View Full Version : Swiss Arms SG 553 R (7.62x39)
I have the pistol version of the Swiss Arms SG 553 R in 7.62x39 on order. I really like my Sig 556 SBR, so this one should be fun too.
http://www.swissarms.ch/media/images/weapon-detail/sg-553-r.png
I'm told it should arrive around January. The gun shop that I'm purchasing it from will also have the buttstock available. I know that a good number of the pistol versions have been imported in 5.56x45 and made in to SBR's, so I'm wondering what everyone is using for compliance parts. Obviously I can use a US made AK magazine, but what about the US parts beyond that?
http://www.swissarms.ch/en/sg-553-r-assault-rifle.php
BTW, I realize some will say that sec922(r) compliance parts are not required for SBR's and I agree according to the text of the law. However, the ATF in their infinite wisdom has more recently said otherwise, so I'm not looking to get in to that debate. I'm just wanting to know what those who are using compliance parts have installed.
Ben at Gatewood Supply is able to get you up an running on the 5.56 guns. Not sure if the 7.62x39 guns are able to be 922r.
Is this your first Swiss Sig? If so, prepare to have your socks knocked off.
It is. I decided to get it because it's different enough (7.62x39, longer barrel, green stock set) from my 556 SBR that I could justify it. It would be really nice if I could just swap the trigger groups between the rifles.
You will need five US parts if the flash hider is integral to the barrel, six if it is removable.
Your options for parts to replace:
- Flash hider.
- Bolt carrier (from 556). I assume that the standard 553 and the 553R use the same carrier.
- Pistol grip. The furniture is green on these 553Rs, so matching may be tough or just paint. Can use a 556 pistol grip after modifying where it interfaces with the trigger guard. Or use a hogue.
- Hammer (Shooting Sight)
- Sear (Shooting Sight)
- Trigger (556)
- Mag body
- Mag follower
- Mag floorplate
- Stock. Craptastic US made 556 stock vs. M4 stock adapter.
Of these I would swap the FCG parts and use US magazines, keeping the rest of the rifle Swiss.
JoshNC, What do you mean by "Shooting Sight" next to hammer and sear?
I definitely want to keep the stock set original.
http://shop.shootingsight.com/SIG-556-556R-551-A1-522-Rifle-Products_c10.htm
Thanks for the link. If those work, perhaps just swapping the FCG between the SG 553 R and my 556 SBR will work. I'll keep my fingers crossed.
"The expected delivery of the 553R pistol has been delayed from September to March 2017 due to a redesign to the magazine well and ejection port".
https://www.sanswissarms.com/news.html
Bummer, I thought they were on the way. Oh well. I've learned patience when it comes to the SBR game. I'd much rather that they work out whatever issue there was than it have a problem when it gets here.
Delayed again until August and now until September. I'm patient knowing that they are getting the magazine well redesign right. On the bright side, perhaps the NFA backlog will be down significantly by the time they arrive.
Delayed again until August and now until September. I'm patient knowing that they are getting the magazine well redesign right. On the bright side, perhaps the NFA backlog will be down significantly by the time they arrive.
I suspect your patience will be rewarded. The Swiss are obsessive about quality, including with firearms. They won't put it out until it is perfect.
I feel your pain. I paid in full and already have the friggin tax stamp. The delivery keeps getting pushed. Here is hoping for September. We should really know for sure. If they are delivering them in September then they should be working on them right now.
I didn't pay in full because I figured that would somehow cause it never to happen.
Just heard from the importer. It is now October. They have addressed the mag well/ ejection port issues and are waiting for the barrels now. It is starting to feel like Beretta AXR caliber packs, Aug barrels in 300 blackout, and Bren tens.... but we will just have to see. EVERY TIME I pay in full for something, this happens... one would think I would learn.
Waiting on the barrels? My goodness! What have they been doing for the last year and a half? I don't see how they can make money operating that slowly. I don't see how Jdi (importer) can stand it. They get a +1 for being patient. I've been through this before, so I've learned to be patient. My factory Sig556 SBR took a year and a half to arrive. It was worth it in the end. This will be too.
Waiting on the barrels? My goodness! What have they been doing for the last year and a half? I don't see how they can make money operating that slowly. I don't see how Jdi (importer) can stand it. They get a +1 for being patient. I've been though this before, so I've learned to be patient. My factory Sig556 SBR took a year and a half to arrive. It was worth it in the end. This will be too.\
Be
Brother, you must be reading my chats. Its started out with "good lord, they are a year late and they don't even have barrels"? Apparently they didn't want to pay for a bunch of barrels until they got the mag well/ejection port issue sorted. Now that they have that done, they ordered the barrels. ON the bright side, Blaser makes good stuff, so there is that.
Like you, I have been down this road before, although I generally don't pay for stuff in advance - shades of Beretta caliber packs for the rifle, 6.5 Grendel XCRs, 300 blackout AUGs... I did this time to get the tax stamp. I have the stock, pin, optic... ready to roll so if it comes in, it'll be sweet. Been doing some research and it appears that the 7.62x39 fusion round is the best available. I will buy a couple hundred rounds of that and back them by the 8M3 "effect bullet". IF it arrives, IF it works, and IF its accurate, this might be the ideal 150 yard rifle - particularly given the performance/cost ratio of the 8M3 round. Fingers crossed but doubt is starting to creep in.
I will say this about JDI. Super communication. Tells it like it is. Responds within minutes. So I trust them, but they are dependent on Heidi and Gunter...
FYI, for anyone who might want to know. I purchased some Magpul gen3 AK47 magazines for when I convert mine from a pistol to a rifle (for sec922(r) compliance). I tried them in a multitude of AK's and they fit in them all. They're a little tighter than your typical AK magazine, but that's OK. Of course when I get my 553R next month I'll try it with a variety of magazines in pistol configuration just to make sure it's working as it should.
Thanks for the info on the Magpul gen3's. I'm planning on modifying the gen3 .308 followers for use on the 751. We'll see.
Hope your right about October! October would be great... I've grown accustomed to the wait, and I'm absolutely certain that these aren't running late because of paying in advance.
Does anyone know if the 553R's that JDI is bringing in have threaded barrels? Hard to tell.
And they have been further delayed beyond October. Sigh.
I can't imagine that they wouldn't come with threaded barrels. After all, they're being imported as pistols.
The sanswissarms.com website still says October. Do you have information beyond that (and the obvious that we're almost half through October)?
I can't imagine that they wouldn't come with threaded barrels. After all, they're being imported as pistols.
The sanswissarms.com website still says October. Do you have information beyond that (and the obvious that we're almost half through October)?
Some of the 553s coming in do not have threaded barrels IIRC....but in all honesty I cannot place where I saw/read that.
The further delay is from JDI's facebook page.
I just heard from JDI. The 553Rs are leaving Switzerland this week. My tax stamp is here waiting for it. And I leave for 2 weeks of vacation with the wife's family next week, so I won't be able to actually shoot it. Oh the humanity.
I can't believe it! Thanks for sharing the great news.
https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/24774701_1771231706234933_2908907898865652792_n.jpg?oh=0df5dab88c97d6f1e102408853d97d3c&oe=5A91455E
https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/24312952_1771231709568266_2588853746108864672_n.jpg?oh=c77ad7321fc6135784970adec002f8cb&oe=5A8A7B57
;)
https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/24774701_1771231706234933_2908907898865652792_n.jpg?oh=0df5dab88c97d6f1e102408853d97d3c&oe=5A91455E
https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/24312952_1771231709568266_2588853746108864672_n.jpg?oh=c77ad7321fc6135784970adec002f8cb&oe=5A8A7B57
;)
That is a beautiful sight!
my green telescoping swiss stock, pin and cup arrive today. Gun sometime soon... Merry Christmas.
They have shipped. Mine is half way to my ffl.
Thanks for the update. I wonder why he hasn't called me about the balance due on mine.
These were the 31 paid on full guns. The rest arrive in late January.
OK. Please post detailed pictures when it arrives and do a reliability test too.
OK. Please post detailed pictures when it arrives and do a reliability test too.
My plan is to get it engraved, do the work to make it an sbr, (I have my stamp) put a rediculous scope on it and test accuracy with federal fusion, whatever generic x39 I have lying around, and then scratch up some 8m3. Then I will rescope it with a 1.25 -4 leupold and run some drills. Also will run it with an sdn6 and see how it goes. It is sitting at my ffl in WA and I am I Denver.
After over a two year wait, I finally have my San Swiss Arms 553RP. Here it is below my Sig 556 SBR.
https://s9.postimg.org/gosglnhxr/Sig_556_SBR_versus_Sig_553_RP.jpg
Field stripped.
https://s9.postimg.org/fmia36jpr/Sig_553_RP_field_stripped.jpg
Here's the barreled action of the 553RP versus the 556 SBR. Note that the gas system of the 553RP is slightly shorter.
https://s9.postimg.org/rodnxbl8f/Sig_553_RP_action_vers_Sig556_SBR_action.jpg
As a result, the gas piston of the 553RP is slightly shorter.
https://s9.postimg.org/n2hjozmun/Sig_556_SBR_gas_piston_versus_Sig_553_RP_gas_piston.jpg
The trigger groups from each rifle appear to be virtually identical. I'm hoping that they'll interchange which would give me three easy 922r parts. The pin diameters are the same.
https://s9.postimg.org/8w1str49r/Sig_553_RP_lower_versus_Sig_556_SBR_lower.jpg
I took it to the range today along with 110rds of Wolf 123gr FMJ Copper Jacket that was made in a Ukrainian factory that the Russians destroyed. I loaded the ammunition in (2) Magpul Gen3 30rd mags, a Hungarian 20rd mag and an Eastern Block 30rd metal magazine of unknown origin. I've used the Hungarian and Eastern Block magazines previously with no issues. The Magpul Gen3 mags were a bear to get locked in place. Once locked in place, it was difficult to retract the carrier to the rear. However, once I did that, they did cycle just fine. They were also a bear to unlock. The Hungarian and Eastern Block mags inserted easily, the carrier retracted easily with them in place and they were easy to unlock.
Now for the sort of bad news. I had (7) failures to fire. Looking at the primers, it appears that they were hit hard enough, but just didn't ignite. Now I might be worried about this, but I've been down this route before with my Windham Weaponry 7.62x39 AR-15. It would fail to ignite the primers of this same ammo occasionally too, but they would always fire on the second strike. I didn't retry when this happened in the 553RP. The Windham would run 100% with Lapua 123gr FMJ and IMI 123gr FMJ. After I installed a Wolff extra power AR-15 hammer spring in the Windham, it runs 100% when running this Wolf 123gr FMJ Copper Jacket. So, lesson learned. These primers are kind of hard to ignite.
Now for the thing that concerns me. I had two failures to feed when using the Eastern block magazine. Both times the bullet ended up hitting above the chamber which made the cartridge stop at about a 45deg angle.
When I got home I grabbed an assortment of AK magazines. All would lock and unlock easily except the Magpul Gen3's and Bulgarian waffles. Interestingly, the Magpul Gen1 that came with the pistol locked in and unlocked just fine. Perhaps I was overthinking it going with the Gen3 version because they have the metal insert at the top. I took a file to the underside of the mag catch of the two Gen3's. It took a while, but they now lock in pretty easily. They still take a little force to unlock, but I didn't want to push my luck.
My plan when I go to the range tomorrow is to see if I get light primer strikes with other ammo. I also need to see if I have any feeing issues when just using the Gen3 Magpuls. I'm taking some Golden Tiger 123gr FMJ bimetal to try out initially. If it works fine, then I'll know that the Wolf ammo I tried just has hard primers. If I still get failures to ignite, then I'll give it a go with some Lapua 123gr FMJ.
I had better results at the range today. I fired 85rds of Golden Tiger 123gr FMJ bimetal using the two Gen3 Magpul magazines. All fired and cycled successfully. I'm going to purchase some new Wolf Polyformance 125gr FMJ copper jacket to see how it performs. Brass cased 7.62x39 is very expensive, but I'd rather not shoot the bimetal jacketed ammo through the 553RP.
Today I fired 120rds of the aforementioned Wolf Polyformance 125gr FMJ copper jacket through the 553RP. Function was 100%. I ran the 1st through with the gas regulator set to 14. It was tossing brass about ten yards. For the 2nd, 3rd and 4th magazines, I set the gas regulator to 13. Most cases went about five yards on average. I didn't try setting it to 12 because I figured that would be pushing my luck too far. Now to fill out that Form 1.
https://s13.postimg.org/c8mpmnl6v/553_RP_at_the_range.jpg
I took the 553RP out to the range again today. I'd purchased some Tula 122gr FMJ copper jacketed ammo from SGAmmo.com and wanted to see if it would run like the Wolf Polyformance 125gr FMJ. It fired and cycled 40rds through the 553RP just fine. It's hard to say if it's as accurate as the Wolf due to the lack of a buttstock. I also fired another 40rds of the Wolf Polyformance 125gr FMJ copper jacket which fired and cycled just fine too. I actually changed the gas valve over to the 12 setting and it was ejecting spent cases with plenty of distance. Perhaps it was tossing spent cases further today at the 12 setting due to it being a bit warmer. The magazine I used was a 30rd Arsenal waffle for all but the first 10rds which were fired through a couple of 5rd Arsenal waffles. Oddly enough, the 5rd mags had difficulty locking in while the 30rd mag was not problem. This is odd since they appear identical up top with the 30rd mag just being longer.
https://s14.postimg.org/ufldjkur5/553_R_with_Tula_122gr_copper_jacket.jpg
ramairthree
03-25-18, 08:48
Cool.
I have the 556, SBR. Not factory. Pistol upper with the stocked lower. I do have issues with light primer strikes with some varities of steel cases ammo with it.
I recently got a used 556R Carbine. The 3rd gen magpuls are my tightest mags. I have not had light primers strikes or any malfunctions with it. I have used first gen and later magpuls, tapco it came with, some Chinese smooth backs, some 40 rounds smoothbacks, and some assorted European metal ribbed. It likes 124 grain TULA HPs best group wise. I no longer have any of my Norinco ammo stash.
Other than length, what is the essential difference besides length and this being real SIG vs USA compared to the 55R?
I regard my 556 as a less ergonomic AR with a folding stock.
I regard my 556R as a more ergonomic AK.
Neither of which matters as both are dead platforms.
I can't speak for the 556R because I don't have one. However, comparing my 556 SBR to this 553RP, I'd say that the difference has to do with the quality of manufacturing. This difference is especially evident when you look at the bolt carrier and bolt. The Swiss bolt carrier and bolt just look perfectly manufactured. That said, my 556 SBR is a great rifle. The only thing I find lacking is that it is over gassed, but I'm working on a fix for that. I know there were some reliability issues with the US 556 rifles, but I have been fortunate enough not to have had any problems. I could buy a 5.56 chambered Swiss manufactured 553, but the 556 SBR is doing everything that I want it to do, so I don't feel the urge. Plus, I actually like the fact that it takes AR15 magazines. I have a Swiss manufactured 551 on order from JDI and wish that it would also take AR15 magazines. I know that's blasphemy to some and I do like AK type rock and lock magazines, but I just find that the proprietary Swiss 5.56 magazines don't offer an improvement over AR15 magazines. Plus, the AR15 magazines are less expensive and give you three easy sec922(r) compliance parts.
ramairthree
03-26-18, 16:21
Thank you.
I suspected something along those lines, but do not have one to compare.
I got the stamp back to make my 553R an SBR. I'm now working on the stupid sec922(r) compliance. The US magazine counts for thee parts and the trigger group counts for three parts. I need one more assuming the flash hider is removable. Based on the finish, the flash hider looks to be a separate part from the barrel. Before I start cranking on it, does anyone know if it's somehow permanently attached? If not, is it right hand or left hand twist?
Standard 30 cal flash hider threading
There is no universal standard, which is why I asked. AR-10's are 5/8x24RH, AK47's are M14x1LH, vz.58's are M14x1RH, etc. If they decided to follow the AK47 pattern, then the flash hider is LH. Otherwise, it's likely RH. I'd like to know before I try to twist it off.
According to Dave when I asked it is the typical AR 10 Pattern of 5/8x24 RH. Feel free to PM him on facebook, however, that is what I was told.
Great. I'll try the leftie-loosie twist off.
MadAngler1
07-25-18, 16:45
Did you finally get the gen 3 magpul mags to work? Since US Palm is now bankrupt, whom else makes quality AK mags? Does Arsenal have US made mags? Nothing beats Bulgarian waffles and Russian mags for AK 47 and 74 pattern rifles IMHO. It seems that non-Bulgarian and Russian AKs tend to have different tastes when it comes to polymer AK mags.
Just to clarify, I am referring to polymer mags. Old steel eastern block mags run great as well
I did get the Magpuls to work, but it took some filing on the catch tabs. Arsenal has mags with US followers and floor plates. That would be a better alternative, but you'd have to use another US compliance part somewhere else. My US compliance parts are:
FCG = 3
Magazine = 3
Flash hider = 1
As far as I know, there are not any other US parts that can be used, but I'm open to ideas.
I was finally able to complete my 553R SBR. I swapped out the factory trigger group with a ShootingSight hammer and sear along with a Sig USA trigger. Dry firing it definitely feels better than the factory trigger group, but I'll have to see how it feels at the range. Dave confirmed that the threading of the muzzle is 5/8x24RH. I was able to remove the factory flash hider, so now I'm looking to find something to replace it. I'm thinking about installing some sort of 3-lug adapter & flash hider combination. Suggestions are welcome. I know that many don't care about sec922(r), but the rifle is now compliant using the Magpul magazines.
https://s22.postimg.cc/h6518hg69/Sig_553_R_SBR_left_view.jpg
https://s22.postimg.cc/gtdn2b5m9/Sig_553_R_SBR_right_view.jpg
MadAngler1
08-08-18, 20:31
Range report? :-)
Got my Form 1 back on my 553R. My suppressor for it is in jail, which also has the muzzle device with it. As soon as that gets out of jail I will zero it at 50 yards with the Aimpoint T2 and some 8M3. That will make for a very deadly HD weapon. I figured I would wait a little bit until I can get the true zero with the suppressor. When shooting unsuppressed I will just accept the POI shift.
PNorris, what suppressor and muzzle device are you using? I'd like to get a suppressor, but I honestly don't know much about them. I do have a TiRant 9 that I use on some of my pistols. Are you going with one that threads on or one of those 3-lug type. From the videos I've seen, the 3-lug type seems very secure, but I've never seen one in person.
I am getting this one. https://www.silencershop.com/griffin-armament-30-sd.html#product-review-block I am pretty sure, however, that any good 30 Caliber suppressor will work. This one just had some really good reviews and I liked the QD system it comes with the muzzle device. You can also use the suppressor on 5.56 rifles as well.
Griffin is close to releasing a shorter version of the 30SD, which will be the same length (or very close) to the M4SD.
I took my Sig 553R SBR to the range today to test its function with the new trigger group and SBR configuration. It ran 100% with 120rds of Wolf 125gr FMJ (copper jacket). The trigger is still just as heavy, but it's smoother and breaks very nicely. I couldn't be more pleased.
https://s22.postimg.cc/6hg76by7l/553_R_SBR.jpg
Beautiful rifle. What is the muzzle flash like? I've watched a few videos with 12.5" AMD-65, and it was really something, but it had muzzle break that directs the blast to the sides. SG553 R has similar barrel length... Ordinary 16" barrel AK with a flash hider like bird cage or Fighter break is a pleasant shooting even indoors. I've watched Lary Vickers SG553 RP video and it seemed in the slow motion detail that the flash hider works pretty well.
Thanks. Right now it's a flame thrower because I don't have a flash hider installed. I have to install a US made one in order to keep it sec922(r) compliant. I'd like one that looks similar to the original, but have not found it yet.
MadAngler1
12-16-18, 22:35
Is there enough of a shoulder on the end of the threaded barrel to allow for use of shims with a Surefire SOCOM flash hider? I have a SOCOM 762 suppressor that might work well with this rifle.
I just watched the LAV video. It sucks you can’t at least lock the bolt back (I realize AK mags don’t have a bolt hold open).
Is JDI going to import spare bolts and bolt carriers? I only see 556 stuff and one 762 firing pin on their website.
Is there enough of a shoulder on the end of the threaded barrel to allow for use of shims with a Surefire SOCOM flash hider? I have a SOCOM 762 suppressor that might work well with this rifle.
What exactly would tell you if there's enough of a shoulder? I can measure the diameter at the shoulder and the outside diameter of the threads.
Is JDI going to import spare bolts and bolt carriers? I only see 556 stuff and one 762 firing pin on their website.
He seems to order stuff from them on a regular basis, so I don't think it would hurt to ask. Obviously the market for 7.62x39 and 7.62x51 is much smaller that 5.56x45, so it would probably just depend on whether he thinks there's enough of a market for it or not. It all seems so well made to me that I'm not worried about bolts or carriers breaking. In fact, I've never seen either break on a regular factory made AK (excluding recent US made parts). If you had to replace a bolt, I'm not sure how the headspacing would work. Are they drop in or would they have to be fitted like a typical AK?
MadAngler1
12-17-18, 16:42
Thanks for the reply.
7.62 shims are 0.750" OD, 0.625" ID.
https://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/barrel-parts/rifle-barrel-hardware/washers/ar-308-shim-kit-7-62-5-8-24--prod98458.aspx
I guess I should call JDI and ask about parts. A friend of mine has like 3-4 if these Sig 553 type rifles and spent a fortune to buy spare parts. For my purposes, a Bulgarian AK tuned by Rifle Dynamics may work just as well, but the Sig has a far better optics rail. I could see the Sig being the perfect 7.62 Soviet hog gun (and deer for that matter)........assuming if I ever get time to hunt again with my job :-(
MadAngler1
12-17-18, 16:50
Forgot to add that the reason I asked the flash hider/suppressor question is because the SCAR 17’s pencil barrel doesn’t give you enough shoulder to mount a Surefire FH. You have to use the Surefire washer reversed or a special ring that Parker Mountain Machine sells. Not sure why FN didn’t give the barrel some more meat on the end. When I see your pics of your Sig, the muzzle threads look a little skinny to me
7.62 shims are 0.750" OD, 0.625" ID.
The diameter at the threads is 0.615". The outside diameter of the shoulder is 0.787". The length from the muzzle to the shoulder is 0.64". Based on mine, I think the shims should fit.
For my purposes, a Bulgarian AK tuned by Rifle Dynamics may work just as well, but the Sig has a far better optics rail. I could see the Sig being the perfect 7.62 Soviet hog gun (and deer for that matter)........assuming if I ever get time to hunt again with my job :-(
If you can afford the 553R, then get it. I have it and several Arsenal AK's. There is no comparison when it comes to quality and reliability.
I figured I might as well post here as well:
I have a question concerning green cheek rests if someone could possibly help.
Mr Vickers seemed to have had one in his 553R video, but where in the world could one of these be found -preferably new?
Also, I have one of the older WEZ "triple diamond" green ones, but know little to nothing about them or their years of manufacture -and Guisan's knowledge is no longer.. Any information concerning these would be greatly appreciated as well.
Here's a dusty pic!
54575
JDI has had them. Gunfactory.ch had them.
MadAngler1
01-06-19, 16:27
The diameter at the threads is 0.615". The outside diameter of the shoulder is 0.787". The length from the muzzle to the shoulder is 0.64". Based on mine, I think the shims should fit.
If you can afford the 553R, then get it. I have it and several Arsenal AK's. There is no comparison when it comes to quality and reliability.
Thanks for the info. I’ll make a decision after I see what comes out at the SHOT Show. I also want a 5.56 NATO SBR, and I value that over another caliber. I have a SCAR-H, and it’s a very effective hog hunting rifle IMHO. A 7.62x39 Russian Sig 553 would be the icing on the cake though (and pretty cool to own.....at least until a miracle occurs and we can get our hands on Sako M92s).
Concerning the gas valve, Who is using the 1.4,1.5,1.3,1.2 that it was shipped with (at least mine did), and has anyone used the
2.3,2.5,1.5,X that is shown in the manual -and on Dave's web page?
(Bret)
After seeing the Hogue on Gunfactory.ch, I used it as opposed to a different grip. It's not bad..
Anyone actually gotten a green cheek rest from JDI or gunfactory.ch? Gunfactory is out, and is listed as "aftermarket"?? I haven't heard back from Dave concerning these either..
Concerning the gas valve, Who is using the 1.4,1.5,1.3,1.2 that it was shipped with (at least mine did)
Me and it runs on the 1.2 setting.
and has anyone used the 2.3,2.5,1.5,X that is shown in the manual -and on Dave's web page?
That's for the 553R SB (short barrel). I definitely wouldn't use that on a 553R LB.
Thanks Bret,
Senior moment on the SB gas valve..
After looking at the paper manual that came with the 553RP, it has a separate sheet showing the existing gas valve settings: 1.4,1.5,1.3,1.2. I had been referring to the online PDF which is outdated (concerning the gas valve) for these 553RP's.
The thing that was confusing me was that JDI has the "old" gas valve (2.3,2.5,1.5,X) for sale on his website which is the same as the "old" PDF version for the 553R that I had been referring to..
Bottom line is that the gas valve settings have been changed on our newer "Gen 2" 553R's, and the X doesn't exist for silencer use with "no self load function".
If you are still looking for a flash hider, "brick" on gunbroker makes some that are very similar to the SIG FH's. I've used a few of them for 922(r) compliance parts (no, your not alone!). They have 2 ports on each side and blocked off at the top. This works for me as rifles this length would not be used in the prone position anyway. On the 751 though, I positioned the blocked off portion on the bottom before pinning it, so as not to kick up dust.
Here's a video of the 553R.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odt1nMWh7Ro
If you are still looking for a flash hider, "brick" on gunbroker makes some that are very similar to the SIG FH's.
I bought one and put it on. It looks great. Thanks!
MadAngler1
02-13-23, 16:55
Thread resurrection. JDI has these in stock again. Questions:
1. What suppressors are you running and what gas valve setting?
2. Is the bolt larger than the 551/550 bolt or did Sig do what they did with their MCX LT 7.62x39 model and make the wall thickness thinner to keep the same receiver profile? Scroll to 9 minutes to see what I am talking about:
https://youtu.be/rJ1zB5Nomb8
3. What type of accuracy with good ammo? 2 MOA is all I am asking for this gun
Thanks
All Sig 55X guns are over gassed. They must design them to run at -20F using the weakest ammunition available. I don't run a suppressor, but I can for sure say that you'll need to run it on the lowest setting as they run on that setting without a suppressor. In particular, my 553R tosses spent cases about 10yds when on the 1.2 setting.
You're overthinking the bolt wall thickness thing. The AK was designed for 7.62x39 and doesn't have near as many thin points. Plus, these parts go much further back on the bolt. I'm sure that it's happened, but I've never heard of an AK type bolt breaking in a similar manner to how 7.62x39 AR15 bolts can shear a lug.
5.56x45 vs 7.62x39
https://i.postimg.cc/zGndn7BY/556x45-vs-762x39-bolt-faces.jpg
7.62x39 over 5.56x45
https://i.postimg.cc/hGc2Mmzz/762x39-over-556x45-bolt.jpg
BTW, the bolt stems are the same diameter.
I'm sure that it's capable of 2 MOA with high quality ammunition. Unfortunately, I've only used the Russian and Ukranian stuff which itself isn't that capable.
One point to note, I did have some light primer strikes when I first started out. It turned out that a lot of Wolf Ukranian ammunition that I was using had really hard primers. They'd go off 100% using any AK, but were not 100% with the 553R. Once I figured it out, I had no more issues with a variety of ammunition. It's not likely that you'll encounter this particular ammunition again as the Russians destroyed the factory about five years ago.
Finally, don't hesitate. Buy it. While you're at it, buy the buttstock and cheek rest. You'll likely have to wait a while for them, but we can provide the measurements you need for your Form 1. The cheek rest will put your eyes at the perfect height for your optic. My 55X rifles are literally the best that I have ever experienced when it comes to a good cheek rest for a military style rifle.
MadAngler1
02-14-23, 15:12
Thank you for the quick reply.
I will definitely submit a form 1 if I buy this. There is no point otherwise. I have both a spare green adjustable Swiss stock and the Swiss made AR stock adapter for my 551's. Combine one of those stocks with a Shooting sight hammer, sear, Hogue pistol grip, Magpul AK magazine, that easily gets me to 6-7 922R parts I need, depending on how you count the trunnion in the parts count (since it is welded to the receiver). Dimensions are more than welcome.
I wish someone could get their hands on spare bolts, springs, gas tubes, etc.
Is the lowest setting on yours 0.9 or 1.2 mm? Seems like it would benefit from an OSS can, which frankly stinks on barrels shorter than 14.5-16" in my experience.
The settings on my 553R's gas valve are 1.2, 1.3, 1.4 and 1.5.
For 922(r) compliance parts you can also use a US flash hider and/or a trigger from a Sig 556 rifle. The triggers are identical, so don't worry about them being of less quality. I bought a bunch when they were available as spares. They came in bags marked "made in USA".
MadAngler1
02-15-23, 17:28
Thanks for the replies. Sounds like an OSS can (which I have) would work best with the gas port set to 1.2. A DeadAir Sandman K or Primal may be another option. I just wish they were selling spare parts for it (namely bolts, springs, etc). I bought two 551’s for that reason.
MadAngler1
02-14-24, 12:29
So I finally picked one of these up in pistol form. I have a 2nd one inbound that I will SBR.
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I put some magazines through it today with the gas set to 1.4.
What worked:
- Circle 10 bulgarian waffle magazine with Golden Tiger 123 gr JHPs (this is the good stuff with sealed primers, etc).
- Magpul MOE with PPU brass cased ammo
- Tula ammo in the Magpul magazine
What did not work:
- Bulgarian and Serbian steel magazine with Tula ammo (this is the crappy cheap stuff with gray colored cases, no coating). Multiple FTFs, one double feed
What worked half the time:
- Bulgarian commercial polymer magazine with Tula (didn't work at first, but then it worked).
I will post more pics later tonight, and on ARFCOM, of the lower and upper receiver. I am surprise there is not a larger bullet guide or feed ramp. Again, zero issues with Golden Tiger or PPU brass cased using Magpul MOE and Bulgarian Circle 10 magazines. I suspect it needs to be broken in. I shot 100 rounds and had to leave. I won't get to the range again until the end of March.
On another note, I had issues with a Swiss AR stock adapter. The typical USGI locking plate will not mate to the AR stock adapter indentation. Pics to come.
Congratulations on getting your 553R. Based on many years of experience, breaking in guns generally doesn't make them more reliable. However, this one was an exception for me. After the first range session, it became reliable, and I was eventually able to set the gas setting to 1.2. I think having it with a stock will help too.
MadAngler1
02-14-24, 23:57
OK, I took the gun apart and cleaned it. I compared the receiver to my 551s. There is a hole at the bottom just before the chamber. I guess this is for over pressured rounds (so it blows out down away from the shooter)?
71403
Note the barrel was marked 2019 but my receiver is 2021 (not shown). Kind of cool given the pandemic and how they have to batch things.
Here is the chamber. Compared to my 551, the feed ramp looks the same and is quite small. There is not much of anything between the feed ramp and the chamber, unlike the feed ramps on the M4 or an AK bullet guide. I’m just used to seeing large riveted bullet guides on my AKs. That’s all. I just think it didn’t like Tula:
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That’s the best picture I could take with my iPad. Moving on, look at the lower receiver. There is little lateral play with magazines. There is a large amount of forward and rearward play with the magazine however. This was a hard picture for me to take, but here is the Magpul MOE magazine resting naturally without any pressure on it:
71405
Now watch it when I use my finger to push the magazine forward in the lower receiver:
71406
I can do this with the steel magazines and commercial Bulgarian magazines. Not so much with the Circle 10 magazines though. I’m guessing this was by design? Once I SBR the other 553R I bought, I’ll take it to the flat range, shoot prone, and see if magazine pressure induces any malfunction. I’ll just have to stick to brass cased ammo or good quality steel cased ammo (lacquer coated, good stuff like Barnual manufactured).
Regardless, it’s nice little pistol. Needs a tax stamp.
OK, I took the gun apart and cleaned it. I compared the receiver to my 551s. There is a hole at the bottom just before the chamber. I guess this is for over pressured rounds (so it blows out down away from the shooter)?
71403
Note the barrel was marked 2019 but my receiver is 2021 (not shown). Kind of cool given the pandemic and how they have to batch things.
Here is the chamber. Compared to my 551, the feed ramp looks the same and is quite small. There is not much of anything between the feed ramp and the chamber, unlike the feed ramps on the M4 or an AK bullet guide. I’m just used to seeing large riveted bullet guides on my AKs. That’s all. I just think it didn’t like Tula:
71404
That’s the best picture I could take with my iPad. Moving on, look at the lower receiver. There is little lateral play with magazines. There is a large amount of forward and rearward play with the magazine however. This was a hard picture for me to take, but here is the Magpul MOE magazine resting naturally without any pressure on it:
71405
Now watch it when I use my finger to push the magazine forward in the lower receiver:
71406
I can do this with the steel magazines and commercial Bulgarian magazines. Not so much with the Circle 10 magazines though. I’m guessing this was by design? Once I SBR the other 553R I bought, I’ll take it to the flat range, shoot prone, and see if magazine pressure induces any malfunction. I’ll just have to stick to brass cased ammo or good quality steel cased ammo (lacquer coated, good stuff like Barnual manufactured).
Regardless, it’s nice little pistol. Needs a tax stamp.
I don't think any magazines lock up as tight as Circle 10s. Even Tantals are just tight openings, rather than solid lockups.
I've never had the pleasure to shoot a 553R but I assume there is some play just like there is on 550/551s so that rock n lock mags don't have to be force fit inserted.
The Dumb Gun Collector
02-20-24, 21:26
Man I regret not picking one of these up. I did get a regular 553 SB. I guess I have my galil ACE but nothing is as sexy as a 550.
MadAngler1
02-22-24, 21:12
Man I regret not picking one of these up. I did get a regular 553 SB. I guess I have my galil ACE but nothing is as sexy as a 550.
The Galil ACE is a tool. This 553R seems more like a toy but the jury is still out.
SteyrAUG: The forward-backward play is far more than I have seen on any AK or the 551 for that matter. If I don’t push the magazine forward, it will not release easily either from the magazine catch. I’ll see how the other 553R does when I pick it up. Work gets in the way right now.
The Galil ACE is a tool. This 553R seems more like a toy but the jury is still out.
SteyrAUG: The forward-backward play is far more than I have seen on any AK or the 551 for that matter. If I don’t push the magazine forward, it will not release easily either from the magazine catch. I’ll see how the other 553R does when I pick it up. Work gets in the way right now.
That doesn't sound good. Does Sig SAN make a specific magazine for it? You know how AK mags sometimes go.
MadAngler1
02-24-24, 03:55
That doesn't sound good. Does Sig SAN make a specific magazine for it? You know how AK mags sometimes go.
No they do not. Per the Swiss 553R manual, they designed it to work with all AK magazines. The photo from the manual shows steel mil spec, Bulgarian Circle 10, Finnish Rk 62 polymer and Soviet Bakelites.
71431
The release for better with Slip 2000 or Go-Juice. I am away for work. I will compare this lower with the second 553R I purchased when I get home. Maybe it is out of spec? The previous owner never shot it once. I intend to keep one as a spare for parts and the other to SBR. If I find the issue is permanent, I will call JDI for help.
MadAngler1
04-25-24, 20:56
OK. So I got the second 553R and I SBRed it. I got the tax stamp in record time, 11 days to be exact. Insane but I love it.
Here it is with all of the 922R parts installed (US magazine (3), Hogue pistol grip, BCM AR stock, OSS flash hider, shooting sight hammer, shooting sight sear). Per the BATF letters I have seen, you need 7 to be compliant on a 553 with a threaded muzzle. I put a BCM stock on it for now, but I'm going to try a green Magpul DT stock, just because I think all Swiss Sigs need some green on them. Also attached is a B&T handguard and a Swiss downward sloping charging handle (C&H Precision I believe).
71638
It runs 100% with Magpul MOE and M3 magazines shooting brass cased ammo (123 gr FMJ and Hornady SST 123 grain). I use the 1.4 mm gas setting with the OSS can. Good ejection no FTFs. The gun does not like Tula, but it will take Golden Tiger. I have yet to open up one of my Barnaul cans for good reason.
The BUIS are nothing to root about but get the job done. Harder to get behind compared to an AR.
I installed my Steiner P4x with a Reptilia mount. I really like this mount despite the lack of QD capability. Very slick, steam lined but yet robust.
Bad news: Even on adverse setting 1.5 mm, it will not cycle Hornady 255 gr subsonics. Also, this rifle runs dirtier than my suppressed Galil ACEs. Must be the design. The 553R also feels 1-2 lbs heavier than my Galil ACE SBR. I will eventually weigh both to compare.
Now, back to the first 553R I picked up. I fixed the magazine release issue by filing the magazine release latch on the inside of the receiver (not the receiver itself but the steel latch). It releases smoothly now. I'm keeping this 553R as a spare anyway for parts. It's my policy on all of these sorts of rare birds.
All in all, I will lug the 553R with my beloved Galil ACE SBR whenever I get a chance to shoot them. I think the Galil ACE is still more robust and lighter (eats everything I feed it), but the Sig 553R is nice because of the flat top rail and because I can easily use a scope with it. Time will tell which I prefer (work gets in the way darn it).
The Dumb Gun Collector
04-25-24, 22:33
Fantastic. I have a 553 (in 556) and a Galil Ace in 762x39 so I have always wished I had a 553R. Keep us posted!
I have both as well. The Galil Ace is certainly the better value, but I'd have to give the overall edge to the 553R. I'm glad that I have both.
I've got both as well. The 553 R is definitely finicky was mags. It is really fun to shoot suppressed though and really is cool. The Ace just runs everything and anything. Of course, the ACE extracts to the moon.
Both are over gassed. Fortunately, the 553R comes with a 4-position gas valve. Mine runs 100% on the lowest setting. I'd advise getting a KNS piston for the Ace. It really tames the ejection.
The Dumb Gun Collector
04-27-24, 17:12
I put the kns in my ace and it is freaky light kicking. Really transformed the gun.
MadAngler1
04-27-24, 18:35
Thanks for the replies guys. Sorry it took so long to circle back. Work gets in the way.
Agree. KNS pistons are a must for any Galil ACE rifle. Makes it a completely different rifle. I honestly feel that the Galil ACE Gen 1 is a superior rifle to any of the custom makes out there (Rifle Dynamics, Meridian Defense, etc). You get a CHF chrome lined barrel, milled receiver, picatinny top cover, etc. It's a bomb proof rifle, and I wish IMI would give us more spare parts like bolts, bolt carriers etc. I own a SAM-5 pimped up by RD, and I prefer the ACE to it. The Gen 2 ACE is too bulky and the AR stock adapter they use looks dumb. Gen 1 much nicer, although I wish they would offer a flip up rear sight to go with a permanent front sight. Would be the best solution for both worlds.
Anyhow, I'll try to take my 553R to the 100 yard range close to me in the next couple of months to zero the scope and for accuracy testing. Yes PNorris, the 553R prefers Magpuls and Bulgarian Waffle Circle 10s. It does not feed well with Warsaw pact spec steel magazines, Serbian, Croatian or with Bulgarian commercial spec polymer magazines I have tried. I think it has to do with the 55x's feed ramp design. They really needed a bullet guide like an AK. They can't feed 7.62x39 out of AK magazines like they can feed 5.56 out of Sig spec magazines. Different animal.
KNS pistons are a must for any Galil ACE rifle.
I have an almost complete collection of Gen 1 Ace's, so I'll add some more information. Every Ace that I have is over gassed except for the 13" and 8" 5.45x39's which are perfectly gassed as is. Oddly, my 308Win chambered SBR seems to be under gassed, though it hasn't choked on me yet. So, if you get an Ace, you should pretty much plan on buying a KNS piston. Shoot it first though just to be sure.
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