How do you stamp a gun without a serial number?

[ramairthree]

I was going to SBS a 12 gauge Chinese double barrel with external hammers,
But decided to go American for long term parts availability, etc.

I also decided to skip the external hammers.

I picked up a decent used Stevens/Savage 530A.
Probably made between 1948 to the 50s.

I fired up E forms,
But could not find a SN on the gun.

I have since found out these do not have serial numbers.

[BigWaylon]

You have to assign one, like you would an 80% lower or a Form 1 suppressor.

On a Form 1, you're allowed to adopt the existing markings (including the SN) if you want. There's no requirement to do so. However, a Form 1 NFA item must have a serial number, so you'll need to create one.

[Auto-X Fil]

Yup, what BW said. Engrave it with a S/N when you add your trust name/city to the gun.

[ramairthree]

Thank you

[BigWaylon]

I would suggest creating a .doc file (or similar) with a couple sentences stating it had no SN and you're creating one. That way they're not trying to match the SN to the original manufacturer records. Just a little way to help prevent any confusion.

[scottryan]

You need to check under the forearm and the rear receiver tang for a serial number. It was common practice back then to put the serial numbers on these guns in these places.

[ramairthree]

Just a year code hidden, these had no SN.

I will just make one and get it engraved when approved.

[tom12.7]

Engrave it before you submit the form, not after it is approved.

[Conrad101st]

Engrave it before you submit the form, not after it is approved.

Why would you do that?
What's the advantage of pre stamping it?
I got mine form 1 approved. Then stamped and put together the very next day.

[BigWaylon]

Why would you do that?
What's the advantage of pre stamping it?
I got mine form 1 approved. Then stamped and put together the very next day.
In a situation like this, no way I'd engrave it before it was approved. Who knows what they may ask you to do differently than you originally submit it?

[tom12.7]

I don't have much time here, but let us look at a few things. A manufacturer has a defined time limit, when you do A F1, you are manufacturing that. The paperwork for that form says what it is, and what you want it to be. This may sound simplistic, but you do not want to be a entity that has possession of that stamp for 1 second without being in compliance.

[MistWolf]

Stag was found to be out of compliance with AR lowers that had gone without serial numbers more than 7 days.

There is no reason to not contact the BATF for clarification on the matter before proceeding

[Auto-X Fil]

You don't need to engrave it first, because it's not an SBS yet. You are requesting permission to make an SBS, not saying that you have made one already. Once the F1 comes back, get it engraved, then get out the hacksaw.

What you may NOT do is cut the barrels, and then engrave it.

[BigWaylon]

You don't need to engrave it first, because it's not an SBS yet. You are requesting permission to make an SBS, not saying that you have made one already. Once the F1 comes back, get it engraved, then get out the hacksaw.

What you may NOT do is cut the barrels, and then engrave it.
^^ this ^^

Just because the form is approved doesn't mean you have an NFA firearm. And there's no deadline to make the NFA item. If you change your mind, you can still get your $200 back even after approval.

Engrave it before you configure it into an NFA item...but zero reason to do it before Approval if you don't want to. I engrave mine while waiting for the stamp, but only for my AR lowers because I know I'm GTG with my forms...after several dozen approvals. I have my first two SBS forms pending, and I'm not engraving anything until I see a stamp...and until I cut a barrel, they're just GCA firearms.


(And on a Form 1, you're not manufacturing anything. You're making it)

[ramairthree]

Yeah, for my SBRs I have always got approval, engraved, then complete.

This gun has not had a serial number for the past 60plus years.

When approved I will engrave, then cut down.

Looks like paragraph 6.2.1 says I need to use my initials plus 4 digits.

[daniel87]

Aproval, engrave, cut
In that order

Until its aproved stamped and engraved you have no nfa firearm.





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[BigWaylon]

Looks like paragraph 6.2.1 says I need to use my initials plus 4 digits.
All NFA firearms must be identified by a serial number and other specified markings. If an existing firearm is being used in the making of the NFA weapon, and that firearm is serialized, the existing serial number should be used (unless it duplicates a serial number already used by the maker on Form 1) and entered in Block 4(g). If the weapon is of new manufacture, the applicant must assign a unique serial number and enter it in Block 4(g). For example, a unique serial number could be composed of at least 4 digits preceded by the initials of the maker. NOTE: alpha characters, e.g., a name, will not be accepted as a serial number. If a name is to be used, there must be at least one numeric character in addition to the alpha characters.


could be does not equal need...

For all my F1 cans I used my son's initials and then 001, 002, etc.

But, you could also simply do birthdays...like for today 12916, 01292016, or even 29JAN16. Doesn't matter, as long as it has the minimum of one numeral.

(And if it doesn't have a model, you can put N/A and not have to engrave one. Model is an "if designated" item, and I didn't choose one for any of my F1 cans)