View Full Version : The Man in The High Castle
I just watched the first episode of The Man In The High Castle on Amazon Prime. It's set in the very early 60s and the east coast of the U is controlled by the Nazis and the west coast by Imperial Japanese. There is a band between that's known as the Neutral Zone. Obviously, the US and it's Allies lost the war. Or did they? A news reel surfaces that shows that the US did indeed win the war. So what happened between then and the 60s? I don't know, but I'm going to continue watching and find out.
The series is based on a novel of the same name, written by Phillip K. Dick. I haven't read it, but anything written by PKD could take you anywhere.
I recommend watching this series. It promises to be good
That novel was Philip K. Dick, so the answer to your question is Yarrow stalks, Heraclitus and lots of drugs.
We streamed epi 2 last night, it was good. It would be nice if Amazon would put the whole season up like Netflix. There's like a 9 month gap from the premier to the 2nd episode. I'm guessing they are looking at ratings and reviews to decide to continue on a project. This is definitely one of their better productions.
Sound like something I'd love. Maybe it will be available on DVD one day and I'll actually see it.
MountainRaven
10-25-15, 22:52
Spoilers may lie ahead... you have been warned!
I found the weapon selection of the first episode to be disappointing.
The number of Japanese in the Kempeitai in San Fransisco seems rather... high. Seems like it should be made up mostly of Americans with Japanese higher-ups - like the American SS. If the American Kempeitai were Americans, I would better understand why the Kempeitai is armed with WWII-era bolt action rifles.
I would be similarly disappointed with the armaments of the Nazis, but since they're American Brown Shirts and not German military, it's understandable that they would have the out-dated left-overs.
In episode two....
The gun problem is resolved for the German side at least, as American or German troops are seen with MP5s following a resistance ambush.
Which leads to my chief complaint about episode two, which is that the resistance ambush seemed rather amateurish. Which doesn't fit with what I would think of the actions of a ten or fifteen year old resistance movement - especially since the resistance movements in Europe were only functional for a few years and were pretty effective/professional in a hurry. Although they did have the SOE and OSS to train them. But I think it's safe to say that the same guys would have trained the American resistance, being members themselves. I did really like that the resistance was rocking Thomspons, though.
And finally....
I don't remember the Japanese being as douchebagish in the book. In fact, I remember the book basically being the United States as post-war Germany with the Japanese-occupied US being Western Germany, German-occupied US being Eastern Germany, with the Japanese presence in the West being more akin to the US occupation of Japan - and the Germans being the Soviets. In fact, I don't recall there being an effective resistance in the US.
Nonetheless:
Resistance>Japan>Germany. Still.
Outstanding first two episodes, thanks for the recommendation!
The Man In High Castle? The United States under foreign-run totalitarian fascist unConstitutional government?
Is this a documentary about Barrack Hussein Obama, Hitlery Clinton, Pelosi, Feinstein and the Democrats?
Spurholder
10-27-15, 05:15
We streamed epi 2 last night, it was good. It would be nice if Amazon would put the whole season up like Netflix. There's like a 9 month gap from the premier to the 2nd episode. I'm guessing they are looking at ratings and reviews to decide to continue on a project. This is definitely one of their better productions.
The first episode was the pilot. Amazon's model is pretty neat - they picked this one and roughly 10 other shows for pilot episodes, had them made, and then placed them on their website for review and feedback. Based on what they received, they selected several for a full 1st season. They'll probably do the entire process again in January.
Some were meh - there was a Civil War drama that I couldn't sit through, and a few others just didn't draw my interest. Another show - about a bunch of 40-somethings that end up in Central America and called Mad Dogs was pretty good, and it will have a full first season, too. The pilot's still available on Amazon Prime.
The Man in the High Castle exceeded all expectations, and the entire 1st season will be available by November 21st.
MountainRaven
10-27-15, 09:26
The Man In High Castle? The United States under foreign-run totalitarian fascist unConstitutional government?
Is this a documentary about Barrack Hussein Obama, Hitlery Clinton, Pelosi, Feinstein and the Democrats?
I do not think those words mean what you think they mean.
Started watching it this morning after reading this thread. I'm hooked. What really got me is after the cop stopped to help the guy change the tire the guy noticed ash falling. Cops says "every (whatever day it was) the hospital burns the elderly, crippled, terminally ill, you know, the drags on the state". That is exactly how I imagine a world in which Hitler had not been stopped....
The full season was put up today..
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00RSI6NKS
Saw first ep. Want to see more. Anything Dick ever wrote was pure gold. He really was ahead of his time.
It's going to be more like a reverse Americans with a lot of under the hat trickery instead of a Wolverines style fight. But seeing a bunch of smug Nazi types and Imperial japanese made me want to see SOMEBODY jump out with a BAR and start gunning them down.
Why? Because we live here!
But I thought it was neat how the Japanese are so into old American replica gundms and Americana. This was in the source material.
Kind of like how people in America now are into anime and J pop.
I guess I am the outlier. I'm three episodes in and this show is completely failing to hold my interest. The wife is enjoying it, so I don't complain too much that it's on.
Digital_Damage
11-21-15, 20:07
shit show...
First three episodes were great, the rest was an epic fail.
Boring and the drama just does not keep you hooked.
shit show...
First three episodes were great, the rest was an epic fail.
Boring and the drama just does not keep you hooked.
agreed.. viewed 3 and 4.. zzzzzz lost interest.
BoringGuy45
11-21-15, 21:55
Saw first ep. Want to see more. Anything Dick ever wrote was pure gold. He really was ahead of his time.
Agreed, and pretty much all his works that were adapted for film or TV did the source material proud.
Finished all 10 episodes and I went my 10 hours back.
Dumber than Lost.
MountainRaven
11-21-15, 22:39
I'm on episode 8 and enjoying it so far.
I've only had time to watch the first two and enjoyed them both. I did get the audio book and listened to it in the car and while at work. There is no doubt, the book has a PKD ending
MountainRaven
11-22-15, 01:28
I've only had time to watch the first two and enjoyed them both. I did get the audio book and listened to it in the car and while at work. There is no doubt, the book has a PKD ending
I hope that I can tell you, without spoiling anything, that the first (and only, thus far) season at least has a similar ending.
And, as a fan of the book, the series has not disappointed.
I'm 3 episodes in, and Hollywood libturds are already injecting their politics.
The diner owner and resistance fighter (the black guy, somethingorother Washington) is a Muslim. Of-****ing-course.
Yep, a Black Muslim fighting Nazis. Just ignore that Muslims were allied with the Nazis in WWII, here comes the-son-Obama-never-had to save the United States from fascism.
Digital_Damage
11-23-15, 09:34
I'm 3 episodes in, and Hollywood libturds are already injecting their politics.
The diner owner and resistance fighter (the black guy, somethingorother Washington) is a Muslim. Of-****ing-course.
Yep, a Black Muslim fighting Nazis. Just ignore that Muslims were allied with the Nazis in WWII, here comes the-son-Obama-never-had to save the United States from fascism.
Jesus, you are one angry little man... It is based on a book written in 1962
Actually I agree.
After episode 3 it went to teetotal dogshit. And they have strayed from the source material.
Just go read the book. In the book they always consult the Tao.
The Nazis had no space race competition and colonized Mars. Africa had been wiped out with nukes and towards the end you get a mindf--k.
Like an LSD one that makes it feel like, if you read it in 1962, you would feel like maybe YOU were in the alternate reality.
Oh well. Through A Scanner Darkly was well done.
Digital_Damage
11-23-15, 10:13
Actually I agree.
After episode 3 it went to teetotal dogshit. And they have strayed from the source material.
Just go read the book. In the book they always consult the Tao.
The Nazis had no space race competition and colonized Mars. Africa had been wiped out with nukes and towards the end you get a mindf--k.
Like an LSD one that makes it feel like, if you read it in 1962, you would feel like maybe YOU were in the alternate reality.
Oh well. Through A Scanner Darkly was well done.
Ya, after ep 3 was when Amazon greenlit it for a full season. I'm sure there was a lot of source change "we will produce a full season, but lets make some changes". Got boring as shit after ep3.
MountainRaven
11-23-15, 13:50
Yes, I am angry that Islam keeps getting whitewashed and airbrushed, to be portrayed as a peaceful, enlightened religion.
Was it shown this way in the book too? I am curious.
There was no Resistance in book. The only combat I recall occurred when a Nazi wetwork team got wasted by a Japanese businessman with a black powder revolver.
Considering the time period, the choice to make a character who is black a Muslim might be intended to be a reflection of the role black Muslims took in the civil rights movement of the 60s. And to be honest, the Nazis would not likely see Muslims and especially Muslim Arabs as anything but useful idiots and exterminate them once their usefulness was at an end. Given that the possession and sale of Bibles is banned, it's probably safe to assume that the sale and possession of Qurans is banned - and the practice of any religion in the Reich is totally banned (along with the practice of any religions but Shinto and state-approved sects of Buddhism in the Japanese Pacific States).
The portrayal of the Japanese was much more positive, as I recall, in the book. Basically it's the US occupation of Japan, with the roles reversed. The Nazis were still douchebags, basically playing the Soviets to eastern America's East Germany.
Philip K. Dick was the thinking man's William S. Burroughs.
He was pretty forward thinking.
Look how much anime we watch and video games we play. The foreign cars. Etc. If the Japanese had occupied the US they would (and kinda do anyway) have a fascination with our stuff.
The atrocities of Japanese would've been likened to "shit happens" like in any other war. And there were guys who were WWII vets when this book came out who were mid 30s so it was still a touchy subject. But realistic.
The Germans looked like middle America of that time but that's where it ended. The value systems were different. The book was pretty deep. The TV show was a mixture of stereotypical Col Klink nazis and dieselpunk 80s style Japanese corporate types (when we thought they could actually buy us...lol)
The first episode or two caught the feel of the book but just got stupid. I agree about the black power muslim guy. That was pretty lame.
The story was deeper. It drew you in expecting this weird "occupied America" story but had deeper introspective themes of what freedom really is and is not.
A lot of "grass is greener". I mean...this was during one of the spikes of US/USSR tensions it was written. How things could have been better (more advanced space exploration) and worse (annihilation of entire races, a hot Cold War) and that razor thin line between fate, nature, and self determination.
The TV show just wanted provocative imagery and totally lost the point.
Had it been a strict miniseries of four SOLID episodes, it would've been great.
Remember that one mini series Amerika? Kind of like that but better. Instead just Swastikas and stereotypical Japanese imagery and "Ve haf vays of meking you talk".
It was Fear the Walking Dead all over. Promises of an epic build up but bleh
I'm 3 episodes in, and Hollywood libturds are already injecting their politics.
The diner owner and resistance fighter (the black guy, somethingorother Washington) is a Muslim. Of-****ing-course.
Yep, a Black Muslim fighting Nazis. Just ignore that Muslims were allied with the Nazis in WWII, here comes the-son-Obama-never-had to save the United States from fascism.
Muslims were about as allied with the Nazis as were Christians. Roughly 1700 Moroccans participated in D-Day. Estimated 233,000 N. African Muslims fought on the French side. Some 40,000 died liberating Europe. 500,000 Indian Muslims enlisted in the British Army. Majority of Bosnian Muslims fought for as parisans. Albanias saved their small Jewish population and was the only country that was directly occupied by the Germans and had an increase in Jewish population at the end of the war. Then there were the Muslim countries under the Soviet flag who fought in the red army.
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MountainRaven
11-23-15, 15:10
I'm just going to guess - based on the ratings that the show is getting - that there will be knock-offs. Like the History Channel's Vikings (free idea book, er, history version of Game of Thrones). So we might see a series based on Harry Turtledove's Southern Victory/Timeline-191 books. And that might be neat.
Please don't crap on another thread with the ISIS/islam-related outrage and rhetoric. If it historically relates to the show, keep it narrow with a clear line from A to B. Keep this one about the show and storyline.
Just got done watching ep 2 and its a little too much blah blah blah and not enough bang bang bang. I'll give it a few more episodes, but I need more action during a cardio session.
MountainRaven
11-23-15, 21:31
Just got done watching ep 2 and its a little too much blah blah blah and not enough bang bang bang. I'll give it a few more episodes, but I need more action during a cardio session.
There's not much bang-bang-bang. Most of it is done in the first two episodes.
And then there's a bit in the last episode. But in between, it's pretty sparse.
Spoilers:
Between the ambush on Obergruppenführer Smith and the last episode there is... Prince Akihito gets shot, a Reich bounty hunter does a couple mag dumps with an 1887 on the heroes in Cañon City... and then that's it. Last episode, we have Chief Inspector Kīdo summarily executing a Nazi operative, Colonel Wegener kills himself, a Reich sniper kills Reinhard Heydrich's aide, and then Obergruppenführer Smith shoots Heydrich with a hunting rifle. And... that's it, that I can recall.
It's not Red Dawn with Nazis. It wasn't meant to be.
The book rather. Screw the TV show.
Who is watching season two?
I have to say: awesome. Blows season one out of the water.
eightmillimeter
12-19-16, 18:31
I'm through 4 episodes. Not what I was expecting at all and yes it is very good
I am on episode ten. It is suspenseful for sure.
Spurholder
12-19-16, 18:48
This season's remarkably better than Season One.
This season's remarkably better than Season One.
That it is. I liked the first, but they far out did it with two.
I highly recommend it to those who might have abandoned after the first.
OH thanks did not realize 2 is out :)
off to binge watch
Who is watching season two?
I have to say: awesome. Blows season one out of the water.
I'm going to have to check it out. I thought it was done when the first season ended.
Season 2 is awesome. I'm on episode 9.
I would have to agree with the above posts. I still liked season 1 but season 2 is night and day better.
I'm watching episode 3 of season 2 and like it. But the freaking taxi key the lady passed the guy on the bar was the same I have for my 2008 Ford Crown Vic at work! The Japanese manning .50's was strange too. I just finished season two. Great series.
Who is watching season two?
I have to say: awesome. Blows season one out of the water.
I am and agree, worth sticking with the show.
eightmillimeter
01-01-17, 01:44
Finished it the other day. 9 and 10 were great. Easily left it open if they do a season 3.
Getting good again
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So I've only seen a couple episodes of the first season thus far but I have a question, regarding the American SS officers having Wehrmacht style wreaths on their caps instead of the SS "death's head".
Is this because the costumer is an idiot who botched one of the quintessential aspects of an SS uniform, or because the costumer is really clever and reasoned that the German governing authorities would know he American public would react poorly to collaborating US personnel wearing skulls on their hats and opted to change it in universe to make it more palatable?
Also, "Greater Nazi Reich"? Isn't "Nazi" sort of a flippant nickname for the German National Socialists that they never actually used for themselves?
MountainRaven
01-01-17, 15:26
So I've only seen a couple episodes of the first season thus far but I have a question, regarding the American SS officers having Wehrmacht style wreaths on their caps instead of the SS "death's head".
Is this because the costumer is an idiot who botched one of the quintessential aspects of an SS uniform, or because the costumer is really clever and reasoned that the German governing authorities would know he American public would react poorly to collaborating US personnel wearing skulls on their hats and opted to change it in universe to make it more palatable?
Also, "Greater Nazi Reich"? Isn't "Nazi" sort of a flippant nickname for the German National Socialists that they never actually used for themselves?
My money would be on, "really clever," since we have Waffen-SS and Heer armed with MP5s and G3s and the IJA assigned to Crown Prince Akihito's PSD is armed with Howa Type-64s. Although I would expect the American SS to wear uniforms more similar to WWII-era US uniforms, albeit with Nazi-specific paraphernalia. The NYPD uniforms look to be a happy mixture of real world 1940s/50s/60s NYPD uniforms and Nazi uniforms. Although I would have expected their uniforms - sans leather jackets - to maintain either the traditional blue color of US police uniforms or the traditional green of German police uniforms, rather than being (what appeared to be) SS black.
More suspension of disbelief breaking is the fact that everybody in Germany seems to speak English - instead of everybody in the Eastern US speaking German. (Not to say that English wouldn't still be the most commonly spoken language in the US, but German would be the lingua franca of the Western World and there would be little reason for Germans living in Germany, especially the children of high-ranking Nazi bureaucrats, to learn any languages other than German and maybe Latin or French.)
That and I would have expected the Kempeitai in the US to be more reliant on American grunts with Japanese-born officers, rather than being almost purely Japanese, beyond support-level auxiliaries. Which would have given better reason for the Kempeitai to be armed with Arisakas while the IJA is armed with Type-64s: Thus it would give the American LE/troops bolt action rifles while the Japanese would have been armed with semi-automatic or select-fire battle rifles.
HardToHandle
01-01-17, 20:12
I will agree on the costumes being pretty clever more than slap dash thrown together. There are occasional anarchornisms in the show, but the second season is dialed in.
My biggest issue is the 8mm Nambus used by the Japanese as being such man killers. Everyone shot by the Chief Inspector and other Kempeitai seems to go down much harder than the FMJ! leisurely velocity and bullet weight would indicate. The Nambu strikes me as a pistol that carries poorly in a concealed belt holster - slender barrel and weighted at the rear. The very long throw safety and trigger were poor options too.
I will excuse the M2 for guarding the very special Japanese warehouse... Could be very common 15 years after the end of the war, especially since John Browning's design was better than Vickers and other designs used by Japanese war machine.
Just caught the last episode the other day. Lots of people at work are getting into the show also. Having to remember it's science fiction when they get into the alternate realities, it's a pretty good show. Nice to see TV having the nads to portray BOTH the Germans AND the Japanese as they were back then. Too many people now days are too quick to forget how brutal the Japanese were back then.
Season two was awesome at the end. I hope they do a season three.
Also, "Greater Nazi Reich"? Isn't "Nazi" sort of a flippant nickname for the German National Socialists that they never actually used for themselves?
Pretty much. They referred to themselves as National Socialists, "Nationalsozialisten," but usage of the term "Nazi" wasn't common in Germany under that party's rule. I think that's an area where they went with the option to make it easy for the viewer rather than historically accurate.
MountainRaven
01-04-17, 00:12
Pretty much. They referred to themselves as National Socialists, "Nationalsozialisten," but usage of the term "Nazi" wasn't common in Germany under that party's rule. I think that's an area where they went with the option to make it easy for the viewer rather than historically accurate.
It's been nearly 20 years since the end of the war (well, the end of the war in our universe, in the book, I believe there's reference to a character being injured by a German tank shell during the Battle of London in 1946), plenty of time for a lot of things to have changed.
Finished it the other day. 9 and 10 were great. Easily left it open if they do a season 3.
I hope they do another season. They could go back in time and fill in some of the blanks.
I will agree on the costumes being pretty clever more than slap dash thrown together. There are occasional anarchornisms in the show, but the second season is dialed in.
My biggest issue is the 8mm Nambus used by the Japanese as being such man killers. Everyone shot by the Chief Inspector and other Kempeitai seems to go down much harder than the FMJ! leisurely velocity and bullet weight would indicate. The Nambu strikes me as a pistol that carries poorly in a concealed belt holster - slender barrel and weighted at the rear. The very long throw safety and trigger were poor options too.
I will excuse the M2 for guarding the very special Japanese warehouse... Could be very common 15 years after the end of the war, especially since John Browning's design was better than Vickers and other designs used by Japanese war machine.
The M2 bugged me too. I would not think the Japanese National Pride would allow their use except in an emergency.
things are different and alternate time universe kinda thing I am OK with some things that do not quite line up ! ;)
I had New Year's Day off, so I ended up being watching the first and most of the second season. The show isn't what I was expecting, but it's pretty good so far. Maybe not up to HBO standards, but the story kept me involved enough to want to keep watching and see how thing things played out. I finished up the second season yesterday and I was pleasantly surprised. They left things pretty open for a 3rd season and it will be interesting to see what happens next.
MountainRaven
01-04-17, 20:36
The M2 bugged me too. I would not think the Japanese National Pride would allow their use except in an emergency.
A- Arisaka rifles were (and are) modified, locally-produced Mausers and the 7.7mm Arisaka cartridge is basically a rimless 303 British (and the IJN adopted a rimmed version of the 7.7mm, a direct copy of 303 British), so the Japanese weren't totally averse to things that weren't made in Japan. Before the war ended in the real world, they also had copies of the Me-262 and were attempting to make production copies of the M1 Garand.
B- It appears that a lot of the equipment being used in the Pacific States is second-line gear. So the M2s could be from stocks of arms captured from the US, Australia, &c.
sundance435
10-08-18, 13:23
Okay, who's through Season 3 already? THERE BE SPOILERS AHEAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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I thought the pace really picked up in Season 2 and now they kind of throttled it back again for everyone but John Smith. Disappointed that the Trade Minister became largely irrelevant for the last few episodes. What was the point of finding Frank? Why did they spend so much time on Ed and Robert? Why bring Joe Blake back at all (unless it has something to do with Juliana's "memories", which I still don't quite get)?!? I thought the season finale was pretty weak. Now, another year waiting...
From a broad perspective, it seems likes there's really no organized resistance in either the PCS or the Greater Reich. Several characters alluded to how you start to change things from nothing, but they never really addressed that. Is the film supposed to galvanize the masses or just blowing up the Nazi portal will do it? I'm struggling to see the importance of blowing up the device in light of High Castle's revelation.
Plus, how about how technologically inferior the Japanese are compared to the Germans? It looks like most of the Japs are still toting around Arisakas while the Germans have G3s and MP5s. I don't think that IRL the Japs would have been 17 years behind the Germans in building the bomb.
sundance435
10-08-18, 13:30
A- Arisaka rifles were (and are) modified, locally-produced Mausers and the 7.7mm Arisaka cartridge is basically a rimless 303 British (and the IJN adopted a rimmed version of the 7.7mm, a direct copy of 303 British), so the Japanese weren't totally averse to things that weren't made in Japan. Before the war ended in the real world, they also had copies of the Me-262 and were attempting to make production copies of the M1 Garand.
B- It appears that a lot of the equipment being used in the Pacific States is second-line gear. So the M2s could be from stocks of arms captured from the US, Australia, &c.
Also, the M2 makes an appearance in German guise in Season 3. The Germans had very favorable opinions of the M2...from an analytical viewpoint. It was basically the only gun of its kind in the war. German small arms were superior (except for the 98k v. Garand) or comparable enough in every other way, though the Stg44 was a class of its own and the FG42 probably wasn't as practical as a BAR.
MountainRaven
10-08-18, 20:18
Also, the M2 makes an appearance in German guise in Season 3. The Germans had very favorable opinions of the M2...from an analytical viewpoint. It was basically the only gun of its kind in the war. German small arms were superior (except for the 98k v. Garand) or comparable enough in every other way, though the Stg44 was a class of its own and the FG42 probably wasn't as practical as a BAR.
The FG42 wouldn't meet it's true equal until the FN FAL and H&K G3. And even then, the FG42 is probably the more controllable gun on full-auto.
ETA: I think it's really weird that the Nazis are attempting to invade alternate dimensions three years after the moon landing (in universe). Never mind what they think will happen if the world they invade is almost identical to theirs: Who invades whom? Would a Hitler in an alternate universe owe The Man in the High Castle's prime universe allegiance? What happens if a universe similar to theirs invades them? Or if they invade, say, our universe. 1962: The US and Soviet Union have hydrogen bombs, the Nazis don't - would anything end the Cold War like an interdimensional repeat of WWII between a dimension where the Allies defeated the Axis and one where the Axis defeated the Allies? Oh hell, wouldn't that just end up being the Größeres Nazi-Reich versus the US, USSR, and their own universe's Japanese Empire? AKMs, M14s, M1s, AR-10s, and FALs (and Type-64s and G3s) versus G3s. I don't see that ending well for the Nazis.
ETA2: Also: Too bad there wasn't a ball-and-cap revolver involved in the Japanese guy killing the Nazi assassin.
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