View Full Version : Building an SBR from an existing lower I own
Hi,
I was curious about getting a tax stamp for a lower that I already own so I can put a 10.5" upper on it. Do I need to give the lower to a class 3 dealer until I get the stamp for it? Or keep it and get it engraved once I get a stamp?
I have an NFA trust already executed and ready to go
Thanks
Scott
Keep it while you wait for your stamp. It's not an SBR until there is a qualifying upper on it.
Hi,
I was curious about getting a tax stamp for a lower that I already own so I can put a 10.5" upper on it. Do I need to give the lower to a class 3 dealer until I get the stamp for it? Or keep it and get it engraved once I get a stamp?
I have an NFA trust already executed and ready to go
Thanks
Scott
You can also get your lower engraved now while you're waiting. Just submit your form1. When you get your stamp you're good to go. Don't overthink it.
Great, thank you for the help
Scott
I know leaving my home state with NFA stuff is a pretty big PITA. Is it ok to put a 16.1" OAL upper on an engraved NFA lower and be ok? Or once a lower is engraved is it stuck in state?
Scott
You're fine with an upper that's over 16" since it's no longer considered an SBR. You still have to follow any state laws regarding firearms, however.
It sounds like you should do a lot more reading before you make the leap. It's not rocket surgery, but there are some important bits you don't want to get caught up on.
I know leaving my home state with NFA stuff is a pretty big PITA. Is it ok to put a 16.1" OAL upper on an engraved NFA lower and be ok? Or once a lower is engraved is it stuck in state?
Scott
Really? It's just filling out ATF Form 5320.20. Not sure how long it takes to return the Form 20 these days, but it's good for a year.
Really? It's just filling out ATF Form 5320.20. Not sure how long it takes to return the Form 20 these days, but it's good for a year.
^^ this ^^
It may be an inconvenience, but it's a long way from being a PITA. I have forms already filled out, including 1/1/ and 12/31/ in the date fields. Each fall, I can simply print them, write the year, sign and date. You can mail them in, fax them in, or email them in. I've even reworked the form so that all 8 SBRs fit on a single form. I already have forms for all of 2015 for the four states that touch NC. Sometime this fall, it'll take me <5 min to apply for all of 2016 for every SBR I own.
Yeah thanks, I've done done reading. when I travel, I don't have any time frame, and. Can be on the road for months at a time. I have a home in Chicago, where NFA stuff isn't legal. In 2013 the law changed, and maybe a trust in another state can transport an SBR into illinois, but I'm not about to do that.
I know the law, and that anything with a 16.1" OAL isn't an SBR. We all know the government doesn't exactly use clear logic when ruling on things which is why I asked if putting a 16.1" upper on a registered NFA lower is good to go out of home state.
Maybe PITA is the wrong wording, but with my travel habits and visits to Chicago, it's not something I want to deal with.
Scott
I know the law, and that anything with a 16.1" OAL isn't an SBR. We all know the government doesn't exactly use clear logic when ruling on things which is why I asked if putting a 16.1" upper on a registered NFA lower is good to go out of home state.
Just to clarify (and I think you know the laws and just didn't type what you were thinking.
The barrel length is 16", while the OAL is 26".
A couple things to support the explanation. First, from the ATF's SBR FAQ:
Q: If I remove the short barrel from the registered SBR or SBS, is the receiver still subject to NFA transfer and possession regulations?
If the possessor retains control over the barrel or other parts required to assemble the SBR or SBS, the firearm would still be subject to NFA transfer and possession regulations. ATF recommends contacting State law enforcement officials to ensure compliance with state and local law.
Q: Does the installation of a barrel over 16 inches in length (SBR) or 18 inches in length (SBS) remove the firearm from the purview of the NFA? If so, is this considered a permanent change?
Installation of a barrel greater than 16 inches in length (SBR) or 18 inches in length (SBS) will remove the firearm from the purview of the NFA provided the registrant does not maintain control over the parts necessary to reconfigure the firearm as a SBR or SBS.
Q: If I remove the short barrel from my SBR or SBS, may I move the firearm across state lines without the submission of ATF Form 5320.20, Application to Transport or to Temporarily Export Certain Firearms?
If the registrant retains control over the parts required to assemble the SBR or SBS, the firearm is still be subject to all requirements of the NFA. ATF recommends contacting law enforcement officials in the destination state to ensure compliance with state and local law.
Q: May the short barrel on an SBR or SBS be replaced with a long barrel for hunting or other purposes, with the intent of replacing the short barrel?
Yes, and you will not be required to again register the firearm before replacing the short barrel. ATF recommends written notification to the NFA Branch when a firearm’s configuration is permanently changed or removed from the purview of the NFA.
The "maintains possession of" often raises a question as to what that means. The best answer I've seen on it came from one of the ATF letters:
http://i751.photobucket.com/albums/xx151/thegreghorton/Mobile%20Uploads/FE3D3E43-3B12-48FC-8263-4076D89DC143_zpsrxhwl0db.jpg
So...hope that helps. You're definitely in the clear as far as NFA/non-NFA is concerned. It's only an SBR when configured as such, unless you have all the parts and no other legal way to use them
Q: May a FFL or an individual legally possess the parts to manufacture an SBR or SBS as long as no firearms are actually assembled?
A FFL (Type-7 or Type-10) who pays the Special Occupational Tax (SOT) may possess parts required to assemble NFA firearms. A non-licensee or FFL who has not paid the SOT is required to register any NFA firearm via an ATF Form 1 (5320.1) prior to acquisition of the parts required to assemble such firearm.
Hey thank you BigWaylon, lots if good info there, and yes thanks for correcting my careless wording, bbl length as opposed to OAL. Yes, as long as I am not in possession of the parts to complete the SBR, I am free to bring an NFA engraved lower to states that don't prohibit that type of firearm.
Scott
Most all of this has been addressed in the NFA area. I would take a few minutes to look around.
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