View Full Version : How many of you actually fired/drew a handgun in a CCW experience
have fired your handgun in a CCW experience or drew your gun, both of which the LEO's were called.
Was your pistol seized as evidence?
How long was it in evidence or how long has it been in evidence?
Do you think you will ever get it back?
How expensive of a gun is it in the evidence locker?
Thank you for your answers...
BTW: If not you, Then a friend of a brother in laws cousin will work for a story anyway.:lol:
plouffedaddy
10-11-14, 22:37
The problem with these types of threads is the statutes of limitations and civil law. Most folks are smart enough not to share their experiences due to one of those two factors.
Yes, I agree, but not giving details on the incident. Question then, Being a person carrying concealed or open, with or without a CHL,
have you had an encounter with LEO and your handgun was collected as evidence?
How long now?
Just should have worded the OP a little differently.
Thanks Mike.
The problem with these types of threads is the statutes of limitations and civil law. Most folks are smart enough not to share their experiences due to one of those two factors.
:thank_you2: Not ever a good idea to share those stories.
Just to give you an idea. Your question is going to vary wildly on jurisdiction. Some will never EVER let a handgun come back out. Others may be a bit more forgiving.
Nobody in their right mind would enter personal experiences of this nature on the internet. In addition, you will likely find a different answer for each jurisdiction. I can tell you that two LE shootings involving LEO's I work with, in adjoining counties varied drastically. One county LEO had his gun in evidence for a week and a half. Another in the neighboring county had his in evidence for 3 years. Both were no-brainer good shoots.
Nobody in their right mind would enter personal experiences of this nature on the internet. In addition, you will likely find a different answer for each jurisdiction. I can tell you that two LE shootings involving LEO's I work with, in adjoining counties varied drastically. One county LEO had his gun in evidence for a week and a half. Another in the neighboring county had his in evidence for 3 years. Both were no-brainer good shoots.
That is really the kind of info I was looking for. Wondering if the time the gun is in evidence is different for a civilian and a LEO?
My S&W revolver didn't stay long in evidence. A couple of months. Suspect was charged with Attempted Capital Murder. Back then, there was still the speedy trial act. Our County Attorney did not get the case on the docket in the time needed so charges were dropped. The CA was a Democrat through and through. I am a Republican, my Chief and the Chief of Detectives were Democrats.
Back in those days politics played into decisions. I called every state Senator and Representative airing my distaste for the loophole for felons and Speedy Trial. Whether I had any influence or not, it got changed. Don't care if I did or not, as long as it did.
Than You.
This is on the LEO side where I'm but I've talked to a few who were involved in OIS. They were told to report to the firearms lab and relinquish their duty weapon for immediate testing. IIRC, a few of their duty rounds were shot into a tank or apparatus. They also collect unfired rounds from their magazine. A trigger pull test was also done for the weight.
In an AD/ND situation, officers would have to report to the firearms training division. The staff (armorer) will function test your gun and look over it to rule out mechanical issues.
With all that said all the officers I talked to never had their guns seized and tagged. The only time I see that happening is if there was a shooting that was VERY questionable and both the district attorney and the division want it.
I was involved in a fatal SD shooting several tears ago in Detroit here is my experience... 3 yrs ago I was involved in a fatal self defense shooting
I was arrested, questioned, charged [felony homicide]and released in about five hours, two days later my cpl was suspended. I was cleared and had my cpl reinstated a little over two weeks later. My pistol was kept, sent to MSP for ballistics [this happened in detroit they don't have a crime lab hence the trip to MSP] and after 7 months of 2 or 3 calls a week I picked up my hk p2000 scratched and nicked up and the rear sight knocked loose from being dropped, and they emptied my three mags of 357 sig gold dot into a baggy and threw it in a drawer said they couldn't let me walk out with a gun and ammo!!!!
JBecker 72
10-13-14, 07:57
I don't even see why they need your gun if it's a good shoot. And I certainly don't see why or how they can legally confiscate your property indefinitely.
Beat Trash
10-13-14, 09:08
IF shots are fired and they take effect (Hit the bag guy) the firearm will be taken into evidence until the Grand Jury returns a "No Bill" and does not indite, or until the trial is complete.
This will happen even for on-duty LEO's acting in the course of their official duties. The average time for one of our officers to get their pistol back is about 8 months. If it's a high profile incident or there are civil lawsuits pending, well it may be a while. It is what it is...
This is why many recommend you have a spare gun that is vetted and set aside. The person you shot may have friends and relatives. These individuals may have issue with your decision making process. They may want to visit you and express their displeasure. It would be a bad time to be gunless, have a type of gun you haven't trained on, or a gun that doesn't work with your holster, spare magazines and mag holders.
If shots are NOT fired, and a CCW holder draws a firearm and points it at someone, then it depends on the situation. If the CCW holder is acting within all local and state laws, and stops a Felony offense of violence in progress without shots fired, I can't see how the gun would be taken into evidence. At least in my jurisdiction. The responding LEO should secure the weapon until things are sorted out, and that LEO has an idea what really happened. The LEO may check to ensure the gun has not been fired. This would be done by ensuring it's fully loaded and by any witnesses available and willing to talk to the Police. (Another reason to fully load your gun and magazines.)
Now if you have a CCW holder who's acting like a moron and pointing his gun at people that he shouldn't have put at gunpoint, well that person can expect to have the gun seized for evidence and charged appropriately.
Take my advice for what it's worth. I'm not an attorney, just a LEO supervisor with 23 years experience in an inter-city agency.
^^^this sounds like the best answer without going into detail, thank you.
It is very interesting to read the answers that have already been posted. I assume a larger agence would just issue another department pistol. Smaller agency, you may be left to provide your own replacement. The decent handguns I took to forensics for testing I noted condition, also had photos. Later when I picked them up, chain of custody, they appeared to have been drug up and down main st paved in cobblestone. They were beat to pieces. These are some more of the horror stories I was looking for.
Thanks and please add more if you are able or feel comfortable.
netchemica
10-14-14, 08:48
I drew my gun, but kept it out of sight in case I was wrong:
When at a stop, I like to put my truck into neutral when I'm on a flat surface and there are cars stopped behind me, this way I don't have to hold the brake down during long lights (pure laziness).
Well, I'm sitting there and I look in my rear view mirror to see some thuggish looking guy getting out of the passenger side of this old beat to shit Trans Am. He ducks down ever so slightly and quickly approaches my driver side door. I was slightly stereotyping, which didn't help since I was in a particularly bad area.
This guy briskly walks up to my door, still slightly ducked down, and taps on my window pretty hard. I thought I was getting car jacked. I pulled out my gun and kept it by the seat belt release... just in case.
"Excuse me sir, I think your brake lights went out, they were just on and I saw them disappear... just thought you should know. Have a nice day!"
And that's when I felt like an asshole.
I usually leave the area when I feel like I'm in a sketchy situation, I obviously had no place to go there, which is why I felt I needed to unholster. Lucky for me it was just a good sam.
B_A_Merkonakis
10-14-14, 09:15
Drew my gun and pointed it at guy (with crowbar) trying to break into my apartment back in 1997. Bad guy ran and I wasn't going to shoot him in the back or chase. Police called. Didn't even ask to see my gun. This was in Waco, TX and I was a CHL holder.
brickboy240
10-14-14, 11:00
About 8 years ago...I was driving my second car (91 Volvo) and someone got irate at me while in traffic on a busy 4 lane street. Did I cut him off? Did I do something else to annoy him? I don't really know. All of a sudden this irate Arab man in his 40s was pulling up next to me and giving me the finger and screaming with his windows down.
I did not give him the finger back (...and was racking my brain as to what I actually did to piss him off) when at the next red light...he got out of his car and stood in front of my car...yelling and ranting and giving me the finger.
I just sat there and shrugged my shoulders which only seemed to make him more angry. I told myself that I was not going to pull the Glock 17 out from under the front seat..unless he went for my door handle or did something else drastic. I was hoping he was getting this out of his system and would go away in a minute. I was in a suit and tie and he was much bigger than I was...the last thing I wanted was to fist fight this moron...I had things to do and places to be.
Well, he began pounding on the hood of my car (my old Volvo was pristine and I cared about it) and it was then that I pulled out the Glock 17 and racked the slide and did not point it at him, but showed it to him.
Immediately, the guy raced to his car and turned into the parking lot right next to the road and sped away to the cross street.
I pulled into the convenience store parking lot about a block down, where a police car was sitting. Told the officer the whole story and gave him a description of the guy and a partial of his license plate. The cop never asked to see my pistol, nor did he take it. He filled out a report and took my info and asked to see my drivers license and CHL permit.
That was pretty much the end of it...I never heard back from the police.
Just showing someone a gun CAN prevent further crimes...i am living proof of that.
-brickboy240
Phillygunguy
10-14-14, 11:12
About 8 years ago...I was driving my second car (91 Volvo) and someone got irate at me while in traffic on a busy 4 lane street. Did I cut him off? Did I do something else to annoy him? I don't really know. All of a sudden this irate Arab man in his 40s was pulling up next to me and giving me the finger and screaming with his windows down.
I did not give him the finger back (...and was racking my brain as to what I actually did to piss him off) when at the next red light...he got out of his car and stood in front of my car...yelling and ranting and giving me the finger.
I just sat there and shrugged my shoulders which only seemed to make him more angry. I told myself that I was not going to pull the Glock 17 out from under the front seat..unless he went for my door handle or did something else drastic. I was hoping he was getting this out of his system and would go away in a minute. I was in a suit and tie and he was much bigger than I was...the last thing I wanted was to fist fight this moron...I had things to do and places to be.
Well, he began pounding on the hood of my car (my old Volvo was pristine and I cared about it) and it was then that I pulled out the Glock 17 and racked the slide and did not point it at him, but showed it to him.
Immediately, the guy raced to his car and turned into the parking lot right next to the road and sped away to the cross street.
I pulled into the convenience store parking lot about a block down, where a police car was sitting. Told the officer the whole story and gave him a description of the guy and a partial of his license plate. The cop never asked to see my pistol, nor did he take it. He filled out a report and took my info and asked to see my drivers license and CHL permit.
That was pretty much the end of it...I never heard back from the police.
Just showing someone a gun CAN prevent further crimes...i am living proof of that.
-brickboy240
Your lucky there's plenty of times I would have loved to do that but I'd get locked up
brickboy240
10-14-14, 11:19
Well...that is because I live in a free state.
Still..I was afraid that me telling the cop would get me in trouble for "brandishing" but I guess the cop saw that I was visibly shaken by the event and that I did not try to engage, exit the car or shoot the guy. Being a white guy in a suit and driving an old Volvo might have helped too LOL.
I just thought that I was not going to point it at him or shoot unless he was coming at me and kept a cool head.
-brickboy240
Phillygunguy
10-14-14, 11:25
Well...that is because I live in a free state.
Still..I was afraid that me telling the cop would get me in trouble for "brandishing" but I guess the cop saw that I was visibly shaken by the event and that I did not try to engage, exit the car or shoot the guy. Being a white guy in a suit and driving an old Volvo might have helped too LOL.
I just thought that I was not going to point it at him or shoot unless he was coming at me and kept a cool head.
-brickboy240
Yeah I live in former free state
brickboy240, I was in a situation that your story reminds me of, but not all that similar.
One Saturday morning a few months ago, a guy right next to me on the highway was playing grab-ass with another car and apparently noticed me shaking my head slowly. He rolled down his window and started yelling in my direction and holding his middle finger up. He held that pose for a surprisingly long time and provoked nothing more than a slight Mona Lisa smile from me. That boy had to be on something.
I declined to draw the Glock 22 from its holster that is mounted under the steering column near my right knee. Didn't need it. Didn't need the G23 in my IWB holster, either. Nor the AK nor the AR in the back seat that I had been out shooting earlier in the morning.
The incident reminded me that even subtle reactions to stupidity can ignite and/or sustain rage. I as an often heavily armed person need be calm no matter what happens, short of an unprovoked attack on me. Live and let live.
Arab man in his 40s pounding on my car, well that could get interesting. There'd be a lot of adrenalin to manage.
JBecker 72
10-14-14, 15:30
When someone gives me the finger on the road I give them the thumbs up and smile. It pisses them off way more than returning the gesture. :lol:
When someone gives me the finger on the road I give them the thumbs up and smile. It pisses them off way more than returning the gesture. :lol:
Bro, you mad?
Gets them every time.
brickboy240
10-14-14, 16:22
Yeah...I usually carry the Glock 17 and two extra 17 rounders in a mag pouch in the glove box. There is also an old 1200 Winny pump in the trunk and several boxes of 00 buck nearby.
Still...I don't give people the finger back or try to taunt them with a smile or other gestures. I merely shrugged my shoulders at this moron and I think my inaction was only making him more mad.
I kept going over and over in my head, "ok...stay calm and the gun does not come out unless he touches the car or tries to yank me out."
The guy was well over 6 feet and huge...I am maybe 5ft 9in and 175 pounds on a good day. Again...I was also headed to a meeting and was in a suit - not really wanting to do battle with anyone. LOL
Good thing was once I racked the slide and showed him the gun...that was it...he wanted no part of that! LOL Big guy ran back to his car and took off.
If I had no gun in the car..who knows how that would have gone?
Still...you HAVE to keep a cool head and don't get the gun out unless it appears there is NO other alternative to stopping the situation.
I seriously hope that NEVER happens again and I certainly do NOT go looking for that kind of interaction.
-brickboy240
It is very interesting to read the answers that have already been posted. I assume a larger agence would just issue another department pistol. Smaller agency, you may be left to provide your own replacement. The decent handguns I took to forensics for testing I noted condition, also had photos. Later when I picked them up, chain of custody, they appeared to have been drug up and down main st paved in cobblestone. They were beat to pieces. These are some more of the horror stories I was looking for.
Thanks and please add more if you are able or feel comfortable.
The example I gave of the LEO who waited 3 years to get his gun back had to buy another. They are one of the largest agencies in the country but their folks have to buy their own duty weapon in the academy.
Another OIS was with an AR. I forgot how long it took to get it back, but their FI showed me pics of it. The extractor was bent outwards!! No idea how the hell the lab did that....
I hope this thread doesn't get too far off track. Correct me if I'm wrong but the OP seems to be asking about how long weapons were seized and if they were damaged. Some posters are just posting stories about drawing guns/encounters without a seizure for evidence.
To add a little more mine had three zip ties on it one through the barrel, one holding the trigger back and one though the magwell and out the ejection port and was stored in a manilla envelope tossed into a file cabinet drawer.
When I finally got to pick it up the property officer was actually digging through drawers knocking guns around, when he found it he poured my HK and three mags out on the desk like the were nothing and popped his knife open to start sawing at the zip ties, I told him to stop I'll get them off later.
This is Detroit so I am sure its worse than what would happen most anywhere else
I have taken my ccw out and it did its job.
Leaveammoforme
10-15-14, 00:04
I will partially share one that is somewhat inline with OP request.
I had 2 rifles, mags and ammo confiscated by the city PD about 14 years ago. I got both back a couple months later in nice sealed storage bags. Seriously, they were nice. Kind of didn't want to break the seals. Never got ammo back.
Yes, I was asking more for the seizure of your weapon as evidence and how long was it kept. I like the stories also, like the ones in the NRA magazines and a couple other publications.
When someone gives me the finger on the road I give them the thumbs up and smile. It pisses them off way more than returning the gesture. :lol:
Heck yeah. If they really piss me off i stick my tongue out at them. childish, yes- but man that really gets them going and its a good laugh for me.
brickboy240
10-17-14, 12:06
I don't even do that.
Shrugging my shoulders got my hood pounded on by the angry Arab guy.
I mind my own business and try like mad to keep a very cool head. It is just not worth it.
This is a big city and being a border state...we have tons of crazy drivers. Tons of traffic, too. Plan ahead and don't be in a big hurry and you won't go crazy.
-brickboy240
I had a Robar customized two tone Kimber Ultra taken after an incident. Took over a year to get back. Came back with a rusty barrel, and they were nice enough to engrave case numbers into the barrel, slide, frame and magazine with an electric pencil. And the remaining ammo was gone too.
Another time after an on duty incident I had my P220 taken. It was returned a couple months later, not engraved but still rusted from shitty storage conditions. This dept made us purchase our own sidearms from an approved list of pistols. After that I always maintained doubles or more of preferred sidearms.
Cap'n Crash
10-17-14, 13:41
About 8 years ago...I was driving my second car (91 Volvo)... (my old Volvo was pristine and I cared about it)...
-brickboy240
Is your name really Anders Holmvik, and did you refer to it as the 'Vo? ;)
A lot of police officers have a CWP in case there weapon is taken while on suspension. They can still carry their own weapon.
Is your name really Anders Holmvik, and did you refer to it as the 'Vo? ;)
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c245/USMC-to-be/bb35ca7140b836d8a349a67a76412dacde5966cae577e6fc24ffd1d5a2bb3b20_zpsf29905b5.jpg (http://s28.photobucket.com/user/USMC-to-be/media/bb35ca7140b836d8a349a67a76412dacde5966cae577e6fc24ffd1d5a2bb3b20_zpsf29905b5.jpg.html)
At a handgun self defense class they told us it would vary widely depending on where you are. They gave one example of a rural county in southern ohio where the prosecutor came to the scene of a self defense shooting. He saw that it was a good shoot and told the cops to give the man his gun back. Said "I don't want him to worry about anything from my office." They did say not expect that kind of thing in most areas.
A lot of police officers have a CWP in case there weapon is taken while on suspension. They can still carry their own weapon.
I've kept my CHL current so I don't have to qualify with every weapon I carry off-duty.
My department usually keeps the gun after an OIS a little less than a week. It basically get's a full armorers inspection and everything gets documented and then it gets returned to the officer. We carry a mix of personally owned guns and department issued guns, but when they take your gun whether its issued or not you get handed a loaded department gun before you go home so you aren't unarmed.
If you are a citizen and use the gun in a shooting plan on the gun staying in evidence for awhile. In this county it stays until after the coroner's inquest which usually is at least a couple months.
I've kept my CHL current so I don't have to qualify with every weapon I carry off-duty.
Make sure that's still within policy, it's not that way for me. I do keep my CCW current, but by policy I must qualify with anything I carry, on or off duty. Additionally, I'd bet that if you have a weapon you're carrying "under your ccw" as opposed to your commission, your department might not cover you under LEOSA for that weapon.
Just some thoughts.
I've never had to (knock on wood), but I know someone who has... which makes me wonder if I could...
I've never had to (knock on wood), but I know someone who has... which makes me wonder if I could...If you think you can't pull the trigger, carry quick clot and or vaseline. Quick Clot to plug the hole in your body of a loved one, vaseline to lube your gun before it gets shoved where the Sun don't shine. You should have already made up your mind what you can or can't do.
The Agency I retired from, we were required to qualify with issued duty guns and any other gun you intended to carry off duty or on secondary jobs not in Agency uniform. Like Sig, a 226 was duty, 220/228/229/239 are all the same mechanics, but different feel and handling. Must qualify with each one.
We always had extra 226/229 in the Armory for breakage or an OIS.
I've never had to (knock on wood), but I know someone who has... which makes me wonder if I could...
If you think you can't pull the trigger, carry quick clot and or vaseline. Quick Clot to plug the hole in your body of a loved one, vaseline to lube your gun before it gets shoved where the Sun don't shine. You should have already made up your mind what you can or can't do.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIGMUAMevH0
ShortytheFirefighter
10-22-14, 14:30
Haven't had to, hope I never do.
Prepared just in case.
whatthepuck
10-22-14, 14:41
I've never had to (knock on wood), but I know someone who has... which makes me wonder if I could...
Mighty Mighty Bosstones reference?
http://gifs.gifbin.com/052012/1336066176_merging_in_russia.gif
Make sure that's still within policy, it's not that way for me. I do keep my CCW current, but by policy I must qualify with anything I carry, on or off duty. Additionally, I'd bet that if you have a weapon you're carrying "under your ccw" as opposed to your commission, your department might not cover you under LEOSA for that weapon.
Just some thoughts.
Valid points, thanks for bringing it up. We also have a policy that in a nutshell states, "in an emergency use of any accessible weapon is permitted."
I've never thought about LEOSA as I rarely travel outside of my state. I briefly read over it [the section covering non-retired] and unless I missed something, I don't believe LEOSA specifically indicates the weapon we carry off-duty/concealed must be the same weapon we qualify with under the department. Our state law regarding peace officers carrying weapons doesn't specify either.
With that said, I believe to cover all my bases I'll qualify with the G27 next go around. The LCP at 25 yards will be interesting.
have fired your handgun in a CCW experience or drew your gun, both of which the LEO's were called.
Was your pistol seized as evidence?
How long was it in evidence or how long has it been in evidence?
Do you think you will ever get it back?
How expensive of a gun is it in the evidence locker?
Thank you for your answers...
BTW: If not you, Then a friend of a brother in laws cousin will work for a story anyway.:lol:
I guess you are asking several questions here and I read a lot of different answers but maybe not the ones you are looking for?
Is it a matter of how expensive of a firearm you want locked up and what kind of condition you're going to get it back in (if at all)? The reason I ask is I see these questions all the time on the 1911/GlockTalk/XDTalk (fill in the blank) especially when concerning high end 1911 pistols. People say they don't want to carry their Wilson Combat because if they ever had to use it to defend themselves it would be taken. If they got it back at all it would be marked, scratched and rusted. Therefore you must carry something cheap and plentiful like a Hi-Point. Actually I jest about the hi-point but to carry a lesser gun based on these fears is absolutely insane in my mind. You carry the best gun you can, the best gun that works all the time and puts the holes where you want them. If that's your $8500 Heirloom Precision commander built by Ted Yost himself then so be it. Carry that gun and in the event you have to use it it goes into evidence. But hopefully you go home. Your pride and joy pistol is nothing more than an item in a chain of custody form and bag. You may not see it again and most likely if you do it won't be as pretty. SO WHAT, you obviously were forced to use said gun to save your life. Glock / Sig / XD / 1911 it doesn't matter. As long as you have a quality gun that works and can protect your life then it did it's job. Let it rest in evidence. I likely have more things to concern myself with than the evindence tech's oiling up my Les Baer while it rusts away. Even in a justified shooting the price of that pistol will be rather small compared to other legal expenses. I carry the best gun to do the job, if it happens to be my Baer TRS the that's fine. When and if I get it back it will be properly thanked and either back into service or placed on a spot on my wall.
Valid points, thanks for bringing it up. We also have a policy that in a nutshell states, "in an emergency use of any accessible weapon is permitted."
I've never thought about LEOSA as I rarely travel outside of my state. I briefly read over it [the section covering non-retired] and unless I missed something, I don't believe LEOSA specifically indicates the weapon we carry off-duty/concealed must be the same weapon we qualify with under the department. Our state law regarding peace officers carrying weapons doesn't specify either.
With that said, I believe to cover all my bases I'll qualify with the G27 next go around. The LCP at 25 yards will be interesting.
Back before retirement, off duty qual was slightly modified from duty qualification. Fewer rounds and start at 10 yds instead of 15 yds.
When I carried a Bersa Thunder 380 all the time off duty, I did the same quals as duty with it. Gun shops sure sold lots of them after that. I was busy doing quals for Deputies with new off duty guns. I don't know id me and the P380 could do that now.
The problem with these types of threads is the statutes of limitations and civil law. Most folks are smart enough not to share their experiences due to one of those two factors.
Precisely.
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