barnes precision machine CQB vs Kac sr15

[Goitch101]

Hi I'm looking to get either a CQB patrolman or a sr15 by Kac. I've heard great things about the barnes and that a lot of SF guys like these. Of course the sr15 has a great reputation. Can I get any input from anyone who has first hand experience with these rifles? Of course the KAC would be more expensive but money isn't an issue with this purchase. Thanks!

[Boba Fett v2]

Barnes is a somewhat NKOB in terms of firearms manufacturing. They've had a few "operators" endorse their stuff in the past from what I recall. They aren't a household name that's for sure. I've handled a few of their guns whenever I see them in shops or at gun shows, and they seem to be of good quality. I haven't really heard anything bad about them, but then again I don't know where they source their parts or anything. I would say stick to a tried and true and well established manufactures for the time being. I own and love KAC rifles and will likely buy more in the future, but honestly you don't need to spend all that coin to play. Daniel Defense, BCM, Colt, LMT, etc. are the usual suspects to consider as well. Good luck.

[PatrioticDisorder]

SR-15 is the apex AR-15, the ultimate alpha dog. You said money isn't an issue, this one isn't even a contest, SR-15 all the way.

[GH41]

No way I would spend $1,300 for the Barns when this is available.. http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=750-780

[SteveL]

I've never even heard of Barnes Precision.

[Boba Fett v2]

Steve Sellars was a big Barnes supporter on this board IIRC.

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[firefighter37]

They lost me with the NiB bolt carrier group...
I would be willing to give them a shot if it wasn't for that, but they don't do anything that other, already proven manufacturers already do. I understand the need for newcomers to be given a fair shot, but I'm not gonna be anyone's test dummy, especially when NiB can cause brittleness.

With all that out of the way, I own multiple rifles from many major brands (Colt, KAC, BCM, LMT, Noveske) and nothing that I have ever shot tops my SR-15s. I never believed the hype until I owned one, but an SR-15 shoots better than any other AR platform gun, period. I was happy with my Colts and BCMs until I shot one.

Many say it's not worth the premium you pay, but I would imagine they have never shot one. You won't be disappointed

[Dionysusigma]

You said money isn't an issue, this one isn't even a contest. SR-15 all the way.

Agreed. And, if money is an issue, the stock-configuration Colt 6920 is still a damned fine rifle.

The only thing I've ever heard about Barnes is that they're solely a bullet manufacturer. Not sure what I'd think of a car made by Shell...

[firefighter37]

Agreed. And, if money is an issue, the stock-configuration Colt 6920 is still a damned fine rifle.

The only thing I've ever heard about Barnes is that they're solely a bullet manufacturer. Not sure what I'd think of a car made by Shell...

I don't think it's the same company, but I could be wrong

[Boba Fett v2]

Agreed. And, if money is an issue, the stock-configuration Colt 6920 is still a damned fine rifle.

The only thing I've ever heard about Barnes is that they're solely a bullet manufacturer. Not sure what I'd think of a car made by Shell...

Not the same company. Barnes Precision Machine (https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?116256-Barnes-Precision-Machine)

[Tzook]

Dude. KAC. It's not even a question

[zackmars]

Dude. KAC. It's not even a question

This. Exactly this

[RAM Engineer]

I've never even heard of Barnes Precision.

Same here. This was akin to someone asking "Should I buy a car from Joe's Garage Worx or a Mercedes AMG? Lots of guys on the local forum love JGW's tuners!"

I would like it if the original poster could explain how he categorized these two rifles together during his narrowing of choices.

[Goitch101]

Same here. This was akin to someone asking "Should I buy a car from Joe's Garage Worx or a Mercedes AMG? Lots of guys on the local forum love JGW's tuners!"

I would like it if the original poster could explain how he categorized these two rifles together during his narrowing of choices.
Yeah this is pretty much what I thought. Since I heard SF guys like barnes precision I thought maybe it's some secretly badass ar that hasn't had the exposure that other high-end makers have had. I'm not knocking barnes. I'm sure they still make a solid AR.

[GH41]

What some companies do is give a couple of SF badasses product and advertise that SF guys use their product. It happens with everything from gun oil to pocket knives! It doesn't mean the products are good or bad just that a few SF guys use them on a square range.

[JC5188]

I've never heard of Barnes either. Even if I had, I'd still go with the KAC, as they are pretty much the Apex AR as has been stated.


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[Mr. Goodtimes]

Hi I'm looking to get either a CQB patrolman or a sr15 by Kac. I've heard great things about the barnes and that a lot of SF guys like these. Of course the sr15 has a great reputation. Can I get any input from anyone who has first hand experience with these rifles? Of course the KAC would be more expensive but money isn't an issue with this purchase. Thanks!

Who told you this? The Cletus behind the counter at the local gun shop? Somebody from Barnes Precision Machine? Some dude at the range who's buddy was on the Bin Laden raid?

Let me assure you that no USSOCOM entity of any kind is using a rifle from this no name company. KAC on the other hand is generally regarded as the best manufacturers in the industry and the SR-15 is regarded by many actual real world face shooters as the pinnacle of AR-15 performance. KAC, unlike Barnes does in fact hold many government contracts ranging from federal to local law enforcement.


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[jhs1969]

They lost me with the NiB bolt carrier group...
I would be willing to give them a shot if it wasn't for that, but they don't do anything that other, already proven manufacturers already do. I understand the need for newcomers to be given a fair shot, but I'm not gonna be anyone's test dummy, especially when NiB can cause brittleness.

With all that out of the way, I own multiple rifles from many major brands (Colt, KAC, BCM, LMT, Noveske) and nothing that I have ever shot tops my SR-15s. I never believed the hype until I owned one, but an SR-15 shoots better than any other AR platform gun, period. I was happy with my Colts and BCMs until I shot one.

Many say it's not worth the premium you pay, but I would imagine they have never shot one. You won't be disappointed

Well said and mirrors my own experience. I will also add that bringing a Colt (or any other brand) up to specs similar to the KAC will actually cost more, but you will still fall short of the KAC's bolt improvements. Ask me how I know

[Iraqgunz]

I'll just point out the obvious. It has an NiB BCG and absolutely no mention of material specs, testing, etc.. Call me crazy but when I see that kind of stuff, the red flags are usually somewhere near by.

[Frome]

A local shop by me is a Barnes dealer and I was very close to buying one. It seemed like a good value for the price but for me the deal breaker was the ss barrel. If I'm not mistaken I believe that's all they offer and they use 416 ss which has higher sulfur content than the 416r and th 410.
I ended up going with a DDM4 V5 and couldn't be happier.

[Livefreeordie92]

I'll just point out the obvious. It has an NiB BCG and absolutely no mention of material specs, testing, etc.. Call me crazy but when I see that kind of stuff, the red flags are usually somewhere near by.

Kinda like a Black Rain Ordinance that's less suited for the zombie breakout containment squad and $1000 cheaper.

[JoshNC]

Barnes is a somewhat NKOB in terms of firearms manufacturing. They've had a few "operators" endorse their stuff in the past from what I recall. They aren't a household name that's for sure. I've handled a few of their guns whenever I see them in shops or at gun shows, and they seem to be of good quality. I haven't really heard anything bad about them, but then again I don't know where they source their parts or anything. I would say stick to a tried and true and well established manufactures for the time being. I own and love KAC rifles and will likely buy more in the future, but honestly you don't need to spend all that coin to play. Daniel Defense, BCM, Colt, LMT, etc. are the usual suspects to consider as well. Good luck.

I've toured the BPM factory and was very very impressed. Andrew is making just about everything in house and a ton of really nice equipment to do so. I saw barrel blanks being turned and chambered, lowers, bolts, and bolt carriers being machined. Very impressive stuff.

Andrew is very knowledgeable about the AR and firearms in general. I shot my first and only 3 gun competition and was in his squad. Got to talking to him about his guns, specs, etc. I don't recall what barrel blanks he uses, but I know for certain that he was using the mil spec 158 carpenter steel for his bolts, which are machined in house.

I think Barnes makes very high quality rifles. I have no connection to BPM, I just happen to live in their neck of the woods and was able to tour their facility.

[REdruM0351]

I'll just point out the obvious. It has an NiB BCG and absolutely no mention of material specs, testing, etc.. Call me crazy but when I see that kind of stuff, the red flags are usually somewhere near by.

I was curious so I messaged them with some spec and material questions. Here is the response I got. I also inquired about their 300 blk.

The carrier is 86L20 and the bolts are Carpenter158, both are Nickle
Boron coated. The barrels are 416SS, heat treated and stress relieved
blanks sourced from Montana Rifleman blanks. All 16" 300blk bbls
use a carbine length gas system and come standard with our adjustable
gas system. Your option of 1/2"x28 or 5/8"x24 muzzle threads. The
rails are 6063 T5 aluminum. Uppers and lowers are 7075 forged
aluminum. All pins and detents are made in house to meet or exceed
milspec standards.

Please let me know if you have any additional questions. Right now
we are filling orders within 1-2 weeks, with some builds we are able
to ship same day.

Thank you,


Jon Smith
Barnes Precision Machine
jsmith@barnesprecision.com
(919)362-6805

[StevieJ309]

Who told you this? The Cletus behind the counter at the local gun shop? Somebody from Barnes Precision Machine? Some dude at the range who's buddy was on the Bin Laden raid?

Let me assure you that no USSOCOM entity of any kind is using a rifle from this no name company. KAC on the other hand is generally regarded as the best manufacturers in the industry and the SR-15 is regarded by many actual real world face shooters as the pinnacle of AR-15 performance. KAC, unlike Barnes does in fact hold many government contracts ranging from federal to local law enforcement.


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OP isn't exactly wrong. While it's obviously not issued, pictured below is a complete Barnes Precision rifle.


An U.S. Special Forces Soldier, attached to Combined Joint Special Operations Task Force-Afghanistan, scans an open field for activity after receiving enemy fire during an operation in the Nejrab district, Kapisa province, Afghanistan, May 27, 2014. USSF assisted Afghan National Army special forces and commandos on an operation to disrupt insurgent freedom of maneuver in the area. (U.S. Army photo by Spc. Connor Mendez/Released)
http://i.imgur.com/qCIyISI.jpg

[Iraqgunz]

No mention at all of HP/MPI testing. I do know for a fact, that a couple of years ago HP was not an option.


I was curious so I messaged them with some spec and material questions. Here is the response I got. I also inquired about their 300 blk.

The carrier is 86L20 and the bolts are Carpenter158, both are Nickle
Boron coated. The barrels are 416SS, heat treated and stress relieved
blanks sourced from Montana Rifleman blanks. All 16" 300blk bbls
use a carbine length gas system and come standard with our adjustable
gas system. Your option of 1/2"x28 or 5/8"x24 muzzle threads. The
rails are 6063 T5 aluminum. Uppers and lowers are 7075 forged
aluminum. All pins and detents are made in house to meet or exceed
milspec standards.

Please let me know if you have any additional questions. Right now
we are filling orders within 1-2 weeks, with some builds we are able
to ship same day.

Thank you,


Jon Smith
Barnes Precision Machine
jsmith@barnesprecision.com
(919)362-6805

[REdruM0351]

No mention at all of HP/MPI testing. I do know for a fact, that a couple of years ago HP was not an option.

I am trying to press them on this right now. It was the weekend so they will probably respond sometime this week.