View Full Version : Need Help Narrowing for new CCW handgun
Ok, had to sell off my M&P9 to help pay medical bills and as I look to move to 1st floor apartment I want to have a handgun in case another crackhead (literally) tries to break in again. I will list some aspects that really restrict me from just going out and getting X gun.
I have not really followed the handgun market at all in about 4 years or so, so if there are some new guns on the market that would fit my criteria, it would be a bonus. I am coming here because I like the no-BS responses I get as well as the quality of the SME's.
Mitigating facts:
I'm disabled, I can't afford to go out and buy a LAV or High End 1911, so any calls for a Nighthawk, Wilson Combat etc.
I am a big guy. 6'4 about 370lbs.
I do have large hands, so something like an XDM or overly compact gun will fit my grip well and be comfortable shooting.
My range is $300-500 or so; either New or Used.
Factors to consider for any weapon:
First thing I want is reliability. I know enough to avoid Hi-Point's, Jennings etc, but from there I am lost.
I can't afford to blow $3-5K on a Custom 1911. My range will be between $300-500 for either New or Used gun.
Home invasions are popular and there was in my complex that had 3-4 assailants. This was in my building, on my floor, it was literally the mirror to my apartment.
I do live in a city and sadly, I do have to worry about small groups of thugs who see crippled white guy as a mark to beat up.
I would like 9mm, but will also consider .45 ACP. I have shot .40 S&W and the snap to it for some reason bothers my writs.
Not married to any manufacturer.
vicious_cb
11-19-14, 13:31
Why not just rebuy a M&P9? Was there something you didnt like about it? It fits all your criteria and since you previously owned one you would already be familiar with it.
I've got a Sig P290RS that I'll tell you to avoid. It light strikes primers. It's only "reliable" with Federal ammo, due to the soft primers.
My buddies who cc all have S&W Shield models and they swear by them.
Why not just rebuy a M&P9? Was there something you didnt like about it? It fits all your criteria and since you previously owned one you would already be familiar with it.
I liked the M&P9 for shooting, but also want to check other options as well. For me, when I was carrying the M&P I felt the thing printed lot more noticably than say the 1911 I used to carry or say a Glock 19 which is more flat like a 1911.
I am not ruling out another M&P9, just want to see what is out there in addition to.
I've got a Sig P290RS that I'll tell you to avoid. It light strikes primers. It's only "reliable" with Federal ammo, due to the soft primers.
My buddies who cc all have S&W Shield models and they swear by them.
Thanks for telling me about the new Sig's. I was actually curious about them, heard about how good they are. Also, want to learn bit more about the M&P Shields.
Agreed on the M&P9. Order from Grant and get the newest model with all of S&Ws updates and fixes and pay the extra $25 for a trigger polish. If funds ever allow, you can throw Apex parts in later for a VERY crisp trigger action. If not, you have a great handgun that fulfills all of your requirements and you're already familiar with it.
ETA - re printing: ensure you have a good holster and belt, and experiment with different options. That will solve it for most people. There are smaller guns like the Shield or M&PC, but since you have big hands it may be difficult to find one that conceals exceptionally well but is also easy and comfortable for you to shoot. I care more about the latter, but YMMV. Plus if you can manage a FS M&P9, that's 17+1 rounds to deal with all kinds of crackheads.
Agreed on the M&P9. Order from Grant and get the newest model with all of S&Ws updates and fixes and pay the extra $25 for a trigger polish. If funds ever allow, you can throw Apex parts in later for a VERY crisp trigger action. If not, you have a great handgun that fulfills all of your requirements and you're already familiar with it.
ETA - re printing: ensure you have a good holster and belt, and experiment with different options. That will solve it for most people. There are smaller guns like the Shield or M&PC, but since you have big hands it may be difficult to find one that conceals exceptionally well but is also easy and comfortable for you to shoot. I care more about the latter, but YMMV. Plus if you can manage a FS M&P9, that's 17+1 rounds to deal with all kinds of crackheads.
Thanks again for another nod to the M&P. I had a Raven Concealment Holster, also had the APEX stuff in it as well. Loved the way it shot, just when I carried it, I thought I had a huge growth there. Never had that feeling when I was carrying a 1911.
M&P would not be a bad choice. Other new comers to consider are the Walther PPQ and HK VP9. Both are a little over your budget but you might be able to pick up a lightly used one.
M&P would not be a bad choice. Other new comers to consider are the Walther PPQ and HK VP9. Both are a little over your budget but you might be able to pick up a lightly used one.
Steve, I was looking into the VP9 and honestly, I'd like to keep it in the 300-500 range but it is not hard and fast. And at around $600 can pay that, and as you said, always look for one lightly used.
Glock 19. It's the perfect size for what you need. Big enough for duty/home defense, small enough to ccw under just a t shirt. I'd also look at the new Sig P320 Compact. They are getting pretty good reviews and they meet your requirements. An M&P isn't a bad choice either and they have pretty good prices on them right now, but by the time you replace the suboptimal trigger you are right back up in the G19/Sig P320 range anyhow so I'd call price a wash on all 3.
Glock 19. It's the perfect size for what you need. Big enough for duty/home defense, small enough to ccw under just a t shirt. I'd also look at the new Sig P320 Compact. They are getting pretty good reviews and they meet your requirements. An M&P isn't a bad choice either and they have pretty good prices on them right now, but by the time you replace the suboptimal trigger you are right back up in the G19/Sig P320 range anyhow so I'd call price a wash on all 3.
New M&P trigger is pretty comparable to stock Glock 19 trigger so that point is kind of invalid. The only benefit is the size, but that may not be enough of a difference to justify having to learn how to shoot with the Glock angle.
Were I in your shoes, I would consider the M&P9c, the Glock 26, and the G19, -with the larger mags for the bed-side. I would also consider a cheap shotgun for bed-side.
WickedWillis
11-19-14, 16:50
Glock 19 really fits every role that you have need of that you listed. Size, capacity, concealibility, reliability, and price point. It seems to answer all of your questions.
I have pretty big hands, not huge, but bigger than most. The Shield is manageable for me but not great. It does not have interchangeable back straps like the M&P does, so you get what you get. Given, it conceals wonderfully, but being a single stack magazine lowers capacity enough that I wouldn't carry without an extra mag as well. I'm just not gung-ho about an auto loader with a capacity a little over a revolver. YMMV, but I really don't worry about printing at home.
I don't know when your previous M&P was manufactured, but the newer triggers are vastly improved over the old design that had a lot of grit, no tactile reset, etc. If I needed to buy a "one and only" pistol it would be a M&P9. Sounds like you might need all the capacity you can get.
Were I in your shoes, I would consider the M&P9c, the Glock 26, and the G19, -with the larger mags for the bed-side. I would also consider a cheap shotgun for bed-side.
I'd consider the 19 but have shot the 26 and actually owned the 9c, the rather shortish grips on it causes my mind to just go nuts with the way my pinky just hangs free.
I do appreciate the input on them, but I have had shot all 3 you mentioned, going as far as owning the 9c, but the 9c and 26 are just to small. I shot the 19 once and didn't like it much, but willing to try again.
Consider a used smith 59 series auto they are available cheap give you high cap and good reliability with lots of holster choices. They are a bit thinner than most polymer frame guns. Although at the high end of your budget a used browning high power is also an excellent choice. Used sig 226 is also a solid choice. Nothing wrong with a glock 19 or m&p. I prefer a gun with a longer track record than the m&p. while a little on the big side ( but still concealable with the right belt and holster combination ) a beretta 92 is also good
Consider a used smith 59 series auto they are available cheap give you high cap and good reliability with lots of holster choices. They are a bit thinner than most polymer frame guns. Although at the high end of your budget a used browning high power is also an excellent choice. Used sig 226 is also a solid choice. Nothing wrong with a glock 19 or m&p. I prefer a gun with a longer track record than the m&p. while a little on the big side ( but still concealable with the right belt and holster combination ) a beretta 92 is also good
Thanks for the alternative nod to the Beretta and that other S&W!
I am curious if anyone has any feedback on the FNH FNS-9?
I've heard good things about FNS. Here's a thread from a pretty reputable trainer who has been wringing one out. Some others to look at would be a used Sig P229, HK P2000, and HK P30 size wise, although new they would be out of your price range. CDNN has some very good deals on used Sigs. For my money though, I'd would, and did go Glock 19 Gen 4 and don't regret it. I'd try a gen 4 if you haven't already. The grip difference, while subtle, makes a big difference for a lot of people who hate the gen 3 grip.
http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?11515-FNH-FNS9-Two-Weeks-and-2-265-rounds
http://www.cdnnsports.com/firearms.html?SID=petq3s0jh1oidtshl8kcs13ni2&brand=363&cat=20
Psalms144.1
11-19-14, 18:42
Are you going to carry concealed? If yes, then the size efficiency of the G19 becomes very attractive, for me. If this is primarily for HD, then if you were happy with the M&P 9 last time, I don't see a reason not to get another. The Glock grip angle DOES become an issue for a lot of folks transitioning from other platforms, especially 1911 shooters.
I don't know enough about the FN line to opine. The VP9 is attractive, but might get beyond your budget (and almost certainly will with extra magazines, decent sights, leather, etc). The Sig P320 has my attention right now, once my self-imposed "Year of the Glock" ends, it's likely to be my first experiment (in Carry configuration). Others have had exceptionally good luck with the CZ P07, which is WELL within your price range if you're willing to work the DA/SA transition (or you can "convert" the decocking lever to a safety only and carry it like you did your 1911...)
But, having been down this path LITERALLY dozens of times over the last four decades of shooting, I always end up back with the G19. YMMV, of course, and the M&P might be "the one" for you.
Regards,
Kevin
WickedWillis
11-19-14, 18:57
I've heard good things about FNS. Here's a thread from a pretty reputable trainer who has been wringing one out. Some others to look at would be a used Sig P229, HK P2000, and HK P30 size wise, although new they would be out of your price range. CDNN has some very good deals on used Sigs. For my money though, I'd would, and did go Glock 19 Gen 4 and don't regret it. I'd try a gen 4 if you haven't already. The grip difference, while subtle, makes a big difference for a lot of people who hate the gen 3 grip.
http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?11515-FNH-FNS9-Two-Weeks-and-2-265-rounds
http://www.cdnnsports.com/firearms.html?SID=petq3s0jh1oidtshl8kcs13ni2&brand=363&cat=20
Damn. I wish someone did this with HK's.
brushy bill
11-19-14, 19:47
Full disclosure, I do not own and have not fired one, but if I were you, this is what I would do. Get a CZ P-07.
You can find one for $384 cash discount (includes shipping) at Bud's Gunshop and probably cheaper if you take the time to investigate. (http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/58053).
I base my recommendation on a very long but informative thread this forum which explains how the guns is recommended by a well known trainer/SME and why it matches your criteria (quality, cost, capacity, size, concealable, etc) :
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?149986-CZ-P-07 (main thread--lots to keep you busy)
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?143941-CZ-P-07 (follow up from the SME initial tread based on -- gun is holding up well and no issues).
There is also a lot of information on pistol-forum.com. I'd do a search there for the P-07 and P-09 as well as here. Pretty consistently high praise.
If I were looking for another gun and didn't mind getting new mags/holsters/etc and my situation resembled yours, I'd go with this option in a heart beat. Also, you might consider the CZ P09 based on your size and it holds a few extra rounds.
Maybe Moderator Sam will chime in here. He has gone through a class or two with one and seemed pretty pleased. May PM him if he doesn't.
My 2 cents (worth what you paid for it).
Good luck.
Another P-07 recommendation here. I own two, one for concealed carry and one in my bedside safe. It is a great gun, very reliable and it feels fantastic in the hand. I'm not a big dude (5'7" 165) and I have no problem concealing it even in with just a t-shirt.If you go this route make sure you get the 2014 model with the interchangeable back straps. They can be had all day long for under five hundred.
OP,
Given your body and stated hand size as well as your budget I would recommend a Glock 17 or 19. I have and enjoy a gen 3 G17 and I am 6'2" 245lbs. I fit in large to XL gloves from most makers.
Really appreciating the look into the CZ for carry. Digging up the threads right now to read.
davidjinks
11-19-14, 21:34
Glock 17, either Gen 3 or 4, RCS holster (Convertible from OWB to IWB), RCS mag pouch and a couple spare mags.
9MM, 17 +1 rounds, easily concealable, better grip than a G19 and it will fill multiple roles (HD, CCW, range/training and general fun gun). Spare parts are abundant and easy to come by. User friendly for maintenance.
Ok, had to sell off my M&P9 to help pay medical bills and as I look to move to 1st floor apartment I want to have a handgun in case another crackhead (literally) tries to break in again. I will list some aspects that really restrict me from just going out and getting X gun.
I have not really followed the handgun market at all in about 4 years or so, so if there are some new guns on the market that would fit my criteria, it would be a bonus. I am coming here because I like the no-BS responses I get as well as the quality of the SME's.
Mitigating facts:
I'm disabled, I can't afford to go out and buy a LAV or High End 1911, so any calls for a Nighthawk, Wilson Combat etc.
I am a big guy. 6'4 about 370lbs.
I do have large hands, so something like an XDM or overly compact gun will fit my grip well and be comfortable shooting.
My range is $300-500 or so; either New or Used.
Factors to consider for any weapon:
First thing I want is reliability. I know enough to avoid Hi-Point's, Jennings etc, but from there I am lost.
I can't afford to blow $3-5K on a Custom 1911. My range will be between $300-500 for either New or Used gun.
Home invasions are popular and there was in my complex that had 3-4 assailants. This was in my building, on my floor, it was literally the mirror to my apartment.
I do live in a city and sadly, I do have to worry about small groups of thugs who see crippled white guy as a mark to beat up.
I would like 9mm, but will also consider .45 ACP. I have shot .40 S&W and the snap to it for some reason bothers my writs.
Not married to any manufacturer.
Glock 17, either Gen 3 or 4, RCS holster (Convertible from OWB to IWB), RCS mag pouch and a couple spare mags.
9MM, 17 +1 rounds, easily concealable, better grip than a G19 and it will fill multiple roles (HD, CCW, range/training and general fun gun). Spare parts are abundant and easy to come by. User friendly for maintenance.
Isn't the 17 slightly bigger than an M&P9? Wouldn't make sense to recommend that if so, sense the M&P was a little too big for his taste.
OP - I forgot about the CZ. I was damn close to buying one and swapping the decocker for a safety until I got one in my hands. The lever was just a little too far for me to reach as easily as I'd want but I've got smaller hands so I doubt you'd have a problem. Depending on size vs the M&P and Glocks, that sounds to be a solid recommendation by all accounts (assuming you're cool with the DA thing).
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Right now narrowed it down to 3 guns mainly
The Cz P-07 is really looking appealing to me. I can pretty much pick up a new P-07, replace sights, get a RCS and have it still cost less than a new Glock or M&P.
Glock 19/17 (that order). The various after markets and after watching the Vickers/Hackathorn/Harrington video on Glock Mods notice that an aftermarket item could very well change my view when I shoot them.
M&P9 - Had it before, loved it, but again, when I carried it felt like I had a huge tumor at my side.
I really want to take this time to thank everyone who responded. There was no emotional type BS/Hype I have seen on similiar type of threads. Everyone gave me excellent recommendations, and an aweful lot to think about and do some field testing (if possible).
Right now narrowed it down to 3 guns mainly
The Cz P-07 is really looking appealing to me. I can pretty much pick up a new P-07, replace sights, get a RCS and have it still cost less than a new Glock or M&P.
Glock 19/17 (that order). The various after markets and after watching the Vickers/Hackathorn/Harrington video on Glock Mods notice that an aftermarket item could very well change my view when I shoot them.
M&P9 - Had it before, loved it, but again, when I carried it felt like I had a huge tumor at my side.
I really want to take this time to thank everyone who responded. There was no emotional type BS/Hype I have seen on similiar type of threads. Everyone gave me excellent recommendations, and an aweful lot to think about and do some field testing (if possible).
Do a little more research on the P-07..if you intend to use this as a CCW,HD pistol you'll need to replace the DA roller with a oversize roller from Cajun gunworks. this will prevent dissconector timing issues that ALL P-07/09's have.. The bright side here is, it's a $20 part, and a one time, drop in installation that completely solves the problem. I'd figure that in if you go with the CZ, My P-07 had this problem, and the roller resolved the issue, other than that, these are great little pistols.. and if funds allow later, the DA/SA triggers can be easily worked into excellent DA/SA triggers with Cajun gunworks parts kits..
davidjinks
11-20-14, 09:48
Couldn't tell you. However the OP is about opinion...so take it for what it is.
It's also possible that the OP didn't have the right setup for carry and that is why he felt the way he did? Figured to throw out some information and maybe that may guide him into something.
Isn't the 17 slightly bigger than an M&P9? Wouldn't make sense to recommend that if so, sense the M&P was a little too big for his taste.
OP - I forgot about the CZ. I was damn close to buying one and swapping the decocker for a safety until I got one in my hands. The lever was just a little too far for me to reach as easily as I'd want but I've got smaller hands so I doubt you'd have a problem. Depending on size vs the M&P and Glocks, that sounds to be a solid recommendation by all accounts (assuming you're cool with the DA thing).
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Do a little more research on the P-07..if you intend to use this as a CCW,HD pistol you'll need to replace the DA roller with a oversize roller from Cajun gunworks. this will prevent dissconector timing issues that ALL P-07/09's have.. The bright side here is, it's a $20 part, and a one time, drop in installation that completely solves the problem. I'd figure that in if you go with the CZ, My P-07 had this problem, and the roller resolved the issue, other than that, these are great little pistols.. and if funds allow later, the DA/SA triggers can be easily worked into excellent DA/SA triggers with Cajun gunworks parts kits..
Oh, thanks so much, even with the $20 drop isn't going to be a huge deal breaker, and will def. have it done.
Lionheart Industries is doing LH9's for $399 for Black Friday, and free shipping.
shakazulu12
11-20-14, 10:54
I really do like my P-07 that I picked up from G&R. Basically the size of a G19 with better build quality and feels better in the hand. I still haven't swithced mine over to the thumb safety as I'm attempting to master the dual action first pull. But the trigger is pretty sweet.
Lionheart Industries is doing LH9's for $399 for Black Friday, and free shipping.
IMO, this thing hasn't been around long enough to build up the support and knowledge base or to have it thoroughly vetted to take a gamble on as a CCW especially, with a limited budget.
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Look at the Px4 Storm in 9mm. They are offering a $75 rebate until the end of the year. Or just get the M&P9 its a great pistol. Also look at a used Beretta 92.
Isn't the 17 slightly bigger than an M&P9? Wouldn't make sense to recommend that if so, sense the M&P was a little too big for his taste.
Yes and no. I think length of slide and grip are a tad longer, but the M&P is a fair amount wider, about like a G21. I carried an M&P9 IWB for about 6 months and never warmed up to it. Something about it just wasn't comfortable. When I switched to a G19 is was night and day better. I have since carried a G22 IWB a bit and it's every bit as comfortable as the 19, but just prints a little more in the grip. I personally find the Glocks in both sizes much more comfortable, but that's me.
I'd have to say if I were in the market today for a CC pistol that wasn't a single stack, I would buy the CZ p-07. Of course the M&P is also a great choice...bullet proof and affordable.
MountainRaven
11-20-14, 21:10
I would look for an LE trade-in/refurb Glock. 19 or 17 preferred, but it's usually pretty difficult to find anything but 22s.
Yeah, the tritium sights are usually pretty dim. But at least they're steel. And the pistol (with the sights) is going to be significantly less expensive than buying a new pistol with the place-holder sights and without the disadvantage of the place-holder sights.
IMO, this thing hasn't been around long enough to build up the support and knowledge base or to have it thoroughly vetted to take a gamble on as a CCW especially, with a limited budget.
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And the Daewoo K5 or S&W 59? Have they been around long enough?
And the Daewoo K5 or S&W 59? Have they been around long enough?
What does that have to do with anything?
Beat Trash
11-20-14, 23:36
The M&P9 is a good gun. But if you felt it was a bit on the too big side for you to conceal, then go smaller. The Glock 17 is close enough to the size of the M&P9 that you'll have the same issue.
Look at the Glock 19 gen4 guns. I'm smaller than you but have large hands with long fingers. The large beavertail back straps on the gen4 Glock 19 has totally changed the way this gun feels to me. Yet it conceals like a Glock 19 does.
The P-07 might be another gun to consider, as it's close in size to the Glock 19. But I have no first hand experience with it to comment on.
What does that have to do with anything?
Because they're the same thing. The Lionheart is just a dolled up K5. Plenty of service history.
WickedWillis
11-21-14, 10:34
Because they're the same thing. The Lionheart is just a dolled up K5. Plenty of service history.
He is correct on this.
Interesting, I didn't know that. Still, I prefer to stick to something more widely used here in the US, but that is why I said it was just my opinion.
WickedWillis
11-21-14, 12:00
Interesting, I didn't know that. Still, I prefer to stick to something more widely used here in the US, but that is why I said it was just my opinion.
I agree with you as well, I believe the only country that the lionheart is in service is South Korea. I have fired one and it felt nice, like a little bit lighter Sig.
Father of 3
11-22-14, 23:31
Given your situation, Smith and Wesson SD9. Saves you some $$ over ther M&P, enough to buy a little more ammo, holster, mags, etc. It comes with a Tritium front sight and backed by S&W warranty. I was skeptic of this model after a Sigma years ago but after reading the 2000 round review below, I am considering this as a plausible option for CCW rotation. APEX parts available for it as well.
This could be another sleeper like the P-07 was.
http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?13363-S-amp-W-SD9VE-2-000-round-test-thread
How about the Walther PPX? Well within your budget and IIRC was on sale at CDNN for $279 for the standard model, and $299 for a threaded barrel. never shot one myself but after handling one in the store I have been considering getting one for the truck. I too have big hands and this pistol fit me just fine.
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Why restrict yourself to polymer? I know it is trendy, but its not like you need to carry it all day, right? Used Third Gen Smith and Wesson autos like a 5906, CZ-75B, Beretta 92FS, all can be had either new or slightly used in your price range. Nothing wrong with the P-07, or P-09 from CZ either. Used G17's, and G19's are well price also.
teutonicpolymer
11-24-14, 09:10
Did the S&W Shield get mentioned? If not then consider one, they are pretty affordable
Why restrict yourself to polymer? I know it is trendy, but its not like you need to carry it all day, right? Used Third Gen Smith and Wesson autos like a 5906, CZ-75B, Beretta 92FS, all can be had either new or slightly used in your price range. Nothing wrong with the P-07, or P-09 from CZ either. Used G17's, and G19's are well price also.
I am heavily leaning towards the P-07. Can get it new for what it would cost some other guns used. Need to hit a local shop that carries them next week to check out how it feels in my hand and at later time maybe drop the $$$ if the place rents them, though highly unlikey; he has Glocks, M&P's and high end 1911's for rent for the most part.
Howdy BVickery,
Have you considered a Taurus?
I have a Taurus PT 845 .45acp that's my drive to work truck gun. I cannot carry at work so I have to leave it in my truck so I wanted a quality but low price handgun and the Taurus fit the bill.
It's a full size handgun but it's easy for a standard size or larger man to conceal.
I've fired over 2,000 rounds through it with any hiccups except for my LSWC handloads. All other types of ammo worked
just fine.
The same model is available in 9mm and .40S&W. I paid $359.xx at Academy Sports.
HTH
Paul
Howdy BVickery,
Have you considered a Taurus?
I have a Taurus PT 845 .45acp that's my drive to work truck gun. I cannot carry at work so I have to leave it in my truck so I wanted a quality but low price handgun and the Taurus fit the bill.
It's a full size handgun but it's easy for a standard size or larger man to conceal.
I've fired over 2,000 rounds through it with any hiccups except for my LSWC handloads. All other types of ammo worked
just fine.
The same model is available in 9mm and .40S&W. I paid $359.xx at Academy Sports.
HTH
Paul
I have way to many bad memories of shooting a Taurus of a friend and to many issues. Not saying yours is bad, but just have severe doubts on their QC based on past issues.
I am going to grab the CZ P-07 after doing a lot of research on it here, on the net of various sites.
Dustin Cantrell
11-28-14, 01:18
Good choice on the P-07. Love my P-09 and recently picked up a P-07 for carry. Check out the StealthGear Onyx hybrid IWB holster. They sent out an email for 25% today for existing customers and said they will have a deal on Cyber Monday for all customers. The holsters are pricey but I'm glad I bought mine for the P-07.
I think the P-07 is a great choice, but for a few more bucks you can get the compact, lightweight alloy frame 75D PCR, or P-01 (with rail). I have the PCR and have been carrying it happily for years. It is about the same size, and weight as the P-07, but gives you that classic CZ-75 grip, and feel.
http://i750.photobucket.com/albums/xx150/Metrochef/Photoroll086.jpg (http://media.photobucket.com/user/Metrochef/media/Photoroll086.jpg.html)
If you really like DA/SA the PCR is very nice for the size/weight and slimness. If you MAY go for manual safety, look for the Unicorn - the P02 or a Canik 100. The P07 is a tad thick at the muzzle end BUT it allows you to 'change your mind' and adapt the gun to your training/preferences. Also, the P07 will likely come with a better trigger OTB, and MUCH easier system to deal with than the PCR/P01.
One feature I do like about the P-07 is the picatany rails in case I want to add a light or laser to it.
The main reason I'm going to be reluctant to really look at the PCR is this, and sadly, it is a big factor for me.
For the price of a PCR and the cost of most likely trigger upgrade work I can get a P-07 with the short reset upgrade, and this is a real attractive aspect for me, then be able to go and take the money I would have had to spend to get a good trigger and use it instead for training. I do hear this a lot on the site, and think it is GREAT advice to factor into the cost of getting a gun, so i did.
One feature I do like about the P-07 is the picatany rails in case I want to add a light or laser to it.
The main reason I'm going to be reluctant to really look at the PCR is this, and sadly, it is a big factor for me.
The P-01 has a light rail. See my post above. FWIW my PCR trigger was light, and crisp out of the box, and has only become better. It is totally stock, and has not required any trigger work.
NoDakRoughrider
12-08-14, 22:19
Don't discount a snub nose .357 Magnum revolver.
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