Hk91; Buy or Build?

[ClassIIIGunsmith]

Ok so I've been snooping in the roller delay blowback rifle market and I'm wondering if its more cost effective to buy or build 2 Hk91 clones and then the same for 2 Hk94 clones? I'm also thinking the same for a Hk93 clone but not sure if I like that action for my 223 or if I like my AR's better for 223. I've also heard word that there is some one making Hk style guns in .300BLK

[Bolt_Overide]

If you have the money, real deal HK is always better. It will be more expensive, but it will retain value. Barring that, my next choice would be clones built under HK contract with HK parts on HK machinery. I had a greek (I think) G3 clone, it was branded springfield armory, that was an HK contract gun. I could find no noticable differences between it and my real deal HK91.

I suggest that you dig up SteyerAug's primer on HK guns, it mostly addresses the G3/HK91 type, but the info can be applied to all roller lock guns.

Hope that helps.

[ClassIIIGunsmith]

I'm also looking at starting from a 80% reciever. I have most of the tools but no "stamp" would it be worth getting a "stamp" if I build more than one gun? Also for me I don't sell my stuff ever cause my kids could use/have them oneday so value rentension has no current value. I have a friend with a real Hk and a PTR; I see no differences between the two besides the markings on the reciever cause they both have Hk marked bolts

[Berserkr556]

I own an HK91 and have owned several since the 1980s. I wouldn't want to spend the money people are asking for them now though. The licensed rifles are ok but the price people are asking for them is insane as well. The FMP (Portugal) are a bit better made than the EBO (Greek) which are better than the POF (Pakistan) Either way they're going to be used. It would be extremely rare to find one in NOS condition.

If you really want a German made HK91 then by all means find the best one you can. On the other hand you can buy a PTR91 receiver, a RCM CHF barrel and fill out the rest of the parts with German and U.S. (922r) parts and have a qualified smith assemble you a masterpiece. Yes you MAY have the same amount of money in a built rifle as a German made rifle but if you're a shooter and not a collector the assembled rifle will serve your purpose better. If you're a collector more than a shooter than by all means buy a German HK91. The FMP, EBO and POF rifles aren't bad but they're all going to be used and you don't know how the previous owner used them.

[SteyrAUG]

I'm also looking at starting from a 80% reciever. I have most of the tools but no "stamp" would it be worth getting a "stamp" if I build more than one gun? Also for me I don't sell my stuff ever cause my kids could use/have them oneday so value rentension has no current value. I have a friend with a real Hk and a PTR; I see no differences between the two besides the markings on the reciever cause they both have Hk marked bolts

PTR has FMP tooling. But there are still some differences.

[eodinert]

I just recently got a roller lock, and did a bit of similar research before making the leap. I was looking for an MP5 (SD, and possibly a K), not a '91, so not exactly the same. I have built AKs from flats, made my own rivet squishers, and press my own barrels, so I thought it would be no problem to crank out a roller lock gun.

The problem with the roller locks is everything is expensive, even the tools. Especially the tools. I could buy everything I needed, build two guns, and spend more than if I had just purchased them from a reputable manufacturer...and I might not have a gun that works right when I'm done. Of course, this isn't taking into account the expensive of bodging a receiver or two during the folding process, which is a very real possibility.

At the end of the day, the math just didn't make sense to build two. My caveat to that is I know G3 parts are much cheaper and more common that MP5 parts, so maybe you could pull it off at something close to the price of a PTR... but I would be surprised if you did, and I would be surprised if the gun you built was as good as a PTR.

Were I in your shoes, I'd look for a lightly used quality clone that had been loved and pampered by the previous owner (and upgrades, like replacing the hideous US made trigger packs). I ended up with a newly made MP5SD clone from DJ Getz for $2200 (as a pistol, soon to be SBR'd), and I'm still not sure how he does it so well, so fast, and so cheap.

[lowprone]

Zenith firearms may be an option, they just introduced the 9mm, 5.56 and 7.62
roller locked rifles that are derived from the Turkish service rifles that were built
under license.

[teutonicpolymer]

I would either get a PTR 91 or buy a FAL parts kit, barrel, and Coonan receiver from Sarco and send it to a gunsmith to build it (assuming I had no intention to get the tools myself)

[ClassIIIGunsmith]

I would either get a PTR 91 or buy a FAL parts kit, barrel, and Coonan receiver from Sarco and send it to a gunsmith to build it (assuming I had no intention to get the tools myself)

I see all the Hk G3 Parts kits on the web which have a good price some even come with a 80% receiver almost all are under $600 and a good "stamp" is $287.97 so its like $800-900 range for gun with a "stamp". I'm just seeing if it would be a viable option if one has the skills to do the extra work. So is it better to build or buy? I guess my true question is it worth building two $600 rifles with a $300 "stamp" or buying 2 $1100 ones? And the Website that is selling it says its a universal "stamp" so if I save $1000 in building Hk91's and then possible save $400 in building two 93's. This also brings me to another question could one Form 1 a homemade Hk91 into a Hk51 and a Hk93 into Hk53 legally? I guess that's the true possible difference between buying and building does the cost of building out weight the cost in labor plus the NFA paperwork?

[teutonicpolymer]

I see PTR 91's for $800 at CDNN so that would be my first choice right now unless I wanted something specific. I think the PTR's are supposed to have some pretty good warranty so that is something else to look into and think about.

[Renegade04]

In my opinion, the PTR-91 is the way to go. I have one of the older JLD Enterprises PTR-91s that I bought new about 8 years ago. They were made with the same machines as the HK91s were. In some ways, they are better built than the HK91s, but they do not have that "HK" name that equates to prolonged value. For the money and the quality, I recommend the PTR-91.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m8/jamesrea_2006/Weapons%202014/PTR-91/017_zps3c3017c7.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/jamesrea_2006/media/Weapons%202014/PTR-91/017_zps3c3017c7.jpg.html)

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m8/jamesrea_2006/Weapons%202014/PTR-91/020_zpsb4fc2c50.jpg (http://s100.photobucket.com/user/jamesrea_2006/media/Weapons%202014/PTR-91/020_zpsb4fc2c50.jpg.html)

[Firefly]

Here is my unbiased input, hope this helps:

If you are buying an HK because it is an HK then the original is worth the premium, to an extent. I have a West German HK91 I've had for about a decade. Came in to a good deal. If you pay more than 1900 or so, you may enter diminishing returns.

HK doesn't usually put out lemons and the rifles are rugged so it will likely work well. People don't often part with originals. HK no longer services legacy rifles but there are competent HK smiths out there should you have a problem.

As a youth of the 80s and a fan of Chevy Chase movies, the HK was a must have for me. I shoot it so often. Always gets attention (if you want it). Reasonably accurate. That said, if you are smaller statured or used to newer, lighter triggers on your rifles; You may not like the HK91 as a shooter. The sights can be a tad ungainly to zero to your peculiar zero by modern standards. It has a fairly manageable recoil for a 7.62. Cleaning it will be not so fun.

Unless you grew up really wanting it, it might not be for you. It is outmoded by today's standards. If you're under 35 it might give you buyer's remorse, is what I'm saying. However, I appreciate mine for what it is and next to my SR-25, it will be the last rifle I part with. I don't know much about the clones but most seem to work. None of them felt as good or solid as my original.

That said....I remember almost getting an original G3A3 parts kit WITH barrel from Interordnance years ago. Like a lot of years ago. Maybe a solid decade. For $299. Still kick myself.

Hope this helps.