A Question of Names, Nomenclature and Numbers and Tech Specs

[Ernst]

I've noticed that when referring to an "M4 Carbine" there are some AR folks who kind of go, well, ape-poop, about calling anything that is not actually a COLT M4 Military select-fire M4 an M4. Some even seem to go into a kind of full melt down over it and insist it is actually just an AR15.

So, when is an M4 an M4 and not an M4 but "merely" an AR15?

[ColtSeavers]

I've noticed that when referring to an "M4 Carbine" there are some AR folks who kind of go, well, ape-poop, about calling anything that is not actually a COLT M4 Military select-fire M4 an M4. Some even seem to go into a kind of full melt down over it and insist it is actually just an AR15.

So, when is an M4 an M4 and not an M4 but "merely" an AR15?

Didn't you just answer your own question?

[Molon]

I've noticed that when referring to an "M4 Carbine" there are some AR folks who kind of go, well, ape-poop, about calling anything that is not actually a COLT M4 Military select-fire M4 an M4. Some even seem to go into a kind of full melt down over it and insist it is actually just an AR15.

So, when is an M4 an M4 and not an M4 but "merely" an AR15?




Let me add to your dilemma; the original AR-15 was select-fire (full-auto).


...

[bigwagon]

How would you define an M4?

[Iraqgunz]

It's pretty simple for the most part. If it is select-fire and has a 14.5" barrel and is issued to the military it's an M4 Carbine. Everything else is essentially an M4 clone.

As for "AR folks" who go apoplectic about that kind of nonsense....who cares?

[titsonritz]

As for "AR folks" who go apoplectic about that kind of nonsense....who cares?

Oh, good word.

[lysander]

How would you define an M4?

The M4 is a 5.56-mm, magazine-fed, gas operated, shoulder-fired weapon. It is designed to fire either semiautomatic or a three-round burst through the use of a selector lever (SAFE, SEMI, and BURST). The M4A1 is fully automatic (SAFE, SEMI, and AUTO).

[Koshinn]

I've noticed that when referring to an "M4 Carbine" there are some AR folks who kind of go, well, ape-poop, about calling anything that is not actually a COLT M4 Military select-fire M4 an M4. Some even seem to go into a kind of full melt down over it and insist it is actually just an AR15.

So, when is an M4 an M4 and not an M4 but "merely" an AR15?

AR-15 is the family of weapons and includes every variant. You can roughly define an AR-15 as a lower receiver that will accept a certain specification of upper receivers.

Within the AR-15 FOW is the M4, a US Military issued, 14.5" bbl, collapsible stock variant. The standard M4 is 3 rd burst. Within the M4 circle is the M4A1 with full auto and a heavier barrel, for example. Another weapon within the AR-15 FOW is the Mk18, also a US Military issued variant, but with a 10.5" barrel. The M16 is another, with a 20" barrel. The M4, M16, and Mk18 are all AR-15s, but a M16 is not an M4, an M4 is not a Mk18, and a Mk18 is not an M16. Also within the AR-15 FOW are non-US Military issued weapons, like the S&W M&P 15, KAC SR-15, Larue PredatAR, Bushmaster Carbon 15, AAC Honey Badger, Alexander Arms .50 Beowulf Overmatch Plus, H&K MR556, and countless others. A S&W M&P 15 is not an M4 as a M16 is not an M4.


Strictly speaking, it needs to have actually been an issued military weapon to be an M4, but it's more or less correct to call a non-issued AR-15 an M4 if it follows the specs (14.5" barrel, etc) to include being a registered machine gun.

[Ernst]

How about "a civilian variant of an M4" which is a type of an AR15 rifle?

[bigwagon]

The M4 is a 5.56-mm, magazine-fed, gas operated, shoulder-fired weapon. It is designed to fire either semiautomatic or a three-round burst through the use of a selector lever (SAFE, SEMI, and BURST). The M4A1 is fully automatic (SAFE, SEMI, and AUTO).

I was asking the OP how he would define an M4, but your description does not differentiate the M4 from other AR15 variants that meet the same criteria.

[Koshinn]

How about "a civilian variant of an M4" which is a type of an AR15 rifle?

Already covered above.

If it has a 14.5" chrome-lined barrel, collapsible stock, and is select fire or full auto, you could make the case that it's an M4.

If it has a 16" barrel and semi-only, it does not meet any definition of an M4.

[TMS951]

The make and model of your fire arm is that, the make and model. It should say it clearly on the receiver. It may well also be an AR15 pattern rifle, which you may choose to include in your description.

[Ernst]

The rifle I have is a BCM upper and lower, with a 11.5" barrel. BCM calls it a M4 Carbine. I will probably just keep referring to it as a civilian varient of an M4 Carbine which is a type of AR15 and leave it at that. If somebody wants more details I can have that discussion too.

[jackblack73]

I don't know anyone that calls a civilian owned AR an M4. Everyone just calls it an AR15. I didn't think it was even an issue.

[SomeOtherGuy]

I call my rifles M4geries, or Gungnir, or my little friend...

We could have a long and tedious discussion about the merits of different names, but - SQUIRREL!!!

[Iraqgunz]

Plenty of people do. I have a BCM lower that is marked M4A1. I have a modified Colt carbine and the lower is marked M4 Carbine. So in theory they would be considered an "M4 Carbine" if someone actually gave a shit about insignificant stuff like that.


I don't know anyone that calls a civilian owned AR an M4. Everyone just calls it an AR15. I didn't think it was even an issue.

[Zirk208]

I rank this right up there with "Band-aids" and "Kleenex." It may not be the exact brand or trademarked model, but when someone says it, you know what they mean.

[Ernst]

When asked about it, I'm simply going to say, "Sir, the private's weapon's name is Charlene, sir! "