Something that ticked me off yesterday

[Crow Hunter]

My wife has been wanting a G42 ever since she handled one at a local store and we decided to go and look for one yesterday on a weekend trip.

We went to a pawn shop that I have done a lot of business with over the years. I like the guy that owns it and he always has very good prices on handguns. He is a Glock stocking dealer so I figured he might have one.

While we were there looking at all the toys a somewhat older couple came it carrying a TV. They are apparently fairly common customers since the guy working the counter knew them. They wanted to pawn their TV so they could borrow $70. I was really feeling bad because here was this older couple bringing in their TV just to get $70 and here my wife was getting ready to plop down $400+ for a G42 that we honestly don't need, just something she wants. The pawn shop was going to give them $70 and make them pay by $85. The gentleman asked if they would be open on Monday so he could get it back, so it was obvious that it wasn't something they were wanting to get rid of.

I actually turned to look up from the really sweet .22 Ruger SP101 that I was admiring to offer to let them have $70 so they wouldn't have to pay that enormous interest rate. I felt that bad.

Then I saw the woman was zooming in to look at something on her Iphone while her husband was filling out the paperwork....:suicide:

I don't even own a smart phone and neither does my wife, because the price/utility just isn't there.

If your financial position is so freaking precarious that you have to borrow $70 from a pawn shop on your TV, WHAT THE HELL are you doing with a freaking SMART PHONE!?!?!?!?!

ETA:

And here I was, willing to part with $70 of my money, that I don't spend on a smart phone, to help them out.

I feel bad for being angry but I feel ticked off that they are spending that kind of money and probably voting for Obama and complaining about "rich" white people like me that won't give them a break.

[lunchbox]

I wouldn't let it under your skin. Just know that you are a good person for feeling compassion for fellow man.

[Moose-Knuckle]

****'em . . .


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Oy6DwHAi70

[AKDoug]

I am surprised that you were surprised... I see it every day.

[VIP3R 237]

Its tough to know the back story. I used to judge when people had new smartphones and got out of nice cars and then used ebt cards. However after losing my job a couple months ago and having to have unemployment to survive, my outlook on it has completely changed. It was a rough couple months in between jobs and it has humbled me.

[SteyrAUG]

Actually right now, things are kinda tight but my wife has a smart phone. But hers was provided by her employer so they could reach her at all hours of the day and night. Would be easy for somebody to make a similar assumption about us.

So the old couple might just be prioritizing. Could be they decided to dump the cable and house phone and keep the cell phone as the most practical way to minimize. This might explain why the TV is being pawned. The smart phone might be their best contact with family, friends, etc.

The only important thing is you considered doing something nice for somebody who seemed like they might be in trouble. That is all that matters, no reason to get angry because your perception indicates they somehow failed your expectations.

If a guy who looks like he's having trouble paying for his coffee motivates me to give him a dollar to help him out that is what "I" did without expectation of anything. I don't expect him to repay me, be my friend or feel indebted to me. If he then takes his coffee and climbs into a Jaguar and drives away, well that is still what "I" did and "I" am the one who needs to learn from it.

Probably most of us here have been naive and taken advantage of when we were young and foolish. It is why most of us are a bit more vigilant and cynical today. But I do what I do because I decided at the time that it was the correct thing to do. And I'll take all the "wow I should have kept my dollar" incidents in stride so long as all the times I was able to help somebody with something as simple as a "dollar" or maybe a "sack of cheeseburgers" when they looked like they really needed it. I had the dollar or the ability to buy a "sack of cheeseburgers" and in most cases it was money well spent.

I hope I'm NEVER in a position where I need to get bailed out by a total stranger because I'm a dollar short of being able to take care of myself.

[thopkins22]

I know a lot of people who have eschewed cable, home internet service, laptops/desktops, home phone lines, GPS upgrades in vehicles(usually at least $1000 as far as I can tell,) and so forth for one single smart phone.

For a lot of people, having a smart phone can be a responsible choice where you're probably at least breaking even if not saving money.

For what it's worth...I think not giving them the money was a smart choice. Pawning things can become a vicious cycle for folks, but I sincerely doubt that your $70 would have broken it.

[MountainRaven]

My thoughts:

1- Most cellphone companies lock people into multi-year contracts that can be very difficult to wiggle out of and possibly very expensive.
2- See previous post re: Landlines.
3- There exists a real possibility that the phone is bought and paid for by their kids as an easy way of receiving photos and staying in touch with grandkids.
4- Flip phones in today's market are like the SiG P225 and H&K P7M8: Pretty much every body has gone to tiny pistols or double-stacks - there is no longer a quality option for a compact (~G19-size) single-stack. The same is true of flip phones. On top of this, smart phones have been around for some years now and the phone you saw could have been that old, perhaps predating the recession.

And, as previously mentioned, it isn't that difficult to imagine a situation in which one possesses a piece of modern, high-technology, but needs to pawn a TV to make rent - for those of us who have been there. Hell, on Steyr's hypothetical Jagman, I know a guy who was unemployed and owned both a Cadillac Escalade and a BMW Z3 cabrio. (Although I don't think he was ever truly broke and his wife was still squeaking by with her real estate business.)

[Belmont31R]

Smart phone is a pretty broad term. Can be anything from $30 to over $1000.

And like people said some people can get away with having a phone be their main device. I've gone without a computer before, and all I had was my phone. I could easily live without a TV and cable. Have that stuff, and an Xbox for the kids. However, a smart phone is a must for me. Between work and school I'd end up having to spend a lot more on various other devices to do the same work my single phone can to accomplish the same tasks.

I'd also say to not go out of your way to get into other people's business or feel sorry for them. Old people at that age aren't going to change, and not all old people are benevolent little old people. Shitheads grow up to be old, too, and they're still shitheads in their old age. You aren't going to change anything, and if you'd given them money you'd only have been enabling the same behavior they've most likely been doing their entire adult lives.

[Eurodriver]

I got my iPhone 5c for free from Verizon.

if I had a flip phone I would only save $20 a month. I have the lowest data plan.

However if you're pawning a TV then $20 is substantial...so who knows.

[Averageman]

My Brother in Law worked for Apple for years, he still does some work for them from time to time.
They have a family plan that includes my Mom in the deal. She doesn't have a lot of cash sometimes, but She always has a cool phone.

[jmoney]

When I was in high school we had to do a minimum amount of community service each semester. I always did mine at one of the local church run food banks. Every week, for 4 years, the same hispanic family showed up in a brand new suburban. (Changed out for each brand new model every year). They pretended not to speak english and would constantly say pretty awful things about the "white" people helping them every week. I spoke pretty fluent spanish when I was younger and I never said a word, just listened. As the years progressed, their numbers swelled to over 100 that came every week, to get their free groceries.

What they didn't realize is that a new system was installed to make sure people were not hitting different branches to load up each week, and when we found out they hit all 4 branches each saturday they were finally cut-off. This experience changed my view on welfare programs drastically. Some people need help, but there are so many that just take advantage of the system.

Its not wrong to get irritated when you see stuff like that, but don't always jump to conclusions. However, I'm a firm believer that if you are taking advantage of the system you should be cut off from it permanently.

[Crow Hunter]

I understand that people fall on hard times and they might be stuck in a contract that they can't get out of.

This couple was old enough that I would be surprised if they were still working, which was why I felt compelled to help them out.

It just struck me very wrong that they had an Iphone and while I don't know much about them, it looked fairly new and it was the same size as the one my "must have the newest everything" brother in law has.

I am sure that I would get some utility out of a smart phone. I know my wife would get quite a bit. But we choose to have low cost pre-paid flip phones to save $20+/month that we were paying before for our Verizon service.

We do this to save money and we are DINK professionals (Engineer and HR Manager) making good salaries, particularly good for our rural, low income area and we can't "afford" smart phones.

I guess I am guilty of projecting my values on other people but it just rubbed me the wrong way. I am judgmental that way, I can't help it and I fully admit it. I do without things I want, avoid buying the latest and greatest, and pinch pennies so that I can save for the future and I guess I have the feelings that others should be doing the same.

I apologize if I stepped on any toes here. I didn't mean to.

I have been very fortunate over the years and I have never been in that type of situation. So maybe I just need to keep my mouth shut if I haven't experienced that.

[Averageman]

I guess I am guilty of projecting my values on other people but it just rubbed me the wrong way. I am judgmental that way, I can't help it and I fully admit it. I do without things I want, avoid buying the latest and greatest, and pinch pennies so that I can save for the future and I guess I have the feelings that others should be doing the same.

I apologize if I stepped on any toes here. I didn't mean to.

I have been very fortunate over the years and I have never been in that type of situation. So maybe I just need to keep my mouth shut if I haven't experienced that.
I think it is easy to do, especially when it comes to older folks and how they budget stuff. With seven kids, someone is always pitching in something to make my Moms life a little easier, in retun She does some pretty cool stuff for us when She can.
As an example it's pretty common for a older couple to own more than one property and depend upon the income from a rental house to suppliment their retirement and Social Security. Lets say the water heater takes a crap on the 25th of the month, the next thing you know you're pawning a TV to get the Water Heater installed for the renters.
Getting older and finances can be a challange especially for those in such cases.

[markm]

Then I saw the woman was zooming in to look at something on her Iphone while her husband was filling out the paperwork....:suicide:


I feel you. I'm so sick of the idiot masses with their brainless heads buried in their "smart" phones.... let alone the idiots who can't afford other things because of these gadgets.

And now you have car companies making vehicles that brake for you when you're about to run into something so these morons can spend even more time tweeting their brainless asses off.

[brickboy240]

Does not surprise me.

Every time I go in the grocery store near my office (not in a very good part of town) I see people use EBT cards but they carry I-Phones and load their groceries into vehicles much newer and nicer than any that I own. They are also usually buying a cart full of things we rarely buy like steaks and fresh seafood.

So the EBT users are eating better than me...a small business owner. They are also using better phones and driving nicer cars.

why work?

[markm]

It pays to be useless.

[rjacobs]

I work with people who cant afford to go out to eat on the road(airlines, you basically HAVE to eat out when you are on a trip), yet they have an Iphone 6 or other high end phone and when I say something like "well if you werent paying 150 bucks a month for that phone, plus the 300 or whatever cost to buy, maybe you could afford McDonalds" and I usually get a blank stare or some other ridiculous explanation on to why they "need" that and are steeling crap food off the airplane all week or eating oatmeal and ramen for every meal. I try to buy a meal for my crew on each trip(which I personally can easily afford), but when I fly with people like this, I have a hard time opening my wallet.

[brickboy240]

The majority of Americans are terrible with budgeting their own incomes. Many whine about being poor or not having enough money when they actually make plenty but are spending it all wrong.

Why else do you see tv reporters interviewing whining SUV drivers at the pump,when gas goes up 25-50 cents a gallon? Excuse me but if you had bought the 20 thousand dollar used SUV instead of the 40 thousand dollar SUV you have...maybe a gas price increase would not make you so angry?

-brickboy240

[Eurodriver]

Does not surprise me.

Every time I go in the grocery store near my office (not in a very good part of town) I see people use EBT cards but they carry I-Phones and load their groceries into vehicles much newer and nicer than any that I own. They are also usually buying a cart full of things we rarely buy like steaks and fresh seafood.

So the EBT users are eating better than me...a small business owner. They are also using better phones and driving nicer cars.

why work?

Not a welfare apologist and I completely understand and agree with your viewpoint - but if you were in their shoes you'd soon learn that it isn't as nice as you think. A nice phone, a steak, and a car with rims do not a nice life make.

I busted my ass to get out of the ghetto. I know the mentality of which you speak too well, and I couldn't give a shit whether or not someone uses their under the table income to buy nice gadgets. At the end of the day they are going home to a house full of screaming kids, drama, probation officers, police harassment, drug problems, crime, and all sorts of other issues that can't be fixed with a government handout.

[WickedWillis]

Last week I finally made myself debt free. I started last May, and clawed and saved and sacrificed, to make it happen so I can be better prepared for the future. I was feeling incredibly good about myself, happy to have that weight off my shoulders finally. It was all from me being irresponsible and unaccountable a few years ago when I was in my very early 20's, plus a few decent sized medical bills for an ambulance ride and an emergency room stay when I could not afford (nor was offered from my two part time jobs at the time) insurance. I make a decent livable wage that affords me to have a little money to spare for my hobbies, and I live within a strict budget now. I was rolling around on facebook over the weekend, and saw a post from a girl I went to High School with. Now she has three children from three different fathers. She posted bragging about the fact that she got her medical bills all paid off from the government, taking care of her babies at a tune of $15K worth. I let it get to me. I was ****ing enraged. She ended the post with "Thanks Uncle Barry" Needless to say, I let it ruin my day.

[Eurodriver]

I let it get to me. I was ****ing enraged. She ended the post with "Thanks Uncle Barry" Needless to say, I let it ruin my day.

Why? Do you really think your life is that much worse than hers is? That bit about her medical bills being paid for is probably the only good thing to happen to her in years.

[WickedWillis]

Why? Do you really think your life is that much worse than hers is? That bit about her medical bills being paid for is probably the only good thing to happen to her in years.

No, but I am someone who can only be proud of things I earn, not things that I am given.

[MountainRaven]

The majority of Americans are terrible with budgeting their own incomes. Many whine about being poor or not having enough money when they actually make plenty but are spending it all wrong.

Why else do you see tv reporters interviewing whining SUV drivers at the pump,when gas goes up 25-50 cents a gallon? Excuse me but if you had bought the 20 thousand dollar used SUV instead of the 40 thousand dollar SUV you have...maybe a gas price increase would not make you so angry?

-brickboy240

The fact that most Americans are making the same amount of money as they did seven years ago - or less than they did seven years ago - while the prices of gas, food, ammo, and medical care continues to climb probably doesn't help much, either.

I have a friend who was a banker and loan agent in another life. He told me that he once asked a millionaire what his favorite beer was. The response? "Whatever's cheapest or free." I don't know that I would consider a life of ramen and PBR to be "living", though. ;)

[brickboy240]

I know several people with a net worth over a million dollars.

None of them drive a BMW or Mercedes and I never see them drinking overly expensive alcohol, either.

Most common vehicle I see the wealthy people I know driving? Chevy Suburban or pickup.

...seriously

[thopkins22]

I know several people with a net worth over a million dollars.

None of them drive a BMW or Mercedes and I never see them drinking overly expensive alcohol, either.

Most common vehicle I see the wealthy people I know driving? Chevy Suburban or pickup.

...seriously

This is very true. My grandmother is close friends with one of the P&G heiresses. She drives a Subaru. Of course her farm is seriously impressive. Jim Justice is a billionaire who lives in a three bedroom house on a regular street...of course he does have a private jet he uses to fly to football games on a whim. I know at least one person worth eight figures who actually prefers Jim Beam and doesn't see the point of spending any more on something she intends to consume. John Arnold(is or at least was TX's youngest billionaire) does not live in River Oaks or Tanglewood, he lives in West U(definitely very nice, but not where you expect to find billionaires.) I'm good friends with the grandchildren of one of George Bush's business partners(happens to be in the Hall of Fame in the Petroleum museum.) Indeed, he drives a Ford F150 that's a few years old. By and large I think the rule is that the more financially successful a person is, the more you'll see their wealth invested in property as opposed to things that lose value rapidly(though they may have those too.) I'd say that's because to gain that much wealth, you generally need to be intelligent enough to recognize a bad deal when you see it. I don't think they differentiate between things like vehicles and equity investments when weighing the pros and cons.

Oddly enough, they do all use iPhones. It's a great example of the beauty of a free market...the wealthiest people in the world and those who have to make tough day to day choices, are able to use the exact same phone and be ecstatic with it. ;)

I've only met one extraordinarily wealthy man who did not live frugally. He happened to be the largest private shareholder of Exxon stock provided you do not count Berkshire Hathaway as essentially being Warren Buffet the individual.

[Dave_M]

I know several people with a net worth over a million dollars.

None of them drive a BMW or Mercedes and I never see them drinking overly expensive alcohol, either.

Most common vehicle I see the wealthy people I know driving? Chevy Suburban or pickup.

...seriously

I do recall reading that the most common vehicle driven by an American millionaire was a Ford F150. Makes sense, as the Paris Hilton's of the world are the exceptions, not the rule. Most of them are business owners and work 60+ hours a week.

[MountainRaven]

I do recall reading that the most common vehicle driven by an American millionaire was a Ford F150. Makes sense, as the Paris Hilton's of the world are the exceptions, not the rule. Most of them are business owners and work 60+ hours a week.

Ford F-series pickups (and the F-150 in particular) are the best selling automobiles on earth (well, after the Toyota Corolla). It only makes sense that as the most common car (that isn't eye-wateringly boring) on earth is also the most common ride for millionaires. ;)

[wildcard600]

All the millionaires i've met/known wear clothes.

true story.

[jwfuhrman]

The majority of Americans are terrible with budgeting their own incomes. Many whine about being poor or not having enough money when they actually make plenty but are spending it all wrong.

-brickboy240

I won't lie. I'm one of those people. I admit it and don't go looking for hand outs when I'm broke because I bought shit I shouldn't have and didn't manage my budget. I dig myself into holes, but then bust my ass and get myself out of them.

[Dead Man]

You can get free iPhones from each of the major providers. Free. 2 year agreement, data plan ranging from $60-$140 a month. I used to pay $80 a month just for phone service for the wife and I, pre-data days.

Judging a book based on a its cover is bad enough. Doing so whilst being stupid ignorant on the topic.............. You get the picture.

Bite your fingers, OP.

[Averageman]

Grandma getting a cellphone from her Son doesn't bother me as much as seeing a family where every kid has one.
Those are the folks who when they hit 65 will want to retire and live on Social Security and then not understand why they are eating Ritz Crackers and Cat food and living in the dumpster.

[brickboy240]

Show me the "plan" that Verizon currently runs where I can get a totally free I-phone.

[thopkins22]

Show me the "plan" that Verizon currently runs where I can get a totally free I-phone.

Not Verizon...but they almost all have something very similar. It's refurbed...big deal.

http://www.att.com/cellphones/iphone/iphone-5c-refurb.html#fbid=RvYoIoN764K?sku=sku7020400

[Crow Hunter]

You can get free iPhones from each of the major providers. Free. 2 year agreement, data plan ranging from $60-$140 a month. I used to pay $80 a month just for phone service for the wife and I, pre-data days.

Judging a book based on a its cover is bad enough. Doing so whilst being stupid ignorant on the topic.............. You get the picture.

Bite your fingers, OP.

I will admit that I judge a book by it's cover. It is called heuristics. I also admit to being ignorant of specific prices of smart phones or plans other than I know it is higher than what I pay.

However I disagree with the stupid part.

I pay $66/month for both my wife and my cell phones.

And I don't have a contract and I am not pawning my TV for $70.;)

My complaint is that if a person didn't have enough cushion (read emergency fund 3-6 months of expenses) that they needed $70 from pawning a TV to pay a bill, why on earth would they be paying $60/month (or more) for a cell phone and locking themselves into a contract for 2 years?

Now who is the stupid one?;)

A simple $33/month Straight Talk prepaid phone from Wal-Mart (what I use) would still let them communicate AND in 2.5 months they would have that extra $70 banked an not have needed to pawn their TV.

There are other prepaid phone plans out there that will reduce your cost even further.

What got me irritated is, again based on heuristics (which might be wrong, but probably isn't), that they most likely blame "me" for their misfortune, voted for Obama and firmly believe that I should "share my wealth" that I have attained my NOT being in a smart phone contract without a large enough funding cushion to prevent needing to use a pawn shop.;)

That is what ticked me off.

But again. I have never been in that type of situation so maybe a retired person on a fixed income needs a smart phone to conduct their daily business and doesn't find it necessary to provide a sizeable cushion for the unexpected but is okay with paying usurious interest rates.

[Dead Man]

Show me the "plan" that Verizon currently runs where I can get a totally free I-phone.

Call them. The wife and I just received two brand new 32 gig 5Cs for free with two-year agreement from Verizon, and I negotiated for free activation as well. In-hand, free, save for our monthly service fees.

I know Sprint is offering the same deal, and with less expensive monthly rates.

[Dead Man]

I will admit that I judge a book by it's cover. It is called heuristics. I also admit to being ignorant of specific prices of smart phones or plans other than I know it is higher than what I pay.

However I disagree with the stupid part.

I pay $66/month for both my wife and my cell phones.

And I don't have a contract and I am not pawning my TV for $70.;)

My complaint is that if a person didn't have enough cushion (read emergency fund 3-6 months of expenses) that they needed $70 from pawning a TV to pay a bill, why on earth would they be paying $60/month (or more) for a cell phone and locking themselves into a contract for 2 years?

Now who is the stupid one?;)

A simple $33/month Straight Talk prepaid phone from Wal-Mart (what I use) would still let them communicate AND in 2.5 months they would have that extra $70 banked an not have needed to pawn their TV.

There are other prepaid phone plans out there that will reduce your cost even further.

What got me irritated is, again based on heuristics (which might be wrong, but probably isn't), that they most likely blame "me" for their misfortune, voted for Obama and firmly believe that I should "share my wealth" that I have attained my NOT being in a smart phone contract without a large enough funding cushion to prevent needing to use a pawn shop.;)

That is what ticked me off.

But again. I have never been in that type of situation so maybe a retired person on a fixed income needs a smart phone to conduct their daily business and doesn't find it necessary to provide a sizeable cushion for the unexpected but is okay with paying usurious interest rates.

All of this is simply you rationalizing your judgment, not validating it.

[GotAmmo]

I am surprised that you were surprised... I see it every day.

^^^^^^

Ever seen a place that lets you rent rims for your car??

[rjacobs]

The two people I know well who are multi millionaires, one drives a mid 2000's suburban and the other a mid 2000's tahoe. One of the guys has a bumper pull travel trailer that is fairly old and has a square cut in the side and a home window unit stuck in it for A/C. He looks and talks like Jeff Foxworthy and cuts off his jeans every spring and makes them into shorts and then buys a few new pairs in the fall(im sure on sale from Kohls or some such place for cheap). You would NEVER know he has money. The other guy has a bunch of classic cars in various forms of disarray and has a really nice RV(but even that he got a killer deal on in a bankruptcy sale). He does splurge on Fireball whiskey though. But again if you met him you wouldnt know how much he was worth and he worked his ass off for 30 years to make his money.

[Kain]

^^^^^^

Ever seen a place that lets you rent rims for your car??

Those places make me laugh. The only thing really more pathetic are the idiots who roll out who can't afford all four rims. The first time you see an old POS with a single rim that that costs more than the car is worth in scrap.....

[thopkins22]

He does splurge on Fireball whiskey though.

Is he a teenage girl?:p

[Kain]

The two people I know well who are multi millionaires, one drives a mid 2000's suburban and the other a mid 2000's tahoe. One of the guys has a bumper pull travel trailer that is fairly old and has a square cut in the side and a home window unit stuck in it for A/C. He looks and talks like Jeff Foxworthy and cuts off his jeans every spring and makes them into shorts and then buys a few new pairs in the fall(im sure on sale from Kohls or some such place for cheap). You would NEVER know he has money. The other guy has a bunch of classic cars in various forms of disarray and has a really nice RV(but even that he got a killer deal on in a bankruptcy sale). He does splurge on Fireball whiskey though. But again if you met him you wouldnt know how much he was worth and he worked his ass off for 30 years to make his money.

You know what. I am convinced that most people who really have money, and I've met a few well off people, have that money because they don't "flaunt" it and spend wisely and save and most of them did work damn hard for it. I try to do the same, save my money, invest, ect. Not to say I don't buy things I really want, but I rarely am the first in line, nor do I generally pay full retail as I shop around and wait for sales.

And Fireball whiskey can be dangerous shit. Tastes like candy going down. And ice cold... easier to get college girls ****ed up on it than vodka, lol.

[brickboy240]

Pawn shops, payday loan stores and rental rim stores...proof that many Americans have money but do not know how to properly manage it.

-brickboy240

[wildcard600]

All of this is simply you rationalizing your judgment, not validating it.

and your assertion that smartphones and $60+ phone plans are not stupid financial decisions is better ? $60 is almost 4 months of cell phone coverage for myself. if some clown wants to blow that on one month with some fancy thing, they can pawn the tv and starve for all i care.

[Kain]

Pawn shops, payday loan stores and rental rim stores...proof that many Americans have money but do not know how to properly manage it.

-brickboy240

I think you might wish to add check cashing places as well.

[Belmont31R]

and your assertion that smartphones and $60+ phone plans are not stupid financial decisions is better ? $60 is almost 4 months of cell phone coverage for myself. if some clown wants to blow that on one month with some fancy thing, they can pawn the tv and starve for all i care.



What are you using a phone for that $15 a month works for you coverage wise?

[wildcard600]

What are you using a phone for that $15 a month works for you coverage wise?

couple of texts a day and a few 30 min phone calls a month. now i have thousands of minutes in reserve due to roll over from not using all the minutes.

[Crow Hunter]

What are you using a phone for that $15 a month works for you coverage wise?

What happens if we turn this around and ask what do you use your $60/month smart phone for? This is what I do to myself when I want to buy something.

My experience to date with people who own/use smart phones is that it is:

A. Work use to allow them to stay in constant communication -Very, very, very rare most of the people where I work that use them spend time surfing the internet or playing games instead of paying attention in meetings.

B. Goof off when they could be actually talking with friends/family by playing mindless games or surfing the internet - Fairly common

C. Status symbol to show off to friends/family how successful you are because you can "afford" to pay $300-600 for a phone and $100/month data plan to go with it - Most common

My BIL/SIL are C.

They gave a "$300 phone" to their 8 yr old son when my wife's sister upgraded to her "$600 phone" so he could play mindless games.

Weekend before last, to my great amusement, he dropped it in the toilet while playing a game when taking a dump.:fie:

This is how I know how much the phones cost when my SIL was wailing about what he had just done and why she wouldn't let him use her phone because he was pitching a fit to play Minecraft instead of spending time with his Grandfather/Grandmother.

ETA: It was also quite amusing to see the look of horror on my MIL face when he came into the kitchen and grabbed the dishtowel and started frantically trying to dry off the phone and I asked him, "What did you do drop the phone in the commode?" And he turned with a sheepish look on his face and said "Yes, can you fix it?". The look on my MIL face would have been worth nearly $300 to me. :D

[Crow Hunter]

All of this is simply you rationalizing your judgment, not validating it.

Yes, I am a very rational judgmental person.;)

It comes from being an engineer all these years.

[G19A3]

Judging a book based on a its cover is bad enough. Doing so whilst being stupid ignorant on the topic.............. You get the picture.

Bite your fingers, OP.

Every person has some degree of personal survival skills. Some have more, some less. One of those skills is prejudging.

For example, I realize not all pitbulls are vicious, but enough of them are for whatever reason more so than other dogs, I don't go around petting them. I guess that would make me a pitbull-racist or something. You get the picture.

[Belmont31R]

couple of texts a day and a few 30 min phone calls a month. now i have thousands of minutes in reserve due to roll over from not using all the minutes.

You're on the very low use side of what most people are doing so $15 a month probably gets you less value for your amount of use than someone that spends $60 but is a heavy user.



What happens if we turn this around and ask what do you use your $60/month smart phone for? This is what I do to myself when I want to buy something.

My experience to date with people who own/use smart phones is that it is:

A. Work use to allow them to stay in constant communication -Very, very, very rare most of the people where I work that use them spend time surfing the internet or playing games instead of paying attention in meetings.

B. Goof off when they could be actually talking with friends/family by playing mindless games or surfing the internet - Fairly common

C. Status symbol to show off to friends/family how successful you are because you can "afford" to pay $300-600 for a phone and $100/month data plan to go with it - Most common

My BIL/SIL are C.

They gave a "$300 phone" to their 8 yr old son when my wife's sister upgraded to her "$600 phone" so he could play mindless games.

Weekend before last, to my great amusement, he dropped it in the toilet while playing a game when taking a dump.:fie:

This is how I know how much the phones cost when my SIL was wailing about what he had just done and why she wouldn't let him use her phone because he was pitching a fit to play Minecraft instead of spending time with his Grandfather/Grandmother.

ETA: It was also quite amusing to see the look of horror on my MIL face when he came into the kitchen and grabbed the dishtowel and started frantically trying to dry off the phone and I asked him, "What did you do drop the phone in the commode?" And he turned with a sheepish look on his face and said "Yes, can you fix it?". The look on my MIL face would have been worth nearly $300 to me. :D


Stay in contact with friends, family, and work. I use around 3000-4000 texts a month.

At work I use the phone's maps to make deliveries, contact customers, get calls from the call center/office, ect.

Take a lot of pictures with my phone.

School- emails, checking assignments, contacting fellow students for group assignments/meetings, ect.

Calendars- how I stay on top of stuff for my kids, school assignments, ect.

Weather- check the weather with up to date radar, forecasts, alerts for severe weather, ect.


Not everyone sits there and plays games all day. If I had to do away with my phone, and replace all that with other devices to accomplish the same tasks, I'd be spending a lot more money than the cost of a phone. Separate GPS device, camera, laptop with a cellular connection, ect.

[Dead Man]

Every person has some degree of personal survival skills. Some have more, some less. One of those skills is prejudging.

For example, I realize not all pitbulls are vicious, but enough of them are for whatever reason more so than other dogs, I don't go around petting them. I guess that would make me a pitbull-racist or something. You get the picture.

You're also wrong, and perfectly illustrating my point. Study up on pitbulls and get back to me.

[wildcard600]

You're also wrong, and perfectly illustrating my point. Study up on pitbulls and get back to me.

You are free to start giving out your money if you wish. In fact i could use some extra cash this month. you want my paypal email ?

[WickedWillis]

I see a ton of wannabe tough-guys roll with Pitbulls, and snakes for that matter but we are getting off-topic. My experience with Pitbulls is it's all about how they were raised, and if it wasn't by some wannabe thug they are generally well behaved.

[rjacobs]

My cell bill is $120 a month, I hate it. Dare I say I do need it and a lot for work. I check weather on it, pull paperwork, check flight status, check schedule changes, call my company(more than I would like lately), etc... Yea, I get on facebook and check my stocks and play games and listen to music, but I would bet I use it for work at least 50% of the time(which coincidentally is what I am allowed to deduct on my taxes).

[williejc]

Money talks, and bullshit walks. Always has. Always will.

[Pi3]

1. I have seen financially strapped people living with a cascade of bad decisions that accumulated over the years. Having to hock your tv would be a definite indication of poor planning somewhere in the past. It could just be bad luck, but probably not.
2. Giving food to the rescue mission is probably more productive than giving it to a guy standing by the side of the road with a sign.
3. I resisted getting an iPhone for a while after my wife got one, but once getting it, I use it constantly like Belmont said. I graze this & other gun forum sites a lot on it, send and receive family photos, videos, etc.. It has replaced my wristwatch, alarm clock, camera & video camera. The flash light comes in handy. The previous flip phone did some of this, but not very well. It really helps with comparison shopping when out in a store. It is not a necessity.

[G19A3]

You're also wrong, and perfectly illustrating my point. Study up on pitbulls and get back to me.

I was speaking with a generalization as prejudgments are generalizations. I don't need additional read ups on pitbulls to know the breed is in the top ten if not the top five of dog attacks. But thanks for your suggestion. Don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining.

For the record, I do judge people as individuals. I have met friendly pitbulls too, but after I've observed them for a time will I think about getting close. Same with people. So until I vet them (people, dogs, etc.), I follow my experience and instincts. Look like a duck, waddle like a duck, quack like a duck and all that.

The OP had a possible regret on a passing thought based on a prejudgment, which I see no problem with. He did not act negatively on that thought.

[MountainRaven]

I have yet to meet a pibble that wasn't an absolute sweetheart.

But then, I don't hang around with thugs and gangbangers.

[Denali]

My wife has been wanting a G42 ever since she handled one at a local store and we decided to go and look for one yesterday on a weekend trip.

We went to a pawn shop that I have done a lot of business with over the years. I like the guy that owns it and he always has very good prices on handguns. He is a Glock stocking dealer so I figured he might have one.

While we were there looking at all the toys a somewhat older couple came it carrying a TV. They are apparently fairly common customers since the guy working the counter knew them. They wanted to pawn their TV so they could borrow $70. I was really feeling bad because here was this older couple bringing in their TV just to get $70 and here my wife was getting ready to plop down $400+ for a G42 that we honestly don't need, just something she wants. The pawn shop was going to give them $70 and make them pay by $85. The gentleman asked if they would be open on Monday so he could get it back, so it was obvious that it wasn't something they were wanting to get rid of.

I actually turned to look up from the really sweet .22 Ruger SP101 that I was admiring to offer to let them have $70 so they wouldn't have to pay that enormous interest rate. I felt that bad.

Then I saw the woman was zooming in to look at something on her Iphone while her husband was filling out the paperwork....:suicide:

I don't even own a smart phone and neither does my wife, because the price/utility just isn't there.

If your financial position is so freaking precarious that you have to borrow $70 from a pawn shop on your TV, WHAT THE HELL are you doing with a freaking SMART PHONE!?!?!?!?!

ETA:

And here I was, willing to part with $70 of my money, that I don't spend on a smart phone, to help them out.

I feel bad for being angry but I feel ticked off that they are spending that kind of money and probably voting for Obama and complaining about "rich" white people like me that won't give them a break.

I don't understand your anger, my iphone itself cost me just $120.00 with a $60.00 a month unlimited walk & talk contract! It's significantly less then my land line costs. I find it almost impossible to believe you couldn't have a pair of them, they are that inexpensive. I can't comment to the other issues beyond who knows what the deal happens to be with their pawning a TV, and who cares, its their business and none of your's!

[Crow Hunter]

I don't understand your anger, my iphone itself cost me just $120.00 with a $60.00 a month unlimited walk & talk contract! It's significantly less then my land line costs. I find it almost impossible to believe you couldn't have a pair of them, they are that inexpensive. I can't comment to the other issues beyond who knows what the deal happens to be with their pawning a TV, and who cares, its their business and none of your's!

I wasn't angry. Just ticked off that I was going to try and help them out, to save them from paying 17.6% interest to borrow $70 because I thought they might have fallen on hard times or had an emergency that they had no control over.

Having to borrow $70 because they have a $120 phone that they are paying $60/month for when they could do what I do, $33/month and a $40 phone and already have $404 extra in their pocket so that they would not need to borrow that $70. Heck, they could have paid that $70 5X and still had money left over.

So it wasn't an emergency that they had no control over. They made choices that got them into that situation.

It was a microcosm of the Ant and the Grasshopper fable. A demonstration of the FSA mentality and part of what is wrong with America today IMHO.

I guess that makes me a bad person in some people's eyes.

PS. I get the impression that some people are taking offense that I don't see utility in owning a smart phone for the price and are somehow projecting that onto their own situation. I am not intending that. But if you are only one missed check, one financial mistake away from having to pawn your TV for $70 and you have a smart phone, well don't be at the pawn shop doing it while I am there buying a G42 with my wife because I will get ticked and complain about you on the internet.:)

[Belmont31R]

I wasn't angry. Just ticked off that I was going to try and help them out, to save them from paying 17.6% interest to borrow $70 because I thought they might have fallen on hard times or had an emergency that they had no control over.

Having to borrow $70 because they have a $120 phone that they are paying $60/month for when they could do what I do, $33/month and a $40 phone and already have $404 extra in their pocket so that they would not need to borrow that $70. Heck, they could have paid that $70 5X and still had money left over.

So it wasn't an emergency that they had no control over. They made choices that got them into that situation.

It was a microcosm of the Ant and the Grasshopper fable. A demonstration of the FSA mentality and part of what is wrong with America today IMHO.

I guess that makes me a bad person in some people's eyes.

PS. I get the impression that some people are taking offense that I don't see utility in owning a smart phone for the price and are somehow projecting that onto their own situation. I am not intending that. But if you are only one missed check, one financial mistake away from having to pawn your TV for $70 and you have a smart phone, well don't be at the pawn shop doing it while I am there buying a G42 with my wife because I will get ticked and complain about you on the internet.:)


Don't really know what people's situation is, and just saying they had a iPhone doesn't mean much. Don't know what they're paying a month on service. They could have had a relative buy it for them. My dad is on my sister's cell plan, and doesn't cost him that much. Theres a lot of people putting grandparents and such on their plans, and giving them their 1-2 year old phones so they can use the extra upgrade. They might have bought a 2 year old phone used, and didn't pay that much. People lose their jobs, and go from a steady income to nothing, and have to sell off extra shit to make ends meet.

And no not everyone makes the best financial decisions. You were in a pawn store. Thats the sort of place where you expect to see that sort of thing. You saw a sliver of what led them in there, and filling in the rest of the story in your mind to make some sort of point. And you're interjecting yourself into someone else's business and being critical of them.

[wildcard600]

I wasn't angry. Just ticked off that I was going to try and help them out, to save them from paying 17.6% interest to borrow $70 because I thought they might have fallen on hard times or had an emergency that they had no control over.

Having to borrow $70 because they have a $120 phone that they are paying $60/month for when they could do what I do, $33/month and a $40 phone and already have $404 extra in their pocket so that they would not need to borrow that $70. Heck, they could have paid that $70 5X and still had money left over.

So it wasn't an emergency that they had no control over. They made choices that got them into that situation.

It was a microcosm of the Ant and the Grasshopper fable. A demonstration of the FSA mentality and part of what is wrong with America today IMHO.

I guess that makes me a bad person in some people's eyes.

PS. I get the impression that some people are taking offense that I don't see utility in owning a smart phone for the price and are somehow projecting that onto their own situation. I am not intending that. But if you are only one missed check, one financial mistake away from having to pawn your TV for $70 and you have a smart phone, well don't be at the pawn shop doing it while I am there buying a G42 with my wife because I will get ticked and complain about you on the internet.:)

i agree. seems to be alot more words being put out there from people defending paying for a expenisve phone/plan than actually deconstructing the logic you used to pass judgement.

guess you struck a nerve.

[brickboy240]

Then it might be a combination of not being good at managing their money and misplaced priorities.

Some feel that a good smart phone is more important that spending on other things...who knows?

I work with several 20-something types that whine all the time that they have no money. They make decent money, but they eat out every day for lunch, shop for clothes at the mall and drive cars that cost well into the 30 thousand range. It is not that they make no money...it is that they pay too much for some things and have nothing left over for other things.

This is a situation I find many people that whine about not having enough money. It is not that they don't MAKE enough...it is that they blow it on too many things they could cut back on to have extra cash.

There is little chance of helping those people. Dave Ramsey made a whole lucrative career helping those with Congress's spending habits! LOL

[wildcard600]

Then it might be a combination of not being good at managing their money and misplaced priorities.

Some feel that a good smart phone is more important that spending on other things...who knows?

I work with several 20-something types that whine all the time that they have no money. They make decent money, but they eat out every day for lunch, shop for clothes at the mall and drive cars that cost well into the 30 thousand range. It is not that they make no money...it is that they pay too much for some things and have nothing left over for other things.

This is a situation I find many people that whine about not having enough money. It is not that they don't MAKE enough...it is that they blow it on too many things they could cut back on to have extra cash.

There is little chance of helping those people. Dave Ramsey made a whole lucrative career helping those with Congress's spending habits! LOL

many people havent yet realized that the standard of living has been going down in this country for many years and as inflation continues to outstrip wage growth its only going to get worse.

[brickboy240]

Very true. Many have not seen a meaningful raise in income in 5-8 years or so. Yet the prices on gas, groceries and damned near everything keeps going up.

It won't take too long and nope...most people will not be able to keep up their current lifestyles. Especially if they are living at or over their means and are very used to always dining out, having expensive material goods and paying for services like maids and yard work.

Noticed how many pay day loan shops have cropped up in your town? 10 years ago...you never saw those businesses...did you?

Many start by cutting out cable tv or downgrading their cars or other measures but it won't take too many more years of this type of economy and yes...we will start to see real bad problems.

I hate to say it but I think this is at the source of why so many people suffer from depression, anxiety or have to take tons of pills. It is why so many people seem on edge 24-7 and why so many abuse alcohol and prescription drugs.

Unless we see some sort of miracle in our economic future...things are going to get worse long before they get better.

-brickboy240

[wildcard600]

Very true. Many have not seen a meaningful raise in income in 5-8 years or so. Yet the prices on gas, groceries and damned near everything keeps going up.

It won't take too long and nope...most people will not be able to keep up their current lifestyles. Especially if they are living at or over their means and are very used to always dining out, having expensive material goods and paying for services like maids and yard work.

Noticed how many pay day loan shops have cropped up in your town? 10 years ago...you never saw those businesses...did you?

Many start by cutting out cable tv or downgrading their cars or other measures but it won't take too many more years of this type of economy and yes...we will start to see real bad problems.

I hate to say it but I think this is at the source of why so many people suffer from depression, anxiety or have to take tons of pills. It is why so many people seem on edge 24-7 and why so many abuse alcohol and prescription drugs.

Unless we see some sort of miracle in our economic future...things are going to get worse long before they get better.

-brickboy240

I agree. i know that despite relative frugal living, i am much more anxious about money these days than even just 5 years ago due to the amount of money i make being stagnant but losing its value due to inflation and rising costs.

knock on wood however, i should be debt free by next year with the exception of my mortgage which will be a great relief.

i would encourage everyone to take a good look at your personal situation and future outlook and make adjustments to your standard of living now, while its still voluntary instead of later when hard reality dictates it.

YMMV

[Moose-Knuckle]

Does not surprise me.

Every time I go in the grocery store near my office (not in a very good part of town) I see people use EBT cards but they carry I-Phones and load their groceries into vehicles much newer and nicer than any that I own. They are also usually buying a cart full of things we rarely buy like steaks and fresh seafood.

So the EBT users are eating better than me...a small business owner. They are also using better phones and driving nicer cars.

why work?

"You didn't build that." - Obama

[Moose-Knuckle]

Not a welfare apologist and I completely understand and agree with your viewpoint - but if you were in their shoes you'd soon learn that it isn't as nice as you think. A nice phone, a steak, and a car with rims do not a nice life make.

I busted my ass to get out of the ghetto. I know the mentality of which you speak too well, and I couldn't give a shit whether or not someone uses their under the table income to buy nice gadgets. At the end of the day they are going home to a house full of screaming kids, drama, probation officers, police harassment, drug problems, crime, and all sorts of other issues that can't be fixed with a government handout.

:suicide:

So that just makes it a-okay to rob me and other US tax payers of our hard earned money just to redistribute it to a bunch of oxygen thieves in the FSA.

[wildcard600]

:suicide:

So that just makes it a-okay to rob me and other US tax payers of our hard earned money just to redistribute it to a bunch of oxygen thieves in the FSA.

exactly. i am forced to downgrade my standard of living to support myself with the 60% of my income that i am "allowed" to keep so those shit bags can have steaks and rims ? its not like any actual hard working people ever had drug, police or screaming kid problems though right ???

[brickboy240]

Not to mention that those "oxygen thieves" are also organizing and voting for people like Obama that will take more and more from us.

I have a theory that the unemployment rate in America remains high because we have made it too easy to LIVE without a steady job.

Take away the Obama-phones and free food and you would see all sorts of people go to work! LOL

[williejc]

Eurodriver was almost flamed for sharing his life experience that few of us have known. He escaped an environment that traps most in a quagmire of crime, illiteracy, drug addiction, and dependency on government subsidy.. He said that he was not an apologist for the welfare state. He never implied otherwise, but some of us inferred differently.

[Abraham]

As a 20 year old, working a job that payed $643 a month and married with one child, with a stay at home wife:

We had no phone, no luxuries of any sort, lived in $43.00 a month furnished rent house, (yeah, not great, but it was a roof over our heads) never ate out.

We owned a cranky 20+ year old used Rambler, and a 13" black and white, rabbit earred T.V. I guess we did have some luxuries...

We thought we were doing o.k., not great, but adequate.

As time passed and our child got old enough for day care, my wife went to school, later to work and I was continually promoted upward, until one day we could afford our own home and a ton of luxuries.

What's my point?

Live within your means. Do without luxuries. It won't kill you. Don't get on welfare. Keep your dignity.

Stay employed and make the necessary sacrifices, like getting along with your boss, even if he's a tyrant.

Eventually you'll do well without your hand out.

[wildcard600]

Eurodriver was almost flamed for sharing his life experience that few of us have known. He escaped an environment that traps most in a quagmire of crime, illiteracy, drug addiction, and dependency on government subsidy.. He said that he was not an apologist for the welfare state. He never implied otherwise, but some of us inferred differently.

sorry... didnt realize that most of the membership here were all raised in wealthy families in nice neighborhoods and went to esteemed colleges before sliding into secure white collar jobs.

:rolleyes:

[Crow Hunter]

sorry... didnt realize that most of the membership here were all raised in wealthy families in nice neighborhoods and went to esteemed colleges before sliding into secure white collar jobs.

:rolleyes:

We didn't?:p

[gun71530]

I got my iPhone 5c for free from Verizon.

if I had a flip phone I would only save $20 a month. I have the lowest data plan.

However if you're pawning a TV then $20 is substantial...so who knows.

Same exact thing for me. Smartphones are nothing new, meaning they're not that expensive unless you want them to be.

[wildcard600]

Same exact thing for me. Smartphones are nothing new, meaning they're not that expensive unless you want them to be.

If you're hocking your TV for $70, apparently ANY cell phone is more than you can afford.

[Abraham]

I'm with the OP if it wasn't apparent.

You don't NEED a freakin smart phone.

You don't need luxuries and a smart phone is a luxury.

Strip down to what you need and chances are higher you'll be able to live without hocking anything.

I lived in South Texas (earlier in life) without Air Conditioning or a t.v/phone/ and did just fine. Was it tough, yes, but we made do.

I think a lot of people think they should enjoy the life style of a successful 40 something, who didn't do a thing to achieve that life style, but insist they deserve it.

Unless, you made the necessary sacrifices and effort to make it so, sorry, you're S.O.L.

[26 Inf]

Kind of continuing on and pointing the finger at myself -

When we were first married, we saved for 6 months to buy a $90.00 black and white TV (1973); I waited for payday so I could buy one magazine (Dirbike or MX Action).

We all did it. How many do it now? I'm not quite as bad as a youngster, but if I want something I buy it. No waiting for payday, put it on the card. There have been many times when the pay checks didn't have enough extra and I have to dip into savings to pay the card off each month. Most of the time I'm pretty good about replacing the money....unless something else strikes my fancy. And I'm a Dave Ramsey practitioner - kind of :)

That is what the credit economy has done to most Americans.

If the youngsters couldn't get credit until they had built a legit credit history it wouldn't be so bad.

If the states hadn't loosened the reins on the Pay Day loan industry, it wouldn't be as bad. But some fat cat saw another way to make a buck.

Sure it is the person's fault, but damn we sure allow folks to egg them on.

[MountainRaven]

As a 20 year old, working a job that payed $643 a month and married with one child, with a stay at home wife:

We had no phone, no luxuries of any sort, lived in $43.00 a month furnished rent house, (yeah, not great, but it was a roof over our heads) never ate out.

We owned a cranky 20+ year old used Rambler, and a 13" black and white, rabbit earred T.V. I guess we did have some luxuries...

We thought we were doing o.k., not great, but adequate.

As time passed and our child got old enough for day care, my wife went to school, later to work and I was continually promoted upward, until one day we could afford our own home and a ton of luxuries.

What's my point?

Live within your means. Do without luxuries. It won't kill you. Don't get on welfare. Keep your dignity.

Stay employed and make the necessary sacrifices, like getting along with your boss, even if he's a tyrant.

Eventually you'll do well without your hand out.

How the hell do you find somewhere to live for $43 a month? I don't think you could rent a bed in a homeless shelter for $43 a month.

$43 out of $643 is fantastic. Most people making $643 will be living in places that cost them $200-300 a month. And those places will still be crap.

I remember making $1000 a month, paying $300 a month in rent, with zero dependents, and nothing to pay for but gas and rent. The place was crap - no dead bolt, wind just blew through the doors and windows, cold in the winter, and hot in the summer. And unfurnished (I had a bed, a desk, an old sofa and an old entertainment center my parents were going to throw away). But I always had money. With the rate of inflation and its impact on the price of gas and food and the new spike in the price of housing, I can't imagine making that work, any more.

[Belmont31R]

A smart phone is not a luxury item....


I posted a thread a while ago about the Lumia 520 which is a smart phone. https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?145642-Nokia-Lumia-520-(AT-amp-T)-Good-deal-for-a-backup-or-teen-s-phone&highlight=lumia


http://www.amazon.com/Nokia-Lumia-520-GoPhone-AT/dp/B00E45043A/ref=sr_1_1?s=wireless&ie=UTF8&qid=1413956324&sr=1-1&keywords=lumia+520


Not every smart phone is a brand new $650 iPhone or Galaxy S whatever.


And I actually used a 520 for a few weeks at one point earlier this year. Its perfectly capable of basic smart phone tasks. It does visual voicemail, email, Word docs, podcasts, weather, ect. And I actually touted it back then as a good phone for teenagers or people needing a cheap phone.

There is a similar Nokia 521 which will work on T-mobile, and you can get a $30 a month plan with 100 minutes, unlimited texts, and unlimited data.

People would rather jump on their high horses, and bemoan other people when the opportunity exists than champion real cost saving measures as shown.

And no one cares what people did when 13" televisions were around and messing with rabbit ears. You can't even find those TV's in stores or even in pawn shops. Everyone dealt with that stuff 10-20-30 years ago. Now you can go buy a 24" LCD TV for a fraction of what people paid for those 13" tube TV's back in the day. So what? Time moves on, and you're not a survivor or anything for having one. I grew up when a Sony TV encased in a giant wood encasing was the hot shit, and the giant antenna on our roof was high tech stuff. Move on.

[Moose-Knuckle]

Depending on what one's income is I do consider "smart phones" luxury items. Hell I've handled homeless people that have better phones than me.

Luxury items are things one does not need to survive day to day. I don't think anyone has died from not being able to watch YouTube/Netflix, send a Tweet, update their Facebook status, or achieve a personal best at Fruit Ninja.

If someone earns their income then I could careless what they spend it on to include smart phones and their data packages. But when you read the fine print on your cell phone bill and you see all the various charges the phone company is collecting so the Federal government can redistribute your income for "Obama phones" yeah, people have the right to be livid.

[Belmont31R]

Depending on what one's income is I do consider "smart phones" luxury items. Hell I've handled homeless people that have better phones than me.

Luxury items are things one does not need to survive day to day. I don't think anyone has died from not being able to watch YouTube/Netflix, send a Tweet, update their Facebook status, or achieve a personal best at Fruit Ninja.

If someone earns their income then I could careless what they spend it on to include smart phones and their data packages. But when you read the fine print on your cell phone bill and you see all the various charges the phone company is collecting so the Federal government can redistribute your income for "Obama phones" yeah, people have the right to be livid.


If you define luxury as that then yeah.


I see it at the cost benefit ratio being a lot higher than people are giving a smart phone as credit for. A $48 phone, and $30 a month in service would be a steal even 5 or 10 years ago. Let alone what people paid for land line service with long distance fees before.

In context, a cheap smartphone with a cheap plan compared to what people paid for a single land line 20 years ago is a friggen bargain of a lifetime.

And I don't consider luxury as just above existing. My Mazda 3 isn't a luxury car. I don't need it to exist. It serves a purpose.

[Moose-Knuckle]

So if smart phones are not luxury items is the ability to watch videos, play games, take a selfie, and Tweet i.e. be entertained a basic right/need?

I guess I'm just old school as I consider eating, drinking, and breathing basic rights/needs but then again I don't feel I should be forced via the rule of law to pay for someone to participate in those events either.

It equates to someone who is going hungry and instead of eating a bologna sandwich with glass of water they acquire caviar and champagne by either taking a government handout or pawning their belongings.

[wildcard600]

I can't find any T-Mobile cell plans for less than $45 dollars a month ?? Maybe its a store only thing ?

At any rate, a $10 prepaid phone with a $15/month service card will fulfill the same role as a smart phone costing more than twice as much (phone calls and texts). That is still what I consider a baseline and until "smart phones" cost the same or less, I will consider them luxury expenditures.

YMMV

[chuckman]

I see this every day, and I saw it in its most heinous form in the ED: gals with $70 hair, $50 nails, whipping out the latest Apple i-whatever, but asking us for a sandwich because the welfare check had not comer in yet, asking for a taxi voucher because it's faster than the bus, and asking for a pregnancy test, knowing they will not have to pay for it like they would if they went to the drug store (or even dollar store).

It has hardened me. I am I callous and judgmental? Yup.

[Belmont31R]

I can't find any T-Mobile cell plans for less than $45 dollars a month ?? Maybe its a store only thing ?

At any rate, a $10 prepaid phone with a $15/month service card will fulfill the same role as a smart phone costing more than twice as much (phone calls and texts). That is still what I consider a baseline and until "smart phones" cost the same or less, I will consider them luxury expenditures.

YMMV



If you buy a SIM off their site, and then go through the pre-paid setup, theres an option for the $30 a month plan. I have a SIM with that plan since my phone is unlocked, and can use pretty much any carrier. I had it to test T-Mobile's cellular coverage since we've been with AT&T forever, and get tired of their crap, but they have better coverage than T-Mobile so we're still with AT&T. The $30 plan is sold through Walmart normally but any SIM kit can be used to activate that plan.

[Belmont31R]

So if smart phones are not luxury items is the ability to watch videos, play games, take a selfie, and Tweet i.e. be entertained a basic right/need?

I guess I'm just old school as I consider eating, drinking, and breathing basic rights/needs but then again I don't feel I should be forced via the rule of law to pay for someone to participate in those events either.

It equates to someone who is going hungry and instead of eating a bologna sandwich with glass of water they acquire caviar and champagne by either taking a government handout or pawning their belongings.




My point is people wouldn't make a big deal about someone having a land line 20 years ago, and being poor, but land lines used to cost a lot of money. Now people can pay less for a cell phone even if its a smart phone. Its just the fact its a smart phone, and can do more than just make a call, so suddenly its a luxury item because technology has gotten to the point where phones do more than just make a call despite being cheaper. We haven't had a land line at home for about 5 years now, and I know a lot of people who have ditched them.


Before I got into smartphones, I had phones like the Razr, which are dumb by today's standards, but cost a lot more than the Nokia 520 I mentioned.

[Abraham]

Fjallhrafn,

This was in 1967.

Plus, the monthly salary I posted was gross, not net, before taxes...

A lot of what people now classify as essentials, i.e. not luxuries, such as smart phones, is bogus.

I know people in my family who think satellite/cable t.v. is essential - it's not. They buy a lot of things that aren't essential, but though they can't afford them, they insist they're entitled. Heck, all around have these items, why shouldn't they? They can't afford them and go deep into debt because hey, they deserve them...

Many people think a lot of luxuries are essentials they JUST can't do without. Nonsense!

If the point is to live within your means, do so.

Yeah, it's painful to cut back and do without, but that's what it takes. Discipline.

[Moose-Knuckle]

A lot of what people now classify as essentials, i.e. not luxuries, such as smart phones, is bogus.

I know people in my family who think satellite/cable t.v. is essential - it's not. They buy a lot of things that aren't essential, but though they can't afford them, they insist they're entitled. Heck, all around have these items, why shouldn't they? They can't afford them and go deep into debt because hey, they deserve them...

Many people think a lot of luxuries are essentials they JUST can't do without. Nonsense!

If the point is to live within your means, do so.

Yeah, it's painful to cut back and do without, but that's what it takes. Discipline.

Hammer meet nail and all that, bravo sir!