View Full Version : CZ and Canic clone issue
My CZ SP-01 Tactical and my Tri Star Canic series 100 both showed the same part breakage--trigger return spring. Both pistols "broke" within two days of each other. The Canic round count was 2500, and the CZ round count was 250. I bought it seven days ago. The Cajun Gun Works owner points out that the trigger return spring in the CZ is prone to break and offers a better replacement. I assume that the popular CZ P-07/09 pistols share this problem. I think that the Beretta 92s trigger return springs also have a short life.
I'll ask my dealer to request a new spring from Tri Star instead of contacting them myself. I understand that their policy is to sell parts to gun smiths only. I'll email CZ USA and ask for a new spring. Actually I'll need trigger pins for each since the originals will likely be damaged during removal.
One reason for posting this info is to reinforce to new guys that good pistols from reputable manufacturers can "break". I've owned several CZ 75 series handguns that functioned as they should. My new SP-01 died before the box store clone did. In each case a faulty trigger return spring was the culprit. In neither case can I conclude that my pistols were lemons--just the springs.
Its a pretty common failure, I had a baby desert eagle that broke as well.
I hold the record for broken trigger springs - I think I broke 7-8. Most of these were from two P01s I had - one was a replacement - long story. My PreB went for several thousand dry fires before it broke, and I've had two CZs that never broke one. The ones above are associated mostly with a bad run of trigger springs in the 2003 time frame. CZ was using bad springs.
The trouble with the CZ line is that to replace them, you really need to do a complete detail strip (except for the stirrup spring, and slide lock retaining spring). This is why I ditched my P01. I do NOT want to have to send my gun in to someone who can detail strip the decocker. The P01/PCR decocking system is just a further complication. Yes, people now know how to do it, but I don't like the ergos or the added headache of the CZ decocker system. As I understand it, the P07/09 have a system that is easier to deal with (Omega) and this should not be as much of a problem - and the decocker on the P09 is actually not bad in terms of thumb placement for shooting.
This IS an 'achilles heal' - but many people just never run into it. The other is the slide stop - but here again, many shooters go many thousands of rounds without a problem with a slide stop. I think they generally go 20-30K, before breakage. I still trust the CZ 75 system as a reliable and durable system.
Use the CGW trigger return spring pin - it is ingenious and MUCH easier to deal with than roll pins or double peened solid pins. CGW also makes an improved TRS, and CZ Custom offers an improved version.
BTW - the Canik varies as to which trigger pin will work - call CGW - it depends when it was made. I DO like the CGW trigger system better, and the reset is MUCH improved over the CZ 75B system with shorter and more positive reset - not unlike the PreB system.
Fire_Medic
10-12-14, 20:35
I hold the record for broken trigger springs - I think I broke 7-8. Most of these were from two P01s I had - one was a replacement - long story. My PreB went for several thousand dry fires before it broke, and I've had two CZs that never broke one. The ones above are associated mostly with a bad run of trigger springs in the 2003 time frame. CZ was using bad springs.
The trouble with the CZ line is that to replace them, you really need to do a complete detail strip (except for the stirrup spring, and slide lock retaining spring). This is why I ditched my P01. I do NOT want to have to send my gun in to someone who can detail strip the decocker. The P01/PCR decocking system is just a further complication. Yes, people now know how to do it, but I don't like the ergos or the added headache of the CZ decocker system. As I understand it, the P07/09 have a system that is easier to deal with (Omega) and this should not be as much of a problem - and the decocker on the P09 is actually not bad in terms of thumb placement for shooting.
This IS an 'achilles heal' - but many people just never run into it. The other is the slide stop - but here again, many shooters go many thousands of rounds without a problem with a slide stop. I think they generally go 20-30K, before breakage. I still trust the CZ 75 system as a reliable and durable system.
Use the CGW trigger return spring pin - it is ingenious and MUCH easier to deal with than roll pins or double peened solid pins. CGW also makes an improved TRS, and CZ Custom offers an improved version.
BTW - the Canik varies as to which trigger pin will work - call CGW - it depends when it was made. I DO like the CGW trigger system better, and the reset is MUCH improved over the CZ 75B system with shorter and more positive reset - not unlike the PreB system.
Clear your inbox buddy, you're full was trying to send you a pm.
Thanks ;)
The trouble with the CZ line is that to replace them, you really need to do a complete detail strip (except for the stirrup spring, and slide lock retaining spring).
You've replaced that many trigger return springs and didn't realize that you could do it *without* a detail strip?
I assume that the popular CZ P-07/09 pistols share this problem.
The P01 and P07/09 have different triggers. The 07/09 have the Omega trigger and its infinitely easier to work on from what I understand. I dont have an 01/shadow, but I do have an 09 and have had it completely apart and didnt think it was all that bad to work on. My buddy has both and said the 09 is definitely easier to work on.
The P01 and P07/09 have different triggers. The 07/09 have the Omega trigger and its infinitely easier to work on from what I understand. I dont have an 01/shadow, but I do have an 09 and have had it completely apart and didnt think it was all that bad to work on. My buddy has both and said the 09 is definitely easier to work on.
It is easier to work on the P07/09 series for sure, but they share the same trigger return spring with the same questionable lifespan.
highxg: I've heard of people doing it - and I've tried several times to no avail. How many have you replaced yourself without a detail strip? Post a vid - sure would appreciate it. With the CGW system - it might be easier, but it ain't that simple. Most CZs these days DO need a detail strip and complete polish. So, you fire till it breaks then do a polish and TRS replacement.
It is easier to work on the P07/09 series for sure, but they share the same trigger return spring with the same questionable lifespan.
Good to know. I think I replaced my TRS when I did the rest of the CGW parts, but I cant find my packing list. I know I did the main spring, firing pin and firing pin spring, safety block spring, and I THINK I did the TRS.
Today I called CZ USA and Tristar about the broken trigger springs, and each company is sending me the springs and pin. Both outfits were courteous and helpful. In each instance I talked with a technician, and each said that the spring could be replaced without a detail disassembly. Internet research indicates not. I understand that a "big hammer" is required, and I see how a detail strip, which would remove the hammer first, would permit the hammering to take place with the part removed from the pistol.
I will order CGW hammer pins for the replacement pins.
CGW hammer pins are fine, but ALSO get the right CGW trigger pins. They stock both CZ and Tristar - but the Tristar can vary in diameter. Some of the newer Tristars have thicker pins (which I think are better). In any case, I've HEARD of people replacing the TRS without a detail strip, but never mastered it - maybe highxj will be the first to post an instruction video.
Trying to hammer/punch the standard pins in place without dinging up the frame is beyond my tools and skill. The CGW trigger pins make it MUCH easier. In detail stripping you have to take the sear cage, then hammer assembly, then the trigger and stirrup assembly. CGW will send you a slave pin with their TRS or trigger pin. Give them a call - great folks.
Apologies M4Brian for my sounding somewhat snobby in my post. I've actually only replaced a couple without first removing the fire control parts and trigger assembly, but I don't recall it being particularly tricky. Bearing in mind that the CGW trigger pin with it's floating fit makes it much easier. After driving out the trigger pin far enough to release the old/broken spring for removal, I just positioned the pin back in far enough to retain the trigger, then inserted the TRS into the recess with a pair of needle nose pliers and forced it down until it lined up to allow the pin to be pushed back through.
No problem. I just was never able to do it. A slave pin would make it easier, and the CGW would also be helpful.
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