View Full Version : Mk25 stolen, looking for new gun, possibly 10mm- thoughts.
I had my Sig Mk25 stolen out of my glove box- which is weird because I had a IPad, IPhone, Maui Jims, Laptop and some cash laying in the passenger seat and that was not touched. So now I am looking to buy another gun. I am possibly leaning to buying a 1911. I have never owned a 1911 and do like them- I am possibly considering a
Colt Delta Elite 10mm
36576
or maybe a .38 super
36577
-why, I think just because its different calibers and unique- I tend to always like stuff that is not of the popular majority.
Does anyone have any experience with either caliber? Also, are these guns universal with other 1911's like grips, magwell's, sights ect.?
TheChunkNorris
12-20-15, 09:59
I'm sure you have other pistols so this would be for fun? Have you considered the Sig P220 10mm?
Well, sorry to hear of your theft. I hate thieves. Hope you got a report and had serial no. to be entered into NCIC.
Second, I'd get a Glock 20 or a S&W 1006 if you can find one.
I shot super in colts for years, before race gun shooters "discovered" it.
During the first 10mm & 1911 fall from favor (doublestack fad) I bought a stainless Delta elite on closeout crazy cheap.
It's been a great pistol, 10mm easy to load for, easy to get hot ammo, and to me is as fast to shoot as a 45.
Both 1911s and 10mm are back in vogue somewhat, so you have some good options.
But the 10mm is much more flexible and is easier to own than super. Better bullet selection, etc.
Plus you can put a 40 barrel in one and shoot cheap 40 as well.
Sent from my PRC-104 using phonetics
I'm sure you have other pistols so this would be for fun? Have you considered the Sig P220 10mm?
well, Texas is going to be an "open carry" state, I still prefer to conceal but now I'm not as worried that my gun might be showing or might be seen by accident- which will allow me to carry a larger gun more comfortably. I like full size guns but I hate having to wear layers to cover myself especially in the summer. I wanted something with a thin profile, no rail, simple and I have always liked the 1911 models. A Detonics would be awesome, I know nothing about them but I know Sonny Crockett had one and if its good enough for him, its good enough for me.
I shot super in colts for years, before race gun shooters "discovered" it.
During the first 10mm & 1911 fall from favor (doublestack fad) I bought a stainless Delta elite on closeout crazy cheap.
It's been a great pistol, 10mm easy to load for, easy to get hot ammo, and to me is as fast to shoot as a 45.
Both 1911s and 10mm are back in vogue somewhat, so you have some good options.
But the 10mm is much more flexible and is easier to own than super. Better bullet selection, etc.
Plus you can put a 40 barrel in one and shoot cheap 40 as well.
Sent from my PRC-104 using phonetics
since you have experience with both, I want to ask, what is the response from the 10mm compared to a .40 or a .45? Is t fast. is it tight or is it a loose cannon? Can you put 3 rounds on target fairly quickly and somewhat hold a tight grouping
TheChunkNorris
12-20-15, 11:44
well, Texas is going to be an "open carry" state, I still prefer to conceal but now I'm not as worried that my gun might be showing or might be seen by accident- which will allow me to carry a larger gun more comfortably. I like full size guns but I hate having to wear layers to cover myself especially in the summer. I wanted something with a thin profile, no rail, simple and I have always liked the 1911 models. A Detonics would be awesome, I know nothing about them but I know Sonny Crockett had one and if its good enough for him, its good enough for me.
Seems like the Colt or maybe even the Glock is what you'd actually use. I've seen the Sig and it was rather nice looking. Wish Bren Tens were available and maybe I'd consider a 10mm.
Gunnar da Wolf
12-20-15, 11:56
In ancient times I carried a S&W 1006 as an issued gun. Very accurate and controllable with full tilt 10mm ammo. Hits like a .41 magnum, I was able to knock down Pepper Poppers at 100 yards reliably. When time came to trade them in several exhibited some peening of the area of the frame next to the feed ramp. It didn't seem to affect reliability but was worrisome enough that I didn't buy the gun back. But you probably won't have a government agency buying your ammo either.
I've shot the Delta and it's more of a good thing accuracy wise. I'm very interested in the SIG 10mm but too invested in .45acp pistols at this time.
Supposed to leave a Ruger in the glove box, not a Sig...
I don't have 38 Super, so I can't help with a comparison. I bought a new edition Delta 3 years ago for a hunting sidearm. It has served me well. I cannot shoot it as fast as a 45acp 1911, but is not terribly slower. i have carried it on occasion, usually during hunting season. If you already reload for 40, it is just a die adjustment to reload 10mm. My 40 dies have only been used for 10mm since I bought that pistol. The frame was changed on the newer versions, so they are not breaking like the previous generations.
Having owned both a 10mm and 38 super Colt I would choose the .38 super unless you are planning on using it as a hunting gun. Full power 10mm hits hard, like a 41 mag but I would not consider it controllable enough to shoot quickly on multiple targets. They make downloaded 10mm but now you basically have a single stack .40 S&W.
Quick question? Were you keeping your MK 25 as. " car gun" or did you simply have to stash it due to going someplace you couldn't CC? I ask because theft from vehicles is a significant source of crime guns and a pet peeve of mine. If you must stash your CC piece, please invest in a console vault bolted into the car or a locked case like a Gunvault mini under the seat cable locked to the frame.
The concept of a "car gun" is popular here in TX because that was the only legal way to carry here prior to the CHL law. It has remained popular because it gets very hot and people are too damn lazy to carry their gun. Unfortunately, we have CHLs in large part because the notion you will have time to return to your car and retrieve your car gun in an emergency was proven to be BS. If you need a gun for defense you will need it RIGHT NOW.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=532248616
Dan Wesson 10mm. Nice guns
Gary1911A1
12-21-15, 12:28
Also sorry to hear about your Sig being stolen. In 1911s' I would recommend Dan Wessons and if you liked your Sig the 220 in 10MM is a very good pistol. Both the Razorback and Sig 220 10MM are about the same size and weight.
Auto-X Fil
12-21-15, 13:07
My brother has a P220 in 10mm - the stainless Match Elite version. It's one of the most accurate handguns I've used, and is my favorite 10mm by far. I can't recommend it enough.
Please everyone, don't leave guns in your cars. It is one of the main ways they get into the hands of criminals. Really you should never leave anything of value in your car, let alone visible. Anti-gunners love to paint gun owners as irresponsible and push for more legislation. Leaving a gun in a glove box with bait (iPad etc.) visible is asking for a theft. If you absolutely don't have any choice but to leave a gun in your car, consider getting a mounted lock box in your trunk or at least put it in your trunk with nothing visible in the main cab to encourage a vehicle burglary in the first place. Let's not give the anti-gun people ammunition.
I don't "leave" my guns in the car, I had placed my gun in the center console for a short while. This happened at my home, in my circular drive in a well established N Dallas neighborhood. The fact that they took my gun and not my laptop, Rolex Presidential, IPhone, IPad, or around $1500 in cash seemed suspicious, the police officer I called said it looked like a insider job, meaning someone either threw a dart at a dartboard and took a chance or knew exactly what I had and came for only 1 thing. I drive a Mercedes and it is common knowledge that a Mercedes key fob will by default open 1 out of every 5 Mercedes. When the Police told me that, I narrowed it down to 1 person that I thought would do this. I cannot prove it but he has a history for always needing money, I mean, he sold every toilet he had in his house on craigslist for $25 one time when he was desperate. Even sold a 2006 Cadillac he owned for $400- it was worth $10k. I had the officer record all of this. He told me the city he lived in had him under suspicion for non related things-mostly being associated with another man who was a fence.
I called 4 gun shops that were open today and none had either a 10mm or 38 super in stock. I think I made up my mind on the Delta Elite
I don't "leave" my guns in the car, I had placed my gun in the center console for a short while. This happened at my home, in my circular drive in a well established N Dallas neighborhood. The fact that they took my gun and not my laptop, Rolex Presidential, IPhone, IPad, or around $1500 in cash seemed suspicious, the police officer I called said it looked like a insider job, meaning someone either threw a dart at a dartboard and took a chance or knew exactly what I had and came for only 1 thing. I drive a Mercedes and it is common knowledge that a Mercedes key fob will by default open 1 out of every 5 Mercedes. When the Police told me that, I narrowed it down to 1 person that I thought would do this. I cannot prove it but he has a history for always needing money, I mean, he sold every toilet he had in his house on craigslist for $25 one time when he was desperate. Even sold a 2006 Cadillac he owned for $400- it was worth $10k. I had the officer record all of this. He told me the city he lived in had him under suspicion for non related things-mostly being associated with another man who was a fence.
I called 4 gun shops that were open today and none had either a 10mm or 38 super in stock. I think I made up my mind on the Delta Elite
Don't tell people you own guns. Tell your wife and kids to keep quiet, too. Don't drive a Mercedes/BMW/etc.
Don't tell people you own guns. Tell your wife and kids to keep quiet, too. Don't drive a Mercedes/BMW/etc.
This post wasn't about my gun getting stolen, I hope it isn't in the wrong hands but I can go buy another gun, any gun. it was just getting other member thoughts and experience on a 10mm or 38 Super in a 1911 configuration.
Auto-X Fil
12-21-15, 19:53
Oh jeez, I forgot my measuring tape. I didn't know it was going to be that kind of thread.
Oh jeez, I forgot my measuring tape. I didn't know it was going to be that kind of thread.
this thread was about any thoughts or opinions on a 10mm or a 38 super, then i was told not to drive a certain car. Sorry. Its NOT that kind of thread, ive already made up my mind though to get a Colt Delta Elite 10mm.
Don't tell people you own guns. Tell your wife and kids to keep quiet, too. Don't drive a Mercedes/BMW/etc.
Totally off topic, but oddly enough every Jeep I owned (four - Cherokees, not soft top Wranglers) got broken into at some point, since switching to a BMW I haven't had a single problem....
And yeah, don't leave guns in cars. It seems like an Agent in my agency loses a gun every few months that way, and it drives me NUTS every time I have to read the official email about it. Carry it on your damn person or take it inside your house.
kantstudien
12-21-15, 22:59
Spend money on a good holster system first, then worry about getting another gun.
That being said, I don't think you'll be able to shoot full power 10mm loads out of a Delta Elite because of the lack of full case support (or so I've read).
I always try to park next to someone with a nicer / sportier car than me. One of the guys I work with drives a Jaguar, I almost always park next to him!
I don't "leave" my guns in the car, I had placed my gun in the center console for a short while. This happened at my home, in my circular drive in a well established N Dallas neighborhood. The fact that they took my gun and not my laptop, Rolex Presidential, IPhone, IPad, or around $1500 in cash seemed suspicious, the police officer I called said it looked like a insider job, meaning someone either threw a dart at a dartboard and took a chance or knew exactly what I had and came for only 1 thing. I drive a Mercedes and it is common knowledge that a Mercedes key fob will by default open 1 out of every 5 Mercedes. When the Police told me that, I narrowed it down to 1 person that I thought would do this. I cannot prove it but he has a history for always needing money, I mean, he sold every toilet he had in his house on craigslist for $25 one time when he was desperate. Even sold a 2006 Cadillac he owned for $400- it was worth $10k. I had the officer record all of this. He told me the city he lived in had him under suspicion for non related things-mostly being associated with another man who was a fence
Elephant, I'm not trying to pick on you. The reality is I've done the same thing in the past and been fortunate that I didn't have my gun stolen. I only comment to spread awareness. One of the main ways guns get stolen is from being left in cars and the anti-gun people love to rub this in our faces when we claim "responsible gun ownership." Sad thing is they have a point. It's our responsibility to keep our guns reasonably secure. The passenger compartment of a car doesn't cut it. At this point my gun is either within arms reach or in a safe. Again not to pick on you, but in this environment we need to be doing things the right way to not give anti-gun people any additional ammo against us.
since you have experience with both, I want to ask, what is the response from the 10mm compared to a .40 or a .45? Is t fast. is it tight or is it a loose cannon? Can you put 3 rounds on target fairly quickly and somewhat hold a tight grouping
Sorry for the delayed response. I started this whole exercise way back in the 70's trying to get .357 performance in a 1911. Which led to handloaded 38 Super.
Went back to .45, but was also shooting IHMSA at the time with big pistols (7BR), and .45 was very difficult on the 50yd pigs due to drop, etc. 1911's fell from favor due to doublestack fad, and I picked up a 10mm DE cheap. And never went back, much flatter shooting, better on 50yd IHMSA pigs for fun.
I find 10mm in the Delta Elite to recoil flatter, but harder and sharper. Net-net: I shoot it about as fast as .45 for all but the most powerful 10mm loadings in heavier bullet weights.
It does not "rock" as much in recoil, but stings the hand a bit more when above 40cal loadings. But I grew up shooting magnum pistols, so am used to the sting.
The advantage the 10mm has over super is that you can go lighter bullets (165g) and get .357 Mag performance, or you can go heavier and have .45+P performance.
Also real .38 Super is .357, so 9mm bullets (.355-.356) are not as accurate. Don't know what they are making the barrels now, but this used to be an issue with super. hard to find auto friendly hollowpoints. (less of an issue now with XTP and similar)
Plus bullets are very cheap due to .40SW. Cases are also reasonable from Starline. In this regard, 10mm is cheaper for me to shoot than .45 due to the much lower bullet prices.
I mostly shoot 160-180g overruns from Nosler, loaded to 40SW levels when shooting for fun. Very reliable, can shoot all day long.
But even superhot 10mm loadings are easier to shoot than 41mag in a blackhawk, another favorite.
teutonicpolymer
12-22-15, 20:58
I suppose it might already be too late since you've made up your mind already but I would not get a Colt for 10mm... The delta elites cannot even handle full power 10mm loads so you end up needing to buy "delta elite" loads which is just silly. If you want a 10mm the Glocks are good options; if I could only have one pistol, it would probably be one of the full size 10mm Glocks. The new SIG P220 10mm's look nice. Dan Wesson makes very nice 1911's and they are still 1k-2k guns. As for used guns, there are the old S&W 1006's and 610's which are both nice but overpriced for what they are.
Hot 10mm loads are really not that bad once you get the hang of it. Even top end loads like Underwood can be very well controlled. As has been said, the bullets are cheap. The cases are actually pretty cheap as well. Ammo prices are pretty close to .45 ACP and .40 S&W if you buy Prvi Partizan. The energy delivered surpasses .357 magnum in virtually all hot loads while .45 acp +p is left in the dust (10mm is more like .45 super). I think 10mm is probably more available than .38 super nowadays as well. 10mm is a great cartridge (probably my favorite handgun cartridge) and is highly versatile from bullet weights to bullet energy/power factor.
Agreed on Glock over Delta Elite for 10mms due to cartridge support. Additionally, if you're not familiar with 1911 style firearms training on your part will be required if this is to be a defensive use sidearm (external safeties etc.)
The 1911 10mm can be tuned for heavier or lighter loads with different recoil springs, hammer springs and a flat bottom Firing pin stop.
The Glock 20/29 are good guns but they actually don't run very well with very heavy loads like the Underwood "Rhino Rollers".
teutonicpolymer
12-24-15, 18:55
The 1911 10mm can be tuned for heavier or lighter loads with different recoil springs, hammer springs and a flat bottom Firing pin stop.
The Glock 20/29 are good guns but they actually don't run very well with very heavy loads like the Underwood "Rhino Rollers".
I have not found that to be true, even with 220 gr hard casts through a G20 with stock barrel nor the lighter but faster and higher energy loads
The gen 4 double spring set up is pretty good at dealing with wimpy to heavy loads
Lost River
12-26-15, 15:47
The 1911 10mm can be tuned for heavier or lighter loads with different recoil springs, hammer springs and a flat bottom Firing pin stop.
The Glock 20/29 are good guns but they actually don't run very well with very heavy loads like the Underwood "Rhino Rollers".
That has has not been my experience at all, with 10mms and Glocks. In the last 20 years, I have had 3 G20s and a couple G29s. Swapping out for heavier recoil springs, I have run heavy for caliber, hard cast projectiles extensively, and found the large frame Glocks work quite well as a platform.
I just wanted something different, lately I have tried to stay away from the "go to" guns. I have a Sig 226,232, 238, Glock 17,19,26, HKUSP 45, USP 9 compact, P2000 HK45, Walther PPS, P99 and an old S&W 5906(which is my favorite). I just wanted something nobody had or desired to have- I don't know why, I've been looking for Detonics, BrenTen, S&W 1006, Delta Elite, or some type of obscure 1911 model.
teutonicpolymer
12-29-15, 02:16
I just wanted something different, lately I have tried to stay away from the "go to" guns. I have a Sig 226,232, 238, Glock 17,19,26, HKUSP 45, USP 9 compact, P2000 HK45, Walther PPS, P99 and an old S&W 5906(which is my favorite). I just wanted something nobody had or desired to have- I don't know why, I've been looking for Detonics, BrenTen, S&W 1006, Delta Elite, or some type of obscure 1911 model.
If you want something different and don't mind paying more then you might like the S&W 1006, S&W 610, or a 10mm 1911 with a "fully supported" barrel (aka not a delta elite). Perhaps a 10mm longslide 1911 would fit the bill for a more unique gun. Dan Wesson has a longslide 10mm coming as a 2016 model.
thespaceghost
01-04-16, 15:04
I love the 10mm versatility and have a Glock 29 that is somewhere in the realm of awesome. Good balance between a smaller (yet hardy) size frame and cartridge.
EAA has 10mm in several lengths and frame constructions.
Brand new to the market last year, Rock Island Armory has two new 10mm with Commander length frame (one rail, one non-rail). 8 round mags and very reasonable price. They take mags from Colt, Metalform, Mec-Gar etc. Shoots great and recoil is stout but manageable.
Shouldn't have left your pistol unattended. I hope nobody gets hurt as a result.
Spend money on a good holster system first, then worry about getting another gun.
That being said, I don't think you'll be able to shoot full power 10mm loads out of a Delta Elite because of the lack of full case support (or so I've read).
Correct.....Steer WAY clear of the Colt Delta Elite. Had one rupture a FACTORY Buffalo Bore cartridge in the face of one of my shooting acquaintances.
Brass shrapnel lodged in his face and were it not for his shooting glasses, he might have lost an eye.
He sold it the following week and unfortunately, bought a gLoCk, but at least it hasn't spit in his face.
http://hkguns.zenfolio.com/img/s/v-2/p1522060347-4.jpg
http://hkguns.zenfolio.com/img/s/v-2/p1522060386-4.jpg
Correct.....Steer WAY clear of the Colt Delta Elite. Had one rupture a FACTORY Buffalo Bore cartridge in the face of one of my shooting acquaintances.
I'd probably state that a bit differently... Make sure you go with a fully supported case barrel if you want to shoot some of the non-SAAMI +P, heavy & super hot, or similar loads from mfgs like Buffalo or Underwood.
Implying they are factory (in the SAAMI sense) loads is very misleading, and nowhere does Buffalo Bore imply that nor do they provide any info I've seen on SAAMI pressure testing.
BB is known for very heavy for caliber 10mm loadings that are extremely hot and way above standard 10mm pressures.
The good news is that if you want to go super hot and heavy, you can do so with several decent options.
Sent from my PRC-104 using phonetics
Cant believe all the repetive bashing in here. It happened, he wasnt asking for everyone's opinions of stashing a firearm. It was, in my eyes, obviously someone who knew. Regardless, this wasnt the point of the topic.
On the point of the topic, I have zero experience with 10mm, though i have heard so many pronouns about it (good and bad ). I liked the .38 super 1911 i got to try from a random at the range bench (he was interested in trying out my Canik 55 "Dolphin" TP9.) So, in exchange, we tried each other's out.
The .38 Super was reletively controllable for me. But, again, no in depth experience with either.
Nonetheless, sorry to hear about the happening Elephant, i surely hope your replacement serves you well.
I'd probably state that a bit differently... Make sure you go with a fully supported case barrel if you want to shoot some of the non-SAAMI +P, heavy & super hot, or similar loads from mfgs like Buffalo or Underwood.
Implying they are factory (in the SAAMI sense) loads is very misleading, and nowhere does Buffalo Bore imply that nor do they provide any info I've seen on SAAMI pressure testing.
BB is known for very heavy for caliber 10mm loadings that are extremely hot and way above standard 10mm pressures.
The good news is that if you want to go super hot and heavy, you can do so with several decent options.
Sent from my PRC-104 using phonetics
Fair enough, but I disagree. These were not especially hot buffalo bore rounds and the Colt should have been able to handle them without a case rupture.
I got a Colt .38 super auto just because I always wanted one. Both the 10mm and .38SA are reloaders cartridges so if you don't mind actually having to buy your cases then go for it. I've played with super soft loads and max loads and had fun the whole way.
Fair enough, but I disagree. These were not especially hot buffalo bore rounds and the Colt should have been able to handle them without a case rupture.
Buffalo Bore themselves label standard or lower pressure loadings as exactly that. Most of their 10mm loadings are bullets about 20 grains heavier for velocity than SAAMI loadings.
Your core point is still valid, fully supported case is a good thing and critical if you want to go max hot.
Kind of like the difference between a sw29 and a super blackhawk. If you want to push the pressure envelope better go with a design with more safety margin
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.