Is anyone working on QD mounts for keymod?

[HansTheHobbit]

There were rumors back in 2013 that someone was working on quick detach mounts and rail sections for keymod rails, similar to the Kinetic mounts for mlok. Alas, I haven't heard anything since.

Seems to me that a mount could be made that would replace the keymod nuts with spring loaded cams. I see several advantages. First and foremost, it would be quick detach. It also seems like it would be more secure since it would have constant pressure on a mechanical lock, as opposed to relying on the clamping force of the traditional screws. And maybe best of all, there wouldn't be any screws to back out, so no loctite needed.

I don't know if it's possible or practical to engineer such a thing, but it would be pretty sweet if someone would go ahead and develop it.

[Eurodriver]

The only thing I've seen remotely close to QD for Keymod is the BCM twist mount vertical grip.

And that came out like two years ago.

[Brahmzy]

I do not think QD and KeyMod would play nice together. KeyMod requires are pretty tight lockup with the nuts in order to achieve its strength design. QD couldn't be tight when you think about the shape and be beveled nature of the KeyMod holes.
MLOK has a thicker design with right angles. Not saying one is better than the other, except in this case. Personally I think picatinny wins in this area.

[PrivateCitizen]

I do not think QD and KeyMod would play nice together. KeyMod requires are pretty tight lockup with the nuts in order to achieve its strength design. QD couldn't be tight when you think about the shape and be beveled nature of the KeyMod holes.
MLOK has a thicker design with right angles. Not saying one is better than the other, except in this case. Personally I think picatinny wins in this area.

I'd tend to agree. The amount of pull on a fastener like KeyMod or MLOK seems like a bad idea for something like a sling and that much potential leverage.

[tonyxcom]

If you need QD between the rail and accessory interface, I don't think Keymod or MLOK are the right choice for you.

I have one of the SHORT KDG QD rails and it is very fussy to get right. On the back the rail, there are 2 small pins that are engaged by the flat part of your rail. If those aren't engaged at the EXACT same time, only one pawl grabs the rail and the other won't engage. This happens on both my SCAR KDG rail and a current production Geissele MK4 rail. It would probably be quicker to screw a non QD one on. Maybe the longer rail section is easier to deal with because that goes on and off in video very easy.

[GH41]

Properly designed and manufactured KM rails and accessories don't require any tighter fastening than anything else. More internet BS! The KM screws don't need to be any tighter than what keeps them from loosening.

[Brahmzy]

Properly designed and manufactured KM rails and accessories don't require any tighter fastening than anything else. More internet BS! The KM screws don't need to be any tighter than what keeps them from loosening.
Ok Einstein. Why then, are there virtually zero QD accessories for KeyMod? The only one that I know of is the mentioned BCM VG and it basically pressure-clamps itself up against the rail with tremendous force. I have one and it works, but that's a specific design with the luxury of a large space to work out the mechanism. All other accessories are a bolted design, NOT QD.

[KingsideRook]

Ok Einstein. Why then, are there virtually zero QD accessories for KeyMod? The only one that I know of is the mentioned BCM VG and it basically pressure-clamps itself up against the rail with tremendous force. I have one and it works, but that's a specific design with the luxury of a large space to work out the mechanism. All other accessories are a bolted design, NOT QD.

Just another one of KeyMod's inherent advantages - so good on it's own, that it doesn't even NEED quick detach capability. :p

(that said, my experience with QD on M-LOK with the KDG rail sections mirrors tonyxcom's - not that quick or forgiving.)

[GH41]

Ok Einstein. Why then, are there virtually zero QD accessories for KeyMod? The only one that I know of is the mentioned BCM VG and it basically pressure-clamps itself up against the rail with tremendous force. I have one and it works, but that's a specific design with the luxury of a large space to work out the mechanism. All other accessories are a bolted design, NOT QD.

Why do you need QD for KM? If you cannot afford one of everything for every rifle you own you need to get a second job. QD means Quick Disconnect not put everything you own on everything you've got.

[Brahmzy]

Why do you need QD for KM? If you cannot afford one of everything for every rifle you own you need to get a second job. QD means Quick Disconnect not put everything you own on everything you've got.

Easy there dude - I didn't start this thread. I'm not the one asking for KeyMod QD bits. Read the thread.

[HansTheHobbit]

Interesting points. As for the need for QD mounts for keymod, I can think of several reasons offhand. Night vision devices would be a big one. As everyone knows, they're heavy, so it's nice to be able to remove them during the day. This would be a big deal for military users. Even regular weapon lights would be nice to be able to remove when not in use, in certain circumstances. Let's say you've got a soldier or contractor working a checkpoint. He might want a very large weapon light for that purpose, but he's not going to want to tote it around all day or clear a building with it.

Another advantage of a QD system is that no tools are required, and that's possibly the biggest bonus. Just for argument's sake, let's say you were deployed or on patrol or even just at the range, and something came loose. If you don't have the appropriate tool, then you're screwed. You wouldn't even be able to remove it; you'd just have to let it flop around until it was either loose enough to remove or until you find a tool.

I also think that a QD system could be made to be stronger and more secure than the current connection. By using a spring powered cam system, the interfaces would be constantly loaded. This means that bumps and vibrations, like from recoil, would actually tighten the clamping action, as opposed to potentially compromising it by causing the screws to back out. If you've dealt with machine screws long enough, then you know those little bastards like to houdini themselves loose at the worst possible moments. In general, the fewer machine screws on a rifle the more comfortable I am with it. The cam action would also work in two directions simultaneously, pushing the feet into their slots while also clamping them. This would provide a mechanical lock to prevent lateral movement, as opposed to relying solely on the clamping force of the nuts.

[GH41]

Springs, cams and other crap are just more things to go south at the wrong time. Does anyone even make direct attach KM mounts for your NV example. If you need QD capability run the accessory on a rail section.

[HansTheHobbit]

Springs, cams and other crap are just more things to go south at the wrong time. Does anyone even make direct attach KM mounts for your NV example. If you need QD capability run the accessory on a rail section.

The mechanism would actually be extremely simple and not inherently prone to failure. Not only that, but impacts and vibrations would actually tighten it, and it would automatically apply the perfect amount of clamping force at all times, regardless of any external factors. As for rail sections, the whole point of keymod is to get rid of mounts on mounts and instead have the accessory attach directly to the rail. If you're going to be mounting QD stuff to rail segments, then you might as well go with a quad rail.

[GH41]

The mechanism would actually be extremely simple and not inherently prone to failure. Not only that, but impacts and vibrations would actually tighten it, and it would automatically apply the perfect amount of clamping force at all times, regardless of any external factors. As for rail sections, the whole point of keymod is to get rid of mounts on mounts and instead have the accessory attach directly to the rail. If you're going to be mounting QD stuff to rail segments, then you might as well go with a quad rail.

Not prone to failure if everything is clean. The purpose of KM is to have a place to mount something without the weight and bulk of a quad rail. The QD ML mounts will only gain traction with people that have more money than sense.

[KingsideRook]

Not prone to failure if everything is clean. The purpose of KM is to have a place to mount something without the weight and bulk of a quad rail. The QD ML mounts will only gain traction with people that have more money than sense.

Welp, pack it in everyone. Innovation is over, and this guy's got all possible use cases refuted, apparently. No one bother inventing anything new, we don't need it. QD is for hobbyists and dirt-shooters. Real men loctite everything to their rails, and if it breaks or gets in the way, they just deal.

Seriously, we get it. You don't need it. Thanks for letting us know we don't need it either, but you might have to allow us to make up our own minds on that.

[HansTheHobbit]

Not prone to failure if everything is clean. The purpose of KM is to have a place to mount something without the weight and bulk of a quad rail. The QD ML mounts will only gain traction with people that have more money than sense.

A QD mount for keymod wouldn't be anymore prone to getting dirty than any other QD mount on the market. Even if it did, it's nothing a little water can't take care of. When it's actually on the rifle, there wouldn't be any points of ingress. And most importantly, there's no grit that could possibly shut down a QD mount that wouldn't freak up your action ten times over, making it a moot point. And let's just say you're in the sandstorm of the century and grit does jam it up somehow. Even in this worst case scenario, the only consequence is you can't get it off, which leaves you basically in the same position you would be in with normal keymod.

I'm the kind of guy who basically installs something and leaves it, so the QD feature doesn't make much difference to me. But, what I like most about certain QD mounts is the way that they always apply the perfect amount of pressure to the rail, and react dynamically to shock and vibration. I think using springs and cams is just a much better way to secure things to any rail system, as opposed to machine screws.

[tonyxcom]

So I took my Scar 16 with KDG rail and their small MLOK Qd pic rail for my Atlas bipod out to the desert.

When the bipod is loaded and I fire a double tap the mount pops right out of the slot. I tried it several times and every time the muzzle side claw would retract to the locked position and my muzzle would hit dirt. Flipped the QD and same result.

[HansTheHobbit]

So I took my Scar 16 with KDG rail and their small MLOK Qd pic rail for my Atlas bipod out to the desert.

When the bipod is loaded and I fire a double tap the mount pops right out of the slot. I tried it several times and every time the muzzle side claw would retract to the locked position and my muzzle would hit dirt. Flipped the QD and same result.

That doesn't surprise me too much. I looked at those KDG mounts and wasn't impressed with the interface. I'm not sure what the design principle is on those, but a properly designed cam system would actually get tighter with recoil.

Just out of curiosity, is it possible to install that mount in either direction? If so, that might be the inherent design flaw.

[tonyxcom]

The mount can go either direction and there isn't any indication it's designed to go a specific way.

[HansTheHobbit]

The mount can go either direction and there isn't any indication it's designed to go a specific way.

I can think of two ways they might be designed internally. If they're designed the way I think, then it won't matter. However, if it's designed with two cams facing the same direction, then turning it 180 degrees should fix your problem. If you try it, I would be extremely interested to know if it works or not.

[rapomstage3]

I never understood quick detach for anything other than optics/night vision and suppressors. Your night vision generally is still on top mounted to rail not key mod, so it doesn't seem necessary to me. Actually I pretty much don't utilize quick detach even for my optics anymore. It's there but I never take them off.

[titsonritz]

I never understood quick detach for anything other than optics/night vision and suppressors. Your night vision generally is still on top mounted to rail not key mod, so it doesn't seem necessary to me. Actually I pretty don't utilize quick detach even for my optics anymore. It's there but I never take them off.

Same here

[HansTheHobbit]

I never understood quick detach for anything other than optics/night vision and suppressors. Your night vision generally is still on top mounted to rail not key mod, so it doesn't seem necessary to me. Actually I pretty much don't utilize quick detach even for my optics anymore. It's there but I never take them off.

I'm in the same boat for the most part. I install something and that's pretty much where it stays. But I've fallen in love with Bobro mounts because I always know that they're perfectly tensioned at all times, no loctite is involved, and there aren't any machine screws to back out. And it is really convenient to move it around when needed.

[The FNG]

I still think if LaRue and BCM got together and made keymod accessory babies it would be glorious.


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[HansTheHobbit]

I still think if LaRue and BCM got together and made keymod accessory babies it would be glorious.


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Haha, yep.