View Full Version : Current soft armor only options?
Hi all,
I've been looking and searching for something to provide a little protection for range time, IDPA matches, and general use, and have focused in on the idea of soft armor (level III) being all the protection I would need. Admittedly I'm new to this, so if you all feel I'm wrong about something let me know.
I would ideally like a carrier with MOLLE for M4 mag pouch attachment so I could replace my chest rig, but it seems that there are no current set ups for BALCS cut armor (my initial thought for what to use) which have this feature. Seems like First Spear and Eagle are both no longer making such systems. So the question is this: is there a product that holds soft armor only like the old Eagle CIRAS, and has MOLLE, or could I run just soft plates in another PC like the Mayflower APC? I have searched pretty extensively for this and as of yet can't find something that would be level III (providing mobility and weight savings) and have attachment points. If there were something like the new Paraclete LVBC with MOLLE attachments, it would be perfect.
So, help me out with your collective knowledge, what do you all think would be best for me?
Thanks in advance!
I know there's enough collective knowledge here to help me out!
In quick summary, what options are there for a soft armor/BALCS carrier with MOLLE attachments? Or can/should I run a PC with plate backers only?
Mayflower LPAC or LPAAC. both will take your soft armor, and plates if you want to add them. second one is full molle, first one is not. both with use the SwiftClip system for adding a rig..
Also, from the sound of it, you're looking for NIJ level IIIA as opposed to level III. Level III would be hard armor for rifle up to and including 7.62 NATO. Level IIIA is for most common pistol rounds and fragmentation (ie. 9mm-44 mag plus frag).
Mayflower LPAC or LPAAC. both will take your soft armor, and plates if you want to add them. second one is full molle, first one is not. both with use the SwiftClip system for adding a rig..
That's exactly what I'm looking for!
Is there a good online source for purchasing the soft armor inserts? If I remember they use a proprietary Velocity Systems cut. I'm not MIL or LE, but do have a CCW, is there an online source you all know if where I could purchase these inserts?
Also Jparish, you're right, that's what I'm looking for.
That's exactly what I'm looking for!
Is there a good online source for purchasing the soft armor inserts? If I remember they use a proprietary Velocity Systems cut. I'm not MIL or LE, but do have a CCW, is there an online source you all know if where I could purchase these inserts?
Also Jparish, you're right, that's what I'm looking for.
Optactical.com has a good selection. http://www.optactical.com/sparcasisar.html
Also, keep a look out on the EE. If there is something out there you really want but can't afford, isnt made any longer or its out of stock, someone is bound to have one for sale sooner or later.
I may be wrong but I think your issue will be less of a gear one, due to lack of options, and more of an employment one. What you're asking for kinda defeats the purpose of the different gear types.
The soft armor I used to use was the tan "second chance" brand ones and we would throw our plate carriers over that for applicable situations. Not to insult your intelligence but the plate carriers are ideal for stopping rounds from rifles and some belt fed weapons, something that can be a higher likelihood when clearing fatal funnels and rushing objectives under fire. It's made to be an easily donned item that can keep you moving forward without losing momentum...there's more to it that goes from physics to tactics to psychology, but that's irrelevant here.
So your soft armor is, ideally anyway, supposed to be kept slick so your plates can be worn over it. This is why I'm such a huge advocate for belt and suspension systems as well as chest rigs. Makes it easier to choose what gear you bring, layer gear and armor, etc. Your soft armor kits and BALCS utilize the sewn layered Kevlar rather than ceramic composite plates which stop, deform, and remove the terminal velocity from an incoming bullet. While the plates are good too they're obviously heavy and restrict movement. I know that in my experience we dropped plates when we got to our objective if we weren't in contact or pushed out on security. The soft armor stayed on because the armor technology makes it much more suitable for shrapnel (IED, mortar, RPG, 107mm) and more flexible. On the other end, if we were familiar with an area or rushed or a particular set of circumstances, I left my soft armor with our RBE as much as I wore it.
The reason you see such prolific use of both soft and hard armor in one massive package is the typical military politics. The old gen1 & 2 Interceptor vests you saw in OIF and a little bit in OEF were made by Point Blank (I have one of their soft armor kits as well, not as comfortable but still NIJ III rated) and were not issued with plates in the early stages of the wars. Read about Gunny Jeffrey Bohr for a little more on that. When enough guys were KIA from rifle rounds, especially from the Dragunov and SDM type rifles or AP rounds from RPK/PKM, the big push for more armor went out from the higher ups and their bosses. That's when everyone was getting issued a set of the old SAPI to insert in their Kevlar Interceptor vests and you started seeing actual armor packages for vehicles instead of the Road Warrior Special. When guys were wearing chest rigs with backers and we were getting issued those horrid BlackHawk PCs, the IED threat went up and became the biggest killer. So rather than leaving it on the ground leadership level to ensure their Grunts were using the right armor for the job (a full Humvee going on a raid will have 3-5 guys who all need different armor for this op. And by next op, that could all change) the military did what they always do.
Blanket policies to remove the possibility that someone's career is cut down because one of their guys wasn't wearing what he was given for PPE. Oh and of course uniformity. But we all know that blanket policies for all units despite their mission requirements are nothing but a waste of time and are largely counterproductive. I have a story about a LtCol and those ECM backpacks but that's for another day as well. So the mil ended up in a painful 3-4 year cycle of massive soft kits and modified SAPI plates on the front, back, and sides, and apparently diapers too though I never wore those. And since that does nothing but make our guys slower and faster to become fatigued, slower in and out of doorways and capable of carrying less mission essential gear, the massive push to make everyone safe actually got people killed. But that's how we learn.
For the TL;DR version of that history lesson, see below.
Don't get a MOLLE soft armor carrier. You want it to be slick and stay that way so your plate carrier can be thrown over it in a hurry. That also give you the ability to conceal the armor. There are Velcro type pouches you can throw on if you're doing something like EP work and need to be able to cover an egress, I just used a Mayflower kangaroo pouch for a TQ and med gear and a spare mag. But those are the most I would ever recommend doing because they can be pulled off to throw on your plates.
Look at the carriers and soft armor packages at HighCom Security, as well as the First Spear and SKD slick rigs. Also Galls.com will have a wide variety of the Second Chance and Point Blank SA kits and I bet they still have their own. Paraclete has some but it's not the same version of Paraclete that used to make gear for the 75th guys and a few Group ODAs. They're usually offered in black or white, I took my white ones and painted them light brown with a leaf stencil pattern in green. On the front and back I was able to paint my ID Sign as well as blood type in red so someone would see it if they were treating me but it was otherwise covered.
Even on your plate carrier I would recommend you try a rig and belt and keep the MOLLE slick. I don't even have MOLLE on my PC anymore except the shoulder straps. The belt is faster and the rig is easier to half-unclip to go prone or for sustained mounted ops. Just some thoughts on what worked for me.
SOW,
Thank you for the thought and the education. The more I look at options out there, the more I'm liking the First Spear sleeper, which would be slick essentially, but also allow for M4 mag carriage. I do run a "battle belt" with all my pistol and med gear, so this may be a viable combo and a better overall option. I'll need to do some re-thinking and this may be a way for me to go. I could also run a chest rig I currently have (an old Eagle one) over a slick soft armor carrier, again, maybe a better option with more modularity.
EricTheRed
01-26-15, 21:22
This article: http://www.itstactical.com/gearcom/load-bearing/slick-to-full-loadout-building-a-scaleable-and-modular-armor-system/ greatly influenced my decision making process. Hopefully it can help yours. I am also a civilian with about the same req's as you, but i wanted the ability to build it into anything that could conceivably be needed as well. So far the LPAC with a haley d3 and the EGL adapter fronts has done everything I need it too.
ETA: Just re read the title and realized you mentioned soft armor only. If I just wanted a low profile soft armor only rig I may have chosen differently, but in my limited experience the LPAC run slick works fine.
SOW,
Thank you for the thought and the education. The more I look at options out there, the more I'm liking the First Spear sleeper, which would be slick essentially, but also allow for M4 mag carriage. I do run a "battle belt" with all my pistol and med gear, so this may be a viable combo and a better overall option. I'll need to do some re-thinking and this may be a way for me to go. I could also run a chest rig I currently have (an old Eagle one) over a slick soft armor carrier, again, maybe a better option with more modularity.
so do you have any armor or plates yet? what is your budget? the Sleeper is sweet but do you really want to spend that much just to IDPA/train?
you got good suggestions above. if you'll never run plates get a good soft armor carrier and use your eagle chest rig over - excellent solution.
if you think you might want plates down the road, something like the LPAC gives you that option and you can run it slick with your Eagle c/r or jock it up for more dineros, your choice.
good luck...
This article: http://www.itstactical.com/gearcom/load-bearing/slick-to-full-loadout-building-a-scaleable-and-modular-armor-system/ greatly influenced my decision making process. Hopefully it can help yours. I am also a civilian with about the same req's as you, but i wanted the ability to build it into anything that could conceivably be needed as well. So far the LPAC with a haley d3 and the EGL adapter fronts has done everything I need it too.
ETA: Just re read the title and realized you mentioned soft armor only. If I just wanted a low profile soft armor only rig I may have chosen differently, but in my limited experience the LPAC run slick works fine.
I concur...
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