View Full Version : P-35 Legitimized as EDC....
.....by Nighthawks latest entry?
http://www.nighthawkcustom.com/pistols/browning-hi-power
Personally not too impressed with their "mods" (never cared for a beavertail on a Hi-Power); but perhaps this somehow legitimizes what some of us have known for quite awhile.
For those that prefer a single action, hi-cap, 9 mm pistol; the P-35 is a heck of a carry gun.
Curious if there are any BHP shooters here.
http://i1043.photobucket.com/albums/b434/huntershooter/EDC%20P-35/EDC%20P-35%2011_zpsahvcipqw.jpg
http://i1043.photobucket.com/albums/b434/huntershooter/EDC%20P-35/EDC%20P-35%2010_zpssopext1n.jpg
http://i1043.photobucket.com/albums/b434/huntershooter/EDC%20P-35/EDC%20P-35%208_zpsqyftuxon.jpg
http://i1043.photobucket.com/albums/b434/huntershooter/EDC%20P-35/EDC%20P-35%206_zpsa66s5ozp.jpg
http://i1043.photobucket.com/albums/b434/huntershooter/EDC%20P-35/EDC%20P-35%204_zpsu75lzkxq.jpg
I used to own and carry them. After some trigger work they're wonderful shooters.
Always lusted after a Novak's build. Hi-Power's have always been "legit" carry pieces.
The Dumb Gun Collector
02-13-16, 19:08
Hardly needs legitimation. The p35 is one of the world's classic and most effective combat autoloaders.
Hardly needs legitimation. The p35 is one of the Most world's classic and most effective combat autoloaders.
My addition is bolded. But, yeah, the P35 is still a fine weapon, I know they fit me scary well. It really is a sad that is hasn't had the following that its younger brother the 1911 has enjoyed.
Hardly needs legitimation. The p35 is one of the world's classic and most effective combat autoloaders.
That is my point. There is a generation that has never experienced this platform; likely due to the advent of the plastic nines. Pity.
Without a beavertail I can't find one that doesn't bite. My buddy loves the High Power has a couple by Don Williams at The Action Works, and a Novak Spec-Ops package.
The Novak no-bite modification still bites. I would probably have gotten in to the High Power if I could run it without the web of my hand getting chewed up. The trigger is
kind of meh without some work, but they are a great little pistol.
A close friend has been carrying a stock Browning High Power for years. He is proficient with it and says it has never failed him.
Glad to see someone breathing new life into a classic.
Unfortunately, while I *really* want to like Hi-Powers, they just don't work for me.
When it comes to all-steel 9mms, I'm CZ-75 all the way.
I love it. I need to send mine off to be tuned one day.
It is the best "looking" pistol in my opinion. Just like a Porsche 911 is always good looking and Cindy Crawford is still a smoke show. Classic good looks are always in style. Doesn't hurt that the P-35 is also a great pistol to carry and shoot!
Drifting Fate
02-13-16, 20:52
While 'smiths can do beautiful things with the Browning Hi-Power, it works great out of the box.
I spent many miles with one on my hip, would do so again, and am on the edge about buying another one (+ a Nighthawk version, as I've always wanted a Nighthawk) because it could very well be my favorite pistol design, ever.
Dare I say it, it's the Gun Snob's Glock 19.
Dare I say it, it's the Gun Snob's Glock 19.
Love it. I may have to borrow that one.
Hardly needs legitimation. The p35 is one of the world's classic and most effective combat autoloaders.
Agreed. I don't get why people care what others think about firearms they use / carry. :confused:
I carried a bone stock MKIII for years in a Milt Sparks VMII or a Raven type kydex. It (they, I had several) ate any ammo I fed it and was scary accurate with 147gr HST.
The mag disconnect is a non-issue if you use stock phosphated magazines. The slick blued mags make the trigger notchy and rough. Factory 20 rounders are just as reliable as the 13s. Mec-Gar 15s are GTG but I always liked the follower design of the 13s better.
The epoxy finish doesn't rust and the stock plastic grips feel great in my hand. Black out the stripes on the rear sight with sight black and the stock sights are very good.
I quit carrying Hi Powers altogether after I hurt my back and had to start carrying appendix. I never went back after moving to 9mm Glocks and realizing that I could do everything better with a Glock 17 or 19 that weighed less.
arbninftry
02-13-16, 23:22
Owned, Carried and Shot them for years.
Hell, my ex wife owned one. Damn I miss it,... The hi power, not that bi@@@.
They are great guns.
It really is a sad that is hasn't had the following that its younger brother the 1911 has enjoyed.
Actually, the P35 is the younger of the two.
Okie John
titsonritz
02-14-16, 11:02
I love Hi-Powers. I remember my dad had an older ones with a deep, rich blued finish, it was a beautiful.
Actually, the P35 is the younger of the two.
Okie John
Lol. I shouldn't post after drinking, meant older Brother the 1911. Though, I will say this, in someways I do think the P35/high Power are better than a 1911, I do know that a P35 does fit my hand very well, perhaps even better than the 1911. Which I am sure is blasphemy to some.
titsonritz
02-14-16, 11:22
I'd say the 1911 is the P35's older half-brother.
I'd say the 1911 is the P35's older half-brother.
A fair assessment. I unfortunatelt forget the mans name but it was finished the design at FN after John Browning's death if my memory serves me. So callig them half brothers would be accurate in my opinion.
WWW.ACTIONSBYT.COM
Have Teddy Jacobson do an action job on a P35. I have shot 2 HP he worked over. Very nice.
Much lower cost than Nighthawk
Dieudonné Saive took up the reins after JMB passed.
Mrgunsngear
02-14-16, 13:17
I think the current generation of shooters is reticent to take up the Hi Power as a HD/Duty/carry gun because it doesn't have a light rail. It's an awesome gun though for sure. I've got a FN that shoots great.
lawusmc0844
02-14-16, 13:20
Lol. I shouldn't post after drinking, meant older Brother the 1911. Though, I will say this, in someways I do think the P35/high Power are better than a 1911, I do know that a P35 does fit my hand very well, perhaps even better than the 1911. Which I am sure is blasphemy to some.
Can't call it blasphemy when the Hi-Power is basically an improvement of the 1911 design, those guys really don't have an argument. The only downsides compared to the 1911 is the even shorter tang and mag disconnect. I have medium size hands which fortunately aren't big enough to get bit by the hammer but still I wonder why Browning and Saive didn't think of a extended beavertail.
It was my duty weapon for a lot of years and I now own 3 a box stock, Novak Spec Ops, and a Cylinder and Slide full house.
I have to say I just picked up and played with a CZ P09 that just might be my new love.
I think the current generation of shooters is reticent to take up the Hi Power as a HD/Duty/carry gun because it doesn't have a light rail. It's an awesome gun though for sure. I've got a FN that shoots great.
Yeah, that's definitely a turn-off. Every gun I own has to have the capability of having a light attached. All my ARs have a 5 or 600 lumen Surefire on 'em, all my handguns have a rail and any time a handgun serves as a bedside gun, there is an X300 on it.
Another thing about a HiPower is that you have to do a reload right, or it'll come to a nails-on-the-chalkboard stop about halfway in. Those mags can go in a little twisted, but not they won't self align for some reason.
Can't call it blasphemy when the Hi-Power is basically an improvement of the 1911 design, those guys really don't have an argument. The only downsides compared to the 1911 is the even shorter tang and mag disconnect. I have medium size hands which fortunately aren't big enough to get bit by the hammer but still I wonder why Browning and Saive didn't think of a extended beavertail.
Some guys will though. Because it isn't a 1911 so it must suck, kind of like the guys who have Glock, Ak, or even AR so far up their ass that everything else is inferior. I forgot about the mag disconnect. That is really something of an annoyance. As far as the beavertail goes I haven't a clue, one of those it worked for them, so it didn't need changing perhaps, or maybe it was just the prevalent style of the day. I just don't have the answer for it. That said, the High power really does bring things to the table, and if it were to be taken and modernized in the ways the 1911 has I think it could hold its own. Alas, another handgun that deserves a place in the collection, and one that I do sometimes wish I had bought the one that I had in my hands a few years back. So many guns, so little money.
I've had a MK III Silver Chrome Hi Power with the stock adjustable sights since 1994, but it is just a range gun. Accurate as hell, and never skips a beat. I'd wouldn't hesitate to carry one with standard sights. It is slim, elegant, and perfectly sized for the 9MM.
brushy bill
02-14-16, 18:50
Another thing about a HiPower is that you have to do a reload right, or it'll come to a nails-on-the-chalkboard stop about halfway in. Those mags can go in a little twisted, but not they won't self align for some reason.
I never heard of this...can you provide a little more info to clarify what this entails? Thanks.
titsonritz
02-14-16, 18:56
A fair assessment. I unfortunatelt forget the mans name but it was finished the design at FN after John Browning's death if my memory serves me. So callig them half brothers would be accurate in my opinion.
Dieudonné Saive.
The Browning Hi Power (http://www.realguns.com/articles/424.htm)
titsonritz
02-14-16, 19:05
I think the current generation of shooters is reticent to take up the Hi Power as a HD/Duty/carry gun because it doesn't have a light rail. It's an awesome gun though for sure. I've got a FN that shoots great.
Yeah, that's definitely a turn-off. Every gun I own has to have the capability of having a light attached. All my ARs have a 5 or 600 lumen Surefire on 'em, all my handguns have a rail and any time a handgun serves as a bedside gun, there is an X300 on it.
Another thing about a HiPower is that you have to do a reload right, or it'll come to a nails-on-the-chalkboard stop about halfway in. Those mags can go in a little twisted, but not they won't self align for some reason.
That can be "fixed"
http://www.thecountryshed.com/browning_pistol_accessories.htm
http://www.cylinder-slide.com/index.php?app=ccp0&ns=prodshow&ref=CS264
http://kitup.military.com/2011/03/put-your-pistol-on-rails.html
Another thing about a HiPower is that you have to do a reload right, or it'll come to a nails-on-the-chalkboard stop about halfway in. Those mags can go in a little twisted, but not they won't self align for some reason.
I have never had that experience with my Hi Power nor others I have shot, and I've owned one, and shot other friends Hi Power since the early 90's. I have never even heard that before.
teutonicpolymer
02-14-16, 19:48
I have never had that experience with my Hi Power nor others I have shot, and I've owned one, and shot other friends Hi Power since the early 90's. I have never even heard that before.
The magwell/channel is pretty narrow on Hi Powers so I agree with reloads being difficult
KalashniKEV
02-14-16, 20:35
P-35 Legitimized
Legitimized???
Homey... GP35 is AS LEGIT AS IT GETS.
http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h88/operationiceberg/saddamhipower.jpg (http://s62.photobucket.com/user/operationiceberg/media/saddamhipower.jpg.html)
lawusmc0844
02-14-16, 20:40
Some guys will though. Because it isn't a 1911 so it must suck, kind of like the guys who have Glock, Ak, or even AR so far up their ass that everything else is inferior. I forgot about the mag disconnect. That is really something of an annoyance. As far as the beavertail goes I haven't a clue, one of those it worked for them, so it didn't need changing perhaps, or maybe it was just the prevalent style of the day. I just don't have the answer for it. That said, the High power really does bring things to the table, and if it were to be taken and modernized in the ways the 1911 has I think it could hold its own. Alas, another handgun that deserves a place in the collection, and one that I do sometimes wish I had bought the one that I had in my hands a few years back. So many guns, so little money.
Those people are TOOLs, I prefer Glock but I dont go around telling everyone how superior it is over everything else. I understand its capabilities and limitations, just like with the 1911 and the BHP. I own all three too and can switch back and forth without any issue. Fanatics of anything make me sick...
Yes, the Hi-Power seems very underrated and if I had the money, I would do some modern improvements on mine. Mine is at a shop in Vegas waiting to get fixed because I made the mistake of purchasing it without test firing it first. The owners before the last owner I bought it from removed the mag disconnect but there is no trigger reset at all. It also locked the slide back with rounds still in the magazine when I use my normal aggressive thumb over thumb grip. Other than that it is a tack driver, it is what 9mm 1911 owners should look at instead.
lawusmc0844
02-14-16, 20:48
Lol now THIS is legit!
http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/gadaffi_pistol-tfb.jpg
The magwell/channel is pretty narrow on Hi Powers so I agree with reloads being difficult
But, the mag "twisting" in the magwell??? My MK III has a beveled magwell.
KalashniKEV
02-14-16, 21:57
Lol now THIS is legit!
That one belonged to the Brother Leader.
British Royalty consider it properly legitimate as well:
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/Harry_022908.jpg
That one belonged to the Brother Leader.
British Royalty consider it properly legitimate as well:
Trying to figure Harry out: hat with US flag, purple sharpie or map marker, and butchered PALS insecurely holding a pistol. Talk about unsafe carry!
I carry a plain jane alloy frame hi power quite a bit. Ive tossed around the idea of sending it off to get customized but cant really justify the cost most smiths demand for hi power work. I like the gun as it is already.
Can't call it blasphemy when the Hi-Power is basically an improvement of the 1911 design, those guys really don't have an argument. The only downsides compared to the 1911 is the even shorter tang and mag disconnect. I have medium size hands which fortunately aren't big enough to get bit by the hammer but still I wonder why Browning and Saive didn't think of a extended beavertail.
If they didnt have to work around the various 1911 patents, the Hi Power could've been the perfect pistol.
Trying to figure Harry out: hat with US flag, purple sharpie or map marker, and butchered PALS insecurely holding a pistol. Talk about unsafe carry!
Wasn't he a helicopter back seater/weapons officer? That BHP should be in a holster and secured, that's for sure.
dragonsfire311
02-15-16, 14:28
37781
Works just fine
Aim Surplus just started advertising FN MK 2 Hi Powers w/lanyard rings for $435.00 .
mkmckinley
02-15-16, 16:57
Interesting. What 1911 patents compromised the BHP?
Wasn't he a helicopter back seater/weapons officer? That BHP should be in a holster and secured, that's for sure.
Probably not a lot of people in the British Army willing to tell the prince what he can and cannot do with his pistol.
Interesting. What 1911 patents compromised the BHP?
All of them, he sold the rights to the M1911 to Colt before France co.missioned him to design their new service pistol.
https://www.google.com/patents/US1618510
I put about 50 rounds through 3 Hi-powers today. One Novak Spec ops package, one worked over by Don Williams at the Action Works and a stock one.
The Action Works pistol has a nicer trigger than the Novak, and both were much nicer than stock. For shooters who notice lack of tactile trigger reset the High power seems weak to me.
All 3 shot great and they are slim handy little pistols. My buddy who owns all 3 and another 3 or 4 more that he didn't bring loves the High Power. For me a Sig P320 or Glock 17/19 just works better.
The Action Works pistol has a beavertail which I would need if I owned one, because the other two chew the back of my hand up. Overall its a great little pistol just has a couple of bugs for me personally.
I had one for a while, neat guns but the tiny little thumb safety, sights, magazine disconnect, ho-hum trigger, lackluster ammo capacity, and lack of a accompanying compact version led me to sell it. Sort of like a 1911, I'd have to spend too much money to get one the way I'd really like.
For someone has the desire to address those concerns though, it would certainly make a unique and special EDC.
All of them, he sold the rights to the M1911 to Colt before France co.missioned him to design their new service pistol.
https://www.google.com/patents/US1618510
I think what he means (and I'd be interested to know also) it's what could have been improved if not for the 1911 patents?
first pistol i ever bought was a hungarian FEG clone of a HP. Had it 15 years now and it still runs like a champ. Probably county on 2 hands the number of malfunctions I've had over god knows how many rounds....most attributable to shit magazines.
WWW.ACTIONSBYT.COM
Have Teddy Jacobson do an action job on a P35. I have shot 2 HP he worked over. Very nice.
Much lower cost than Nighthawk
Same here...A belgium HP was my first duty pistol, and "T" worked it over for me. It still resides in my safe and is still my favorite 9mm without a doubt. I wish I would have picked up a few more before the prices got so high on them.
TXPO
KalashniKEV
02-16-16, 09:52
All of them, he sold the rights to the M1911 to Colt before France co.missioned him to design their new service pistol.
https://www.google.com/patents/US1618510
Ummm... there are obviously patents associated with each design, but which ones specifically did he want to carry over but couldn't?
Grip Safety? (stupid)
Bow Trigger? (stupid)
Plunger Tube? (stupid)
The only thing I can possibly think of that's better on a 1911 is the safety.
Maybe swappable mainspring housings could have become the original interchangeable backstraps??
The mag disconnect safety is the one unique (and stupid) feature of the GP35, and that was a specific customer request.
Are you proposing a Hi Power made in .45 and 10MM?!
Because, I would be all on that.
brickboy240
02-16-16, 10:03
Very cool that they offer this package.
I have a highly modded FN Hi-Power that was done with many Cylinder & Slide parts. Very accurate and reliable. A tad heavy for carry but it is thin and fits a few of my 1911 pancake leather holsters and I open carry this pistol on the family ranch quite often.
After fooling around with a very finicky 9mm 1911...yeah...give me a Hi-Power over a 9mm 1911 any day. The damned thing was designed as a 9mm and runs best that way.
The mag disconnect safety is the one unique (and stupid) feature of the GP35, and that was a specific customer request.
First thing every HP owner should ditch. Makes the trigger much nicer.
Are you proposing a Hi Power made in .45 and 10MM?!
Because, I would be all on that.
That would be awesome....
KalashniKEV
02-16-16, 10:39
First thing every HP owner should ditch. Makes the trigger much nicer.
I actually put mine back in.
The break is not as nice with the safety installed, but the reset is much improved (maybe just on my sample?).
brickboy240
02-16-16, 11:55
I took out the mag safety and added Cylinder & Slide's commander hammer/sear package and their spring kit.
Amazing difference....almost 1911-ish.
If you ask me, the Hi-Power, when properly set up, is one sweet shooting 9mm.
I actually put mine back in.
The break is not as nice with the safety installed, but the reset is much improved (maybe just on my sample?).
That is the one downside to removing the mag safety. Reset is a bit ambiguous on mine. Mine has been relegated to range use though so to me the break is more important than the reset. The tradeoffs are something to consider if you were going to use it as a defensive pistol...
I think the current generation of shooters is reticent to take up the Hi Power as a HD/Duty/carry gun because it doesn't have a light rail. It's an awesome gun though for sure. I've got a FN that shoots great.
For those who like rails, you just get the BHP evolution in the form of a CZ SP01. I have never been a fan of the BHP, but that is slowly changing as I get a chance to shoot them.
Ummm... there are obviously patents associated with each design, but which ones specifically did he want to carry over but couldn't?
Grip Safety? (stupid)
Bow Trigger? (stupid)
Plunger Tube? (stupid)
The only thing I can possibly think of that's better on a 1911 is the safety.
Maybe swappable mainspring housings could have become the original interchangeable backstraps??
The mag disconnect safety is the one unique (and stupid) feature of the GP35, and that was a specific customer request.
No idea what if anything he wanted to swap over, but he was forced into an entirely new design because he could not legally use anything from the 1911 platform. What exactly in your opinion, makes the bow trigger "stupid"?
crazymoose
02-16-16, 17:47
If memory serves, the Hi Power was substantially different when Browning kicked, to the tune of striker-fired operation. Some of Browning's ideas temained, like the mag, but the gun really should be remembered more as Saive's handiwork than Browning's.
Good guns, but the grip is too short for my hands and the trigger is not great. The more complicated linkage was a huge step back from the 1911's simplicity.
If memory serves, the Hi Power was substantially different when Browning kicked, to the tune of striker-fired operation. Some of Browning's ideas temained, like the mag, but the gun really should be remembered more as Saive's handiwork than Browning's.
Good guns, but the grip is too short for my hands and the trigger is not great. The more complicated linkage was a huge step back from the 1911's simplicity.
That's true. The gun that Browning designed for the French pistol trials is not the one that we know today as the Hi Power. Browning's design didn't win and was shelved at FN. Saive was the one who took the design and reworked it after Browning's death to create the gun we know today as the Hi Power. He was also the one who designed the staggered column magazine in the first place.
lawusmc0844
02-16-16, 19:54
Very interesting, I always thought Saive continued Browning's ideas for the gun after his death. Maybe we should call it the Saive Hi-Power? Or like the Mosin-Nagant call it the Browning-Saive?
That is the one downside to removing the mag safety. Reset is a bit ambiguous on mine. Mine has been relegated to range use though so to me the break is more important than the reset. The tradeoffs are something to consider if you were going to use it as a defensive pistol...
Mine had zero felt reset with the mag disconnect removed. Since I want all my guns to be able to be used in a defensive matter, I sent it to get fixed, trigger reset is very important to me.
Had one for a week a while back. Itty bitty safety and the fact that it choked on just about every fmj.....eh no thanks
Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk
Interesting thread, and especially some of the later comments about what Browning designed before he died in 1926. Here's a link to his 1923 patent that was part of the basis of the later Hi-Power model https://www.google.com/patents/US1618510. Browning's original is striker fired -- not his first to use that, by the way -- and does incorporate the staggered magazine designed by Saive.
KalashniKEV
02-16-16, 23:04
What exactly in your opinion, makes the bow trigger "stupid"?
It is not a good design.
Mrgunsngear
02-17-16, 07:54
For those who like rails, you just get the BHP evolution in the form of a CZ SP01. I have never been a fan of the BHP, but that is slowly changing as I get a chance to shoot them.
Indeed. I have no clue what the sales numbers but I'd imagine that guns which are an 'evolution' of the design sell better in America than actual Hi Powers do.
crusader377
02-17-16, 08:19
Indeed. I have no clue what the sales numbers but I'd imagine that guns which are an 'evolution' of the design sell better in America than actual Hi Powers do.
I have no idea of the actual sales numbers but I would be surprised in Browning sells more than a few thousand Hi-Powers per year. There great guns but the market for a pistol that sells for the $900-$1000 range is pretty small in the whole scheme of things and the Hi Power was never a particularly common pistol in the United States.
I have one that shoots very nicely. The trigger needed a C/S hammer and sear and work that wasn't cheap. They require a PHD gunsmith because the trigger is indirect via the transfer bar. Not every area has this type of smith. SOME admittedly don't require this, but most do. This coupled with price, makes a fairly flat market. But, they do exude coolness, and are generally very accurate.
KalashniKEV
02-17-16, 10:08
The trigger needed... They require a PHD gunsmith...
Interesting language.
Interesting language.
Yup - picked that term up on 1911 forum in the BHP section - and I agree with it. It took TWO trips to a very reputable smith here in my area, and it ain't perfect. The trigger bar in the frame lifts the front of the transfer bar, in which the other end presses the sear. To me this is very ingenious in terms of getting a smaller frame, but complicated in terms of the trigger action. Really complicated - the opposite of the 1911 - which is straight and direct.
OBTW: I don't see any connection to the CZ other than the fact that the CZ is hicap, and has lightening cuts in the end of the slide. The BHP is its own thing along with its direct clones.
Shot one for the first time, an Inglis, in a "Commando" match in Canada, in 1960. Very rakish in those long-ago days. I had already sworn the Jeff Cooper blood oath of eternal loyalty to the 1911, but I have a real soft spot for the elegant (and reliable!) BHP. Delete the mag safety, install a C&S thumb safety, Spegels, and done.
Stephen Camp's "Guide" to the BHP is very useful, still available. Well worth having.
Indeed. I have no clue what the sales numbers but I'd imagine that guns which are an 'evolution' of the design sell better in America than actual Hi Powers do.
I have no idea of the actual sales numbers but I would be surprised in Browning sells more than a few thousand Hi-Powers per year. There great guns but the market for a pistol that sells for the $900-$1000 range is pretty small in the whole scheme of things and the Hi Power was never a particularly common pistol in the United States.
I think another factor to the BHP's relative obscurity in the U.S. is marketing. How many BHP's did you see in the hands of the action stars of the 80's? I can only recall seeing one in the hands of Col. Hannibal Smith on The A-Team. However Detectives John McClain and Martin Riggs along with the entire LAPD(the agency that was always in the movies) carried Beretta 92FS's and the real life cops people knew back then mostly carried revolvers or some type of S&W semi-auto. Then in the 90's the Beretta was replaced by Glock, thus making the BHP a gun that many people had never seen nor heard of and relegating it to a small niche in the U.S. market.
Also when I say Browning to most of the gun owners I know this is the exact image that pops into their heads:
37834
And then they want to tell me about their A-Bolt chambered in .270
I think another factor to the BHP's relative obscurity in the U.S. is marketing. How many BHP's did you see in the hands of the action stars of the 80's? I can only recall seeing one in the hands of Col. Hannibal Smith on The A-Team. However Detectives John McClain and Martin Riggs along with the entire LAPD(the agency that was always in the movies) carried Beretta 92FS's and the real life cops people knew back then mostly carried revolvers or some type of S&W semi-auto. Then in the 90's the Beretta was replaced by Glock, thus making the BHP a gun that many people had never seen nor heard of and relegating it to a small niche in the U.S. market.
Also when I say Browning to most of the gun owners I know this is the exact image that pops into their heads:
37834
And then they want to tell me about their A-Bolt chambered in .270
Eddie Murphy in Beverly Hills Cop.
Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk
I think another factor to the BHP's relative obscurity in the U.S. is marketing. How many BHP's did you see in the hands of the action stars of the 80's? I can only recall seeing one in the hands of Col. Hannibal Smith on The A-Team. However Detectives John McClain and Martin Riggs along with the entire LAPD(the agency that was always in the movies) carried Beretta 92FS's and the real life cops people knew back then mostly carried revolvers or some type of S&W semi-auto. Then in the 90's the Beretta was replaced by Glock, thus making the BHP a gun that many people had never seen nor heard of and relegating it to a small niche in the U.S. market.
Another aspect is that during it's peak popularity as a military sidearm, that was a period when the US Military was using the 1911. A lot of foreign militaries issued it, getting people familiar with it overseas, but never here in the US.
brickboy240
02-18-16, 10:08
Didn't you ever watch the "Beverly Hills Cop" movies with Eddie Murphy in the 80s?
His detective character always carried a Hi-Power.
teutonicpolymer
02-19-16, 08:33
I think another factor to the BHP's relative obscurity in the U.S. is marketing. How many BHP's did you see in the hands of the action stars of the 80's? I can only recall seeing one in the hands of Col. Hannibal Smith on The A-Team. However Detectives John McClain and Martin Riggs along with the entire LAPD(the agency that was always in the movies) carried Beretta 92FS's and the real life cops people knew back then mostly carried revolvers or some type of S&W semi-auto. Then in the 90's the Beretta was replaced by Glock, thus making the BHP a gun that many people had never seen nor heard of and relegating it to a small niche in the U.S. market.
Also when I say Browning to most of the gun owners I know this is the exact image that pops into their heads:
37834
And then they want to tell me about their A-Bolt chambered in .270
Al Pacino had one in Serpico
MountainRaven
02-19-16, 09:31
Al Pacino had one in Serpico
Miami Vice's Detective Stan Switek (Michael Talbot) carried a GP-35 for all five seasons of that TV show. And virtually everyone in The Usual Suspects. And Switch in The Matrix.
Read the book, "First In", by Gary Shroen, they were issued P-35 (and AK) when they were inserted into Afghanistan 15 days after 9/11.
titsonritz
02-19-16, 11:55
Captain Malcolm Reynolds got shot in the gut with one.
Captain Malcolm Reynolds got shot in the gut with one.
So did Pope John Paul II.
Okie John
Primus Pilum
02-19-16, 14:49
Without a beavertail I can't find one that doesn't bite. My buddy loves the High Power has a couple by Don Williams at The Action Works, and a Novak Spec-Ops package.
The Novak no-bite modification still bites. I would probably have gotten in to the High Power if I could run it without the web of my hand getting chewed up. The trigger is
kind of meh without some work, but they are a great little pistol.
Fix your grip. With the C&S upgrades is a non issue.
titsonritz
02-19-16, 14:52
So did Pope John Paul II.
Okie John
Pope John Paul II Assasination Attempt (http://www.upi.com/Archives/Audio/Events-of-1981/Pope-John-Paul-II-Assasination-Attempt)
Fix your grip. With the C&S upgrades is a non issue.
There is nothing wrong with my grip. I have shot High Powers with the C&S hammer. I don't have this issue with any other pistol.
Including 1911's without beavertails. The High Power just doesn't work for me.
militarymoron
02-20-16, 00:16
'The final option' always comes to my mind as far as movies go, that feature the BHP. I've always associated the BHP with a british TV show called 'the professionals' and the SAS.
37850
I have a very old (not 100% sure how old) BHP I inherited from my grandfather. It's a fantastic shooter, although it suffers from an ejection port that's too small and a recoil spring that's far too stiff. If I ever had more of a 'shooter" BHP I would carry it constantly.
Miami Vice's Detective Stan Switek (Michael Talbot) carried a GP-35 for all five seasons of that TV show. And virtually everyone in The Usual Suspects. And Switch in The Matrix.
Crockett and Tubbs didn't.
Didn't you ever watch the "Beverly Hills Cop" movies with Eddie Murphy in the 80s?
His detective character always carried a Hi-Power.
No, I've actually never seen the whole thing start to finish, just bits and pieces.
Al Pacino had one in Serpico
Not exactly an 80's action movie.
If we are talking HPs in cinema, don't forget the Usual Suspects. That was everyone's gun. Plus that one mean girl eas killing folks up with one in Battle Royale.
The HP was also like one of the defacto Green Beanie guns of the Vietnam War. IIRC most were personal purchase. I think I read that one book Gone Native snd dude said he bought his stateside during leave and smuggled it in with like five mags and sold it off before going back or something.
Thread needs more pics. Just saying. Lol
Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
Yes sir.
http://api.viglink.com/api/click?format=go&jsonp=vglnk_14560154791399&key=d2f6dc3d61fd72ef48d01980d6bfec29&libId=ikvu0puj01000o08000DA41s5acmj&loc=http%3A%2F%2Fyukublg.u.yuku.com%2Ffs%2Fview%2Ffid%2F282972&v=1&out=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.yuku.com%2Fimage%2Fjpeg%2Ff8635101d6bcfade07d390b96a3c40a4658de34.jpg&ref=http%3A%2F%2Fyukublg.u.yuku.com%2Ffs%2Fls%2Fid%2F131872&title=Images%20-%20My%20Images&txt=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.yuku.com%2Fimage%2Fjpeg%2Ff8635101d6bcfade07d390b96a3c40a4658de34.jpg
Since then it got the C/S hammer/sear.
Thread needs more pics. Just saying. Lol
Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
Yost HP that somebody wanted real bad, so I let it go :)
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/DSCF12251.JPG
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/DSCF12291.JPG
Did someone say picture thread?
http://i58.tinypic.com/16948zb.jpg
Special delivery from Craig Spegel. Cool story about those grips.
http://i54.tinypic.com/2hn96hx.jpg
Built this one up a bit for my dad. Spegels were on their way.
http://i55.tinypic.com/25hkchy.jpg
But, on topic, I think it's great to see someone else working on HP's. That said, I don't think this will improve nor hurt it's use as a carry weapon, but it's always good to have more options.
Thread needs more pics. Just saying.
Excellent point.
I don't particularly enjoy shooting them, but I do love looking at them.
More Cowbell
MkIII Practical, MkII, and a FN marked MkIII warmed over by Don Williams
http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k158/mrbieler/HP%20Family_zpsif7riplx.jpg
The FN marked pistols were odd. Not sure why FN was marketing them direct in the US when Browning was already their retail point, but they were going for all of $400 (MUCH cheaper then the same pistol with a Browning roll mark) so I had to pick up a few. Bought 3. Sold two to pay for the one I kept. Should have kept them all.
Pair of Inglis HP's as well. Always interesting to see Canadian troops still using them in the field. The sights are a fair bit better then the older model HP sights.
http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k158/mrbieler/Inglis%20Family_zpsratckayx.jpg
militarymoron
02-21-16, 10:13
why not...
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v483/militarymoron/bhp21.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v483/militarymoron/bhp22.jpg
Spurholder
02-21-16, 10:15
'The final option' always comes to my mind as far as movies go, that feature the BHP. I've always associated the BHP with a british TV show called 'the professionals' and the SAS.
37850
If you haven't seen the film in a while, it's available for free streaming from Amazon Prime Video. The scene at the Mews was my favorite part.
Just watched it the other day, and got the BHP bug...again.
MountainRaven
02-21-16, 15:50
Did somebody say Hi Power?
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a198/Jagdraben/photo-32_zpsc487e1bd.jpg
My meager offering. I got the holster by mail order from Milt Sparks around 1983.
http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb192/cigardad/image_zpsf9vf8qbk.jpeg (http://s208.photobucket.com/user/cigardad/media/image_zpsf9vf8qbk.jpeg.html)
My meager offering. I got the holster by mail order from Milt Sparks around 1983.
http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb192/cigardad/image_zpsf9vf8qbk.jpeg (http://s208.photobucket.com/user/cigardad/media/image_zpsf9vf8qbk.jpeg.html)
Nothing meager about that pair, classic and classy.
Love the 1AT, especially with the fancy stitching.
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/ms5.jpg
My meager collection :)
If you haven't seen the film in a while, it's available for free streaming from Amazon Prime Video. The scene at the Mews was my favorite part.
Just watched it the other day, and got the BHP bug...again.
One of my all time favorite movies! The scene where Rosalind Lloyd is fighting the terrorist bitch and the SAS shooters come through the wall is incredible. FWIW she was, I believe, the daughter of one of the producers, Euan Lloyd. She also played the card dealer and girlfriend of Roger Moore in "The Wild Geese" (Another Euan Lloyd movie).
I guess if I can't have her, I can have the lovely BHP...
I can't shake the BHP bug!
The P35 is a great pistol. I carry it regularly.
http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb192/cigardad/image_zpsf9vf8qbk.jpeg (http://s208.photobucket.com/user/cigardad/media/image_zpsf9vf8qbk.jpeg.html)
Gorgeous. Are those Spegels?
KalashniKEV
02-21-16, 23:25
Thread needs more pics. Just saying. Lol
Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r220/Kalashnikev/Pistols/IMAG1068_zpsiy1i6i0k.jpg (http://s145.photobucket.com/user/Kalashnikev/media/Pistols/IMAG1068_zpsiy1i6i0k.jpg.html)
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r220/Kalashnikev/Pistols/IMAG0902_zpsntcujp4i.jpg (http://s145.photobucket.com/user/Kalashnikev/media/Pistols/IMAG0902_zpsntcujp4i.jpg.html)
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r220/Kalashnikev/Pistols/IMG_1238.jpg (http://s145.photobucket.com/user/Kalashnikev/media/Pistols/IMG_1238.jpg.html)
I'm bringing the ugly girl to the prom...
http://i.imgur.com/N0pAW8J.jpg
I've had it for like two days.
1985 FN Mk2, allegedly ex-Israeli police issue. Lots of wear and tear on the finish but seems to be in good mechanical shape. The rear sight is pretty dinged up but still appears usable. I might have the sights addressed at some point but will likely leave the finish mostly the way it is.
Nothing meager about that pair, classic and classy.
Love the 1AT, especially with the fancy stitching.
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/ms5.jpg
My meager collection :)
Those are beautiful. I wish everything I bought lasted as well. I bought the AT and what was known as the "Arizona Ranger" rig IIRC for a 4" N frame at the same time and have been able to hold on to them.
http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb192/cigardad/image_zpsq9aqhk5z.jpeg (http://s208.photobucket.com/user/cigardad/media/image_zpsq9aqhk5z.jpeg.html)
Frailer, yes those are Spegels.
LibertyNeverDies
02-25-16, 20:04
Browning Hi Power was the first semi auto handgun I ever fired. It holds a very special place in my heart. I'm 21 so I'm firmly in the younger generation. I won't buy one till have can justify spending the money to have one fully customized.
If Browning would produce a stainless or satin nickel version again I might buy one now. The current guns in their line up are ugly. They need some G10 or nice finishes to appeal to my generation.
I believe if Browning were to revamp the finishes then the sales would go up. All my friends love 1911s and part of that is the finishes and sex appeal.
MountainRaven
02-25-16, 21:54
Browning Hi Power was the first semi auto handgun I ever fired. It holds a very special place in my heart. I'm 21 so I'm firmly in the younger generation. I won't buy one till have can justify spending the money to have one fully customized.
If Browning would produce a stainless or satin nickel version again I might buy one now. The current guns in their line up are ugly. They need some G10 or nice finishes to appeal to my generation.
I believe if Browning were to revamp the finishes then the sales would go up. All my friends love 1911s and part of that is the finishes and sex appeal.
While the epoxy finish is pretty blah, FN's bluing is fantastic.
KalashniKEV
02-25-16, 22:05
They need some G10 or nice finishes to appeal to my generation.
Ighhh...
NO WAY
The GP35 is a classic.
If you want to spray it, mount curb feelers, or dangle an air freshener off the lanyard loop, just buy one and go at it.
There should be 3 finishes- Parkerized, Epoxy, and deep rich blueing.
The Browning is a great gun I remember reading an issue of American Handgunner many years ago that beat on the Browning because it wasn't a 45 so it wasn't a "High Power". Stupid article. It sone classic gun a lot of fun to shoot too, and they can bettered up to perfection. Damn I may have to out a get one!
Great pics in here guys.
Ed
"The HP was also like one of the defacto Green Beanie guns of the Vietnam War. IIRC most were personal purchase. I think I read that one book Gone Native snd dude said he bought his stateside during leave and smuggled it in with like five mags and sold it off before going back or something."
FWIW I picked up an "experienced" tangent sighted Inglis from, I think, Maryland Gun Works about 1992 or so. The story that went with the gun was that it had belonged to an SF type who carried it in El Salvador. Maybe so, maybe not. I also knew Al Mar (SF) and he had another Inglis. We ran a couple of boxes of the then new +P+ 115 gr. JHPs through it with no ill effects. It seemed to rather like them.
Did somebody say Hi Power?
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a198/Jagdraben/photo-32_zpsc487e1bd.jpg
I worked with another guy on TOS to get Simonich to do gunner grips for the hi power about a decade ago, then never bought them. If I ever get another MKIII .40, first thing Ill do is swap in the 9mm conversion bar sto barrel, and get those grips.
LibertyNeverDies
02-27-16, 12:42
While the epoxy finish is pretty blah, FN's bluing is fantastic.
I've never seen the blueing in person. The epoxy is the only gun I've seen in shops on the new guns.
LibertyNeverDies
02-27-16, 12:51
Ighhh...
NO WAY
The GP35 is a classic.
If you want to spray it, mount curb feelers, or dangle an air freshener off the lanyard loop, just buy one and go at it.
There should be 3 finishes- Parkerized, Epoxy, and deep rich blueing.
I think no one can disagree that it's a classic, but more options are always better. I appreciate the Parkerized and Blued models but most 1911s selling today aren't 70 series government models. They are buy stainless models with nice looking grips.
If Browning or FN offered a satin finish and G10 grip it would expand the market leading to more hi power shooters which would be a good thing for everyone!
I've owned about a dozen Hi-Powers over the last 45 years and love them. That said, until Browning redesigned the feed ramp and tweaked the barrel to slide lock-up, the Hi-Power was unreliable except with hard ball and was much less accurate than current models. Today their trigger pull is fair but years ago they were terrible. Custom gun work along with a BarSto barrel resolved any issues then as it will today. My opinion is that a Mk111 in the back pocket is an excellent woods companion and will serve well in other defense roles.
The Hi-Powers like other classics have soul. For sentimental reasons I carry mine during short trips afield but would leave it at home if I feared for my life.
For that I would use one of the ugly Glocks or CZs which I now trust. Is there something wrong with the Hi-Power that would make me leave it home? No. But, I know that a couple other pistols in my sock drawer might do better.
MountainRaven
02-27-16, 14:38
I've never seen the blueing in person. The epoxy is the only gun I've seen in shops on the new guns.
The Browning Hi Power in my post, as quoted by N.Franklin, is blued.
I think no one can disagree that it's a classic, but more options are always better. I appreciate the Parkerized and Blued models but most 1911s selling today aren't 70 series government models. They are buy stainless models with nice looking grips.
If Browning or FN offered a satin finish and G10 grip it would expand the market leading to more hi power shooters which would be a good thing for everyone!
I'm not sure what you're talking about - I'm not seeing many stainless guns. Most of them are basic blued or "blued" and shipping with plastic, rubber/rubberized, or laminate/cocobolo grips. Yes, there are models that are cerakoted, KimProII'd, with G10s... but they're not that common and they tend to be the higher end, slower selling guns.
In any event, G10 grips are about $70 and 60 seconds to fix if you don't like plastic or cocobolo. And I can't think of a 1911 that I've owned that I haven't swapped the grips out on, regardless of what came on them from the factory, whether the gun came from Kimber or Colt, Wilson or Nighthawk. Hell, the only guns that I can think of that I was perfectly happy with the stock grips on were an LCR (with Crimson Trace), a S&W 310 Night Guard (with Pachmayr Compaqs), and a S&W 686 SSR (with black laminated Miculek-style grips).
I've owned about a dozen Hi-Powers over the last 45 years and love them. That said, until Browning redesigned the feed ramp and tweaked the barrel to slide lock-up, the Hi-Power was unreliable except with hard ball and was much less accurate than current models. Today their trigger pull is fair but years ago they were terrible. Custom gun work along with a BarSto barrel resolved any issues then as it will today. My opinion is that a Mk111 in the back pocket is an excellent woods companion and will serve well in other defense roles.
The Hi-Powers like other classics have soul. For sentimental reasons I carry mine during short trips afield but would leave it at home if I feared for my life.
For that I would use one of the ugly Glocks or CZs which I now trust. Is there something wrong with the Hi-Power that would make me leave it home? No. But, I know that a couple other pistols in my sock drawer might do better.
The only thing I don't like about the Hi Power is the practically non-existant reset.
And the lack of checkering. Plus the fact that Browning puts the serial number on the front strap makes it tricky to have it added. But that's why I went with the Gunner grips for my BHP - if the only place where I was going to get a grippy surface was going to be the grip panels, I figured I'd do with the grippiest grip panels I could get.
I am still tempted from time to time with the prospect of picking up a Glock-cheap surplus BHP - most of them seem to be MkIIIs nowadays - and gradually working it up over time, but I just haven't pulled the trigger on it.
Grip tape works fine and is a cinch to apply on the broad HP grip. Would not mind gunners
On the Israeli surplus guns, it is for sure they were carried a lot and shot very little by most of the blue police in Israel. Back in the day we carried Hi Powers in the police in Israel the blue police which is like the regular police had no special units so they didn't shoot a lot. I have a friend who was the head of criminal intelligence unit in Jerusalem and he was lucky if he shot 100 rounds a year.
Where in MAGAV the gendarme of Israel has units that used to wear Hi Powers out, so much Uzi ammo was shot through them.
I love my Hi Powers and think they are great pistols and wouldn't think twice about carrying it in harms way again. But I wish someone would try and make one with a poly frame just for ease of carry. Which is why next trip back to the USA I am going to get a CZ P09 and try it out to see if it can give me the best of the Hi Power combined with the best of the Glock.
I love my Hi Powers and think they are great pistols and wouldn't think twice about carrying it in harms way again. But I wish someone would try and make one with a poly frame just for ease of carry. Which is why next trip back to the USA I am going to get a CZ P09 and try it out to see if it can give me the best of the Hi Power combined with the best of the Glock.
Poly Framed Hi Power: http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/Polymer%20Frame.htm
I would think the P07 would provide a closer to Hi Power size than the huge P09. Also, as with most compact models, the P07 has a slightly better trigger (most I've handled). If you want a polymer descendant it MIGHT be good to look at the FNX-9. It is VERY light, slim, and can be carried C/L and has a decent SA trigger.
Of course, there is the SP 2022, which has an excellent trigger - but no C/L carry.
m4brian thanks for the link, but that so called poly Hi Power is ugly. I had a visit to a gun shop the last time I was in the USA. They had a P09 which felt great in my hand and had a fantastic single action trigger pull. They also had a FNX-9 which didn't have such a great trigger pull.
I like the Glock 17 better than the 19, so I tend to favor larger pistols.
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/qadafi-hp1.jpg
Supposedly belonged to Gadaffi.
LibertyNeverDies
03-02-16, 14:10
The Browning Hi Power in my post, as quoted by N.Franklin, is blued.
I'm not sure what you're talking about - I'm not seeing many stainless guns. Most of them are basic blued or "blued" and shipping with plastic, rubber/rubberized, or laminate/cocobolo grips. Yes, there are models that are cerakoted, KimProII'd, with G10s... but they're not that common and they tend to be the higher end, slower selling guns.
In any event, G10 grips are about $70 and 60 seconds to fix if you don't like plastic or cocobolo. And I can't think of a 1911 that I've owned that I haven't swapped the grips out on, regardless of what came on them from the factory, whether the gun came from Kimber or Colt, Wilson or Nighthawk. Hell, the only guns that I can think of that I was perfectly happy with the stock grips on were an LCR (with Crimson Trace), a S&W 310 Night Guard (with Pachmayr Compaqs), and a S&W 686 SSR (with black laminated Miculek-style grips).
My local shops have the stainless and cerakoted 1911s. I personally agree with you that it's no big deal to spend $100 and change out the grips. Most consumers don't have that kind of imagination. If they are spending more than $600 OTD they want the gun to be done from the start. If the hi power was a sub $500-$600 gun then grips wouldn't matter. Most of these people buy a gun and shoot a box 2 times a year, but they buy guns.
The reason kimber is still in business is that they offer a lot of aesthetic features on their guns. Browning should follow their cue.
teutonicpolymer
03-02-16, 15:01
What I would say if Browning asked me to make a Mk4 Hi Power would be this:
-Increase the thickness of the frame
-Going along with increased frame thickness, checker the front strap and give vertical serrations to the backstrap
-Increase the size of the magazine well... a lot
-Use a dual recoil spring system
-Use a larger, paddle style safety that can be used as a thumb rest when down
-Use Novak sight cuts, have a model with a Bomar cut rear, and a model milled for an RDS
-Offer the Hi-Power in stainless steel
-Use only wide triggers
-Use only lightweight speed hammers
-Give it a real beavertail and make it as high as it can go
-Offer a railed model
-Get rid of the magazine safety
-Improve the trigger pull
-Make some kind of provision in the frame so an external mag well can be added
KalashniKEV
03-02-16, 15:39
What I would say if Browning asked me to make a Mk4 Hi Power would be this:
...
What I would say if Browning asked me to make a Mk4 Hi Power would be this:
-Make it a DA/SA with a nice trigger pull.
-Improve the ergos while increasing capacity.
-Give it a rail to mount a tac light.
-Make night sights standard.
-Put the lanyard loop in a normal place.
DONE
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r220/Kalashnikev/Pistols/20150724_185644_zps8d6xyae6.jpg (http://s145.photobucket.com/user/Kalashnikev/media/Pistols/20150724_185644_zps8d6xyae6.jpg.html)
I would have added poly frame to that list.
teutonicpolymer
03-02-16, 21:15
What I would say if Browning asked me to make a Mk4 Hi Power would be this:
-Make it a DA/SA with a nice trigger pull.
-Improve the ergos while increasing capacity.
-Give it a rail to mount a tac light.
-Make night sights standard.
-Put the lanyard loop in a normal place.
DONE
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r220/Kalashnikev/Pistols/20150724_185644_zps8d6xyae6.jpg (http://s145.photobucket.com/user/Kalashnikev/media/Pistols/20150724_185644_zps8d6xyae6.jpg.html)
Night sights aren't standard
CZ's break trigger return springs and slide stops
I don't want a DA/SA, especially one that has a safety and not a decocker
Does anyone even use lanyard holes anyways
Does anyone even use lanyard holes anyways
I do. I spend a lot of time on the water during hunting season and guns don't float. Lots of military and LE guys use them, too.
Okie John
teutonicpolymer
03-02-16, 23:26
I do. I spend a lot of time on the water during hunting season and guns don't float. Lots of military and LE guys use them, too.
Okie John
With bungee or the like attached to you I'm assuming? Not like a lanyard like you'd use with a blade, right?
MountainRaven
03-02-16, 23:30
1- I would never make a DA/SA BHP.
2- I would never make a polymer frame BHP.
3- Ergos are fine (OK, the safety sucks a little bit, but the C&S version fixes that).
4- Night sights are not necessary.
I would give it a rail (as an option), make it available in an aluminum frame, delete the magazine disconnect safety, add texture to the front and back of the grip frame, improve the trigger reset, change the sight dovetails to standard Novak/1911. I would offer it in four models:
"Thunderbolt" with steel frame, matte black Cerakote, rail, and tritium front sight (FO and gold bead as options);
"Warhawk" with steel frame, semi-gloss black Cerakote, no rail, gold bead front sight (tritium and FO as options);
"Lightning" with an aluminum frame, tungsten grey Cerakote, rail, and tritium front sight (FO or gold bead front sights optional); and
"Mustang" with aluminum frame, two-tone tungsten grey Cerakote frame with matte black slide, no rail, and fiber optic front (optional gold bead or tritium).
The reason I would like to see a poly framed Hi Power is for ease of carry. I LOVE Hi Powers it was my duty pistol for most of my life. Now I am old and carry a RMR equipped Glock since it allows me to shoot at longer distance with accuracy with my 50 year old eyes.
But every few month I miss my Hi Power and carry one of my custom Hi Powers for a while and then after a period of time I go back to the Glock and really notice how light the Glock is.
If someone were to make a poly framed Hi Power I would probably make it my carry gun.
The last time I was in the USA I got my hands on a CZ P09, and it felt great in the hand, and it's single action was better than my Novak or C&S custom Hi Powers that I spent a lot of money on. So next time back a CZ P09 will become mine and I will see if it becomes my carry gun. But even if it does my heart will always LOVE the Hi Power, just as it does that cute girl from High School that used to make me happy.
So next time back a CZ P09 will become mine
What hoops do you have to jump through to make that happen?
What hoops do you have to jump through to make that happen?
No different than you I was born in the USA. I just happen to work outside the USA. But I am more than willing to move back to the USA full time if someone can pay me the same I make living in the 3rd world. But please G-D in the next 6 months I will split my time 50-50 between VA and 3rd world.
No different than you I was born in the USA. I just happen to work outside the USA. But I am more than willing to move back to the USA full time if someone can pay me the same I make living in the 3rd world. But please G-D in the next 6 months I will split my time 50-50 between VA and 3rd world.
Cool. I figured you at least had dual citizenship but didn't know how it worked.
Served in uniform in both of my countries, shed more of my blood in the sheriff deputies uniform than I did in Israel. I am a lucky and a cursed guy grew up in the USA while it was still the USA, served and lived in Israel of old. Now I am watching both countries spin out of control.
KalashniKEV
03-03-16, 13:59
Night sights aren't standard
4- Night sights are not necessary.
They are 100% necessary, and since I wouldn't buy anything else, and basically nobody even stocks the non-NS SP-01s... they are de-facto "standard."
CZ's break trigger return springs and slide stops
No, they very seldom do. When the do, it's just normal maintenance like swapping out the locking block on an M9 or whatever.
I've heard rumors that some bad geometry makes a certain few years '75s stop-breakers (nobody can agree what this is) and I've heard that it only effects race guns that have been ****ered with.
Either way I've never seen a broken slide stop myself, and that includes the old timey styled slide stops on my Pre-B's- which are high round count milsurp guns.
Does anyone even use lanyard holes anyways
I do, in kit.
Even with a retention holster you never want to look down and be like "what the???"
This goes double on helicopters and boats...
I also am not sold on night sights. If you don't use a light to identify your target you are asking for problems and if it is close enough you don't need a light we found that in training many times people would shoot very good at night without seeing their sights and just indexing on the target.
KalashniKEV
03-03-16, 16:34
I also am not sold on night sights. If you don't use a light to identify your target you are asking for problems and if it is close enough you don't need a light we found that in training many times people would shoot very good at night without seeing their sights and just indexing on the target.
It all depends on your requirements and how you use white light.
White light tends to attract bullets. When you need to apply white light, the correct thing to do is to flash and move.
Yes, in a home defense scenario it is possible to do long presses or go full retard and flip the switch... and you'll probably make it out alive. It's also possible to pump a shotgun and say, "I have a GUN!" and you'll probably make it out alive. Another possibility is that the accomplice/ getaway driver/ #2 man sees you with a gun/light and just shoots you through the window or from another part of the building.
Tactical white light is a MUST on any working gun.
So are sights that work during hours of limited visibility...
I did a lot to try and figure out the whole night sight thing. I found that in urban settings their was enough ambient light to see regular black sights.
Inside buildings where there was a lot less light and you couldn't see the black sights you would still get good hits with muscle memory. Also we are taking across the room distance.
Turn a white light on and leaving it on is as dumb as a sniper in a war situation not shooting and moving. It is a good way to get a mortar dropped on your head. Urban anti terror operations with a sniper in over watch is different .
Night sights are a luxury not a deal breaker for me.
Night sights are a luxury not a deal breaker for me.
What kinds of sights do you prefer? Genuinely curious.
Okie John
When my eyes were better Heinie fixed sights on my Glocks. I have a Novak Special Ops Hi Power and it has Novak rear and fiber optic front, which is not so bad.
I have played with XS big dots as my eyes started getting worse.
Now I have a Glock with RMR, curse of chasing my youth.
I think if us older guys remember the rule of 3 on gun fights in the USA, we might not worry so much on sights. I have a hard time with the black Heinies shooting great goups at 25 meters like I could do 15 years ago. But you put a target at 7 meters and less with muscle memory all the shots go in where they need to go, even if I am not really using the sights .
When my eyes were better Heinie fixed sights on my Glocks. I have a Novak Special Ops Hi Power and it has Novak rear and fiber optic front, which is not so bad.
I have played with XS big dots as my eyes started getting worse.
Now I have a Glock with RMR, curse of chasing my youth.
I think if us older guys remember the rule of 3 on gun fights in the USA, we might not worry so much on sights. I have a hard time with the black Heinies shooting great goups at 25 meters like I could do 15 years ago. But you put a target at 7 meters and less with muscle memory all the shots go in where they need to go, even if I am not really using the sights .
Fair enough.
Thank you.
Okie John
crazymoose
03-03-16, 19:07
Night sights aren't standard
CZ's break trigger return springs and slide stops
I don't want a DA/SA, especially one that has a safety and not a decocker
Does anyone even use lanyard holes anyways
Get a non-fp block model, or a Jericho, now that the thumb-safety variants are being imported again. SA triggers in non-FP block CZ type guns beat any SA I've felt on a Hi Power.
KalashniKEV
03-03-16, 19:20
...you would still get good hits with muscle memory. Also we are taking across the room distance.
I think we might have a different definition of "good hits."
A good pair of night sights (front AND rear luminescent) greatly increases your chances of making solid, A-zone hits every-single-time, quickly, even when there is a little bit of light to work with.
It's been proven out many, many times over in training, and this holds true from beginner to expert level of skill.
3 to 4 inch group over the heart is good enough, at 7 yards or less is good enough.
MountainRaven
03-03-16, 21:32
They are 100% necessary, and since I wouldn't buy anything else, and basically nobody even stocks the non-NS SP-01s... they are de-facto "standard."
I need to do some night shooting/training, but...
Mike Pannone rocks fiber optic front sights, and ran them hard enough while CONUS that he trusted them enough to run FO fronts while deployed in fun hot, dry places.
BBC's Mike "the Mook" Searson recently wrote a piece as an "AAR" from an LMC low-light course and one of his take-aways was this:
Night sights are almost completely useless except right at dawn and dusk. You can see the sights in total darkness and the Heine Straight 8’s on our H&K USP Compact Tactical were mostly used to properly guide the pistol into the holster. You cannot see your target without a flashlight and the light renders the sights useless. Fiber optic sights on the other hand gather that light and give a better than average sight picture. I will never add Tritium sights to another firearm, nor pay more money for that option in the future (and we’re curious about your thoughts on the matter, so weigh in below in the comments).
Link to the article: here (http://www.breachbangclear.com/lms-defense-low-light-takeaways/).
Of course, your experience is your experience. If it works for you, it works for you. But that's why tritium is an option on my four ideal BHP models.
I need to do some night shooting/training, but...
Mike Pannone rocks fiber optic front sights, and ran them hard enough while CONUS that he trusted them enough to run FO fronts while deployed...
I had something of an epiphany at the night shoot portion of one of Ken Hackathorn's classes a few months ago.
During the first engagement I learned the tritium front sight on the Glock 17 I was using was completely dead (I assume I'd whacked it and cracked the vial somehow). I did change over to my backup gun (my carry Glock 26) when I got the chance, but it wasn't necessary--nor did it make an appreciable difference. My light permitted me to grab a "good enough" sight picture, and the muzzle flash provided confirmation that the bullet was going where it needed to.
I'll keep my night sights on the guns that have them, but all my new guns (including the SP-01 which should be on its way to me from Cajun Gun Works in a few weeks) will have fiber optic front sights.
Others' mileage may vary.
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