View Full Version : MARS work...
LowSpeed_HighDrag
02-24-15, 20:49
I am planning on sending my Rail Gun to MARS Armament in Utah towards the middle of April. I have read some good things about them, but they don't seem to have a lot of press out there. Steve Morrison has been very good with bis communication and has promised me a very short turnaround on my pistol.
I am curious if any of you have had work done by them and what your opinions are?
Also, what do you 1911 guru's think about my build plan:
Base pistol: Colt Rail Gun Series 80
Dehorning
Golf Ball front strap and flat mainspring housing (includes barstock housing, true and high cut front strap and housing )
Contour/Blend/Fit Harrison Design TAC Thumb Safety https://shop.harrisoncustom.com/extreme-service-tac-thumb-safety
Colt 1911 Reliability package (Government model)
Colt Trigger Job
Cerakote in Black
Does this sound like a solid build for a duty 1911?
I am planning on sending my Rail Gun to MARS Armament in Utah towards the middle of April. I have read some good things about them, but they don't seem to have a lot of press out there. Steve Morrison has been very good with bis communication and has promised me a very short turnaround on my pistol.
I am curious if any of you have had work done by them and what your opinions are?
Also, what do you 1911 guru's think about my build plan:
Base pistol: Colt Rail Gun Series 80
Dehorning
Golf Ball front strap and flat mainspring housing (includes barstock housing, true and high cut front strap and housing )
Contour/Blend/Fit Harrison Design TAC Thumb Safety https://shop.harrisoncustom.com/extreme-service-tac-thumb-safety
Colt 1911 Reliability package (Government model)
Colt Trigger Job
Cerakote in Black
Does this sound like a solid build for a duty 1911?
Search for "Mars" guns in the 1911 sub forum here. You will find lots of posts. Steve is good people. I have a Colt series 70 there right now getting the axiom package and plan to have a black army built by him someday.
my favorite builds that he does are the black army repros, they are awesome and in my opinion his signature base gun. Search black army in this sub forum as well for an awesome right up on one Steve built.
ETA https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?65778-MARS-THUG-Colt-s-Government-Model-Series-70
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?72972-MARS-armament-builds-lets-see-em
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?23513-Colt-quot-Black-Army-quot-by-MARS
I have a gun done by him. The attention to detail is very good as is all of the machining. I went with the MARS golf ball dimpling (the NOT pointed version), and am honestly surprised by it's "grippy-ness". You can drag the front strap across your face and nary a scratch, but if you grip the pistol, your skin fills the divots and it is anchored as well as any checkered pistol I've ever shot. Coupled with the Gen 2 housing having the same treatment and the grips he sold me that match, I honestly don't know that I'd benefit from it being any "grippyier", and I have pretty tough hands. I REALLY like the high cut front strap, the attention to detail, and the quality of the parkerized finish. I didn't Cerakote it because it's going to be a user for at least the first half of its life before getting a make over and possibly being handed down as the young ones grow up. Unless I have another one done by him eventually...
Check a few pages back for the thread on MARS 1911s. There was a period where he was hurting with his backlog, but if you follow him on FB it seems like he's sending more pistols out then ever, and they all look great. I should note that when I got my pistol, I was convinced it shot low, and I wasn't really impressed by it. I sent it back to him, he test fired it almost right away, produced a target, and shipped it back. A couple more trips to the range, and it didn't shoot low anymore. Needless to say, I was kind of embarrassed...
Hunter Rose
02-25-15, 06:37
Steve is nice guy. He seems to do excellent work by the reviews of people who have pistols from him. It's getting the pistol that is the hard part.
Do not believe promises of a short turnaround.
arbninftry
02-25-15, 11:39
I have one of his guns. They are top notch, and he has quite a following of loyal customers.
If you check out the MARS guns threads you will find some happy customers and great guns.
It's great stuff - short turnaround time is relative (at one point they had a nearly 14mo backlog on complete pistol builds). With almost all good 1911 stuff, patience pays in quality, so I don't consider that to be a significant negative.
I too, can't really figure out why anybody would run a nice 1911 without a magwell at this point either; the ILAPs are just plain awesome.
unclestevie45
02-25-15, 22:31
I've had a Colt there since April 2011. I asked for the THUG package and a couple other options. My most recent conversation with Steve was earlier this month. He said "3 or 4 weeks."
Fingers crossed.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
02-25-15, 22:49
Steve "guaranteed" me at 10 Business days….
unclestevie45
02-25-15, 23:24
I hope that he is able to keep that guarantee.
But I hope he finishes mine first :)
LowSpeed_HighDrag
02-25-15, 23:25
I hope that he is able to keep that guarantee.
But I hope he finishes mine first :)
I would be very irritated to learn that others were being quoted 10 days and I was sitting at 1.5 years….
unclestevie45
02-25-15, 23:31
I'm thinking about it now, and I can't recall being quoted a set time. That being said, I did not expect it to be this long of a wait.
I do remember a phone call from him, about two years ago, and he was beginning the build then. We hashed out a few details.
I can't complain about contact-he has been great about answering texts. He has sent some pictures also of the progress of the build.
I am sure it will be worth the wait. I just hope that he is able to have the gun done in the next week or so, as he said in our most recent conversation.
IZinterrogator
02-26-15, 01:06
I had an Axiom done a few years back, took a little over 26 months if I remember correctly. Once we were actually in the building phase, I got regular texts and picture updates and it went rather quickly. It was worth the wait, which I understand has gone down since he stopped taking new work for awhile until he got caught up. I'm considering having him install a Wilson BP ambi safety on mine now, wonder how long that would take. I have a Colt Series 70 repro in the safe waiting to be worked on someday when I have that kind of money lying around again.
I would be very irritated to learn that others were being quoted 10 days and I was sitting at 1.5 years….
Lshd, are you LE .mil etc...? I believe Steve makes duty guns a priority which may account for the 10 day quote.
I would be very irritated to learn that others were being quoted 10 days and I was sitting at 1.5 years….
Me too. I was quoted 6 months, that was over 4 1/2 years ago.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
02-26-15, 13:24
Lshd, are you LE .mil etc...? I believe Steve makes duty guns a priority which may account for the 10 day quote.
I am LE and former MIL, and this pistol will be used as a duty pistol.
Me too. I was quoted 6 months, that was over 4 1/2 years ago.
Am I reading this correctly? You have been waiting 4.5 years?
Am I reading this correctly? You have been waiting 4.5 years?
Yep, 4.5 years and counting for a THUG. Steve has been good about responding to texts and I have received some recent pics of work in progress. Hopefully it will be in my hands soon. Not sure I would go this route again.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
02-26-15, 14:56
Yep, 4.5 years and counting for a THUG. Steve has been good about responding to texts and I have received some recent pics of work in progress. Hopefully it will be in my hands soon. Not sure I would go this route again.
Thats insane, I hope the THUG is worth it for you. I'm hesitant to trust their quote at this point, but no other major smith is taking work or has a wait time under a year....
Me too. Try http://bullockcustom.com, he is near Steve and MARS does some machining work for him. I have heard good things and I believe his wait times are measured in months not years
Hunter Rose
02-26-15, 19:04
Mine is pushing 5 years at his shop. Frankly, I've run out of patience.
It's great to offer priority to LE/MIL duty guns, but if you get so much work from them that all other guns are perpetually on the back-burner it's poor business practice in my opinion. John Harrison has a much better system where he just puts your name on a waiting list and when he's actually ready to work on it is when he has you send the pistol in. Once my name came up on his list my pistol was only gone for 10 weeks.
unclestevie45
02-26-15, 20:37
I am pretty sure I would not go down this route again either.
Four years is a long time to wait. And now I'm depressed because both dsa and Hunter Rose have had their guns there longer than I have.
theJanitor
02-26-15, 21:04
My good buddy has had a pistol there since Nov 2011
I have another gun with a another well known 'smith and it is taking longer than he quoted too. Steve has always promptly responded to my texts and I am confident the gun will exceed my expectations when it arrives.
Dos Cylindros
03-01-15, 12:43
Steve built me an Axiom a few years back. I sent the gun to him and was quoted 10 months. In reality it took 18, and that was when he was not so busy.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
03-03-15, 01:53
I am going to take Steve's word.
According to Steve, he is able to fit in LE guns (10 day wait) that are only having minor work done (not complete builds). As most of his work is done by machining and on schedules, he accepts pistols based on where he is at in his machining schedule. My CRG will be going to him in April for the following work:
-Furnish, true and golf ball steel mainspring housing, blend to frame; Hi Cut, true
and golf ball front strap (With Gen 2 ILAP Magwell)
-Contour, Blend, and Fit H-D Single Safety
-MARS COLT Model O Reliability Package
-Fully dehorn pistol for carry
-Cerakote Pistol in MARS Black
-***NOTE: Duty gun, we will expedite in 10 work days from receipt of pistol
I had asked him for a few other options, and he told me that he could not do anymore as that would be very unfair to everyone that has been waiting FOREVER. I thought that was more than fair.
theJanitor
03-03-15, 11:31
Just to be clear, and to tie this into your other thread...You fired your first 1911 a few weeks ago, and now you're building a "duty gun"?
LowSpeed_HighDrag
03-03-15, 12:34
Just to be clear, and to tie this into your other thread...You fired your first 1911 a few weeks ago, and now you're building a "duty gun"?
You betcha.
Read. A crapload. Start with stuff from Hilton Yam, LAV, and Ken Hackathorn; I've seen - and been guilty myself - of building an ostensibly duty oriented 1911 and still speccing all sorts of dumb or non-ideal stuff onto it. That said, with MARS packages it's nearly impossible to go full retard, as their basic to mid-level stuff (Axiom and THUG) are practical over flashy.
Read. A crapload. Start with stuff from Hilton Yam, LAV, and Ken Hackathorn; I've seen - and been guilty myself - of building an ostensibly duty oriented 1911 and still speccing all sorts of dumb or non-ideal stuff onto it. That said, with MARS packages it's nearly impossible to go full retard, as their basic to mid-level stuff (Axiom and THUG) are practical over flashy.
This.^ I went full circle from wanting every newest way to do a 1911 to eventually asking for Steve's opinion and essentially having an Axiom built. And I'm very happy with it.
I've purchased three 1911's from Steve. The first one took a few weeks. The second set of Colt, THUGs with golfball grip took several years.
Although it was frustrating at times the guns are absolutly excellent. Accurate, perfect fit up, finish etc. He is a good guy and well intentioned. He just gets slammed with orders. I know he stopped taking orders for a while so he could get caught up. Perhaps he is caught up.
One note of advice, his work is great but adding features like blended magwells appear to take much more time. Keeping it simple helps expedite the process.
Hunter Rose
03-19-15, 13:17
My pistol is apparently done so there is one less in line for the guys still waiting.
unclestevie45
03-19-15, 19:38
I got a text last month saying mine was almost done. I sent shipping info and am waiting on a final invoice.
I recently received my invoice as well.
unclestevie45
03-26-15, 23:26
Final invoice came Tuesday night. Bank check sent overnight yesterday. Notification today that a FedEx shipping label had been 'created'. Estimated delivery date is next Tuesday. Almost exactly four years from when the gun was shipped.
I'll be excited when it does actually ship.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
04-06-15, 19:55
Talked with Steve tonight, he seemed very honest and knowledgeable. I'll be sending my 1911 in tomorrow, I'm all sorts of excited for the results.
my Rana took over two and a half years, thug close to that, i've had a 9mm series 70 there for over two years. His work is very very good, he builds a really good fighting gun but i will never say he is amazing with timelines. If you want a morrison gun send and forget, harder to do for some then others. His guns are awesome, ned christiansen is at a 7 year wait right now and chuck is at a fairly lengthy wait as well. Last time i checked Jason and the heirloom boys are around a year or so out, I will say that Jason and Ted, steve Bailey etc are probably one of the best with scheduling from a custom gun shop. Anyways yeah long waits are par for the course and adding a ton of features only lengthens that. a year or so ago he had almost 70 guns in his shop in line to be built. He is popular for a reason but just realize like a long ride at a theme park there is usually a line for a reason, you are welcome to go to the ride with out a line but i think you get what you wait for...
I was about to get worked up when I saw ten days, then I saw the rest of the thread and laughed. I've had a gun over there for at least 3 years for an Axiom with some extra work. Someday. In the meantime, lost my mind and bought a Wilson. So, well, that.
theJanitor
04-13-15, 12:00
The big difference between MARS and other 'smiths, is in the time he has your pistol, and I ASSume that is because of the way he schedules specific tasks in the shop. Some makers work on a couple of pistols at a time, start to finish. Some work on half a dozen, and schedule "sight install days", or "checkering days". A smith with 70 pistols IN THE SHOP, must be scheduling "checkering weeks", or in Steve's case, "golfballing weeks". We all know setup time is huge in a machine shop....
The longest a smith has ever had a 1911 of mine was about a year and a half. But he told me it would be long, and I told him it didn't matter. He was traveling the country training, and could only work on my pistol in his spare time. The others, no matter how long the list was, or how many years it takes for my name to come up on the list, only has the gun for 6 months or so.
Steve's saving grace is that he builds a damn nice pistol
LowSpeed_HighDrag
04-13-15, 13:31
The big difference between MARS and other 'smiths, is in the time he has your pistol, and I ASSume that is because of the way he schedules specific tasks in the shop. Some makers work on a couple of pistols at a time, start to finish. Some work on half a dozen, and schedule "sight install days", or "checkering days". A smith with 70 pistols IN THE SHOP, must be scheduling "checkering weeks", or in Steve's case, "golfballing weeks". We all know setup time is huge in a machine shop....
The longest a smith has ever had a 1911 of mine was about a year and a half. But he told me it would be long, and I told him it didn't matter. He was traveling the country training, and could only work on my pistol in his spare time. The others, no matter how long the list was, or how many years it takes for my name to come up on the list, only has the gun for 6 months or so.
Steve's saving grace is that he builds a damn nice pistol
I would say your assessment is spot on. Steve was able to quote me the "10 Day LE" turnaround time because the little work I was having done fit into his machining schedule.
I totally understand the frustration of members here hearing about a 10 day build, but understand that my work is so minimal compared to the custom build most are having done.
Well, if it helps, John Harrison is taking work with a backlog of 5 years right now. :)
again steve's wait isn't outside the norm for people like harrison, chuck, ned, etc. His time management is not the best and i'll never tell you it is. But there is a reason he is that back logged.
Things that don't help your cause:
1. changes throughout the build. i get to hear about the people who call and constantly change the color, grips, want more machining or different machining, different parts, etc. I hear this from not only steve but other smiths as well as guys who build bolt guns about people who can't make up their minds
2. comparing your build to anyone else's, I know we hit more then a couple speed bumps in my rana with parts from manufacturers being on backorder, or not fitting right, I also wanted a series 70 slide on a rail gun frame which didn't help my cause but I was willing to deal with any extra wait.
3. comparing wait times between smiths, if someone has a 6 month wait on full builds and they are a one man shop there is usually a reason. If you don't like the wait times or prospect of their being a longer then expected wait... don't send your gun. I keep trying to get steve to go to a waiting list format but people want their gun there because that means they'll get it done, but when you jump in the back of a line of 50 plus pistols... it might be a while.
theJanitor
04-14-15, 11:54
When you send a pistol in for a build, it is absolutely your responsibility to determine if the timeline is right for you. Back in '08, axioms were a stocking pistols, and I was a fool for not grabbing one when Steve said they were available. MARS' timelines are laughable, and as Big Joe mentioned, time management may be an issue. I do believe that a wait list is appropriate for the type of business he's in. Having your gun in a shop, automatically makes you think that it's being worked on. Combine that with botched time estimates, and the frustration level can get pretty high. This is not the first thread to highlight this.
Custom shit (sometimes) takes a long time. You can't get around that. But, the smiths and customers have to do their part to communicate properly, even if it's to say, "the timeline's blown". Also, having your shit in a pile BEFORE commissioning a build is important. Asking the best builders in the country to make something but not knowing what is wanted, is ridiculous.
I've had a custom hunting rifle on order for five years now. He told me last month that he's not ready for the base rifle yet. No big deal, because he's communicating succinctly with me, and told me from the start that the timeline will be open ended. I have a custom knife on order for three years now, too. I've also been bitten in the ass because I didn't want to wait the six months for some additional work on a pistol to be done. I sent it to a local smith who eff'd it up. Now it's back at another shop getting squared away.
I'm gingerly wading into the custom knife pool, and I'm finding the problems with makers' timelines are the same there. No matter how long the project takes, as long as the maker is keeping to the timetables, everyone remains happy.
And for reference (and this will probably get some panties in a twist) here's a excerpt from another forum:
About 3 years ago I decided it was time to start looking for a base gun. I emailed Jason at Heirloom about the build details, pricing and what they recommend for a base gun. I searched Gun broker for about a year and settled on a 50's era Commercial. I sent the pistol to Heirloom to secure my place in line. When Ted called saying it was my turn at the bench I was more than ready. I gave Ted the specs and about 3 weeks later this is what Ted sent me.
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2823/9705382757_6f8cc9fe65_b.jpg
yep like i said, the heirloom boys have their timelines nailed down tight. they are good at what they do
When you send a pistol in for a build, it is absolutely your responsibility to determine if the timeline is right for you. Back in '08, axioms were a stocking pistols, and I was a fool for not grabbing one when Steve said they were available. MARS' timelines are laughable, and as Big Joe mentioned, time management may be an issue. I do believe that a wait list is appropriate for the type of business he's in. Having your gun in a shop, automatically makes you think that it's being worked on. Combine that with botched time estimates, and the frustration level can get pretty high. This is not the first thread to highlight this.
Custom shit (sometimes) takes a long time. You can't get around that. But, the smiths and customers have to do their part to communicate properly, even if it's to say, "the timeline's blown". Also, having your shit in a pile BEFORE commissioning a build is important. Asking the best builders in the country to make something but not knowing what is wanted, is ridiculous.
I've had a custom hunting rifle on order for five years now. He told me last month that he's not ready for the base rifle yet. No big deal, because he's communicating succinctly with me, and told me from the start that the timeline will be open ended. I have a custom knife on order for three years now, too. I've also been bitten in the ass because I didn't want to wait the six months for some additional work on a pistol to be done. I sent it to a local smith who eff'd it up. Now it's back at another shop getting squared away.
I'm gingerly wading into the custom knife pool, and I'm finding the problems with makers' timelines are the same there. No matter how long the project takes, as long as the maker is keeping to the timetables, everyone remains happy.
And for reference (and this will probably get some panties in a twist) here's a excerpt from another forum:
About 3 years ago I decided it was time to start looking for a base gun. I emailed Jason at Heirloom about the build details, pricing and what they recommend for a base gun. I searched Gun broker for about a year and settled on a 50's era Commercial. I sent the pistol to Heirloom to secure my place in line. When Ted called saying it was my turn at the bench I was more than ready. I gave Ted the specs and about 3 weeks later this is what Ted sent me.
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2823/9705382757_6f8cc9fe65_b.jpg
I want those grips!!!
Well, got an invoice from Steve today with final details to finish up! So hopefully in a few weeks a new Mars Axiom+
It may have been almost 4 years, but I'm pretty sure it'll be worth it.
N
unclestevie45
08-13-15, 19:11
My THUG indeed arrived, back when Steve promised it would.
As for my basis of knowledge, I have owned a number of 1911's over the years, to include many that most of us would consider to be on the 'higher end' of 1911's. I still have a SA Pro, and it is one of the best guns I have ever owned or fired.
I picked the gun up around the time we started one of our departmental quals, so I had it on the range for the better part of two weeks while I was teaching. A number of my friends shot it. All ammo through it thus far has been Winchester white box 230 grain ball.
The gun, in almost every respect, is what I had hoped it would be. Aesthetics are top notch, with a black cera coted slide and parkarized frame. The white ring on the front sight is VERY visible, and the MARS rear sight gives a sharp and distinctive picture. The MARS bushing is finger tight but very well fit.
Steve talked me out of fitting the barrel, as well as tightening the frame to slide. I thought that if I'm spending this much on a gun, I should have that done. Based on the accuracy this gun has shown, Steve was right. This is one of the most accurate guns I have ever shot. I am amazed at the accuracy. I can't say that enough-stock Colt barrel, and no extra 'accuracy' work done to it-just the magic that MARS puts into it's guns.
The beavertail has a touch of play but I may be being picky. It does it's job beautifully.
I was, initially, not pleased with the trigger work. Yes, it broke right around 4 pounds but the reset was longer than I like, and not that firm. That has worked itself out and the trigger is on par with the rest of the gun.
The golf ball cuts on the front strap and the mainspring housing are good. It's not 25 lpi checkering but it works. And it doesn't tear up my covering garments.
I retrospect, I should have asked for a mag well. That is not part of the THUG package and I thought it would be fine without it. I've had other 1911's without them and they have been fine. But, on this gun, I kind of wish I had had Steve put one on. He has told me he can easily do this, in a short amount of time. For now I'll leave it like this though.
Finally, the grips Steve shipped the gun with are incredible. Sadly, my very good friend coveted them. I owe him a debt that I can never repay, and I gave him the grips off the gun. We may, actually, be even now. I reached out to Steve to purchase a new set as they are that good. Not too much grab but just enough as well as the 'just right' thickness.
I give the gun an A plus. Despite the pain of the long wait, this gun was worth it. Others have said that its the subtle things that MARS does to a gun that make them special. I didn't fully understand that until I had this gun for a month or so.
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