View Full Version : Primary Arms 1-8 Platinum Series review
Alaskapopo
09-07-15, 20:57
Product Review: Primary Arms Platinum Series 1-8x Mil Scope FFP
Part 1 of a 2 part review.
INITIAL OBSERVATIONS:
I got this scope in last week on 8-30-15 and could not wait to open up the box and take a look at it. I noticed that the glass was extremely clear all the way out to the edges with no distortion or dark spots. The illumination was good visible even on a bright sunny day. The turrets had positive clicks and I like the fact that they are fairly low profile and are locking. I do wish there was a zero stop capability but that is not a deal breaker by any means.
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BACKGROUND:
I wanted this scope for my AR10 lightweight semi auto precision rifle build. See the attached picture for more details on this build. Basically with this rifle I wanted it to be as light as feasible while still having 1 MOA accuracy. With the loads it likes the best this rifle is a ¾ moa gun. With FMJ cheaper plinking rounds it’s typically a 2 moa rifle.
I thought a 1-8 scope would be ideal for this platform. I had a 2.5-10 mounted on it to start with. The 2.5-10 Vortex is one of my favorite scopes but it lacked the speed up close I wanted because the reticle was too small to be useful on 2.5 x. It was a nice scope and I have one on my .223 precision semi auto build but on this rifle I wanted something a bit better up close.
Then tried a 1.5-8 Burris XTR 2 and I was not happy. The glass quality was not there, the adjustments were a bit mushy and the dual focal plane reticle it had did not line up. (2nd focal plane to the first focal plane) I ended up selling the scope. To be honest I was very disappointed in the Burris and its retail is in the same range as the Primary Arms at 1200 to 1439. The glass on the Vortex PST 2.5-10 was better and it’s a $800 scope.
Then I put a 1-6 Vortex Razor 2 on it and I love that scope its super clear with great illumination. The Razor 2 was a great scope but it lacked the qualities I wanted in a long range scope like such as exposed turrets and mil markings ( I have the JM reticle). A great scope but I put it back on one of my three gun rifles.
So the search was on for the perfect scope that could be fast up close and still be used as a precision medium range optic (out to 600 yards or so). Before the Primary Arms 1-8 I had considered a Leupold 1-8 but 3k is out of my price range. The Primary Arms is an answer to my quest for the perfect optic to match the mission I had in mind for this rifle.
http://<a href=http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g299/355sigfan/Product%20reviews/Primary%20Arms%201-8%20scope%20review/AR10%20build_zps5bzpksbn.jpg</a>" />
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TESTING:
ZEROING 8-31-15
I mounted the optic in a ADM Delta mount leveled it and then took it to the range on 8-31-15 for the first time. It was a very windy day and I ended up only sighting in the rifle at 100 yards. My best group of the day with my best load for this gun was .65. (168 grain Sierra Match King 44 grains of Varget CCI Bench Rest Primer, Lapua Brass) On that day my 3 shot group average of 8 3 shot groups was 1.0 moa. I blame some of that on the wind.
I liked the way the turrets are simple to operate. You just lift them up to turn them and then push them back down into the locked position to lock them in place. Once your zeroed you unscrew the turrets and lift them off being careful not to lose the rubber o ring and then set them back down in the proper place. Fairly simple to do but be careful not to lose the oring I almost did. Like I said earlier the clicks were very positive with no mush.
http://<a href=http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g299/355sigfan/Product%20reviews/Primary%20Arms%201-8%20scope%20review/Best%20group_zpscgxaw6vy.jpg</a>" />
TRACKING TEST:
Alaskapopo
09-07-15, 20:57
On 9-7-15 I took the rifle out again. It was a great day with almost no wind and it was sunny with no overcast. I was in a hurry to get some ammo loaded up for testing and I did not want to use up a lot of my 168 grain load in tracking testing so I loaded up some cheaper rounds. That load is described below.
The load I loaded up somewhat in a hurry to get this report done was Federal cases trimmed on a Dillon 1200 trimmer. I did not deburr the cases inside and out like I usually do. I used standard CCI primers instead of bench rest and I loaded Hornady seconds bullets (178 BTHP) This load average 1.48 MOA for 18 groups fired 1 of the groups was a 4 shot group 4 of them were 5 shot and the rest were 3 shot groups.
For the tracking test I dialied 2 mills up then down then left then right all shooting 3 shot groups at each adjustment. The final group was shot back in the middle. The tracking was as it should be.
I also noticed that my Level bubble which mounts on the rail was slightly touching the scope mount. I moved it back on the rail and the last three groups were a bit better 1.26 moa. Not sure if it mattered or not because the change was less than .25 moa.
I fired 5 3 shot groups at 174 yards which is as far as I can go on the city range we have. I dialed up 3 clicks (3 tenths of a mil) which is what my Shooter App said was needed after I entered the loads data into it and it was spot on. The group size at this range averaged 2.34 inches or 1.35 moa.
http://<a href=http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g299/355sigfan/Product%20reviews/Primary%20Arms%201-8%20scope%20review/pov%20shot_zps0ffmmp3c.jpg</a>" />
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OPTICAL TESTING:
I tried to find flaws in the class but found none. Even at the outer edge I could see the bullet holes on target at 100 yards just as clear as in the center of the class.
Alaskapopo
09-07-15, 20:58
This is a true 1x scope. See the pics below and notice how the grass in the back ground stays the same side in the scope as out of it.
I plan on taking this rifle out to the 400 yard range at the prison next week with my shooting buddy. We will test the scope at 200, 300 and 400 yards. I also plan on doing some close in speed drills with it as well comparing the speed of the scope on 1x to the off set red dot.
http://<a href=http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g299/355sigfan/Product%20reviews/Primary%20Arms%201-8%20scope%20review/true%201x_zpsnmqy0mvm.jpg</a>" />
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Thanks for the review. How is the glass compared to the Vortex HD 1-6x?
Alaskapopo
09-07-15, 22:02
Thanks for the review. How is the glass compared to the Vortex HD 1-6x?
So close that I can't tell a difference. Both are Japanese glass and both are excellent.
Nice, that's what I was hoping to hear.
I'm looking forward to more additions to PA's Platinum line.
Been really short of funds lately from getting laid off 2 months ago so I've been debating on whittling my AR's down to only 1primary all purpose gun that I can use for 3gun, classes and everything. This glass may just have to get purchased using funds from guns I've gotten rid of as I think it will fill that roll perfectly on my 14.5 EMW BCM gun that I plan on using for that all purpose gun.
Here are the specifications on the scope. https://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_Arms_Platinum_Series_1_8X24_Front_Focal_Pl_p/pa1-8x24ffp-ad-mil.htm Net Weight: 26.45 oz.
How does this compare to the bushnell 1-8.5?
I have the Vortex HD2 1-6 JM1 and the Bushnell 1-6.5 FFP BTR-2. The Vortex is clearly the better scope of the two.
The Bushnell 1-6.5 is very good on my 16" 300BLK rifle. I zero my supersonic load at 100 yards, and then use the Bushnell's reticle with holdovers at 3MIL for 100 yards and 7MIL for 200 yards for my subsonic load. My only complaint of the Bushnell is the reticle focus - in focus at 6.5x is out of focus at 1x for me. But it's not a big problem when using the illumination on 1x - it still works fine even though the reticle is not perfectly sharp.
I like the combination of a red dot and crosshairs with BDC on the Vortex much better than the illuminated reticle on the Bushnell. I'd love to try out a Leupold with the SPR firedot reticle - it seems like the best of both worlds.
Alaskapopo
09-08-15, 13:44
How does this compare to the bushnell 1-8.5?
I have the Vortex HD2 1-6 JM1 and the Bushnell 1-6.5 FFP BTR-2. The Vortex is clearly the better scope of the two.
The Bushnell 1-6.5 is very good on my 16" 300BLK rifle. I zero my supersonic load at 100 yards, and then use the Bushnell's reticle with holdovers at 3MIL for 100 yards and 7MIL for 200 yards for my subsonic load. My only complaint of the Bushnell is the reticle focus - in focus at 6.5x is out of focus at 1x for me. But it's not a big problem when using the illumination on 1x - it still works fine even though the reticle is not perfectly sharp.
I like the combination of a red dot and crosshairs with BDC on the Vortex much better than the illuminated reticle on the Bushnell. I'd love to try out a Leupold with the SPR firedot reticle - it seems like the best of both worlds.
I have not tired the 1-8.5 Bushnell but I have tried the 1-6.5 and did not like the fact the reticle was so dim and not daylight bright.
Pat
I have not tired the 1-8.5 Bushnell but I have tried the 1-6.5 and did not like the fact the reticle was so dim and not daylight bright.
Pat
I should have clarified that the version of the Bushnell that I have is daylight visible. I have read that this was changed at some point as users complained of this on the early production models.
Thank you for your excellent review and I look forward to part 2.
RussellAthletic
09-09-15, 13:51
Great review. I'll certainly keep an eye on this as a great all around optic choice.
Alaskapopo
09-15-15, 01:10
Product Review Primary Arms 1-8 Platinum Series Mil Scope part 2.
Date 9-14-15
Long range testing:
This part of the test was pretty simple. I confirmed zero at 100 yards and then dialed .5 mil for 200 yards and 1.5 mils for 300 and 2.5 for 400 and everything hit like it should. I was shooting at steel targets.
Short range CQB testing.
Myself and my shooting buddy Greg took part in these drills. 3 USPSA targets were used at a range of 12 yards and they were spaced about 4 yards apart. Scoring was a IDPA time plus system. .5 seconds were given for a C zone hit and 1.5 seconds for a D zone hit. Neither of us missed. Scope magnification was set to 1x.
Drill 1.
Shooter starts at low ready at the sound of the buzzer he shoots target 1 one with one round center mass. Time is recorded and then drill is repeated on target 2 and then on target 3. This drill was done twice. Once with the illumination on the scope off and the next set was done with the illumination on. The point of this drill was to see how fast a shooter could acquire the target and scope reticle and fire.
Results
Time
Greg Illumination off average time for all 3 targets was 1.26 seconds.
Greg Illumination on average 1.11
Pat Illumination off average time for all 3 targets was 1.16 seconds.
Pat Illumination on average 1.12
I tallied up the accuracy at the end of all the drills looking back I should have done it as I went. Read ahead. Greg shot a bit more accurately than me and as a result I had to buy him lunch.
Drill 2.
Shooter starts at the low ready and at the sound of the buzzer he engages targets 1-3 with one round each. The drill was repeated 3 times. Illumination was left on for both shooters on the scope.
Greg’s Average 2.87
Pat’s Average 3.02
Drill 3
Shooter performs a failure to stop drill from the low ready on target 2. We just did this once.
Greg’s time 2.40
Pat’s time 2.66
Drill 4.
Shooter starts in Low ready and performs 1 head shot on target one. Time is recorded and then shooter repeats on target 3. (that gave us each 20 rounds total fired)
Greg’s average 1.45
Pat’s average 1.50
Accuracy
Greg had 17 A hits and 3 C hits
Pat had 13 A hits and 7 C hits. ( I know sloppy)
Gregs total score was 22.46 seconds once penalties were added in and mine was 24.99. Loser had to buy lunch.
I shot Drill’s 1 and 2 again with my rifles off set red dot sight to give a comparison. My hits were worse with me scoring 6 C hits and 1 D hit.
Times are as follows.
Drill one Average 1.05 Compared to 1.12 with the scope set on 1x with the illumination on.
Drill 2 Average was 2.67 Compared to the scope at 3.02. The dot was faster on raw time but the scope won over all due to the penalties from poor hits. I shot sloppier with the dot.
CONCLUSION:
This scope was very easy to use up close. The eye relief was never a problem and the reticle was easy to find even with the illumination off. I will keep giving my impressions of the scope as time goes on but as of now I am a satisfied customer.
http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g299/355sigfan/Product%20reviews/Primary%20Arms%201-8%20scope%20review/Prison%20range%20400%20yards_zpskryhaqff.jpg (http://s59.photobucket.com/user/355sigfan/media/Product%20reviews/Primary%20Arms%201-8%20scope%20review/Prison%20range%20400%20yards_zpskryhaqff.jpg.html)
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http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g299/355sigfan/Product%20reviews/Primary%20Arms%201-8%20scope%20review/Greg_zpsyojowkrp.jpg (http://s59.photobucket.com/user/355sigfan/media/Product%20reviews/Primary%20Arms%201-8%20scope%20review/Greg_zpsyojowkrp.jpg.html)
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Gabriel556
09-15-15, 11:38
Thank you for this review. I know some people love and some people don't care for PA, but this looks like a good value(bang for the buck) optic for this type of application. I'm interested to see how it does as you expose it to harsh winter environments and more use but I don't expect to see you throw it off a cliff to see how it holds zero. Not everyone can afford high end optics and not all people need them, but this looks like a good setup and I'm glad PA is able to continue developing new products like this.
Just a quick update on the warranty. We have come to terms with the factory on a program so we can now offer a lifetime warranty on these.
CONCLUSION:
This scope was very easy to use up close. The eye relief was never a problem and the reticle was easy to find even with the illumination off. I will keep giving my impressions of the scope as time goes on but as of now I am a satisfied customer.
Alaska can you give us an idea of what the eyebox is like and how the illumination responds to motion? It looked like the eyebox was fairly forgiving in the YouTube video PA posted, but I'm not sure if they mounted the scope in front of the camera or were just holding it there.
And is the illumination steady as you traverse the eyebox? I hate how the Mark 6 line from Leupold flickers if you're not perfectly still, it kind of defeats the purpose of using it similar to a red dot at 1x if it flickers while you advance.
I've been hunting a 1-6x like this for years, and while I was really hoping to avoid the extra 8 ounces the 2 extra power brings, I might not be able to resist this one.
Spring-Diver
10-11-15, 14:44
Just a quick update on the warranty. We have come to terms with the factory on a program so we can now offer a lifetime warranty on these.
That is excellent news!!! Now I'm just deciding between this or your ACSS ACOG.
Cheers
Shannon
Alaskapopo
11-28-15, 04:39
No reticle flickering. Very forgiving
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Thanks for the review. I have a similar set up and am running a PA 1-6 and a Weaver 3-10 both on ADM QD mounts. Been thinking about streamlining to a 1-8.
Rotorhead84
12-03-15, 12:06
Nice review. Primary Arms makes neat stuff.
What company makes this for PA?
What company makes this for PA?
Not sure if you mean a company as in another scope brand? We spec out and contract direct with the premier factory in Japan (there are not many left) just like the big boys.
Not sure if you mean a company as in another scope brand? We spec out and contract direct with the premier factory in Japan (there are not many left) just like the big boys.
Thanks for the reply. I didn't realize how that worked. The scope looks interesting and I'm definitely considering one.
Not sure if you mean a company as in another scope brand? We spec out and contract direct with the premier factory in Japan (there are not many left) just like the big boys.
So the factory ONLY produces Premier optics? No other brands?
I have a feeling these scopes are made in the same facility as the Bushnell Elite, SFWA SS HD, and maybe even NF and Vortex Razors.
So the factory ONLY produces Premier optics? No other brands?
He didn't say that.
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my first outing with my new 1-8 was Thanksgiving. Shot some through the scope video.
https://youtu.be/Mg_2-PcM3GI
I picked up a Primary Arms Platinum 1-8 with the ACSS REticle.
" ACSS Reticle "Advanced Combined Sighting System" combing Bullet Drop Compensation, Range Estimation, Wind and Leads "
Dimitri Mikroulis, at Primary Arms, developed a non-mil, non-MOA reticle that simply works. I have followed the development of this reticle over the past few years. The concept is that the reticle takes advantage of average target sizes. Sight the ACSS reticle in at 100 yards holdovers out to 800 yards.
That said, I am a novice shooter and have learned to use my horus reticles and mil dot reticles so this is stupifyingly simple for me. I am still getting used to it.
The optic itself is nice. I have two Leupold Mk 8s so I am familiar with the 1-8x optic.
This optic is clear. The glass is a step above the other PA optics that I have owned.
The turrets feel great The clicks are positive. Audible and easily felt. They feel great. I like the pull up to turn and push down to lock feature.
I did the initial zero using Wolf 62gr The final zero will be with my hunting ammo. 75Gr Gold Dots.
http://s19.postimg.org/xkxad66ib/20151126_122713.jpg
Here is the rig. POF P416, Gemtech Trek Ti, Primary Arms Platinum 1-8x24 in a Larue SPR mount.
Its sitting in my Hog Saddle on a Giotto Tripod and Ball mount.
http://s19.postimg.org/ldy59cpyr/20151126_122720.jpg
http://s19.postimg.org/e5hx6bnub/20151126_122742.jpg
The 1-8x24mm in the Larue Mount
http://s19.postimg.org/8y1fflwmr/20151126_122844.jpg
http://s19.postimg.org/4avddu99v/20151126_122902.jpg
The Gemtech Trek Ti
http://s19.postimg.org/61eefbqsz/20151127_130146.jpg
Enjoying a Cigar with my vintage Seiko Diver
http://s19.postimg.org/viwsyx8j7/20151127_134106.jpg
http://s19.postimg.org/3k78lswab/20151127_135523.jpg
http://s19.postimg.org/3k78lswab/20151127_135523.jpg
http://s19.postimg.org/hugsxacmr/20151127_135530.jpg
http://s19.postimg.org/9wmdvmzcj/20151127_135631.jpg
www.TexasGunTrust.com
So the factory ONLY produces Premier optics? No other brands?
No I used the word "premier" to mean that this is unaversally accepted as the factory producing the highest quality scopes coming out of Japan
TimeOnTarget
12-06-15, 08:42
Major props on that Seiko SC!
Vintage oldskool is ver cool.
I have several PA scopes now. Like everyone says, great value in PA.
I have a feeling these scopes are made in the same facility as the Bushnell Elite, SFWA SS HD, and maybe even NF and Vortex Razors.
Exactly.
Thanks. Hope the video shows the reticle well enough
Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk
Thanks. Hope the video shows the reticle well enough
Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk
Do you have any drawings of the reticle?
Here is some video from the 200yd line.
https://youtu.be/2BBCUsBtEg0
www.TexasGunTrust.com
Is that reticle mil based or a bdc?
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/12/08/37810b79428ce7d79df8a5a6bd874bfb.jpg
Does anyone have information on this reticle? I like the way it looks but is there a drawing showing the specs and such?
Does anyone have information on this reticle? I like the way it looks but is there a drawing showing the specs and such?
It looks to be Primary Arms Patented ACSS 5.56/5.45/.308 reticle. You can find a tutorial here;
http://youtu.be/I7DmssXBNgo
3655936560
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It certainly looks like the acss but it is calling it an advanced mil reticle on the website. I'm confused.
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/12/18/b168d8a5eb4e45ce94846e2ebed7b5d2.jpg
They have 2 1-8 with different rets. One mil, one bdc
http://tacticalgunreview.com/primary-arms-platinum-series-1-8x24/
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Which reticle should I get?
The Advanced Mil Reticle
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160125/f211847ee421335bf14964af809f8593.jpg
Or
ACSS
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160125/dbfd92dcaa87dcd8492414ce8de31166.jpg
Alaskapopo
01-24-16, 21:57
Which reticle should I get?
The Advanced Mil Reticle
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160125/f211847ee421335bf14964af809f8593.jpg
Or
ACSS
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160125/dbfd92dcaa87dcd8492414ce8de31166.jpg
I prefer the mil reticle.
ACSS all the way IMO.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
ACSS all the way IMO.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
This.
Mrgunsngear
01-25-16, 04:35
I can't decide.
I did the video below with Dimitri---the designer of the reticle. May help you decide one way or the other:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwdlz5lUXtY
turnburglar
01-25-16, 15:10
I vote for ACSS, unless you have some very specific need for measuring in mils. The ACSS reticle is very easy to use for ranging 2 legged animals and the holds are already dialed in for you.
I'm leaning toward the BDC but I've never had one before so it feels scary. I've been so used to Mil style reticles. I guess I just have to leave the turrets alone and just shoot.
One more thing. How are these 24mm objective scopes in low light? Do you have to dial it down to 3x to get the exit pupil big enough to see anything at dusk?
One more thing. How are these 24mm objective scopes in low light? Do you have to dial it down to 3x to get the exit pupil big enough to see anything at dusk?
Depending upon light transmission it depends. Not all 6mm exit pupils are the same.
Very nice scope for the money!
I am a fan of mils. You can use it on any barrel length with any load, just plug in the dope.
The ACSS reticle is very easy to use for ranging 2 legged animals and the holds are already dialed in for you.
What about hogs? Can I range hogs with this reticle?
turnburglar
01-26-16, 18:38
What about hogs? Can I range hogs with this reticle?
I believe you can, but don't have the conversion chart on hand.
turnburglar
01-26-16, 18:38
What about hogs? Can I range hogs with this reticle?
I believe you can, but don't have the conversion chart on hand.
I believe you can, but don't have the conversion chart on hand.
I think having the ability to range two legged animals might come in handy one day but right now I want to practice on some hogs.
Is there a quick throw lever available for this scope?
Alaskapopo
02-14-16, 09:56
http://www.primaryarms.com/3-gun-stuff-cat-tail-scope-lever-for-primary-arms-1-8-scope/p/gs-500/
Yes here is the link just ordered one.
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Well I just ordered one of these scopes today. It decided to get the ACSS reticle. I also ordered the Sampson DMR mount and the quick throw lever. I'll post what I think about it soon.
Mrgunsngear
03-21-16, 10:17
Well I just ordered one of these scopes today. It decided to get the ACSS reticle. I also ordered the Sampson DMT mount and the quick throw lever. I'll post what I think about it soon.
I'm debating getting one too; looking forward to your report
I noticed on the primary arms website that they have a 1-8x ACSS reticle with a chevron under their patented section but I couldn't find it as an option on any of their scopes. Does anyone know what's up? Is that particular reticle licenced out to another manufacturer? I sent an email to them about it, and the response was very prompt. It however was not very illuminating. Just "we don't have the ACSS with a chevron". This seems like a perfect scope for me but I'd really prefer a chevron.
My initial impression with the scope is very good. Glass clarity is great and the reticle illumination is impressive. The eye box is very generous. On 1 power it operates like a red dot. You can maneuver around with both eyes open and it feels natural.
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160324/3dd5ccc46339f6ab2e6481b8781a9783.jpg
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160324/087f6b268735e8130516179a4862050c.jpg
Is the image flat on 1x or does it fish eye?
Is the image flat on 1x or does it fish eye?
I'm not sure what fish eye looks like. It seemed pretty natural looking.
Do you have a picture of a fisheye image?
This is very exaggerated, but like this:
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160324/3f4c588ca695a55eb89df6c997aa66ff.jpg
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Is the image flat on 1x or does it fish eye?
I have never seen a 1-nx optic with a truly flat image on 1x, including my K16i, Nightforce, a MK6 I handled, the Vortex Razor, or any others. There is always a little bit of diopter/parallax/etc. However, it gets VERY CLOSE on the good optics. The absolute worst was the VCOG. The best so far have been the K16i/Z6i twins. I'd love to get some hands-on with the Steiners. I have also never handled the new USO or S&B's.
At 1x, my optic appears flat. I have not noticed fisheye distortion. I'll take a closer look.
This is very exaggerated, but like this:
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160324/3f4c588ca695a55eb89df6c997aa66ff.jpg
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I didn't notice anything like that but I'll pay more attention to it.
At 1x, my optic appears flat. I have not noticed fisheye distortion. I'll take a closer look.
Aim it at a door-frame or something on 1x. Look at the door frame and move the optic through your FOV. The frame will bend/distort/lose continuum very notably as it nears the edges of the FOV.
Mrgunsngear
03-24-16, 13:37
I have never seen a 1-nx optic with a truly flat image on 1x, including my K16i, Nightforce, a MK6 I handled, the Vortex Razor, or any others. There is always a little bit of diopter/parallax/etc. However, it gets VERY CLOSE on the good optics. The absolute worst was the VCOG. The best so far have been the K16i/Z6i twins. I'd love to get some hands-on with the Steiners. I have also never handled the new USO or S&B's.
Agreed with all of that. I always found it odd how bad the VCOGs are in this regard, I do still like them though....
I have a Primary Arms 1-8 arriving tomorrow.
Cant wait to check it out.
Agreed with all of that. I always found it odd how bad the VCOGs are in this regard, I do still like them though....
I just couldn't like my VCOG and sold it.
-Very small FOV compared to other scopes that came out years before, in 1-6.
-Terrible fish-eye/parallax on 1x when diopter is dialed for 6x, and vis-versa except it's blurry on 6x, then.
-Weighs 23oz WITHOUT the mount
-Costs the same or more than anything but a S&B
-Proving to not be as durable in military deployments as people wished.
-Illumination is ho-hum.
Literally the ONLY 2 sexy features are that you don't have rings to mess with, and it takes a AA battery. However, it's heavy as hell, and the illumination sucks anyways, which kindof negates the "nice" factor of those two by a very significant margin. In short, it doesn't do a damn thing well except look cool and impress people who think the external metal tube is the weakest link in a glass, gear, and spring-filled precision instrument.
Is the image flat on 1x or does it fish eye?
I actually didn't notice any fisheye until you said something. I did go back and look at a door frame and moved the scope from center to edge. It does have the fisheye however, I don't think it is an issue as it is mild in my opinion. If you hadn't said anything I would have never paid any mind to it.
I will say this. I really like this scope. It is set up well for what I want to do. I have Nightforce and USO, this scope feels on par with them.
Does anyone know who makes these optics for PSA and where they are made?
They're made in Japan. I can't remember if it's the same place the razor had comes from or not.
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3857138572
I received mine yesterday , very happy with it .
A little heavy but all the 1-8's are.
Find ManBearPig!
03-26-16, 20:21
For those of you who have this scope, how "far" do you feel the combination of image quality, reticle design, and magnification levels will let you take the scope out? Or, in other words, assuming the rifle, cartridge, and shooter are not factors, at what distances do you feel the scope starts to loose the ability to make reasonably precise shots?
Sorry if that question is a bit vague, I'm unsure how to word it better at the moment.
For those of you who have this scope, how "far" do you feel the combination of image quality, reticle design, and magnification levels will let you take the scope out? Or, in other words, assuming the rifle, cartridge, and shooter are not factors, at what distances do you feel the scope starts to loose the ability to make reasonably precise shots?
Sorry if that question is a bit vague, I'm unsure how to word it better at the moment.
I wouldn't buy this scope with "precision" in mind. This scope was made for quick target acquisition. It is very well suited for a gas gun.
This doesn't mean that you can't make precise shots with it. Going by the 1 power per hundred yards rule, you are good for 800 yards. Really though, if I was going to buy a scope to shoot long range like that it would be a 5-25 power. High power scopes suck at close range though.
What are your requirements for a scope? There is no one size fits all. You need to buy a scope to satisfy the requirements of what you need to do.
Find ManBearPig!
03-27-16, 00:40
I wouldn't buy this scope with "precision" in mind. This scope was made for quick target acquisition. It is very well suited for a gas gun.
This doesn't mean that you can't make precise shots with it. Going by the 1 power per hundred yards rule, you are good for 800 yards. Really though, if I was going to buy a scope to shoot long range like that it would be a 5-25 power. High power scopes suck at close range though.
What are your requirements for a scope? There is no one size fits all. You need to buy a scope to satisfy the requirements of what you need to do.
Right now, I'm looking to buy either quality, high accuracy AR-10, or an AR-15 chambered in something bigger and better suited for distance work than 5.56, and I'm going to need an optic for it. The idea is to have a rifle I can enjoy shooting at targets at around the 600 yard mark and below while retaining decent precision, as well as having something handy I could go hunting medium sized game with. I want the optic to be light enough, small enough, tough enough, and easy enough to use that I can just leave it on the rifle and not need to worry too much about it not working or being too cumbersome, but I also want a reasonable level of magnification and precision that I can take advantage of the accuracy modern gas guns are capable of. I am expecting neither the speed and ease of use of an Aimpoint, nor the precision and long range ability of a dedicated precision scope, but I would like something in between.
I'm a novice when it comes to longer range precision shooting, but from what I've learned so far through my current precision rifle (a Savage MK II in .22LR with a heavy barrel, Boyd's stock, and SWFA SS 10x) as well as reading up on the subject, I prefer mil/mil scopes and FFP reticles, simply because I "get" mils, and don't want to have to worry about my magnification the scope is on in relation to the reticle. If in end I decide to go a different direction and go for a more specialized rifle, then I'll also look for a more specialized optic, but for now, I'm looking for a "jack of all trades, master of none" type optic to fit a rifle with a similar mission. Currently, the frontrunner for my choice of rifle is a new lightweight, high accuracy .308 AR-10 carbine from Mega Arms, which will feature a 1 MOA or better accuracy guarantee... and if you could not tell from my post, I'm a bit conflicted on what I want optics wise, as I am unsure where to strike the balance of precision vs. speed/weight/compactness. As I said, I'm new to this.
If weight is a concern and you're not looking for aimpoint speed, you could get more mag and less weight looking elsewhere. PA 1-8 is not light.
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Right now, I'm looking to buy either quality, high accuracy AR-10, or an AR-15 chambered in something bigger and better suited for distance work than 5.56, and I'm going to need an optic for it. The idea is to have a rifle I can enjoy shooting at targets at around the 600 yard mark and below while retaining decent precision, as well as having something handy I could go hunting medium sized game with. I want the optic to be light enough, small enough, tough enough, and easy enough to use that I can just leave it on the rifle and not need to worry too much about it not working or being too cumbersome, but I also want a reasonable level of magnification and precision that I can take advantage of the accuracy modern gas guns are capable of. I am expecting neither the speed and ease of use of an Aimpoint, nor the precision and long range ability of a dedicated precision scope, but I would like something in between.
I'm a novice when it comes to longer range precision shooting, but from what I've learned so far through my current precision rifle (a Savage MK II in .22LR with a heavy barrel, Boyd's stock, and SWFA SS 10x) as well as reading up on the subject, I prefer mil/mil scopes and FFP reticles, simply because I "get" mils, and don't want to have to worry about my magnification the scope is on in relation to the reticle. If in end I decide to go a different direction and go for a more specialized rifle, then I'll also look for a more specialized optic, but for now, I'm looking for a "jack of all trades, master of none" type optic to fit a rifle with a similar mission. Currently, the frontrunner for my choice of rifle is a new lightweight, high accuracy .308 AR-10 carbine from Mega Arms, which will feature a 1 MOA or better accuracy guarantee... and if you could not tell from my post, I'm a bit conflicted on what I want optics wise, as I am unsure where to strike the balance of precision vs. speed/weight/compactness. As I said, I'm new to this.
If you do decide to get the PA I would suggest you get the Mil reticle and not the BDC one. I got the BDC because it fit the role I want to use my rifle for but it sounds like you have different requirements.
Find ManBearPig!
03-27-16, 14:09
If weight is a concern and you're not looking for aimpoint speed, you could get more mag and less weight looking elsewhere. PA 1-8 is not light.
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You're right, I seem to have not noticed the weight, I must have been confusing the Primary Arms with something else. That certainly throws a wrench into my calculations, thank you for pointing it out.
By chance, do you know of any good lighterweight, higher mag scopes? I saw the Nightforce NXS 2.5-10 line, and everything looks good about them save they are SFP.
Also, I wouldn't mind being able to use the scope like an Aimpoint, it's just that I'm not willing to make a significant precision trade-off to get that ability, nor do I find it an absolute deal breaker if the scope does not function like an Aimpoint.
If you do decide to get the PA I would suggest you get the Mil reticle and not the BDC one. I got the BDC because it fit the role I want to use my rifle for but it sounds like you have different requirements.
Definitely. Compared to many of the other low power variables on the market, I like the looks of the PA mil/mil setup significantly more- it reminds me a lot of the reticle on my SWFA, which while not perfect, is certainly effective enough for me.
Alaskapopo
04-13-16, 02:39
Three Gun Range Report with the Primary Arms 1-8.
http://www.primaryarms.com/primary-arms-platinum-series-1-8x24-front-focal-plane-scope-with-advanced-cqb-mil-reticle/p/kt-pa1-8x24ffp-ad-mil/
On 4-10-16 I completed in a local three-gun match using the Primary Arms Premier 1-8 Scope. I shot two divisions using the same rifle, Open and Tac optics. I placed 2nd in Open and 4th in Tac Optics. This is my first time using this optic in an actual match. It did not disappoint. This match tested the optics speed more than its precision due to their being closer range shots and the longest shots being at around 200 yards. For this match I shot on 1x for all but a few shots. This was my first match since September so I was a little rusty. I had a great time shooting this scope. I showed it off to most of the other shooters at the match and they were impressed with the optics clarity. I am hoping the next match will have states where I can stretch its legs and use the 8x top end. Here are few videos and photos from the match. I owe a special thanks to my girlfriend Jennifer Meyer for being a trooper and filming me and also running the I pad to score the match. This was the first time she had ever been to a three gun match.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFfDNbiCDsY&feature=youtu.be
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oCYHQSfEwSU&nohtml5=False
Here is a link to a prior review I have done on this optic.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?173511-Primary-Arms-1-8-Platinum-Series-review
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?181156-Getting-ready-for-the-3-gun-season
Boba Fett v2
04-15-16, 15:20
Alaskapopo, appreciate the informative write-up. This thread has put the PA 1-8x on my short list of options to consider for my next LPVO.
Just when I thought I was sold on the Vortex Razor HD 1-6 I come across this thread. It just seems to good to be true in a pricerange on the low end like this.
I'm looking for a true 1x, daytime bright illumination variable that doesn't have any tunneling at low power, fisheye effect, and horrible edge distortion. Maybe this will fit the bill. I do like the option to cover the turrets though and these do look exposed.
awesome righteous write up.
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Dionysusigma
08-20-16, 11:49
Seriously planning on buying one of these as soon as funds are available, but have a question regarding the mount. It'll be going on an A1-stocked rifle with an A2 buttplate (which over the years has always felt the best for me), with a Magpul MBUS Pro rear sight.
I've been looking at the Geissele Super Precision mounts, but am wondering what would be the best choice, regardless of price, manufacturer, model, etc. that would offer the best placement for eye relief at 8x, yet still comfortably clear the folded rear sight with a Breakaway Cattail (http://www.breakawayusa.com/products/accessories/rifle-accessories/) around the adjustment ring. QD isn't really a priority, and I've never been much of one for NTCH aiming...
Also, does anyone have a video demonstrating the FFP performance while increasing magnification? I'd like to get a good idea of what to expect while using it, and what parts of the reticle (if not the whole image) are illuminated... every video out there seems to show it off at only 1x and 8x, with nowhere in between.
Alaskapopo
08-20-16, 13:01
I use a Warne Skel mount now on both of my 1-8's. But I don't have Irons under them. I have off set red dots so I can't help you there. I have always felt that with a scope standard irons are useless even with QD mounts as the time it takes to get the scope off is going to get you killed vs just rotating the gun and using your off set irons or optic. The horseshoe is illuminated as well as each half mil mark. I have the non BDC version.
Pat
Just when I thought I was sold on the Vortex Razor HD 1-6 I come across this thread. It just seems to good to be true in a pricerange on the low end like this.
I'm looking for a true 1x, daytime bright illumination variable that doesn't have any tunneling at low power, fisheye effect, and horrible edge distortion. Maybe this will fit the bill. I do like the option to cover the turrets though and these do look exposed.
It does have some fisheye but it doesn't distract me.
The turrets lock so having them exposed isn't really an issue.
It is a damned nice scope. I may get another one.
Is the Mil Reticle on this scope hard to learn? I wanted the ACSS version, but no one has them in stock and primary arms said it will be 2-3 more months before they are back in stock. I went ahead and bought the Mil Reticle version, but I hear it's a little harder to get used to.
TimeOnTarget
01-05-17, 09:10
Is the Mil Reticle on this scope hard to learn? I wanted the ACSS version, but no one has them in stock and primary arms said it will be 2-3 more months before they are back in stock. I went ahead and bought the Mil Reticle version, but I hear it's a little harder to get used to.
It is not that difficult to learn the MIL system, but the ACSS reticle takes all of that out of the equation. It is already done for you assuming that your loads are the same or close to standard loads. ACSS is kinda like "point and shoot".
A MIL reticle is more versatile because you can use it for any round where a bullet drop reticle like the ACSS is designed for a limited range of rounds. To their credit, Primary Arms has done a great job with the entire line of scopes. They work very well for the intended purpose which is putting effective rounds on man sized targets.
Alaskapopo
01-05-17, 09:16
It is not that difficult to learn the MIL system, but the ACSS reticle takes all of that out of the equation. It is already done for you assuming that your loads are the same or close to standard loads. ACSS is kinda like "point and shoot".
A MIL reticle is more versatile because you can use it for any round where a bullet drop reticle like the ACSS is designed for a limited range of rounds. To their credit, Primary Arms has done a great job with the entire line of scopes. They work very well for the intended purpose which is putting effective rounds on man sized targets.
I much prefer the Mil reticle. The ACSS only fits one load but with the mil reticle you can use any load. I find it a lot easier.
Pat
Furbyballer
01-05-17, 09:59
I own an acss platinum 1-8 and I like it. The system is stupid easy to use and who doesn't have military ball ammo laying around? I will say that I am going to sell it in favor of lighter 1-6 options available since I haven't found the extra 2 power to be really needed out to 600 yds and yes, I am also switching to mil/mil scopes. Its an awesome scope, at a great price, but damn is it heavy.
I own an acss platinum 1-8 and I like it. The system is stupid easy to use and who doesn't have military ball ammo laying around? I will say that I am going to sell it in favor of lighter 1-6 options available since I haven't found the extra 2 power to be really needed out to 600 yds and yes, I am also switching to mil/mil scopes. Its an awesome scope, at a great price, but damn is it heavy.
When do you plan on selling it? Is it still in good shape? I might be willing to trade you if you want a Mil Reticle. Mine comes in tomorrow. I'm thinking the ACSS will fit me better. I mostly shoot 55 and 62 grain stuff. Mostly 55 grain m193 since I have a 1:9 twist barrel.
Dionysusigma
01-08-17, 09:07
I wanted the ACSS version, but no one has them in stock and primary arms said it will be 2-3 more months before they are back in stock.
Wonder why it'll be so long... import/customs, maybe? :confused:
Vegasshooter
01-14-17, 03:01
Very likely they have to wait in line for their "turn" in the production run. The factory that makes these scopes also makes MANY others. A company buys production time from them. The factory will turn out Bushnells for a bit, then Vortex for a bit, etc. Primary probably has to wait in line.
It looks very much like LOW in Japan is doing these scopes. They stay very busy.
Bringing this one back up...how easy is it to pick up the reticle on 1x with the illumination OFF?
And how precise (with speed) can you be at ranges where the circle is too big for a small target but you would still be at 1x for your engagement (for example 15-25 out to 50+ yds on a 6" target)?
Pats pictures make it look like it might be hard to find, but that may not be the case.
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