them, that makes 67 rounds to use in a firefight. While I hope it will never come to even pulling the gun out since getting in a shoot situation is mostly bad mojo and has so much liability's these days......but if the need arises I am prepared.
3 different carry scenarios for me and I use them all a fair bit. All involve an extra mag
G19 + G17 magazine spare
G26 + G17 magazine spare
MP Shield + 8 rd mag spare
only exception is in instances where I have to be VERY concealed, in that cause I carry a bodyguard 380 with a spare mag if I have shorts with pockets to do so.
3 different carry scenarios for me and I use them all a fair bit. All involve an extra mag
G19 + G17 magazine spare
G26 + G17 magazine spare
MP Shield + 8 rd mag spare
only exception is in instances where I have to be VERY concealed, in that cause I carry a bodyguard 380 with a spare mag if I have shorts with pockets to do so.
whatthepuck
10-08-14, 22:02
I can see the validity of carrying an extra mag in the case of a malfunction. I suppose I'd just rather not for comfort's sake when carrying. 10+1 of 9mm in my g26 when carrying iwb works fine for me.
What I don't get is some folks saying they carry over 50rds in case of a "firefight". It may just be me, but my thoughts are I'll probably never need more than the typical 3 to 4 shots fired in the case of a justified use of a handgun in self defense. So if I have a gun I've vetted as reliable to deliver those 3-4 shots, I don't feel the need to burden myself with extra mags. Heck, I'm about to purchase an LCR which should become my primary carry after I get comfortable with it, so 5rds of .38 special will work for me.
I guess what I'm saying is, I think anyone would have a whole lot of 'splainin to do if they emptied their CCW, then went to another reload. The only instance I could ever think that would be justified would be in the case of a zombie attack or God forbid, an active shooter incident. In either one of those situations, I'm looking for the nearest exit, not to engage in gun-guy fantasy...
So in the end, carry what works for you and what you feel comfortable with...
I guess what I'm saying is, I think anyone would have a whole lot of 'splainin to do if they emptied their CCW, then went to another reload....
No more so than a cop, its just much less likely for a non-leo. Legal SD is legal regardless of # of rounds fired.
Mag problems are not uncommon and a fresh mag will fix it.
My viewpoint and why I carry at least 1 reload.
I can see the validity of carrying an extra mag in the case of a malfunction. I suppose I'd just rather not for comfort's sake when carrying. 10+1 of 9mm in my g26 when carrying iwb works fine for me.
What I don't get is some folks saying they carry over 50rds in case of a "firefight". It may just be me, but my thoughts are I'll probably never need more than the typical 3 to 4 shots fired in the case of a justified use of a handgun in self defense. So if I have a gun I've vetted as reliable to deliver those 3-4 shots, I don't feel the need to burden myself with extra mags. Heck, I'm about to purchase an LCR which should become my primary carry after I get comfortable with it, so 5rds of .38 special will work for me.
I guess what I'm saying is, I think anyone would have a whole lot of 'splainin to do if they emptied their CCW, then went to another reload. The only instance I could ever think that would be justified would be in the case of a zombie attack or God forbid, an active shooter incident. In either one of those situations, I'm looking for the nearest exit, not to engage in gun-guy fantasy...
So in the end, carry what works for you and what you feel comfortable with...
I agree, do what makes you comfy.
Points to consider:
1. How many shots do you think it might take to make someone stop doing what they're doing to you? Could be 1, could be 4.
2. Most criminals do not operate alone. Will perp #2, #3, etc., flee as soon as the first shot us fired? Maybe, maybe not.
3. How good will your hit % be, keeping in mind that cops only hit with about 20% of their shots?
At that point, for ME, ten rounds seems like the bare minimum. Anything else is just hoping you are in the "average" fight. If you prefer to plan for the average, well, why carry a gun at all? The "average" person will never need his or her gun for self defense anyway.
As for the active shooter scenario, I agree, get out of dodge. But.......I might have to fight my way out of dodge, in which case, I like the idea of more rounds on tap.
If I am trapped, then I have to assume it is for a "reason" that I am there with 31 rounds and have spent a lot of $ to train with some of the best people in the country.
crusader377
10-09-14, 08:55
I carry my M&P Shield with a spare magazine. IMO it is a good balance between having good concealability, good capability (16rds of 9mm), and reasonability comfortable while carrying. I live in a very low crime area (outer suburb/semi-rural area) and I simply don't need a service type pistol for daily carry.
Dollylamma
10-09-14, 18:32
Does anyone have any links where a CCW civilian reloaded during a shoot out, and kept shooting? Just curious.
Can a Mod fix the title? It's bugging me [emoji12]
Does anyone have any links where a CCW civilian reloaded during a shoot out, and kept shooting? Just curious.
There was the case of that woman who hid in a closet or bathroom after a perp broke in. On phone with her husband who told her what to do, she emptied the J frame into the guy (i think through a door) and the cops found him bleeding down the street. I think it was in Georgia or Florida in the last two years. She didn't reload, and it wasn't a CCW case per se, but I bet she wished she had more rounds available.
Can a Mod fix the title? It's bugging me [emoji12]
Mow come?
Can a Mod fix the title? It's bugging me [emoji12]
What's wrong with it?
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Dollylamma
10-09-14, 20:02
There was the case of that woman who hid in a closet or bathroom after a perp broke in. On phone with her husband who told her what to do, she emptied the J frame into the guy (i think through a door) and the cops found him bleeding down the street. I think it was in Georgia or Florida in the last two years. She didn't reload, and it wasn't a CCW case per se, but I bet she wished she had more rounds available.
No doubt. Glad she was armed with some sort of gun. But I am assuming she probably wasn't carrying, and she holed up in her residence? I ask because it is relevant to the topic. Was that gun staged in the house? Two different animals between guns in house and guns on person. Let me revise my question. Outside of subjects residence are there any links where a CCW reloaded and kept shooting during a shoot out?
I've always carried a spare magazine while carrying concealed. It never really occurred to me not to. That said, even having learned about the pros and cons I don't think I'll change my habits.
That is, when I can legally carry concealed again, which will be either when Baker wins or I move back to America.
No doubt. Glad she was armed with some sort of gun. But I am assuming she probably wasn't carrying, and she holed up in her residence? I ask because it is relevant to the topic. Was that gun staged in the house? Two different animals between guns in house and guns on person. Let me revise my question. Outside of subjects residence are there any links where a CCW reloaded and kept shooting during a shoot out?
Don't know if this definitively answers your question, but I read it as a "yes." Not perfectly clear though.
http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=328876
Glock 19 and a backup 17 mag, always.
Went to MA today so took the 1911 with 2 eight round mags, one in the roscoe, one in a mag holder. I put one in my bag too, I don't like having to change my carry habits to comply with 10rd mag carry law.
Left my G34 at home.
EricTheRed
10-09-14, 21:31
Don't know if this definitively answers your question, but I read it as a "yes." Not perfectly clear though.
http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=328876
That was a great read. Thanks.
I carry at least 10 rounds, whether I am carrying a J Frame or semi-automatic pistol. I carry at least one speed strip with the J Frame and at least one magazine if I am carrying a semi-automatic pistol.
I don't care if a semi-automatic pistol has a 5 shot capacity or 18 shot capacity I always carry a spare magazine, because the fastest way to resolve a malfunction is with a fresh magazine.
SeriousStudent
10-09-14, 22:13
Can a Mod fix the title? It's bugging me [emoji12]
So let it be written, so let it be done.
Mow come?
Lol funny
So let it be written, so let it be done.
Thank you!
Howdy,
My EDC is a Glock 23 .40S&W and I normally carry 4-15 round mags and a Kel-Tek PF-9 as a BUG with 2 spare mags.
"Be Prepared!"
Paul
goodoleboy
10-10-14, 19:43
I always carry extra, "I'm sure glad I didn't bring any extra ammo, cause I didn't need it this time," said no one who ever saw action.
Glock 19 and a backup 17 mag, always.
Yeah, G27 with a G23 as a spare. Always.
packinaglock
10-10-14, 20:21
Yes, one reload.
Redbeardsong
10-10-14, 21:27
Most days I carry an M&P9 IWB with two spare 17 round magazines. It conceals well enough under an untucked t-shirt and cover shirt. When I need deeper concealment, I'll carry an SR9c with a spare 10 or 17 round mag on the waist or in a pocket or an M&P Shield with a spare 8 round mag IWB or in a pocket. I've found the spare mags help balance the weight of the gun on my waist and since I started carrying them, I feel uneasy without at least one spare mag. I'll probably never need a gun at all, but with the reality of terrorist attacks like the Westgate Mall attack in Kenya, active shooters (sometimes multiple shooters) and robbery crews, I'd prefer to have more than a handful of bullets.
joshrunkle35
10-10-14, 21:48
Typically yes. 1-2 spare mags.
No extra mags on my body, one extra in my vehicle for my Glock 19. I figured the majority of shooting situations that can be expected in a self-defense situation can be resolved with under 15 rds. A spare in case of malfunctions may be the only thing I consider for the future based on this thread. No intent to change for now though.
If you're carrying a gun, why would you not carry at least 1 spare mag?
In case of malfunction or an outbreak of stupid, better to have than not.
Kind of seems as silly not to carry a spare mag as to say you won't need more than 1 round to stop a threat....
Extras in your vehicle do so much good when you're in your vehicle. ;)
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I always carry a spare. Mainly because most malfunctions are either ammo or mag related. But it's also nice know that I probably won't ever get into some kind of prolonged gunfight. But if I do I have enough rounds to at least hold them off until the Calvary arrives.
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2-4 spares (usually two), depending on where I'm going. I try to avoid the protests and riots but since I work near both areas...
When I carry a 1911, xtra magazines are pretty much required. I will also usually carry extra magazines with my Jericho. Only pistol I am not currently carrying extra magazines for is my FNX45. Whenever I can find a good mag pouch to carry a spare magazine, I probably will. Just doesn't make sense not to carry at least one spare mag.
beschatten
10-14-14, 14:07
I once met a man that carried about 6 extra magazines in his childs diaper bag for his PPQ. Interesting conversation we had. Saw him doing draws from the diaper bag at the range.
I carry 1 extra magazine for when I carry a 1911. Winter its 2.
Carrying an extra mag just makes me feel better.
MSparks909
10-16-14, 05:14
Always have an extra magazine when I'm carrying. Some of my "casual" CCW friends think I'm a bit overboard, but I feel comfort with my decision to carry a spare magazine, even if that means I have to *slightly* alter my attire.
You guys must plan on really getting into some intense firefights with 2-3 reloads necessary. The only time I carry an extra mag is when I carry my LCP because the extra mag is so small and unobtrusive. I feel very adequately armed for any situatIon I may encounter in everyday life when carrying a g19 or g26 with no reload.
since magazines are one of the components of a malfunction, having a spare is just good sense. having a spare spare is for those times you're pinned down behind the wagon...
lahunter57
10-16-14, 16:29
I carry a glock 26 and always have a spare 17 rd magazine with it. I mean, it's not going to hurt to have it and I don't even notice it's there.
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Usually carry my Glock 27 with an extra Glock 22 magazine.
On duty two extras for my M&P40. Off duty, the mag inside the 9C.
SuaSponte175
10-20-14, 00:21
I always carry at least one extra mag, if not two.
ChrisCross
10-20-14, 20:08
1 extra mag for my M&P 9c
For me it depends on what I am carrying, if I am carrying something with a low round count such as the Glock 42 or XDs, I'll carry at least one extra mag. If I am carrying a Glock 19, then I dont feel the need, if 16 rounds doesnt get the job done I'm probibly screwed anyway. If its my Glock 27 it could go either way, sometimes I carry an extra, sometimes not.
Voodoo_Man
10-23-14, 08:48
Always.
A pistol is like a car that needs gas to work. The more gas the longer it runs. The more ammo the longer you are in the fight.
Always.
A pistol is like a car that needs gas to work. The more gas the longer it runs. The more ammo the longer you are in the fight.My thinking exactly, though I'm wondering as a corollary to that as to whether longer fights tend to favor the attacker or the defender. Obviously I want to win as fast as possible to be certain to minimize errors, but the situation isn't ideal anyway being attacked in the first place.
My thinking exactly, though I'm wondering as a corollary to that as to whether longer fights tend to favor the attacker or the defender. Obviously I want to win as fast as possible to be certain to minimize errors, but the situation isn't ideal anyway being attacked in the first place.
The longer the fight lasts (with me still in it in one form or another:) - the longer I have time to create distance and/or seek better cover/concealment. Cover/concealment is always good, and I have been told by many with far more experience than me that distance favors the trained individual. YMMV - john
In the extraordinarily unlikely event that I would need use my gun in self defense, I consider it even more unlikely that it would take more than 7 rounds to do so. For me, where I live, in my daily activities, carrying an extra magazine is almost certainly a needless inconvenience. Others, who live elsewhere, may have different needs.
The longer the fight lasts (with me still in it in one form or another:) - the longer I have time to create distance and/or seek better cover/concealment. Cover/concealment is always good, and I have been told by many with far more experience than me that distance favors the trained individual. YMMV - johnAh yes, and with distance more opportunity to escape. A place where someone is trying to harm me is not a place I want to be in longer than I have to.
With my Bodyguard or 1911, usually 2 spares and with the Glock 17, at least 1.
Better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.
YMMV.
Mauser KAR98K
10-23-14, 22:34
I always carry a spare mag. Always.
MikeDawg46L
10-24-14, 07:31
P30 and 1-3 spares, depending on what I'm wearing. The more pockets, the more mags.
Tapatalk'd
Not being mean but...are some of you guys larger than optimal weight? Or do you wear VERTX Kryptec pants to the grocery store?
In a pair of blue jeans, I have to carry my G19 in a fantastic holster at the 2 or 4 o'clock position. With a 30" waist, if I carry at the 3 o'clock with a forward cant, the tip of the rear sight and the base of the mag extend further from a side view than my body. Already this makes it pretty difficult to conceal with typical, non-eccentric clothing for the +/- 30yr old crowd. I'm not against carrying a spare mag, but there's often a few benefits to "advancing" your evening plans. Don't slum it if you don't have to. Pick your routes to avoid as much danger as possible. When it's time to shoot, and it does happen to everyday Americans, take slower well aimed shots.
The idea of trying to carry some of the EDC items I am reading here would require I wear a trench coat and a duty belt. Or some cargo pockets which would be cool if it were...well, I don't know that cargo pants were ever really in style, and being able to blend in is a far better tactic than carrying a blowout kit, bugout bag, head lamp, six sure fires, and a dozen mags.
Now with my G42 I always carry a spare mag. Partly because of the capacity limitation, though I'm not too worried about coming up short with that little laser, and partly because it's much more practical. If I stuff my lighter inside my pack of smokes (back left pocket which has my real items, wallet is petty cash and prepaid cards) and throw the spare mag in my front pocket, it's going to print the same shape and dimensions as a bic lighter. It draws no attention. There's a reason why I don't carry a full size McAwesome Brand 1911, and it's not because I'm not 'Merican enough. I have a large chest and shoulders, a very thin waist, and have to wear slim/tapered fit shirts to avoid looking like I'm swimming in an off shelf dress shirt. Now if I wore size 54" pants I wouldn't mind because not only would my belt line be a fuvkin catastrophe anyway, but I'd probably have a few natural TuckN'Take folds to flop over my holsters and spotlights and triple-mag shingles...
I'm 30. I wear 32" waist x34" length jeans and carry a G19 and an extra mag. Hell today I'm carrying a G17 w/X400 in an OWB holster and a flannel shirt covering it.
What do you wear skinny jeans like a girly boy?
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lahunter57
10-24-14, 11:19
I have a 34" waist and I carry a spare mag opposite of my G26 which I carry appendix style. I don't have a problem with printing, even with a full size G17 magazine.
You just have to find a carrier/holster that works for you.
As far as EDC stuff goes: I have my wallet, keys with leatherman squirt and a craftsman flat head screwdriver key chain thing, Benchmade Mini Barrage, Wallet, iphone 5, G26 and spare mag. I usually wear a blackhawk riggers belt because I rarely ruck my shirt in(in college, no job) and it does just fine. I don't really see the need for anything else to be carried on my person, anything else I could possibly need is in my truck.
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MikeDawg46L
10-24-14, 11:35
5'-7", 170-ish lbs, 32-33" waist, and in great shape. I don't have a six pack and I'm not "skinny", I have more of a short, stocky, running back build. I carry my P30 AIWB around 1-2o'clock in a GI Silent Thunder holster, and carry a spare mag in my left pocket with my cell. Or if I'm wearing my Vertx pants/shorts, which I do almost everyday if I'm not headed to the gym, I'll put the mag in the left cargo pocket. I mostly wear UA t-shirts, and the butt prints a little but the average soccer mom at Wally World doesn't know the difference. Anyone that would pick up on the fact that I'm CCW would likely be doing the same, as I've noticed others that way in the past. If I'm in winter clothes with a jacket, I'll throw another mag in the pocket.
I don't look commando or mall ninja. I look like every other 25-40 year old dude in my area that isn't a flaming emo or hipster.
SW 9mm Shield. 1 extra mag. (I carry the extra for malf clearing)
Always. On duty I have the two extra, off duty I carry one extra (I'm just not big enough to conceal two spare mags).
P2000 with one extra magazine in my front pocket.
I carry a PPQ with 17 round magazine. Depending on what I'm wearing, more often than not I have a spare 17 round mag in my front left pocket. It's not exactly the ideal setup for a spare mag, but it is what it is. I've found that on me personally a spare mag carrier prints way worse than my IWB holster with a full sized gun in it. I've experimented with a few different mag carriers and haven't found that really makes any difference.
I can probably count on one hand the number of times in 2014 that I've carried a spare mag.
I also leave the house some days without my gun on me.
I'm a monster.
Not being mean but...are some of you guys larger than optimal weight?.
Yep - some of us are "man-sized":). For me - that would be 6'5" and 285#, and while I carry a bit more poundage after entering my 7th decade, I've never been described as overweight (the height helps:):):)
Two things I've never quite understood....... 1). LEOs who never carry off duty, and 2). CCW folks who don't carry a spare mag. FWIW - summer or winter, I carry a G26 with G19 mag, and two G26 12-rounders for a total round count of 40 rounds.
john
FWIW, I carry one extra for my G19 at all times. I figure, if 15 is good, 30 is better.
FWIW, I have Fireclean now in this, that I take with me to the training center and range:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002LYQALQ/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
It's fantastic.
Voodoo_Man
10-24-14, 19:15
Spare mags, ftw.
http://i.imgur.com/FT5foLH.jpg
Not being mean but...are some of you guys larger than optimal weight? Or do you wear VERTX Kryptec pants to the grocery store?
I'm 6'0", 165lbs. I wear nice clothes that fit, normal jeans, fitted shirts. Button ups make it a breeze, T-shirts? I have to get the gear in the right spot with those.
I AIWB carry an M&P40 FS in a VG2(used to use an original VG). I can fit 2 mags in safariland metal mag clips and hide them well. I have about 3 shirts that require the shield, and I stuff a spare mag in the waistband - the baseplate is flat enough it doesn't fall out.
If I carried 4:00 - Id have to carry the shield nearly all the time. With AIWB carry, I think I could conceal an AR pistol with a hooded sweatshirt. I too have a wide chest and thinner waist.
MountainRaven
10-24-14, 22:13
Not being mean but...are some of you guys larger than optimal weight? Or do you wear VERTX Kryptec pants to the grocery store?
Under 30. 6'4", 220 lbs. 34" waist, 36" inseam. I like wearing fitted clothing.
And I can still pull off a full-size 1911, G17, P30L, or VP9 with an IWB. OWB if I wear something longer or baggier or patterned or all three.
Voodoo_Man
10-25-14, 08:46
Another point of reference, I am mid twenties, 6' even, and 155 pounds. I currently carry a VP9 in an RCS holster in the waistband between 3 & 4 o'clock, and in the past have carried anything from a P30 to a Glock 19 or 17. I also wear slim jeans, and somewhat fitted shirts. Button down shirts, even fitted ones, makes concealing a handgun easy for me. Even slim tshirts are usually not a big deal. I honestly think that even very minor differences in everyone's body makes a huge deal in what size handgun that they can conceal.
On this particular topic, I have a hard time concealing a spare magazine, so unfortunately, I do not carry one often. Still on the hunt for a good mag pouch, I have tried a decent number of carriers as well, and even concealing a full size handgun IWB being no issue for me, carrying a spare mag IWB sucks. BFG is supposed to be putting out a belt mounted 10 speed pouch any day now, and I have high hopes for that.
Rear pocket or front pocket, both closest to your A line. That is easiest way to pocket carry. It works well.
But I look so good in skinny jeans!
My question wasn't a dig and was probably poorly worded. At 5'10" and 190, I'm not enormous by any stretch. My girlfriend has been bringing me to a lot of higher-class work functions, and my semi-daily work environments may go from camo to a flight suit, to a suit or slacks and shirt. I'm usually dressed in business casual and most of those items are tailored because I don't want to look like an off-the-rack guy...it's just bad form. Nobody has to know I only pay $4 for a $100 shirt by letting the girl do the bargain shopping.
Anyway some of you guys mentioned what I was talking about. In some attire, it's difficult enough to conceal the gun. Throwing more and more shit on your EDC list means you're leaving the realm of practicality. I chose my daily carry gun because I can carry 16 rounds of my favorite defensive ammo without a spare mag. That's far more than I've ever needed to take control of a situation, I won't be out there firing 600+ rounds into a parked car. My goal is to E&E quickly, engage as fast and effectively as I need to to continue my E&E, and skedaddle on outta there. Were I taking on an offensive role that would be different.
Everything else, the catalog of the ever changing "I only ever use these here XXXXX products" accessories from those oh-so-honest well known name instructors, that can stay in the truck. With my other things that I don't need to stay alive. And this is why I don't carry a 1911, negligible ballistic compromise and more than twice the magazine capacity without having to conduct a reload. It's about time the obsolete guns are called what they are ;)
MountainRaven
10-25-14, 14:40
Having sixteen rounds ready to rock in one magazine is great, until the gun suffers a magazine-related failure on your second round. Or you failed to seat the magazine properly. Or the magazine release was hit in the holster.
Compared to concealing a full-size 1911 or G17, concealing a magazine and/or a fixed blade is easy. Especially in a world where it seems like half of everybody is wearing a cell phone and/or a multitool on their belt. And if you're wearing a blazer/business jacket/suit coat/sport coat, it's super easy. The trick is finding a tailor who understands and appreciates the need/desire to carry a firearm, magazine, fixed blade, TQ, &c.... whatever's on your "bat belt" and knows how to make alterations accordingly.
^exactly. Reread the thread and you'll quickly see that people don't carry a backup solely for the capacity, but the event of a mag getting dumped or a magazine failure. A single-round in the chamber may not do the job. If you're a Glock guy, you have certainly come to terms with the idea that your $25 magazine is the biggest failure point.
I carry a Glock, but for CCW, I wouldn't feel undergunned with a properly functioning 1911 with one reload. 8 in the mag, one in the chamber and a follow up mag of 8 is as likely to solve my issue in CCW as a G19 with 14 in the mag and one in the chamber I wouldn't trust a factory Glock mag loaded to capacity.
Fwiw, I find a spare actually pulls the gun closer and concealed better.
10mmSpringfield
10-25-14, 17:07
I carry a Springer ROC, so a 6 round spare officer's mag doesn't take up much space. Carry one in my front pocket.
I honestly think that even very minor differences in everyone's body makes a huge deal in what size handgun that they can conceal.
This is true.
It's also true that there's quite a bit of variation in what people find "acceptable." One man's "conceals fine" is another man's "no go."
I've heard people who are my height and weight say that they have no problems concealing a full size, double stack handgun with nothing but a normal sized t-shirt. Personally, after trying numerous handguns and holsters, I've yet to find a combination that has been at all acceptable for me personally with just that amount of clothing. Either I have to go down in gun size or start adding button downs and the like to the equation.
Just the rounds in my Glock23 normally. No extra mags. Only time I take an extra mag is when going into the risky areas of ZA.
Having sixteen rounds ready to rock in one magazine is great, until the gun suffers a magazine-related failure on your second round. Or you failed to seat the magazine properly. Or the magazine release was hit in the holster.
Compared to concealing a full-size 1911 or G17, concealing a magazine and/or a fixed blade is easy. Especially in a world where it seems like half of everybody is wearing a cell phone and/or a multitool on their belt. And if you're wearing a blazer/business jacket/suit coat/sport coat, it's super easy. The trick is finding a tailor who understands and appreciates the need/desire to carry a firearm, magazine, fixed blade, TQ, &c.... whatever's on your "bat belt" and knows how to make alterations accordingly.
Good point. I guess my only counter to that is that not only do I thoroughly test each mag for performance and run the most reliable for CCW, I also usually have a backup nearby even if not on my body.
Your brain is a far more effective weapon in a lot of ways. If my weapon suffers an odd mechanical failure that I can't overcome, I'll certainly have other options.
Every mag is perfect until it fails the first time. Close by doesn't help should you need it.
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coyotegray
10-26-14, 09:22
At least one. Extra ammo and for failure drill.
At least one. Extra ammo and for failure drill.
Failure drill? As in Mozambique drill?
Failure drill? As in Mozambique drill?
Lmao!
I have a question for everyone who cites malfunction as the reason to carry an extra magazine: why not carry a two inch bbl revolver?
I subscribe to the K.I.S.S principle while off duty because I do not train for that. I carry over principles of my on duty training into my off duty world.
I am not knocking anyone who carry extra magazines. It's just another variable for me to have to account for if the crap hits the fan.
Voodoo_Man
10-26-14, 10:08
Lmao!
I have a question for everyone who cites malfunction as the reason to carry an extra magazine: why not carry a two inch bbl revolver?
I subscribe to the K.I.S.S principle while off duty because I do not train for that. I carry over principles of my on duty training into my off duty world.
I am not knocking anyone who carry extra magazines. It's just another variable for me to have to account for if the crap hits the fan.
Find me a revolver with 17+1 or 15+1 capacity. Find me a revolver that you can hit out to 25 yards extremely accurately. Find me a revolver you can shoot with a standard pistol grip without burning your hands. Find me a revolver that can accept light or laser mounted devices. Find me one that does all the above and I will carry it on the spot without regret.
I totally understand why guys carry revolvers off-duty, I do, but is some old school thinking going on. To me, K.I.S.S. is a Glock in 9mm with two mags, not a revolver that severely limits my chances of victory due to unknown circumstances.
Will I need an extra 17 round magazine? Who knows. Failing to plan is planning to fail. I rather have that extra magazine and not need it, because all it takes is one situation where you need it and you are done.
Lmao!
I have a question for everyone who cites malfunction as the reason to carry an extra magazine: why not carry a two inch bbl revolver?
I subscribe to the K.I.S.S principle while off duty because I do not train for that. I carry over principles of my on duty training into my off duty world.
I am not knocking anyone who carry extra magazines. It's just another variable for me to have to account for if the crap hits the fan.
I have an Airweight (642) that I occasionally carry in a Speed Scabbard, or maybe in a pocket if the pants I'm wearing are baggy enough (rare). I hate shooting that little gun, but there's no denying its convenience in the relatively rare occasions where I can't hide the PPS.
coyotegray
10-26-14, 10:25
Failure drill? As in Mozambique drill?
As in tap, rack, bang.
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As in tap, rack, bang.
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Where I am from, we call that a malfunction drill. A failure drill for us is to overcome hidden body armor. Two center mass one to the brain pan.
Singlestack Wonder
10-26-14, 10:46
I always carry extra ammo. Shit happens...
Every mag is perfect until it fails the first time. Close by doesn't help should you need it.
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Well shucks, now that you say it like that....see I've never really needed a gun before. I just carry for piece of mind. But since things do fail sometimes, I'll get a few spare mags and ammo from different lot numbers, a spare barrel, a spare drop in trigger and some extra sets of sights. I may even wear a second set of pants under my real pants in case I suffer a mechanical pantaloons issue.
Since everything is potentially the weak link at any given time, I find it hard to enjoy life when I'm staking my well being on a small,imperfect piece of equipment. If my back is against the wall and my life depends on that gun going bang when I pull the trigger, it's a result of a long series of failures on my part.
MountainRaven
10-26-14, 14:56
Lmao!
I have a question for everyone who cites malfunction as the reason to carry an extra magazine: why not carry a two inch bbl revolver?
I subscribe to the K.I.S.S principle while off duty because I do not train for that. I carry over principles of my on duty training into my off duty world.
I am not knocking anyone who carry extra magazines. It's just another variable for me to have to account for if the crap hits the fan.
As someone whose first handgun was a 1911, my thinking has been inordinately impacted by that of the late 'Jeff' Cooper and Clint Smith.
One of their principles that I have taken to heart - and has been reinforced to me by every reputable instructor I have met (and some disreputable ones, too) - is to carry as large a handgun as possible. To carry a fighting handgun, a combat handgun, or whatever you want to call it. The larger the handgun, the more powerful it can be, the easier it is to hang on to, and the greater the capacity of rounds you can carry on your person.
To get back to the snub-nose revolver....
I have carried such a weapon before and plan to do so again: But when it is the only gun I'm carrying, I'm not carrying a gun.
Well shucks, now that you say it like that....see I've never really needed a gun before. I just carry for piece of mind. But since things do fail sometimes, I'll get a few spare mags and ammo from different lot numbers, a spare barrel, a spare drop in trigger and some extra sets of sights. I may even wear a second set of pants under my real pants in case I suffer a mechanical pantaloons issue.
Since everything is potentially the weak link at any given time, I find it hard to enjoy life when I'm staking my well being on a small,imperfect piece of equipment. If my back is against the wall and my life depends on that gun going bang when I pull the trigger, it's a result of a long series of failures on my part.
So sarcasm aside, you only own one pair of trousers?
I mean, one of the tenets of this site is that one should own spare parts for their firearms. Obviously, you might have a fire control group break on you, or you might get a barrel plugged by a squib in the real world. But it's not particularly likely to happen. And the chances of being able to swap out those parts under fire without getting dead are pretty slim.
Again, if you can conceal a handgun, concealing a little piece of metal and plastic that fits inside that handgun should be easy-peasy. And it's a part that is designed to be fast and easy to replace in the field.
By all means, carry whatever makes you comfortable - although I believe it was Clint Smith who said, "Carrying a gun isn't supposed to be comfortable, it is supposed to be a comfort," - it's better than throwing rocks. But to my mind, the sort of thinking that ignores the possibilities of being confronted by multiple attackers or suffering an ammunition- or magazine-related malfunction and so forgoes an additional magazine or two is the same sort of thinking that ignores the possibility of being attacked at night and so forgoes a flashlight and/or night sights... or ignores the possibility of being in a car accident and so forgoes wearing a seat belt. Not wearing a seat belt is more comfortable, too, I suppose.
Well shucks, now that you say it like that....see I've never really needed a gun before. I just carry for piece of mind. But since things do fail sometimes, I'll get a few spare mags and ammo from different lot numbers, a spare barrel, a spare drop in trigger and some extra sets of sights. I may even wear a second set of pants under my real pants in case I suffer a mechanical pantaloons issue.
Since everything is potentially the weak link at any given time, I find it hard to enjoy life when I'm staking my well being on a small,imperfect piece of equipment. If my back is against the wall and my life depends on that gun going bang when I pull the trigger, it's a result of a long series of failures on my part.
Yeah. If I was to really try to minimize my daily risks, wearing body armor and a helmet every time I get in my car would be at the top of my list.
Lmao!
I have a question for everyone who cites malfunction as the reason to carry an extra magazine: why not carry a two inch bbl revolver?
I subscribe to the K.I.S.S principle while off duty because I do not train for that. I carry over principles of my on duty training into my off duty world.
I am not knocking anyone who carry extra magazines. It's just another variable for me to have to account for if the crap hits the fan.
Funny you say that. I've seen more catastrophic failures of revolvers in handgun classes. My good friend that is a defensive pistol instructor has seen more failures in revolvers than pistols.
Personally I don't like revolvers. I don't shoot them as accurately as fast as a 19 or 17.
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Well shucks, now that you say it like that....see I've never really needed a gun before. I just carry for piece of mind. But since things do fail sometimes, I'll get a few spare mags and ammo from different lot numbers, a spare barrel, a spare drop in trigger and some extra sets of sights. I may even wear a second set of pants under my real pants in case I suffer a mechanical pantaloons issue.
Since everything is potentially the weak link at any given time, I find it hard to enjoy life when I'm staking my well being on a small,imperfect piece of equipment. If my back is against the wall and my life depends on that gun going bang when I pull the trigger, it's a result of a long series of failures on my part.
Way to be a smartass. I recommend you don't carry. It's obvious you do it just to do it. Your mindset is wrong if you fail to recognize that pants failing don't cost you your life. If you can't recognize that magazines are the weakest link in the system, I really don't know what you expect from this forum.
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Let's keep it about the topic, not the members.
Way to be a smartass. I recommend you don't carry. It's obvious you do it just to do it. Your mindset is wrong if you fail to recognize that pants failing don't cost you your life. If you can't recognize that magazines are the weakest link in the system, I really don't know what you expect from this forum.
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Well I was being a smartass and that wasn't necessary, so apology on my part. I'll consider your recommendation.
My decision to carry, or not carry, a spare mag has a lot more to do with a big picture assessment than comfort. Comfort has never been a concern to me nor do I think I've been uncomfortable carrying. However, while a magazine is one of the weak points in the cycle of operations performance, it's not the only one. It isn't likely to fail me though so preparing as if it is imminent seems a bit of a stretch, no?
Okay, will I take the chance that maybe a lack of a spare mag could get me killed? Maybe. A lot can get me killed in a day. You're really talking about a perfect storm of events though, one so unlikely that I choose not to stress about it or take on the added risk* of carrying a large amount of gear. My mag failing me means;
-I'm in an active shooter or some form of attack where it's NOT known that I'm carrying, and I happen to be in the intended crowd of targeted bystanders. Not only is this a statistically rare occurrence, but my planning process usually keeps me away from the usual areas these things happen. So supposing I failed to plan that day or it just happened to find me at the time...
-I would have to NOT know my area or building. What does De Niro say in Ronin about going into a building you can't get out of? Most venues for public events have blueprints or building layouts hosted on their website. These are really easy to analyze and choose areas of likely threats and plan which two or three egress points to confirm when you get there. Same with driving and knowing your way back to the highway, it's just easy to keep in the back of your mind. Even most department stores follow simple layouts that are regulated, and thus fairly universal. I don't usually go somewhere new, during a time of high interest. And...
-It's not my last resort, never is and never will be. I'll attempt and egress with my loved ones first, I'll make the path to me more difficult for an attacker, and I'll use the layout to create distance. If I cannot exit the building or venue, I'll choose a stairwell or corner office to fortify. This buys me time to gather some improvised weapons and make life really difficult for whoever comes in. I've done this before and it works wonderfully. So since by now my options are running out, I suppose I have to hope the sun and the moon aren't aligned just right so that my well maintained and modified mag decides to fail. If it does, my glock just became a hammer to hit someone while I bite their throat or do what I can to protect my loved ones.
Of course none of that matters since it's an individual choice based on my experience. I've been quick on the gun before, and that's saved my life. I've been quick NOT to use my gun, and instead search out better solutions than standing and gunning, and that's saved my life and others' lives as well. As for the "added risk*" of carrying a bat belt of gear, I'm not going to make myself a target. If an intelligent and dangerous attacker is going for mass death tolls, they're going to kill anyone that poses as an obstacle first. They'll observe the crowd and have spotters wandering or mingling. My attire, should it need to cover a whole mess of gear, is possibly an indicator that I can't wear what everyone else is wearing. My lumpy midsection in an otherwise polished and ironed appearance generates curiosity and looks unusual. I could go on, but by being the guy in 5.11 pants at a black tie event, I'm likely to never live long enough to pull the trigger one time. Carry a spare mag or ten if you want, I don't care. I don't doubt that your experience and education have led you to believe you need to and that's fine. I don't assume it makes you stupid or incapable of carrying a gun. From my lessons learned, I choose to keep my CCW mindset as a game of thinking rather than relying on equipment.
I'm glad you could apologize. I'm not suggesting a mess of gear; just an extra magazine, should yours malfunction, be inadvertently dropped, etc. If you don't want to, that's on you. But I can tell you from years of carrying that it doesn't make you a target not is it hard to conceal. Most other things on your pistol aren't going to fail you quite as frequently as the magazine. I've personally watched mags fall out for lack of seating, inadvertently being released on the person, the mag fail, etc in training. Sounds like you're planning for what to so should something bad happen, but you're assuming that it can be dealt with otherwise.
Why so against an extra mag, if not about comfort or concealment? How does a mag equate a lot of gear? Where do you believe one suggests you wear, or need them for that matter, 5.11s at a black tie event?
I really don't get what you wear that a spare mag points to you being somebody carrying? I've gone in full business attire carrying without it drawing a bit of attention. Hell, I carried in a wedding party last year without a blazer because of the heat. I just splashed some baby powder on my inside holster, blouses my shirt, kept everything tucked, wore at four and mag at seven.
I applaud you for knowing your surroundings and making a conscious effort to do so.
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MorphCross
10-27-14, 16:42
10 round with pinkie extension in the pistol, pair of 14 rounders in whatever pocket is most comfortable. More and more often we see armed robberies occurring as group events rather than single shooter scenarios.
Lmao!
I have a question for everyone who cites malfunction as the reason to carry an extra magazine: why not carry a two inch bbl revolver?
A mag change is quicker. Then you have 16rds instead of 6(or 5) and its in a much more capable gun.
I subscribe to the K.I.S.S principle while off duty because I do not train for that. I carry over principles of my on duty training into my off duty world.
How is carrying 2 different guns, with 2 different modes of operation KISS? How is leaving a reload at home more simple? Why don't you train for it, and/or why does carry-over not appy?
I am not knocking anyone who carry extra magazines. It's just another variable for me to have to account for if the crap hits the fan.
Red is mine.
How in a spare mag another variable to account for? What drawbacks, other than possibly concealment, could a spare bring on?
Its your decision, but carrying a spare seems like a 100% positive, purely logical decision. I sometimes don't carry a spare, and I'll admit, its usually due to laziness.
Pretty much always have a spare mag in my left front pants pocket, regardless of which gun I am carrying. As my momma always said, better to have it an not need it, than to need it an not have it.
Yeah. If I was to really try to minimize my daily risks, wearing body armor and a helmet every time I get in my car would be at the top of my list.
With my commute I'd seriously consider the helmet.
Maybe I should bring this up with the insurance company...
Oh, I carry an extra mag for the G19,
I'm glad you could apologize. I'm not suggesting a mess of gear; just an extra magazine, should yours malfunction, be inadvertently dropped, etc. If you don't want to, that's on you. But I can tell you from years of carrying that it doesn't make you a target not is it hard to conceal. Most other things on your pistol aren't going to fail you quite as frequently as the magazine. I've personally watched mags fall out for lack of seating, inadvertently being released on the person, the mag fail, etc in training. Sounds like you're planning for what to so should something bad happen, but you're assuming that it can be dealt with otherwise.
Why so against an extra mag, if not about comfort or concealment? How does a mag equate a lot of gear? Where do you believe one suggests you wear, or need them for that matter, 5.11s at a black tie event?
I really don't get what you wear that a spare mag points to you being somebody carrying? I've gone in full business attire carrying without it drawing a bit of attention. Hell, I carried in a wedding party last year without a blazer because of the heat. I just splashed some baby powder on my inside holster, blouses my shirt, kept everything tucked, wore at four and mag at seven.
I applaud you for knowing your surroundings and making a conscious effort to do so.
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I've done a decent amount of shooting in my lifetime, certainly not as much as some, but a good amount. I've had my gun out and pointed at other people several times, nearly all of them were under stress and were performed using muscle memory. In all of that, I have never dropped a mag inadvertently. I almost never carry a spare mag off duty.
The man has done his personal threat assessment and mental preparation. So have I, and so have you. We've each come to different conclusions about what we need and what we want. His and my decision to not carry a spare mag don't make us inferior to you, nor does it make us any less responsible as gun owners.
Genuinely curious - in your shooting practice, including your high stress draw/fire drills, how many failures have you actually had where you either dropped your mag or that a magazine change was the most appropriate means of fixing your problem?
Actually had one last time I was out doing draw-fire from concealment. I had a mag double-feed. I tapped racked banged and it did it again. The. I dropped the mag and inserted a fresh one. It took about 7 seconds.
I've personally ever inadvertently dropped a pistol mag, but I have seen others.
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carry one or don't it's up to (anyone of) you. but trying to justify not taking one because you can't conceal it is silly. it's MUCH easier to conceal than the gun itself. I can completely conceal an 18rd SIG mag in a pair of gym shorts and loose t-shirt.
but, if I may, I'd like to ask a question that has bugged me for awhile -- why all the paranoia about making your gear completely invisible?..
if you carry concealed you only have two ways to do it legally - be official, or with a permit. my state CCW law says the gun must be concealed. that doesn't mean completely indiscernible to intense scrutiny. it means concealed to open view.
the average person wouldn't notice if you walked around wearing two different shoes, much less discern that the slight rumple under your shirt is a gun. I've even had gun people come up to me with a grin on their face ask, "what's that bulge under your shirt?" and when I say, "that's my phone" they go "oh, ok" and drop it.
now I'm not talking about being so overt (OWB under a tight t-shirt) that it's obvious to anyone with a casual glance. I understand the idea of a bad guy identifying it and choosing you to shoot first so my situational awareness and demeanor change to aid concealment when I'm carrying. I dress to do my best to keep the gun from printing, I try to sit or stand with my gun on the blind side, and I don't bend over recklessly in front of people, but lets face it, if someone suspects you are carrying and looking for it, they'll spot your gun.
if you're carrying legally, why the hand wringing if someone is able to detect that you are?..
if you're carrying legally, why the hand wringing if someone is able to detect that you are?..
In many circumstances and in many jobs, overtly carrying a gun makes one's patients/customers/friends/co-workers/employers nervous. They might tolerate it if they know that you are armed but don't see it, but generally are less likely to do so if they are actually confronted with the weapon itself.
Not that that is, in itself, a reason not to be armed if you perceive that your life is in danger on a daily basis, but for many (or most) that isn't the case and the downside of carrying a gun (with our without extra mag) outweighs the need. Different people's circumstances will dictate that relative need differently.
St.Michael
11-01-14, 04:33
G17 with two extra mags. Lots of 5.11 pants. Makes it easy to carry them. Longer t shirts make them look like normal cargo pants and I love it.
1 spare mag, G26. Just got a remora holster and they sent a small pouch along with it. I keep it in the cargo pocket and so far it seems to keep it upright. Thats a 26 10 rd mag in it.
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e109/88sporty/45/IMG_20141101_052953564_zps6b437771.jpg (http://s38.photobucket.com/user/88sporty/media/45/IMG_20141101_052953564_zps6b437771.jpg.html)
Usually carry an extra mag. Just feel naked without an extra mag.
Wow, I guess I'm the exception around here. I'm 6'1" 155lbs and I daily carry Shield AIWB, a spare 8rd mag, a 500 lumen light, a SWAT-T and quick clot. No printing, no discomfort.
St.Michael
11-02-14, 06:17
Wow, I guess I'm the exception around here. I'm 6'1" 155lbs and I daily carry Shield AIWB, a spare 8rd mag, a 500 lumen light, a SWAT-T and quick clot. No printing, no discomfort.
I have a friend with just about the same build as you who gets away with a full galco holster with his 17 and 2 mags, a iwb 19 with extra mag and flashlight. He has no issues either hiding the stuff under his shirt.
IZinterrogator
11-02-14, 12:25
but, if I may, I'd like to ask a question that has bugged me for awhile -- why all the paranoia about making your gear completely invisible?..
if you carry concealed you only have two ways to do it legally - be official, or with a permit. my state CCW law says the gun must be concealed. that doesn't mean completely indiscernible to intense scrutiny. it means concealed to open view.
if you're carrying legally, why the hand wringing if someone is able to detect that you are?..
In Texas, failure to conceal is a crime if you have a CHL. Printing badly can be interpreted by a cop as failure to conceal.
I see no reason to bash people either way. We each have voiced our opinion (as requested) and a summary as to why. We all mitigate risk daily whether at work, home or out and about. I'm just glad people out there are carrying, reload or not. I routinely don't carry an extra mag as I stated earlier but times are changing, events seem to be far too frequent and some good points have been made. Either way keep carrying.
St.Michael
11-02-14, 17:58
In Texas, failure to conceal is a crime if you have a CHL. Printing badly can be interpreted by a cop as failure to conceal.
There are too many things left to just the interpretation for leo. I've never had an officer mention printing to me personally. I wonder what the ticket for something like that is. I was using kydex mag carriers for my extra mags, but it gets annoying in the car. I just practice my ccw mag reloads from pockets now
IZinterrogator
11-02-14, 18:00
I had an officer question the bump under my shirt once. Oddly enough, that time it was my phone because I was headed onto Fort Hood later.
I carry 2 spare mags for my primary, G19, and 1 spare mag for my BUG, LCP. Mob attacks and stuff like the Westgate Mall attack made me decide to up my EDC gear. I used to just carry the G19 with one spare mag.
In many circumstances and in many jobs, overtly carrying a gun makes one's patients/customers/friends/co-workers/employers nervous. They might tolerate it if they know that you are armed but don't see it, but generally are less likely to do so if they are actually confronted with the weapon itself.
Not that that is, in itself, a reason not to be armed if you perceive that your life is in danger on a daily basis, but for many (or most) that isn't the case and the downside of carrying a gun (with our without extra mag) outweighs the need. Different people's circumstances will dictate that relative need differently.
nono, I didn't say overt. I understand all the issues above. but if you've CCW for awhile you have to know that sooner or later it will be "discoverable", whether by printing through the cover garment or by outright exposure.
I'm only talking about guns large enough to be considered viable SD weapons, easily accessible, carried in a holster somewhere on the waist, not some type of "deep cover" gun.
this is a thread asking about carrying an extra magazine and a lot of the negative answers reference visibility as a reason not to. as I said, guns of this size will conceal quite well given appropriate cover but will never be invisible to scrutiny if someone knows what to look for. a spare magazine is so many times more easily concealed than a gun that I don't understand this rationale...
In Texas, failure to conceal is a crime if you have a CHL. Printing badly can be interpreted by a cop as failure to conceal.
well that would be very much up to the individual cop. if it's clearly obvious, then that's a failure on your part. if it's a suspicious bump that can be explained away by a reasonable explanation (phone, PDA, glasses, etc...), I don't see how that's going to be a problem unless they want to make it one.
I'm not saying lie to a cop if they ask you "what's that bump?", it's just that if they do ask, they probably haven't made an actual identification and are just going on suspicion.
it's funny, when I get together with my friends (all cops or CCW holders), we're all carrying all the time...
we like to prank and kid each other and a common question is someone will point to a hip and ask, "ah-ha! what ya carrying there?".
I'm left handed but one time at a barbeque I was only carrying my BUG off-side with spare mag in a pocket. one of the guys came up and popped the question and I raised my shirt on my strong (empty) side and said, "nothing, I got you guys to protect me"... that passed and no one else ever said anything even though many bro-hugs were given.
point is, these guys were practiced observers with an expectation that there was something there. and unless someone is actually looking for it, as much as you think it may be super obvious, most people wouldn't notice if you were wearing clown shoes.
dress with appropriate cover, do your best to avoid motions that will reveal your weapon, and and carry on with the same level of alertness that causes you to carry in the first place...
I carry an extra mag, small fixed blade and pen light as part of my EDC with my VP9.
I carry 2 spare mags for my primary, G19, and 1 spare mag for my BUG, LCP. Mob attacks and stuff like the Westgate Mall attack made me decide to up my EDC gear. I used to just carry the G19 with one spare mag.
How can all that be concealed on your person?
How can all that be concealed on your person?
Easy! 5.11 pants help a lot though. Milt Sparks Summer Special II IWB for G19 strong side at 4:30. Safariland 572 dual mag carrier weak side hip. LCP back left pocket, LCP spare mag in front cell phone pouch. That's not including knife, light, phone, keys, etc. It's all in how you dress and being aware of your movements. When I was new to CC it was hard just figuring out how to hide my G19, now I can't imagine leaving the house with only the G19.
teutonicpolymer
11-04-14, 20:06
Easy! 5.11 pants help a lot though. Milt Sparks Summer Special II IWB for G19 strong side at 4:30. Safariland 572 dual mag carrier weak side hip. LCP back left pocket, LCP spare mag in front cell phone pouch. That's not including knife, light, phone, keys, etc. It's all in how you dress and being aware of your movements. When I was new to CC it was hard just figuring out how to hide my G19, now I can't imagine leaving the house with only the G19.
Damn that is a lot of stuff to carry but I understand the logic
Damn that is a lot of stuff to carry but I understand the logic
It seems like a lot until you get used to it. Belt helps A LOT too. I'm running a Galco SB1. I carry this stuff with ease so I don't understand why some people refuse to carry just 1 spare mag. Not knocking anyone, I just don't understand why anyone wouldn't.
Two huge things I think of when I put all this crap on in the morning: 1) Mags are a big weak link in semi-autos and 2) If something really bad goes down I'm only going to have what is on me at my disposal.
teutonicpolymer
11-04-14, 21:08
It seems like a lot until you get used to it. Belt helps A LOT too. I'm running a Galco SB1. I carry this stuff with ease so I don't understand why some people refuse to carry just 1 spare mag. Not knocking anyone, I just don't understand why anyone wouldn't.
Two huge things I think of when I put all this crap on in the morning: 1) Mags are a big weak link in semi-autos and 2) If something really bad goes down I'm only going to have what is on me at my disposal.
I totally understand- when I lived in Arizona I actually carried a somewhat similar setup... sucked in the heat.
St.Michael
11-05-14, 02:13
I may go back to carrying a Smith .38 this year as a bug. I was using a galco ankle holster for that. I worked in the kitchen for a while for a very popular chain restaurant and was limited to only a lcp due to the uniform but I still carried two mags for it.
One extra (G17 mag) about 70% of time for G19 depends on where I am. I also feel 15+1 is pretty good for me.
One extra (G17 mag) about 70% of time for G19 depends on where I am. I also feel 15+1 is pretty good for me.
The same
One spare mag, always except when at home.
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I carry a Glock 17 mag as a spare for my off duty Glock 19.
I used to pocket carry a spare magazine in my left pocket. After a week or so of carry, I unloaded my carry ammo and found a large amount of pocket lint inside the magazine and on the cases of my carry ammo. This bothered me. I soon found the Desantis Mag-Packer. http://www.desantisholster.com/MAG-PACKER. I ordered a few of these and started putting my spare magazine inside and no longer have any pocket lint issues because the magazine is secured. I'd say this product is a must for anyone who pocket carries a spare magazine.
davidjinks
11-19-14, 21:54
Always have a spare mag on me while carrying. When I'm on the road, long trips away from home, I carry 2 spares on me and 5 additional with a spare parts kit in my travel bag.
Personal opinion is; a spare mag is cheap insurance for the end user. Will you ever need to change a mag because you ran dry during a shooting? Who knows. Will you have a magazine induced failure that can be remedied by changing mags? Who knows. At least you'd have one if any of those situations ever arose.
If you do, let us know.
If not, why not?
Talking Monkey
11-20-14, 08:25
I carry a spare G17 mag when carrying my G19. For one thing, I find it more comfortable in a way - my rig feels more balanced.
Voodoo_Man
11-20-14, 08:34
On topic question...
How do you guys carry the extra mag? Anyone carry aiwb or iwb in a leather or kydex pouch? If so, what kind and your opinion.
nono, I didn't say overt. I understand all the issues above. but if you've CCW for awhile you have to know that sooner or later it will be "discoverable", whether by printing through the cover garment or by outright exposure.
I'm only talking about guns large enough to be considered viable SD weapons, easily accessible, carried in a holster somewhere on the waist, not some type of "deep cover" gun.
this is a thread asking about carrying an extra magazine and a lot of the negative answers reference visibility as a reason not to. as I said, guns of this size will conceal quite well given appropriate cover but will never be invisible to scrutiny if someone knows what to look for. a spare magazine is so many times more easily concealed than a gun that I don't understand this rationale...
Your question was "if you're carrying legally, why the hand wringing if someone is able to detect that you are?..". The reason is that there can be adverse consequences even if one co-worker/patient/customer sees you printing even that one time accidentally. Depending on your lifestyle, circumstances, job...carrying a gun, let alone an extra magazine, isn't always necessary nor desirable, the balance being that it can cause you far more problems than it solves.
Eurodriver
11-20-14, 08:47
Have a spare mag in the car. Never carry a spare mag on me , seems ridiculous for my purposes.
Wow, I guess I'm the exception around here. I'm 6'1" 155lbs and I daily carry Shield AIWB, a spare 8rd mag, a 500 lumen light, a SWAT-T and quick clot. No printing, no discomfort.
Oh wow...
Talking Monkey
11-20-14, 09:00
On topic question...
How do you guys carry the extra mag? Anyone carry aiwb or iwb in a leather or kydex pouch? If so, what kind and your opinion.
I carry a spare mag in a Raven OWB pouch with the quick mount straps. GLOCK 19 is carried IWB in either an MDJ hybrid holster or Comp-Tac CTAC.
davidjinks
11-20-14, 09:44
Rig dependent...
Leather: Milt Sparks S4C or D4C
Kydex: Blade-Tech OWB SMP with belt loop (No longer made by them) or RCS SMP or DMP with belt loops.
I've tried IWB mag pouches before but I find them to be very uncomfortable for me.
On topic question...
How do you guys carry the extra mag? Anyone carry aiwb or iwb in a leather or kydex pouch? If so, what kind and your opinion.
Voodoo_Man
11-20-14, 10:56
Anyone have a bianchi russett? Thinkin about trying but would like better reviews from guys on here.
Carrying a G17, usually not. Carrying a 1911 or Shield, always.
MountainRaven
11-20-14, 19:30
Rig dependent...
Leather: Milt Sparks S4C or D4C
Kydex: Blade-Tech OWB SMP with belt loop (No longer made by them) or RCS SMP or DMP with belt loops.
I've tried IWB mag pouches before but I find them to be very uncomfortable for me.
This mirrors my experience with IWB mag pouches. 1911 mags are more comfortable to IWB than double stacks. But neither is especially comfortable for me for anything more than occasional use. I also find I have difficulty accessing magazines in IWB pouches - with 1911 mags being more difficult to access than double stacks.
back in my old job, i usually carried an extra magazine just in case of any malfunction. nowadays, as my new job is as the Police Medical Examiner in a region in the Philippines where there is a solid terrorist presence in two of the four provinces i cover- care of the communist New People's Army- both the mags i have, the one loaded and the spare, both have +2 base pads. so i have 18 shots in each, instead of the regular 16, for my Tanfoglio Force (that's EEA Witness for you guys in the US). also have another +2 mag in the bag which i place in the police van assigned to the unit.
just to be clear, most of the time my job is in well-secured, towns and pro-government areas. but then, about 10-20% of my case load deals with SOCO call-outs. that's Scene Of the Crime Operations- the Brit equivalent of the American CSI- as the first teams here were trained by Scotland Yard. those call-outs sometimes involve going to areas that may be... difficult to go to. early this month, did an exhumation in a tribal community where i needed to take an 8 man team from a town's police HRT, in camos and M16s, plus an 8 man squad from the nearby Infantry company (with M203s and a K3 SAW) for heavier firepower.
with that said, i am not trying to live out a gun-guy fantasy. i know my 9mm is not at par with the M16A1s and AKs the rebels/terrorists carry, although the thickness of the vegetation in the forests means that they could get down to 30-50 meters before we notice each other (and thus giving me a chance). my gun is just there so that the the communists know that i am not a soft target, to protect the back of the other SOCO team members, and to keep the communists heads down while we try to beat a hasty retreat and let the HRT/Army units do their job. there's also a M2 carbine in the police van, but that's to be used in dire emergencies. so a shootout would usually have us trying to give covering fire while the nearest one grabs the carbine, and another guy call for back-up.
I didn't get a chance to browse all 30 pages of this thread so I don't know if it's been brought up or not but has anyone tried the Snagmag?
Have a spare mag in the car. Never carry a spare mag on me , seems ridiculous for my purposes.
Oh wow...
Depends on your purposes, doesn't it?
If your purpose is self-protection, bad idea. Fight starts when you're ten (or a thousand) feet from your car, but you need a spare mag right now. What are you going to do? Call Time Out and go get your reload?
I've got a snag mag and I love it. It's not as fast as on the belt, but with practice is still quite fast and much more concealable. I've had several other gun friends ask why I'm carrying 2 knives and have to show them that it's a spare mag. It's definitely discreet.
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Depends on your purposes, doesn't it?
If your purpose is self-protection, bad idea. Fight starts when you're ten (or a thousand) feet from your car, but you need a spare mag right now. What are you going to do? Call Time Out and go get your reload?
That's assuming there is some realistic likelihood that a fight is going to happen, that you're going to need a gun to resolve it, and that it will take more than 7 rounds to do so. Pretty long odds in my cozy little life. YMMV depending on where you live/work/play.
.
That's assuming there is some realistic likelihood that a fight is going to happen, that you're going to need a gun to resolve it, and that it will take more than 7 rounds to do so. Pretty long odds in my cozy little life. YMMV depending on where you live/work/play.
.
Multiple armed assailants with cover (think parking garage with cement pillars) can make the need for additional ammunition very desirable.
-john
I got a Wilderness Products horizontal mag pouch for this purpose. Not as thin as I would have liked, something in kydex would be better. For me carrying spare ammo depends on the capacity of the arm I carry.
I keep spare mag in safari land competitor mag holder turned for iwb. I prefer readymag, but they weren't in stock. Either way, same concept (metal vs poly), and carried iwb at 7-8 o'clock position. I Aiwb the gun.
Multiple armed assailants with cover (think parking garage with cement pillars) can make the need for additional ammunition very desirable.
-john
Right. Because that's a problem that I face frequently and am likely to face in the future.
I have a good imagination. I can fantasize about protracted firefights as well as anybody here, I suspect. Where that falls down, for me, is the reality of applying that fantasy to my real life.
whatthepuck
12-17-14, 11:17
Right. Because that's a problem that I face frequently and am likely to face in the future.
I have a good imagination. I can fantasize about protracted firefights as well as anybody here, I suspect. Where that falls down, for me, is the reality of applying that fantasy to my real life.
+1,000,000
In any real world scenario I'm likely to face. I'm sure my s&w 642 or pm9 will be more than sufficient...
Some of the responses in this thread are interesting to say the least.
If I am outside of my home I am carrying a gun.
If I am carrying a gun I have, at minimum, one reload for said gun. Just depends on what I am carrying and how I am carrying it.
In addition I ususally have one fixed blade knife, one folding knife, and a small flashlight, not always, but usually.
What I am doing and how I am dressed dictates what I am carrying and how I am carrying it.
With the myriad of handguns designed for self defense as well as the cornacopia of holster makers out there you should be able to find some way to discretely and comfortably carry a firearm and reload of your choice while still remaining stylish.
That's assuming there is some realistic likelihood that a fight is going to happen, that you're going to need a gun to resolve it, and that it will take more than 7 rounds to do so. Pretty long odds in my cozy little life. YMMV depending on where you live/work/play.
.
I suppose if you live / work / play in the "midwest" you might feel safer than I do. I live in Big City TX where there's every kind of potential danger you can name. Mental cases, drug dealers, armed hotheads, gangs, professional criminals, drug addicts, you name it. I have no reason to feel safe. So yes, there is some considerable possibility that in my lifetime I will need a firearm, including more than seven rounds, to stay alive.
And the other contributor that commented about fantasizing on the subject of protracted firefights. Think of Darren Wilson. He fired 10 rounds out of a 13 round mag of premium .40 JHPs and it wasn't until the last shot that the fight stopped. What if there had been THREE attackers as big as refrigerators?
whatthepuck
12-17-14, 19:57
I suppose if you live / work / play in the "midwest" you might feel safer than I do. I live in Big City TX where there's every kind of potential danger you can name. Mental cases, drug dealers, armed hotheads, gangs, professional criminals, drug addicts, you name it. I have no reason to feel safe. So yes, there is some considerable possibility that in my lifetime I will need a firearm, including more than seven rounds, to stay alive.
And the other contributor that commented about fantasizing on the subject of protracted firefights. Think of Darren Wilson. He fired 10 rounds out of a 13 round mag of premium .40 JHPs and it wasn't until the last shot that the fight stopped. What if there had been THREE attackers as big as refrigerators?
Darren Wilson was also an LEO. I think you're going to be very hard-pressed ever explaining the expenditure of 10rds or more of ammo in any "good" civilian self defense shoot.
I suppose if you live / work / play in the "midwest" you might feel safer than I do. I live in Big City TX where there's every kind of potential danger you can name. Mental cases, drug dealers, armed hotheads, gangs, professional criminals, drug addicts, you name it. I have no reason to feel safe. So yes, there is some considerable possibility that in my lifetime I will need a firearm, including more than seven rounds, to stay alive.
And the other contributor that commented about fantasizing on the subject of protracted firefights. Think of Darren Wilson. He fired 10 rounds out of a 13 round mag of premium .40 JHPs and it wasn't until the last shot that the fight stopped. What if there had been THREE attackers as big as refrigerators?
Yes, if I was a cop in a suburb of a major crime-ridden city, my personal protection plan would be different. I'm a doctor in rural Minnesota. The likelihood of me needing a firearm to defend my life or the life of my family is very, very, low. The liklihood that I'll need more than 7 shots to do it are so vanishingly small that it's not even close to being worth the inconvenience of routinely putting on a gun and an extra magazine in the clothes I typically wear to work.
If I really wanted to mitigate the daily risk to my life, I'd put on a NASCAR-type helmet every time I got in the car. That is a far bigger risk to my life than being attacked by three big refrigerators and engaging them as in one's typical fantasy firefight .
/
Yes, if I was a cop in a suburb of a major crime-ridden city, my personal protection plan would be different. I'm a doctor in rural Minnesota. The likelihood of me needing a firearm to defend my life or the life of my family is very, very, low. The liklihood that I'll need more than 7 shots to do it are so vanishingly small that it's not even close to being worth the inconvenience of routinely putting on a gun and an extra magazine in the clothes I typically wear to work.
If I really wanted to mitigate the daily risk to my life, I'd put on a NASCAR-type helmet every time I got in the car. That is a far bigger risk to my life than being attacked by three big refrigerators and engaging them as in one's typical fantasy firefight .
/
That helps explain it. I don't live in Rural Minnesota. I live in Urban Texas, where multiple-assailant robberies and other forms of gang-thuggery happen every day. No "fantasy," just fact. I carry 8+1 and a spare 8 round mag, and still have a Mini-14 in the truck, in case that becomes useful.
And when I think about it, a Nascar helmet might be helpful on urban TX freeways as well.
Depends on your environment, I suppose.
MountainRaven
12-17-14, 21:10
Darren Wilson was also an LEO. I think you're going to be very hard-pressed ever explaining the expenditure of 10rds or more of ammo in any "good" civilian self defense shoot.
No you're not.
All you need is one of the countless dash cams or body cams that have recorded cops dumping magazines in an assailant's general direction while scoring only a few hits.
Yes, if I was a cop in a suburb of a major crime-ridden city, my personal protection plan would be different. I'm a doctor in rural Minnesota. The likelihood of me needing a firearm to defend my life or the life of my family is very, very, low. The liklihood that I'll need more than 7 shots to do it are so vanishingly small that it's not even close to being worth the inconvenience of routinely putting on a gun and an extra magazine in the clothes I typically wear to work.
If I really wanted to mitigate the daily risk to my life, I'd put on a NASCAR-type helmet every time I got in the car. That is a far bigger risk to my life than being attacked by three big refrigerators and engaging them as in one's typical fantasy firefight .
You live in the heartland of al-Shabab's American recruiting grounds, the American hotspot for forging Jihadists, and you think seven rounds is sufficient? OK.
Darren Wilson was also an LEO. I think you're going to be very hard-pressed ever explaining the expenditure of 10rds or more of ammo in any "good" civilian self defense shoot.
Horshit.
"I was in fear of my life for 2 seconds." Good shoot is good, regardless of round count, caliber, weapon, etc. This crap always comes up for no reason.
Darren Wilson was also an LEO. I think you're going to be very hard-pressed ever explaining the expenditure of 10rds or more of ammo in any "good" civilian self defense shoot.
Horshit.
"I was in fear of my life for 2 seconds." Good shoot is good, regardless of round count, caliber, weapon, etc. This crap always comes up for no reason.
True.
I recommend that everyone review the excellent work of Claude Werner (www.tacticalprofessor.com) and Tom Givens (www.rangemaster.com). Both have done extensive work on citizen uses of handguns in self defense, as well as related force usage and planning considerations. Both directly or indirectly note the bell-curved nature of these things. Most are the often cited norm of a few rounds in a few yards in a few seconds. They are relatively simple, and well resolved by lightly equipped citizens with little to no training.
Good reading here:
http://tacticalprofessor.wordpress.com/2014/12/02/the-armed-citizen/
https://tacticalprofessor.files.wordpress.com/2014/12/tac-5-year-w-tables.pdf
I also recommend Claude and Tom's podcast appearances on ballisticradio.com, here:
http://ballisticradio.com/2014/11/24/happy-thanksgivens-podcast-season-2-ballistic-radio-episode-87-november-23rd-2014/
http://ballisticradio.com/2014/08/25/threat-management-podcast-season-2-ballistic-radio-episode-76-august-24th-2014/
http://ballisticradio.com/2013/06/30/ballistic-radio-episode-17-june-30-2013/
http://ballisticradio.com/2013/05/14/podcast-ballistic-radio-episode-10-may-12-2013/
The rub is the potential for an outlying event on the curve. There's a lot of individual cost:benefit in the preparation for those. Whatever the decision folks make, if they did it with both eyes open I'd hope that we wouldn't begrudge or belittle them.
Darren Wilson was also an LEO. I think you're going to be very hard-pressed ever explaining the expenditure of 10rds or more of ammo in any "good" civilian self defense shoot.
What about multiple assailants? The magazine is the number 1 failure point in a semi-auto also. A guy on PCP might take 10 or more rounds to stop. Tons of reasons to carry spares, no reasons IMO not to carry spares.
SeriousStudent
12-17-14, 22:45
I recommend that everyone review the excellent work of Claude Werner (www.tacticalprofessor.com) and Tom Givens (www.rangemaster.com). Both have done extensive work on citizen uses of handguns in self defense, as well as related force usage and planning considerations. Both directly or indirectly note the bell-curved nature of these things. Most are the often cited norm of a few rounds in a few yards in a few seconds. They are relatively simple, and well resolved by lightly equipped citizens with little to no training.
Good reading here:
http://tacticalprofessor.wordpress.com/2014/12/02/the-armed-citizen/
https://tacticalprofessor.files.wordpress.com/2014/12/tac-5-year-w-tables.pdf
I also recommend Claude and Tom's podcast appearances on ballisticradio.com, here:
http://ballisticradio.com/2014/11/24/happy-thanksgivens-podcast-season-2-ballistic-radio-episode-87-november-23rd-2014/
http://ballisticradio.com/2014/08/25/threat-management-podcast-season-2-ballistic-radio-episode-76-august-24th-2014/
http://ballisticradio.com/2013/06/30/ballistic-radio-episode-17-june-30-2013/
http://ballisticradio.com/2013/05/14/podcast-ballistic-radio-episode-10-may-12-2013/
The rub is the potential for an outlying event on the curve. There's a lot of individual cost:benefit in the preparation for those. Whatever the decision folks make, if they did it with both eyes open I'd hope that we wouldn't begrudge or belittle them.
This is really good advice. Both the gentlemen mentioned are members here, but post infrequently.
I have had the pleasure of meeting Mr Givens and his wife, and listening to their thoughts. I am very much looking forward to doing the same with Mr Werner. Both have free email newsletters that are absolutely worth subscribing to.
I'll be in training classes with both in February, and am eagerly looking forward to it.
A funny story that kinda goes along with topic.
I took a class a couple months ago (ESEE Protective Operations) and in usual ESEE fasion they train for worst case scenarios. We were going over weapon manipulations/malfunctions for injured shooter/loss of limb use before drills, after which instructor asked if there was any questions (we were encouraged to train with what we EDC in daily routine). One guy raised hand and asked "what if you don't carry a spare mag?", the instuctor kinda gave a grin w/ nod and said "well then your wrong". Of course we all laughed and the guy went and grabbed a spare mag from bag. After running drills/scenarios for two days, everybody was running three mags, some even on both strong & weak side. In addition to TQs, which they incorporated TQ application w/ dead arm reloads into drills. Really beat in the "Better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it" concept. Teaching preparing for the things you can think of is good, being prepared for the things you can't think of is better.
sig chaser
12-18-14, 00:03
Yes I always carry a spare mag. To me it is less about needing extra ammo and more about having a backup in case something goes wrong with the first mag. Though extra ammo is nice too.
You live in the heartland of al-Shabab's American recruiting grounds, the American hotspot for forging Jihadists, and you think seven rounds is sufficient? OK.
Really? The whole state? :)...no, I don't think so.
I do get down to "the heartland of al-Shabab's American recruiting grounds", otherwise known as "Minneapolis", every couple of months. I'll likely carry a gun as I often have in the past. Probably skip the extra magazines though and just stay away from the terrorist hangouts.
.
I carry at least one reload depending upon where I am going.
StrawmanAR
12-18-14, 11:57
Yep, always one extra mag.
Depends. If I carry my Glock 19 then no extra mag. If my Springfield XDS 9' then I throw an extra mag in my pocket.
Right. Because that's a problem that I face frequently and am likely to face in the future.
I have a good imagination. I can fantasize about protracted firefights as well as anybody here, I suspect. Where that falls down, for me, is the reality of applying that fantasy to my real life.
You can look at it the other way as well. It might suggest you are a bit overconfident that a scenario will cooperate with how you envision it.
-john
You can look at it the other way as well. It might suggest you are a bit overconfident that a scenario will cooperate with how you envision it.
-john
But since you are totally unaware of my lifestyle and location, you really wouldn't have a clue about that, would you?
Sometimes, sometimes not. Hell, I hardly carry anymore.
My regular is a FS M&P 9...carrying an spare magazine is much easier on off and comfortwise
it's just very cheap insurance
LightningFast
12-19-14, 20:25
It's almost zero more effort to carry a spare mag than the gun, I don't see a reason not to. I personally find comfort in having a Plan B should my mag fail, or get ejected, or run dry, etc.
Again, it's no effort. The argument against it typically comes down to laziness, rather than necessity.
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