Educate me on firearm safes

[WickedWillis]

I am in the process of closing on purchasing my very first home. When I receive the earnest and appraisal money back, I plan on purchasing my first real safe as well. I am pretty uneducated on what is good and bad, as well as reputable manufacturers. One of my local customers, Ironman safe, makes from what I can tell high quality safes. I have also looked at Liberty, Bighorn, and a few other big box manufacturers. My price ideally is from $900-$1200, because I want to do it right the first time here. I have two long guns currently, but I will of course be adding more in the future, and I also own six handguns. Which I may be adding to as well. I would like to store my handguns in their boxes in the safe, unless this could cause moisture or other issues that is. What are your guys recommendations here? My needs are:

6-10 Rifles and shotguns. I need to be a tad flexible for the future here.
6-12 Handguns. I don't see myself buying that many more handguns honestly. My EDC and HD handguns won't be in the safe.
Good firewall. I am in a fortunate are when it comes to fires, but accidents do happen
Recommendations on ammunition storage

Anything else that I am not thinking of here? Thank you guys for all your help on everything, this is a fantastic and helpful community.

Off topic, anyone know if NFA laws are restricted when it comes to residences very close to schools? That may be another thread all together though :D

[SilverBullet432]

Check out this liberty safe selection tool!

http://m.libertysafe.com/safe-selector-question.php?qid=1

[officerX]

Check out this liberty safe selection tool!

http://m.libertysafe.com/safe-selector-question.php?qid=1

Thanks for that!

[WickedWillis]

Check out this liberty safe selection tool!

http://m.libertysafe.com/safe-selector-question.php?qid=1

So I am assuming liberty is GTG then?

[SilverBullet432]

Ive heard good things. I dont have one. So ill wait until the "pros" chime in. I too, am looking for one.

[GH41]

Whatever you do don't put much faith in what a safe manufacturer says the safe's capacity is!! Sure you can stuff 24 rifles in a 30" safe if you stack them like cord wood! Buy at least twice as much safe as you think you will need.

[philcam]

I just replaced my Cannon safe with a Superior Safe. The only reason I made the swap was because of size. I did quite a bit of research before buying. My budget was the same as yours.

Understand one thing, unless you are buying the higher end Fort Knox or the Graffunder safes, most residential security containers (the aren't really safes) are pretty much the same. The exception to the rule being www.sturdysafe.com I really think the sturdy safe is the best bang for your buck, but I didn't buy one because it was still a bit out of my price range and given your budget, it will most likely be out of yours too. I do like my Superior, but I'm having a bit of buyer remorse by not saving my money a little longer and buying the sturdy. Buy once cry once I guess.

Cannon, Winchester, Liberty, Superior, Browning and Bighorn safes that are in your price range will all be made of 12-14 gauge steel and maybe a have 3/8 plate door. If the safe has a composite door and not a solid plate, ask the dealer to remove the inner door liner. You might be surprised how flimsy the door becomes. I prefer the solid plate. Safes in your budget will have sheet rock for the fire rating. Cannon and Bighorn will be foreign made.

Anyway, the security of your firearms should be multi-tier with the safe being only one part. Consider an alarm system, dogs, etc. For the location of the safe, I wouldn't put it on display. Try and hide it in a closet etc. Certainly bolt it down. I put mine in a corner where the side wall would make it a bit more difficult to pry the door. I realize all this won't stop a pro, but at least it's going to be difficult for the meth head smash and grab guys.

Look on craigslist. I saw some really good safes going for half the price of new or less. I just had a very specific size I needed for my location and while I found some great buys, none would fit where I wanted to put the safe.

This 30 minute youtube video has some good info.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltK-bDbADa8

[7.62NATO]

...........................

[Clint]

Buy quality and get a size or two bigger than you think you'll need.

Scratch that; get one size below totally ridiculously big.

[Rayrevolver]

I went with a BF AMSEC which is now full. Try to buy something bigger than you think you will need.

The AMSEC models come with a door organizer which can hold 2 long rifles and 4 pistols + multiple mags. If anything, try to get a safe that comes with the door organizers installed.

Edit: Congrats on your first house!

These are the brands I narrowed my search down to after looking real hard at the Chinese safes from Steelwater Safes (who will definitely have a big safe in the ~$1300 range).
Superior
Zykan (a dealer who also makes his own safe, very helpful on the phone)
Sun Welding
Amsec

I went with a smaller but I feel like higher quality Amsec (found a dealer on Ebay for best deal). It is a beast, but I need more room. FYI - Handguns in boxes will take up a lot of space.

[Clint]

Also, pistol hanger racks like this are handy.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/474x/2c/ab/27/2cab275a0ccddb3623afe4a105851d90.jpg

http://www.amazon.com/GunClub-Hanger-Original-Handgun-Hangers/dp/B00AWHLTYM/ref=pd_sim_sg_1?ie=UTF8&refRID=096KDXSRCRKZWA47WMCC

[SteyrAUG]

Whatever you do don't put much faith in what a safe manufacturer says the safe's capacity is!! Sure you can stuff 24 rifles in a 30" safe if you stack them like cord wood! Buy at least twice as much safe as you think you will need.

And make sure you have room for cameras, jewelry and other non gun valuables.

[TAZ]

And make sure you have room for cameras, jewelry and other non gun valuables.

1+ to this and every other person who suggested getting the biggest safe you can afford. You may not think you will need to put other things in there, but as the years go by you'll be surprised at what will be stuffed into your safe. I bought what I thought was too big a safe and now I'm wondering where to stuff things and how to access them. This is especially true if you get into reloading and want to store your primers and powder someplace more contained than a cabinet.

In the end the safe is just one layer of security. Given time it will be defeated by cheap tools from Harbor Freight so don't go thinking that all is good. Think about insurance riders to cover valuables and such that can still get stolen by a determined enough bunch.

[SkiDevil]

I would check-out the Liberty Centurian models. They are assembled in Mexico but offer good value. They will be in the higher range of your budget though.

Like most things in life you do get what you pay for generally speaking. The higher priced safes are better made, use thicker gauge steel, and have a greater resistance to forced entry and fire/ heat.

I purchased a Liberty safe recently and I am pleased with the safe so far. If you are looking at listed safe capacity bear in mind that if the capacity is listed at 10 long guns then it really means 5. Take your time and consultant with a reputable shop. They will educate you on what models fit your needs.

I spent more than I planned, and like others wonder if I should have bought something bigger. But in the end, my current safe serves my current needs. As to the futility of buying a RSC versus a real safe. I look at it this way, what is the likelihood of a professional thief breaking into my residence? Not very high. A standard quality safe will offer a greater level of security from prying hands and from the typical break-in smash and grab.

[SomeOtherGuy]

Understand one thing, unless you are buying the higher end Fort Knox or the Graffunder safes, most residential security containers (the aren't really safes) are pretty much the same. The exception to the rule being www.sturdysafe.com I really think the sturdy safe is the best bang for your buck, but I didn't buy one because it was still a bit out of my price range and given your budget, it will most likely be out of yours too.

I've had a Sturdy safe for about 7 years and am very happy with it. It's not a TL-15 or better, but I think it's far above the sporting goods store type RSCs. If it's in your budget, I would consider it.

However, having moved this safe twice and seeing your comment that this is your first house, I would encourage you to think about when and where you might move again. Moving a quality safe is an enormous hassle and significant cost. Not all moving companies will do it, and the ones that will are generally going to charge a premium one way or another. If I were starting again in a house that I didn't plan to stay in for decades, I would look seriously at one of the "Safes" that can be taken apart, like Zanotti. The security may not be as high, so it will depend on what you're storing and how much of a theft risk you have generally. On the flip side, consider installing something permanently into the house and treating it as part of the house when you sell it. That seems to happen a lot with offices that use business record safes.

You need to decide between some options:
1) A truly high quality safe that will resist serious attack. This will cost $5k and up and will be so heavy that most movers cannot move it. But it's high security. Remember that seriously determined thieves may simply go to armed robbery/hostage taking, if you have something that valuable.
2) An inexpensive RSC that will keep out children and meth-heads, but not stop smarter thieves. Many are light enough to be moved by movers, but still a hassle.
3) A take-down RSC with about the same level of security as #2 but much greater ease of moving. Someone who's likely to move houses more than once a decade should seriously consider this, unless you have NFA items or other unusually valuable stuff to store.
4) I would rate a Sturdy safe as halfway between 1 and 2 in all aspects.

Whatever you decide, try to keep it out of sight both at delivery and in use, and bolt it down to a concrete slab if you can.

[WickedWillis]

I just replaced my Cannon safe with a Superior Safe. The only reason I made the swap was because of size. I did quite a bit of research before buying. My budget was the same as yours.

Understand one thing, unless you are buying the higher end Fort Knox or the Graffunder safes, most residential security containers (the aren't really safes) are pretty much the same. The exception to the rule being www.sturdysafe.com I really think the sturdy safe is the best bang for your buck, but I didn't buy one because it was still a bit out of my price range and given your budget, it will most likely be out of yours too. I do like my Superior, but I'm having a bit of buyer remorse by not saving my money a little longer and buying the sturdy. Buy once cry once I guess.

Cannon, Winchester, Liberty, Superior, Browning and Bighorn safes that are in your price range will all be made of 12-14 gauge steel and maybe a have 3/8 plate door. If the safe has a composite door and not a solid plate, ask the dealer to remove the inner door liner. You might be surprised how flimsy the door becomes. I prefer the solid plate. Safes in your budget will have sheet rock for the fire rating. Cannon and Bighorn will be foreign made.

Anyway, the security of your firearms should be multi-tier with the safe being only one part. Consider an alarm system, dogs, etc. For the location of the safe, I wouldn't put it on display. Try and hide it in a closet etc. Certainly bolt it down. I put mine in a corner where the side wall would make it a bit more difficult to pry the door. I realize all this won't stop a pro, but at least it's going to be difficult for the meth head smash and grab guys.

Look on craigslist. I saw some really good safes going for half the price of new or less. I just had a very specific size I needed for my location and while I found some great buys, none would fit where I wanted to put the safe.

This 30 minute youtube video has some good info.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltK-bDbADa8

Thank you for all of this information here. I will watch this video when I have time today, probably on my lunch break. The largest group I want to deter here is the meth head smash and grab scumbags that are all over this area. I am looking into home security also for the house. I don't have a ton of nice things, but they are still my things and I would hate to see someone steal them. I have looked at getting the safe mounted in a closet where it would still be plenty hidden.


I recommend Graffunder and AMSEC. You can't go wrong with either. Buy once, cry once. I've seen too many threads on stolen/burned guns.

I am going to a dealer in Spokane this weekend and they are a Liberty and Graffunder dealer. I am not opposed to buying top of the line, it would just depend on how long that I would have to save. Thank you for your feedback.

[nova3930]

I bought a vault door from these guys that I'm very pleased with. I expect their free standing safes are the same quality. No sheet metal in their stuff, the outer skin on my door is 1/2" of solid steel.

http://www.smithsecuritysafes.com/pages/6foot.html

[RCI1911]

With a $1200 budget and having minimum long guns, this is the safe I would go with unless you want to cram a bunch of extra "non-gun" stuff in it. http://www.homelandsafes.com/closet-gun-safe-level-V.html I would have bought one of their safes if my old home's floor could support the weight. Great fire rating, 18 locking bolts, and 10 gauge sides. Most major brands are 12 gauge sides that you can hack into with an axe if you wanted to.

[SilverBullet432]

You need dis:

:sarcastic: local safe builder. Hes done all the vault doors ive seen here. Well built.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=IM0bzDHRXLU

[hotrodder636]

Great safes but you need to make sure the floor can take the load one of these will put down.
I recommend Graffunder and AMSEC. You can't go wrong with either. Buy once, cry once. I've seen too many threads on stolen/burned guns.

And as previously stated, whatever the quantity of guns the safe is designed for (ie 32 gun safe), cut that number nearly in half for realistic storage space.

[SomeOtherGuy]

Great safes but you need to make sure the floor can take the load one of these will put down.

Absolutely, and remember that a safe should be bolted down, ideally to a large concrete slab. Here in the north that means the garage or basement, and a safe that goes into the basement isn't coming out easily unless it's a walk-out. In the south I know it's more common to have the first floor on a slab so you have more options. But basically, a safe should be on a concrete slab, wherever that is in your house.


And as previously stated, whatever the quantity of guns the safe is designed for (ie 32 gun safe), cut that number nearly in half for realistic storage space.

Yes. Anything with a pistol grip takes up extra space, and anything with a grip and on optic takes up double. I think the # of gun ratings are plausible if you own only iron-sighted bird guns and old style rifles. For longer term storage you can pack guns in tight by having them alternating left/right and even muzzle up/down, but that is not convenient for access.