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a1madrid
01-27-15, 11:15
Do any of you guys deer hunt with your ARs? I have seen pictures of deer taken with .223 shot out of an AR but I seem kinda skeptical about it. I have always used a bolt action .270, which has served me well, but I was just wondering which .223/ 5.56 loads work best on deer.


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MBtech
01-27-15, 11:23
Nosler partition 60gr or Barnes TSX

Federal Power Shok 64 gr. SP
Federal Vital Shok 60 gr. Partition or Barnes 55 gr. TSX
Federal Fusion 62 gr.
Winchester PP
Barnes Vi-Tor TSX factory ammo

a1madrid
01-27-15, 11:26
I live in New Mexico so the deer we have out here are pretty big.... Especially some of the mule deer I have seen when out hunting. How well would these loads do on a hog?


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Chipper78
01-27-15, 11:27
You may want to check you state regulations to see if it's legal to hunt deer with 223/5.56 where you live. It is not here in Virginia, and I'm sure we're not the only state with that regulation.

brickboy240
01-27-15, 11:31
Nope. That is what the 270 or 30-06 are for.

My 223 and 22-250 are for varmints and the bolt guns get the bigger stuff.

If you already own a rifle in 308, 0-06, 270 or other "deer calibers" why chance it?

Our deer aren't even that big....and I am not taking a chance with a 223....sorry.

IraqVet1982
01-27-15, 11:36
It can be done. There are a lot of factors involved. A heavy (60+ gr) "hunting" bullet is preferred. Shot placement is key, if you hit the heart and lungs it'll drop. Distance is also key, you'll lose energy the longer the shot.

I prefer my 450bm, 308, or 300AAC.

MBtech
01-27-15, 11:39
I live in New Mexico so the deer we have out here are pretty big.... Especially some of the mule deer I have seen when out hunting. How well would these loads do on a hog?


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Will do just fine on a hog, and I agree with what others have stated be sure to check your local laws on caliber and magazine capacity also. Shot placement shot placement shot placement..

JS-Maine
01-27-15, 11:50
We have some big bodied deer here in Maine as well, and I come from a long family tradition of shooting 30-06 for deer/moose almost exclusively. With that said, I would not hesitate to use .223 but using the right ammo and waiting for the right shot is crucial. Broadside or quartering away is ideal, but any straight on bone penetration is going to drastically detract from killing power. Quartering to and trying to pass one through the shoulder is not ideal. Neither is a pelvic or hip hit, obviously. I only mention the pelvis/hip because that very scenario happened this year. The Game Wardens carry AR's in their vehicles and will dispatch road hit and nuisance animals with them. This year a close friend was able to witness, inspect, and eat some Game warden killed nuisance deer and the effectiveness was adequate. The first deer took one broadside and went down very quick. The second deer wasn't so easy as it was on the move. The first round hit the hip, blew apart, but did take the deer to the ground where it was quickly dispatched. I wish I knew what ammo he was shooting, but I would guess it was probably something similar to xm193. Not ideal.

Another interesting note is if you have watched the show Yukon Men, they shoot .223 a ton, and often for caribou.

3 AE
01-27-15, 11:55
Look what I found here on M4Carbine.net!

https://www.m4carbine.net/forumdisplay.php?202-Hunting

That is so cool having a Sub-forum that deals with Hunting. What will the Staff come up with next? :cool:

MBtech
01-27-15, 11:57
^^^^ (JS-Maine) This, a properly patient shot placed in heart/lungs and game over, just don't get cocky on distance and use the right bullet.

MBtech
01-27-15, 12:01
Look what I found here on M4Carbine.net!

https://www.m4carbine.net/forumdisplay.php?202-Hunting

That is so cool having a Sub-forum that deals with Hunting. What will the Staff come up with next? :cool:

I was waiting on one of those, go hallway patrol :nono::cool:

JBecker 72
01-27-15, 12:05
You may want to check you state regulations to see if it's legal to hunt deer with 223/5.56 where you live. It is not here in Virginia, and I'm sure we're not the only state with that regulation.

Yeah, I hate that I can't use one of my M4 rifles to take a deer here in VA. But I can use my Glock 19. Stupid.

gun71530
01-27-15, 12:06
I've killed several 200lb deer with 5.56. The key is to use a good bullet like the Federal Fusion or Barnes TSX, and keep your shots within 150 yards. Shot placement is key.

punkey71
01-27-15, 12:09
I've had great success with 70gr TSX from SSA and ASYM.




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R.P.
01-27-15, 12:30
barnes 70 grain tsx and good shot placement and you will not be disappointed. When I got bit by the ar bug years ago I sold all my traditional deer rifles and have never looked back.

MBtech
01-27-15, 12:43
barnes 70 grain tsx and good shot placement and you will not be disappointed. When I got bit by the ar bug years ago I sold all my traditional deer rifles and have never looked back.

Great thread about that https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?94628-223-Barnes-70-Grain-TSX-Performance Awesome hunting round.

Zirk208
01-27-15, 13:22
I used my 16" Colt 6920 with a 62 gr Federal Fusion round on a N. Idaho doe this last season. 40 yard shot. It worked. Lung shot, through and through. She ran for 30-40 yards and dropped.

C-grunt
01-27-15, 13:31
I went hunting at my uncle ranch in Oklahoma a few years back and absolutely destroyed a buck with my 7mm Mag. Way more than was needed. My uncle's friend had taken his girlfriend hunting that year for the first time and she dropped a big buck with a 223. My uncle and his friend, both good ole country boys, were impressed with the damage done by the 223. Next time I go Ill be using one of my ARs and ill post up some pictures.

JS-Maine
01-27-15, 13:45
I would guess that other than the AR being lightweight and handy this is exactly why the guys on Yukon Men use them. They are sustenance hunters, so the least amount of damage they can do to the meat is the goal.


I went hunting at my uncle ranch in Oklahoma a few years back and absolutely destroyed a buck with my 7mm Mag. Way more than was needed.

Malig8r
01-27-15, 13:51
I know it can be done...hell the deer in NC and some other states are the size of large dogs anyways. However, whitetail deer in MI can be pretty big and I have a concern about using such a small caliber for "medium sized game."

My dad asked me to build him a retro AR so that he could take it deer hunting and I'm having a hard time wanting to do it. He's not the best shot in the first place. He NEEDED the M16 when he was in...lol.

To each their own but when I go hunting I grab my 300 WSM.

MBtech
01-27-15, 14:10
Barnes 70gr TSX 100 yards + (exit) was slightly quarting to me, entry was right next to the opposite armpit, both lungs destroyed, doe was already dead before she took her last 20 yard staggering run.
31319

tylerw02
01-28-15, 06:51
I loaded up a few hundred Barnes TSX for friends and family a few years ago. Thus far, about 10 deer have been shot with them and the furthest one walked after being hit was about 10 yards. They are fine if you're using them with good placement and at normal ranges. If you're going to hunt open fields, take take a more powerful rifle that can shoot a longer range. In short range woods or on stalks, take the light, handy AR.


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akm4guy
01-28-15, 15:46
The natives up here in most of the villages use 223's on everything. Moose, caribou, grizz, sheep, polar bear, etc. Lots of Mini-14's and AR's in use.

phreakboy83
01-28-15, 18:39
I have shot 2 cow elk with 5.56 77gr SMK. One with 14.5 barrel at 50 yds. Walked 30 yards and fell and one with 10.3 barrel at 133 yds hard quartering away behind the shoulder. Same deal. Like all others state shot placement is key. Shoot whitetail allot also.

farmhard
01-28-15, 21:24
the .223/5.56 with proper ammunition just plain work. the biggest advantage in my opinion is quick follow up shots if necessary. hunt with confidence.

trigger45
01-29-15, 20:44
The natives up here in most of the villages use 223's on everything. Moose, caribou, grizz, sheep, polar bear, etc. Lots of Mini-14's and AR's in use.
Where is up here? A friend of mine used .22lr befor he grew up and got a license and did it the right way.

tylerw02
01-29-15, 20:45
Where is up here? A friend of mine used .22lr befor he grew up and got a license and did it the right way.

I'm guessing Alaska for the "ak" in his name.


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trigger45
01-29-15, 20:53
Well it said akm.

tylerw02
01-29-15, 20:54
akm4. But it's just a guess.


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Redbeardsong
01-29-15, 20:54
Here in Georgia, 5.56 is used to great effect with hogs and, to a lesser extent, with whitetail deer. our deer are smaller than elsewhere, but a good bullet, like Barnes Vor-Tx, will do the trick. I know one guy who took out two deer with one shot on his first AR hunt. Went through the lungs of one deer and shattered the leg of one behind it. That one required a finishing shot.

akm4guy
01-29-15, 21:43
Where is up here? A friend of mine used .22lr befor he grew up and got a license and did it the right way.

Alaska, my bad. Guess I better finish my profile.

trigger45
01-30-15, 07:07
It's ok.

6920_enthusiast
01-30-15, 08:51
I don't see why you couldn't use 5.56, it has more ballistic energy than a .44 magnum.

svh
01-30-15, 09:25
NEVER AGAIN. Colt 6920, 16"bbl, with 5.56 63 gn soft points. Two deer, two different results.

1: Doe at +- 80 yds.

Shot 1 - standing, broadside, right through the boiler room, she took off. Shot was through and through with little blood trail, and no expansion.

Second shot - quartering at me, on the run, a few inches behind the first, through the diaphragm and into the abdominal cavity. Shot didn't exit, lodged in ribs on opposite side. Minimal expansion minimal blood trail. Still running.

Third shot - standing on wobbly legs at about 25 yds, just behind the left eye. Large exit wound, dropped like a sack of hammers.

No doubt she would have expired from shot number one .... but after how long ? No indication of a good hit. Wasn't sure of placement, no visible signs of entry/exit.

2: Decent buck at walking speed at +- 50 yds. Same loadout, next day.

Shot 1 - No visible signs of a hit, no blood trail. Miss ??? I don't think so, but it happens.

Shot 2 - Through and through, decent exit splatter, bright red bubbly blood, little hair/tissue. Lung shot. Tracked for over 4 hours, and what had to be a couple miles to property line. Blood trail quickly dissipated after a few hundred yards, but kept finding spots here and there. Never did recover the animal. No doubt dead well onto the neighboring property. This was NOT from a lack of tracking skills, been hunting deer for just over 40 years.

Soooo, I drove 100 miles home to get my M77 30.06 with 155 gn. soft points, came back the next day and harvested a trophy buck, one round through the heart at about 60 yds. Saw the reaction of the deer getting hit, saw the "pink mist", and saw him crash a few yards from impact, NONE of which I saw with the 5.56.

Personally, I don't think the 5.56 has the ass to ethically harvest a deer sized animal consistently. NEVER AGAIN. For this reason, I'm in the process of putting together a 300 AAC, based on a SIG M400 pistol lower with a Advanced Armament 100884 9 inch upper and either a Saker or Omega can.

http://i1301.photobucket.com/albums/ag101/svh12/IMG_20141120_123630270_HDR_zpsfd74f65c.jpg (http://s1301.photobucket.com/user/svh12/media/IMG_20141120_123630270_HDR_zpsfd74f65c.jpg.html)

BufordTJustice
01-30-15, 09:44
Svh, I understand what you've relayed, and I don't doubt your account, but ammo selection is everything and your ammo sucked.

There is plenty of ass to the 5.56 when using proper ammo. See this thread: https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=94628

tylerw02
01-30-15, 09:56
I watched guys wound deer with a .300 Win Mags and not kill them. Guess they should switch to .338 Win Mags?


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OIPactual
01-30-15, 11:17
I have used my ar's on deer for a few years now. I use 70 tsx bullets and all but one have been drt (that one went 35 yards with good blood). I hate hearing that the .223 is to small for deer, you just have to get a good shot. If you don't have a good shot, you shouldn't shoot anyway. I feed my family each year with three deer, and never once have I come up short because of the .223 round.

I'm in Michigan where the deer are around 175-250 pounds. I get complete pass through shots every time.

Aim small miss small.

svh
01-30-15, 13:25
Svh, I understand what you've relayed, and I don't doubt your account, but ammo selection is everything and your ammo sucked.

There is plenty of ass to the 5.56 when using proper ammo. See this thread: https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=94628

I understand and agree with everything you said. Ammo and shot placement. Ideally I wanted heavier gn. bullets, but it didn't work out that way..... I've harvested well over 100 deer, mostly with a firearm, 30 cal, 7mm, etc., and FOR ME, the 5.56 just doesn't SEEM to do the job efficiently. JMO.

I really wanted it to work well for me, but it didn't. and I personally wouldn't recommend it anyone. Besides, it's giving me an excuse to go the 300BLK rout. :D

Respect
Steve

BuzzinSATX
01-30-15, 16:50
Svh, I understand what you've relayed, and I don't doubt your account, but ammo selection is everything and your ammo sucked.

There is plenty of ass to the 5.56 when using proper ammo. See this thread: https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=94628

These two conflicting posts sum it up well for me...5.56 sucks with the wrong bullet, even with great shot placement, while it performs great with the right bullet. I used to hunt deer and antelope with a 22-250 and found the same thing. had issues with light bullets, but when I went to a solid copper bullet and all the critters pretty much dropped in their tracks.

MBtech
01-30-15, 16:53
So pretty much use the right ammunition and hit the right spot and deer dies and goes to the freezer?

That is just too simple.

tylerw02
01-30-15, 16:54
These two conflicting posts sum it up well for me...5.56 sucks with the wrong bullet, even with great shot placement, while it performs great with the right bullet. I used to hunt deer and antelope with a 22-250 and found the same thing. had issues with light bullets, but when I went to a solid copper bullet and all the critters pretty much dropped in their tracks.

Spot on.

Right bullet for any caliber. I have a friend that was older that used .22-250 and lost four deer in one year. Turned out he had varmint ammo. I also watched a guy lose a deer with a .300 shooting the deer at close range. It was a light fast bullet and he had bad placement and the bullet didn't hold together.


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svh
01-31-15, 15:55
How about some ammo recommendations ? Although I reload several calibers, I don't do 5.56 yet, so factory if possible.

Thanks.

punkey71
01-31-15, 16:05
http://store.asym-ammo.com/223_SOLID_DEFENSE_X_70_gr_Barnes_Copper_TSX_p/223n4-1.htm

http://www.southwestammunition.com/product_p/55670stsx-match.htm

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phreakboy83
01-31-15, 16:10
I have used BH 223 77gr SMK blue box and kills vary. 5.56 chambered 77smk works better in my experience but still shot placment and soft tissue entry is key.

farmhard
01-31-15, 16:16
.62 gr federal fusion works great.

BufordTJustice
01-31-15, 18:06
How about some ammo recommendations ? Although I reload several calibers, I don't do 5.56 yet, so factory if possible.

Thanks.
Ted Nugent has a 70gr TSX load for a very reasonable price. Haven't used it yet, though.

70 gr Hornady GMX TAP, 55gr Hornady GMX TAP, 62gr TSX (also available from THE NOODGE), 50gr TSX (but only from black hills), Federal 62gr TBBC in 5.56 (XM556FBIT3).

Those are the great ones.

tylerw02
04-10-15, 19:38
No caliber works in the brush.


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tylerw02
04-10-15, 19:47
That's inconsistent with every scientific test that's been done on the subject. Essentially all calibers deviate too much to consistently hit the target. 7mm has nothing to do with your 6.8.


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Team Kabob
04-10-15, 20:00
^^ very true sir. I have both a 6.8 and 7mm. Just saying if in the event you hit a "small" limb not seen in a scope you have a better chance with a larger gun. Just my 2cents. It's all about ethical hunting at the end of the day.


-)---> ¥
Got him!

tylerw02
04-10-15, 20:01
Neither one fare well. You don't shoot in that situation.


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hr00544
04-10-15, 20:52
Aim small miss small

Honda4828
06-06-15, 22:26
I've had great results with prvi partisan 75gr match and mk262 black hills. Shot placement is the key to hunting with most any caliber rifle.

derfarhar333
07-15-15, 10:35
I know people who let their young kids use 223 for whitetail. Just use the correct ammo.

ReRun
09-04-15, 08:55
I tried it last year for whitetail. Used the Barnes 70gr TSX. Had an easy 80 yard shot, got a good hit on the deer and subsequently lost it. It ran into thick brush about 15 yards from where I hit it and it didn't leave a big enough blood trail to track it through those conditions. I decided to go back to my .308 which has consistently dropped them in their tracks or kept them within 40 yards of the shot.

I'm sure the .556 would work better if the terrain was more open but I learned my lesson on that one.

tylerw02
09-04-15, 09:52
You probably missed. Larger bullets, depending on how constructed, is more forgiving.

A single anecdotal event really doesn't say much. If you're confident with a .308, that's what you should use.


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ReRun
09-04-15, 10:54
You probably missed. Larger bullets, depending on how constructed, is more forgiving.

A single anecdotal event really doesn't say much. If you're confident with a .308, that's what you should use.


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Well, That was my experience, YMMV.

I shoot sub moa with that rifle (bcm ss410), it was 80 yards away and I found some blood with bubbles in it and a clump of goo that came out with it. Given, it had been raining and was sprinkling at the time so the trail was harder to find, which again goes back to the fact it didn't leave a large enough blood trail or drop fast enough for the terrain.

I'm gonna go ahead and say it was a good hit but thanks for that theory.

Will it kill them? Sure.

Is it as effective as a larger bullet? No.

tylerw02
09-04-15, 11:42
You can disagree all you want, but a single instance of anecdotal evidence without knowing exact placement doesn't mean it's inadequate. For Pete's sake, I've watched .300 Win Mag shooters have the same experience you describe.




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Claycow
09-04-15, 11:43
You missed. Accept it.

ReRun
09-04-15, 12:43
Haha, wow did I accidentally get redirected to arfcom? Your responses to my post have added absolutely 0 to this thread other than trolling for an argument and I now feel dumber for having been sucked into it.

Pretty sure that the op asked for experiences on this. I provided mine and my personal decision after that experience. Take it for what it's worth and don't come on here telling me I missed. Obviously this round is so deadly the only conceivable conclusion must be that I missed. To the contrary, you do know what bubbles in blood means right?

No, you can't make a conclusion based on one data point. Otherwise we'd be praising how great DPMS is after a single range trip. If you read my post I said yes it works but other rounds are more effective. Are you disagreeing with that?

No one came here to piss in your Cheerios. I'm just saying that I tried them and prefer bacon and eggs.

That is all. OP, sorry for your thread getting derailed.

tylerw02
09-04-15, 12:51
It means you missed ;)


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ReRun
09-04-15, 12:58
It means you missed ;)


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Haha. I'll admit, that made me laugh.

Pilgrim
09-04-15, 13:54
I'm starting to think that old school fragmenting bullets (64gr. Winchester PP) work better on deer... Man you talk about a blood trail! But barrier blind bullets still work just fine for me, nothing (5 deer) has ever made it more than 25 yards.

Either way, wait till the deer is perpendicular to the bore axis so you can get both lungs and a part the heart, and the deer is down in under 15 seconds.

BufordTJustice
09-05-15, 12:26
I'm starting to think that old school fragmenting bullets (64gr. Winchester PP) work better on deer... Man you talk about a blood trail! But barrier blind bullets still work just fine for me, nothing (5 deer) has ever made it more than 25 yards.

Either way, wait till the deer is perpendicular to the bore axis so you can get both lungs and a part the heart, and the deer is down in under 15 seconds.
Well, I'm going on a Florida hog hunt a week from today (Saturday, 9/12). Going to be using my AR with 70gr GMX 5.56 TAP in the morning and my Tikka T3 in .308 with Federal 165gr Trophy Bonded Tip in the evening.

I'll report back. They're seeing what look like some 280+ pound boars on the trail cams.

cspackler
09-12-15, 09:41
Well, I'm going on a Florida hog hunt a week from today (Saturday, 9/12). Going to be using my AR with 70gr GMX 5.56 TAP in the morning and my Tikka T3 in .308 with Federal 165gr Trophy Bonded Tip in the evening.

I'll report back. They're seeing what look like some 280+ pound boars on the trail cams.
It's past morning.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQFxmAdyKcg

Milspec
10-09-15, 19:14
Bought a 5.56 Colt LE6920 last spring and got some fragmenting ammo for it. Went to our place in South Carolina when the season opened on August 15th. We lease land there and this year we had a new tract that we were told had a lot of deer on it. It didn't disappoint. The third day of the hunt, I had focused on an ambush point I thought would yield good results. I was 25 feet up in a tree and shot down on an angle proportionate to 52 yards. The deer(5 total) were heading straight at me and the point man was a spike buck.

I waited till he stopped and was looking around and I took the shot where the left shoulder and neck join. The bullet destroyed the left shoulder and went on in to explode the heart. The buck fell back on his butt and never tried to get up. It was like it was hit with lightning. The bullet never exited and the buck dressed out to 95 lbs.. We only found very small pieces of the bullet. I want to go back at the first of November and I want to get a broadside shot and see what happens.

I have chased deer down and finally got them killed even while they had a 30-06 bullet in their heart. I was happy with the results and wouldn't hesitate to take another shot like that.

BufordTJustice
10-09-15, 22:33
It's past morning.....
Lol. I only got to use my Tikka .308. Right around 95-100 pound sow. 70+ yard snap shot, with Federal 165gr TBT. Resilient little shit flipped completely over by the bullet impact, but still got up and wandered another 20 feet before calling it quits. No lungs left and only half a heart after the bullet did its job.

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/09/ea237ac0737901524a3a930babb3b31c.jpg

johnson
11-25-15, 14:27
Got a 6 point buck in Missouri. He was 85 yards away and fell over on the first shot. I was aiming high at the liver because I wanted to save the heart but found out later that I got him in the spine/shoulder area. The second shot was in the neck which I couldn't recover. Both hit bone and didn't go through the other side.

http://i.imgur.com/rq5MXex.jpg

Retained most of the weight. Federal Fusion .223 62gr

http://i.imgur.com/k9XssWP.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/YvQxEdR.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/wqVipmT.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/gKn5Exz.jpg

punkey71
11-25-15, 20:42
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/11/25/4341e612c2f5c5bac164d7f3e6ba5f5a.jpg

Exit wound from a buck this AM.

ASYM 70 gr TSX. Double lung shot. Jumped up, ran 15 yds and fell over dead.

11.5" BCM with a can @ 150 yds.

6th deer with this load - 5 last year and this is this years first. All shots 125-175 yds although this was the first with an SBR.

All shots lung/heart or neck and only two have ran - ~15 yds in each instance.


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MBtech
11-26-15, 13:21
These last two posts pretty much sum up the whole thread. Shot placement and ammunition used. Put those together and it's a done deal. Congrats on your venison fellas thanks for sharing what rounds you used to make good kills and even better GOOD FOOD!

Wake27
11-26-15, 14:55
Got a 6 point buck in Missouri. He was 85 yards away and fell over on the first shot.

He fell over on the first shot but you hit him again?


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Mr blasty
11-26-15, 20:11
He fell over on the first shot but you hit him again?


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Must have been a Chicago deer. :p

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johnson
11-29-15, 20:36
He fell over on the first shot but you hit him again?


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Yes. Fell over != DRT.

farmhard
12-04-15, 07:20
Taken at 70 yards with Federal Fusion 62 gr MSR36338. More picture in the hunting picture section.

Rekkr870
12-08-15, 21:03
Shot a fairly decent doe today in my field. She was ranged at 192 meters. Ran 20 yards and she gave it up.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20151209/7c450d79160d059e1d913c6ffacbb0bd.jpg

13.7" Noveske Infidel with perm M249F flash hider, using 62 grain Fusion

Vortex Razor 1-6
Geissele SD-E


Entrance before skinning
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20151209/729c2fd8eac26381ef4a91eab651cce5.jpg

Entrance after:
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20151209/4928dddfaeb8f92eeb5b880254e60590.jpg

Exit:
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20151209/df63ab696af3569c50353777721d19c6.jpg

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Freethought
02-04-16, 13:29
I live in New Mexico so the deer we have out here are pretty big.... Especially some of the mule deer I have seen when out hunting. How well would these loads do on a hog?


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In my experience quite well as long as one exercises a degree of shot discipline. I've done a lot of hog removal in both Texas and Calif utilising AR platforms in .223 and the performance has always been adequate , but then I also stay at 200 yards and under when using .223/556 on hogs and use a properly constructed slug for the purpose.

Deer? With proper placement it should work adequately ( again given the proper loadings) for some deer , larger Muleys and big whitetails...I dunno.

WillBrink
02-04-16, 13:34
In my experience quite well as long as one exercises a degree of shot discipline. I've done a lot of hog removal in both Texas and Calif utilising AR platforms in .223 and the performance has always been adequate , but then I also stay at 200 yards and under when using .223/556 on hogs and use a properly constructed slug for the purpose.

What did you use from what barrel length? I'm hoping to do some hog hunting in the near future with my AR.

nick1169
02-04-16, 14:20
This same debate always comes up along with the 9mm AR variants. (Also heard from plenty of poachers taking deer with .22lr) Either can do the job with proper ammo choice and shot placement. Some people have had excellent experience in using either, other no so much. What it comes down to is weather or not your choice is ethical. I live in MI and I'm not sure about anyone else, I know that with a proper shot and ideal conditions that I can place a .223 or 9mm perfectly in the heart/lungs and provide a humane kill. But ideal conditions are not always guaranteed here. Ultimately it is your choice for what caliber you choose to use (provided it is legal in your state) but myself IMHO I prefer to use something that removes all question for a quick humane kill.


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Kansaswoodguy
03-02-16, 23:01
I have been using 223 Rem for 20 years on whitetail. I like 55 grain barns or GMX but soft tips where the norm for years. If your shooting a 16" or shorter barrel I would avoid the 70-75gr bullets not sure you can push them fast enough for reliable exspantion.

Rusty Pheasant
03-04-16, 11:56
I've taken 2 deer with my 11.5" AR pistol shooting a 70gr Barnes TSX. Both were taken with neck shots and no bullet was recovered. I will try to chronograph this load up and see how fast I'm pushing the 70gr TSX. However according to these guys, the 70gr Barnes works just fine with SBRs

" The expansion threshold for this bullet is approximately 1800 fps. Even fired from very short 10.5" barreled carbines, this expansion velocity threshold is maintained out past 200 yds."

http://store.chencustom.com/223_SOLID_DEFENSE_X_70_gr_Barnes_Copper_TSX_s/92.htm

http://i1069.photobucket.com/albums/u468/rmhills86/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsjakvacyg.jpeg (http://s1069.photobucket.com/user/rmhills86/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsjakvacyg.jpeg.html)

punkey71
03-04-16, 12:12
I've taken 2 deer with my 11.5" AR pistol shooting a 70gr Barnes TSX. Both were taken with neck shots and no bullet was recovered. I will try to chronograph this load up and see how fast I'm pushing the 70gr TSX. However according to these guys, the 70gr Barnes works just fine with SBRs

" The expansion threshold for this bullet is approximately 1800 fps. Even fired from very short 10.5" barreled carbines, this expansion velocity threshold is maintained out past 200 yds."

http://store.chencustom.com/223_SOLID_DEFENSE_X_70_gr_Barnes_Copper_TSX_s/92.htm

http://i1069.photobucket.com/albums/u468/rmhills86/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsjakvacyg.jpeg (http://s1069.photobucket.com/user/rmhills86/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsjakvacyg.jpeg.html)
I chrono's ASYM and SSA 70 TSX loads from my 11.5" BCM a year ago.

From memory, they left the muzzle in the 2450 range.

Chrono'd at 200 around 1950.

Should expand out past 250 from an 11.5.

That load/gun is my deer rig as well.

Farthest shot last year was about 165 yds. Double lung shot pass through that ran 20 yards and collapsed.

Eurodriver
03-05-16, 10:29
Where do you guys hunt where your shots are being taken at 70 yards?!? I see deer at 400+!

.46caliber
03-05-16, 10:45
Where do you guys hunt where your shots are being taken at 70 yards?!? I see deer at 400+!

Happens all the time here in MO when hunting the woods and hills. The long shots only happen across feed/crop fields. Just depends on the terrain. Muzzleloader and shotgun is big here.

nick1169
03-06-16, 10:28
Where do you guys hunt where your shots are being taken at 70 yards?!? I see deer at 400+!

Same as what .46 caliber said. I'm in MI and most deer are taken here within 100yds. The woods and brush is pretty dense. Unless you are hunting in a large crop field that is clear enough for 100+ yard shot. Not saying that people here do not hunt deer at long distance, it's just the majority is less than 100yds.


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sva01
03-06-16, 14:56
Same as what .46 caliber said. I'm in MI and most deer are taken here within 100yds. The woods and brush is pretty dense. Unless you are hunting in a large crop field that is clear enough for 100+ yard shot. Not saying that people here do not hunt deer at long distance, it's just the majority is less than 100yds.

Michigan here as well. I'm prepared for a 250yd shot but I've never shot, at a deer, over 100yds yet. Farm fields will give you multiple hundreds of yards but that is less common than hunting in the woods.

FrankW
03-12-16, 21:03
I killed got 3 deer with my AR this season. .223 federal 64 grain soft points. None walked more that 20 yards after being hit. Shot placement was in the chest cavity. The soft point evicerated the heart lungs on impact. I was pleased with the rounds performance. 2 kills were within 50 yards and one was 150 yards. Just an FYI.

HighDesert
03-12-16, 21:58
I killed got 3 deer with my AR this season. .223 federal 64 grain soft points. None walked more that 20 yards after being hit. Shot placement was in the chest cavity. The soft point evicerated the heart lungs on impact. I was pleased with the rounds performance. 2 kills were within 50 yards and one was 150 yards. Just an FYI.
Was that the fusion msr?

FrankW
03-21-16, 14:48
Was that the fusion msr?

Yes it was

Eurodriver
05-11-16, 06:49
Bumping this thread. Obviously deer hunting isn't for a while but I'd like to start developing loads now.

I have a choice between a 20" 308 and a 20" 5.56. Both have Krieger barrels and both are stupid accurate.

I like the 5.56 because it drops way less. With a 200 yard zero the 5.56 drops 8" at 300 yards, but the 308 drops 15". I suppose I could get a LRF and eliminate this issue, but how effective would 5.56 be at 300 yards and what bullet would get it done at that distance on <200lb bucks?

Ryno12
05-11-16, 07:06
I'm not a huge advocate of 5.56 for deer hunting. Sure, it can get it done but if there's better tools in the tool box, use them. IMO, whenever there's a question between 5.56 vs 308 for deer hunting, the answer is always 308.

abso
05-11-16, 11:29
I have used BH 223 77gr SMK blue box and kills vary. 5.56 chambered 77smk works better in my experience but still shot placment and soft tissue entry is key.

I'm interested in your rational on using a 77smk. Won't the bullet fragment and ruin the meat? I've picked up federal fusion 62gr for as little as 40cpr which seems to be substantially better for hunting.

phreakboy83
05-11-16, 12:03
5.56 SMK will penetrate the rib cage then shrapnel inside the vital area. It actually does not ruin much meat at all compared to a 270 or 308/300 which usually destroys both shoulders and sometimes part of the back straps if hit high. Last season I had even more succees with the new 77 TMK in 5.56. Killed every deer I shot with it last year. I may have some photos of deer skinned out and what the chest area looked like after it was skinned. I think I have a pic of an elk killed with TMK also. Will post if I can find them. I was using 14.5 and 10.3 DD barrels suppressed and unsupressed.

cobra246
05-11-16, 13:00
This topic comes up quite often. And its been a huge debate about whether the .223/5.56 is an ethical choice for big game. But frankly if you're comfortable with it and its reasonably capable of taking the target animal at a reasonable range then i dont see why not use it.
Btw heres my hunting rifle
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160511/8a18205c68500f800bd4c709b89af972.jpg

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phreakboy83
05-11-16, 14:56
39431

phreakboy83
05-11-16, 15:00
3943239433
Son shot his first spike

phreakboy83
05-11-16, 15:04
39434
Can't find the pic I was thinking of but found these of the 2 cow elk shot with 5.56TMK

fledge
05-11-16, 16:24
Elk with 556? Where was that pic taken? Though impressive, it's illegal in CO to use a caliber that size on elk.

phreakboy83
05-11-16, 16:28
Texas. Private Hunting Ranch.

BufordTJustice
05-12-16, 08:25
I agree that, with proper ammo selection, 5.56 is fine. But there is also the ability to use a 16" 308. Throw a can on that and it becomes an attractive option.

But I've taken some very large and angry hogs with 5.56 (and other calibers) and many of them were DRT. None who ran, ran appreciably further than kills with 300 or .308.

My favorite hog rounds are Hornady TAP 5.56 70gr GMX and Federal XM556FBIT3 62gr TBBC.

Eurodriver
06-02-16, 16:53
I know this has been beat up, even by me, but can someone tell me:

If you have a .223 semi auto capable of hitting sub-MOA out to 600 yards (I do) and you were hunting southeastern deer not getting any bigger than 180lbs...

What would be the absolute furthest you would shoot a deer, and what bullet/round would you use?

Here's my issue. Where I hunt in SC there is one stand that has about 3 shooting lanes that go out to 150 yards max. I'm not concerned about this. A second one has a maximum range of about 350 yards. This affords pretty good cover and if I see a big buck I can get out of the stand and get a bit closer if I have to.

But the last one is almost 600 yards. I know a .223 isn't wise that far so I'm just curious how close I can get and still make a clean kill using a .223 assuming I get a perfect vital hit.

Rekkr870
06-02-16, 17:11
I know this has been beat up, even by me, but can someone tell me:

If you have a .223 semi auto capable of hitting sub-MOA out to 600 yards (I do) and you were hunting southeastern deer not getting any bigger than 180lbs...

What would be the absolute furthest you would shoot a deer, and what bullet/round would you use?

Here's my issue. Where I hunt in SC there is one stand that has about 3 shooting lanes that go out to 150 yards max. I'm not concerned about this. A second one has a maximum range of about 350 yards. This affords pretty good cover and if I see a big buck I can get out of the stand and get a bit closer if I have to.

But the last one is almost 600 yards. I know a .223 isn't wise that far so I'm just curious how close I can get and still make a clean kill using a .223 assuming I get a perfect vital hit.
I've shot deer with a .223 AR up to 275 yards. I'd have no problem shooting one if it was at 350 yards as well; I've still got about 600ft lbs of energy at that range. I do agree that 600 yards is a bit of a hike for the .223 and hunting.

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MBtech
06-02-16, 18:22
I know this has been beat up, even by me, but can someone tell me:

If you have a .223 semi auto capable of hitting sub-MOA out to 600 yards (I do) and you were hunting southeastern deer not getting any bigger than 180lbs...

What would be the absolute furthest you would shoot a deer, and what bullet/round would you use?

Here's my issue. Where I hunt in SC there is one stand that has about 3 shooting lanes that go out to 150 yards max. I'm not concerned about this. A second one has a maximum range of about 350 yards. This affords pretty good cover and if I see a big buck I can get out of the stand and get a bit closer if I have to.

But the last one is almost 600 yards. I know a .223 isn't wise that far so I'm just curious how close I can get and still make a clean kill using a .223 assuming I get a perfect vital hit.

My #1 choice would be Barnes TSX, (I'd even look into the Remington Hog Hammer for deer hunting)
Nosler Partition
DRT Teminal shock

Personally around 300 yards would be my max, the more under 300 the better.

Best of luck this year I know I can't wait!

travellightfreezeatnight
06-02-16, 19:47
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160603/9c157c552bc9ae8d56cf7e9ec8cdfb07.jpg

62 gr fusion at roughly 50 yards.

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nick1169
06-03-16, 08:01
.223 @ 600 yards will only have about 150ftlbs of energy. I would say 300 yard max for deer. Just for comparison, a .308 has about 1,000ftlbs of energy @ 600yds.


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pinzgauer
06-03-16, 08:54
My #1 choice would be Barnes TSX, (I'd even look into the Remington Hog Hammer for deer hunting)
Nosler Partition
DRT Teminal shock

Personally around 300 yards would be my max, the more under 300 the better.

Especially with the TSX, you can usually find out the minimum velocity for reliable expansion

Eurodriver
06-03-16, 09:31
What bullet is best for longer distances? I cant find any load data for XBR for any of those bullets MBTech mentioned either.

loaded605
06-03-16, 10:24
I would not take a shot over 150 and that is with a Barnes TSX/TTSX out of a longer barrel 18+. Here in South Dakota you could have really long shots so I never would use an AR unless I was stalking and going to be close or in a tight area. Deer can be massive too. My kids will probably use this type of gun and load for their first time, but only on shorter shots.

e z money
12-06-17, 18:48
49103
I harvested this buck last Monday from 100 yards, using Winchester super X 55 grain factory ammo. It only went about 15 feet, then dropped and bled out.

R.P.
12-07-17, 09:22
Nice buck!

Rusty Pheasant
12-07-17, 09:34
49109

Doe taken this season. 60 yard shot using the Barnes 70gr TSX out of my 11.5” BCM. Took out both lungs and the top of the heart. She ran 30 yards.

jaholder
12-27-17, 13:58
Friend of mine took 2 does this year with his cheap build carbine, Primary Arms Optic and Speer 62 grain Gold dots. 100 yards shots, both deer dropped inside 30 yards, both were heart/lung shots.

I haven't been able to get out for the past couple of years, but next year I plan on using either one of my AR's or else my Stevens 200 in .223

Jsp10477
12-21-18, 22:25
We usually use 69gr tmk’s. I’ve found with good shot placement they enter, frag, deposit all their energy in the vitals and 90% of the ones I’ve shot all drop. Longest I’ve had one run was 50 yards. I keep shots with a 223 under 200 yards. Just for reference here’s a small doe my son shot through the neck with a 50 gr vmax at 100 yards. Straight through the spine. Heck of an exit wound.

55120

HKGuns
12-22-18, 14:35
Sure they will work. There are a ton of variables involved.

I prefer to use a higher powered round to allow for a higher margin of error to ensure an ethical kill.

Pappabear
12-22-18, 17:53
I have a Buddy and all his friends use 22-250 or .223 for small Coues Deer in AZ. A 243 would be the smallest I would try, but many a folk have knocked down deer with the smaller pills. I thought our laws were greater than .22 cal, which can be interpreted differently.

PB

Esq.
12-27-18, 10:20
Have killed several smallish Texas Whitetails with the 5.56. We use the Winchester 64 grain Power Point. Cheap, readily available, does the work- have never lost an animal. We shoot them moderately close though- 100 yards or less typically and often out of blinds with good accuracy etc....