View Full Version : Walmart fight at Cottonwood, AZ
El Vaquero
04-11-15, 12:22
Holy Cow.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=6e3_1428698048
Warning - Item Chaotic fatal brawl and shooting at a Walmart caught on dashcam might contain content that is not suitable for all ages.
SpeedRacer
04-11-15, 13:24
End of the world loonies. What a cluster...I'm surprised only one ended up dead.
On a side note, at 8:00 did that officer really throw his Glock to the other officer? Yikes.
Holy Cow.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=6e3_1428698048
Holy cow indeed!
And this is why you don't go to Walmart after dark.
This video should be shown to all the idiots that ask:
"Why didn't he just cuff my baby, he didn't have to tadd him, he didn't need to shoot him, etc"
Shows you just how sideways things can go at any moment.
Dango man...
End of the world loonies. What a cluster...I'm surprised only one ended up dead.
On a side note, at 8:00 did that officer really throw his Glock to the other officer? Yikes.
I saw that too and thought: "did that cop really just throw his gun?"
Whiskey_Bravo
04-11-15, 13:46
Hot damn!!! That escalated quickly. Those were some seriously persistent Walmart people there(some sort of drugs or alcohol involved). Multiple tasing and ass whippings by the LEOs and I think being fat and fatigue was the only thing that slowed those couple of guys down.
Unbelievable more didn't get shot. Prayers for the officer.
Whiskey_Bravo
04-11-15, 13:47
Yeah I caught the gun throw, hopefully they review that procedure in the aar.
SilverBullet432
04-11-15, 13:47
Looks like a taser being thrown? Crazy shit..
That family is well known to LE in my home town of Boise, ID. They claimed to be a family of religious musicians and used to live in a bus in town but supposedly were never violent, just strange. They would beg in front of grocery stores for food and money and collect food from churches downtown.
I think the cops used a lot of restraint, they could have shot a lot more of them.
Whiskey_Bravo
04-11-15, 13:54
That family is well known to LE in my home town of Boise, ID. They claimed to be a family of religious musicians and used to live in a bus in town but supposedly were never violent, just strange. They would beg in front of grocery stores for food and money and collect food from churches downtown.
I think the cops used a lot of restraint, they could have shot a lot more of them.
And probably should have when even after the shots they didn't all drop the ground.
Mauser KAR98K
04-11-15, 14:11
"Well....Everyone was kung-fu fightin..."
SilverBullet432
04-11-15, 14:13
"Well....Everyone was kung-fu fightin..."
Lol.. Just :lol:
Mauser KAR98K
04-11-15, 14:17
Lol.. Just :lol:
The family that's in jail together, stays together.
That got out of hand real fast. I had to watch the press conference video just to figure out what was going on there. That family should feel lucky that they weren't all shot. That was a taser that was tossed to the officer towards the end. Just another example of how difficult a job in LE can be, dang.
Averageman
04-11-15, 14:40
And on a related note:
http://www.wnd.com/2015/04/nearly-12-of-citys-crime-comes-from-local-walmart/#5jfk4tvQOTkkz6Vx.99
PORT RICHEY -- Port Richey police says nearly half of the city's crime is coming from its local Walmart, and the agency has come up with a game plan to combat the problem.
Police say 46 percent of Port Richey’s crime happens at the Walmart on U.S. 19 and Ridge Road. That’s four out of every 10 crimes. Police are getting called out to the store two times a day on average.
Wal Mart; You really have to love what they bring to the commuinity.
Remember when these folks would drop in to Mayberry?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Darlings
The Darlings (usually pronounced Darlin's) lived in a mountain shack somewhere in the mountains neighboring Mayberry. The good-natured, but trouble-makingAppalachian clan, led by patriarch Briscoe Darling (played by Denver Pyle) usually came into town when they had some sort of problem that Sheriff Andy Taylorhad to resolve. Briscoe was the widowed father of five grown children (four sons and one daughter) who all lived together, and each had a different musical talent. All together, the members of the family formed a bluegrass band. They had their own set of values and rules and had little concern for matters that went on outside of their family. Due to their secluded lifestyle, their lack of social grace, and their superstitious belief in mountain lore, they were perceived by the people of Mayberry as being somewhat backward. Their arrival in town usually meant trouble for Sheriff Taylor and Deputy Barney Fife, despite their friendly relationship with the family.
You have to be vigilant when it comes to family Bands.
Deputy B. Fife.
Does anyone know that if during the struggle for the officer's handgun he was shot with his own weapon?
Hoping for a full recovery for all of the officers involved. They showed a lot of restraint given how chaotic that looked in the video.
Does anyone know that if during the struggle for the officer's handgun he was shot with his own weapon?
Hoping for a full recovery for all of the officers involved. They showed a lot of restraint given how chaotic that looked in the video.
According to what I read, it was his own gun.
MountainRaven
04-11-15, 15:37
Stupid should hurt. How stupid do you have to be to start a brawl with a bunch of cops over somebody you pushed?
In this case, stupid was lethal.
Averageman
04-11-15, 15:54
Stupid should hurt. How stupid do you have to be to start a brawl with a bunch of cops over somebody you pushed?
In this case, stupid was lethal.
I don't think Lethal, but someone was wounded and perhaps a lot more should have been shot.
Did anyone else notice the "Good Samaritan" that kept jumping in to the frey everytime the Cops seemed to have their hands full?
El Vaquero
04-11-15, 16:12
"Well....Everyone was kung-fu fightin..."
Good one. That's exactly what happened. Glad the boys in blue all made it home that night cus they were getting worked over there for a little awhile. If one of those crazies had a gun or rifle in that Suburban we'd have some dead LEO's that night. That Good Samaritan/Walmart employee (the big boy) really helped them out for awhile there because they needed it.
MountainRaven
04-11-15, 16:16
I don't think Lethal, but someone was wounded and perhaps a lot more should have been shot.
Did anyone else notice the "Good Samaritan" that kept jumping in to the frey everytime the Cops seemed to have their hands full?
I thought that I read that one of the suspects had been shot dead and another one wounded.
Eurodriver
04-11-15, 16:21
Those guys, the nutcases, may be easy to marginalized right now but they were well trained and knew they weren't going down without a fight. Look how they always go for the eyes and pretend to give up so they can attack when LE gets close.
El Vaquero
04-11-15, 16:24
They weren't going down and when they would stop fighting to catch a breath they would run interference by getting in the way of other officers helping each when they were on the ground.
The son that shot the officer was shot dead, and another son was shot in the abdomen. The video of the press conference shows the full video, then it starts over from the beginning and the Chief of Police commentates while the video is played at 1/4 speed. The officer, Sgt. Daniels, was shot with his own firearm in the leg, but shortly before his weapon discharges it was pointed at his abdomen. Sgt. Daniels regained control of his weapon after being shot in the leg.
Not only did the officer get shot in the leg, but another officer kicked him in the face. Id need a stiff drink if that were me.
End of the world loonies. What a cluster...I'm surprised only one ended up dead.
On a side note, at 8:00 did that officer really throw his Glock to the other officer? Yikes.
It looked like a Taser, but I am not certain.
It was a real mess. From what little I could see in the video, the officers showed a lot of restraint.
Hopefully the family members who were arrested get lengthy prison sentences.
it looks close but frame by frame sure looks like he did not kick him (him as in the LEO) but the bad guy on top :)
for sure a taser being thrown you can see the wires and the size etc...
Not only did the officer get shot in the leg, but another officer kicked him in the face. Id need a stiff drink if that were me.
I saw that, I believe @ 3:19 and it looked like the officer was dazed after that blow. I know the situation was crazy and glad to see all the cops go home that night but I laughed pretty damn hard when the cop kicked the other cop in the head.
You get a few officers in a fight and odds are one of them will hit another officer during the fight. It's happened to me more than once already in my short career. The first time resulted in bruised ribs.
SpeedRacer
04-11-15, 20:29
for sure a taser being thrown you can see the wires and the size etc...
You're right. After watching again I noticed you can see the officer who threw it pulling the wires out the way shortly before the toss.
Anybody remember the old school sap or blackjack--leather wrapped tool with lead on one end attached to metal with some spring to it. I think this type of baton would be much more effective when dealing with such idiots. Where was the K-9 officer?
In 1983 I was in London and enjoyed talking with their Bobbies. One told me that their special gun teams always had at least one man with an ax handle. Maybe the good guys in this fight needed ax handles.
Anybody want to bet that these idiots will sue.
snackgunner
04-11-15, 23:02
Those guys, the nutcases, may be easy to marginalized right now but they were well trained and knew they weren't going down without a fight. Look how they always go for the eyes and pretend to give up so they can attack when LE gets close.
Well trained?
Lol.
Whiskey_Bravo
04-11-15, 23:22
Well trained?
Lol.
Why the lol?
By well trained he is talking about how they know to go for the face and eyes(watch the video to see). They are not trying to punch. Also each time one gets up they either feign surrender or run interference for another that is fighting the LEOs. Not well trained as in super black op operators operating in an operational environment, but trained/experienced in dealing with police officers.
Good hell...Once again, why does half of the totally ****ed up things in the news involve people from idaho.....
No trash like white trash, right? What a guy wouldn't do for a bag of flash and 9 band grenades at that moment.
What would have been the right way to handle this? Less lethal shot gun rounds and just go till they are down and cuffed? Back off and wait for more units to show?
Wonder if they were on something or just that inbred.
FromMyColdDeadHand
04-12-15, 00:56
Good hell...Once again, why does half of the totally ****ed up things in the news involve people from idaho.....
No trash like white trash, right? What a guy wouldn't do for a bag of flash and 9 band grenades at that moment.
What would have been the right way to handle this? Less lethal shot gun rounds and just go till they are down and cuffed? Back off and wait for more units to show?
Wonder if they were on something or just that inbred.
That was just messed up. I was trying to figure out also what the solution was. It seems that with out numerical superiority, the cops couldn't isolate anyone long enough to get cuffs on any one person so it just continued and continued.
I haven't heard that many "Get Downs" since my last family wedding.
Pull back, regroup, pick out the leader and cuff and stuff him first? That all goes out the window when you've got dead and wounded.
Is the walmart guy in a tan shirt? I was trying to figure out what he was doing, since the cops seemed to leave him alone.
Those cops have more self-control that I do. I would have turned someone's head into a canoe.
Anybody remember the old school sap or blackjack--leather wrapped tool with lead on one end attached to metal with some spring to it. I think this type of baton would be much more effective when dealing with such idiots. Where was the K-9 officer?
In 1983 I was in London and enjoyed talking with their Bobbies. One told me that their special gun teams always had at least one man with an ax handle. Maybe the good guys in this fight needed ax handles.
Anybody want to bet that these idiots will sue.
Unfortunately, many agencies now prohibit saps, primarily because they are most effective when targeting the miscreant's noggin. Mine also prohibits sap gloves as well.
When I came on (20 years ago) some of the older guys still recalled when we had far less restrictions on impact weapons and axe handles were permitted.
I do remember sap gloves. Pretty damn cool.
Unfortunately, many agencies now prohibit saps, primarily because they are most effective when targeting the miscreant's noggin. Mine also prohibits sap gloves as well.
When I came on (20 years ago) some of the older guys still recalled when we had far less restrictions on impact weapons and axe handles were permitted.
Jesus.
That was the biggest bowl of WTF I've seen in a long time. What exactly did those people think was going to happen?
ClearedHot
04-12-15, 02:34
http://ct.fra.bz/ol/fz/sw/i51/5/2/9/fbz_0bd667cfcf22e956723a9d8308bfc787.jpg
one of the articles said the LEO knew the walmart guy :) knowing walmart and its crime issues I can bet they know him quite well :) hahahahaha
interesting the baton did not do more damage ? I imagine the LEO are hitting soft parts as in trained not to go for collar bones etc... ?
as far as axe handles watch "The Sweeney"
not a bad brit film kinda good action etc... and you will see axe handles more than a few times
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EaNAtkzaKe4
Averageman
04-12-15, 07:27
Anybody remember the old school sap or blackjack--leather wrapped tool with lead on one end attached to metal with some spring to it. I think this type of baton would be much more effective when dealing with such idiots. Where was the K-9 officer?
In 1983 I was in London and enjoyed talking with their Bobbies. One told me that their special gun teams always had at least one man with an ax handle. Maybe the good guys in this fight needed ax handles.
Anybody want to bet that these idiots will sue.
I have one of those Saps, I think they would be very effective, but unfortunatly they are not leagal to carry in Texas.
I can't believe every one of the male members weren't shot.
I bet everyone of that family's IQ has to be on the low end. For a moment I thought it was the dumbass Alaska family from "Alaskan Bush People".
http://www.adn.com/article/20141022/stars-alaska-reality-tv-show-charged-pfd-fraud
A family starring in the reality television series "Alaskan Bush People" faces multiple felony charges tied to falsely submitting applications for the Alaska Permanent Fund dividend, according to documents filed in Superior Court.
The Browns -- Billy, Ami and their seven children -- are characterized in the Discovery Channel show as "a recently discovered family that was born and raised wild."
A Juneau grand jury charged six of the family members with a total of 60 counts of first-degree unsworn falsification and first- and second-degree theft, according to the documents filed Oct. 3.
http://www.adn.com/sites/default/files/styles/full_width_620/public/PKXBL.AuSt_.7.jpeg?itok=bHEWwF0j
Derp, derp, derp, derp.
http://www.gannett-cdn.com/-mm-/414c145efc73dd086f8cc100aa58149083a053bf/c=56-42-442-556&r=537&c=0-0-534-712/local/-/media/2015/03/23/Phoenix/Phoenix/635627428569303636-Gaver-Jeremiah-C-age-28.jpg
http://www.gannett-cdn.com/-mm-/065e725370d7705a29b0ebbb484703e83725e2f6/c=15-0-465-600&r=183&c=0-0-180-238/local/-/media/2015/03/23/Phoenix/Phoenix/635627428569303636-Gaver-Nathaniel-age-27.jpg
http://www.gannett-cdn.com/-mm-/9acb30a4e5482cf2c1d249be8e814152889ca63c/c=24-25-446-588&r=183&c=0-0-180-238/local/-/media/2015/03/23/Phoenix/Phoenix/635627428569303636-Gaver-Peter-age-55.jpg
http://www.gannett-cdn.com/-mm-/065e725370d7705a29b0ebbb484703e83725e2f6/c=15-0-465-600&r=183&c=0-0-180-238/local/-/media/2015/03/23/Phoenix/Phoenix/635627428576167812-Gaver-Ruth-age-52.jpg
Well, As an aside, you all know the singer Jewel right? The one that was hitched to Ty murray for a while..... Her family is on that other alaska show, the last frontier............ I know right? Mind effing blown all over the wall.
At least for the gavers, the leo in the situation showed restraint. I lack that kind of self control. There would have been so much mace used that it would have looked like a sriracha bomb went off.
I agree with Eurodriver that these dumb asses have a skill set, but I'm not sure what it's based on. Stupidity, though, is part of the mix, and without a doubt some of them have done time. Viewing the clip several times creeped me out so much that I had to stop. The next day I realized why. The buffoonery hides treachery, extreme danger, and evil. My solution to the problem is unconstitutional, illegal, unethical, devoid of Jesus' teachings, cruel, and inhumane and would get me banned if I elaborated.
The use of pepper spray and Tasers is the result of police administrators being afraid of public opinion when an officer uses his/her 26" baton to control an actively resisting suspect.
Could the outcome have been any different if the officers used night sticks at the outset of the physical confrontation? Opinions?
Jesus.
That was the biggest bowl of WTF I've seen in a long time. What exactly did those people think was going to happen?
Pretty much my thoughts exactly. I kept thinking this reminds me of a hillbilly rumble.
How appropriate for it to happen in a Walmart parking lot.
ETA: Now that I see those pictures, it WAS a Hillbilly rumble.
The use of pepper spray and Tasers is the result of police administrators being afraid of public opinion when an officer uses his/her 26" baton to control an actively resisting suspect.
Could the outcome have been any different if the officers used night sticks at the outset of the physical confrontation? Opinions?
As I watched the video, I noticed most baton strikes were primarily arm strength strikes without much weight transfer and hip rotation - largely because the officers were in a fluid situation that didn't lend itself well to stationary strikes. Two-hand usage would have helped, but unfortunately the most effective use of a club in rapidly moving situations like that seems to be the instinctive '5-from the sky' which is also the most dangerous/lethal.
Once you get amped up, the normal human can absorb a tremendous amount of damage and still keep trucking, the pain comes later. JMO
There are a lot of issues there when it comes to apprehension tactics, but to anyone wondering why the batons didn't seem to have an effect, you should know that expandable batons SUCK. The ASP lacks the weight of a Cocobolo baton and the Monadnock, while heavy, lacks the rigidity. Go ahead and YouTube a bunch of recent videos of cops using batons, it will take you a while to find one where it looks like it's actually making the suspect change his behavior.
As I watched the video, I noticed most baton strikes were primarily arm strength strikes without much weight transfer and hip rotation - largely because the officers were in a fluid situation that didn't lend itself well to stationary strikes. Two-hand usage would have helped, but unfortunately the most effective use of a club in rapidly moving situations like that seems to be the instinctive '5-from the sky' which is also the most dangerous/lethal.
Once you get amped up, the normal human can absorb a tremendous amount of damage and still keep trucking, the pain comes later. JMO
Also, you're right about those strikes. Not just from a weight transfer perspective but also, you can't just strike once and pull the baton back. We train to strike across then strike going back and to repeat, rapidly as needed. Not to Monday morning QB here, but they let the interferers draw them away from the fights by pursuing them and so they couldn't successfully handcuff anyone. You have to keep enough guys in the actual fight to get the guy in cuffs and just push the others away until that's done. I get that you don't want to lose sight of someone because they can come back with a weapon, but you just have to play the odds when you're outnumbered like that. In reality, a lot of people fight the cops, but relatively speaking, practically none of them shoot us.
Isn't that type of thing called a cluster something or other?
Crazy, that clip easily trumped 10 years of Cops episodes.
As I watched the video, I noticed most baton strikes were primarily arm strength strikes without much weight transfer and hip rotation - largely because the officers were in a fluid situation that didn't lend itself well to stationary strikes. Two-hand usage would have helped, but unfortunately the most effective use of a club in rapidly moving situations like that seems to be the instinctive '5-from the sky' which is also the most dangerous/lethal.
Once you get amped up, the normal human can absorb a tremendous amount of damage and still keep trucking, the pain comes later. JMO
You bring up some good points. That is why I use to train Rookies jabbing and blocking techniques they were not taught at our academy. Jabbing works well while fighting in a tight space, like inside an automobile, fighting in a crowd or where you cannot get the momentum you want from a solid swing. The smash works well inside 3 feet.
Someone also made a comment about the ASP. Our department issued the ASP after I had been on the job for about 5 years, it was a fairly new piece of equipment at the time. I did not find the ASP nearly as effective as a 26" piece of wood in a real fight.
When I first started, all we were issued was a 26" baton, handcuffs, an 8 shot 9mm and one extra magazine. You had to get good with the baton or have your head handed to you.
TF82 hit the nail on the head when it comes to batons. The ASPs dont really work well and no matter how justified you are in using it the video looks bad to the public. I stopped carrying mine years ago.
Someone earlier brought up less lethal like shotgun bean bags. The problem with those in this situation is the bean bags are considered lethal force when under 10 yards. Also I believe they say the national average of bean bags fired until the suspects gives up is 5.
Man those LEO sure have far more restraint that I would have had. Given they were outnumbered for a good long time, I'm seriously surprised more people weren't seriously injured.
Not sure what LEO doctrine is wrt to impact weapons, but they sure as shit seem incapable of taking the fight out of a determined opponent. These slobs may not have been trained or skilled, but they were very determined; either due to chemical supplementation or just plane Jane ornery. They were also knowledgable about how the game is played by he LEO. Attack, fake compliance then dunce and repeat.
I'm honestly shocked that after a few attempts at the whole cycle some of the LEO didn't resort to more aggressive defensive tactics. Like broken kneecaps, ankles or wrists.
As for Walmart; this is not a Walmart issue, its a deuche bag issue. Walmart attracts them cause they are open late. These events used to happen at the 24 hr stop and rob.
What an absolute sh*t show. I'm literally impressed that more of them did not cease breathing.
The ASPs dont really work well and no matter how justified you are in using it the video looks bad to the public. I stopped carrying mine years ago.
We are on the same page concerning the ASP. The only technique I thought was effective with an ASP was a hammer fist strike with a closed ASP. You can perform the same technique with the older Motorola portable radio, which had the same shape and approximate weight as a brick.
For the record, my comments are not meant to criticize any of the LEO involved in the fight. They won.
interesting to hear about the ASP and lack of punch it seems to have :) was always curious about that
as Clint says Nothing like a good piece of hickory
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eyjrUAimzZg
It's really light and thin. We carry the monadnock baton and its heavy but when you swing it the thing literally rattles. We used to be able to choose between wooden and garbage but then the fine folkes at DOJ said you have to have only one issued baton and admin, without ever consulting our Defensive Tactics instructors, chose the less effective, more expensive monadnock.
Jesus.
That was the biggest bowl of WTF I've seen in a long time. What exactly did those people think was going to happen?
I dont know but I think a lot could have been prevented had the officers emptied a couple MK9 foggers into them first.
You bring up some good points. That is why I use to train Rookies jabbing and blocking techniques they were not taught at our academy. Jabbing works well while fighting in a tight space, like inside an automobile, fighting in a crowd or where you cannot get the momentum you want from a solid swing. The smash works well inside 3 feet.
Someone also made a comment about the ASP. Our department issued the ASP after I had been on the job for about 5 years, it was a fairly new piece of equipment at the time. I did not find the ASP nearly as effective as a 26" piece of wood in a real fight.
When I first started, all we were issued was a 26" baton, handcuffs, an 8 shot 9mm and one extra magazine. You had to get good with the baton or have your head handed to you.
Id rather have a PR24 than a ASP anyday.
Id rather have a PR24 than a ASP anyday.
Both of those easily trumped by my Thomas Hawk, which would have controlled that situation rather effectively. Might even have improved the looks of some of that ugly running around at the same time.
I think that being on camera interferes with the correct level of officer response. I remain outraged that the officers had to put up with the crap thrown at them.
Long ago before video I was standing in a jail's sally port where police deliver arrested persons. The cop arrived with an idiot that he had called ahead about. This man was 6'10' and weighed 260 pounds. He had kicked out the window glass, back glass, and was raising all sorts of hell, and, of course, he refused to exit the vehicle. One burst from a hot shot cattle prod changed his behavior. As a socially responsible, Christian homophobe, I recommend the prod for these incompetents.
had a LEO friend one time guy would not stay in the car kept poking his head out he kept pushing it back in staying stay in !
after about 5 times or so he just shut the door with his head in it :) went unconscious did not get in trouble for it but was pretty funny to hear him tell it :)
Those officers seem to have their hands tied, worrying about if they shot somebody there would be riots about 'police brutality'...There were at least 4X I saw a legit shoot if I was sitting the courtroom. Those trailer-trash idiots will never know how close more of them didn't end up d-e-a-d from that.
Why is fighting with the police suddenly an olympic sport?
sevenhelmet
04-13-15, 10:10
Why is fighting with the police suddenly an olympic sport?
Because Sharpton, Obama, and Holder, that's why.
MountainRaven
04-13-15, 12:37
Because Sharpton, Obama, and Holder, that's why.
Based on the religious proclivities of these perps, I would say that you're correct in this instance. But likely not for the reasons you suspect (see also: Bundy, Cliven).
Years ago I worked security at a large church in the wrong part of town and later at a huge retirement center located off a main highway in a semi rural location. No weapons was the rule. In both places I hid "clubs" in strategic locations and carried a big pair of needle nose pliers. These pliers work really well when applied up and inside the nostrils, the outer ear, or the facial trigeminal nerve. The selected weapons were last ditch devices to save me from injury or death. Using them would have got me fired but not jailed.
An LEO friend finds the asp contemptible as an effective tool in his kit.
He uses a wooden baton for effective perp compliance.
FromMyColdDeadHand
04-13-15, 14:42
Years ago I worked security at a large church in the wrong part of town and later at a huge retirement center located off a main highway in a semi rural location. No weapons was the rule. In both places I hid "clubs" in strategic locations and carried a big pair of needle nose pliers. These pliers work really well when applied up and inside the nostrils, the outer ear, or the facial trigeminal nerve. The selected weapons were last ditch devices to save me from injury or death. Using them would have got me fired but not jailed.
WTF- did you learn that from the Three Stooges???
Knuck, knuck, knuck.
Years ago I worked security at a large church in the wrong part of town and later at a huge retirement center located off a main highway in a semi rural location. No weapons was the rule. In both places I hid "clubs" in strategic locations and carried a big pair of needle nose pliers. These pliers work really well when applied up and inside the nostrils, the outer ear, or the facial trigeminal nerve. The selected weapons were last ditch devices to save me from injury or death. Using them would have got me fired but not jailed.
You really need to explore yawara stick techniques. Mini mag light / Sure Fire light is all you need.
Cottonwood Police Chief Jody Fannings breaks down the dash cam video.
https://youtu.be/Ki-R0d7DIAE
Whiskey_Bravo
04-13-15, 21:56
Years ago I worked security at a large church in the wrong part of town and later at a huge retirement center located off a main highway in a semi rural location. No weapons was the rule. In both places I hid "clubs" in strategic locations and carried a big pair of needle nose pliers. These pliers work really well when applied up and inside the nostrils, the outer ear, or the facial trigeminal nerve. The selected weapons were last ditch devices to save me from injury or death. Using them would have got me fired but not jailed.
Wait... What? You carried needle nose pliers with the sole intention of sticking them up someone's nostrils if shit hit the fan? Did you practice that because I have to say it doesn't seem all that feasible, and by not all that feasible I mean sounds like an absolutely terrible idea.
Here crazy attacking guy, it's going to take forever to jab these up your nose if you doesn't get still.
I expected to be flamed for writing about the pliers strategy. Light maintenance was part of the job--thus the pliers idea. My age was 60 at the time. If put on the floor with bubba on top, the pliers were a last ditch effort. At he retirement center, the security guy before me left because another employee threatened to kill him. The employee was a close relative to one of the administrators so nothing was done about it. I had to deal with this idiot, who was later fired because of his interaction/comments to me. Six months after being terminated, the gentleman shot and killed an unarmed man during a verbal dispute. In Texas, churches, hospital, nursing homes and such are off limits for CHL. In these jobs, pepper spray was not an option.
I've worked with and around a sub culture who when they fight will bite, kick, scratch, and gouge, and this comment applies to both sexes. Maybe the Three Stooges learned their tricks from them. Biting is quite common among prison inmates and their relatives that are walking the streets even as I write. When I was a kid, we used plier like bull tongs to control unruly cattle during vaccinating or other treatments. That's the source for my strategy. Also, I would bite too--if I still had good teeth.
Our forum has a very large number of sophisticated and highly qualified shooters, soldiers, and lawmen. I now regret placing the needle nose pliers idea before them. It's a redneck response. Had I been younger, hog tying would have been considered after gaining control. Once I knew a sheriff who used his jail's gallows to improve behavior. He would stand the inmate on the trap door, and while he was talking to the man, someone else would pull the handle. The inmate would unexpectedly fall through to the floor below. No rope, though.
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