View Full Version : BCM Lower
I received an email that Brownells is selling BCM lowers. That is cool but I get mine from G&R.
Leonidas24
02-02-16, 00:46
I received an email that Brownells is selling BCM lowers. That is cool but I get mine from G&R.
I don't understand how this is worth a thread.
Pledging his allegiance to G&R.
Mauser KAR98K
02-02-16, 05:28
Pledging his allegiance to G&R.
All hail Grant. All hail Grant.
http://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/receiver-parts/receivers/lower-receivers/ar-15-complete-lower-receiver-w-bcmgunfighter-stock-prod83804.aspx
Competition is great, but the blems are a better deal, as long as you realize the M3 pmags may not seat properly...
I got the email yesterday too.
It's interesting to see BCM going more mainstream. They've been great guns for years but not something I've seen available locally. I've had to order all of mine through G&R. It would be nice to walk into a LGS and just pick one up. It sucks shopping locally and seeing only Rugers and other crap. I'd have more BCM guns if I could buy and trade for them locally.
Averageman
02-02-16, 06:36
I got the email yesterday too.
It's interesting to see BCM going more mainstream. They've been great guns for years but not something I've seen available locally. I've had to order all of mine through G&R. It would be nice to walk into a LGS and just pick one up. It sucks shopping locally and seeing only Rugers and other crap. I'd have more BCM guns if I could buy and trade for them locally.
I got the note also, that is interesting; Brownells and BCM.
I stopped by my LGS this weekend. I saw they still had the DD banner up, but no guns on the shelf. I asked why and was told that they just couldn't sell them. No one wanted to pay a premium price for a quality gun, however crap seems to fly off of the shelves.
I think BCM, DD and to some degree Colt (as odd as that sounds at the current price point) are a niche sale. Not everyone knows or demands a quality gun.
BrigandTwoFour
02-02-16, 09:06
All hail Grant. All hail Grant.
So say we all.
I got the note also, that is interesting; Brownells and BCM.
I stopped by my LGS this weekend. I saw they still had the DD banner up, but no guns on the shelf. I asked why and was told that they just couldn't sell them. No one wanted to pay a premium price for a quality gun, however crap seems to fly off of the shelves.
I think BCM, DD and to some degree Colt (as odd as that sounds at the current price point) are a niche sale. Not everyone knows or demands a quality gun.
Man the prices some of the crap sells for is embarrassing. Some people just don't know better. Gun shop owners and employees included.
I'm lucky, the LGS I visit regularly has some employees who are knowledgable because the owners and management want them to be.
I've seen people buy Windham, Bushy etc off of their shelf while a DD, PWS or Colt is sitting right next to them for similar money. Some people just don't care what they buy as long as it looks cool.
Averageman
02-02-16, 11:32
I'm lucky, the LGS I visit regularly has some employees who are knowledgable because the owners and management want them to be.
I've seen people buy Windham, Bushy etc off of their shelf while a DD, PWS or Colt is sitting right next to them for similar money. Some people just don't care what they buy as long as it looks cool.
No small part of that has to do with business. Do you really want to spend the time educating someone on which gun to buy when for the most part half of them "know it all" anyway, so...
I think you might be better off avoiding stocking some lesser quality stuff and sticking to the quality guns you know are built right and have spec'ed internals and a good Q/A, Q/C before it leaves their shop.
That being said someone down the street might put you out of business selling craptastic deals on lesser quality stuff in quantity.
Wonder why they don't sell stripped lowers? Getting one in NJ that has a carbine buffer tube is a pain in the balls...
Still need a BCM lower in my collection, but I would order an A2 from Grant.
Wonder why they don't sell stripped lowers? Getting one in NJ that has a carbine buffer tube is a pain in the balls...
Still need a BCM lower in my collection, but I would order an A2 from Grant.
https://www.rainierarms.com/bcm-lower-group-w-a2-stock
If they sold stripped lowers, someone can install a POS LPK and sell it off as a genuine BCM.
This is the reason DD doesn't sell stripped lowers or complete lower groups, and never will.
Did anybody catch the edge members only thing from Brownells?
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I got the note also, that is interesting; Brownells and BCM.
I stopped by my LGS this weekend. I saw they still had the DD banner up, but no guns on the shelf. I asked why and was told that they just couldn't sell them. No one wanted to pay a premium price for a quality gun, however crap seems to fly off of the shelves.
I think BCM, DD and to some degree Colt (as odd as that sounds at the current price point) are a niche sale. Not everyone knows or demands a quality gun.
It is not easy, takes some work, and you have to focus on your niche, but being a top tier AR dealer can work.
So say we all.
BattleStar fan, you sir have my respect.
turnburglar
02-02-16, 19:04
The reason why M&P 15's fly off the shelves is because every gun owner isn't an operator. You honestly think America has 100 million riflemen? If you can't find quality brands at your LGS its because your LGS sucks. Ive been too more than one that stocks KAC, DD, COLT, and BCM on the same wall.
https://www.rainierarms.com/bcm-lower-group-w-a2-stock
If they sold stripped lowers, someone can install a POS LPK and sell it off as a genuine BCM.
This is the reason DD doesn't sell stripped lowers or complete lower groups, and never will.
I'm pretty sure DD used to sell stripped lowers.
I understand the sentiment but you can get a Noveske, Colt lowers. BCM is top notch stuff but other good guys sell stripped ones. At the end of the day it's their call and I respect it.
I'm pretty sure DD used to sell stripped lowers.
I understand the sentiment but you can get a Noveske, Colt lowers. BCM is top notch stuff but other good guys sell stripped ones. At the end of the day it's their call and I respect it.
They used to sell complete lowers, but no longer do because they ran into problems. I don't recall ever seeing stripped DD lowers, but I may be wrong.
Moose-Knuckle
02-03-16, 01:53
It's interesting to see BCM going more mainstream. They've been great guns for years but not something I've seen available locally. I've had to order all of mine through G&R. It would be nice to walk into a LGS and just pick one up.
I'm blessed, B L E S S E D I tell you when I say that my LGS that is seven miles away carries OEM BCM SBRs, lowers, uppers, and all their accessories. I was shocked the first time I walked in. They've only been in operation for two years and business for them is BOOMING.
Other than them, I have seen ONE single solitary complete BCM rifle a RECCE at a gun show several years back. I stuck up a conversation with the dealer and he told me I was the only one that entire weekend that had ever heard of them lol!
Moose-Knuckle
02-03-16, 02:01
I got the note also, that is interesting; Brownells and BCM.
Not sure if you are aware and or saw them but Larry Vickers did video promos of the BCM Gunfighter grip, stock, CH, and KeyMod rails for Brownells at SHOT. They have all been put on the Brownells website.
http://www.brownells.com/GunTech/index.htm?k=Larry+Vickers
I stopped by my LGS this weekend. I saw they still had the DD banner up, but no guns on the shelf. I asked why and was told that they just couldn't sell them. No one wanted to pay a premium price for a quality gun, however crap seems to fly off of the shelves.
I think BCM, DD and to some degree Colt (as odd as that sounds at the current price point) are a niche sale. Not everyone knows or demands a quality gun.
I remember back when DD put out their first rifle, the DDM4V1. Larry Vickers essentially said at the time that it was THE out of the box carbine to acquire. Soon after they made his Vickers Signature rifle which IIRC was a custom M4V1. Anyway, no one had heard of them unless you were on here or some other sites. At gun shows dealers were giving them away for a little over $1K stating they couldn't sell them cause no one had heard of them and were buying known manufactures like Bushmaster and DPMS lol.
Averageman
02-03-16, 03:30
I remember back when DD put out their first rifle, the DDM4V1. Larry Vickers essentially said at the time that it was THE out of the box carbine to acquire. Soon after they made his Vickers Signature rifle which IIRC was a custom M4V1. Anyway, no one had heard of them unless you were on here or some other sites. At gun shows dealers were giving them away for a little over $1K stating they couldn't sell them cause no one had heard of them and were buying known manufactures like Bushmaster and DPMS lol.
That is the perfect example of what I am seeing here.
This LGS has been a perfect example of what happens when political pressure is applied to gun laws and how it effects the market.
Someone watches the news one night and sees that the POTUS wants all of your evil assault weapons. The LGS buys up a metric ton of low end crap and they sell like hot cakes.
Perhaps the guy had the best of intentions and actually zero'ed the damned thing, or just lost interest and set it in the closet. Either way his Bushmaster is "The Shizzle" and his way of going up against the man.
It works for the LGS, because volume sales to these guys requires little skill and very few unhappy customers in this niche. Sales rock.
Now however having ventured in to the DD line and fewer sales happen because DD or BCM is lesser known to most of the LGS shoppers and the cost compared to DPMS is somewhat more prohibitive to budgets, they just drop the whole line, but keep the banner.
I've been an observer of trends and most gun purchases seem to me to be emotional rather than logical.
I'm pretty sure DD used to sell stripped lowers.
I understand the sentiment but you can get a Noveske, Colt lowers. BCM is top notch stuff but other good guys sell stripped ones. At the end of the day it's their call and I respect it.
I have busted some people trying to pass off home builds as factory Noveske...on the bright side, you can call ask them if the serial number was sold as a rifle or a lower :)
I got the note also, that is interesting; Brownells and BCM.
I stopped by my LGS this weekend. I saw they still had the DD banner up, but no guns on the shelf. I asked why and was told that they just couldn't sell them. No one wanted to pay a premium price for a quality gun, however crap seems to fly off of the shelves.
I think BCM, DD and to some degree Colt (as odd as that sounds at the current price point) are a niche sale. Not everyone knows or demands a quality gun.
I have the EXACT same problem.
Did the Daniel Defense Stocking dealer 2 years ago. 1 Rifle a month for 6 Months....... at the end of the 6 months I had 4 of the 6 still and only reason I sold 2 of them was because of friends who know what quality rifles were. EVERY OTHER SINGLE customer would come in and be disgusted that an AR was $1400 when they could buy the DPMS or Smith and Wesson for $650 and it would (do the exact same thing just as well).
I am a BCM dealer and a Daniel Defense dealer still, I stock BCM accessories and will carry 1 BCM rifle and 1 Daniel Defense Rifle and the rest are Ruger, DPMS or S&W. I sell 20 to 1 DPMS guns over any other brand. Its then hilarious to me when those folks come in and start putting BCM accessories(handguards, grips and stocks) and be excited they have a top tier gun now.
Its those same folks who come to the classes I put on and end up having issues by the end of the first day.....
MountainRaven
02-05-16, 23:45
I got the note also, that is interesting; Brownells and BCM.
I stopped by my LGS this weekend. I saw they still had the DD banner up, but no guns on the shelf. I asked why and was told that they just couldn't sell them. No one wanted to pay a premium price for a quality gun, however crap seems to fly off of the shelves.
I think BCM, DD and to some degree Colt (as odd as that sounds at the current price point) are a niche sale. Not everyone knows or demands a quality gun.
Semi-related note: Brownell's is also stocking stripped NoDak Spud retro-15 uppers and lowers. (But only in black, not grey.)
Semi-related note: Brownell's is also stocking stripped NoDak Spud retro-15 uppers and lowers. (But only in black, not grey.)
That's awesome!
Was it listed in an email or flyer? I didn't see them. All I found were three 10-22 items. A receiver, front sight and rail.
I've bought four BCM's and two LMT's from Grant. I shared the love and sold a BCM middy to a co worker to fund my first SBR, an LMT 10 from G&R. The last two BCM's were blems. That is still the way to go. The last one was a gift http://i859.photobucket.com/albums/ab160/usmcvet0331/BCM%201_zpsgcozuehe.jpg (http://s859.photo-bucket.com/user/usmcvet0331/media/BCM%201_zpsgcozuehe.jpg.html)
http://i859.photobucket.com/albums/ab160/usmcvet0331/BCM%202_zpsdkssw368.jpg (http://s859.photobucket.com/user/usmcvet0331/media/BCM%202_zpsdkssw368.jpg.html).
It has a BFG sling too. She didn't want a Aimpoint yet. I bought a BCM middy upper from BCM and set it up for my left handed GF. She loves it.
MountainRaven
02-06-16, 09:21
That's awesome!
Was it listed in an email or flyer? I didn't see them. All I found were three 10-22 items. A receiver, front sight and rail.
Upper: http://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/receiver-parts/receivers/upper-receivers/ar-15-m16a1-upper-receiver-prod83620.aspx
Lower: http://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/receiver-parts/receivers/lower-receivers/ar-15-m16-a1-lower-receiver-prod83622.aspx
Did the Daniel Defense Stocking dealer 2 years ago. 1 Rifle a month for 6 Months....... at the end of the 6 months I had 4 of the 6 still and only reason I sold 2 of them was because of friends who know what quality rifles were. EVERY OTHER SINGLE customer would come in and be disgusted that an AR was $1400 when they could buy the DPMS or Smith and Wesson for $650 and it would (do the exact same thing just as well)...
Really wish DD would do a basic MOE or OEM version now that the backlogs are freed up. There is still a strong market for kiss carbines without extreme rails or stocks.
I build DD uppers from parts for personal carbines for this reason, can't buy what I want. And then put it on a LMT complete lower as DD does not sell lowers.
I know BCM offers basic rifles, but none of the stores who stock BCM carry them, its always high $$$ signature models.
Meanwhile, rockriver, S&W, dpms, etc stream out the door by the hundreds.
I know the argument is that XYZ sells everything they build, so why do basic models? And that triggers so many thoughts about business models, economies of scale, growth, etc.
I don't really see BCM offering basic rifles...they do offer complete uppers and lowers separately.
Upper: http://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/receiver-parts/receivers/upper-receivers/ar-15-m16a1-upper-receiver-prod83620.aspx
Lower: http://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/receiver-parts/receivers/lower-receivers/ar-15-m16-a1-lower-receiver-prod83622.aspx
Thank you! This is all I could find.
http://www.brownells.com/search/index.htm?k=nodak&ksubmit=y
I don't really see BCM offering basic rifles...they do offer complete uppers and lowers separately.
BCM sells complete guns.
http://bravocompanymfg.com/weapon_systems/index.php
The MOD 0 is very basic
http://bravocompanymfg.com/carbines/m4.php
http://bravocompanymfg.com/carbines/cqb.php
Moose-Knuckle
02-07-16, 02:46
I don't really see BCM offering basic rifles...they do offer complete uppers and lowers separately.
Not sure if you have ever checked out G&R's site, but they have probably the largest selection of complete BCM rifles on the internet. Even models sans stocks and handguards to keep price down for KISS carbines years before Colt offered their OEM models. I typically buy uppers separate from the lowers so I can get exactly what I want. But there are complete rifles out there, I'm sure from your end as a dealer BCM can hook you up with basic configured carbines.
BCM sells complete guns.
http://bravocompanymfg.com/weapon_systems/index.php
The MOD 0 is very basic
http://bravocompanymfg.com/carbines/m4.php
http://bravocompanymfg.com/carbines/cqb.php
But it's almost $300 more than a 6920. As fantastic a rifle as the BCM is, the Colt wins the price point. That's for guys who are "switched on". Now add in the typical gun store traffic, and all those DPMS, BM's, etc make sense to the LGS wanting to keep the doors open.
If I'm buying a BCM, it won't be the "basic model".
That's my take on why you mostly see only the upgraded models from them, DD, etc.
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The BCM blemished lower from G&R is $345 with a stock or $330 w/o
http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=LWR-BCM-BLEM
and a BCM upper with BCG & CH from BCM's website ($585) is under $1,000.
The BCM blemished lower from G&R is $345 with a stock or $330 w/o
http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=LWR-BCM-BLEM
and a BCM upper with BCG & CH from BCM's website ($585) is under $1,000.
Rainier Arms and Primary Arms both will have the complete blem lowers for $250 to $300.
Rainier Arms and Primary Arms both will have the complete blem lowers for $250 to $300.
Don't understand buying blem when you can get a complete LMT lower for not much more? It appears they went up a bit, but just a couple of months ago I bought one $330 out the door including tax.
Don't understand buying blem when you can get a complete LMT lower for not much more? It appears they went up a bit, but just a couple of months ago I bought one $330 out the door including tax.
Some like a BCM lower with their BCM upper.
Don't understand buying blem when you can get a complete LMT lower for not much more? It appears they went up a bit, but just a couple of months ago I bought one $330 out the door including tax.
I should add the LMT lowers seem to have fewer issue with pmags, which is a big plus.
Some like a BCM lower with their BCM upper.
Because vanity! :D
BCM sells complete guns.
http://bravocompanymfg.com/weapon_systems/index.php
The MOD 0 is very basic
http://bravocompanymfg.com/carbines/m4.php
http://bravocompanymfg.com/carbines/cqb.php
Not sure if you have ever checked out G&R's site, but they have probably the largest selection of complete BCM rifles on the internet. Even models sans stocks and handguards to keep price down for KISS carbines years before Colt offered their OEM models. I typically buy uppers separate from the lowers so I can get exactly what I want. But there are complete rifles out there, I'm sure from your end as a dealer BCM can hook you up with basic configured carbines.
Thanks guys, and yes I understand that these are available, and I see where I did not make a clear statement. Yes, they do have a base model, but the least expensive model to me, a dealer, is over a $1000, and when I order direct from BCM, even those are not offered to me. And yes, I am quite familiar with the awesomeness of G&R, ordered tons of stuff there myself.
Rainier Arms and Primary Arms both will have the complete blem lowers for $250 to $300.
That is awesome!
Don't understand buying blem when you can get a complete LMT lower for not much more? It appears they went up a bit, but just a couple of months ago I bought one $330 out the door including tax.
I don't think Grant carries LMT anymore. I don't see them in stock when shopping online. I really want a LMT A2 lower. I have two and love them. I don't see them locally. BCM and LMT are the brands I buy. I've bought two blems. I don't see any issues with them.
That is awesome!
I don't think Grant carries LMT anymore. I don't see them in stock when shopping online. I really want a LMT A2 lower. I have two and love them. I don't see them locally. BCM and LMT are the brands I buy. I've bought two blems. I don't see any issues with them.
LMT A2s are sweet lowers, and make for excellent hosts for SPR/20" uppers. Grant will tell you that LMT makes excellent ARs, but they've never become mainstream, and their marketing lacks. Supposedly they live off .gov contracts.
Moose-Knuckle
02-09-16, 01:22
Thanks guys, and yes I understand that these are available, and I see where I did not make a clear statement. Yes, they do have a base model, but the least expensive model to me, a dealer, is over a $1000, and when I order direct from BCM, even those are not offered to me. And yes, I am quite familiar with the awesomeness of G&R, ordered tons of stuff there myself.
Well that is a shame, I purposely purchase BCM lowers separate from the uppers just to save money. I've done this for a DD M4V5LW back when DD sold complete factory lowers separately. Saved a ton of money!
Well that is a shame, I purposely purchase BCM lowers separate from the uppers just to save money. I've done this for a DD M4V5LW back when DD sold complete factory lowers separately. Saved a ton of money!
Yes, that is how I offer them....buy the upper and lower separate.
JackFanToM
02-09-16, 09:34
I live in Rapid City, SD and our local gun range carries quite a few BCM products. It was really nice when I walked in and saw they had a wall of DD and a wall of BCM
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