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vicious_cb
01-20-12, 04:54
If they can keep the weight down I might have to ditch my DD rails for these.
http://militarytimes.com/blogs/gearscout/2012/01/16/geissele-rail-you-betcha/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UO4_YOswsqA
Robb Jensen
01-20-12, 05:12
Yes it's quite nice.
Bill Geissele is a mechanical genius, and wouldn't be coming out with a rail system if it was significantly different than the current players in that market like DD, Troy, Centurion, Larue, etc.
I think the larger barrel nut is a very nice feature that will allow for more contact area with the rail, and by extension this will yield more rigidity, and should also help with heat dissipation.
I have good faith in anything Bill makes, but I don't know that I'd be ditching anything for anything.
But then I'm still using my DD M4 rail on the same gun for the last 5+ years.
From the videos of the Geissele handguard he mentions not having to line up the gas tube notches, which in and of itself is great.
vicious_cb
01-20-12, 06:16
The fact that the Geissele rail got a mil. contract over other more well known rail manufacturers like KAC or DD says a lot. If anyone who is at SHOT gets a chance to handle these let us know.
IrishDevil
01-20-12, 08:00
The one thing I haven't seen about this rail is anti-rotation. He(Bill G.) mentioned the production version will have teeth that engage the barrel nut, but I don't see that as an anti-rotation measure.
Is the bottom rail removable?
I see the top rail is not taken to the extreme end which is also a negative.
IrishDevil
01-20-12, 08:52
No, it's one piece.
Already decided I'm swapping to this geisselle rail on my precision .223 ar. The Geisselle looks to be a more comfortable sturdy option than my current setup, and I love the way it looks.
No, it's one piece.
Then I fail to see what this brings to the table over previous offerings.
The fact that the Geissele rail got a mil. contract over other more well known rail manufacturers like KAC or DD says a lot. If anyone who is at SHOT gets a chance to handle these let us know.
What did they get a contract for?
justin_247
01-20-12, 10:20
Then I fail to see what this brings to the table over previous offerings.
For once, Scott and I agree. What's so great about this rail other than the name attached to it?
IrishDevil
01-20-12, 10:23
The contract was for a 416 rail, they developed the M4 rail at the same time.
The contract was for a 416 rail, they developed the M4 rail at the same time.
Correct.
C4
bnanaphone
01-20-12, 10:56
That's a great looking rail. If I was in the market for a new one, I would strongly consider it. I certainly don't see it replacing my VTAC TRX Extreme rails any time soon, unless they prove to be unreliable.
skullworks
01-20-12, 11:23
The interface looks like the Spuhr Interface (http://www.spuhr.com/interface.html), but it might just be the picture.
Oops, checked the video; I was wrong.
Bill did a great job with this rail. The ONLY thing I'll say is that it requires a new barrel nut.
With that in mind the Daniel Defense rail is totally drop in, and is so low profile and light it makes the normally boat-anchor-heavy 416 feel like a modern featherweight SBR.
ETA these comments are in regards to the 416 rail!
I don't know, it has some nice features. I like the built in QD socket and the steel inserts for rail attachments. It's jumping on the bandwagon of removable rail sections, which is also nice. Like the others, I wouldn't dump any of my current forends for it, but depending on weight, I'd probably try one for a future build if it fit the specs I needed.
The contract was for a 416 rail, they developed the M4 rail at the same time.
For the M27 IAR or simply others being issued throughout the inventory?
IrishDevil
01-20-12, 14:08
For the M27 IAR or simply others being issued throughout the inventory?
Bill G. says that SOCOM approached them for the 416 rail, so I'm guessing that doesn't include the M27.
Bill did a great job with this rail. The ONLY thing I'll say is that it requires a new barrel nut.
With that in mind the Daniel Defense rail is totally drop in, and is so low profile and light it makes the normally boat-anchor-heavy 416 feel like a modern featherweight SBR.
ETA these comments are in regards to the 416 rail!
The 416 rail uses the standard HK barrel nut. The M4 rail uses the proprietary barrel nut
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
You're right, I was told the wrong thing at the booth and during the AAC Big Bang shoot. The 416 is drop in.
Smart design always wins. Congrats to Bill and his team on another one. That's a sweet and very well thought-out rail.
Robb Jensen
01-20-12, 18:38
It's a nice rail, made in black, FDE and a dark green. The bottom rail and side rails come with it and are removeable. The barrel nut is steel and about 3" long and locks up with two steel bolts very solidly. IIRC he's offering this in 10"-15" in 1" increments. It's not the lightest rail but very nice. I picked up 2 ACT triggers from him to these are USGI triggers which are are really nice these come with Geissele pins and have a Nickel-Boron finish and give about 5lb very smooth single stage pull. Bill G has a few of these there with 50K+ dryfires on them.
I'm in the process of narrowing down items for a 14.5 complete rifle, I was set on the Apex tube, but I'll definately be watching for info on this system.
Bill did a great job with this rail. The ONLY thing I'll say is that it requires a new barrel nut.
With that in mind the Daniel Defense rail is totally drop in, and is so low profile and light it makes the normally boat-anchor-heavy 416 feel like a modern featherweight SBR.
ETA these comments are in regards to the 416 rail!
DD did a 416 rail? Any pics?
Anything is better than the stock 416 rail, ugh.
Geissele rail looks like a winner, I will definitely be picking one of those up.
I'm excited for this rail, as well as the new Noveske and Midwest Industries rail.
It's going to be hard to choose between the three. Hopefully someone makes a review that compares the specs of all 3.
New Noveske rail:
http://www.weaponevolution.com/forum/showthread.php?3615-Noveske-s-New-Rail
New Midwest rail:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7q68bw4L0EU
I really liked the Geissele rail I looked at in their booth. Very solid and one little thing they did I really like is the rail sections screw right in to the rail similar to the LaRue slick rail. No T nuts or anything like that. Be interesting to see when they are actually available and the price point.
I'm pretty sure in the video he said around $325 in the Spring. Lengths will be every inch.
I'm pretty sure in the video he said around $325 in the Spring. Lengths will be every inch.
Thats one thing that tilts the shit out of me about the show and about the firearms industry in general:
Me: "When can I buy them?"
Anyone with something cool: "Later in the year. Probably. If we get caught up."
I'm pretty sure in the video he said around $325 in the Spring. Lengths will be every inch.
I'm in the market for a rail of that style for my 6920 duty rifle, but $325 is probably going to be too much. I'll probably have to settle for a VTAC or maybe the new Midwest model.
I recognize that you get what you pay for and the Geissele looks like a winner, but unless it is discounted I won't be able to justify the difference.
eternal24k
01-21-12, 08:29
looks great, but I feel like it would have to be a little cheaper to rock any boats
Probably plenty other good options for M4, but so far it's only non-OFM option for HK (if not counting vaporware from Remington Defense). It probably will not be lighter than HK rail, but looks way more comfortable.
Looks like it's very well thought out..I'm impressed with the barrel nut.I hope they do well with it..
The Geissele rail looks fantastic. I just went back and forth between the Geissele rail and the new Daniel Defense MFR, and I'd have to go with the Geissele.
Now... if DD had made the MFR with the bolt-up system on their Lite rails, I might reconsider.
Teeth on the barrel nut is not an anti-rotation device. I'm surprised that one of the multiple techniques available for this feature are not used here. Hopefully Geissele will use some tabs to index on the upper receiver, a la MFR, on the production version.
It's made to handle some serious weight pulling on it so worrying about rotation might be a bit premature.
DD did a 416 rail? Any pics?
Anything is better than the stock 416 rail, ugh.
There are several photos of it on BookFace, but here's one from Daniel Defense page [it's the tubular handguard in the middle]:
http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/407372_287791877935345_131185560262645_659729_7591540_n.jpg
Does anyone have the dimensions on this bad boy?
Looks like another nice option for the slick rail lovers. I'm more excited to finally know how to pronounce Geissele though...
I'm very excited about this rail but why does the HK version have built in QD mounts and the M4 version does not?
I'm very excited about this rail but why does the HK version have built in QD mounts and the M4 version does not?
Because customer who ordered HK rail requested high strength QD (stronger than rail attachment) mounts, and M4 version is made "by the way". This kind of QD mount rises costs (handguard must be made thick then machined down, not just extruded), when not special request, no reason to put it here.
FightingTupperware
01-28-12, 19:29
questions.
1 how dose the "rail" attach to the the nut?
2 how dose the nut make things stronger when the thinest cross-section is the forged receiver itself?
i kick myself now because i was at the show and bought a trigger at there booth (SSA-E... WOW!) but did not even realize they had a rail.
Now... if DD had made the MFR with the bolt-up system on their Lite rails, I might reconsider.
I want to scream every time I see the MFR and think about my RISII.
Why why why didn't they do that??
I want to scream every time I see the MFR and think about my RISII.
Why why why didn't they do that??
You're right, the RISII and Lite both have the same system. I realize it ain't cheap, and it uses a non-standard barrel nut, but it's a really decent way to attach a free float handguard.
continuous 12 o'clock rail
no need to drill some gay-ass hole in your upper (WTF, Noveske?)
and it is SOLID.
plus, DD offers them with cutouts for fixed front sights, so you know they're not just poser rails ;)
Robb Jensen
01-28-12, 20:12
You're right, the RISII and Lite both have the same system. I realize it ain't cheap, and it uses a non-standard barrel nut, but it's a really decent way to attach a free float handguard.
continuous 12 o'clock rail
no need to drill some gay-ass hole in your upper (WTF, Noveske?)
and it is SOLID.
plus, DD offers them with cutouts for fixed front sights, so you know they're not just poser rails ;)
You don't "have to" drill a hole in your upper receiver to install a Noveske/SWS rail. I just installed a take off Noveske/SWS rail on my 16" .300 BLK upper. I didn't drill a hole in the upper and didn't use the pin Noveske had on it when it was on the Noveske/VLTOR MUR1 upper.
Does anyone have an estimated weight on the rail w/ the barrel nut?
I would like to see more options for fixed front sight bases. Mostly those that extend on the sides up to the front of the base itself. Until then, these are nice variations to add to the wide array of choices and a nice option for someone looking for a new rail, but there isn't enough going for it to swap anything I have now for one, especially at that price point.
OTOH, I am wanting to give a his single stage GI type trigger a try. See if it is that much better than my own variant. If it is and for my normal uses I would be very interested it purchasing these types of triggers over his Geissele line up.
Because customer who ordered HK rail requested high strength QD (stronger than rail attachment) mounts, and M4 version is made "by the way". This kind of QD mount rises costs (handguard must be made thick then machined down, not just extruded), when not special request, no reason to put it here.
Not correct.
Will Geissele told me that there was no room on the M4 rail for a 45 deg swivel. However, a bolt on one will be available for the rail.
Anyway, can't wait to get one for my next project :dirol:
Honestly, I really liked the 416 rail, but was only luke warm on the regular M4 rail without the qd swivels. Too many other choices for the M4. The 416 rail is truely unique.
You don't "have to" drill a hole in your upper receiver to install a Noveske/SWS rail. I just installed a take off Noveske/SWS rail on my 16" .300 BLK upper. I didn't drill a hole in the upper and didn't use the pin Noveske had on it when it was on the Noveske/VLTOR MUR1 upper.
I think he's talking about the NSR.
Or does the current Noveske/SWS use the same mechanism?
Not correct.
Will Geissele told me that there was no room on the M4 rail for a 45 deg swivel. However, a bolt on one will be available for the rail.
Anyway, can't wait to get one for my next project :dirol:
I stand corrected :cray:
However my interest is in 416 rail, but longer (like 13-14").
I want to scream every time I see the MFR and think about my RISII.
Why why why didn't they do that??
I felt the same way but it's a cheaper rail. If they would've made it with the Lite/RIS mounting system, it would've probably cost upwards of $300 just due to the popularity. It would be a DD Lite-Lite. It also has anti-rotation tabs which I never understood why DD didn't bring over from the RIS to the Lite rails. One downside vs this rail and the Noveske is there isn't an improved accessory mounting system over any other slick tubes. Lack of QD cups and having to buy them aftermarket is odd.
I think he's talking about the NSR.
Or does the current Noveske/SWS use the same mechanism?
I think the pin will be optional or maybe not even available when the rail is sold separately. Todd K. says their current M4 uppers don't have the pin.
The Geissele rail is said to be anti-rotational but I fail to see how that could be. I don't see any feature regardless of the cross-bolts or how securely it attaches to the barrel nut that would fully prevent rotation. It wouldn't be a concern of mine but that is just a claim that I don't believe can be substantiated. That's like saying my DD Lite has anti-rotation.
any more news about release of these rails?
The fact that this is expected to be released in a 15" version has peaked my interest. I love my 14" DD lite but I wish it was a smidge longer
If they can keep the weight down I might have to ditch my DD rails for these.
http://militarytimes.com/blogs/gearscout/2012/01/16/geissele-rail-you-betcha/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UO4_YOswsqA
look nice!
Any updates on an expected release date?
According to Bill on 5/2/12....
" 15" are shipping to anodizing tomorrow. It should be no more than two weeks, three max.
13' are two weeks after the 15" "
Here are some pics of one of the first ones.....everything shown comes with it, and it's in Sand Matte for the M4 Carbine
http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x22/G-auto/004.jpg
http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x22/G-auto/005.jpg
http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x22/G-auto/008.jpg
These new rails are gonna be wicked!
Looks pretty good. Beefy as hell to boot. This and the nsr will make nice editions to the AR platform.
Atleast it appears to come with a decent qualty barrel wrench lol
TangoSauce
05-03-12, 22:49
According to Bill on 5/2/12....
" 15" are shipping to anodizing tomorrow. It should be no more than two weeks, three max.
13' are two weeks after the 15" "
Here are some pics of one of the first ones.....everything shown comes with it, and it's in Sand Matte for the M4 Carbine
http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x22/G-auto/004.jpg
http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x22/G-auto/005.jpg
http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x22/G-auto/008.jpg
These new rails are gonna be wicked!
WOW!!
The Geissele rail is said to be anti-rotational but I fail to see how that could be. I don't see any feature regardless of the cross-bolts or how securely it attaches to the barrel nut that would fully prevent rotation. It wouldn't be a concern of mine but that is just a claim that I don't believe can be substantiated. That's like saying my DD Lite has anti-rotation.
I believe the rear section of the rail closest to the receiver has extended material, anti-rotation "areas", maybe with set screws as well from the pics above. In conjunction with the mounting system, barrel nut: grooved for the cross bolt assembly, I dont see this rail moving. Looks to be a solid setup, as is all of Geissele's products.
Does anyone know if this system will be offered in a AR15 12" length?
Everything Geissele touches turns to gold:)
New custom rail for the HK shooting team.....
http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/540645_10150846051320233_286968105232_10031285_689269427_n.jpg
Everything Geissele touches turns to gold:)
New custom rail for the HK shooting team.....
http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/540645_10150846051320233_286968105232_10031285_689269427_n.jpg
While it looks pretty F'n BA, it also looks like it weighs half a ton.
vicious_cb
05-23-12, 11:51
I might have to pass even though I like most everything about this handguard. I asked whether or not bolt on plastic covers would be available and they stated that they were not needed because of the smoothed edges. I could care less about sharp edges, I shoot often with the handguard against abrasive stuff concrete and metal both of which would scratch the hell out of the nice smoothed out edges. I might have to look at the NSR which comes with true accessory support.
I might have to pass even though I like most everything about this handguard. I asked whether or not bolt on plastic covers would be available and they stated that they were not needed because of the smoothed edges. I could care less about sharp edges, I shoot often with the handguard against abrasive stuff concrete and metal both of which would scratch the hell out of the nice smoothed out edges. I might have to look at the NSR which comes with true accessory support.
"Not needed?" :confused:
You can always bolt on pic rails :rolleyes:
vicious_cb
05-23-12, 13:01
"Not needed?" :confused:
You can always bolt on pic rails :rolleyes:
Yes Im rather disappointed. I guess you could bolt on rail panels then put rail covers on them. :rolleyes:
Originally Posted By Hipwrguitar:
Originally Posted By vicious_cb:
Any plans on making polymer bolt on panels for the handguards?
At this time there are no plans for a polymer bolt-on panel. Our rails have contoured, rounded edges so there is no need for them. They will ship with two bolt-on picatinny rails.
JB
I might have to pass even though I like most everything about this handguard. I asked whether or not bolt on plastic covers would be available and they stated that they were not needed because of the smoothed edges. I could care less about sharp edges, I shoot often with the handguard against abrasive stuff concrete and metal both of which would scratch the hell out of the nice smoothed out edges. I might have to look at the NSR which comes with true accessory support.
I hope Geissele changes his mind about this. I think both LaRue and Noveske got it right by offering the covers for their slick rails.
As evidenced by the hk416 origin of the rail, intended for professional users, cosmetics not a consideration.
vicious_cb
05-23-12, 22:51
As evidenced by the hk416 origin of the rail, intended for professional users, cosmetics not a consideration.
True, but when I pay for stuff with my own dime I like to keep the wear and tear at a minimum.
As evidenced by the hk416 origin of the rail, intended for professional users, cosmetics not a consideration.
So heat mitigation and improved grip offered by polymer covers isn't an issue for "professional" users?
So heat mitigation and improved grip offered by polymer covers isn't an issue for "professional" users?
The "professional" user sadly doesn't get to take advantage of the rather mind pondering benefits of all the various neat looking polymer covers/rail panels since they have a very famous history of going tits up immediately when used in combat.
Oddly enough a pair of $15 base model Mechanix gloves provide an equal solution to the latest high speed rail cover.
Some of us have the liberty of putting things on our rifles that others simply don't have due to their circumstances not allowing it.
Everything Geissele touches turns to gold:)
So...can we count on you for an unbiased review of the rail?
The "professional" user sadly doesn't get to take advantage of the rather mind pondering benefits of all the various neat looking polymer covers/rail panels since they have a very famous history of going tits up immediately when used in combat.
Oddly enough a pair of $15 base model Mechanix gloves provide an equal solution to Magpul's latest high speed rail cover.
Some of us have the liberty of putting things on our rifles that others simply don't have the ability to do because their circumstances won't allow it.
Believe it or not they do serve a purpose for people that aren't just after "neat looking" rail panels but functionality and not constantly having to deal with gloves.
Modularity and options...one reason I suppose Noveske found a need and realistic market for them. I'm sure Geissele knows what's best for their customers though.
So...can we count on you for an unbiased review of the rail?
Overlooking the smartass nature of that question, I'll be more than happy to answer it for you....
I have no bias in regards to any rail...be it this one or any of the other new ones. It's kinda a waste of my time to ponder rails when I exclusively run LMT monolithic tops.
So heat mitigation and improved grip offered by polymer covers isn't an issue for "professional" users?
No, not really. There are these special, exotic things called "Gloves" that mitigate the need for panels.
I haven't used panels in YEARS and have somehow survived. :D
C4
The "professional" user sadly doesn't get to take advantage of the rather mind pondering benefits of all the various neat looking polymer covers/rail panels since they have a very famous history of going tits up immediately when used in combat.
Oddly enough a pair of $15 base model Mechanix gloves provide an equal solution to the latest high speed rail cover.
Some of us have the liberty of putting things on our rifles that others simply don't have due to their circumstances not allowing it.
Overlooking the smartass nature of that question, I'll be more than happy to answer it for you....
I have no bias in regards to any rail...be it this one or any of the other new ones. It's kinda a waste of my time to ponder rails when I exclusively run LMT monolithic tops.
Tit for tat, my friend. I asked a non-cosmetic, functional question and you reply with a smartass answer about the "mind pondering benefits of all the various neat looking polymer covers".
No, not really. There are these special, exotic things called "Gloves" that mitigate the need for panels.
I haven't used panels in YEARS and have somehow survived. :D
C4
Christ, I didn't know asking a legitimate question that potential customers may want to know the answer would stir up this much crap. I meant no disrespect to anyone, particularly professionals in the field. Gloves are your choice but not for everyone. Geissele's business decisions, while sometimes odd (remember S2S?) are their own to make.
Christ, I didn't know asking a legitimate question that potential customers may want to know the answer would stir up this much crap. I meant no disrespect to anyone, particularly professionals in the field. Gloves are your choice but not for everyone. Geissele's business decisions, while sometimes odd (remember S2S?) are their own to make.
Oh, I don't think you post was that big a deal, but was just explaining that those of use with a lot of time running AR, AK, Suppressors, etc have learned that Gloves are must for any type of long shooting (as do our troops).
If you don't like Gloves, that is fine with me (and most likely everyone else).
The S2S is alive and well as the G2S and we sell them on a regular basis. ;)
C4
I'm thinking that the rotation issue is not one with this rail. Those side panels with the set screws look like they could take some serious abuse before they will let the handguard rotate. My guess is if what you are doing causes them to break loose and rotate the handguard you're hands or whatever body part are hanging on to the rifle with will already be broken. The design also looks like I allows for super anal alignment of the top rail with the upper and no slop once the set screws are snugged down. From what I see I like the design. Would like to see it on a gun though. Am also wondering how thick it is since the 3, 6, & 9 o'clock sections are raised instead of a simple circle design ala the Troy or MI.
As for the panels, I don't see Geiselle getting into the molding business, but I could be wrong. I understand wanting to protect your investment, especially of that asking price comes true (OUCH); but I wouldn't make it my go no go decision point. You can always go to Home Depot and buy some grip tape and cover up the exposed ridges.
Wonder what kind of VFG would fit on there without the need to use a pic panel.
vicious_cb
05-24-12, 12:32
Asked Bill himself and got a response. I knew Geissle wouldnt get their customers down.
We have something in the prototype stage. It should do exactly what you need it to do.
Shooterman017
05-25-12, 11:10
http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x22/G-auto/004.jpg
So how much longer (I saw the reference to number of weeks Trident posted...), and how much $$$ until these (refer image) are available??
I really want to change up the rail on my SPR/Recce and it's between this and the NSR.
The "professional" user sadly doesn't get to take advantage of the rather mind pondering benefits of all the various neat looking polymer covers/rail panels since they have a very famous history of going tits up immediately when used in combat.
Oddly enough a pair of $15 base model Mechanix gloves provide an equal solution to the latest high speed rail cover.
Spot on. I have had covers come off plenty of times. The only ones I really trust are the ones from KAC. I would think that a properly attached screw on cover would be on as good as any back up sight.
No, not really. There are these special, exotic things called "Gloves" that mitigate the need for panels.
I haven't used panels in YEARS and have somehow survived. :D
C4
I could personally care less if any of my firearms show signs of use. You guys are both right about gloves, they do the job of protecting your hands from heat. Having very limited experience with the slick handguards I would think that having panels where you grip the handguard would help with traction as well as protect your hands from heat.
Any word on when the rail is going to be for sale? Grant, will you be selling them?
forFREEDOM
06-04-12, 06:22
http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm157/HKforFREEDOM/HKs/IMG_1885.jpg
+1 on gloves for any type of rail system. I love these new Mechanix gloves.
Here are some close up shots of the HK416 version in 14.5" Sand Matte color:
These were contract by the DoD with very specific specs and requests. The same specs are applied to the M4/AR version minus the QD.
http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm157/HKforFREEDOM/HKs/IMG_1892.jpg
Unlike other rail systems, the Geissele rail I received for review was discretely textured. It felt very comfortable with a wood grain feel. Slots are beveled. All edges are smooth.
http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm157/HKforFREEDOM/HKs/IMG_1897.jpg
To me, the standard rail felt pretty light. The Geissele rail is 0.2 oz lighter per inch.
http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm157/HKforFREEDOM/HKs/IMG_1884.jpg
http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm157/HKforFREEDOM/HKs/IMG_1907.jpg
http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm157/HKforFREEDOM/HKs/IMG_1910.jpg
I can't say it's the best hand guard. But quality it next to none and it's definitely the most comfortable system I've ever felt. I have a match in a couple weeks. I'll let you know how it goes.
I think that this rail was not made to be light. Looks like (at least for me) that it was made to be strong, without unnecessary weight.
forFREEDOM
06-04-12, 07:35
Absolutely. Some of the current rails would not even meet requirements. The AR/M4 versions strength will be at the bbl nut, similar to the HK version.
Bill mentioned that the rail could carry a soldier with gear by the sling if he were to be hung up on a heli skid.
http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm157/HKforFREEDOM/HKs/IMG_1907.jpg
Bar none the nicest looking HK416 I've seen....granted I'm a long rail fan, but that Geissele rail makes that rifle's form flow soooo much cleaner at least to the naked eye. Thanks for sharing with us.
I'll try and tip off Bill to this thread, perhaps then he can help us out with any questions or availability dates/prices.
I'll try and tip off Bill to this thread, perhaps then he can help us out with any questions or availability dates/prices.
I called this morning and was told 4-6 more weeks. I did not even think to ask about the price.
vicious_cb
06-14-12, 17:33
Absolutely. Some of the current rails would not even meet requirements. The AR/M4 versions strength will be at the bbl nut, similar to the HK version.
Bill mentioned that the rail could carry a soldier with gear by the sling if he were to be hung up on a heli skid.
Looks like this handguard system is a winner. I dont think Ill ever find my self hanging off a helo skid by my sling, but I do see a new solid well made handguard in my future.
BTW, do you happen to have weight of your rail with and without the barrel nut?
Looks like a solid design! It will no doubt perform as anticipated.
I called this morning and was told 4-6 more weeks. I did not even think to ask about the price.
Ouch...GA typical misses their planned release dates for new products I've found by about 4-5weeks. Just using the SD line of trigger, S2S/G2S? line, and most recently even though technically not GA...the ALG triggers.
I sent Bill an email earlier so perhaps he will reply with some more details if he has the time which I can't imagine them having....I wish I could ask Bill G 1.34 million questions in all seriousness, thus I force myself to almost never ask any questions.
Thanks for the update, and I do believe these rails will be worth the wait in the end for those who require Geissele built machinery:cool:
forFREEDOM
06-14-12, 19:25
I called this morning and was told 4-6 more weeks. I did not even think to ask about the price.
Bill said they would be $360 for the HK416 rails. Should be the ballpark price for the M4/AR variants, but don't quote me on it. From what I've seen, the AR rail will come with a solid bbl nut that allows for a simple 2 screw attachment. So I'm not sure if price will vary.
Timing sounds about right. They are currently in full swing on AR production. Then they will switch the line back to 416/MR556 rail production.
forFREEDOM
06-14-12, 19:37
Looks like this handguard system is a winner. I dont think Ill ever find my self hanging off a helo skid by my sling, but I do see a new solid well made handguard in my future.
BTW, do you happen to have weight of your rail with and without the barrel nut?
I did a full review for the HK guy... HK416/MR556 Geissele Rail (http://www.hkpro.com/forum/hk416-hk417-hq/159404-geissele-hk416-mr556-14-5-rail-14-5-bbl.html)
The HK rifles already have the same type bbl nut that will come with the AR, but not sure of the weight of it. I personally don't notice the extra weight from the added length (+5.5 inches) probably because it's so slim and comfortable to hold. Then again, it's an HK and known to be on the heavy side of the M4 variants. So I'm used to it.
I did do the math when comparing the stock 9 in HK rail to the G-rail per inch and the Geissele rail was .2 oz lighter per inch. That included the QD that's already built into the HK Geissele rail. My guess is that the AR will be slightly lighter than the HK version.
Turns out I received a reply email a little over 30 mins. after I sent my initial one...quite attentive to say the least:) I'll just post the short and sweet of the reply........
Availability: Forecast predicts the first ones available for sale to arrive next week...with the bullseye being Weds. I'm inclined to think this will be accurate as well.
Pricing: Prices are as follows. Black: 15” $375, 13”$345. Sand color will be $25 more. Each rail comes with the rail, cinch bolts, two allen wrenches, two short accessory rail and one long accessory rail with proper screws along with a barrel wrench that will install our barrel nut but also take off the stock one.
Rail nomenclature naming: I'll ask for you guys to weigh in if you'd like to about the name of these rails which will be:
The Geissele Super Modular Rail or SMR, MK1
I really like that name, and after thinking on it for a bit....I couldn't find any other rail that had similar or like namings. This is important to know prior to releasing the rails;)
Now some of you might have just caught on with the naming stuff that the MK1 term was used.....and not to your disappointment's, there will indeed be a MK2 being produced for later release. Which is something that I had not a clue about until just now reading it. I find this to be very big news in terms of both pleasing additional future potential buyer's wants/needs/budget, but also in terms of Geissele already letting the consumer/market know that they intend to aggressively attack and capture a piece of the AR rail segment. So essentially it appears to my own eyes that these initial rail models won't be 80's one hit wonders, but rather the beginning of a complete GA rail lineup.
So anyway, the SMR MK2.....
" I actually have another version of this rail coming out in two months or so. It will still use the same precision barrel nut system but will be less expensive, it will still have accessory rails but there will be some differences to make manufacturing easier. This will be the SMR MK2. I THINK prices will be about $75 less. "
Lastly, GA most certainly listens to M4C's opinion even when their presence isn't actually in the threads...and this discussion is a case and point. The following is a quote from Bill that shows that they didn't need "tipping off to the M4C audience", as they already had directly listened to some of you and already instituted changes in these rail's future designs based on them.
" I listened to the guys on M4 carbine who had mentioned a lack of anti rotation device on the rails I showed at shot so we figured one out and its incorporated in these rails. They are truly bomb proof. I need to find that thread (it might be the one you sent me) and get those guys address so I can hook them up for their good advice. "
It's so rare to be listened to by companies, and for them to put you first and foremost of importance when producing a product for a true hard use fighting rifle. Hard to even put a dollar value on what this brings to the table, but I think it's a large part of why folks should never have a problem spending a little more when buying Geissele built quality.
Singlestack Wonder
06-14-12, 22:28
Turns out I received a reply email a little over 30 mins. after I sent my initial one...quite attentive to say the least:) I'll just post the short and sweet of the reply........
Availability: Forecast predicts the first ones available for sale to arrive next week...with the bullseye being Weds. I'm inclined to think this will be accurate as well.
Pricing: Prices are as follows. Black: 15” $375, 13”$345. Sand color will be $25 more. Each rail comes with the rail, cinch bolts, two allen wrenches, two short accessory rail and one long accessory rail with proper screws along with a barrel wrench that will install our barrel nut but also take off the stock one.
Rail nomenclature naming: I'll ask for you guys to weigh in if you'd like to about the name of these rails which will be:
The Geissele Super Modular Rail or SMR, MK1
I really like that name, and after thinking on it for a bit....I couldn't find any other rail that had similar or like namings. This is important to know prior to releasing the rails;)
Now some of you might have just caught on with the naming stuff that the MK1 term was used.....and not to your disappointment's, there will indeed be a MK2 being produced for later release. Which is something that I had not a clue about until just now reading it. I find this to be very big news in terms of both pleasing additional future potential buyer's wants/needs/budget, but also in terms of Geissele already letting the consumer/market know that they intend to aggressively attack and capture a piece of the AR rail segment. So essentially it appears to my own eyes that these initial rail models won't be 80's one hit wonders, but rather the beginning of a complete GA rail lineup.
So anyway, the SMR MK2.....
" I actually have another version of this rail coming out in two months or so. It will still use the same precision barrel nut system but will be less expensive, it will still have accessory rails but there will be some differences to make manufacturing easier. This will be the SMR MK2. I THINK prices will be about $75 less. "
Lastly, GA most certainly listens to M4C's opinion even when their presence isn't actually in the threads...and this discussion is a case and point. The following is a quote from Bill that shows that they didn't need "tipping off to the M4C audience", as they already had directly listened to some of you and already instituted changes in these rail's future designs based on them.
" I listened to the guys on M4 carbine who had mentioned a lack of anti rotation device on the rails I showed at shot so we figured one out and its incorporated in these rails. They are truly bomb proof. I need to find that thread (it might be the one you sent me) and get those guys address so I can hook them up for their good advice. "
It's so rare to be listened to by companies, and for them to put you first and foremost of importance when producing a product for a true hard use fighting rifle. Hard to even put a dollar value on what this brings to the table, but I think it's a large part of why folks should never have a problem spending a little more when buying Geissele built quality.
Trident82:
FYI...Your mailbox is full.......
forFREEDOM
06-14-12, 22:34
+1 Trident. He's a true believer that if he makes something special..."the creme will rise." And that special comes from his good listening on solid feedback.
I'm also liking the name Geissele SMR MK1. I was just wondering what product name designation he would give it. I hope this one sticks.
Thanks for sharing!
Good news! Thanks for the update.
forFreedom, great looking rifle and thanks for the info.
My pleasure brother.
I learned some more info today, and now I do believe end users will see these rails hit their hands any day now. I also learned some other things going down at GA that are incredibly exciting.
I'll refrain from going any further on that point at the moment since I don't even have any secret squirrel info yet, but suffice to say that Geissele Automatics won't be known as just a trigger company much longer...I see now why they just brought in ultra high dollar machines and moved into a brand new shop, they are doing some serious things!
If my wildest fantasies become a reality, I'll have a number of pics, and some early info, and thoughts in regards to the 13" SMR MK1 tommorow evening:eek:
Singlestack....my bad brother, I need to get on top of that and will clean it up asap. If you can, hit me up via the email link I have on here as it's always nice to talk a little shop with you.
So yesterday morning I had no imminent plans for one of these rails, but yesterday afternoon I learned that one had just shipped out, and was headed my way....well, less than 24 hrs. after being shipped I just had the visit from the brown truck:dance3: (most appropriate use of an emoticon I've made in a really long time:D)
Until I gather some early thoughts, and take several quality pics, I'll post a little something to get the appetite wet....
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC06373.jpg
Several things will honestly blow you away on this rail immediately upon touching it and seeing it....but the way this damn thing feels in your hand is certainly unlike anything Ive ever even come close to feeling. The top coat finishing has a wildly awesome texture to it...again nothing like I've ever felt or seen before.
Also the barrel nut design is sheer genius...talk about reduced upper/barrel flex, and also talk about superior heat dissipation properties over everything I would imagine except for LMT's monolithic chassis and the way in which it captures the barrel. So much weakness enters into the equation via a traditional AR barrel/upper hookup, and by extension the traditional barrel nut that holds everything together.
Oh yeah, see that install tool included.....that thing should be worth at least $30-40, and basing it off the URX wrench it should be worth over a $100. Its not like a DPMS or one time use tool, this thing is truly built a little too well...especially considering that at SHOT show IIrc these weren't even to be included with the rails. This touch alone will win many folks over I promise.
When and where can we purchase these rails?
The wait is killer, as this is the perfect rail for my precision .223 upper.
Trident, if possible I would like to see pics of the barrel nut when installed on the rifle. From what I've read this geiselle rail will secure the barrel like none other. FWIW, I'm also thinking of KAC URX 3.
Also the barrel nut design is sheer genius...
Barrel nut is actually "patterned" after HK416 barrel nut.
bullittmcqueen
06-18-12, 10:23
this rail is beautiful, but that pricing just made me cry a little bit. more than likely thats going to rule it out for me....:(
Save for particular custom needs like side charging or left ejection I don't see the appeal of traditional separate rails and uppers. Full disclosure... i'm invested in the MRP/MWS platforms and my next upper will probably be a newer LMT rail optional mid or rifle length monolithic.
Just seeing this.Is this rail available yet.Don't see any mention on the Geissele web site.
It should be available any day initially through Geissele Directly.
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC06745-1.jpg
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC06778-1.jpg
It should be available any day initially through Geissele Directly.
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC06745-1.jpg
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC06778-1.jpg
That looks great.
I did call them today.Not sure who I talked to but was told to call back in 4-6 weeks to see when it would be available.
forFREEDOM
06-27-12, 19:37
Absolutely stunning.
Ouch Rudy...my bad on the availability date. Something must have changed from last week. I think for those who wait on these rails, it will be worth it in the end.
forFREEDOM...thanks brother, as you already knew these GA rails are pretty easy on the eyes:)
I really like Geissele and I will be buying this rail when its released.
That being said it has been frustrating with their communication on a timeline.
When the rail was revealed at shot show in january the timeline given was availability within two months. Some time around march the timeline became 4-6 weeks. It seems that every time someone has inquired them since then the answer is always 4-6 weeks. I'm starting to think 4-6 weeks is not based on any actual numbers but has just become their standard answer for not ready yet.
I understand that random contract requests come up and when they do that does and obviously should take precedence. I hope that is the issue.
I just wish the communication could be a little better. At this point I wouldn't be surprised if they were released next week or 6 months from now.
One thing to bear in mind with GA is that they just recently expanded their entire operation. By doing this they have brought in completely new machines, and opened several new shops to include dedicated shops for assembly and QA, heat treat and finishing processes, and lastly CNC Manufacturing.
I think this stuff unfortunately is par for the course for a rapidly expanding operation that holds their standards to the highest levels...i.e. won't release stuff til it's ready for prime time. All this said isn't to suggest I don't have sympathy for those who are waiting on something that gets delayed.
pics from GA's facebook page...
http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/268741_10150262253645233_522646_n.jpg
http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/22263_315834890232_3236310_n.jpg
Ouch Rudy...my bad on the availability date. Something must have changed from last week. I think for those who wait on these rails, it will be worth it in the end.
forFREEDOM...thanks brother, as you already knew these GA rails are pretty easy on the eyes:)
You know what they say.Good things come to those that wait.:D
What length is the rail and barrel in your pic?
With the price point on these rails being where they most likely will end up at, I'd imagine any future buyers of them don't wanna see any fast evolving generational tomfoolery...whereas weeks after you shell out the coin to buy one, a new model is introduced with built in QD cups, etc.
RE: Barrel lengths/SMR lengths
Top rifle........13" SMR / 14.5" barrel
Bottom rifle....15" SMR / 18" barrel
Weight of the 13" including barrel nut?
The Geissele SMR MK1 is currently available.
Prices are as follows:
15" Black are $375
13" Black are $345
13" Sand are $370
Just call into the shop and ask for Ashley or Barb. They will take your order over the phone.
Note we do have some blems available. This have small cosmetic defects such as scratches before anodizing. If you are interested they are $30 cheaper.
I think we have one 15" sand blem.
Weights are as follows:
15" = 20.2 oz
13 "= 18.4 oz
weights are with handguard, Geissele barrel nut and cross bolts but subtracting the weight of the stock barrel nut
accessory rails are .82 and .46 oz
WHG
That's not too bad. Now I just need some $$.
justlikeanyoneelse
07-14-12, 17:43
I'm curious why the DOD requested a specific HK416 rail? I use the stock 416 rail and love it, from my point of view I see no major improvement other than its more comfortable and has integrated qd points? Do not get me wrong I'm not knocking it or Geissele, his triggers are the only triggers I use and the rail looks neat, but unless I missed something I do not see much of an improvement to the 416.
They are producing the rail in lengths that HK does not offer, which is the main reason I am waiting on the release.
I'm curious why the DOD requested a specific HK416 rail? I use the stock 416 rail and love it, from my point of view I see no major improvement other than its more comfortable and has integrated qd points? Do not get me wrong I'm not knocking it or Geissele, his triggers are the only triggers I use and the rail looks neat, but unless I missed something I do not see much of an improvement to the 416.
Is the stock 416 rail free floated? I was under the impression it wasn't.
justlikeanyoneelse
07-14-12, 19:45
Yea its free floating
Is the stock 416 rail free floated? I was under the impression it wasn't.
Yea its free floating
Thanks. Haven't seen one in the wild yet.
Count me in on this, awesome rail from a great guy, Ill take it.
Finally got a package in today I have been waiting for since the new smr rail debuted at shot show.
Got in a 15" Sand rail I can't wait to install on my precision shooter. After seeing the color of the rail I may get my complete rifle painted to match.
Teaser pic:
http://i405.photobucket.com/albums/pp133/m1ajunkie/IMAG0114.jpg
Sweet brother....been waiting anxiously for the first few ones in the wild to report in, and hear some end user feedback from others on them.
The 15" SMR rail is such a perfect fit for a Recce or especially a SPR....If your as happy as I'm with it in that role, you'll be grinning for sure.
That sleek, and super long rail puts that bipod as far forward as one can really get which makes a tremendous difference in terms of staying down on your optics through shots, bipod loading consistency, and overall increased stability when in firing position.
When your ready I'm only a State away from you IIrc, and we can do a little SPR challenge once you get yours from above up and going. That would be a killer range session:cool:
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC07024-1.jpg
what is the weight of the stock HK rail & barrel nut?
The following info and pics were gathered by fellow member forFREEDOM....
The stock rail weighs in at 12.5 oz. @ 9" length. That is about 1.4 oz per inch.
http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm157/HKforFREEDOM/HKs/IMG_1895.jpg
The Geissele 14.5" rail weighs 1.1 lbs. Which is about 1.2 oz per inch. That would mean the 10.5" rail will weigh about the same as the stock 9" rail.
http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm157/HKforFREEDOM/HKs/IMG_1894.jpg
Finally got a chance to get my upper back together with the new geiselle rail. I went with the 15" rail for my 20" barrel, and it's a great combo so far. Hopefully I'll get to the range this weekend to give it a go, but so far the shape and feel of the rail are very nice.
Pic:
http://i405.photobucket.com/albums/pp133/m1ajunkie/IMAG0116.jpg
Trident, I am in GA for now but will be traveling to North Dakota for work through november in a couple weeks. When I get back I would love to get together for some range time, maybe at the new range in blakely with shots out to 2200yds.
ETA: I have just one more item I am waiting on for this rifle that I'm thinking will be here in the next few days. I sent a form 1 and 4 on the same day and got the approved form 1 back yesterday so I'm thinking my surefire suppressor is just around the corner.
Finally got a chance to get my upper back together with the new geiselle rail. I went with the 15" rail for my 20" barrel, and it's a great combo so far. Hopefully I'll get to the range this weekend to give it a go, but so far the shape and feel of the rail are very nice.
Pic:
http://i405.photobucket.com/albums/pp133/m1ajunkie/IMAG0116.jpg
Trident, I am in GA for now but will be traveling to North Dakota for work through november in a couple weeks. When I get back I would love to get together for some range time, maybe at the new range in blakely with shots out to 2200yds.
ETA: I have just one more item I am waiting on for this rifle that I'm thinking will be here in the next few days. I sent a form 1 and 4 on the same day and got the approved form 1 back yesterday so I'm thinking my surefire suppressor is just around the corner.
Either I'm color deficient or the color rendering in that pic is a little off. Is that FDE or Foliage Green? What did you use to coat the rail?
Either I'm color deficient or the color rendering in that pic is a little off. Is that FDE or Foliage Green? What did you use to coat the rail?
Yeah the colors in that pic didn't show up to well. Im guessing due to the overcast sky and lack of a quality camera.
That is the factory sand color from geiselle, with an fde magpul miad and the lmt coyote brown sopmod stock.
Yeah the colors in that pic didn't show up to well. Im guessing due to the overcast sky and lack of a quality camera.
That is the factory sand color from geiselle, with an fde magpul miad and the lmt coyote brown sopmod stock.
Thanks! It sure looks good! :)
Chris17404
08-14-12, 13:46
Does anyone know the status on when the new Geissele rail for AR-15's will be available for purchase? From what vendors, rail lengths and estimated price? Thanks.
Chris
Chris, currently these rails are offered in 13", and 15" lengths. They also now come in a Mk1 and Mk2 variant...the Mk2 is a cost friendly alternative to the Mk1. Lastly, you can get the rail in either black or sand ano.
Initially these rails were only avail. through Geissele directly so I'm told, however I've noticed them showing up at places like Rainier Arms, SWFA, and RogTac. Perhaps other places as well.
Personally, I'd just go through Geissele direct....and give them a call at the shop.
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC07500-1.jpg
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC07588-1.jpg
Chris17404
08-14-12, 15:41
Thank you very much, TRIDENT82.
Could you please explain the differences (and pros/cons) between the Mk1 and Mk2 variants? Does the rail have anti-rotation tabs? I don't see any in the pictures I've seen. And perhaps compare/contrast the Geissele rail with the Noveske NSR?
Chris
Chris, currently these rails are offered in 13", and 15" lengths. They also now come in a Mk1 and Mk2 variant...the Mk2 is a cost friendly alternative to the Mk1. Lastly, you can get the rail in either black or sand ano.
Initially these rails were only avail. through Geissele directly so I'm told, however I've noticed them showing up at places like Rainier Arms, SWFA, and RogTac. Perhaps other places as well.
Personally, I'd just go through Geissele direct....and give them a call at the shop.
From Geissele last week:
We are just beginning production, they will be available on the web in roughly 6-8 weeks.
We have a few 13 and 15” M4 hand guards for sale, most with blems.
If you’re interested call our shop and I’ll be glad to help you out.
Thanks.
Barbara Hochwind
Assembly Department Manager
Thank you very much, TRIDENT82.
Could you please explain the differences (and pros/cons) between the Mk1 and Mk2 variants? Does the rail have anti-rotation tabs? I don't see any in the pictures I've seen. And perhaps compare/contrast the Geissele rail with the Noveske NSR?
Chris
My pleasure Chris:)
I don't have any experience with the Noveske NSR, however it certainly looks to have a lot of good things going for it. I do think that the SMR, and NSR were designed for different purposes, and each design to some degree reflects their intended user base.
RE: MK2 version....quote from Mr. Geissele on 8/10:
" MK2 rail is available next week. $270 for the 13" version. It uses the same barrel nut system but the rail is flat sided and it uses slide nuts instead of rail inserts to hold the accessory rails on. "
I don't have one of the MK2 models to compare with my MK1s, but I'll see about trying to get some pics posted of the MK2 models.
I'm curious why the DOD requested a specific HK416 rail? I use the stock 416 rail and love it, from my point of view I see no major improvement other than its more comfortable and has integrated qd points? Do not get me wrong I'm not knocking it or Geissele, his triggers are the only triggers I use and the rail looks neat, but unless I missed something I do not see much of an improvement to the 416.
If I had to guess they aren't using most of the rail space and wanted a thinner rail and integral sling attachment.
For those interested, I'll post up some detailed pics of the initial MK2 versions, and be able to give a better opinion on the differences b/t the MK1 and MK2 variants here pretty soon.
bump.... still waiting on those MK2 comparison pics.
ROG Tactical
08-28-12, 18:17
bump.... still waiting on those MK2 comparison pics.
For a quick fix, you can see a few pics of the MK2 here:
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=109644
I'm sure Trident will post more and better pics of the MK2 shortly.
bump.... still waiting on those MK2 comparison pics.
Just got it late last night....
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC07961-1.jpg
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC07971-1.jpg
That is a slick looking rail!
Are you swapping these on your non-MRP uppers?
Chris17404
09-04-12, 14:44
I apologize if I missed this... but does anyone have the weight of the 13" MK1 rail and barrel nut separately? I'm curious how much of the MK1's weight will be back near the receiver. Thanks.
Chris
rdbse...I built a cpl. new upper receiver groups specifically for use with these rails in the future.
For you guys who are interested in these rails, and specifically the MK2 variants....here is a video I uploaded illustrating the MK1 vs. MK2 differences, and overall the ease at which the SMR rails are removed, installed, and indexed.
Geissele Automatic's SMR rails.....MK1 vs. MK2 variants (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_MN8aI-xFg&lc=D5qh2Fm9TYQawmlIayZYXXqgTs8LdaZ2iHsyL3i1wN4&lch=email&feature=em-comment_received)
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC07976-2.jpg
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC07990-1.jpg
Also, I've heard 11" SMR rails are in the works....7-8weeks. Lightweight versions are coming soon as well.
ETA...
I apologize if I missed this... but does anyone have the weight of the MK1 rail and barrel nut separately? I'm curious how much of the MK1's weight will be back near the receiver. Thanks.
Chris
The barrel nut is 3.2 oz.....the 13" SMR MK1 rail 15.2 oz The panels weigh.... .82 and .46 oz (2 sizes)
rdbse...I built a cpl. new upper receiver groups specifically for use with these rails in the future.
For you guys who are interested in these rails, and specifically the MK2 variants....here is a video I uploaded illustrating the MK1 vs. MK2 differences, and overall the ease at which the SMR rails are removed, installed, and indexed.
Geissele Automatic's SMR rails.....MK1 vs. MK2 variants (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_MN8aI-xFg&lc=D5qh2Fm9TYQawmlIayZYXXqgTs8LdaZ2iHsyL3i1wN4&lch=email&feature=em-comment_received)
Also, I've heard 11" SMR rails are in the works....7-8weeks. Lightweight versions are coming soon as well.
ETA...
The barrel nut is 3.2 oz.....the 13" SMR MK1 rail 15.2 oz The panels weigh.... .82 and .46 oz (2 sizes)
You have a voice! Well done video, Trident.
Thanks for the vid Trident. You're one of the few guys with details on these Geissele rails.
Lightweight versions are coming soon as well.
I'm REALLY interested in this. May have to hold off on getting the KAC URX 3.1 + barrel nut. Spill any details you can.
Glad you guys like the vid, and thanks for watching. I got fired at my day job....being a Mime, so no use to continue to stay in character:) I really try to keep the talking to a minimum, and the shooting to a maximum on my channel. However sounding like a redneck doesn't help either:D
Wanted to go ahead and get these side by side pics posted up asap for those interested. Watching the video, and then checking out the pics I hope should really leave very little unknown to a potential user or buyer of these rails.
Top down view.....
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC08187-1.jpg
Side views.......
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC08222-1.jpg
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC08204-1.jpg
Bottom view....
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC08232-1.jpg
I.D. view.....
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC08225-1.jpg
Up close pic of the nylon tipped set screw design shared by both variants...
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC08174-1-1.jpg
A 13" MK1 just showed up on my doorstep yesterday, and I'm impressed. Geissele's attention to detail is second to none, and I'm excited to see what new variants he comes up with in the future.
Trident do you think using a larue mount for the micro would be good enough to index the rail to the upper? I dont have a longer mount available, and was wondering if you had tried it with a smaller mount.
Just got an email back from Mr. Geissele about the install of rail with a smaller mount to index the rail to upper.
"A small mount would work just fine. Even a straightedge of a block of flat steel. If you used the smaller mount just hold the mount against the receiver and rotate the rail until it just touches. Rotating the SMR precisely is easy due to the close fit to the barrel nut. The rail is not flopping all over the place."
saddlerocker
09-14-12, 21:02
Sorry If I missed it, but is there a 10.5" rail planned for the AR platform.
I know the Hk sports a 10.5"
Im really looking for a URXII Mid substitute. Im not a fan of the proprietary-ness.
Something between 10"-11" for use on 11.5" SBR with suppressor. To maximize rail-estate and provide the "seamless" look.
To my knowledge the URXII mid is the only option to date.
On 9/3 I heard 11" SMR MK1 rails were roughly 7-8 weeks away.
Personally I can't wait....11" SMR with a 11.5" barrel is gonna be wicked!
A 13" MK1 just showed up on my doorstep yesterday, and I'm impressed. Geissele's attention to detail is second to none, and I'm excited to see what new variants he comes up with in the future.
Damn rail fairly over shot my house...
A 13" MK1 just showed up on my doorstep yesterday, and I'm impressed. Geissele's attention to detail is second to none, and I'm excited to see what new variants he comes up with in the future.
I need to be on that list. Shit fire. That's gotta be living right.
MidwestRookie
09-20-12, 16:11
Sorry If I missed it, but is there a 10.5" rail planned for the AR platform.
I know the Hk sports a 10.5"
Im really looking for a URXII Mid substitute. Im not a fan of the proprietary-ness.
Something between 10"-11" for use on 11.5" SBR with suppressor. To maximize rail-estate and provide the "seamless" look.
To my knowledge the URXII mid is the only option to date.
Big +1 to this, tho I won't be sad if I end up having to use the URXII..
Come on 2013!
ETA- The below is a short piece from Rob Curtis (my Military Times editor), I did not take the pics or write about this rail, and haven't actually even seen one yet. My apologies for not making that clear earlier.
http://militarytimes.com/blogs/gearscout/2012/09/27/geissele-super-modular-rail-mk2/
http://militarytimes.com/blogs/gearscout/files/2012/09/Geissele-SMRMk2B-500x500.jpg
Everyone who knows ARs know....it's never officially a party until Stick has product in hands and under his lens!
At this point in time after watching you post thousands of professionally taken pics of the ever changing new kit/rifles, I'm sure even myself is guilty to some degree in regards to taking for granite the service you have been providing for the AR now for as long as I've been on these forums. My appreciation for this task you've always done remains the same even though now I've seen thousands of your professionally taken shots of various kit and rifles. I guess gun porn just never gets old.
Hopefully you'll be doing some form or another of evaluation with that MK2 you photographed above so that I can hear your thoughts on the SMRs. If your not I can understand given I know your side job of catching criminals keeps you kinda busy;)
Hopefully I can get a quick thought or two from you in regards to just the texture of the ano finishing, and more importantly the GA "sand" finish. It's almost to pretty to put on a fighting rifle...almost.
Everyone who knows ARs know....it's never officially a party until Stick has product in hands and under his lens!
At this point in time after watching you post thousands of professionally taken pics of the ever changing new kit/rifles, I'm sure even myself is guilty to some degree in regards to taking for granite the service you have been providing for the AR now for as long as I've been on these forums. My appreciation for this task you've always done remains the same even though now I've seen thousands of your professionally taken shots of various kit and rifles. I guess gun porn just never gets old.
Hopefully you'll be doing some form or another of evaluation with that MK2 you photographed above so that I can hear your thoughts on the SMRs. If your not I can understand given I know your side job of catching criminals keeps you kinda busy;)
Hopefully I can get a quick thought or two from you in regards to just the texture of the ano finishing, and more importantly the GA "sand" finish. It's almost to pretty to put on a fighting rifle...almost.
Sorry, but you can get no thoughts from me on this one, I've never seen or handled one of these rails. The Military Times piece was done by my editor Rob Curtis.
Thank for the kind words on the pictures, I try to keep it lively. I checked a few years ago and back then I was a little over 3,000 different pictures uploaded to a few different hosting sites. I would guess around 4kish at this point.
Trident1982, thank you for your great videos.
About time to start a new project :D
I bit the bullet and bought one of the sand 13' mk2 rails for my 14.5 build. After looking for a rail for my upper, there are not a lot of 13 inch rails that I like. I run a 12 Vltor mur on my other 14.5. I wanted something a little longer but still be able to run my AAC MINI.
G hits a bit of a niche with 13 & 15 IMHO. I would like a 15 for my 18 SPR, but I'm not ready to ditch my 14DD for it.
My pleasure JoJunior :)
PB....I think you'll really like the 13" SMR on a 14.5" barrel. Over the last cpl. months, my own 13" SMR MK1/ 14.5 DD LW rifle seems to get the majority of my trigger time. It's just such a well balanced combo.
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC08395-1.jpg
Good lookin weapon. I was thinking the Mk2 was an improved version of mk1, so I bought the two. Not the case. I hope I dig the mk2 anyway. I wasn't really thinking budget on this build. I'm sure it will still be fine.
Trident, How much does this weigh? I'm no lightweight guy, but just curious. I know it's been discussed. My RISII's are no feathers , but they STOUT.
It's 7.8lbs empty.....8.7lbs w/ fully loaded 30rd pmag
TRIDENT82,
Is this a 15" rail? And barrel length?
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC07024-1.jpg
Barrel length of this? 13" rail?
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC07500-1.jpg
Planning to build a mid length 16" and would like to see if the setup works on a 13" or 15" rails.
.
Top down view.....
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC08187-1.jpg
Wow, is it just the picture, or is the MK I that much narrower? Looks considerably smaller...
JoJunior...
Your correct on the first pic....it's a 15" SMR MK1, and a 18" barrel.
The second pic...it's a 13" SMR MK1, and a 14.5" barrel.
hunt_ak....could be the picture to some degree, however in terms of feel, the MK1 feels like a totally different rail in your hands imho. The MK1 does have a rounded profile as opposed to the MK2's flat sided one due to how they mount up their respective acc. rail panels. I do think it's safe to say that the MK1 is thinner by at least some margin. I would measure for you pal, but I recently sent the Sand MK2 back to GA.
Hopefully next week we will hear news on the new lightweight models. It's my understanding at this time that all future rails will be coming in a newer lightweight configuration. I imagine they will still appear and function the same, just have weight removed from places.
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC07053-1.jpg
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC08528-1-1.jpg
So 15" rail is too long for a 16" mid length with a SF brake??
I don't see any reason at all that a 15" SMR wouldn't work perfectly with a 16" middy, moreover, if I was to build another 16" AR upper today, it's exactly the rail I'd use. Originally I had planned to build a Recce (16"/mid/medium contoured) upper with the 15" SMR, but ultimately I received a SPR barrel that was just too nice to not go with instead.
Perhaps my SPR/M4 blackout on the 15" SMR upper of mine is throwing you off a bit, it indexes quite a bit over the barrel when installed so it makes it hard to tell where my rail ends, and where the actual barrel then ends.
Here is a pic that should help maybe clear that up a bit...
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC06869-1.jpg
Here are some pics of my Geissele MK II Rail. Still finishing the gun but I wanted to some more shots of the Geissele rail for others to see.
Still need a flash hider, back up sights etc.. but this give you a gist of the 13'' rail on a 16'' med contoured barreled AR.
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p226/SRT-M4/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20OWNER-PC/Geissele%20Railed%20M4%2011-10-12/DSC_0292.jpg
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p226/SRT-M4/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20OWNER-PC/Geissele%20Railed%20M4%2011-10-12/DSC_0290.jpg
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p226/SRT-M4/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20OWNER-PC/Geissele%20Railed%20M4%2011-10-12/DSC_0287.jpg
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p226/SRT-M4/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20OWNER-PC/Geissele%20Railed%20M4%2011-10-12/DSC_0285.jpg
I would measure for you pal, but I recently sent the Sand MK2 back to GA.
Bummer! Thanks for the offer, though. I was going to PM you about sending an FDE anodized upper your way just to see how they look side by side, but I guess not! So who do I call at GA to get that 'blem' rail? :)
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p226/SRT-M4/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20OWNER-PC/Geissele%20Railed%20M4%2011-10-12/DSC_0292.jpg
Wow, that makes the sand look way more brown than normal...is it just the picture?
I've got an FDE receiver set that's looking for a 'matching' friend...
http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l167/hunt_ak/CD1A7FE2-1910-4BBF-A198-43044841C3F1-476-000000C6D2FD3304.jpg
The Geissele is more brown than tan ( Which I like) . Its more mor ebrown like the Daniel Defense RIS II.
You receiver looks great.
The Geissele is more brown than tan ( Which I like) . Its more mor ebrown like the Daniel Defense RIS II.
You receiver looks great.
Gotcha. Somewhere between Magpul FDE and DD FDE? Do you have a RIS II to take a picture next to?
Awesome build SRT-M4 :)
I've found that the Sand blended more naturally into the background over Magpul's FDE. It changes color depending on what light conditions are present as well. It's the richest ano finish I've ever seen.
Here it is in a more natural environment, and how it blends with the magpul FDE...
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC08155-1.jpg
Great pic. Any more natural light pics next to other known FDE stuff? Sorry to be buggin....
Gotcha. Somewhere between Magpul FDE and DD FDE? Do you have a RIS II to take a picture next to?
Sold my RIS II to fund the Geiselle. Cant do any comparisons. Probably my 2 favorite rails but the Mk II has won me over.
The Sand color is great and will blend nicely. I like it when these sand and Dark Earth colors end up being more of a brown.
Awesome build SRT-M4 :)
I've found that the Sand blended more naturally into the background over Magpul's FDE. It changes color depending on what light conditions are present as well. It's the richest ano finish I've ever seen.
Here it is in a more natural environment, and how it blends with the magpul FDE...
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC08155-1.jpg
Thanks Trident. It was you and all of your great info on these rails that sold me on them.
Great pic and very nice blaster as well.
Where are these available?
http://geissele.com/supermodularrail.aspx
http://geissele.com/supermodularrail.aspx
Those all show coming soon. Those that have them, did you acquire them by contacting geissele or through a 3rd party?
ROG Tactical
11-12-12, 11:33
The Geissele rails are most likely sold out everywhere at this moment and I have been told it could be up to 6 months before they are available again...at least for me.
Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2
The Geissele rails are most likely sold out everywhere at this moment and I have been told it could be up to 6 months before they are available again...at least for me.
Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2
I think that I got the last one from you. ROG Tactical has outstanding service!
Officially I got the last one. :D. It was delivered on Friday.
I think that I got the last one from you. ROG Tactical has outstanding service!
forFREEDOM
11-13-12, 02:29
Currently, I'm building a new rifle for matches on a 16" MR upper with a black 14.5" rail.
http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm157/HKforFREEDOM/HKs/IMG_3487.jpg
http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm157/HKforFREEDOM/HKs/IMG_3483.jpg
http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm157/HKforFREEDOM/HKs/IMG_3481.jpg
We have some rails stashed away if anyone wants some. They are blems.
C4
Officially I got the last one. :D. It was delivered on Friday.
As was mine!:D
Thanks hunt_ak, and SRT-M4 :)
I have my hands on another 13" SMR MK2 in sand, and I measured the width of the MK1 vs. MK2.
MK1 width: 1.7615"
MK2 width: 1.9625"
*** width measurements were taken on the naked rail.
I like my rifles, like Johnny Cash likes his wardrobe..." 'Till things are brighter, I'm the Man In Black." :cool:
That said hunt_ak, I snapped a quick pic for you as requested above...
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC08668-1.jpg
Awesome. Thank you, sir! That seals the deal on this rail for me...
Awesome. Thank you, sir! That seals the deal on this rail for me...
You wont be disappointed. Best rail that Ive owned yet. The machining is top notch. Very well made. The fit and finish are great.
I was a bit worried at first about using a 13'' rail but it seems to be just right with the 16''barrel. I love the way this gun feels and handles.
ApexAchilles
12-05-12, 17:43
The modularity is appealing, less money spent on rail covers.
ApexAchilles
12-05-12, 17:52
Is the bottom rail removable?
I see the top rail is not taken to the extreme end which is also a negative.
That's true, I sometimes run my flip up irons turned to the front and that would stop it from folding I think.
So now BCM offers the 10" version of this on their Jack Carbine. I would've personally liked an 11"er but I would be VERY interested in a 10" version in sand...any info as to whether or not this will be offered in sand?
After taking my G rail out for multiple shoots, I can say I absolutely love it. I want to buy a stock 6920, cut the FSP off and put a 15 inch in black on that mofoage.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
12-09-12, 23:51
I am very after-market rail ignorant (I only use MOE HG and MRP). Ive worked it out with one of the board gunsmiths to have whatever I buy installed. Its really come down to either a 13" MK2 or a 13.5" NSR on my 16" Middy. Is there any reason I should pay the extra for the MK2? What are your preferences in regards to these rails?
I am very after-market rail ignorant (I only use MOE HG and MRP). Ive worked it out with one of the board gunsmiths to have whatever I buy installed. Its really come down to either a 13" MK2 or a 13.5" NSR on my 16" Middy. Is there any reason I should pay the extra for the MK2? What are your preferences in regards to these rails?
I was wondering the same thing...
I've weighed the difference between the MK1 vs MK2 and from the info earlier in the thread, I think the MK1 will feel better in the hand due to the slight radius on the side of the rails (although more expensive) and is a bit narrower.
MK4 rail. Very trick, very lightweight rail for the AR15 to compliment our MK1 and MK2 rails. Similar barrel nut and mounting arrangement as the MK1 and MK2. Total weight for a 13" is at 12.7oz with everything (rail, bbl nut, mounting bolts)
http://i1111.photobucket.com/albums/h467/Sagmill/C664B85F-1BAE-4D9E-A0BA-88BF410A907A-1699-000001681BACB286.jpg
http://i1111.photobucket.com/albums/h467/Sagmill/990E00DA-6C56-40D6-B408-889A4EF7A503-1699-0000016819C78BEE.jpg
http://i1111.photobucket.com/albums/h467/Sagmill/C733EAAA-71A2-4B09-B8D0-81CEB576208B-1699-000001681D55B4B1.jpg
MK4 rail. Very trick, very lightweight rail for the AR15 to compliment our MK1 and MK2 rails. Similar barrel nut and mounting arrangement as the MK1 and MK2. Total weight for a 13" is at 12.7oz with everything (rail, bbl nut, mounting bolts)
http://i1111.photobucket.com/albums/h467/Sagmill/C664B85F-1BAE-4D9E-A0BA-88BF410A907A-1699-000001681BACB286.jpg
http://i1111.photobucket.com/albums/h467/Sagmill/990E00DA-6C56-40D6-B408-889A4EF7A503-1699-0000016819C78BEE.jpg
http://i1111.photobucket.com/albums/h467/Sagmill/C733EAAA-71A2-4B09-B8D0-81CEB576208B-1699-000001681D55B4B1.jpg
That looks awesome. ETA?
forFREEDOM
12-18-12, 21:55
Outstanding!
ROG Tactical
12-18-12, 23:04
Edited post due to being fooled by tapatalk again...lol. answered a post from the first page, thinking it was a recent post on the last page.
To stay on topic with recent posts...I am liking how the new MK4 is looking!
Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2
Hmmm. Does this make the MK3 some kind of rare, unicorn adorned, must have collector fodder. xD.
That being said, take my money please.
Trident, obviously Bill's got this one fresh off the mill, but do you know if they plan to anodize in sand? Will this be any cheaper than the MK1/MK2?
I just picked up a 15inch in black mk1 to put over a Recon barrel. Should be in this week if Bravo isn't over run with hoarders. Gunz built a 16 inch gun with the 15 inch rail for a guy, but has anyone else done it? It could be nose heavy, weight is not a concern, but I do like a balanced gun.
If it ends up nose heavy, Ill switch it to my SPR and swop rails. No lose situation.
Hey Jack, where can I get a 6920 for $1050 :no:
Scooter...I don't think it should be too long before were able to purchase these. As soon as I hear some dates, I'll be sure to post them up.
hunt_ak....I'd be pretty surprised if they didn't offer this new MK4 is sand since they already do it for the MK1/MK2 models. That said, I haven't heard for sure, but will be sure to ask.
Also, haven't heard yet on pricing, and will update you guys as soon as I hear some more.
New product from GA for 2013
New Products:
* MK4 rail. Very trick, very lightweight rail for the AR15 to compliment our MK1 and MK2 rails. Similar barrel nut and mounting arrangement as the MK1 and MK2. Total weight for a 13" is at 12.7oz with everything (rail, bbl nut, mounting bolts)
* HK417 Rail. Due in March. A modular rail for the HK417 and MR762 guns
* Geissele 2 Stage trigger (G2S). This will finally be available for retail sales. $165. A very good 2 stage trigger with the same reliability as the SSA and about the same pull
* Super TRICON trigger. This is an SSA with a special shaped bow. Curved on top, flat toward the bottom, serrated gripping surface
* Super SCAR. We have developed a precision investment cast version of this trigger and production will finally increase so these will be available. The price will go down from $400 to $325
* Gas Block. A low profile .750 dia gas block investment cast from 17-4 PH stainless steel that can be secured with set screws and/or a roll pin for total security. Lighter than machined versions.
* Reaction Rod and Roll pin tool: The AR15 tool is available now and a 7.62 reaction rod will be ready in Feb.
New things from ALG for 2013
* 6 Second Optic Mount for the Glock 22 family. Developed for the DOD for counter terrorism operations. Will mount an Aimpoint Micro or MRDS very low to the slide and will retain flashlight and laser mount.
*Flared Magwell for the Glock. A well done flared magwell for the Glock 22 family
Talk about one exciting year to come if your a fan of Geissele!
ETA: The weight on the MK4 is mind blowing...quite amazing considering your still getting the MK1/MK2's same general mounting design.
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/mk4.jpg
Trident,
Do you know if the Mk4 will be compatible with the same rail sections as the Mk1/Mk2 SMR ?
The MK4 has 3 small rail portions machined into it at the end of it, and doesn't appear to feature any kind of modular rail attachment design. So this rail won't accept the MK1/MK2 acc. rail panels.
It also has rear and front built in QD sockets, whereas the SMR rails as of now still don't have them.
On the face of it, this MK4 appears to be a totally different animal than the SMRs, if for no other reason than it's weight alone.
FWIW...the MK1 and MK2 acc. rail panels aren't compatible with each other due to the shape of the rail's side (MK1 has round sides, MK2 has flat sides)
Is Geissle going to make any of these rails in a 10.5" like they do for the 416? Sorry if I missed it elsewhere in the thread.
They currently make some in 10", as featured on the new BCM rifle. Haven't heard anything about 10.5" models though.
http://www.bravocompanymfg.com/images/thejack/marquee_thejack.jpg
ROG Tactical posted a pic of a 10" model he received in another thread very recently...
http://s4e5fc2d16a332.img.gostorego.com/802754/cdn/media/s4/e5/fc/2d/16/a3/32/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/i/m/img_3145.jpg
This is very helpful. Out of all the offerings I like the Mk 1 the best due to its shape and features.
Are they planning on offering the MK1 long term ?
Also are rail sections sold individually yet for the MK 1 any where ?
They currently make some in 10", as featured on the new BCM rifle. Haven't heard anything about 10.5" models though.
ROG Tactical posted a pic of a 10" model he received in another thread very recently...
Thanks
I missed the ROG Tactical post. Was aware of the Jack, but since the 10" rail was not on the Geissle site I wasn't sure it was readily avaiolable.
This is very helpful. Out of all the offerings I like the Mk 1 the best due to its shape and features.
Are they planning on offering the MK1 long term ?
Also are rail sections sold individually yet for the MK 1 any where ?
I really can't envision the MK1 going anywhere due to as you noted it's highly unique shape and features.
Good question on the extra panels...and I'm pretty sure that if you called or emailed GA directly about it, they would be able to take care of it. Outside of GA direct, I'm not sure anyone else dealer wise is gonna have them at this point.
The SMR MK1 and MK2 models are direct descendants from the HK416 rail designed to meet a unique military contact. Due to this, we see a rail that is literally bombproof to the Nth degree, and by default some would consider overly heavy for their particular needs and uses.
The MK4 appears to be a very purpose built rail for the M4/AR15 rifle as opposed to the HK416.
Anybody know if geiselle has set a release date for the mk4...? I have had a mk2 on backorder for a while and may just cancel it if mk4 is out anytime soon..
eternal24k
12-21-12, 21:37
Am I the only one interested in a FSP cutout version?
I received my 15 inch MK1 today. It is quite impressive. These guys just seem to have the "Midas touch". If I get my upper in tomorrow, I am going to take it to the shop, "Markm's casa" and get this thing ready to hammer for a Sunday shoot. I was so impressed with the 13' Mk2, I have to expect the goods just get better.
Hopefully, we can post a range report on Monday. Geissele is top of the food chain in estimation.
PB....could you elaborate more on your opinion in regards to the MK1 vs. MK2 rails....specifically the feel(i.e. in the hand), acc. rail panel mounting methods, etc. whenever you feel like doing so.
Your in the unique position of having both. Tell Mark to get busy, damn slacker:)
Will do. I checked tracking, it appears it will show tomorrow. Mark and I will run a couple hundo rounds through it and check back with you.
We'll have that budget build slapped together so fast it'll make your pee pee whistle! :p
What vendors have these?
TIA
Bravo had a version and Rogtac has one flavor too I think.
GA direct...call/email them, rather than just look on their site.
RogTAC....http://www.rogtac.com/upper-parts/rails-handguards.html?cat=76
SWFA........http://swfa.com/Geissele-Hand-Rails-C4433.aspx
G & R Tactical has some last time I heard...
Rainier had some....
PB....could you elaborate more on your opinion in regards to the MK1 vs. MK2 rails....specifically the feel(i.e. in the hand), acc. rail panel mounting methods, etc. whenever you feel like doing so.
Your in the unique position of having both. Tell Mark to get busy, damn slacker:)
We ran both of these rails this weekend and both were outstanding.
13' Sand over a 14.5 Noveske Afghan.
15' Black over a 16' Noveske Recon.
I was worried when building the gun (15/16 inches) that it was going to be real nose heavy. And or too heavy in general. It was not heavy at all and handled great. For a real large Dude, like IraqGunz who likes to reach way out on the barrel, its very nice for an extended grip. IGunz built one the other day, maybe he can chime in on his opinion. And the Recon is kind of beefy to start with. I ran it, Mark ran it and another Cat training in Special Forces ran it. None of us felt it too heavy or even burdensome in any way.
It (15 incher) handles great and will use the rail for another build in a heart beat. And it did not feel much different than the 13 on my 14.5.
Did it feel like a stock 6920, no. But felt like many normal 14.5's or SBR's with lights and shit on them. We ran them with and without the cans.
http://i822.photobucket.com/albums/zz142/Pappabear6940/IMG_0255_zpsea40caf2.jpg
Here's a pair of budget builds...
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb201/trixiebud/Geissele2_zps49c9ac2d.jpg
This is our special forces buddy "Raymond" home for the Holidays..
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb201/trixiebud/Geissele1_zpsfe8fca39.jpg
I'm in the market for a new rail for an 11.5.
How would the Geissele 10, compare the the 11 NSR?
Here's a pair of budget builds...
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb201/trixiebud/Geissele2_zps49c9ac2d.jpg
You know you guys are doing something right when a picture of your rifles is saved as my desktop background. A pair of rifles perched at the ready waiting to deal out some punishment tends to always get me though.
Thanks for such great feedback PB, your opinion matters a great deal to me, and so does the opinions from Mark, and IG. It's great having the AZ crew now have a number of these rails on board, and I look forward to hearing anymore feedback you guys share on them in the future.
No sh*t, you guys couldn't have built two better looking rifles with SMRs than those two. By the way, WTF does the term "budget" mean to Mark? If those are budget builds, please tell Daddy Warbucks to come get me, and little orphan Annie:D
cop1211
The NSR and SMR MK1 are really two totally different type of rails, that were concieved for two really different end users/uses.
The NSR has a neat Keymod design, and ultimately reflects what the civilian, gamer, and otherwise non military end user want currently today in a rail....lightweight, and reasonably priced.
The SMR MK1 is essentially the rail built from request by the DoD for certain HK 416s being used in combat. The end users for these rails demanded an uber strong, bombproof design, as they would undergo huge amounts of abuse in extreme hard use environments.
The rail that will own the market over the next year or two will be the new MK4 IMHO. This rail has so much thought put into it, and every single thing is appearing to be refined to the Nth degree on it. Bill has been working on this design for some time now in almost secret. The engineering savant behind the Geissele designs hit the masterstroke on this rail in my book!
The MK4 will amazingly take the NSRs super lightweight, with the Geissele bombproof anti rotation design, and significantly improved barrel nut design, and combine it into one rail.
Combining uber lightweight, with uber bombproof all in one design won't be cheap I'm sure though fwiw.
You know you guys are doing something right when a picture of your rifles is saved as my desktop background. A pair of rifles perched at the ready waiting to deal out some punishment tends to always get me though.
Thanks for such great feedback PB, your opinion matters a great deal to me, and so does the opinions from Mark, and IG. It's great having the AZ crew now have a number of these rails on board, and I look forward to hearing anymore feedback you guys share on them in the future.
No sh*t, you guys couldn't have built two better looking rifles with SMRs than those two. By the way, WTF does the term "budget" mean to Mark? If those are budget builds, please tell Daddy Warbucks to come get me, and little orphan Annie:D
Budget Build :D Thats Markus being sarcastic and talking smack at me. Those are not exactly Budget builds as you know. I think they busted my budget. Its all good though, nice stuff, yea, what was it -"Pappabear is Double F*#@ed". :cool:
I held that NSR rail. It feels good and is very light. I'm not sold on the keyhole thing, but Noveske is a bright guy and I wouldnt discount it either. If your overall goal was a light weight build, the NSR would be something to look at. I much prefer the Geissele rails.
Yeah... Pappabear always buys these cheap components and wonders why the don't run. :p
Just got my upper assembled, and my new MKII comes with built in QD sockets on each side of the rail near the receiver. In the picture below you can see it (its the last hole closest to the receiver). Tested it this morning with a QD sling swivel I had laying around and it works perfectly.
Pretty pumped to find that out after I received it!
http://s7.postimage.org/harh5j7iz/Recce.jpg (http://postimage.org/)
Here are the specs on my rifle
This is my take on the Recce rifle (still a work in progress).
Specs:
Stag Arms Lower
DD LPK
G27 Grip
Geissele SSA trigger
SOPMOD Gen II stock
Noveske Upper
Colt BCG
16 inch Douglas SS Heavy Barrel from High Caliber Sales, mid length
Badger Gas Block and mid length tube
Geissele MKII Super Modular rail in Sand color
PRI Gasbuster Charging handle
JoJo comp
Ban state compliant
11am1A, are yours on both sides or just the left side as shown in your picture?
They took out some of the mk2 metal right underneath the sling swivel socket...looks more like a mk1 now...shaving weight too i guess.
It's great having the AZ crew now have a number of these rails on board, and I look forward to hearing anymore feedback you guys share on them in the future.
Don't forget the PA crew! 45 minutes from Norristown! :agree:
http://i1014.photobucket.com/albums/af269/CoryCop25/ARs/471F0667-9107-41AF-B36F-2602770330EF-2349-0000011BE1F4AA8C.jpg
Lucky you, neither of mine have QD built in. Kinda sucks because I love that feature. Im glad they added it for future buyers though.
ya man, took me a few days to realize it. Their website and all the reviews mention nothing about it. I called them today and they confirmed that the new ones (MKI's and MKII's) will all come with QD sockets.
wetidlerjr
12-28-12, 06:03
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v114/wetidlerjr/Colt%201911/BCM_MID_JACKSTYLE/BCM_MID12281215Small.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v114/wetidlerjr/Colt%201911/BCM_MID_JACKSTYLE/BCM_MID12281212Small.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v114/wetidlerjr/Colt%201911/BCM_MID_JACKSTYLE/BCM_MID12281211Small.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v114/wetidlerjr/Colt%201911/BCM_MID_JACKSTYLE/BCM_MID1228126Small.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v114/wetidlerjr/Colt%201911/BCM_MID_JACKSTYLE/BCM_MID1228125Small.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v114/wetidlerjr/Colt%201911/BCM_MID_JACKSTYLE/BCM_MID1228123Small.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v114/wetidlerjr/Colt%201911/BCM_MID_JACKSTYLE/BCMMID_JACKa.jpg
BCM 16" mid-length (BFH) I put together last week after seeing the new BCM "Haley Jack". I haven't got out to shoot it yet due to poor weather.
I called them today and they confirmed that the new ones (MKI's and MKII's) will all come with QD sockets.
Anything with a homosexual QD socket should be melted down and used for Beer Can manufacturing.
(and before I get the usual "why do you hate them?" post.... they suck... they can fail... and they're not "shit wired tight")
Anything with a homosexual QD socket should be melted down and used for Beer Can manufacturing.
(and before I get the usual "why do you hate them?" post.... they suck... they can fail... and they're not "shit wired tight")
Obviously a point of contention at the Hide. Not a good idea, that beer would cost a fortune :D
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v114/wetidlerjr/Colt%201911/BCM_MID_JACKSTYLE/BCM_MID12281215Small.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v114/wetidlerjr/Colt%201911/BCM_MID_JACKSTYLE/BCM_MID12281212Small.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v114/wetidlerjr/Colt%201911/BCM_MID_JACKSTYLE/BCM_MID12281211Small.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v114/wetidlerjr/Colt%201911/BCM_MID_JACKSTYLE/BCM_MID1228126Small.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v114/wetidlerjr/Colt%201911/BCM_MID_JACKSTYLE/BCM_MID1228125Small.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v114/wetidlerjr/Colt%201911/BCM_MID_JACKSTYLE/BCM_MID1228123Small.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v114/wetidlerjr/Colt%201911/BCM_MID_JACKSTYLE/BCMMID_JACKa.jpg
BCM 16" mid-length (BFH) I put together last week after seeing the new BCM "Haley Jack". I haven't got out to shoot it yet due to poor weather.
No QD sockets, Feinstein has me picking up all these errant , horrible dangerous rails. Send to Tempe ASAP for confiscation :p
Nice looking gun Jack!
wetidlerjr
12-28-12, 14:03
No QD sockets, Feinstein has me picking up all these errant , horrible dangerous rails. Send to Tempe ASAP for confiscation :p Are you drinking the same stuff as markm?
Nice looking gun Jack!
Thanks! It was the quickest way to get one plus I could do a couple mods I wanted.
Just got my black mk2 that i had back ordered from midway...its the rev. C ....metal removed from the barrel nut area and swivel holes...im happy with it...
lengthofpull
12-28-12, 23:33
Any idea if these are compatible with a rainier ultramatch billet upper?
-LOP
This is definitely on my wishlist!
gesundheit
12-31-12, 21:51
When is the Mk4 supposed to be released? ShotShow 2013?
I'll holdoff on getting Mk1 after seeing TRIDENT82's glowing review of Mk4. Is there a way to pre-order these?
I'm reading what I can find about these rails. Allow me to be something of a challenger to the NEW SHINNY THING group, but if this were such an amazing design why not make it an 11" tube for those thousands of us that would prefer to use shaved pinned gas blocks. And why does the steel threaded insert for rails need to be full length (I guess you could cut it.)? And why are QD sockets machined into the rail (In the wrong places IMHO) instead of user selectable locations? And why isn't there a rail extension for a light built in? How is this rail more easy to handle with its odd cross sectional geometry?
I love almost everything that Geissele makes but I don't see this as revolutionary. I much prefer the NSR rail, which I think is more modular, lighter, ergonomic, and extremely stiff for its weight.
Maybe I'll change my mind after I play with one, but I'm still in the "just another rail" camp.
Shorter lengths will be available in the future...didnt know there was such a high demand for 11" rails for shaved gasblocks lol...this is a NEW rail system...basically barelly on the market. As far as the qd sling socket...and its placement..ITS A HOLE...thats it...choose to use it or not. I dont knw why everyone is making a big deal about it. The location is perfect for me, exactly where i mount my sling on my duty m4. Again, all based on oppinion. I got rid of my nsr for this rail because the profile, length, mounting system, the way it fits in my hand. I have not found a rail i can say I like more and I have gone through pretty much everything.
If you love that nsr, stick with it, its a decent rail for what it is made for...and im a noveske man all the way, (BTW RIP John Noveske)...As far as high end rails go..its what the individual shooter likes...
gesundheit
01-05-13, 21:35
The location is perfect for me, exactly where i mount my sling on my sling on my duty m4. Again, all based on oppinion. I got rid of my nsr for this rail because the profile, length, mounting system, the way it fits in my hand.
Are you referring to Mk4 rails? Because I think that is what Scottsbad is talking about.
I assumed he was reffering to the mk1/mk2 with the swivel hole placement...my mk2 has qd sockets in the rear...i dropped a nsr for a mk2 smr...my bad if he was talking about the mk4
Here's a pair of budget builds...
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb201/trixiebud/Geissele2_zps49c9ac2d.jpg
This is our special forces buddy "Raymond" home for the Holidays..
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb201/trixiebud/Geissele1_zpsfe8fca39.jpg
What are the lengths on the rails and the barrels?
Anyone have a pic of a 13" on a 14.5" bbl?
13" MK1/ 14.5" DD LW
http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac81/trident1982/DSC08395-1.jpg
Noveske gen 2 lower
Vltor mur upper
Centurion arms 14.5" lw
Geiselle smr mk2
http://i1298.photobucket.com/albums/ag51/Dan_Stuehser/20130104_205406_resized_1_zps1e6f4016.jpg
What are the lengths on the rails and the barrels?
The sand is a 13 with 14.5 bbl. The black is a 15 with a 16" bbl.
I just picked up a 10" SMR MK1 from ROG Tactical. Now I just have to decide what upper/barrel would be the best combo. 11.5"/12.5"/??
The sand is a 13 with 14.5 bbl. The black is a 15 with a 16" bbl.
Thanks! I like that setup.
I just picked up a 10" SMR MK1 from ROG Tactical. Now I just have to decide what upper/barrel would be the best combo. 11.5"/12.5"/??
Does the 10" rail from ROG have the QD swivel ports?
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