View Full Version : Plate carrier that also fits leo soft armor???
Any suggestions on a carrier that fits both hard plates, and leo soft armor?
Soft armor like BALCS cut, or some proprietary cut? Now we're getting into armor carrier territory. If BALCS, you have a ton more options, from SKD/Paraclete's LVBC all the way to the First Spear Siege.
You can find surplused SDS/BAE RBAVs on Ebay for cheap, too.
Plate carrier or a vest? If a vest looks at BCS Tactical.
http://www.beezcombatsystems.com
Plate carrier or a vest? If a vest looks at BCS Tactical.
http://www.beezcombatsystems.com
Doc, have you had any experience with BCS? I was looking at some of their stuff, but after reading a thread on ARFCOM in regards to their product and customer service, I was less than impressed.
If you google "Got a package in the mail from Beez Combat Systems", you can see the thread in question. Of course, this is only a sample size of one, but their response was less than satisfactory...
Balcs cut, standard leo soft armor. I'm a K9 handler so we wear an outer vest, the one the dept. issues is junk, so I'm looking to buy my own even though the dept. gave back
$700,000 from the budget last year.
I'm looking at carrying a level 4 inconjuction plate in the front. For that, the lightest I could find was the parcelete speed plus. Any suggestions on the plate would be appreciated as well.
I wanted to know the same thing. In my brief research, I did not find too many options. I'm non uniformed so I think I'm going to just wear soft armor under street clothes for day to day and hard plates only in something like a PIG carrier for planned enforcement operations.
I was very impressed with the quality and service from Beez Combat systems. I ordered a IOTV vest from them and requested some custom modifications (Velcro cumberbun instead of side buckles), I expected to get $ quote back but got an "no problem". Price was on point too.
ETA http://www.beezcombatsystems.com/BCS-IOTV-LBAV-BCS-IOTV-LBAV.htm.
The Mayflower Low-Profile Armor Carrier (LPAC) is a scalable system that can be worn under a suit or police uniform with soft armor, and upgraded with plates, chest riggs, etc. when concealment is not needed.
http://www.mayflower-rc.org/store/7016/22/Low-Profile-Armor-Carrier.html
It is what I use.
I wanted to know the same thing. In my brief research, I did not find too many options. I'm non uniformed so I think I'm going to just wear soft armor under street clothes for day to day and hard plates only in something like a PIG carrier for planned enforcement operations.
Have you tried this combo minus plates in AZ heat? I cant imagine anything Id rather wear less than concealable soft armor and a hyper insulated PIG on top. The PIG is VERY hot without soft armor or plates in anything over 74 degree weather.
I wish they made something that simply covered the gaps in plate carriers with soft armor to lighten it up and decrease heat. Since I'm CID I have just dropped the concealable soft armor unless working overtime traffic patrol and run the plate carrier alone and take my chances on planned stuff. Have an external soft carrier for field stuff that is lower risk but it seems redundant outside the increased coverage. See no need for level IV, I run level III+ standalone and take my chances no AP rounds are around. Full soft armor and full level IV plates is going to be heavy and hot IMO.
I'm in the same boat Cop1211. I already wear an outer MOLLE carrier with my BDU's, our issued Point Blank R20D MOLLE. This is considered one the RSUC's (Really $h!tty Universal Carriers) While it will hold most NIJ cut panels (not sure about BALCS), there is a lot of extra material and it's made of 1000D so it's heavy to begin with. It does have pockets for rifle plates, and they are easily accessible to remove the plates without taking off the vest.
I am going back to K-9 and am wanting to trim down my vest. I've searched high and low for the solution, to wear only my soft armor, and I'm not finding a really good one. The Mayflower Low Profile Armor Carrier (LPAC), and the Mayflower Low Profile Assault Armor Carrier (LPAAC) are two very good solutions and both get a lot of love. The LPAC is slick, while the LPAAC has MOLLE coverage. My only downsides to them are the proprietary cut of their armor and needing custom work for patch placement per my dept regs. There is a thread on here about placing stardard(ish) NIJ armor in a Mayflower carrier without much extra material or play, so it's achievable. https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?130179-Mayflower-R-amp-C-Low-Profile-Armor-Carrier-amp-HSP-D3-Chest-Rig-Quick-Review-LOTS-O-PICS
Currently my solution is looking to be custom, possibly with the addition of an existing cummerbund. As mentioned earlier, there are a lot more options with BALCS cut panels, versus NIJ-style panels from Safariland, Point Blank/PACA, Armor Express, etc., so you might double check and verify if you do indeed have NIJ or BALCS cut panels. Armor Express seems to have quite a few options on the NIJ-style vest, to include the OCS, Echo, Traverse, and Hard Core.
You might also consider, if possible depending on the department buying your plate, in going with a lighter polyethylene special threat plate. While not getting rifle protection, it closes the gap based on what threats you encounter and are much lighter.
Also, check out this article by someone in LE who was in a similar position as yourself-- needs for soft and hard armor in the same package.
http://www.itstactical.com/gearcom/load-bearing/slick-to-full-loadout-building-a-scaleable-and-modular-armor-system/
I'm looking at carrying a level 4 inconjuction plate in the front. For that, the lightest I could find was the parcelete speed plus. Any suggestions on the plate would be appreciated as well.
FYI, the Speed Plate Plus is not an ICW Level IV, it's a stand alone 3+ (compliant), which is a much better product anyway.
Just wanted to make sure you knew that.
I'm in the same boat Cop1211. I already wear an outer MOLLE carrier with my BDU's, our issued Point Blank R20D MOLLE. This is considered one the RSUC's (Really $h!tty Universal Carriers) While it will hold most NIJ cut panels (not sure about BALCS), there is a lot of extra material and it's made of 1000D so it's heavy to begin with. It does have pockets for rifle plates, and they are easily accessible to remove the plates without taking off the vest.
I am going back to K-9 and am wanting to trim down my vest. I've searched high and low for the solution, to wear only my soft armor, and I'm not finding a really good one. The Mayflower Low Profile Armor Carrier (LPAC), and the Mayflower Low Profile Assault Armor Carrier (LPAAC) are two very good solutions and both get a lot of love. The LPAC is slick, while the LPAAC has MOLLE coverage. My only downsides to them are the proprietary cut of their armor and needing custom work for patch placement per my dept regs. There is a thread on here about placing stardard(ish) NIJ armor in a Mayflower carrier without much extra material or play, so it's achievable. https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?130179-Mayflower-R-amp-C-Low-Profile-Armor-Carrier-amp-HSP-D3-Chest-Rig-Quick-Review-LOTS-O-PICS
Currently my solution is looking to be custom, possibly with the addition of an existing cummerbund. As mentioned earlier, there are a lot more options with BALCS cut panels, versus NIJ-style panels from Safariland, Point Blank/PACA, Armor Express, etc., so you might double check and verify if you do indeed have NIJ or BALCS cut panels. Armor Express seems to have quite a few options on the NIJ-style vest, to include the OCS, Echo, Traverse, and Hard Core.
You might also consider, if possible depending on the department buying your plate, in going with a lighter polyethylene special threat plate. While not getting rifle protection, it closes the gap based on what threats you encounter and are much lighter.
FYI, all of the patterns you mentioned are different (Point Blank, Armor Express, Second Chance, etc). They all use different shapes for their concealable products, and that's before a user requests alterations.
BALCS is a military/tactical pattern that is universally sized (small medium large), which means it fits universally poorly. A properly fitted and adjusted concealable vest should be FAR more customized in sizing specifications than a BALCS cut pattern. That depends on the guy doing your sizing of course, but I sell a ton of Point Blank vests and I travel with about 30 sizing vests that all have custom lengths and alterations in addition to the base size (think suit coat sizing instead of polo shirt sizing).
If you're looking for a better fit with your existing Point Blank panels, look at the International carrier:
http://www.pointblankenterprises.com/pointblankbodyarmor/?product=point-blank-international
You pull the side straps forward (unlike the R20D closure), it has a front (easy access) rifle plate pocket, and it hugs the ballistics much better than the R20D pattern of carriers does.
They're releasing a new carrier shortly that fits better, but I haven't seen it yet.
The International is one of the better ways to make use of your existing PB panels though, and can be made just by giving a PB dealer the serial numbers on your ballistic panels, it just don't handle overlap all that well. If your current panels overlap more than 1.5"-2" on each side, you'll run into issues with the International, there.
FYI, the Speed Plate Plus is not an ICW Level IV, it's a stand alone 3+ (compliant), which is a much better product anyway.
Just wanted to make sure you knew that.
Appreciate the info.
Right now it looks like the best option would be either the Armor Express torc vest, or Beez. With Beez I can trace out the soft panels send that in and they can custom fit it.
Appreciate the info.
Right now it looks like the best option would be either the Armor Express torc vest, or Beez. With Beez I can trace out the soft panels send that in and they can custom fit it.
The TORC is a 4 piece soft armor tactical vest. It has separate front and side pieces, so there is about a zero percent chance of your current panels fittings. It's basically a plate carrier filled out with soft armor behind it and through the cummerbund.
What make are your current ballistic panels?
Well, looks like it beez, Beez, I'll contact them next payday.
As a plain clothes LEO, I used the first gen Mayflower Low Profile Assault Armor Carrier (LPAAC) for a while when I wanted an external carrier and loved it. It was very comfortable. My previous Point Blank armor fit the size large carrier but had some extra space. It wasn't an operational issue. I recently sold that carrier and picked up a used Mayflower Low Profile Armor Carrier (LPAC) and like it even better. The versatility is awesome and my new Point Blank Alpha Elite soft armor fit this carrier better. It fits very closely. I got one of the BFG 10-speed cummerbunds to use with the LPAC. I like that it gives me a ton of options. In my job, I need a carrier that lets me do everything from protection details in a suit, under uniform wear, outer tactical wear, etc.
My agency issues Point Blank concealable armor as well as the Maverick external carrier. The Maverick is not bad, but the LPAAC was much better. That said, I get tired of constantly changing my armor from one carrier to the next. The LPAC allows me to do pretty much everything. I'd choose to wear it on SWAT missions with a chest rig if they'd let me instead of the issued Point Blank Armis. Our issued PB level 3 polyethylene plates fit in the LPAC fine.
I considered getting one of the Beez tactical carriers a while back but the Mayflower products work so well for me that I decided to stick with them. Another carrier that I saw recently was the Perroz Designs concealable soft body armor carrier. I've never dealt with them, but they may cut the carrier to work with your armor. I'd like to see them add plate pockets and two vertical rows of hypalon on the front for QASM buckles.
http://www.perrozdesigns.com/shop/featured2/concealable-soft-body-armor-carrier/
Doc, have you had any experience with BCS? I was looking at some of their stuff, but after reading a thread on ARFCOM in regards to their product and customer service, I was less than impressed.
If you google "Got a package in the mail from Beez Combat Systems", you can see the thread in question. Of course, this is only a sample size of one, but their response was less than satisfactory...
Top quality stuff at BCS. I have several items and they have seen HARD use and stand up to it. Never had an issue with orders and they have always replied to email fast.
If I read the water was necessary for life on BARFCOM I would stop drinking it. It is amazing that they can get so much wrong. Statically, they should get a few here and there right....... But they don't.
Just Prince
03-10-16, 09:30
Try Mayflower or Velocity Systems. What soft body armor are you planning to use.
Try Mayflower or Velocity Systems. What soft body armor are you planning to use.
Why are you recommending this?
1) you don't know the make or shape of the guys panels, so they may not fit safely (or comfortably) within any carrier that Mayflower makes.
and
2) using ballistics panels in a carrier made by someone other than the manufacturer of the ballistics typically voids the warranty of the soft armor. I'm not saying people don't do it all the time, but most administrators would throw a fit if their officers were out on patrol using a ballistic product outside of scope of it's written warranty.
You need to be very careful when you start mixing and matching soft ballistics and carriers. Almost all are shaped different, most line up on the sides differently, many attach in the shoulders differently, etc.
Without provisions to secure the soft panel at the top of the shoulders properly, the ballistic can sag and sit lower than it needs to in order to protect the upper chest properly. This combined with a sloppy fit (IE: using a carrier not designed for that style or size of panel) can lead to legitimate safety concerns.
Just because a company makes a bomber carrier doesn't mean it's best to use with every type of soft armor out there.
BALCS cut panels and hard armor plates are one of the few exceptions with this, since those are made to a standard size/shape and will sit properly in virtually everyone's carriers.
Just Prince
03-10-16, 19:12
Why are you recommending this?
1) you don't know the make or shape of the guys panels, so they may not fit safely (or comfortably) within any carrier that Mayflower makes.
and
2) using ballistics panels in a carrier made by someone other than the manufacturer of the ballistics typically voids the warranty of the soft armor. I'm not saying people don't do it all the time, but most administrators would throw a fit if their officers were out on patrol using a ballistic product outside of scope of it's written warranty.
You need to be very careful when you start mixing and matching soft ballistics and carriers. Almost all are shaped different, most line up on the sides differently, many attach in the shoulders differently, etc.
Without provisions to secure the soft panel at the top of the shoulders properly, the ballistic can sag and sit lower than it needs to in order to protect the upper chest properly. This combined with a sloppy fit (IE: using a carrier not designed for that style or size of panel) can lead to legitimate safety concerns.
Just because a company makes a bomber carrier doesn't mean it's best to use with every type of soft armor out there.
BALCS cut panels and hard armor plates are one of the few exceptions with this, since those are made to a standard size/shape and will sit properly in virtually everyone's carriers.
I recommended Mayflower and Velocity because I live in Maryland and i know of several officers in my department who have had carriers custom made by those companies when buying plates to accomplish what he is trying to do. The also used the depatment issued soft panels. Also those to companies are local for me.
Yes it is very diifficult to impossible to match soft panels to an aftermarket carrier hence my second question. Once I read his response I planned to recommend a carrier made by the those armor manufacturer that fits his needs so he would retain the warranty on the armor. I know from working on the armor package for the 1200 officer department I work for that some of not most major body armor manufacturers will not warranty a vest worn in another companies carrier even if the soft armor is placed in a inner carrier and then placed in the outer carrier. The reason given is they can not guarantee that the armor with cover the proper areas. That answer was given to me by a Safariland (ABA, Protech, and Second Chance) rep and a Point Blank Rep.
So I hope this explained it for you. But I also was not done answering his question. I did not have enough information for a complete answer.
The soft armor we have is the Safariland brand. The other K9 handler contacted Armor Express in reference to them doing a custom fit and they said they can do a custom fit.
So we'll have to wait for absolute confirmation and price from Armor Express, as well as Beez.
The problem is that historically the carriers from the armor manufacturers have SUCKED, outside of their strictly concealed covers. They're still way behind the state of the art armor carriers being put out from sewers like Mayflower or First Spear. Point Blanks tactical carriers have gotten better after acquiring Paraclete but still are below par, imo.
OP, some of our officers have been trying carriers from Bushido Tactical and have been happy with them. They offer other models unavailable on their website.
Just Prince
03-11-16, 05:53
The soft armor we have is the Safariland brand. The other K9 handler contacted Armor Express in reference to them doing a custom fit and they said they can do a custom fit.
So we'll have to wait for absolute confirmation and price from Armor Express, as well as Beez.
Before you void the warranty on your vest by not using a Safariland brand carrier check out the carrier Second Chance (A Safariland Company) made for the Oregon City Police department. It will do what you want and allow you to retain the warranty. My entire department just switched to this carrier. They also created a SKU for this carrier if you have ABA soft panels. Safarilands sewing shop is in Florida too. Let me know if you have any questions.
http://www.leedway.com/Safariland-Oregon-City-Armor-Carrier-p/ocac.htm
Why are you recommending this?
1) you don't know the make or shape of the guys panels, so they may not fit safely (or comfortably) within any carrier that Mayflower makes.
and
2) using ballistics panels in a carrier made by someone other than the manufacturer of the ballistics typically voids the warranty of the soft armor. I'm not saying people don't do it all the time, but most administrators would throw a fit if their officers were out on patrol using a ballistic product outside of scope of it's written warranty.
You need to be very careful when you start mixing and matching soft ballistics and carriers. Almost all are shaped different, most line up on the sides differently, many attach in the shoulders differently, etc.
Without provisions to secure the soft panel at the top of the shoulders properly, the ballistic can sag and sit lower than it needs to in order to protect the upper chest properly. This combined with a sloppy fit (IE: using a carrier not designed for that style or size of panel) can lead to legitimate safety concerns.
Just because a company makes a bomber carrier doesn't mean it's best to use with every type of soft armor out there.
BALCS cut panels and hard armor plates are one of the few exceptions with this, since those are made to a standard size/shape and will sit properly in virtually everyone's carriers.
Velocity Systems makes the soft armor that is specifically designed for the Mayflower LPAC/LPAAC. This carrier/armor combo is a collaboration between Mayflower and Velocity Systems.
The LPAC will accommodate most shooter/swimmer cut or SAPI/ESAPI plates depending on the size of the carrier.
I use the specified Velocity Soft Armor inserts and Velocity Systems P34 plates in my LPAC and love this combo.
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