View Full Version : Terror in Brussels, The New Norm for Europe?
Averageman
03-22-16, 06:20
http://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2016-03-22/explosion-heard-at-brussels-airport
Explosions rocked the Brussels airport and its subway system Tuesday, killing at least 13 people according to Belgian media, injuring scores more and prompting authorities to lock down the Belgian capital.
Belgium raised its terror alert to its highest level, diverting arriving planes and trains and ordering people to stay where they were. Airports across Europe immediately tightened security as a fleet of emergency vehicles roared in to handle the carnage at the Brussels airport.
http://www.latimes.com/world/europe/la-fg-belgium-paris-attacks-20160318-story.html
The largest manhunt in Europe came to a dramatic end Friday when police in Belgium arrested a fugitive linked to the Paris terrorist attacks that killed 130 people in November.
Salah Abdeslam, a 26-year-old French national who grew up in Brussels, was captured in a raid that sent loud bursts of gunfire reverberating through the city's Molenbeek neighborhood.
“We got him,” tweeted Belgium's secretary of state for asylum and migration, Theo Francken.
Abdeslam was injured in the leg during the raid and police were preparing to question him late Friday, hopeful that he will reveal crucial information about a Europe-wide network of Islamic extremists.
I'm just guessing that, Yes the two events are linked and Yes this will be the new norm for Europe.
Unless someone decides to take action now, they might as well prepare for more.
FNC is saying 23 dead.
Ugh. F*cking animals.
Eurodriver
03-22-16, 06:32
28 dead now. Suspects are probably Lutherans, right?
28 dead now. Suspects are probably Lutherans, right?
Some kind of privileged white people, I'm sure.
Disgruntled monks
Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk
An airport is a workplace.
So, workplace violence.
Sent from my LG-H811 using Tapatalk 2
Religion of Peace strikes again...
FromMyColdDeadHand
03-22-16, 07:17
Airport bomb was tripped before security. I've always wondered why they put people in those scanners and then let them out if they think they have something on them.... Just put a blast panel on the top and clean up the Pollack painting on the inside. The airport bomb as in front of the American Airlines counter?
No guns this time?
Thoughts and prayers for the families over there.
I have a buddy who is a paramedic over there and he is helping out at one of the locations.
Trump's fault.
I'm blaming the NRA.
This adds even more suspicion in my mind to the shutting down of the entire DC subway system last week. High threat level of terrorism involving transportation, and they shut down the whole system to check the wiring? Hmmm.....
Religion of Peace strikes again...
Neh man....it was the Hare Krishna guys. They hang out at the airports!
Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk
Averageman
03-22-16, 07:41
Do you think the ongoing battle these folks are fighting with both foreign and domestic terrorists will have any impact on the political climate in Europe?
brickboy240
03-22-16, 09:53
I think it already has had an impact.
Several anti-immigrant politicians and candidates are gaining popularity that they have never seen before.
It might indeed be too little, too late but things are starting to change a little bit.
SomeOtherGuy
03-22-16, 10:04
An airport is a workplace.
So, workplace violence.
So true about the San Bernardino incident, it's not even funny...
Airport bomb was tripped before security. I've always wondered why they put people in those scanners and then let them out if they think they have something on them....
Because it's security theater?
Anyone with half a brain knows that the long lines to get into screening are a much softer and easier target than anything past the checkpoint. How many dozens - or hundreds? - of times were people in Iraq and Afghanistan blown up in the lines to get into a secure zone? (Often police or police trainees, as most here know.) It's an absolutely stupid way of doing things if you are actually and sincerely worried about security.
Terrorism isn't a "new norm" for Europe. It's a 'been there, done that' that had a bit of a vacay, and it's coming back. Just change the agents from Red Brigade, Red Army Faction or the PLA to ISIS or ISL.
Dist. Expert 26
03-22-16, 10:48
Every attack in Europe just reminds me how overdue we are here. San Bernardino was bad, but if they ever put a coordinated attack together things will be much worse.
I think the citizens of Europe are getting close to the breaking point, and when they do it's going to get ugly.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjTgkht-fJU
The title of the video said airport attack, looks more like the metro/subway station to me.
FNC is saying 23 dead.
If only that meant what I wish that meant....
titsonritz
03-22-16, 10:59
Thank goodness we are not letting any of these fanatics in this country...oh wait... :blink:
No guns this time?
.
Claims by ISIS:
“Islamic State fighters carried out a series of bombings with explosive belts and devices on Tuesday, targeting an airport and a central metro station in the center of the Belgian capital Brussels, a country participating in the international coalition against the Islamic State,” the message read. "Islamic State fighters opened fire inside Zaventem Airport, before several of them detonated their explosive belts, as a martyrdom bomber detonated his explosive belt in the Maalbeek metro station. The attacks resulted in more than 230 dead and wounded."
Full article:
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2016/03/22/isis-claims-credit-for-brussels-attacks-as-death-toll-reaches-31.html?intcmp=hpbt1
And what does MSNBC blame? Weak gun control in Belgium....
http://newsbusters.org/blogs/nb/nicholas-fondacaro/2016/03/22/msnbc-pundit-blames-ease-getting-guns-brussels-bombing
BBC is reporting over 30 dead, a number sure to rise, and 150 plus wounded.
I think this is a retaliatory strike for taking down the Paris ringleader 4 days ago. A little reminder of "we can do this anytime, anywhere".
There will be some time for mourning and Facebook posts, some anti-immigration sentiment then it's back to business as usually for the EU and US.
I saw the President's remarks, he doesn't give a shit. It was all empty words.
brickboy240
03-22-16, 11:56
Weak gun control laws in Belgium? WTF?
Wasn't the attack done with bombs? I did not hear of anyone getting shot.
And what does MSNBC blame? Weak gun control in Belgium....
That's the most insane part...
Everyone knows that Belgium has a black market for guns...
So... Illegal firearms are to blame for a bombing?
Brace yourself for the onslaught of black, yellow, and red Facebook photos.
brickboy240
03-22-16, 12:19
I guess it is just a knee-jerk reaction for the Mess-NBC folks.
No wonder nobody watches their network. LOL
Weak gun control laws in Belgium? WTF?
Wasn't the attack done with bombs? I did not hear of anyone getting shot.
Read post #21.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjTgkht-fJU
The title of the video said airport attack, looks more like the metro/subway station to me.
It was both, I believe
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Sadly I agree that we are overdue for something of this magnitude here in the United States! As bad as the Boston Marathon bombing was, it could have been much worse, had it been a larger group coordinating multiple attacks, on multiple targets simultaneously!
Trump's fault.
I was kidding, but I guess Ted Cruz wasn't....
"Well, I will say, it is striking that the day after Donald Trump called for America weakening NATO withdrawing from NATO we see Brussels, where NATO is headquartered, the subject of a radical Islamist terrorist attack. Donald Trump is wrong that America should withdraw from the world and abandon our allies. Donald Trump is wrong that America should retreat from Europe, retreat from NATO, hand Putin a major victory and while he’s at it, hand ISIS a major victory."
Every attack in Europe just reminds me how overdue we are here. San Bernardino was bad, but if they ever put a coordinated attack together things will be much worse.
I think the citizens of Europe are getting close to the breaking point, and when they do it's going to get ugly.
If/when a majority of Europe reaches their threshold of tolerance for being invaded, it won't be ugly, but beautiful. I really look forward to it.
I was kidding, but I guess Ted Cruz wasn't....
"Well, I will say, it is striking that the day after Donald Trump called for America weakening NATO withdrawing from NATO we see Brussels, where NATO is headquartered, the subject of a radical Islamist terrorist attack. Donald Trump is wrong that America should withdraw from the world and abandon our allies. Donald Trump is wrong that America should retreat from Europe, retreat from NATO, hand Putin a major victory and while he’s at it, hand ISIS a major victory."
Cruz is a weasel. One can disagree with Trump without blaming him for Jihad that goes back 1400+ years.
WWII largely killed off the last remaining Alpha-males in Europe, so their genes were never passed on. Not necessarily a bad thing if it prevents the rise of Nazi-like beliefs and actions, but not good from a "stick up for yourself" standpoint. Gotta find that delicate balance I guess......
WWII largely killed off the last remaining Alpha-males in Europe, so their genes were never passed on. Not necessarily a bad thing if it prevents the rise of Nazi-like beliefs and actions, but not good from a "stick up for yourself" standpoint. Gotta find that delicate balance I guess......
Suppressed maybe, I don't know about "killed off." It seems though that those who vacillate and waffle and hem-and-haw the most are the ones that rise to leadership and make policy.
ColtSeavers
03-22-16, 13:31
I too wonder if the DC Metro shutdown has more to it now.
Prayers for Brussels/Europe.
This is ongoing assisted cultural suicide.
Coming to your town soon.
Howdy,
The attacks didn't have anything to do with religion, they had to do with hate.
Here in the USA the upper class and business class needed a cheap workforce to do peon labor that the white people thought they were "too good" to do and the Afro-Americans were too lazy to do so they imported Mexicans for a peon workforce.
In Europe where the vast majority are middle-class with an almost non-existent poor working class, a cheap peon workforce was needed.
Since they did not have Mexico to the south of them with a HUGE uneducated peon workforce they turned elsewhere for a cheap peon workforce..............the Middle East.
30 years later there is a HUGE number of 1st generation MEers that were born and raised though out Western Europe. They were born and raised in the slums and ghettos, treated like 3rd rate citizens, and today are very angry and piss offed at the entire world.
They want to blame someone for their miserable lives and has been radicalized, not by religion, but by hate.
Similar to how the inner city young men here in the USA have turned to violence, so have these young men.
The only difference between, say, the young men in the slums/projects/ghettos of Chicago and the young men in the slums/projects/ghettos of Western Europe is the men in Chicago attack one another while the angry young men in Western Europe attack the "System", the "Man" and innocent civilians.
Just my $.02.
Paul
Whiskey_Bravo
03-22-16, 14:02
Howdy,
The attacks didn't have anything to do with religion, they had to do with hate.
Here in the USA the upper class and business class needed a cheap workforce to do peon labor that the white people thought they were "too good" to do and the Afro-Americans were too lazy to do so they imported Mexicans for a peon workforce.
In Europe where the vast majority are middle-class with an almost non-existent poor working class, a cheap peon workforce was needed.
Since they did not have Mexico to the south of them with a HUGE uneducated peon workforce they turned elsewhere for a cheap peon workforce..............the Middle East.
30 years later there is a HUGE number of 1st generation MEers that were born and raised though out Western Europe. They were born and raised in the slums and ghettos, treated like 3rd rate citizens, and today are very angry and piss offed at the entire world.
They want to blame someone for their miserable lives and has been radicalized, not by religion, but by hate.
Similar to how the inner city young men here in the USA have turned to violence, so have these young men.
The only difference between, say, the young men in the slums/projects/ghettos of Chicago and the young men in the slums/projects/ghettos of Western Europe is the men in Chicago attack one another while the angry young men in Western Europe attack the "System", the "Man" and innocent civilians.
Just my $.02.
Paul
Sooooo, it's western Europeans fault that f-tards from the middle east or with middle eastern decent are blowing people up? Just want to make sure I know who to blame.
I could be wrong, but considering these f-tards are doing similar stuff all over the world, it might....just might have something to do with a political based religion that focuses on conquering, converting, and hate of all things different. But what do I know.
This aggression will not stand
And I recall people right here on this forum asking, "Why are they letting all of these military-age males into Europe?"
Howdy W_B,
Sooooo, it's western Europeans fault that f-tards from the middle east or with middle eastern decent are blowing people up? Just want to make sure I know who to blame.
I could be wrong, but considering these f-tards are doing similar stuff all over the world, it might....just might have something to do with a political based religion that focuses on conquering, converting, and hate of all things different. But what do I know.
Why do some people always want to blame someone?
Anywho.........
It isn't about religion, it's about hate.
If it was about religion than EVERY devout Muslim would be strappin' on a suicide vest to kill the infidel.
It's not about religion, it's about hate.
Look at it from a gun POV.........
Did the gun kill someone, or did a person use the gun to kill someone?
From '87 to '93 I spent a lot of time in the ME and no one tried to kill me because I was a white infidel.
Nowadays it's not even remotely safe to travel to areas in the ME that I travelled/worked in back in the "Day".
They have the same religion today that they had in 1989, so what changed?
Hate. That's what has changed
Paul
Whiskey_Bravo
03-22-16, 15:05
Of course it's hate. Hate that a decent sized portion of followers are channeling through the religion of islam.
Howdy,
And I call people right here on this forum asking, "Why are they letting all of these military-age males into Europe?"
I agree 100%. All the military aged men should be drafted into either the military or a workforce similar to Our Depression Era CCC program.
Only "problem" is that all the terrorist have been born in Western Europe, not the ME.
Look at the recent terrorist in Cali.........born, raised and educated in a middle class family in the USA.
Paul
yeah I saw that video on FB !
ironic I thought Trump said pull back our funding and pull back not withdrawal ? i could be wrong about that but what I seem to remember ?
and then he lies about it to adv himself over the deaths of muslims doing what they do !!!!!
yeah you wonder why so many wont support you !!!! go back to bed with beck !!!!
I was kidding, but I guess Ted Cruz wasn't....
"Well, I will say, it is striking that the day after Donald Trump called for America weakening NATO withdrawing from NATO we see Brussels, where NATO is headquartered, the subject of a radical Islamist terrorist attack. Donald Trump is wrong that America should withdraw from the world and abandon our allies. Donald Trump is wrong that America should retreat from Europe, retreat from NATO, hand Putin a major victory and while he’s at it, hand ISIS a major victory."
Howdy W_B,
Of course it's hate. Hate that a decent sized portion of followers are channeling through the religion of islam.
Actually, since there are almost 2 billion Muslims in the world there are only a friction of a per cent that are violently radical.
If only .1% were violently radicalized that would equate to 2,000,000 that are willing to risk/sacrifice their life for their "cause", which is quite terrifying to be honest.
Paul
hahahahahah OK SURE
has nothing to do with islam !!!!!
I reckon you work at MSNBC !
saying its hate is like saying guns never kill people its purely the shock the body takes by a small piece of material entering the body ? and well that shock can happen many ways !!
the gun ! in good persons hand it protects in bad it harms just like any weapon
but the bottom line is the person pulling the trigger and that shooter has to have a reason or more important a excuse and its islam that is saying do that !!!!!
look at whats happening in Africa and who is taking credit just understand history and you realize this is a 1500 year old problem
go back to the beginning of our country and try your theory and then realize its islam !!!!
you can claim hate all you want but all of these attacks by islam are well islamic !!!!!!
if you truly understood that you would realize that hate is not the problem its islam
yes islam hates everyone else but muslims !!!!!
what you have to learn is to separate islam from muslims and realize the folks doing this stuff are following islam more than the others just as many christians do not really follow Jesus as much as they could !
like we see honor killings !!!! and bombings and beheadings and killing children by butchering them in front of there families and this is happening world wide on a daily basis by these muslim people who you want to claim is just hate ?
so muslims truly following islam are what we are getting !!!!!
Howdy,
The attacks didn't have anything to do with religion, they had to do with hate.
Here in the USA the upper class and business class needed a cheap workforce to do peon labor that the white people thought they were "too good" to do and the Afro-Americans were too lazy to do so they imported Mexicans for a peon workforce.
In Europe where the vast majority are middle-class with an almost non-existent poor working class, a cheap peon workforce was needed.
Since they did not have Mexico to the south of them with a HUGE uneducated peon workforce they turned elsewhere for a cheap peon workforce..............the Middle East.
30 years later there is a HUGE number of 1st generation MEers that were born and raised though out Western Europe. They were born and raised in the slums and ghettos, treated like 3rd rate citizens, and today are very angry and piss offed at the entire world.
They want to blame someone for their miserable lives and has been radicalized, not by religion, but by hate.
Similar to how the inner city young men here in the USA have turned to violence, so have these young men.
The only difference between, say, the young men in the slums/projects/ghettos of Chicago and the young men in the slums/projects/ghettos of Western Europe is the men in Chicago attack one another while the angry young men in Western Europe attack the "System", the "Man" and innocent civilians.
Just my $.02.
Paul
brickboy240
03-22-16, 15:43
There are some that would be shouting "but this is not all Muslims" while one is sawing off their head with a rusty machete.
platoonDaddy
03-22-16, 15:55
Heard this on local radio that am and couldn't believe it:
Given the right to personal privacy laid down in the Constitution and the ECHR,[30] searches of private premises can only be performed under certain conditions. First, there has to be an explicit legal basis. Second, the search requires a warrant issued by an investigating judge, unless the person living in the house consents in writing with the search or if s/he is caught in the act of committing the offence. Third, a search of private premises cannot used proactively, with a view of discovering a criminal offence. Mere fishing expeditions are not permitted.
Fourth, the search can only be executed in a limited timeframe. In principle, it has to be carried out between 5am and 9pm, save in a number of limited circumstances (e.g. when a person is caught in the act).[31]
http://defensewiki.ibj.org/index.php/Belgium
***********************************
This video was recorded a little over a week ago as a message to presidential candidate Donald Trump from Brussels Belgium.
https://youtu.be/BsNXmQQSSp0
WWII largely killed off the last remaining Alpha-males in Europe, so their genes were never passed on. Not necessarily a bad thing if it prevents the rise of Nazi-like beliefs and actions, but not good from a "stick up for yourself" standpoint. Gotta find that delicate balance I guess......
Thad what folks thought after WW1. Didn't really work. As WW2 proved all it takes is a small group of nutso bananas leaders to lead the beta males into a war where millions of people are killed. The amount of suppressed rage that is going on in Eurpoe as a whole is pretty significant. I still have relatives living on the outskirts of this cultural suicide cult and even their AO's are seeing seriously pissed off folks. If someone pops the cork on all that frustration all over Europe it's going to get UGLY. No way shape or form of what is likely to happen will be good or beautiful or any semblance there of. The ovens are likely to be fired up and a lot of people who don't need killing will be killed. All the German, Italian, Polish, Belgian, Dutch civilians that got dead in WW2 didn't need killing. The same thing will happen here. A LOT of non violent decent brown folks will get caught up and killed. NOT GOOD.
Again, let's be "just like Civilized Europe" and "do our fair share" of importation of these animals. Yes, they're just pissed at #Trump2016 winning the election.
WW3 is physically impossible with Barry O'Nonads in office. Fricken Neville Chamberlain all over again.
And what does MSNBC blame? Weak gun control in Belgium....
I have no love for MSNBC, but putting the blame on them seems misplaced. The guy that said it was from The Atlantic.
Quote from the link in the OP:
The knowledge that the attacks were bombings didn’t stop Atlantic Washington editor Steve Clemons, who phoned into MSNBC and was inside the country, from criticizing Belgium for their “ease of getting guns here.”
dwhitehorne
03-22-16, 17:29
I too wonder if the DC Metro shutdown has more to it now.
Prayers for Brussels/Europe.
The scary thing in DC is they are more worried about a lawsuit than an attack. An electrical fire brings the system to their knees and half the metro area stays home from work. I can't imagine detonations at four different metro stops like Brussels is dealing with. We are living on borrowed time and have been very lucky so far. David
Cruz is a weasel. One can disagree with Trump without blaming him for Jihad that goes back 1400+ years.
He didn't blame it on Trump, he was merely using an opportunity to point out that those guys are our allies and we shouldn't leave them high and dry.
How do you think our allies, whom we don't need, as in badly need now, feel hearing a viable candiadate for POTUS spout off that way - backing out of NATO, etc.
Trust me, the NATO allies would do us more good than the Israeli Army when it comes down to the nutcutting.
He didn't blame it on Trump, he was merely using an opportunity to point out that those guys are our allies and we shouldn't leave them high and dry.
How do you think our allies, whom we don't need, as in badly need now, feel hearing a viable candiadate for POTUS spout off that way - backing out of NATO, etc.
Trust me, the NATO allies would do us more good than the Israeli Army when it comes down to the nutcutting.
He lied about what Trump said, and he knows it...he was trying to score cheap political points...not the best tact for an "outsider" IMO.
"Neville Chamberlain all over again."
Not quite. Although Hitler & Co. played Chamberlain like a violin, no less a person than Winston Churchill affirmed that Chamberlain DID love his country.
The only thing Obama loves is--himself.
"Neville Chamberlain all over again."
Not quite. Although Hitler & Co. played Chamberlain like a violin, no less a person that Winston Churchill affirmed that Chamberlain did love his country.
The only thing Obama loves is himself.
Point taken, I was thinking of the stupidity of inaction only.
"Neville Chamberlain all over again."
Not quite. Although Hitler & Co. played Chamberlain like a violin, no less a person than Winston Churchill affirmed that Chamberlain DID love his country.
The only thing Obama loves is--himself.
Obama loves the country, the same way the girl friend loves the shitty boy friend...not for what he is, but for what she thinks she can make him into.
ForTehNguyen
03-22-16, 18:59
even if you dont like Trump notice this article dated 1/27/16
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/28/world/europe/trump-finds-new-city-to-insult-brussels.html?smid=tw-share&_r=1
Ned Christiansen
03-22-16, 19:12
The radio thi9s evening could not help but mention in their Belgium reporting that Belgium has "a vibrant arms market" and "the most lax gun laws in Europe".
I suspect that what both comments really mean is that Belgium has a substantial and long standing arms manufacturing industry for its size.
But they had to word in such a way that is sounds like "AK's can be bought in any alley" and "everyone has one, so that's why this happened".
Does anyone have current reliable info on private gun ownership in Belgium?
Good question. It seems there is private ownership but to what extent or capabilities I, too, would like to know.
Regardless, if I lived in Europe right now, I would have a good semi auto rifle and some mags somehow or some way. Legally or illegally. Fair or unfair.
I might have to stand trial, but would still be alive to do so. They can BILL me.
I'll lift weights, catch up on my BET, and just chill for 10 years. Not getting beheaded nor blown up due to someone else's precious feelings
The radio thi9s evening could not help but mention in their Belgium reporting that Belgium has "a vibrant arms market" and "the most lax gun laws in Europe".
I suspect that what both comments really mean is that Belgium has a substantial and long standing arms manufacturing industry for its size.
But they had to word in such a way that is sounds like "AK's can be bought in any alley" and "everyone has one, so that's why this happened".
Does anyone have current reliable info on private gun ownership in Belgium?
It's almost funny (well, not really) how when this kind of shit happens in areas with pretty strict gun control that the Left's answer is to double-down on stupid. "Why, it's not strict enough".
The radio thi9s evening could not help but mention in their Belgium reporting that Belgium has "a vibrant arms market" and "the most lax gun laws in Europe".
I suspect that what both comments really mean is that Belgium has a substantial and long standing arms manufacturing industry for its size.
But they had to word in such a way that is sounds like "AK's can be bought in any alley" and "everyone has one, so that's why this happened".
Does anyone have current reliable info on private gun ownership in Belgium?
In Belgium, civilians are not allowed to possess military weapons, automatic firearms, and their ammunition, concealable firearms, silencers, laser sights, and high capacity cartridges84 85 86
CompareRegulation of Automatic Weapons
In Belgium, private possession of fully automatic weapons is prohibited84 85 86 23
CompareRegulation of Semiautomatic Assault Weapons
In Belgium, private possession of semi-automatic assault weapons is permitted only with special authorisation87 88 86
CompareRegulation of Handguns
In Belgium, private possession of handguns (pistols and revolvers) is permitted only with special authorisation85 87 88 86 23
CompareLaw Regulates Long Guns
In Belgium, civilian possession of rifles and shotguns is regulated by law23
Howdy,
The attacks didn't have anything to do with religion, they had to do with hate.
Here in the USA the upper class and business class needed a cheap workforce to do peon labor that the white people thought they were "too good" to do and the Afro-Americans were too lazy to do so they imported Mexicans for a peon workforce.
In Europe where the vast majority are middle-class with an almost non-existent poor working class, a cheap peon workforce was needed.
Since they did not have Mexico to the south of them with a HUGE uneducated peon workforce they turned elsewhere for a cheap peon workforce..............the Middle East.
30 years later there is a HUGE number of 1st generation MEers that were born and raised though out Western Europe. They were born and raised in the slums and ghettos, treated like 3rd rate citizens, and today are very angry and piss offed at the entire world.
They want to blame someone for their miserable lives and has been radicalized, not by religion, but by hate.
Similar to how the inner city young men here in the USA have turned to violence, so have these young men.
The only difference between, say, the young men in the slums/projects/ghettos of Chicago and the young men in the slums/projects/ghettos of Western Europe is the men in Chicago attack one another while the angry young men in Western Europe attack the "System", the "Man" and innocent civilians.
Just my $.02.
Paul
Partly correct, but you're mistaken about the nothing to do with religion part. Islam has been attacking and invading Europe for 1400 years, long before the current importation for political and ideological reasons. Spain, Vienna, the Balkans, all of these were overt aggressions that were very religious in nature.
Also the hate is part of the religion. They are inseparable in Islam. I suggest you read the Koran, or even listen to an average Muslim sermon.
This aggression will not stand
I'm afraid it will. The elites would rather their people suffer a million of these attacks than relinquish their grip on power, easy votes, undermining of cohesive nationalist sentiment or have their worldview shown to be wrong.
Howdy W_B,
Why do some people always want to blame someone?
Anywho.........
It isn't about religion, it's about hate.
If it was about religion than EVERY devout Muslim would be strappin' on a suicide vest to kill the infidel.
It's not about religion, it's about hate.
Look at it from a gun POV.........
Did the gun kill someone, or did a person use the gun to kill someone?
From '87 to '93 I spent a lot of time in the ME and no one tried to kill me because I was a white infidel.
Nowadays it's not even remotely safe to travel to areas in the ME that I travelled/worked in back in the "Day".
They have the same religion today that they had in 1989, so what changed?
Hate. That's what has changed
Paul
1) The Middle East is not synonymous with Islam. Your experience their was subject to factors such as how suppressed/tamed Islamists were (e.g. Under Sadaam, under Mubarak, under Turkey pre-Ergodan, Iran pre-Islamic Revolution, etc)
2) Muslims were kidnapping, torturing and murdering Americans circa your stay.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Francis_Buckley
3) Strapping bombs is only one of many ways to carry out Jihad against infidels. The Koran is specific about this. Muslims support Jihad in ways such as housing, feeding, hiding, cheering, justifying, birthing, comforting and financially contributing to Jihadis, who are the tip of the spear, so to speak. The Muslim community is the logistics branch.
Howdy W_B,
Actually, since there are almost 2 billion Muslims in the world there are only a friction of a per cent that are violently radical.
If only .1% were violently radicalized that would equate to 2,000,000 that are willing to risk/sacrifice their life for their "cause", which is quite terrifying to be honest.
Paul
In addition to the methods listed above, Muslims also carry out legal Jihad (lawsuits that use the West's laws against it), political jihad (voting for Sharia laws), demographic jihad (immigrating to infidel countries, breeding like rats, raping) and economic jihad (sucking up as many benefits as possible from infidels).
In many ways the overt violent jihad is the easiest to deal with. It's the stealth jihad that's hard because it doesn't make the news.
BoringGuy45
03-22-16, 22:51
Howdy,
The attacks didn't have anything to do with religion, they had to do with hate.
Untrue. Say what you will about Islam as a whole, but it was the religious beliefs these nuts followed that led them to blow themselves up. Whether or not their beliefs are compatible with Islam is irrelevant; they did this because they believe God commands it. That is a religious belief. Not a blind hatred.
Here in the USA the upper class and business class needed a cheap workforce to do peon labor that the white people thought they were "too good" to do and the Afro-Americans were too lazy to do so they imported Mexicans for a peon workforce.
In Europe where the vast majority are middle-class with an almost non-existent poor working class, a cheap peon workforce was needed.
Since they did not have Mexico to the south of them with a HUGE uneducated peon workforce they turned elsewhere for a cheap peon workforce..............the Middle East.
30 years later there is a HUGE number of 1st generation MEers that were born and raised though out Western Europe. They were born and raised in the slums and ghettos, treated like 3rd rate citizens, and today are very angry and piss offed at the entire world.
They want to blame someone for their miserable lives and has been radicalized, not by religion, but by hate.
Similar to how the inner city young men here in the USA have turned to violence, so have these young men.
The only difference between, say, the young men in the slums/projects/ghettos of Chicago and the young men in the slums/projects/ghettos of Western Europe is the men in Chicago attack one another while the angry young men in Western Europe attack the "System", the "Man" and innocent civilians.
Just my $.02.
Paul
Sooo, in other words, Europe had this coming, and this was just nothing more than a bunch of disenfranchised poor folks striking back at The Man? If this is another case of the proletariat striking out at the bourgeoisie, why are they marching under a black flag and not a red one? Why are YOU telling them what they are fighting for? Because last time I checked, they outright stated that their goal is to establish a worldwide caliphate.
Howdy,
Holy Batcrap!!
When's the last time y'all have ventured outside of your mom's basement........uh...... I mean your "Command Post"?
Just curious.
I hear this same kooky BS every time I listen to AM talk radio and the really sad part is y'all actually believe all this kooky BS.
Face it, there are roughly 2,000,000,000 Muslims in the world, more than any other religious group, and if only half were devout and believed they way most of the posters in this forum "think" they believe they will take over the world in less than a year.
Who's going to stop them?
T-Rump? He's a 'Nam draft dodger.
T-Rump Jr? He didn't give a crap enough to enlist after 9-11.
Some one mention military aged males earlier so just out of curiosity..........
Of all the members of this forum, how many were of military age during the War on Terror that enlisted to fight so they could defend "Ol' Glory"?
Just curious. I'm sure that some answered the "Call of Duty" but the vast majority didn't.
What is it about the Koran that has such a strong appeal that men, women and children will strap on a suicide vest and push the button, but in the 2012 election only half of the register voters bother to vote.
Paul
P. S. Looks like T-Rump is going to win the AZ GOP primary. The man is so liberal that he makes Bernie look right wing but he's got over 2Xs the votes as Cruz.
P.S.S. Never mind, I answered my own question.
BoringGuy45
03-22-16, 22:53
Be careful Stengun, you're getting close to troll status.
Howdy Boring Guy,
Be careful Stengun, you're getting close to troll status.
Well, sorry if I don't repeat the same old AM talk radio BS that screams "I'm over 40yo, never married, don't have any kids, live with my mom and have a "Command Post" in the basement!" line of crap.
Paul
ColtSeavers
03-22-16, 23:22
Howdy Boring Guy,
Well, sorry if I don't repeat the same old AM talk radio BS that screams "I'm over 40yo, never married, don't have any kids, live with my mom and have a "Command Post" in the basement!" line of crap.
Paul
Aaannnddd there are the true colors...
Howdy,
Holy Batcrap!!
When's the last time y'all have ventured outside of your mom's basement........uh...... I mean your "Command Post"?
Just curious.
My thoughts:
Christianity(for better or worse) is still the largest religion by professed adherents. Islam is second and arguably dropping in number but either getting pretty secular to pretty extreme.
I could piss on a Bible and put it on youtube and call it art. A Koran, not so much.
Disenfranchisement is a weak argument. These people have the WORLD at their fingertips and could have a good life. Just...ya know...assimilate. Accept religion for what it is. Lots of Atheists I'd rather trust with my last 20 dollars vs so.e people I know in church on Sunday(and I do consider myself a person of faith).
If Islam were just another religion and treated like just another religion and self policed; we would have no issues. But sadly there is that silent majority of Muslims that feels vindicated when a western city gets bombed.
I'm not hearing enough Muslims teetotaling PISSED OFF enough at the blatant murder and terrorism that is going on. If even a loud million got up and said "hey, yo...we got this" and started cramming Jawas uo their own asses, perhaps people could get on board here but it ain't happening.
So we aren't feeling it.
If I were a muslim, I'd be halal, read my book of fables, let other people borrow it if they were really interested, but most importantly wouldn't hurt anyone and would most certainly KEEP IT IN THE MOSQUE. Just like I keep it in Church.
I also wouldn't expect tge world to kiss my ass because of my religion. Don't like pork, don't eat it. Not hard. I'm physically allergic to fish, but I don't harsh on Long John Silver.
No....the ME or SWA or whatever just needs to get over itself, join the 21st century, and quit doing horrid things because somebody...somewhere....doesn't believe in their religion.
Lots of stuff I don't morally approve of but I just don't see myself getting in anyone's face about it. They'll either do right or they wont.
Also the whole "command center" spiel....not appropriate for M4C. You know that. Your experiences are your experiences but bear in mind the world has changed quite a bit since "your" day.
So consider the considerable.
MountainRaven
03-22-16, 23:46
"Neville Chamberlain all over again."
Not quite. Although Hitler & Co. played Chamberlain like a violin, no less a person than Winston Churchill affirmed that Chamberlain DID love his country.
The only thing Obama loves is--himself.
To be fair, Chamberlain actually did a lot to help the UK prepare for war, even though it meant being thrown under the bus. The UK wasn't ready for war in 1938 (although, to be fair, I'm not sure Germany was, either). And it was only barely prepared in late 1939 and 1940.
The radio thi9s evening could not help but mention in their Belgium reporting that Belgium has "a vibrant arms market" and "the most lax gun laws in Europe".
I suspect that what both comments really mean is that Belgium has a substantial and long standing arms manufacturing industry for its size.
But they had to word in such a way that is sounds like "AK's can be bought in any alley" and "everyone has one, so that's why this happened".
Does anyone have current reliable info on private gun ownership in Belgium?
I heard this, too, and had to laugh.
I seem to recall that there was a member of m4c from Belgium some years ago, who bitterly complained about how civilians in Belgium couldn't get FS2000s, PS90s, or SCARs.
Here's a link to a Bustle article about firearms laws in Belgium. It's not exactly specific, but it sounds like Belgium doesn't have a legal gun problem, but an illegal gun problem: Link (http://www.bustle.com/articles/149385-what-are-brussels-gun-laws-like-belgium-has-restrictive-firearm-rules). (Insofar as the US has a gun problem, it is most definitely an illegal gun problem more than a legal gun problem. But it appears that Kalashnikovs are apparently relatively easy to come across in Belgium, provided that one knows the right people to ask and that they're presumably not as expensive as they are in the US.)
It seems to me that these things don't seem to happen in European countries with genuinely more relaxed gun laws, like the Czech Republic, Poland, or Slovenia.
ETA: The one thing that I did hear that made sense is to expect more of these types of attacks. Apparently ISIS, et al., have been pushing for their lone wolves abroad to attack the infidel where ever the infidel is found: Rather than choosing a target for its sensational impact, targets that can be more easily defended and are more difficult to successfully attack, like marathons and skyscrapers in New York, they will choose targets that are and must be, by nature, open and the site of many, many people and therefore virtually impossible to effectively defend without bringing your economy to a grinding halt. Like mass transportation hubs - airports, train stations, &c.
ETA2: Religious suppression doesn't exactly have a grand and glorious history in the world. Neither one of human dignity nor one of being particularly successful. The Nazis only succeeded as much as they could due to strict eugenics laws and the German anal-retentive compulsion to record everything: If too many of your ancestors were Jews, you were legally considered a Jew, even if you were a devout Catholic or Protestant.
Any effort at eradicating Islam in Europe through extermination will suffer the same fate and with the same effectiveness as the Tokugawa shogunate's efforts to crush Christianity. Which is to say that it will be a stain on the continent's history and it ultimately won't be very effective.
ETA3:
Tintin hardened the f___ up.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CeJZ7STUEAAxRTr.jpg (https://twitter.com/michelkichka/status/712230567136210944)
Moose-Knuckle
03-23-16, 01:57
Terror in Brussels, The New Norm for Europe?
Terrorism isn't a "new norm" for Europe. It's a 'been there, done that' that had a bit of a vacay, and it's coming back. Just change the agents from Red Brigade, Red Army Faction or the PLA to ISIS or ISL.
Islamic violence in Europe is nothing new, this is merely the latest islamic conquest of Europe that has been ALLOWED to happen by the globalist Western European leaders.
Traditional European held territories have been attacked by muslims since 649 A.D. that is four hundred and forty seven years before the first crusade.
Moose-Knuckle
03-23-16, 02:08
WWII largely killed off the last remaining Alpha-males in Europe, so their genes were never passed on. Not necessarily a bad thing if it prevents the rise of Nazi-like beliefs and actions, but not good from a "stick up for yourself" standpoint. Gotta find that delicate balance I guess......
Yes it is a BAD thing.
Just imagine how the world would be if we didn't loose millions of European and American alpha males in two world wars.
We'ed have colonies on Mars and expeditions to other systems.
Yes it is a BAD thing.
Just imagine how the world would be if we didn't loose millions of alpha males in two world wars.
Speaking German?
Problem is those Alpha Males swore loyalty oaths to both Hitler and Stalin and followed them regardless of consequences. They were no different than liberals but with balls. Those aren't the alpha males we really needed.
And there are plenty of Europeans trying to stand up to this crap. But in a familiar tune they are being called "racists", "Islamaphobes" or worse "Nazis" for trying to stop the Syrian invasion that is coming along nicely.
You think "white guilt" is a problem here, you should try "NSDAP guilt" in Germany, why do you think Merkle pledged to accept more refugees than any other country? They literally have to do the opposite of anything the nazi's did, problem is the nazi's did a lot of things to protect their country. I'm amazed modern Germans breathe oxygen, after all...the nazis did that too.
Moose-Knuckle
03-23-16, 02:19
Be careful Stengun, you're getting close to troll status.
Aaannnddd there are the true colors...
LOL IRL another one for "It's a religion of peace" aka apologist.
At least he spared us the whole "racist", "Stormfront", "Nazi", and "islamophia" tripe.
Moose-Knuckle
03-23-16, 02:25
Speaking German?
Problem is those Alpha Males swore loyalty oaths to both Hitler and Stalin and followed them regardless of consequences. They were no different than liberals but with balls. Those aren't the alpha males we really needed.
And there are plenty of Europeans trying to stand up to this crap. But in a familiar tune they are being called "racists", "Islamaphobes" or worse "Nazis" for trying to stop the Syrian invasion that is coming along nicely.
You think "white guilt" is a problem here, you should try "NSDAP guilt" in Germany, why do you think Merkle pledged to accept more refugees than any other country? They literally have to do the opposite of anything the nazi's did, problem is the nazi's did a lot of things to protect their country. I'm amazed modern Germans breathe oxygen, after all...the nazis did that too.
I was talking about if none of the events (which IMHO were orchestrated) that led to these wars transpired and the wars never took place. Hitler was never a soldier in WWI or a leader in WWII. Stalin was just another SOB at the factory, etc.
Millions of American, British, German, Russian, Canadian, Australian, New Zealand, French, Dutch, etc. men never died and sired progeny. The globalist like Merkel justify her Cultural Marxism via low birth rates of native Europeans.
Howdy,
Holy Batcrap!!
When's the last time y'all have ventured outside of your mom's basement........uh...... I mean your "Command Post"?
Just curious.
I hear this same kooky BS every time I listen to AM talk radio and the really sad part is y'all actually believe all this kooky BS.
Face it, there are roughly 2,000,000,000 Muslims in the world, more than any other religious group, and if only half were devout and believed they way most of the posters in this forum "think" they believe they will take over the world in less than a year.
Who's going to stop them?
T-Rump? He's a 'Nam draft dodger.
T-Rump Jr? He didn't give a crap enough to enlist after 9-11.
Some one mention military aged males earlier so just out of curiosity..........
Of all the members of this forum, how many were of military age during the War on Terror that enlisted to fight so they could defend "Ol' Glory"?
Just curious. I'm sure that some answered the "Call of Duty" but the vast majority didn't.
What is it about the Koran that has such a strong appeal that men, women and children will strap on a suicide vest and push the button, but in the 2012 election only half of the register voters bother to vote.
Paul
P. S. Looks like T-Rump is going to win the AZ GOP primary. The man is so liberal that he makes Bernie look right wing but he's got over 2Xs the votes as Cruz.
P.S.S. Never mind, I answered my own question.
You have avoided addressing every point I and others made in regards to your previous posts, and then went to launch ad hominem attacks with zero basis in fact. So let's address your latest round of "questions".
Islamis not the majority peaceful belief system that you seem to think it is. Places that have succumbed to it, and where the majority of people are followers, are terrible places to live. Apostates are persecuted and killed, non-believers as well, not to mention gays and whatnot. Free speech is non-existent, drawing the prophet is a death sentence, and preaching something other than Islam (including atheism) is as well.
What is it about Islam that drives people to be like this? Islam's nature is. The life of Muhammed should be a clue.
Moreover, your claim that people who point this out are basement-dwelling children is neither relevant nor true. The fact is that any country that allows non-Muslims the same rights as Muslims cannot by definition be Muslim. Kuffars are to be made to feel subjugated, through various sans - enslavement, jizya, dhimmi status, etc.
It sounds like your knowledge of Islam is very superficial and based on a few individuals you have met, who may or may not have been honest with you, or who may not actually understand what Islam commands.
Either way, you need to start making arguments rather than ad hominem attacks.
Dial back your nonsense, or it will be dialed back for you.
Howdy Boring Guy,
Well, sorry if I don't repeat the same old AM talk radio BS that screams "I'm over 40yo, never married, don't have any kids, live with my mom and have a "Command Post" in the basement!" line of crap.
Paul
Averageman
03-23-16, 06:03
And there are plenty of Europeans trying to stand up to this crap. But in a familiar tune they are being called "racists", "Islamaphobes" or worse "Nazis" for trying to stop the Syrian invasion that is coming along nicely.
You think "white guilt" is a problem here, you should try "NSDAP guilt" in Germany, why do you think Merkle pledged to accept more refugees than any other country? They literally have to do the opposite of anything the nazi's did, problem is the nazi's did a lot of things to protect their country. I'm amazed modern Germans breathe oxygen, after all...the nazis did that too.
I lived in Germany for 9 years and for the most part I found this to be true, nearly exactly true.
I think the German people have gone so far to not be or do anything that could be construed as "nazi" like that they may have left their own best self interest behind in order to appease those who would play that card against them.
They believe and own the guilt to the point of ending up with a Merkle, who will destroy the country rather than say "No More"! There is a new generation of German people who refuse to play this stupid game and I hope they take their country back and throw off the guilt.
There are "vigilante" type groups forming in many places. I have a good friend from Sweden who keeps me up to date. There are entire towns now that are basically off limits to whites, and the police are so overwhelmed they are useless. But groups like Soldiers of Odin are growing, and they are fighting back.
http://sputniknews.com/europe/20160322/1036741831/sweden-finland-soldiers-of-odin.html
VooDoo6Actual
03-23-16, 06:55
Risible & Op Gladio.
The Battlespace is the Planet.
My thoughts:
Christianity(for better or worse) is still the largest religion by professed adherents. Islam is second and arguably dropping in number but either getting pretty secular to pretty extreme.
I could piss on a Bible and put it on youtube and call it art. A Koran, not so much.
Disenfranchisement is a weak argument. These people have the WORLD at their fingertips and could have a good life. Just...ya know...assimilate. Accept religion for what it is. Lots of Atheists I'd rather trust with my last 20 dollars vs so.e people I know in church on Sunday(and I do consider myself a person of faith).
If Islam were just another religion and treated like just another religion and self policed; we would have no issues. But sadly there is that silent majority of Muslims that feels vindicated when a western city gets bombed.
I'm not hearing enough Muslims teetotaling PISSED OFF enough at the blatant murder and terrorism that is going on. If even a loud million got up and said "hey, yo...we got this" and started cramming Jawas uo their own asses, perhaps people could get on board here but it ain't happening.
So we aren't feeling it.
If I were a muslim, I'd be halal, read my book of fables, let other people borrow it if they were really interested, but most importantly wouldn't hurt anyone and would most certainly KEEP IT IN THE MOSQUE. Just like I keep it in Church.
I also wouldn't expect tge world to kiss my ass because of my religion. Don't like pork, don't eat it. Not hard. I'm physically allergic to fish, but I don't harsh on Long John Silver.
No....the ME or SWA or whatever just needs to get over itself, join the 21st century, and quit doing horrid things because somebody...somewhere....doesn't believe in their religion.
Lots of stuff I don't morally approve of but I just don't see myself getting in anyone's face about it. They'll either do right or they wont.
Also the whole "command center" spiel....not appropriate for M4C. You know that. Your experiences are your experiences but bear in mind the world has changed quite a bit since "your" day.
So consider the considerable.
Sorry, buddy throwing the BS flag. It's simple - haters gonna hate - for whatever reason.
And there are a significant number of folks on this forum who have no one to look out for but themselves, sure that is largely the demographic of forums, but that doesn't mean it is unspeakable. I've kind of found that raising kids helps keep things in perspective, your mileage may vary.
And there is a lot of 'from my cold dead hand' rhetoric from folks who didn't ruck up to serve in any way.
And ignoring the socio-economic relationship to crime is the equivalent to still believing flat earth theory. And, yet, if you acknowledge that poverty breeds crime, but doesn't excuse crime, some folks just find that too fvcking hard to process.
I'm out of here, got to go to work.
Averageman
03-23-16, 13:35
Apparently Turkey warned Belgium that at least one of these guys was a shoe in for Terrorism. He had been in country and had worked with ISIS.
They passed it on to Belgium and the warning was ignored and the guy was let in.
I'm pretty sure that's about like the warning Russia gave us on the Boston Bombers. So how do you deal with that kind of ignorance from your Leadership?
Apparently elect Hillary and find out.
Sorry, buddy throwing the BS flag. It's simple - haters gonna hate - for whatever reason.
And there are a significant number of folks on this forum who have no one to look out for but themselves, sure that is largely the demographic of forums, but that doesn't mean it is unspeakable. I've kind of found that raising kids helps keep things in perspective, your mileage may vary.
And there is a lot of 'from my cold dead hand' rhetoric from folks who didn't ruck up to serve in any way.
And ignoring the socio-economic relationship to crime is the equivalent to still believing flat earth theory. And, yet, if you acknowledge that poverty breeds crime, but doesn't excuse crime, some folks just find that too fvcking hard to process.
I'm out of here, got to go to work.
Wingman, I saw some of his point but he buried it in a bit of self righteousness. We both know what impoverishment can encourage amongst certain groups but doesn't excuse it. Still...there is a big difference between burglaries and bombings.
Really the ghettos wouldn't be ghettos if the people living there had a bit more pride in their neighborhoods.
Frankly, I don't think these terrorists really, actually believe in anything. They just use it as an excuse to go after people.
I, personally, would love a family. I just can't afford one right now. Maybe when I'm 40 I guess, but ive spent my entire adult life raising these other people's kids so...its a wash.
I'm no expert but fail to see the point in bombing anyone
I lived in Germany for 9 years and for the most part I found this to be true, nearly exactly true.
I think the German people have gone so far to not be or do anything that could be construed as "nazi" like that they may have left their own best self interest behind in order to appease those who would play that card against them.
They believe and own the guilt to the point of ending up with a Merkle, who will destroy the country rather than say "No More"! There is a new generation of German people who refuse to play this stupid game and I hope they take their country back and throw off the guilt.
This is no shit..... Although my Germany experience was extremely limited (Octoberfest 2010), I am the kind of fellow that loves to talk to people and compare their culture to American culture.
During my ten day stay in Germany, I was astonished and overwhelmed by the "NAZI" guilt at every hotel, beer hall, etc. To a person, they are TAUGHT, no....indoctrinated in school that Germans are inherently "bad". Self hate......same as being taught here in the USA, though our "victims" are the blacks, theirs are the Jews. I mean TRUE self loathing and embarrassment that they are Germans. These people were not older than 30-35 years old, certainly not old enough to have participated in WW2, not even their parents. May be their grandparents if that.
I went with a drinking buddy for Octoberfest and as an example of many examples of the self-hate.....one night of many nights, we were at a beer hall being generally friendly to everyone around us. Most everyone in Germany has a handle of English. We got into a conversation with a nice young couple. We were talking about the German culture and I got a dose of the self hate. I wasn't sure and a bit startled, so I started asking clarification. Once on the subject, the couple kept hanging their heads and insisted that they and the rest of present-day German people were "bad" for what happened in WW2. I asked where did they get that from? They replied they were taught in school since they were very young that Germany was responsible for much of the world's problems, that they owed the world, and that ethnic Germans were inherently bad. I couldn't believe what I was hearing. I replied that I thought Germans were great and proud people, and because of their age, they were not even alive to have done anything wrong in WW2. I mentioned how economically strong Germany was in all of Europe, just stating facts and statistics. Etc, etc, etc.
I think the wife of the couple was turned on by my statements. No shit. And I'm not that kind of guy and I wasn't trying anything funny. I swear I thought it was my imagination or the beer listening/talking. Without mentioning anything to my buddy, he said the same thing about the wife's reaction. And he isn't one of those guys either and he noticed. The German wife was THAT obvious in response of my strong opinions of the Germans.
From that point on, my curiosity was piqued and without being pushy, I started trying to talk to more Germans about the subject, and it was similar all over Germany. Quite an eye opener. Furthermore, I noticed how similar to what is happening here in this country pushed by the liberals. What's happening in Germany and the rest of the EU is the canary in the coal mine for the USA.
This is no shit..... Although my Germany experience was extremely limited (Octoberfest 2010), I am the kind of fellow that loves to talk to people and compare their culture to American culture.
During my ten day stay in Germany, I was astonished and overwhelmed by the "NAZI" guilt at every hotel, beer hall, etc. To a person, they are TAUGHT, no....indoctrinated in school that Germans are inherently "bad". Self hate......same as being taught here in the USA, though our "victims" are the blacks, theirs are the Jews. I mean TRUE self loathing and embarrassment that they are Germans. These people were not older than 30-35 years old, certainly not old enough to have participated in WW2, not even their parents. May be their grandparents if that.
I went with a drinking buddy for Octoberfest and as an example of many examples of the self-hate.....one night of many nights, we were at a beer hall being generally friendly to everyone around us. Most everyone in Germany has a handle of English. We got into a conversation with a nice young couple. We were talking about the German culture and I got a dose of the self hate. I wasn't sure and a bit startled, so I started asking clarification. Once on the subject, the couple kept hanging their heads and insisted that they and the rest of present-day German people were "bad" for what happened in WW2. I asked where did they get that from? They replied they were taught in school since they were very young that Germany was responsible for much of the world's problems, that they owed the world, and that ethnic Germans were inherently bad. I couldn't believe what I was hearing. I replied that I thought Germans were great and proud people, and because of their age, they were not even alive to have done anything wrong in WW2. I mentioned how economically strong Germany was in all of Europe, just stating facts and statistics. Etc, etc, etc.
I think the wife of the couple was turned on my statements. No shit. And I'm not that kind of guy and I was trying anything funny. I swear I thought it was my imagination or the beer listening/talking. Without mentioning anything to my buddy, he said the same thing about the wife's reaction. And he isn't one of those guys either and he noticed. The German wife was THAT obvious in response of my strong opinions of the Germans.
From that point on, my curiosity was piqued and without being pushy, I started trying to talk to more Germans about the subject, and it was similar all over Germany. Quite an eye opener. Furthermore, I noticed how similar to what is happening here in this country pushed by the liberals. What's happening in Germany and the rest of the EU is the canary in the coal mine for the USA.
It's been my experience with Germans that while they are certainly edgy and touchy about the Nazi period, they are proud of their Tutonic heritage, nature and all. To be fair I haven't spent more time than you there or travelled throughout the country; nor was I really honing on their 'nature' as you did.
It's been my experience with Germans that while they are certainly edgy and touchy about the Nazi period, they are proud of their Tutonic heritage, nature and all. To be fair I haven't spent more time than you there or travelled throughout the country; nor was I really honing on their 'nature' as you did.
I didn't bring up the "NAZI period", they did..... as a reason for their admitted head-hanging. But I admit, a ten day vacation is hardly a scientific study.
It's been my experience with Germans that while they are certainly edgy and touchy about the Nazi period, they are proud of their Tutonic heritage, nature and all.
I do business with a large German company. They advertise that they have been in business since 1950 but in reality they been in business since 1933. The Germans are great business people. They are highly skilled, smart, talented and very capable and usually market that characteristic to consumers. But as you said, they tend to omit there history from around 1930-1948. When I asked what they did in that time they looked at the floor and said quietly, we were just a small machine shop. Its one thing to be ashamed of your government, its another to be ashamed of your self, the people that I am talking about were born in the mid 60's and had nothing to do with that time period. They germens did as they were instructed by a radical political party. They made landing gear for Messerschmitt's and Heinkel's. Its almost like having white guilt or rich guilt or smart guilt.
I do business with a large German company. They advertise that they have been in business since 1950 but in reality they been in business since 1933. The Germans are great business people. They are highly skilled, smart, talented and very capable and usually market that characteristic to consumers. But as you said, they tend to omit there history from around 1930-1948. When I asked what they did in that time they looked at the floor and said quietly, we were just a small machine shop. Its one thing to be ashamed of your government, its another to be ashamed of your self, the people that I am talking about were born in the mid 60's and had nothing to do with that time period. They germens did as they were instructed by a radical political party. They made landing gear for Messerschmitt's and Heinkel's. Its almost like having white guilt or rich guilt or smart guilt.
That's actually pretty frustrating sometimes. Try being on a long distance call with JP Sauer trying to get information on your 1939 Drilling. If you call Beretta in Italy they can tell you pretty much everything about anything they made in the last 150 years. One would think the Germans aren't nearly as organized as the Italians.
Howdy Moose-Knuckle,
LOL IRL another one for "It's a religion of peace" aka apologist.
At least he spared us the whole "racist", "Stormfront", "Nazi", and "islamophia" tripe.
I'm not an apologist and I'm not saying that Islam is a religion of peace, all I'm saying is that the terror attacks in Brussells and Paris didn't have anything to do with religion, it's about hate.
Face it, Man has done terrible things to His fellow Man in the name of religion.
Even if the Brussells terror "claim" it's about religion they are just using religion as an excuse.
If it was truly about religion the devout Muslims, roughly 1,000,000,000 of them would be destroying the infidel because face it most people, especially military age American males would not stand up and fight.
Sad but true.
Paul
BoringGuy45
03-23-16, 16:42
Howdy Moose-Knuckle,
I'm not an apologist and I'm not saying that Islam is a religion of peace, all I'm saying is that the terror attacks in Brussells and Paris didn't have anything to do with religion, it's about hate.
Face it, Man has done terrible things to His fellow Man in the name of religion.
Even if the Brussells terror "claim" it's about religion they are just using religion as an excuse.
If it was truly about religion the devout Muslims, roughly 1,000,000,000 of them would be destroying the infidel because face it most people, especially military age American males would not stand up and fight.
Sad but true.
Paul
People don't willingly die, much less kill themselves, for things they don't believe in. Call it what you will: A radical branch of Islam, an off-shoot of Islam, a religion loosely based on Islam, whatever. But the fact is, these people are driven to their actions based on their beliefs in or about spiritual or religious matters. It's not a blind hatred of the world with no goals. These aren't a bunch of nihilists or rebels without a cause; they're religious fanatics. To say that religion plays absolutely no part in these terrorist's actions is ludicrous.
Howdy Moose-Knuckle,
I'm not an apologist and I'm not saying that Islam is a religion of peace, all I'm saying is that the terror attacks in Brussells and Paris didn't have anything to do with religion, it's about hate.
Face it, Man has done terrible things to His fellow Man in the name of religion.
Even if the Brussells terror "claim" it's about religion they are just using religion as an excuse.
If it was truly about religion the devout Muslims, roughly 1,000,000,000 of them would be destroying the infidel because face it most people, especially military age American males would not stand up and fight.
Sad but true.
Paul
They are not going around bombing and maiming innocents across the globe, just to get some piss and vinegar out of their system, and then turning around and blaming religion.
It is about their beliefs in Islam. That is all its about. They are trying to fulfill a prophecy. They are taking the words of the Koran and other accompanying Muslim texts at its word. Their laws are based on them. Sharia. Saudis live by it too and do lots of funding of terrorism as well as have morality police, and have sheiks that are some of the "holy" men that these monsters look up to and follow.
Just because a majority of Muslims don't carry out terrorism doesn't meant that the acts of terrorists are not based in religion. And just because the majority of Muslims don't carry out terrorism doesn't mean that many of them aren't supporting it.
The idea is to create a 100% Muslim world, living under Sharia law and dominating everything around them. No rights.
People don't willingly die, much less kill themselves, for things they don't believe in. Call it what you will: A radical branch of Islam, an off-shoot of Islam, a religion loosely based on Islam, whatever. But the fact is, these people are driven to their actions based on their beliefs in or about spiritual or religious matters. It's not a blind hatred of the world with no goals. These aren't a bunch of nihilists or rebels without a cause; they're religious fanatics. To say that religion plays absolutely no part in these terrorist's actions is ludicrous.
I agree - people don't willingly die or kill themselves for something they don't believe in.
The point that seems to get lost in the noise of differing views is that not all folks follow their religion to a tee. As an example, I am a divorced male, and a fairly devout person of Faith. I have remarried. In some folk's eyes I'm an adulterer. Does that mean in all Christians eye's I am? To say ALL members of a religion are terrorists or believe in jihad flies in the face of reality. It is stereotyping which is simply a way of dealing subjectively about a topic which should be viewed objectively.
This article has an interesting take on suicde bombings: http://origins.osu.edu/article/human-use-human-beings-brief-history-suicide-bombing/page/0/1
Averageman
03-23-16, 17:51
I do business with a large German company. They advertise that they have been in business since 1950 but in reality they been in business since 1933. The Germans are great business people. They are highly skilled, smart, talented and very capable and usually market that characteristic to consumers. But as you said, they tend to omit there history from around 1930-1948. When I asked what they did in that time they looked at the floor and said quietly, we were just a small machine shop. Its one thing to be ashamed of your government, its another to be ashamed of your self, the people that I am talking about were born in the mid 60's and had nothing to do with that time period. They germens did as they were instructed by a radical political party. They made landing gear for Messerschmitt's and Heinkel's. Its almost like having white guilt or rich guilt or smart guilt.
It took me years to develop friendships with the half dozen or so German people I got to know well.
It seems to me that the guys who fought in WWII felt less guilt than the folks who came afterwards.
Averageman
03-23-16, 17:59
Just because a majority of Muslims don't carry out terrorism doesn't meant that the acts of terrorists are not based in religion. And just because the majority of Muslims don't carry out terrorism doesn't mean that many of them aren't supporting it.
The idea is to create a 100% Muslim world, living under Sharia law and dominating everything around them. No rights.
Remember how many Irish Americans gave money to the IRA? Same thing.
People who's families had been in America for generations still sent money, sometimes unknowingly, to keep the fight going.
There are plenty of Muslims here in America sending money back to keep the fight going. Sometimes it is for religious reasons, sometimes not so much. They do it, we know they do it, hell, they leave a paper trail and yet it goes on.
I'm saying the Saudi government as well as other governments knowingly fund them. Shit, we do before they turn "boogie man" and are "surprised" when they go jihadi.
Remember how many Irish Americans gave money to the IRA? Same thing.
People who's families had been in America for generations still sent money, sometimes unknowingly, to keep the fight going.
There are plenty of Muslims here in America sending money back to keep the fight going. Sometimes it is for religious reasons, sometimes not so much. They do it, we know they do it, hell, they leave a paper trail and yet it goes on.
if you look at surveys, strong majorities of Muslims, across the globe, support Sharia law...that means they are at best not strongly opposed to the radicals.
Just imagine how the world would be if we didn't loose millions of European and American alpha males in two world wars.
We'ed have colonies on Mars and expeditions to other systems.The United States had this small conflict called the Civil War. Are we seriously going to argue that no "alpha" genes survived? I assume you are joking about Mars ... yes the "alpha" man in the tribe was really good at throwing his spear but it was still a pointy stick
Averageman
03-23-16, 18:35
if you look at surveys, strong majorities of Muslims, across the globe, support Sharia law...that means they are at best not strongly opposed to the radicals.
My understanding and I am by far no expert, but Sharia Law is essentially the same as our Ten Commandments?
So you wont find a Baptist who will go against the Ten Commandments, but you wont find them blowing themselves up in a grocery store either.
So I would guess it comes back to is your religion fronting violence in order to achieve their Goals?
Problem is those Alpha Males swore loyalty oaths to both Hitler and Stalin and followed them regardless of consequences. They were no different than liberals but with balls. Those aren't the alpha males we really needed.Oh come on like Gunter the Grunt is abreast on the latest Nazi policies and top secret concentration camps (when I'm sure he got to meet and talk with Hitler and Goering at the draft ceremony)... and all the Confederate soldiers fought to preserve bonded labor...
Let's not be this wrongfully sanctimonious
SeriousStudent
03-23-16, 18:48
And I'll repeat Iraqgunz's warning about dialing back the rhetoric.
FromMyColdDeadHand
03-23-16, 19:01
I'll give that Islam isn't the problem, but it is the only palatable solution. We can't discriminate well enough between the good and the evil- the muslims have to do that themselves. When we go and try to get the bad ones we just end up being like a blind man in a china shop, breaking things and killing people and hacking everyone off. When the muslims bleed themselves to the point that the crazies are dead and the ones left move ahead.
If it was truly about religion the devout Muslims, roughly 1,000,000,000 of them would be destroying the infidel because face it most people, especially military age American males would not stand up and fight.
Sad but true.
38517
I call bullshit!!
If it was truly about religion the devout Muslims, roughly 1,000,000,000 of them would be destroying the infidel because face it most peopleYou make a very good point about the number of Muslims, but all this means is that number of "devout" muslims is a very very low percentage of the overall religion. You can say this about any major religion!
I'm not an apologist and I'm not saying that Islam is a religion of peace, all I'm saying is that the terror attacks in Brussells and Paris didn't have anything to do with religion, it's about hate. ... Face it, Man has done terrible things to His fellow Man in the name of religion.No you admit in next sentence it has to do with religion too. Yes of course they have hate (themselves mostly), but without religion they would act differently.
A devout muslim will try to kill your kuffar ass for no other reason than you are not muslim.
My understanding and I am by far no expert, but Sharia Law is essentially the same as our Ten Commandments?
So you wont find a Baptist who will go against the Ten Commandments, but you wont find them blowing themselves up in a grocery store either.
So I would guess it comes back to is your religion fronting violence in order to achieve their Goals?
My understanding is it's more like this:
According to the Sharia law:
• Theft is punishable by amputation of the right hand (above).
• Criticizing or denying any part of the Quran is punishable by death.
• Criticizing or denying Muhammad is a prophet is punishable by death.
• Criticizing or denying Allah, the moon god of Islam is punishable by death.
• A Muslim who becomes a non-Muslim is punishable by death.
• A non-Muslim who leads a Muslim away from Islam is punishable by death.
• A non-Muslim man who marries a Muslim woman is punishable by death.
• A man can marry an infant girl and consummate the marriage when she is 9 years old.
• Girls' clitoris should be cut (per Muhammad's words in Book 41, Kitab Al-Adab, Hadith 5251).
• A woman can have 1 husband, but a man can have up to 4 wives; Muhammad can have more.
• A man can unilaterally divorce his wife but a woman needs her husband's consent to divorce.
• A man can beat his wife for insubordination.
• Testimonies of four male witnesses are required to prove rape against a woman.
• A woman who has been raped cannot testify in court against her rapist(s).
• A woman's testimony in court, allowed only in property cases, carries half the weight of a man's.
• A female heir inherits half of what a male heir inherits.
• A woman cannot drive a car, as it leads to fitnah (upheaval).
• A woman cannot speak alone to a man who is not her husband or relative.
• Meat to be eaten must come from animals that have been sacrificed to Allah - i.e., be Halal.
• Muslims should engage in Taqiyya and lie to non-Muslims to advance Islam.
MountainRaven
03-23-16, 20:22
Up until about 150 years ago, female heirs in the US received nothing. Women couldn't own property - unless they were unwed - any property she held in name, belonged in fact to their husband or their father. When they could own their own property, they couldn't control it - that again fell to their husbands. Every penny that a married woman made belonged to her husband or father. Every possession her had before her marriage would thenceforth belong to her husband. She could not enter into contracts.
Polygamy has only been illegal in the US for about as long.
&c., &c., &c.
Just saying.
My understanding is it's more like this:
According to the Sharia law:
• Theft is punishable by amputation of the right hand (above).
• Criticizing or denying any part of the Quran is punishable by death.
• Criticizing or denying Muhammad is a prophet is punishable by death.
• Criticizing or denying Allah, the moon god of Islam is punishable by death.
• A Muslim who becomes a non-Muslim is punishable by death.
• A non-Muslim who leads a Muslim away from Islam is punishable by death.
• A non-Muslim man who marries a Muslim woman is punishable by death.
• A man can marry an infant girl and consummate the marriage when she is 9 years old.
• Girls' clitoris should be cut (per Muhammad's words in Book 41, Kitab Al-Adab, Hadith 5251).
• A woman can have 1 husband, but a man can have up to 4 wives; Muhammad can have more.
• A man can unilaterally divorce his wife but a woman needs her husband's consent to divorce.
• A man can beat his wife for insubordination.
• Testimonies of four male witnesses are required to prove rape against a woman.
• A woman who has been raped cannot testify in court against her rapist(s).
• A woman's testimony in court, allowed only in property cases, carries half the weight of a man's.
• A female heir inherits half of what a male heir inherits.
• A woman cannot drive a car, as it leads to fitnah (upheaval).
• A woman cannot speak alone to a man who is not her husband or relative.
• Meat to be eaten must come from animals that have been sacrificed to Allah - i.e., be Halal.
• Muslims should engage in Taqiyya and lie to non-Muslims to advance Islam.
Read the Old Testament much?
Up until about 150 years ago, female heirs in the US received nothing. Women couldn't own property - unless they were unwed - any property she held in name, belonged in fact to their husband or their father. When they could own their own property, they couldn't control it - that again fell to their husbands. Every penny that a married woman made belonged to her husband or father. Every possession her had before her marriage would thenceforth belong to her husband. She could not enter into contracts.
Polygamy has only been illegal in the US for about as long.
&c., &c., &c.
Just saying.
So basically youre saying that the West has generally adapted and matured over the years. I dont think anyone has disagreed that every culture, religion, country... has had really crappy times, rules and rulers. Some cultures have evolved and changed their ways while others have chosen to stay stagnant. In the end I dont think anyone here would give a hoot if people would just keep their crap to themselves. That applies to EVERYONE on the damned planet and beyond. Want to chop off heads if someone looks at you cross eyed, live according to Sharia Law, or pray to the all mighty Ba-Al. Isolate it to those who chose to live with and by your chosen rues and I could care less. Its just that there is always a select few who want to force their ways onto others. When the Jehovist gys show up on their bikes, you can just squirt them with the water hose if you want and they scurry along. When the crazy Muslim shows up its not so easy to ignore the big bang.
Europe has chosen its path and unfortunately it will be paid for in blood.
Just saw a news article that the Belgians and Nato in particular are investigating a ISIS threat of expanding
a European wide offensive.
This is eerily similar to Matthew Brackens ; Tet Take Two published on Westernrifleshooters last year, worth
a read.
You have a link to the article so we can read it? Don't tease us like that.
This is a ongoing story on Fox right now,
The Matthew Bracken article is here..........
Tet, Take Two: Islam's 2016 European Offensive
charlescarrollsociety.com/wp-content/uploads/...
Tet, Take Two: Islam’s 2016 European Offensive Page 2 of 20 By Matthew Bracken, November 2015 I also believe it is not 800,000 fighting men that is needed to ...
It's actually really simple.
Yes there are literally millions of muslims and certainly they aren't all terrorists. But the litmus test is this.
"Do you believe in the concept of valid jihad?"
If they honestly answer "no" then they are not part of the problem. If they answer "yes" or secretly believe in the concept of "valid jihad" then they ARE THE PROBLEM. They have just supported "racial holy war" and we all know from Southern Poverty Law Center literature that "racial holy war" is always wrong and is a defining element of a "hate group" or "hateful ideology."
And just because they aren't personally shooting anyone or blowing anything up doesn't mean they don't give tacit support to those who do, even if they verbally condemn this act of terrorism or that act of terrorism and denounce it as "not true Islam."
The problem is it's kind of difficult to have "true Islam" without the concept of "valid Jihad." It's not a problem like being Christian and ordered to kill witches and such. Jihad is as central to Islam as the resurrection is the Christianity, it would be almost impossible to have Christianity but deny the resurrection.
The very word "Islam" means "submission", it does not mean "peace" as some would have you believe. The entire belief is about "submission to Allah" and accepting "Allahs will." This is why Muslims say "Allah Ackbar" (God is Great) even in the face of tragedy. If their child dies in a car accident, they accept Allahs will and praise him to demonstrate devotion.
Jihad is a "Holy War" waged for Allah. So you aren't going to find a ton of Muslims who will praise Allah and his "will" after a truck kills their kid but won't support a Holy War being waged in Allahs name. Secular Islam is almost a cultural impossibility. So there is your actual problem.
This is why Salah Abdeslam was able to avoid capture for so long. Despite being the most wanted man in Europe, there were entire neighborhoods that were willing to shelter him because they believed he was engaged in a "valid Jihad."
Read the Old Testament much?
When was the last time a Jewish person or Christian killed a witch? There are entire countries that practice Sharia Law TODAY and that includes witch trials.
http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2013/08/saudi-arabias-war-on-witchcraft/278701/
if you look at surveys, strong majorities of Muslims, across the globe, support Sharia law...that means they are at best not strongly opposed to the radicals.
Exactly. You don't even need a poll. Just look at Muslim countries, communities in the West, what they preach at mosques down your street, and what their prophet was and what he did.
My understanding and I am by far no expert, but Sharia Law is essentially the same as our Ten Commandments?
So you wont find a Baptist who will go against the Ten Commandments, but you wont find them blowing themselves up in a grocery store either.
So I would guess it comes back to is your religion fronting violence in order to achieve their Goals?
Uh, yeah, think 10 Commandments but more rape, enslavement, subjugation, murder, and whatnot.
I'll give that Islam isn't the problem, but it is the only palatable solution. We can't discriminate well enough between the good and the evil- the muslims have to do that themselves. When we go and try to get the bad ones we just end up being like a blind man in a china shop, breaking things and killing people and hacking everyone off. When the muslims bleed themselves to the point that the crazies are dead and the ones left move ahead.
Oh, Islam is the problem. Nazism was the problem, despite there probably being some nice, pleasant Nazi Party members. We simply don't have the time or resources or the duty to sift through billions of them to figure out who isn't closely following the instructions of a mad rapist murderer and who is.
With the Nazis, it was "only" ten million or so. And we carpet bombed their asses. But since Muslims are special, we are supposed to fight this war on an individual basis? No thanks.
Up until about 150 years ago, female heirs in the US received nothing. Women couldn't own property - unless they were unwed - any property she held in name, belonged in fact to their husband or their father. When they could own their own property, they couldn't control it - that again fell to their husbands. Every penny that a married woman made belonged to her husband or father. Every possession her had before her marriage would thenceforth belong to her husband. She could not enter into contracts.
Polygamy has only been illegal in the US for about as long.
&c., &c., &c.
Just saying.
And yet, despite all that, even in those patriarchal days, women in the U.S. were still treated better than under Islam at any point in its history or future.
Read the Old Testament much?
I have read it. But I didn't know that terrible things 3000+ years ago make Islam and it's terrible acts here and now somehow understandable, justifiable or acceptable. Christianity evolved. Islam does not.
http://www.generationword.com/photos/worldview_chart_gw3.gif
This is an illustration put together by Worldview, read it! Ive just came back from a Worldview seminar, the speakers this year were major university professors, ex-CIA, NSA, psychiatrist , sociologist, anthropologist and military leaders. They spent most of the 4 days on Islam, ISIS, Iran, Syria and USA. They speak about all the candidates running for president not just here in the US but all over the world. Very informative.
I have read it. But I didn't know that terrible things 3000+ years ago make Islam and it's terrible acts here and now somehow understandable, justifiable or acceptable. Christianity evolved. Islam does not.
Okay, I needed a sarcasm emoticon on that.
Surely this Eastern European black market of guns works both ways.
Were I European I'd sell my Saab or max out some credit cards getting some hardware.
As bad as I feel for people the Trojan Horse is looking more and more real.
Right now I have a Glock 21 by my side and feel blessed. It's mine. Paid in full. Plus a longarm or two at home
Right now there are guys who just have nothing and could get flashmobbed or bombed at any moment. Guys with wives and kids who just want a life. Work, home, bed.
And right now, we know some muslim terrorist is somewhere plotting hard to do something.
Who's next? Germany? UK? France? Spain? Austria? Some left coast city or some New England town?
We don't know. And nobody cares. The elites have places to hide. We're just statistics.
There it is.
Found the article, good read.
So Firefly, are we good to go when the balloon goes up and protect us some nubile European lasses?
Seriously, if it kicks off like he projects and as bad as he projects, the ol' U.S. will be right in the thick of it.
I'm more a New Testament guy (acknowledging wingman's sarcasm but..)
I'm a New Testament guy. Live and let live until people make that impossible.
Then we got severe problems.
I've confided to people at times but I'll say this:
I'm not a good man capable of evil. I'm an evil man desperately trying to be good. Desperately.
That's why I really try to check myself.
Or some stupid shit like that.
MountainRaven
03-23-16, 22:25
http://www.generationword.com/photos/worldview_chart_gw3.gif
This is an illustration put together by Worldview, read it! Ive just came back from a Worldview seminar, the speakers this year were major university professors, ex-CIA, NSA, psychiatrist , sociologist, anthropologist and military leaders. They spent most of the 4 days on Islam, ISIS, Iran, Syria and USA. They speak about all the candidates running for president not just here in the US but all over the world. Very informative.
"God exits."
:blink:
When was the last time a Jewish person or Christian killed a witch? There are entire countries that practice Sharia Law TODAY and that includes witch trials.
http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2013/08/saudi-arabias-war-on-witchcraft/278701/
2008 is the most recent that I'm aware of.
Exactly. You don't even need a poll. Just look at Muslim countries, communities in the West, what they preach at mosques down your street, and what their prophet was and what he did.
What do they preach at the mosques down the street from you?
MountainRaven
03-23-16, 22:37
Double.
Yeah, you know me. Anything for a joke.
And in a morbid way, seeing the whole "In America, there is a man with a gun behind every door" being put to the test live and in 3D would actually be interesting to see
I mean sometimes haji really does break into the wrong galldang rec room
Europe made their bed, time to lay in it.
from 1776-1830
Women’s rights to real property—the lands and buildings that constituted most wealth in the early national period—were more extensive than their rights to personalty. A husband could not sell or mortgage the realty his wife brought to their marriage without her consent.
if we go back 150 years as you try to claim ? which is wrong we even had black women making big money !!!! actually the very first female millionaire was a black woman !!!
you are thinking of coverture where a woman could not own property independently when married unless she had written Ok
not at all what you thought or read ?
A married woman had the right to be maintained in a manner commensurate with her husband’s social status. If he refused to provide for her appropriately, she could sue and win support from the courts.
also men could not sell without the wifes consent even if he brought it to the marriage !!!!
A wife also had important rights to the real property that her husband brought to the marriage or purchased afterwards. He could not sell or mortgage it unless she signed a statement signifying her free consent, which was recorded with the deed. Few mortgagors or buyers would enter into an agreement without the wife’s consent.
so yes they could own and yes they had control !!! not as much as today but still had !!!
so to make something up and say this was just 150 years ago ? but actually was never like you say it was to try to compare to your muslims you seem to love so much and EVEN if it was like you said we did move forward
since the birth of our country in 1776 women did own land and the husband could not sell it
actually if we go back to the colony times of the 1600s we find women owned land !!!!
google Mary Brent
NOTHING in common with the savages that have not moved forward one tiny bit in last 1500 years !!
Up until about 150 years ago, female heirs in the US received nothing. Women couldn't own property - unless they were unwed - any property she held in name, belonged in fact to their husband or their father. When they could own their own property, they couldn't control it - that again fell to their husbands. Every penny that a married woman made belonged to her husband or father. Every possession her had before her marriage would thenceforth belong to her husband. She could not enter into contracts.
Polygamy has only been illegal in the US for about as long.
&c., &c., &c.
Just saying.
2008 is the most recent that I'm aware of.
Love to hear about it. Was it done in accordance to the law of the land? Was it a member of a special religious police squad tasked with "magic crimes"?
Europe made their bed, time to lay in it.
Depends. If they are going to recognize the error of their ways and hunt / kill terrorists, I'm all for providing some forms of assistance, especially intelligence and things of that nature.
If they decide to do the "a couple bad apples give everyone a bad name" song and dance, well good luck with that.
I just hope it wakes up people over here. The Boston Marathon bombers should have been the final demonstration for the doubters, but a lot of people seem to have not gotten the message. There is really nothing preventing this from happening here...again.
I just hope it wakes up people over here. The Boston Marathon bombers should have been the final demonstration for the doubters, but a lot of people seem to have not gotten the message. There is really nothing preventing this from happening here...again.
I hope America and the rest of the world wake up before these terrorist start using kids to execute jihad. There are no kids on the "terrorist watch list", there are no kids on the "no fly list", almost no intelligence because they have no known background or ties to radical Islam or terrorism. In other words, they have no past. No ones talking about it, I know its a sore subject but it is a real threat. Most western civilizations has compassion laws that protect children's rights more than adults because of there ignorance and innocence in the eyes of the law. No one would expect an 8 year old walking into a public place with a back pack cause that is normal behavior. We are too busy looking for military age middle eastern men with beards who have twitter accounts. The Boston bombers were young, but that attack could have been carried out by someone much younger. Someone as young as 8. I promise you the first detective that goes on the air and says "we are looking for a 8-10 year old middle eastern boy", all hell would break loose, every liberal in this country and around the world would protest. I honestly think another 9/11 could happen, maybe not in the US but perhaps Europe. I'm talking multiple well choreographed attacks carries out by 100 men in 25 European cities at the same time that would make the attack in Paris seem like just another day. But Europe is going to have to go through the labor pains of the GWOT.
unless you mean in the civilized world ?
because its to late they have already been doing this around the world !
in Africa very very heavily
frontline had a good story on using children as suicide bombers
ISIS has also been capturing kids from there families and making them murder there families just like in Africa
muslims have been abusing children for 1500 years
there has not been one peep of liberals protesting the muslim abuse of children !
why should they when liberals are proud baby killers !!! they support the massive butchering of children in this country as a great thing some even go on shows and say how awesome it was to start a life then murder the child inside them and how it made them feel so empowered and free and liberated and others cheer them on put them on a pedestal and even our president calls the biggest murder of children in the US a super hero !!!!!
to think more black babies were killed in NY than born !!!!! all because of liberals massive push
liberals are most likely killing way more children than the muslims which is really scary !!!!!
its why they IMHO are so in bed with them and love them so much and think they are so awesome ?
why else would a religion that does what it does to women and children be so protected and held up as peaceful by the liberals ?
instead they would rather attack the Christians or to busy wanting to remove God from everything in the US after all muslims are the peaceful ones !!
like some here who think this has nothing to do with islam until people wake up and realize it is about islam and what it teaches it will only get worse
I hope America and the rest of the world wake up before these terrorist start using kids to execute jihad. There are no kids on the "terrorist watch list", there are no kids on the "no fly list", almost no intelligence because they have no known background or ties to radical Islam or terrorism. In other words, they have no past. No ones talking about it, I know its a sore subject but it is a real threat. Most western civilizations has compassion laws that protect children's rights more than adults because of there ignorance and innocence in the eyes of the law. No one would expect an 8 year old walking into a public place with a back pack cause that is normal behavior. We are too busy looking for military age middle eastern men with beards who have twitter accounts. The Boston bombers were young, but that attack could have been carried out by someone much younger. Someone as young as 8. I promise you the first detective that goes on the air and says "we are looking for a 8-10 year old middle eastern boy", all hell would break loose, every liberal in this country and around the world would protest. I honestly think another 9/11 could happen, maybe not in the US but perhaps Europe. I'm talking multiple well choreographed attacks carries out by 100 men in 25 European cities at the same time that would make the attack in Paris seem like just another day. But Europe is going to have to go through the labor pains of the GWOT.
"
I agree 100%
ISLAM IS THE PROBLEM!!!!!!!!!!
Moose-Knuckle
03-24-16, 02:32
Howdy Stengun,
In Europe where the vast majority are middle-class with an almost non-existent poor working class, a cheap peon workforce was needed.
Since they did not have Mexico to the south of them with a HUGE uneducated peon workforce they turned elsewhere for a cheap peon workforce..............the Middle East.
Not true.
The military aged male "refugees" from the Middle East and North Africa that are currently invading Europe do not work. They live off the native tax payers and are given "free" housing, food, medical, internet, computers, et al. Germany has been doing this for decades with the Turks. These "refugees" are not scrubbing toilets, working fast food, or digging ditches. They are however blowing up Paris and Brussels and raping women all over the continent.
From '87 to '93 I spent a lot of time in the ME and no one tried to kill me because I was a white infidel.
Nowadays it's not even remotely safe to travel to areas in the ME that I travelled/worked in back in the "Day".
They have the same religion today that they had in 1989, so what changed?
4 November 1979
Tehran
A group of Iranian students stormed the U.S. Embassy in Tehran, taking more than 60 American hostages.
23 October 1983
Beirut
In the attack on the building serving as a barracks for the 1st Battalion 8th Marines (Battalion Landing Team – BLT 1/8), the death toll was 241 American servicemen: 220 Marines, 18 sailors, and 3 soldiers, making this incident the deadliest single-day death toll for the United States Marine Corps since World War II's Battle of Iwo Jima, the deadliest single-day death toll for the United States military since the first day of the Vietnam War's Tet Offensive, and the deadliest single attack on Americans overseas since World War II.
And as far as "what happened after 1989" why have muslims been attacking traditionally held European territories since the 6th Century A.D.?
I'm not an apologist and I'm not saying that Islam is a religion of peace, all I'm saying is that the terror attacks in Brussells and Paris didn't have anything to do with religion, it's about hate.
Islam is an fanatical ideology of H A T E.
Face it, Man has done terrible things to His fellow Man in the name of religion.
Wait, what?
But you said over and over that it's NOT religion that it's all about "hate". Christians use to hold witch trials and torture people through out the dungeons of Europe. Then they had a little thing called a reformation. Islam, not so much. Many islamic nations to this day still hold witch trials, imprison torture and murder homosexuals, stone women accused of adultery, gang rape women for no reason but hey it's cool with their god so why not.
Moose-Knuckle
03-24-16, 02:38
The United States had this small conflict called the Civil War. Are we seriously going to argue that no "alpha" genes survived? I assume you are joking about Mars ... yes the "alpha" man in the tribe was really good at throwing his spear but it was still a pointy stick
Western civilization has been on the decline since the 60's thanks to mechanisms of globalism, cultural Marxism, etc.
I'm not saying the alpha male gene died after WWII, someone else did. I'm merely asserting that if we had not lost those millions of Allied and Axis we would not be having this discussion of oxygen thieves over running Europe.
We put men on the moon in the 60's we could have gone much further. Since then we put them in a can orbiting the Earth and pay for rides with the Russians.
Moose-Knuckle
03-24-16, 02:42
Up until about 150 years ago, female heirs in the US received nothing. Women couldn't own property - unless they were unwed - any property she held in name, belonged in fact to their husband or their father. When they could own their own property, they couldn't control it - that again fell to their husbands. Every penny that a married woman made belonged to her husband or father. Every possession her had before her marriage would thenceforth belong to her husband. She could not enter into contracts.
Polygamy has only been illegal in the US for about as long.
&c., &c., &c.
Just saying.
If anything with this post you proved that Western civilization has evolved and recognize women as equals where islam has not.
wilson1911
03-24-16, 02:56
There are only a few people in this thread that have a good understanding of islam, and what it means to be a muslim. It is about hate, but that is only the superficial thing lingering on the surface. You might say it is a product of islam, which is the root of the problem.
There is no such thing as a peaceful muslim, nor will there ever be.
Moose-Knuckle
03-24-16, 03:02
It puzzles me that this comes as a surprise to people given the documented history of islamic incursions in Europe going back to the 6th Century A.D., we all live in the 21st century . . . they never left the 7th.
Anyone read the "ISIS Crisis". Its a great book, easy read with only 150 pages. I read it in one night.
A quick break down of why there is no peace in the middle east.
WW1: The easiest way to defeat Germany and Central powers was up break up the Ottoman Empire. The way to do that was to get the Arabs to join the British. (Lawrence of Arabia). The king of England promised the Arabs there own land.- Remember, Iraq, Syria didn't Lebanon didn't exist in 1920. However the Germans controlled the acetone that was used in production of ammunition. It wasn't until a Jewish chemist came up with a solution during WW1. That Jewish man was friends with powerful people in US and England. He convince England and the US to give the Jews there own homeland in exchange for there support of the war. The Jew who lived in Turkey and Hungry would side with the Allies. Up to this point, both Arabs and Jews were promised there own land (the same land). The problem was that England had no intention of honoring there promise. After the war, without taking account of ancient tribes, ethnic back ground the divided the once Ottoman Empire and gave the same land to both Arabs and Jews. The problem with that, is that the English basically drew straigt lines and created different terretories that made up modern day middle east. In the end, Sunnis were living with Shiites and Jews and Kurds.
Sunnis are the same people that were in control of Iraq (saddam Hussein) and Syria ( Bashar as assad) both Baath party. Hamas is also Sunni as well as Palestine. Isis are Sunni. Sunnis are BAD!
Iran are Shiites.Shiites are Bad!
Sunnis believe the Uncle was second in line of Mahammed(caliph), where Shiites believe the son in law was second in line (law). That is what has divided all islam and caused so many problems. Shiites and Sunnis do not go well together. The King of Jordan as well as the leader of ISIS have claimed to be direct disendents to Muhammad. Difference is Shiites have religious supreme leader (ayatollah) where Sunnis have direct desendent of Muhammad.
The reason for all this madness comes down to the year 1979 Iran, Afghanistan and Iraq. 3 different events and how the US responded is responsible for the outcome. Read the book! its very informative. And it is historical accurate.
also note the last sentence like some here was not pointed at you :)
just in general :)
I agree 100%
ISLAM IS THE PROBLEM!!!!!!!!!!
Averageman
03-24-16, 07:24
The agents of ISIS in Europe seem to be ratcheting up the pressure looking for a good fight.
I'm hoping they get one.
I wouldn't take issue if they went door to door and loaded cattle cars and sent several hundred thousand back to Syria and Iraq.
http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016/03/22/geert-wilders-speaks-to-breitbart-on-brussels/
“This is intolerable. Open borders are a huge safety risk. Our citizens are in mortal danger if we do not restore control over our own national borders”.
Speaking earlier today Mr. Wilders lamented that commuters were killed in “cold blood” and said “The cause of all this bloodshed is Islam. We need to de-Islamize the West. That is the only way to safeguard our lives and protect our freedom”.
http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016/03/23/tears-teddy-bears-but-no-resolve-to-deal-with-islamist-threat-in-europe/
Our security services and our police, hamstrung by political correctness, are just as interested (or more?) in rounding up Twitter “hate speech” offenders than criminal, rapist, or terrorist migrants. Our borders are as porous as our brains. We refuse to realise that there are now literally millions of people amongst us who hate us. Who hate our way of life, and who will, one day, dominate our public life.
As much Trump Hate as we have out there people may begin to see that Trump got this one right.
I'm more a New Testament guy (acknowledging wingman's sarcasm but..)
I'm a New Testament guy. Live and let live until people make that impossible.
Then we got severe problems.
I've confided to people at times but I'll say this:
I'm not a good man capable of evil. I'm an evil man desperately trying to be good. Desperately.
That's why I really try to check myself.
Or some stupid shit like that.
St. Augustine?
Averageman
03-24-16, 08:42
St. Augustine?
I think he's more of a Bermuda Grass kind of guy.
I just try to stay positive man. I like to have a good time but I always say no to drugs
SomeOtherGuy
03-24-16, 12:34
Up until about 150 years ago, female heirs in the US received nothing. Women couldn't own property - unless they were unwed - any property she held in name, belonged in fact to their husband or their father. When they could own their own property, they couldn't control it - that again fell to their husbands. Every penny that a married woman made belonged to her husband or father. Every possession her had before her marriage would thenceforth belong to her husband. She could not enter into contracts.
Polygamy has only been illegal in the US for about as long.
&c., &c., &c.
Just saying.
I don't think any of this is actually true. I see that Honu has already dissected this in post #124. I also remember a rather forceful lecture in law school, by a female, feminist law professor, that claims that women were at one time "chattel" or didn't have any rights were entirely false. If you have any source for these claims, I would be very interested to read them.
As for polygamy, I don't think that was ever widely legal in the US. It simply didn't require get much attention until the LDS followers started practicing it, and the US government took measures specifically against them.
Anyway, even if your claims were true 150 years ago - and I don't think they are - the fact that they are not true today, or in anyone's living memory, demonstrates that there is no equivalence in the treatment of women in the USA vs. in some Muslim countries today.
I don't think any of this is actually true. I see that Honu has already dissected this in post #124. I also remember a rather forceful lecture in law school, by a female, feminist law professor, that claims that women were at one time "chattel" or didn't have any rights were entirely false. If you have any source for these claims, I would be very interested to read them.
As for polygamy, I don't think that was ever widely legal in the US. It simply didn't require get much attention until the LDS followers started practicing it, and the US government took measures specifically against them.
Anyway, even if your claims were true 150 years ago - and I don't think they are - the fact that they are not true today, or in anyone's living memory, demonstrates that there is no equivalence in the treatment of women in the USA vs. in some Muslim countries today.
It was a "moral equivalency" argument that was just a little out of date, huh? :rolleyes: Kind of like Islam is a little out of date.
wasn't even out of date since it never was like that or as they say just another LIE !!!!
It was a "moral equivalency" argument that was just a little out of date, huh? :rolleyes: Kind of like Islam is a little out of date.
I'm more a New Testament guy (acknowledging wingman's sarcasm but..)
I'm a New Testament guy. Live and let live until people make that impossible.
Then we got severe problems.
I've confided to people at times but I'll say this:
I'm not a good man capable of evil. I'm an evil man desperately trying to be good. Desperately.
That's why I really try to check myself.
Or some stupid shit like that.
Aquinas ventured to say that even the devil had some good in him as he had existence. At least you're trying--desperately. Wish more folks were.
http://www.amazon.com/Evil-Thomas-Aquinas/dp/0195091833/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1458864731&sr=1-1&keywords=Aquinas+on+Evil
Averageman
03-24-16, 20:34
As for polygamy, I don't think that was ever widely legal in the US. It simply didn't require get much attention until the LDS followers started practicing it, and the US government took measures specifically against them.
Anyway, even if your claims were true 150 years ago - and I don't think they are - the fact that they are not true today, or in anyone's living memory, demonstrates that there is no equivalence in the treatment of women in the USA vs. in some Muslim countries today.
I asked an older LDS guy about this one time. His explanation was the mortality rate for Men in the 19th Century was incredibly high. Being as LDS folks have always promoted large families, chances were if the Husband died, the Wife was left with lots of hungry mouths to feed and little prospect other than Prostitution to make that happen. Thus Polygamy.
I'm not sure how truthful that is, but to some degree it is logical, but with a likely degree of revisionist history.
Wasn't George Washington's wife Martha a Wealthy Widow when he married her? I'm not sure how you become a Wealthy Widow if you can't own shit.
I'm not sure how Progressives are allowed to say stuff like "But One Hundred and Fifty Years Ago Americans did..." How is that relevant to the argument? On one hand you want to lift this Culture up as the Religion of Peace, on the other you say you need to be wary of handing anything to a Muslim with your left hand because that's the one they wipe their asses with???
WTF? even my Hillbilly Family in Appalachia was smart enough to use last years Sears Catalog or a Corn Cob in "Rough Times" a Hundred F'ing years ago.
These folks, the ones you claim invented engineering, astronomy and architecture are still walking around with dooky fingers and it is all good?
I'm sorry it doesn't work both ways.
MountainRaven
03-24-16, 21:51
from 1776-1830
Women’s rights to real property—the lands and buildings that constituted most wealth in the early national period—were more extensive than their rights to personalty. A husband could not sell or mortgage the realty his wife brought to their marriage without her consent.
if we go back 150 years as you try to claim ? which is wrong we even had black women making big money !!!! actually the very first female millionaire was a black woman !!!
you are thinking of coverture where a woman could not own property independently when married unless she had written Ok
not at all what you thought or read ?
A married woman had the right to be maintained in a manner commensurate with her husband’s social status. If he refused to provide for her appropriately, she could sue and win support from the courts.
also men could not sell without the wifes consent even if he brought it to the marriage !!!!
A wife also had important rights to the real property that her husband brought to the marriage or purchased afterwards. He could not sell or mortgage it unless she signed a statement signifying her free consent, which was recorded with the deed. Few mortgagors or buyers would enter into an agreement without the wife’s consent.
so yes they could own and yes they had control !!! not as much as today but still had !!!
so to make something up and say this was just 150 years ago ? but actually was never like you say it was to try to compare to your muslims you seem to love so much and EVEN if it was like you said we did move forward
since the birth of our country in 1776 women did own land and the husband could not sell it
actually if we go back to the colony times of the 1600s we find women owned land !!!!
google Mary Brent
NOTHING in common with the savages that have not moved forward one tiny bit in last 1500 years !!
And yet throughout the 19th Century we see states passing laws allowing married women to own property. Why are such laws needed if married women could own property?
https://memory.loc.gov/ammem/awhhtml/awlaw3/property_law.html
Love to hear about it. Was it done in accordance to the law of the land? Was it a member of a special religious police squad tasked with "magic crimes"?
A mob of around 300 men killed 11 people accused of practicing witchcraft in Kisii County, Kenya. These people were variously clubbed and stabbed to death and then burned. A quick Google search for 'witchcraft kisii' reveals that this may be ongoing and much worse than I initially thought.
wasn't even out of date since it never was like that or as they say just another LIE !!!!
I'm not trying to attack you, I'm genuinely curious: Did you ever take a course in typing in school? Is English not your first language? I ask because the guys on here who are from Norway and Poland for whom English is a second or third language are better typists than you.
I asked an older LDS guy about this one time. His explanation was the mortality rate for Men in the 19th Century was incredibly high. Being as LDS folks have always promoted large families, chances were if the Husband died, the Wife was left with lots of hungry mouths to feed and little prospect other than Prostitution to make that happen. Thus Polygamy.
I'm not sure how truthful that is, but to some degree it is logical, but with a likely degree of revisionist history.
Wasn't George Washington's wife Martha a Wealthy Widow when he married her? I'm not sure how you become a Wealthy Widow if you can't own shit.
I'm not sure how Progressives are allowed to say stuff like "But One Hundred and Fifty Years Ago Americans did..." How is that relevant to the argument? On one hand you want to lift this Culture up as the Religion of Peace, on the other you say you need to be wary of handing anything to a Muslim with your left hand because that's the one they wipe their asses with???
WTF? even my Hillbilly Family in Appalachia was smart enough to use last years Sears Catalog or a Corn Cob in "Rough Times" a Hundred F'ing years ago.
These folks, the ones you claim invented engineering, astronomy and architecture are still walking around with dooky fingers and it is all good?
I'm sorry it doesn't work both ways.
Certain people seem to believe that we've always had televisions, the internet, and electricity. The truth is that we're not as far separated from the barbarians as some people would like to believe.
I also enjoy the use of the hypothetical you in this post to argue points that NO ONE HAS BROUGHT UP.
A mob of around 300 men killed 11 people accused of practicing witchcraft in Kisii County, Kenya. These people were variously clubbed and stabbed to death and then burned. A quick Google search for 'witchcraft kisii' reveals that this may be ongoing and much worse than I initially thought.
And they were Jews or Christians? This kind of thing is very common in Africa, but it's mostly a culturally Islamic thing.
MountainRaven
03-24-16, 22:30
And they were Jews or Christians? This kind of thing is very common in Africa, but it's mostly a culturally Islamic thing.
Kisii County is, from what I can tell, overwhelmingly Christian. To the point where it seems that demographers are more interested in the split between Roman Catholics and Seventh Day Adventists than Christians and Muslims. It appears that victims and perpetrators are both Christian and - frequently - the victims are family members of the chief perpetrators. A DailyMail article from November 2012 reports that "over 50" people over the age of 60 had been lynched due to charges of witchcraft to that time, that year.
The agents of ISIS in Europe seem to be ratcheting up the pressure looking for a good fight.
I'm hoping they get one.
I wouldn't take issue if they went door to door and loaded cattle cars and sent several hundred thousand back to Syria and Iraq.
Beg to disagree. Load them on flat bottom LST's and drop them on the beach at the ass end of Yemen. Let Saudi Arabia, which has taken in ZERO refugees deal with them.
Quite frankly, that's also my solution for illegal Mexican immigrants in America. Drop them on the beach just North of the Guatemalan border and let Mexico figure out what to do with them. My give a shit meter has been pegged so many times, it is pretty much irreparably broken. :(
That is the biggest problem with religion man. Everybody being harsh and hateful.
It's supposed to be about love, man
I know this one half black guy with long hair and some crazy ideas, but he loved everybody. His name is Jesus and he wouldn't approve of witch trials, stonings, or hatefulness.
He'd say "Hey man, be nice to people"
And that's my Weltanschaung
When was the last time a Jewish person or Christian killed a witch? There are entire countries that practice Sharia Law TODAY and that includes witch trials.
http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2013/08/saudi-arabias-war-on-witchcraft/278701/
It would be amusing were it not true. Seriously, it's like reading the script of Borat only it is ACTUALLY happening.
Kisii County is, from what I can tell, overwhelmingly Christian. To the point where it seems that demographers are more interested in the split between Roman Catholics and Seventh Day Adventists than Christians and Muslims. It appears that victims and perpetrators are both Christian and - frequently - the victims are family members of the chief perpetrators. A DailyMail article from November 2012 reports that "over 50" people over the age of 60 had been lynched due to charges of witchcraft to that time, that year.
It's Kenya. They are tribalistic there, likely more allegiance to tribal hocus pocus than Christian theology.
Kisii County is, from what I can tell, overwhelmingly Christian. To the point where it seems that demographers are more interested in the split between Roman Catholics and Seventh Day Adventists than Christians and Muslims..
on a side note, Catholicism means Universal, Protestant came from the Latin word Protestari which means "To protest". - Difference religions, both agree that Jesus was the Messiah and Gods only son who died on the cross for our sins. But Catholics believe in a high priest (pope) to forgive sins and bless people, almost to a point where they can not go to God directly. Where protestant believes that believers have a unique personal one on one relationship with God. The Pilgrims and Quakers who colonized the new world were protestant. The Catholic church in England was corrupt and tax collections were held in church as well as elections and nobal monoarchist had positons in the church like a board of director type role. ( hence why the US has the "separation of church and state")
The first church in the US was a Baptist church (protestant) also found in new world (Caribbean)
Baptist: Means Babtize is one of the oldest churches, General baptist,1st, 2nd, southern baptist trace there roots to the church reform era during the holy roman empire.One of the earliest churches, since the beginning of the age of Church (Apostle Paul). Baptist church split up during the US Cival war and became 4 different churches. (the church was split on issues from war, slavery,) The first Baptist church in the US was founded by Roger Williams in 1639.
The Lutheran Church is based on the German, Maritn Luther's teaching and is an offbrand of Catholicism. Founed in 1505, his intent was not to start another church but to debate the roman catholic priest's motives and general lack of biblical knowledge. ( the Catholic church back then did not take the bible literally) made up there own interpretations.
Methodist is based on missionairies, John and Charles Wesley, founded in England in 1730's, they were frustrated with the catholic church and the strict rules and standards and established a new church with new ways. Doctrine included allowing women to preach, ordaining ministers without any theology background. Very politically correct, pro gay marriage, liberal and soft on abortion and Pro Slavery. Offbrand of Catholicism. A part of the Great Awakening 1790-184?
Seventh Day Adventist and Ladder Day Saints are NOT Christians! Religious Yes!! Good people Yes! But founded on completely different princables not found in the Bible, they have a different set of standards loosely based on biblical princibles.
Straight Shooter
03-24-16, 23:24
A lot of sinful, insane & murderous shit has been done in the name of Christianity. It was WRONG, and they weren't true Christians, NO WHERE did Christ command any of the crap that was done in His name. THATS the difference. Blaming true Christianity for the actions of those who aren't is just some peoples way of making themselves feel better about living in sin, unsaved. For lack of better examples..its like blaming Jack Daniel for alchoholism....S&W for murder...Viagra for rapists...and Ford for auto accidents.
Jesus Christ never commanded anyone to do violence in His name.
And as Moose Knuckle said- holding Christians of today accountable for the SINS of those a long long time ago, its just an easy out for those of you wishing to live outside of Christ, and to be able to do your own thing. Anyone who ever murdered "in the name of Christ" did it not because of Christ commands, but out of their own sin nature. SHOW ME in The New Testament where we are commanded to stone, kill, rape, beat, sodmize, commit pedoephilia, beastiality, torture, assault, and all the whole litany of shit Muslims are commanded or allowed to do for Islam. IVE READ THE KORAN, QURAN or however the hell they wish to pronounce it...it is pure evil. Influenced by Satan himself.
Those who follow..whether or not they have AS YET to act on it, are evil, sick demon worshippers. Someone in this thread said to ask a Muslim if they believe in Jihad, if they say no, they aren't part of the problem. WHAT?! REALLY? You don't know they are TOLD TO LIE by the Koran? Youd believe them just by asking them? That is ****in insanely suicidealy retarded.
Some of yall here, are something else. As noted before, I have nothing in common with many of you other than a passion for firearms, period. Keep believing there are two different kinds of Muslims, radical & peace loving. You FOOL. There are ONLY Muslims, period. May YOUR neck be the next to be hacked off..YOUR body the next to be blown to bits. Youll know then what an idiot you were.
why are new laws always been written would be my answer ?
you were wrong once again
funny you try to pull out 11 people in Africa about some people killing witches :) ahhahahahah
I am sure it happened that is a backwards country and the area is not only Christian but traditional African Religion
both BBC and CNN and other news sites said nothing about Christians doing this ? and if they could have they would have so IMHO most likely crazy people after crazy people
you can find some radical anti religion blogs blaming Christians for the witch hunts but those same blogs praise the muslims and there peacefulness
so will take the news sites and it very well could be some backwards Christians in those parts doing it ? but they are not Christians if they are doing this as its not the word of Jesus to do this unlike the word of allah is to kill !!!! so once again cough cough !!!!
but when you compare that to the millions that are killed by muslims
and the huge amount of rape to children and forced marriage of young girls not even teens yet by muslims etc..
in the conquest of india muslims murdered some 80-100 million some say way way more
muslims africa slave trade over 100 million
those are just two time periods of specific things
they are still murdering huge numbers on a daily basis
I just got back from a trip to visit my ailing grandmother in California. She is being taken care mostly by my gay, but church going, uncle. He is also a flaming liberal that thinks every dime in military spending should be used to give free college education in the U.S. My college aged daughter asked him why he'd want to defund the only thing keeping Muslims from throwing him off a roof in the near future. He responded, "why, because I'm gay?".. my daughter said.. "no, because you're Christain." We got up and left his house at that point. I am glad my daughter got to see the light because she's been trending towards the more liberal side of things lately.
He is in complete denial that the Muslim faith has no room for his kind, and is willing to believe that he faces much graver danger from U.S. citizens. Unbelievable.
He is in complete denial that the Muslim faith has no room for his kind, and is willing to believe that he faces much graver danger from U.S. citizens. Unbelievable.
Are you stupid? You know Global Warming is our worst enemy and the greatest threat to national security-right? Global Warming is what caused ISIS!!!! We MUST take action against Global Warming before it causes worldwide genocide!
Kisii County is, from what I can tell, overwhelmingly Christian. To the point where it seems that demographers are more interested in the split between Roman Catholics and Seventh Day Adventists than Christians and Muslims. It appears that victims and perpetrators are both Christian and - frequently - the victims are family members of the chief perpetrators. A DailyMail article from November 2012 reports that "over 50" people over the age of 60 had been lynched due to charges of witchcraft to that time, that year.
If any of that is true, then they are doing it wrong. They might want to read the New Testament and get current on the whole "kill witches" thing. But as somebody said, this is Kenya and I suspect this is more about tribalism and living as they did 100 years ago. That many Africans haven't joined us in the 20th century (let alone the 21rst century) is not terribly surprising.
What shocks this crap out of me is modern police forces with modern judicial systems that have tasks forces searching for those perpetration "magic crimes" the same way we hunt serial killers and then actually bringing these witches, warlocks and other demon followers to trial for sentencing. It's bizarre.
And it's not a handful of kooks out in the sticks. It's "ground zero" Islamic nations like Saudi and Iran, the literal birthplace of Sunni and Shia Islam. From top to bottom, nearly the entire populations of both countries are insane.
KalashniKEV
03-25-16, 12:18
I'm not an apologist and I'm not saying that Islam is a religion of peace, all I'm saying is that the terror attacks in Brussells and Paris didn't have anything to do with religion, it's about hate.
BINGO.
It's sad that this place has become a congregation point for switched-off-types and those who put their heads in the sand and willingly ignore the causes of the conflict of our times.
There are no "Religions of Peace" because the whole point of religion is to clump together large groups of weak minded people and move them to do your bidding- it's a lever.
If these pissed off underclass people didn't have Islam in common to unite behind, they would be ripe for the picking for any other ideological movement.
Wanna be the leader? Just pick the ideology and sell it online. You could start up a European branch of FARC if you wanted... or anything else...
In violent, backward places, people live violent, backward lives.
All that being said- Let's build a wall and put them on the other side.
wilson1911
03-25-16, 12:38
Why do you believe religion has nothing to do with it ? islam teaches it's followers to rape, rob, kill, and subjugate by any means necessary. The attacks are only 1 tool in their toolbox they use to attack the enemy....which is any nonmuslim.
Howdy,
BINGO.
It's sad that this place has become a congregation point for switched-off-types and those who put their heads in the sand and willingly ignore the causes of the conflict of our times.
There are no "Religions of Peace" because the whole point of religion is to clump together large groups of weak minded people and move them to do your bidding- it's a lever.
If these pissed off underclass people didn't have Islam in common to unite behind, they would be ripe for the picking for any other ideological movement.
Wanna be the leader? Just pick the ideology and sell it online. You could start up a European branch of FARC if you wanted... or anything else...
In violent, backward places, people live violent, backward lives.
All that being said- Let's build a wall and put them on the other side.
Heck, here in the USA We call them T-Rump supporters. Some people are easily dope, fooled and/or conned.
Lenin
Hitler
Joseph Smith
Jim Jones
David Koresh
Charles Manson
And that's to just name a few.
Also there are several Combat Veterans on this forum that risked their lives to defend this country and that did it for reasons other than religion.
I'll use the late pro football player turned Army Range Pat Tillman that left his NFL career and million dollar paycheck behind to enlist after 9-11 and he was an atheist.
Heck, he got shot in the back by a cowardly Bible thumper that didn't have the testicular fortitude to fight.
Tillman didn't enlist because of religious reasons, he did it out of hate and wanting revenge.
Paul
Howdy,
Why do you believe religion has nothing to do with it ? islam teaches it's followers to rape, rob, kill, and subjugate by any means necessary. The attacks are only 1 tool in their toolbox they use to attack the enemy....which is any nonmuslim.
Where does it say that in the Koran?
Just curious.
Paul
Dist. Expert 26
03-25-16, 13:38
Heck, here in the USA We call them T-Rump supporters. Some people are easily dope, fooled and/or conned.
So supporting Trump is tantamount to supporting Islamic jihad. That is what you're trying to say right? Islamic terrorists blowing themselves up in an airport is equivalent to voting for a political candidate you happen to disagree with?
I don't think people bomb, behead, and shoot places up because they are happy go lucky people.
Hatred is kind of implied. People are, and have been for millenia, using religion as an excuse to do mean things.
And, me personally, I think some of these religions are just made up bullshit. I don't want to harsh on others so I won't take it further but that's my deal.
A lot of these places are kinda backwards with poor literacy or poor perspective and people get brought up in this stuff from real young age.
In America, if your family were Jesus freaks...you'd eventually turn 14 and say "gee...I am sick of all these little mores and rituals"
But in these other places you can't do that. In a predominantly Islamic country, I doubt some 16 year old girl could say "Yo, Mom and Poppers...the burqa thing isn't doing it for me. I would like to wear some ripped black skinny jeans and v necks. Maybe even go Goth. Also, not heading to Mosque anymore, just gonna chill and listen to depeche mode. Maybe play some Xbox or Vine"
Lol...no.
I mean I'm not a fan of Islam, but it's not JUST Islam. Go watch Jesus Camp. It'll piss you off.
I consider myself a person of faith, but I err on the side that God in whichever form He chooses does not want people to kill or harm others.
But in a lot of places, religion gives people instant legitimacy because people are looking for a God and end up with a manipulative person who couldn't do anything else but be a preacher.
Communists hid behind Communism
Jihadis hide behind Islam.
Blah
A lot of sinful, insane & murderous shit has been done in the name of Christianity. It was WRONG, and they weren't true Christians, NO WHERE did Christ command any of the crap that was done in His name. THATS the difference. Blaming true Christianity for the actions of those who aren't is just some peoples way of making themselves feel better about living in sin, unsaved. For lack of better examples..its like blaming Jack Daniel for alchoholism....S&W for murder...Viagra for rapists...and Ford for auto accidents.
Jesus Christ never commanded anyone to do violence in His name.
And as Moose Knuckle said- holding Christians of today accountable for the SINS of those a long long time ago, its just an easy out for those of you wishing to live outside of Christ, and to be able to do your own thing. Anyone who ever murdered "in the name of Christ" did it not because of Christ commands, but out of their own sin nature. SHOW ME in The New Testament where we are commanded to stone, kill, rape, beat, sodmize, commit pedoephilia, beastiality, torture, assault, and all the whole litany of shit Muslims are commanded or allowed to do for Islam. IVE READ THE KORAN, QURAN or however the hell they wish to pronounce it...it is pure evil. Influenced by Satan himself.
Those who follow..whether or not they have AS YET to act on it, are evil, sick demon worshippers. Someone in this thread said to ask a Muslim if they believe in Jihad, if they say no, they aren't part of the problem. WHAT?! REALLY? You don't know they are TOLD TO LIE by the Koran? Youd believe them just by asking them? That is ****in insanely suicidealy retarded.
Some of yall here, are something else. As noted before, I have nothing in common with many of you other than a passion for firearms, period. Keep believing there are two different kinds of Muslims, radical & peace loving. You FOOL. There are ONLY Muslims, period. May YOUR neck be the next to be hacked off..YOUR body the next to be blown to bits. Youll know then what an idiot you were.
I have a hard time reconciling the last two paragraphs with the true nature of Christ. That, Christ, is the main reason that I am loathe to advocate the wholesale salughter or denial of rights to folks based not on their actions, but on their faith - even though it is the wrong faith.
Jews, Catholics, Mormans, Jehovah Witnesses, all believe differently than me, I say let them slide until they do something that deserves our wrath.
Does that mean that I think we should let everyone that wants to come into our country do so? Not all. Do I believe that we should allow the Muslims, or any faith, that locates in the U.S. impose their beliefs on us in terms of Sharia Law, etc.? Not all.
wilson1911
03-25-16, 13:54
islam is not just the koran. The sira and hadith are more important imho. A good muslim is one that behaves as mohamed did. I do find it odd that so many want to talk about the koran, but not the other two books.
I don't know everything, but I am reading dr bill warners books on islam.
In american christian terms we have WWJD, in islam they have WWMD.
Howdy DE26,
So supporting Trump is tantamount to supporting Islamic jihad. That is what you're trying to say right? Islamic terrorists blowing themselves up in an airport is equivalent to voting for a political candidate you happen to disagree with?
It doesn't have anything to do with religion. It has to do with being angry and wanting to blame someone else for your failures.
All the people I listed were able to convince ( hence the name CON or con artist) people into doing things that was NOT in their best interest.
The ultra right wing nutjob Jim Jones talked over 600 adults into drinking cyanide laced flavr-rite grape drink mix, giving it to their kids and killing a US Congressman.
Charles Manson talked people into killing for him out of hate.
Hate and fear are the two most powerful emotions known to Mankind.
T-Rump has motivated his followers out of hate and fear. Heck, he has convinced some of his followers to violently attack their fellow Americans out of hate and fear.
Paul
Paul
Dist. Expert 26
03-25-16, 14:07
Howdy DE26,
It doesn't have anything to do with religion. It has to do with being angry and wanting to blame someone else for your failures.
All the people I listed were able to convince ( hence the name CON or con artist) people into doing things that was NOT in their best interest.
The ultra right wing nutjob Jim Jones talked over 600 adults into drinking cyanide laced flavr-rite grape drink mix, giving it to their kids and killing a US Congressman.
Charles Manson talked people into killing for him out of hate.
Hate and fear are the two most powerful emotions known to Mankind.
T-Rump has motivated his followers out of hate and fear. Heck, he has convinced some of his followers to violently attack their fellow Americans out of hate and fear.
Paul
Paul
Not to get too far off topic here, but the attacks I've seen on the news have been primarily carried out by those on the left wing.
That being said, these terrorists are not "blaming others for their failures". They consider themselves to be soldiers in a holy war, and they die in the name of their God. Yes, they are full of hate. But that hate stems from their religion. That fact is inescapable.
islam is not just the koran. The sira and hadith are more important imho. A good muslim is one that behaves as mohamed did. I do find it odd that so many want to talk about the koran, but not the other two books.
I don't know everything, but I am reading dr bill warners books on islam.
In american christian terms we have WWJD, in islam they have WWMD.
You can't be serious. You do know how Mohammed behaved, don't you? Unless you're saying that acting like he did makes them a model Muslim, as opposed to what we would describe as a "good" (as we understand the word "good") Muslim.
"Good" being kind, virtuous, etc.
Throughout human history religion has been used to justify doing nasty things to other people. The crusades, the inquisition, witch trials.... you name it, we've probably done it. The mainstream western religions (Christianity, Judaism...) to this day still preach that their version of God is the true one and all those other belief systems will land their followers in Hell vs Heaven. However, over the past thousand years or so they have tempered their approach from convert by any means necessary into the screw them if they want t go to hell let them approach. Islam, especially as taught and embraced by the Stone Age kingdoms of the Middle East has not. I'm willing to believe that Islam as practiced by folks in the first world is different than what is done by the Stone Age crowd. However, we (western civilization) continue to allow the Stone Age crowd to multiply and expand into other areas. It is ludicrous to believe that as these backwards folks expand into other regions in large numbers that they wont bring their beliefs with them and just as importantly they won't spread their belief among the locals. Some locals may laugh others as we have seen may choose to embrace. Not a good thing.
Claiming that Islam isn't a problem is disingenuous, just as claiming that Islam is the only problem. The version of Islam being allowed to spread and thrive is a problem simply because it's still on the same level of mental capacity as Inquisition Catholicism.
Stop trying to make up feel good excuses. Identify the problem and eliminate it. It's not hard if you want to do it. We just don't have the balls for it.
I don't think people bomb, behead, and shoot places up because they are happy go lucky people.
Hatred is kind of implied. People are, and have been for millenia, using religion as an excuse to do mean things.
And, me personally, I think some of these religions are just made up bullshit. I don't want to harsh on others so I won't take it further but that's my deal.
A lot of these places are kinda backwards with poor literacy or poor perspective and people get brought up in this stuff from real young age.
In America, if your family were Jesus freaks...you'd eventually turn 14 and say "gee...I am sick of all these little mores and rituals"
But in these other places you can't do that. In a predominantly Islamic country, I doubt some 16 year old girl could say "Yo, Mom and Poppers...the burqa thing isn't doing it for me. I would like to wear some ripped black skinny jeans and v necks. Maybe even go Goth. Also, not heading to Mosque anymore, just gonna chill and listen to depeche mode. Maybe play some Xbox or Vine"
Lol...no.
I mean I'm not a fan of Islam, but it's not JUST Islam. Go watch Jesus Camp. It'll piss you off.
I consider myself a person of faith, but I err on the side that God in whichever form He chooses does not want people to kill or harm others.
But in a lot of places, religion gives people instant legitimacy because people are looking for a God and end up with a manipulative person who couldn't do anything else but be a preacher.
Communists hid behind Communism
Jihadis hide behind Islam.
Blah
I agree
A lot of the hate and restlessness comes from a life of uncertainty and centuries of false teachings. Over there, religion and politics are one in the same. Centuries of corrupt religious leaders, sharia law, tyrannical dictatorships, frontier justice system, strict rules for women and almost unachievable standards for men. Centuries of genocide and wide spread killings. Famine and drought on a biblical scale. The only way for those Kings, Dictators, Shah and Ayatollah's to stay in power is to convince there people the problem comes from somewhere else. Most point towards the west, most point towards Israel. When Iraq, Libya, Syria collapsed it brought more uncertainty and fear that the west was going to have a much bigger influence in the Middle East. The Quran is anything but consistent, it is a book written by Muhammad out of his own frustration, anxiety, anger and rage. No where does it speak about peace, compassion, forgiveness, love, kindness, patience (everything Jesus IS). Christians are called to lead and promote peace (that's why Jesus is the Prince of Peace). We are called to HATE SIN but LOVE the sinner as he has for us. Im sure when the new world was discovered and colonized by the puritans, they burned accused witches at the stake. I don't agree with the punishment, but they were escaping persecution and wanted a new world dedicated to serving God, if anyone got in there way, they burned them. The US was extremely religious in its early days. Men who feared God and worshiped him publically. Harvard, Yale, William & Marry, Princeton, Columbia and Brown were all affiliated with the Church of England and the foundation of those universities was biblical, now days they are so liberal, they cannot mention the word GOD. Gods word is truth, and has stood the test of time. God doesn't change his mind, nor does he add or omit his word. A lot of people refuse God because God doesn't like hypocrites, abortion, false idols, money, liars, homosexuality, thief's and people who cheat on there wife. I don't blame him. Many other can understand how so many people are starving around the world and dying everyday, natural disasters, famine, disease and if there was a God, why would he allow this to happen. They don't understand, that is how God, gets peoples attention.
There is only ONE GOD who had ONE son, and his only son died for our sins because the wages of sin is death. It was either pay the price for our sins so we could have a eternal relationship with our creator or be thrown into hell.
ForTehNguyen
03-25-16, 14:32
FYI the crusades were a retaliation for four centuries worth of invasion attempts by you guessed it, Muslims. Islam hasnt gone through their version of a Reformation to purge the violent sects from it. They are still in the middle ages
Howdy DE26,
Not to get too far off topic here, but the attacks I've seen on the news have been primarily carried out by those on the left wing.
That being said, these terrorists are not "blaming others for their failures". They consider themselves to be soldiers in a holy war, and they die in the name of their God. Yes, they are full of hate. But that hate stems from their religion. That fact is inescapable.
So, you're saying that the terror attacks in Europe that have been carried out by "religious terrorist" are liberals?
That's the funniest and kookiest thing I've heard in a long time.
Paul
Dist. Expert 26
03-25-16, 14:44
Howdy DE26,
So, you're saying that the terror attacks in Europe that have been carried out by "religious terrorist" are liberals?
That's the funniest and kookiest thing I've heard in a long time.
Paul
Go back and read your previous post. You insinuated that Trump is inspiring people to attack people who disagree with them. I pointed out that it is in fact those on the left carrying out these attacks. There's a reason I separated my paragraphs.
Howdy wilson1911,
islam is not just the koran. The sira and hadith are more important imho. A good muslim is one that behaves as mohamed did. I do find it odd that so many want to talk about the koran, but not the other two books.
I don't know everything, but I am reading dr bill warners books on islam.
In american christian terms we have WWJD, in islam they have WWMD.
Now I see the problem.
You are reading books written by a non-Muslim that tries to explain to you what devout Muslims believe and feel.
Okey dokey.
Paul
Howdy,
Where does it say that in the Koran?
Just curious.
Paul
here is your answer:
http://www.answering-islam.org/Authors/Arlandson/women_slaves.htm
wilson1911
03-25-16, 14:57
by "good" I mean act and do as mohammed did. I said that looking thru a muslims brain, not a nonmuslim. To be a good muslim, do and act as mohammed did. Is he not the prophet on allah ?
I think we can all agree mohammed smoked too much opium/hash or whatever. No sane man would do the things he did.
Howdy wilson1911,
Now I see the problem.
You are reading books written by a non-Muslim that tries to explain to you what devout Muslims believe and feel.
Okey dokey.
Paul
Look at it this way: If a dog is about to bite me, I don't care how it was brought up, if it was beaten every day, starved, or whatever. All that matters is that I'm about to be attacked. Therefore I will do what is necessary---up to and including killing it---to protect myself or my loved ones.
Likewise I don't really give a damn about the shitholes in the ME and how the young 'uns are raised, how crappy their lives are, how bleak the outlook, or what they have latched onto as their "salvation". All that concerns me is that the threat needs to be eliminated. Are all Muslims terrorists? No, of course not. But are all terrorists Muslims? Yep. [I'm talking about the here and now, 2001-2016, not the IRA of the 70's or the Tamils of yesteryear]
by "good" I mean act and do as mohammed did. I said that looking thru a muslims brain, not a nonmuslim. To be a good muslim, do and act as mohammed did. Is he not the prophet on allah ?
I think we can all agree mohammed smoked too much opium/hash or whatever. No sane man would do the things he did.
Probably didn't smoke enough! The shit he did sounds more like he was tripping on LSD or snorting coke.
Howdy DE26,
So, you're saying that the terror attacks in Europe that have been carried out by "religious terrorist" are liberals?
That's the funniest and kookiest thing I've heard in a long time.
Paul
Liberals, not to be confuse with the American liberals -as in far left democrats. But liberals as in ideology, extremism, progressive, imposing there will on others to follow. Mass beheadings for not converting to Islam, Death to those not following sharia law. 9/11, USS COLE, Madrid, England bus bombing, Paris bombing, Kenya embassy, Libya, Brussels, San Bernardino and Tanzania embassy were all carried out by Islamic militant fighters who profess their lives and sacrifice to the Prophet Mohammad. They are strapping explosives on there body and giving thanks to (Allahu Akbar) before they take there own life and the lives of many others. RELIGIOUS TERRORIST = LIBERALS
wilson1911
03-25-16, 15:10
Since we are letting muslims into the usa, how is the govt screening the ones who "may come out of the closet" ???????
Since we are letting muslims into the usa, how is the govt screening the ones who "may come out of the closet" ???????
Quite frankly it's almost impossible to see into someone's mind/heart. If it's just questions they could lie like a rug. Background check? Seriously? It ain't like their emigrating from Europe or some other First World country where there is some semblance of information technology to show a snapshot of their background. Hell, even here some perps (think McVeigh) have no background smudges that would attract attention. Oh yeah, we're going to successfully vet someone coming from Syria. Riiiiight.
It is 100% about their religion. To deny it is denying facts. It has been their sole motivation from the time of Muhammad.
It isn't just the Koran. As said before, it's in the other texts. Creating a 100% Muslim world by means of violence and intimidation has been the way since Islam began.
islam is not just the koran. The sira and hadith are more important imho. A good muslim is one that behaves as mohamed did. I do find it odd that so many want to talk about the koran, but not the other two books.
I don't know everything, but I am reading dr bill warners books on islam.
In american christian terms we have WWJD, in islam they have WWMD.
Have you read Milestones by Sayyidd Qutb?
http://majalla.org/books/2005/qutb-nilestone.pdf
Mohammed was a boy poker and killed many many people.
Not a person to look up for inspiration.
Peace....
yeah right.
Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk
since islam is based on you do this or that and you will go to heaven with virgins waiting one of those things is jihad or killing infidels no hate needed just the fact you want to get to heaven now and this is a easy way to do it !!!
someone can claim hate all they want but its not the only thing that can make them do this !
since islam teaches hate you can bring normal people into the fold and then tell them this is good to kill infidels so they think they are doing good !
making them hate is easy and they will learn to hate because of islam ! so that is the cause and the trigger and the reason to do this stuff
FromMyColdDeadHand
03-26-16, 00:15
Can I ask a basic, stupid question. What do they expect to accomplish by lighting themselves off and killing civilians?
It isn't a very good advertisement for the faith- join us and the best thing you can do is martyr yourself. I understand it is a kind of way to propagate the direction of the cause, but it really doesn't lead to mass voluntary conversions.
They are terrorist attacks, which by definition are not actual direct threats to the state or people on the whole. So are we supposed to convert? Let more of them in?
I've never understood the end game of these random attacks on fixed- but random effect targets. Random versus targeted attacks like light of car bombs at seats of power, law enforcement, even symbols of repression to try to divide the power from the people and intimidate the leaders. Kill a bunch of people at the airport? You think the EU PMs really see that as an existential threat? Whack enough civilians and the people will clamor for retribution and clamping down. If they had tripped a dirty bomb, or made a bunch of Dutch tulips glow next door- what effect do they think this would have in any kind of positive impact on their cause. Someone needs to sit these idiots down and read them the story of Carthage.
Is there some spiritual or salvation aspect here that would appeal to the masses (not the ones that seek martyrdom) that I am missing?
Is it just nihilism, wrapped in mysticism, amplified and distorted by modern media? Longing for the end times? Get the message, they are tomorrow. They are always tomorrow.
FromMyColdDeadHand
03-26-16, 01:11
Have you read Milestones by Sayyidd Qutb?
http://majalla.org/books/2005/qutb-nilestone.pdf
Just for reference, who is the writer and what is his position?
So, breezing through this.
It is not the intention of Islam to force its beliefs on people, but Islam is not
merely 'belief'. As we have pointed out, Islam is a declaration of the freedom of
man from servitude to other men. Thus it strives from the beginning to abolish all
those systems and governments which are based on the rule of man over men and
the servitude of one human being to another. When Islam releases people from this
political pressure and presents to them its spiritual message, appealing to their
reason, it gives them complete freedom to accept or not to accept its beliefs.
However, this freedom does not mean that they can make their desires their gods,
or that they can choose to remain in the servitude of other human beings, making
some men lords over others. Whatever system is to be established in the world
ought to be on the authority of God, deriving its laws from Him alone. Then every
individual is free, under the protection of this universal system, to adopt any
belief he wishes to adopt. This is the only way in which 'the religion' can be
purified for God alone. The word 'religion' includes more than belief; 'religion'
actually means a way of life, and in Islam this is based on belief. But in an Islamic
system there is room for all kinds of people to follow their own beliefs, while
obeying the laws of the country which are themselves based on the divine
authority.
So, basically, Islam is incompatible with Western Democracy. Islam isn't a religion, it is THE way to organize society. A complete 180 from the trend of the past few centuries in the West- but oddly in line with the Progressive attempt to kill religion (at least Christianity) and replace it with collectivist, egalitarian and free (I am chuckling as a type the last two) new system of organization. Oddly, which seems in line with the concept of Islam- in line but 180 degrees pointed in the opposite direction.
Can I ask a basic, stupid question. What do they expect to accomplish by lighting themselves off and killing civilians?
It isn't a very good advertisement for the faith- join us and the best thing you can do is martyr yourself. I understand it is a kind of way to propagate the direction of the cause, but it really doesn't lead to mass voluntary conversions.
They are terrorist attacks, which by definition are not actual direct threats to the state or people on the whole. So are we supposed to convert? Let more of them in?
I've never understood the end game of these random attacks on fixed- but random effect targets. Random versus targeted attacks like light of car bombs at seats of power, law enforcement, even symbols of repression to try to divide the power from the people and intimidate the leaders. Kill a bunch of people at the airport? You think the EU PMs really see that as an existential threat? Whack enough civilians and the people will clamor for retribution and clamping down. If they had tripped a dirty bomb, or made a bunch of Dutch tulips glow next door- what effect do they think this would have in any kind of positive impact on their cause. Someone needs to sit these idiots down and read them the story of Carthage.
Is there some spiritual or salvation aspect here that would appeal to the masses (not the ones that seek martyrdom) that I am missing?
Is it just nihilism, wrapped in mysticism, amplified and distorted by modern media? Longing for the end times? Get the message, they are tomorrow. They are always tomorrow.
Go back to Abraham, God promised Abraham a son. Abraham was old and so was his wife. Abrahams wife didn't think she could have kids because of her age, so she insisted that Abraham sleep with the maid. He did, she got pregnant and had a son. They named him Ishmael. 14 years later, Abrahams wife got pregnant with the promised son. They named him Isaac. Isaac is the promised son. Ishmael and his mother were later forced out into the wilderness.
As told by God himself, his son, born of a virgin would come from the blood line of David. David comes from the blood line of Jacob, who comes from the blood line of Isaac who is Abrahams promised son. Remember this (father Abraham, had many sons, many sons had father Abraham).
Muslims believe Jesus existed but not as the Messiah or the son of God, they think of him as a good person and spiritual man that was a prophet equal to Moses, Abraham and Muhammad. Since Jesus came from the blood line of Isaac, the Muslims insist that Ishmael was the promised son since he did come from Abraham. Now this causes a HUGE problem. One it denies Jesus the Lord and Savior, the promised king and the Son of God. If the Muslims do not believe that Jesus was the Messiah and came to earth to die for our sins and be resurrected 3 days later, then they need another way to get to heaven, because Jesus said, I am the way the truth and the light, NO ONE comes to the father excepted through ME. - meaning you had to except Jesus as the Lord and Savior, the Messiah and the one who laid his life on that cross for our sins.
So, if they do not believe that, then they have to have another way to heaven. Since Islam is based on the teachings of a false prophet, who denied Jesus, he had to insure that his followers had a way into heaven. Since most of Jesus disciples died the very same way Jesus dies later on in life, Muhammed suggested that being a martyr is the way to heaven. Not the only way but a for sure way. But if you did martyr yourself, you would be rewarded in heaven with riches and virgins rather than just be in heaven.
If you read the first few books of the old testament, God literally told Abraham that having 2 sons would cause big problems later on down the road.
The problem with Islam is that it is a lie. That is how Satin works. He is the master of deceit, comes as the angel of light, he takes a little bit of Gods word and twist it around to confuse you, that way, you think your doing the right thing. Kind of like Eve in the garden of Eden, God said: DO NOT Eat of the fruit from the tree of knowledge for you will certainly die. But Satin said, but you wont surely die, because your eyes will be open and you will be like God. Eve desired wisdom and ate of the fruit. Then both Adam and Eves eyes were open and they realized they were naked, they became ashamed. They ran and hid.
When people don't like what the bible has to say, they alter the word of God to fit there lifestyles. A lot of Methodist Churches don't discuss abortion or homosexuality because they are cool with it. And if you have a large enough following, eventually they want everyone to conform to there believes so they feel better about what they do. They impose there will on you and make you feel ashamed by saying things like, God loves everyone, yet you hate gays and that is how Satin works, by using Gods word against us.
When Jesus wondered through the desert for 40 days and nights, he was tempted by Satin. They could have duked it out with guided missiles, stones, fire but no!, They use the most powerful weapon ever created, Gods Word. Satin Challenged Jesus by reciting scripture and Jesus defended himself the same way, eventually Jesus rebuked Satin using nothing other than Gods Word.
I promise everyone of you, if you read, just a few paragraphs of the bible every day, you will become more and more knowledgeable and you will start to see why there are a lot of problems in the world. The things that are happening today were happening before Noah's flood. Its nothing new.
The reason for Muslims killing innocent people: well, they don't think of them as innocent. In Islam, you either believe in the teaching of the false Prophet Muhammad or you are an infidel. Muhammad himself said to kill all infidels. The reason for killing infidels is because there religion is based on the entire world following the same islamic standards. Without that, they cannot have peace, which is what they claim they want.
What you see today is NOT workplace violence or random acts of violence, what you see regardless of what Obama says is Muslims jihadist on a spiritual quest to earn brownie point with Allah. Kind of "taking one for the team" mentality.
Moose-Knuckle
03-26-16, 01:56
Since we are letting muslims into the usa, how is the govt screening the ones who "may come out of the closet" ???????
"If I was in charge of ISIL, logistically I'd take advantage of this situation and put my people in, into the United States," Bernazzani said. "Now with that said, the FBI is on top of this big time with our Joint Terrorism Task Force and we have what's called a Terrorist Screening Center that these individuals will be run through."
But make no mistake, not every refugee seeking admission to the U.S. would face such scrutiny.
"It's going to be the 18- to 45-year-old male for the most part," he said. "It's a percentage game. It's not fail-safe, but it's a percentage game."
http://www.fox8live.com/story/30428985/syrian-refugees-beginning-to-arrive-in-new-orleans
Bad Mojo:
A security officer at a nuclear site was killed in the Belgian city of Charleroi two days after the terror attacks in Brussels, local newspaper Derniere Heure reported, citing police sources. The paper added that the man’s security pass was stolen.
Charleroi is located 50 km from the Belgian capital.
The guard, identified as Didier Prospero, was walking his dog when he was shot dead in the early evening on Thursday, the paper said.
His security pass was stolen, which alerted the investigators since the man was a member of a nuclear power plant staff.
The prosecutors later told DH that no links to terrorism had been discovered in the murder of the security officer.
https://www.rt.com/news/337276-belgium-nuclear-guard-killed/
FromMyColdDeadHand
03-26-16, 08:28
Bad Mojo:
A security officer at a nuclear site was killed in the Belgian city of Charleroi two days after the terror attacks in Brussels, local newspaper Derniere Heure reported, citing police sources. The paper added that the man’s security pass was stolen.
Charleroi is located 50 km from the Belgian capital.
The guard, identified as Didier Prospero, was walking his dog when he was shot dead in the early evening on Thursday, the paper said.
His security pass was stolen, which alerted the investigators since the man was a member of a nuclear power plant staff.
The prosecutors later told DH that no links to terrorism had been discovered in the murder of the security officer.
https://www.rt.com/news/337276-belgium-nuclear-guard-killed/
How many people are shot walking their dog in Belgium every year?
His security pass was stolen, which alerted the investigators since the man was a member of a nuclear power plant staff.
Papers to a nuclear power plant have been stolen... Oh dandy.
The prosecutors later told DH that no links to terrorism had been discovered in the murder of the security officer.
Of course not.
How many people are shot walking their dog in Belgium every year?
Come now, we've already been told by the media that Belgium is the hub of the European arms trade. I'm sure this happens every hour on the hour. Nothing to see here.
BINGO.
It's sad that this place has become a congregation point for switched-off-types and those who put their heads in the sand and willingly ignore the causes of the conflict of our times.
There are no "Religions of Peace" because the whole point of religion is to clump together large groups of weak minded people and move them to do your bidding- it's a lever.
If these pissed off underclass people didn't have Islam in common to unite behind, they would be ripe for the picking for any other ideological movement.
Wanna be the leader? Just pick the ideology and sell it online. You could start up a European branch of FARC if you wanted... or anything else...
In violent, backward places, people live violent, backward lives.
All that being said- Let's build a wall and put them on the other side.
If I'm to believe you and Stengun, Islam is not the problem, the hate of the people practicing it is? If so, I must assume that when we retaliate against the hateful practitioners, the worldwide Muslim community will not object, because we're not attacking Islam or true Muslims? Therefore everyone worldwide that isn't a terrorist must agree that this isn't a religious war. I'm glad that was so easily solved! Why haven't our world leaders solved it yet? You and Stengun should be on the National Security Council! :rolleyes:
Sorry guys, but in order for your theory to hold water, it has to be agreed upon by the Muslim community at large. It's not. Just as Sunni and Shia do not agree who the real successor to Mohammed's legacy is, they do not agree that western civilization has abandoned the Crusades. We can say "Islam is a religion of peace" or "no religion is a religion of peace or war" all we want. That doesn't make it true. :(
Just for reference, who is the writer and what is his position?
Qutb, I found after reading Milestones, lived in the first half of the 20th Century. He was a religious scholar and the 'invisible brain' behind the Muslim Brotherhood. He studied in America and found American Society to be decadent, thus his hard-on for the West. He was a follower of Muhammad ibn Abd al Wahhab** who espoused that Muslims who weren't 100% devout, were not Muslims, they were apostates masquerading as Muslims.
Shortly after 9/11 I attended the first of several training classes on terrorism, the presenter recommended we all read Milestones, aka Signs along the Path, especially Chapter 3, as it was the playbook for the Wahhabists.
**I had to look him up, I read Milestones, part of the Koran, and formulated the basic ideas that guide me in my thoughts on Muslims to this day. I have not serve in the region, so do not pretend to know more than someone who has, and I'm not much interested in spending more time learning about a flawed religion.
The problem with Islam is that it is a lie. That is how Satin works. He is the master of deceit, comes as the angel of light, he takes a little bit of Gods word and twist it around to confuse you, that way, you think your doing the right thing.
When people don't like what the bible has to say, they alter the word of God to fit there lifestyles. A lot of Methodist Churches don't discuss abortion or homosexuality because they are cool with it. And if you have a large enough following, eventually they want everyone to conform to there believes so they feel better about what they do. They impose there will on you and make you feel ashamed by saying things like, God loves everyone, yet you hate gays and that is how Satin works, by using Gods word against us.
I promise everyone of you, if you read, just a few paragraphs of the bible every day, you will become more and more knowledgeable and you will start to see why there are a lot of problems in the world. The things that are happening today were happening before Noah's flood. Its nothing new.
Elephant, your views are your views, I agree with some, like the last three paragraphs. I'm kind of a Mennonite, started out as a Methodist, changed denominations in my mid-30's, and have since learned more about the Bible than I ever thought I would.
What I know is this: the most powerful weapon Satan has is hate and fear. I also know the Bible is a love story, the story of God and his wayward people whom God love's so much that he sent his son to redeem them. Show me an episode in the Bible where Jesus hated, please.
(Mark 12:28-34) 28 One of the teachers of the law came and heard them debating. Noticing that Jesus had given them a good answer, he asked him, “Of all the commandments, which is the most important?” 29 “The most important one,” answered Jesus, “is this: ‘Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one.[a] 30 Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.’[b] 31 The second is this: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’[c] There is no commandment greater than these.”
Jesus said: (Luke 23:34) Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do.
Jesus said: (Matthew 28) 18 Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”
Christianity isn't an exclusionary club, Churches are hospitals for sinners. The only perfect person was Jesus. Let God and Jesus judge. Those who are homosexuals need Jesus' love and acceptance to recover from their sin, they need to be drawn closer, not pushed away. The same thing with a woman who has had an abortion.
I mentioned I'm sort of a Mennonite - the Mennonites are a Peace Church, I'm not all the way there. Shortly after I started attending my current Church, I asked one of the Elders, 'Why did you guys change? When I first moved here the women all wore bonnets and dresses, the men dressed conservatively, and families drove Buick 225's with blackwalls, no radio and no a/c. What changed?' The Elder replied 'Would you be here if we hadn't?'
For the Church and Christians to carry out the Great Commission they need to be approachable, even to sinners.
I rarely exemplify this, but I have it on my wall as a reminder: 'Preach the Gospel, and if necessary, use words.'
FromMyColdDeadHand
03-26-16, 10:53
The problem with Islam is that it is a lie. That is how Satin works.
Satin, Egg-shell and the High Gloss versus the Son, the Father and the Holy Ghost?
Satan is somewhere thinking "Say my name!!".
KalashniKEV
03-26-16, 11:58
Sorry guys, but in order for your theory to hold water, it has to be agreed upon by the Muslim community at large. It's not.
Good luck getting "the community at large" to agree on anything.
As gun owners, we all support universal background checks, right?
If you don't, then clearly you are on the side of the spree killers and should be captured, tried, and punished accordingly.
Same for gun owners who refuse to apologize for spree killings.
Have you publicly said "Sorry" for Columbine yet?
See how that works?
Nonsense arguments like these only work if you can turn your brain off and start making broad, incorrect assumptions about large, disparate groups.
We can say "Islam is a religion of peace" or "no religion is a religion of peace or war" all we want. That doesn't make it true. :(
No religion is a "religion of peace" because the whole concept of faith and salvation is designed to be exploited to move people to do your bidding.
It's not been very long that death squads were getting sprinkled with holy water before committing genocide in the Balkans... I watched it on TV. A little further back, a different religious sect robbed, killed, and pillaged their way to statehood in the middle east. This month, somewhere in the world, a Coptic or a Chaldean Christian woman will be stoned to death over something stupid... and tonight my GF will go to work with a Christ-worshiping African nurse who confided in her that her clitty button got chopped off when she was a little girl.
The world is a rough place- and people living in desperate, hopeless circumstances live backward and violent lives. It doesn't matter which imaginary friend they talk to.
All that being said- I hope the majority of you guys never stray too far from Starbucks, and that your sheltered views on the topic become irrelevant in time, as we defeat our enemies and return to living in peace.
Religion of peace. (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/12204357/Muslim-shopkeeper-murdered-in-suspected-religiously-prejudiced-attack-after-posting-on-Facebook-of-love-for-Christians.html)
A popular shopkeeper was stabbed to death by another Muslim in a "religiously prejudiced" attack hours after posting an Easter message on Facebook to "my beloved Christian nation".
Asad Shah, 40, a devout Muslim originally from the Pakistani city of Rabwah, had his head stamped on during a savage attack, according to one eyewitness.
Around four hours earlier the victim wrote online: "Good Friday and a very Happy Easter, especially to my beloved Christian nation.
"Let's follow the real footstep of beloved holy Jesus Christ and get the real success in both worlds."...
All that being said- I hope the majority of you guys never stray too far from Starbucks, and that your sheltered views on the topic become irrelevant in time, as we defeat our enemies and return to living in peace.
So who then is "our" enemies? Muslims? "radical" Muslims? Some religions are inherently more peaceful than others by their base teachings, but you can take and twist any religion and other ideology to get people to justify their behavior to anything or anyone not in their tribe. Living in peace has never existed in human history and we are living in perhaps the most peaceful time in our history on this planet. I'm not religious and will not get into that aspect of it as it serves no real purpose. Anyone, of any religion, who used that religion as their excuse and justification to slaughter, torture, and in other deny Basic Human Right en mass, is no friend of mine and no friend to humanity, much less Liberty and Freedom. Personally, I think the founders of the US were aware of that reality, but that's another discussion. As the man said:
“There are plenty of good reasons for fighting,' I said, 'but no good reason ever to hate without reservation, to imagine that God Almighty Himself hates with you, too. Where's evil? It's that large part of every man that wants to hate without limit, that wants to hate with God on its side. It's that part of every man that finds all kinds of ugliness so attractive.” - Kurt Vonnegut
March against fear cancelled due to... fear:
Brussels 'march against fear' cancelled amid security concerns
A solidarity march through the streets of Brussels in honour of those killed in the city's terror attacks this week has been cancelled amid continued heightened security concerns.
Organisers cancelled the event following a public plea from Belgium's Interior minister Jan Jambon asking for the demonstration to be postponed while ongoing police investigations continued.
Jambon said: "We are still all over the country in threat level three and there are enquiries, important enquiries, going on.
"For these enquiries we need a lot of police capacity all over the country and it's our main priority to let the police in the best circumstances possible do these enquiries - that's the reason why we invite the citizens tomorrow not to demonstrate."
http://www.itv.com/news/update/2016-03-26/brussels-march-against-fear-cancelled-amid-security-concerns/
Amp Mangum
03-26-16, 18:05
TEL AVIV – The deadly terrorist attacks in Brussels last week and in Paris last November are dress rehearsals for a coming “big” attack inside the United States, a leading Islamic State-allied militant claimed in an exclusive interview.
http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2016/03/26/exclusive-top-jihadist-brussels-paris-are-rehearsals-for-big-attack-inside-u-s/
very hard to stop these things ?
Trump gets elected and slows down incoming muslims sadly most of the bad ones are hear already ?
the outcry of slowing down the massive import of them he cant crack down on the ones hear as hard ?
massive attack happens and you hear the see this did nothing to stop them !!!!!
the left of course will say its because we shut them down coming in ? which by our logic is OK proof they are bad does not matter who is in office !!!!
or like Reagan might have done take that as a threat and turn the areas these scum are to sheets of glass !!!!!
so what happens ?
go back to WWII and declare war on any and all countries that have any ties with terrorists and do it WWII style to win gloves off total annihilation but this time make them pay for OUR clean up and what it costs us by taking over there oil fields until we are reimbursed for expenses and loss of life and hold those fields for say the next 100 years !
that would be my vote :)
IMHO if they are going to do a massive attack maybe they do it when obama is in office would help conservative get elected ?
but if it happens after one wins if they win then what ? does make me wonder cause again stupid left logic is because a conservative is in office not because these are bad people ?
do the terrorists think like this ? keep making huge attacks when conservatives are in office since they might think liberals will hand over there country easier ?
if hillary wins and a massive attack happens will that push most America into the breaking point of the left ? again it wont matter as they will do what they want but its how hillary reacts of course that will matter
I know my mind is always racing with scenarios :)
ForTehNguyen
03-26-16, 20:37
PC politicians like to conjure numbers like 99.9% of muslims arent radical etc. Pew Research did a study of 39 muslim majority countries and the AVERAGE figure for muslims that believe Apostates should be killed is 27%. What is 27% of 1.6 billion worshipers. That was an average, it was as high as 76% in countries like Egypt. 39% of those countries surveyed believed honor killings are justifiable. What is 39% of 1.6 billion? When western muslims age 18-29 surveyed if suicide bombings were justified: 42% French Muslims, 35% British Muslims, and 26% American Muslims agreed. 53% of those surveyed wanted Sharia Law to be the law of the land. 51% believe in stonings. These beliefs are completely outlandish and barbaric in Western culture yet we are told radicals are a tiny slice of the whole pie.
Is it a radical belief when you have these percentages that result in 100s of millions of people having these beliefs? These numbers are a lot more than .1% PC politicans like you to believe.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSPvnFDDQHk
Good luck getting "the community at large" to agree on anything.
As gun owners, we all support universal background checks, right?
If you don't, then clearly you are on the side of the spree killers and should be captured, tried, and punished accordingly.
Same for gun owners who refuse to apologize for spree killings.
Have you publicly said "Sorry" for Columbine yet?
See how that works?
It doesn't work.
Buying a gun doesn't make you believe anything. Diane Feinstein owns a gun and a carry permit.
But CHOOSING to belong to a hateful ideology like Islam, the KKK, Black Israelites, etc. is having something in common and being collectively responsible for beliefs, actions, etc.
If you are in the KKK and never hurt anyone, you still support the same hatred.
See how that works?
See how that works?
Very well put sir...
Averageman
03-27-16, 08:33
But CHOOSING to belong to a hateful ideology like Islam, the KKK, Black Israelites, etc. is having something in common and being collectively responsible for beliefs, actions, etc.
If you are in the KKK and never hurt anyone, you still support the same hatred.
See how that works?
And here is how the West fails.
We have taken these groups and placed them all in the same group. The KKK, Black Israelite's etc. are a domestic threat, the are more easily dealt with by using our Legal System within our respective Countries. Even if you take the bold step and call these groups "Domestic Terrorists" you still have them contained for the most part and they can be easily prosecuted for their crimes.
Islam, or Radical Islam if you prefer does not commit the same types of "crime". Taking these guys to a conventional courtroom and giving them conventional sentences is counter productive to prosecuting a war.
If we do not come to an understanding that Terrorism is a War Crime, rather than a conventional courtroom these guys need to be given a Military Tribunal when appropriate and be under the same sort of rules that we used on WWII era Fascists who committed War Crimes.
We turned Saddam Hussain over to the new government within Iraq, within months he was executed, Death by Hanging. See how swiftly that works and how justice is done?
Until we turn these Terrorists we capture over to a justice system more able to prosecute and execute a sentence we are merely spinning our wheels.
I think what we might have now as opposed to during any other time in history is a general fear of actually turning to the Military to provide sound swift and final judgement against a group of International Terrorists. I'm not sure why, but I have some thoughts.
Good luck getting "the community at large" to agree on anything.
As gun owners, we all support universal background checks, right?
If you don't, then clearly you are on the side of the spree killers and should be captured, tried, and punished accordingly.
Same for gun owners who refuse to apologize for spree killings.
Have you publicly said "Sorry" for Columbine yet?
See how that works?
Nonsense arguments like these only work if you can turn your brain off and start making broad, incorrect assumptions about large, disparate groups.
No religion is a "religion of peace" because the whole concept of faith and salvation is designed to be exploited to move people to do your bidding.
It's not been very long that death squads were getting sprinkled with holy water before committing genocide in the Balkans... I watched it on TV. A little further back, a different religious sect robbed, killed, and pillaged their way to statehood in the middle east. This month, somewhere in the world, a Coptic or a Chaldean Christian woman will be stoned to death over something stupid... and tonight my GF will go to work with a Christ-worshiping African nurse who confided in her that her clitty button got chopped off when she was a little girl.
The world is a rough place- and people living in desperate, hopeless circumstances live backward and violent lives. It doesn't matter which imaginary friend they talk to.
All that being said- I hope the majority of you guys never stray too far from Starbucks, and that your sheltered views on the topic become irrelevant in time, as we defeat our enemies and return to living in peace.
Good luck with that fantasy because you won't live long enough to see it in your lifetime. P.S., I've traveled half the world and I don't care for Starbucks at all.
Amp Mangum
03-27-16, 19:05
ISIS crossing the southern border from Mexico?
http://video.foxnews.com/v/4819146419001/isis-crossing-the-southern-border-from-mexico/?intcmp=hpvid1#sp=show-clips
KalashniKEV
03-28-16, 08:59
So who then is "our" enemies? Muslims? "radical" Muslims?
Our enemies are ALL fringe radicals who seek to subvert mainstream American values and culture, and change our way of life to fit their backward vision.
"Trouble no one about their religion; respect others in their view, and demand that they respect yours. Love your life, perfect your life, beautify all things in your life. Seek to make your life long and its purpose in the service of your people. Prepare a noble death song for the day when you go over the great divide."
-Tecumseh
We have all bore witness to the rise of white supremacy in gun culture over the past few years, and now we see Nazi-ism starting to appear and spread. This may seem like a perfectly logical response to counter the threat of radical Islamic terror to some- it most certainly is NOT, and it should be understood that by taking up that mantle, you instantly become validated in a certain way... a way that may take you down a very short path.
It doesn't work.
There are no perfect analogies, but I no more expect a person born into the Islamic faith to apologize for al Qaeda/ ISIS/ Taliban/ Boko Haram than I would expect a NY Jew to apologize for the crimes of Israel.
Hell... it was just yesterday I offered prayer by morning, and raised a glass by evening to the centennial anniversary of the Easter Rising.
But didn't Republican action involve killing a whole lot of innocent civilians? You bet it did. This wasn't ancient history either.
Doesn't matter. The orange is shiite, it's ****ing green and white.
...and I guess all that puts me as a sympathizer- one step away from being an enabler and two from being an actor.
Still- no apology from me.
So then would I apologize for Joseph Kony and the Lord's Resistance Army currently conducting terrorist atrocities in Africa? No... Africa is a world away.
Would I apologize on behalf of the Christian faith if his brand of terror became exported, and attacks were conducted in DC? No... because his version of the faith is not mine, and I have nothing to do with any of that.
Are you starting to see how life and the real world works?
We turned Saddam Hussain over to the new government within Iraq, within months he was executed, Death by Hanging. See how swiftly that works and how justice is done?
Justice... by the wide-eyed, slobbering, US-sponsored Iranian puppet regime's lynch mob... and all the fleas, ticks, and critters living in their beards?
Yeah. That was really good... and a smart thing.
It brought about a lot of good things for the country, and just look at how fantastic things are going now!
(LOL... you fools be trippin...)
The first man charged with the Islamic State (IS) Brussels terror attacks is a migrant rights activist and ‘freelance journalist’ who lived next door to headquarters of the European Union (EU).
http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016/03/28/brussels-bomber-was-migrant-rights-activist-who-lived-next-door-to-eu/
brickboy240
03-28-16, 11:54
Umm....Nazis and white supremacists are NOT blowing up mess transit stations and concert venues in Europe, are they?
Until we get leaders that will identify the root causes of these incidents, I doubt we will see an end to them.
Whiskey_Bravo
03-28-16, 12:04
O
So then would I apologize for Joseph Kony and the Lord's Resistance Army currently conducting terrorist atrocities in Africa? No... Africa is a world away.
Would I apologize on behalf of the Christian faith if his brand of terror became exported, and attacks were conducted in DC? No... because his version of the faith is not mine, and I have nothing to do with any of that.
Are you starting to see how life and the real world works?
Uh what? Kony is not Christian nor is he following anything in the bible even remotely. You can't even mistake him for an extreme sect of Christianity since he isn't following any of the teachings of Christ or the Old Testament. He is a rebel that kidnaps children to use as child soldiers and is on the run from multiple world governments. Not only do those in America and Christians around the world condemn his actions, they have sanctioned military action against him so yeah that's kind of better than apologizing for him.
The same cannot be said for Islam and those extremist that follow it's violent teachings. The koran preaches violence, especially against unbelievers. There is no savior in the Koran that changes things like in the bible, it has the same theme throughout.
Your straw man is just that, a straw man.
Averageman
03-28-16, 12:34
Justice... by the wide-eyed, slobbering, US-sponsored Iranian puppet regime's lynch mob... and all the fleas, ticks, and critters living in their beards?
Yeah. That was really good... and a smart thing.
It brought about a lot of good things for the country, and just look at how fantastic things are going now!
(LOL... you fools be trippin...)
You may not like the example you you still failed to explain why Military Justice isn't being handled by the Military.
I would guess it is politics and the politicians wanting to be seen as the ones who took care of the problem. Then their are those who would just turn them loose again to fight another day.
FromMyColdDeadHand
03-28-16, 12:53
You liquor' dip Kev? That was almost free form.
White supremacists just recently got into guns!?!?
Frickn FDR. If we had just kept the old colonial system, we wouldn't have had the last 70 years of near constant war.
KalashniKEV
03-28-16, 13:00
Umm....Nazis and white supremacists are NOT blowing up mess transit stations and concert venues in Europe, are they?
No, but one of them murdered a whole bunch of children on an island not long ago and then blew up a few government buildings.
Did you forget?
Uh what? Kony is not Christian nor is he following anything in the bible even remotely.
The Lord's Resistance Army isn't doing the Lord's work in Africa?
Next you're going to tell me that the Islamic State is not Islamic...
You may not like the example you you still failed to explain why Military Justice isn't being handled by the Military.
I would guess it is politics and the politicians wanting to be seen as the ones who took care of the problem.
No. It's because the military is completely and totally incompetent when it comes to handling matters of justice, and they have no desire or interest in handling the legal piece.
That's why Hasan Akbar, Robert Bales, the Haditha Marines, Steven Dale Green, Nidal Malik Hassan, Calvin Gibbs, etc are all still alive, and GITMO is still open and just filling up with dudes in total limbo status.
brickboy240
03-28-16, 13:32
You left out Timothy McVeigh.
For some reason, when you bring up terrorism...you have to mention him...you know.
Averageman
03-28-16, 13:39
No. It's because the military is completely and totally incompetent when it comes to handling matters of justice, and they have no desire or interest in handling the legal piece.
That's why Hasan Akbar, Robert Bales, the Haditha Marines, Steven Dale Green, Nidal Malik Hassan, Calvin Gibbs, etc are all still alive, and GITMO is still open and just filling up with dudes in total limbo status.
When in your lifetime have you seen the Military handle this kind of Justice?
I'm thinking it's a political football and they could and should be given the mission.
There are a pretty simple set of rules for dealing with it. A lot fewer of our guys would be getting in trouble if the ROE was rest back to where it needs to be and the issue was dealt with in a more speedy manner.
Get caught red handed, you get a wall, a blindfold and a bullet.
brickboy240
03-28-16, 13:51
Also, I don't think the guy in Norway targeted those people because his religion told him to do so.
You left out Timothy McVeigh.
For some reason, when you bring up terrorism...you have to mention him...you know.
Why? That was retaliation for the feds involvement in the Branch Davidians. Sounds like workplace violence. Your thoughts on Ted Kaczynski?
I was but a teenybopper and I recall Waco being a hot topic about Federal overbearance. I mean old Nam vets, newly minted Gulf War guuys and so forth thought it was totally disgusting.
Especially the the APC assaults.
But all of that was overriden by McVeigh who NOBODY sympathized with.
The early part of the Clinton era was pretty grim. It wasn't positive at all. Guys getting DXed from the army with literally 4 years to a pension. Happened to a friend's dad. He was a solid guy but was released from service. Billet closed. Bye. Restructuring and all.
It wasn't until the late 90s that people made any good money thanks more to a burgeoning new Internet. But come 2001 it got dark again. I was there. Have pictures. Everybody wore metallic clothing, goggles, weird 70s retro, people sorta dressed up for school. Lots and lots of orange. It was like everyone was on ecstasy or something. Grunge was out. People were optimistic.
And now...we're worse off. Because we focus on the bullshit and ignore the real shit.
Religion aside, it's people killing people and somebody needs to fix it.
I was but a teenybopper and I recall Waco being a hot topic about Federal overbearance. I mean old Nam vets, newly minted Gulf War guuys and so forth thought it was totally disgusting.
Especially the the APC assaults.
But all of that was overriden by McVeigh who NOBODY sympathized with.
The early part of the Clinton era was pretty grim. It wasn't positive at all. Guys getting DXed from the army with literally 4 years to a pension. Happened to a friend's dad. He was a solid guy but was released from service. Billet closed. Bye. Restructuring and all.
It wasn't until the late 90s that people made any good money thanks more to a burgeoning new Internet. But come 2001 it got dark again. I was there. Have pictures. Everybody wore metallic clothing, goggles, weird 70s retro, people sorta dressed up for school. Lots and lots of orange. It was like everyone was on ecstasy or something. Grunge was out. People were optimistic.
And now...we're worse off. Because we focus on the bullshit and ignore the real shit.
Religion aside, it's people killing people and somebody needs to fix it.
Sadly...
http://s.ecrater.com/stores/84276/492771dfc379b_84276b.jpg
well, during Clintons presidency, it seemed like every 6 months there was something going on that captivated this nation. OJ Simpson, David Koresh, Columbine, Monica Lewinski, Oklahoma City bombing, Unabomber, Bosnia, Kosovo, Princess Diana, Hale Bopp (Heavens Gate), Y2K and Clintons impeachment. Our focus is entertainment driven. What ever people are talking about is what we tend to focus on.
Our government is anything but problem solvers. It seems like everything in this world is out of control. The whole world was waiting for a president like Obama and anticipating Hillary, the world knows they will be blind to the real world and focus 100% of there energy on things like global warming, tuition, healthcare, women empowerment, minority empowerment, bridging income inequality and other stuff. Say what you want but N Korea would not be shooting ICBM's if Bush were still president, nor would China be building islands in the south china sea, ISIS would still exist but very small and not news worthy, OPEC would not have saturated the market with crude to hurt US oil companies and the US would still have a AAA credit rating.
Liberals tend to overlook the important things and turn there attention to peoples feelings- and the whole world goes into chaos because of it.
KalashniKEV
03-28-16, 16:33
When in your lifetime have you seen the Military handle this kind of Justice?
Never... because they have not the judicial competence to pull it off.
We do an extremely poor job of discipline within our own ranks... you think we can prosecute trials for enemy combatants in a timely and adequate manner? Most of the guys who make it all the way to GITMO are basically "awaiting disposition."
What we're good at is finding the Poland Spring bottle in Joe's fridge amongst the al Hayat waters, giving it a sniff, and taking away his rank and money. Yeah, you were saving it for your birthday? Well "Happy Birthday, dumbass."
Meanwhile as the war machine kept turning, the whole Army was scratching their head and wondering why Petraeus doesn't just walk down the hall, empty a mag in to Nouri al Maliki, and then spin the wheel again for another guy who's not in Iran's pocket.
Hell... it would have even given the Sunnis in al Iraqiyya a chance to like... maybe NOT boycott the election and then subsequently challenge the legitimacy of the US sponsored Iranian puppet regime.
Turns out while we were all scratching our heads, he was busy get, get, getting some head...
Makes sense.
Also, I don't think the guy in Norway targeted those people because his religion told him to do so.
Anders Behring Breivik was part of the Knights Templar Movement- a Christian Terror organization that the Norwegian Police say either doesn't exist or has since been absorbed into PEGIDA, Soldiers of Odin, EDL, etc.
Religion aside, it's people killing people and somebody needs to fix it.
Which is basically what I said.
Averageman
03-28-16, 17:09
Never... because they have not the judicial competence to pull it off.
We do an extremely poor job of discipline within our own ranks... you think we can prosecute trials for enemy combatants in a timely and adequate manner? Most of the guys who make it all the way to GITMO are basically "awaiting disposition."
I would have to disagree, I think that they have everything available to do the job, except for the green light to do the job.
There was never a need for GITMO to house anyone, they were either guilty or they were not. Once they have had their trial, disposition of their sentences should have been immediate. Those guilty of War Crimes should have been executed and those not released.
Turning them over to the host nation to serve a "sentence" was simply a losing idea that is somehow tied to "you break it you fix it" and "Nation building"
The comparison between a Serviceman with a bottle of Vodka and someone planting roadside bombs is remarkably different, but either way those things can and should be dealt with by the military.
Just editing to add;
If the European Union wants this to end they had better change tactics rather quickly, as it is the EU is fighting with one hand behind their back and promoting the idea that the Western Countries do not have the will to fight.
Surely they could dust off a Guillotine somewhere, dust it off and roll it out on to a public square and have at it.
FromMyColdDeadHand
03-28-16, 17:18
You have to differentiate between insane people who Wrap their actions in the cloak of something, and the 'sane' people that do crazy things in the name of something. The first are usually lone wolfs like the Norway shooter. The Paris and BRU guys are the later.
ForTehNguyen
03-28-16, 22:32
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpyZfDM1ygc
NO they are not Christian !!!!
yes they started as that over 1000 years ago and when they started doing bad things the church disavowed them and then about 1300 they rounded them up and killed them !!!
so ANYONE claiming to try start that up again basically started up a NON Christian organization that was disavowed
as far as the soldiers of Odin well that is in the name itself and is not Christian by any means !!!!
but some folks are so so so so wanting to wrap up Christians are bad and all religion is bad ?
ironic since non religion types who thought all religions are bad ! are responsible for over 100 million killed in the last 100 years alone !!!
which even tops the muslim killings !!!!!
Anders Behring Breivik was part of the Knights Templar Movement- a Christian Terror organization that the Norwegian Police say either doesn't exist or has since been absorbed into PEGIDA, Soldiers of Odin, EDL, etc.
ditto this !!!!
when the twin towers went down you had many countries basically come out in the streets in mass celebration !!!
and you still get this when large muslim attacks happen countries so so so happy to celebrate the mass killing of people not like them !!
yet Anders might have had a few people happy but that was about it basically everyone was against it ? I am sure some muslims were very happy though just a few less infidels to off !
You have to differentiate between insane people who Wrap their actions in the cloak of something, and the 'sane' people that do crazy things in the name of something. The first are usually lone wolfs like the Norway shooter. The Paris and BRU guys are the later.
Moose-Knuckle
03-29-16, 00:36
I'm still searching but my Google-ful can't seem to turn up the lists for Baptists, Wiccans, Mormons, Taoists, Jainists, et cetera. . .
List of Islamic Terror: Last 30 Days
Date Country City Killed Injured Description
2016.03.27 Pakistan Lahore 72 300 A massive suicide blast targeting Christian families celebrating Easter leaves over seventy dead, half of whom were children.
2016.03.26 Nigeria Tumpun 4 0 Boko Haram gunmen open fire on a group of villagers, killing four.
2016.03.25 Yemen Aden 25 15 Three al-Qaeda suicide bombings leave twenty-five dead.
2016.03.25 Iraq Iskandariyah 41 105 Forty-one innocents are blown to bits by a Fedayeen suicide bomber at a soccer game.
2016.03.24 Scotland Glasgow 1 0 An Ahmadi religious minority is killed by a radical Muslim after wishing Christians a Happy Easter.
2016.03.23 Syria Foua 2 3 Ahrar al-Sham snipers pick off two civilians.
2016.03.22 Bangladesh Kurigram 1 0 A Christian convert is stabbed to death by Religion of Peace proponents.
2016.03.22 Belgium Brussels 14 92 Fourteen people are murdered when two suicide bombers detonate nail-packed explosives at crowded airline counters.
2016.03.22 Belgium Brussels 21 130 A Religion of Peace suicide blast on a subway train incinerates twenty-one commuters.
2016.03.22 Iraq Tarmiya 3 7 A Mujahid bomb blast claims three lives.
2016.03.21 Somalia Laantu Buur 6 0 Six local soldiers are ambushed and killed by an Islamist group.
2016.03.21 Iraq Makhmour 2 0 Two others are taken out by a series of suicide bombers.
2016.03.21 Iraq Anbar 30 0 A British suicide bomber is said to be responsible for a blast that kills thirty Iraqis.
2016.03.21 Yemen Taiz 1 3 Shiite snipers fire on a group of journalists, bringing down one.
2016.03.20 Iraq Haqlaniyah 24 12 A wave of Shahid suicide bombers kill two dozen Iraqis.
2016.03.19 Turkey Istanbul 4 39 An ISIS suicide bomber murders four people along a city street, including two American tourists.
2016.03.19 Egypt al-Arish 15 0 ISIS claims to have detonated a suicide car bomb that leaves fifteen others dead.
2016.03.19 Iraq Kirkuk 2 0 Two more children die from the effects of an ISIS mustard gas attack.
2016.03.19 Iraq Mosul 70 0 A mass grave is discovered containing the remains of seventy female Yazidi victims of ISIS torture and execution.
2016.03.19 Somalia Afmadhow 2 5 An al-Shabaab attack leaves two others dead.
2016.03.18 Syria Aleppo 1 6 A Sunni rocket sends a woman to the morgue.
2016.03.18 Afghanistan Seori Tapi 2 1 A Taliban landmine takes out two people, including a child.
2016.03.18 Iraq Mosul 1 0 A gentleman's head is removed by the Islamic State.
2016.03.18 Syria Aleppo 2 3 Two children, a boy and a girl, are reduced to pulp by a series of Sunni rockets on their neighborhood.
2016.03.17 Pakistan Smagal 4 0 A woman and her child are among four souls obliterated by a suicide bomber.
2016.03.17 Niger Dolbel 3 3 Three guards at a market are shot to death point blank by Jihadis.
2016.03.17 Niger Diffa 1 2 Four suicide bombers manage to kill one other person.
2016.03.17 Philippines Sarangani 1 0 A 43-year-old man is beheaded by a pro-caliphate group.
2016.03.17 Egypt Rafah 5 10 Five are killed when religious extremists attack a local military base.
2016.03.17 Iraq Hamidat 1 0 Radicals put a rival imam against a wall and shoot him to death.
2016.03.17 Thailand Pattani 1 0 A 53-year-old guard at a school is shot to death by Muslim militants.
2016.03.17 Iraq Fallujah 6 0 Six men are executed in barbaric fashion by the Islamic State, including one whose head is blown off with explosives.
2016.03.16 Pakistan Peshawar 15 30 Fifteen people are torn to shreds when Jihadis bomb a bus carrying commuters.
2016.03.16 Nigeria Maiduguri 18 35 Two female suicide bombers slaughter two dozen worshippers at a rival mosque.
2016.03.15 Iraq Qwar 9 17 An ISIS chlorine gas attack kills nine Kurds.
2016.03.15 Afghanistan Hajiabad 4 0 Women and children are among four civilians exterminated by Taliban bombers.
2016.03.15 Afghanistan Laghman 1 1 Sharia state proponents ambush and kill an off-duty police officer.
2016.03.15 Thailand Pattani 1 0 Suspected terrorists shoot a young woman twice in the head at a market.
2016.03.15 Philippines Patikul 2 0 Abu Sayyaf members ambush and kill two local soldiers.
2016.03.14 Nigeria Chul 3 7 Three civilians are taken out by a Boko Haram bomb blast.
2016.03.14 Nigeria Huyum 1 1 Islamic gunmen kill a woman and shoot a child in the leg.
2016.03.14 Egypt al-Arish 2 0 Two Egyptians are picked off by fundamentalist snipers.
2016.03.14 Afghanistan Kandahar 1 0 A woman is shot to death by the Taliban.
2016.03.14 Iraq Zankurah 22 16 Twenty-two Iraqis are killed during an assault by the Islamic State.
2016.03.14 Canada Toronto, ON 0 2 A man stabs two soldiers at a recruiting center, saying that he was just following Allah's instructions.
2016.03.14 Syria Busayrah 1 0 A young man is shot in the head for 'mocking religion'.
2016.03.14 Bangladesh Jhenaidah 1 0 Radical Muslims assassinate a 'polytheist apostate' (ie Shia cleric).
2016.03.14 Iraq Ramadi 25 20 ISIS suicide bombers massacre over two dozen in attacks on two villages.
2016.03.14 Iraq Mosul 6 0 Six young people are rounded up and executed by the caliphate.
2016.03.13 Afghanistan Yengi Qala 2 0 A young couple is murdered over suspected sexual activity.
2016.03.13 Ivory Coast Bassam 18 17 al-Qaeda gunmen assault a hotel and murder anyone refusing to praise Allah with them. The eighteen killed include a 5-year-old Christian who was cut down while praying.
2016.03.13 Iraq Tal Kasab 8 22 Suicide bomb attacks leave eight dead.
2016.03.13 Iraq Sinjar 7 11 ISIS pour shells into a Yazidi village, killing seven residents.
2016.03.12 Iraq Mahmoudiyah 2 7 Mujahid bombers kill two patrons at a market.
2016.03.12 Iraq Munsiyah 7 0 Three women are among seven people murdered in their home by sectarian militia.
2016.03.12 Afghanistan Khanashin 1 3 A child is disassembled by Taliban bombers.
2016.03.11 Ingushetia Nazran 0 4 'Problems in the religious sphere' result in a car bomb blast outside a mosque.
2016.03.11 Pakistan Kohistan 2 0 A couple is shot to death for 'illicit relations'.
2016.03.11 Iraq Sheikhan 11 2 Two ISIS rockets claim the lives of eleven Iraqis.
2016.03.11 Iraq Sinjar 5 3 Five Kurds are laid out by a Shahid suicide bomber.
2016.03.10 Nigeria Tarka 3 0 Fulani mercenaries kill three villagers and burn their homes.
2016.03.10 Libya Misrata 3 0 Three police are killed when ISIS members attack a checkpoint.
2016.03.10 Iraq Mosul 3 0 Three Kurds are beheaded by caliphate members.
2016.03.10 Syria Deir Ezzor 2 0 A poet and his son are murdered by the Islamic State.
2016.03.10 Syria Wilayat al-Khayr 1 0 A man is forced by ISIS to climb a radio tower, from which he is shot off.
2016.03.10 Syria Wilayat al-Khayr 2 0 The Islamic State executes two terrified men by blowing them up.
2016.03.09 Iraq Husseiniya 1 6 Terrorists place a bomb under a bus that kills a passenger.
2016.03.09 Nigeria Benue 8 0 Fulani mercenaries invade four villages in the middle of the night, shooting at least eight residents to death.
2016.03.09 Afghanistan Gereshk 4 30 A Taliban suicide assault on a government building leaves four guards dead.
2016.03.09 Somalia Mogadishu 4 2 Four people bleed out following a suicide car bombing outside a café.
2016.03.09 Iraq Taza 1 1500 A 3-year-old girl dies from an ISIS chemical attack that left hundreds injured.
2016.03.09 Thailand Narathiwat 2 3 Muslim terrorists murder two members of a guard patrol for teachers.
2016.03.08 Uruguay Paysandu 1 0 A Jewish man is stabbed to death by a Muslim convert 'following Allah's order'…
2016.03.08 Iraq al-Hadar 4 0 Four sex slaves are executed for trying to escape captivity in the caliphate.
2016.03.08 Iraq Baghdad 3 7 Three people are left dead following a Mujahideen bombing.
2016.03.08 Thailand Si Sakhon 1 0 A man on a motorcycle is ambushed and killed by Muslim terrorists.
2016.03.08 Turkey Kilis 2 1 A 4-year-old and his mother die when Sunni extremists hit their car with a rocket.
2016.03.08 Israel Jaffa 1 15 Palestinians stab an American tourist to death.
2016.03.08 Afghanistan Maiwand 2 0 Two men clearing landmines are executed by suspected fundamentalists.
2016.03.08 Syria Aleppo 1 0 Devout Muslims implement the 'Rule of Allah' by shooting an 'apostate' in the head.
2016.03.08 Thailand Tak Bai 1 0 A Muslim 'insurgent' walks up to a man in a crowd and fires a bullet into the back of his head.
2016.03.08 Iraq Fallujah 50 0 Fifty civilians are executed by the Islamic State.
2016.03.07 Iraq Kirkuk 5 0 Five young people are torn to shreds by an ISIS bomb blast.
2016.03.07 Pakistan Orangi Town 2 0 A young couple is shot to death by conservative relatives for marrying of their own free will.
2016.03.07 Iraq Abu Ghraib 3 7 Three people at a market are sectionalized by a Jihadi bomb blast.
2016.03.07 Tunisia Ben Guerdane 19 17 A 12-year-old girl is among nineteen others who lose their lives during an Islamist assault on a small town.
2016.03.07 Somalia Beledweyne 0 6 A bomb hidden in a laptop detonates at an airport.
2016.03.07 Pakistan Shabqadar 17 30 A Jamatul Ahrar suicide bomber murders seventeen people at a courthouse, including two children.
2016.03.07 Afghanistan Shindand 3 3 Three civilians are blown to bits by a Taliban bomb blast.
2016.03.07 Egypt al-Arish 2 0 Two local cops are pulled into pieces by Muslim bombers.
2016.03.07 Syria Hasakah 1 3 A woman loses her life to an ISIS explosive device.
2016.03.07 Chechnya Grozny 1 0 Video surfaces showing religious radicals executing a man with a shot to the head.
2016.03.06 Iraq al-Jahash 12 0 A dozen people are executed by a Sharia court.
2016.03.06 Iraq Hillah 61 95 At least sixty people are incinerated when a suicide bomber in a fuel tanker detonates outside a town.
2016.03.06 Syria Aleppo 14 40 Jaish-al-Sunna terrorists send mortars and rockets into a busy market, massacring over a dozen shoppers.
2016.03.06 Egypt Sheikh Zuweid 3 0 Fundamentalists ambush an ambulance and machine-gun a medic and two injured patients.
2016.03.05 Syria Jarablus 1 0 A teen is beheaded for apostasy after missing Friday prayers.
2016.03.05 Yemen Aden 2 0 Sectarian terrorists fire on a vehicle, killing two occupants.
2016.03.04 Yemen Aden 16 0 Militant Muslims storm a Catholic retirement home and murder sixteen, including four nuns and the elderly residents.
2016.03.03 Iraq Abu Ghraib 2 10 Two civilians are killed when terrorists sent mortar shells into a market.
2016.03.03 Libya Surman 2 0 Two Italian hostages are killed while being used as human shields by ISIS.
2016.03.03 Syria Kafriya 1 3 Sunni militants machine-gun a civilian in his home.
2016.03.03 Thailand Yala 1 0 Militant Muslims shoot a rubber tapper to death, then set his body on fire.
2016.03.02 Egypt Khariza 1 3 An Islamist bomb claims one life.
2016.03.02 Iraq Hawija 6 0 Six people are beheaded and crucified by the Islamic State.
2016.03.02 Iraq Nineveh 5 0 A 12-year-old girl is forced by the caliphate to execute five women, including a doctor.
2016.03.02 Syria Quneitra 18 30 Two suicide bombers massacre eighteen bystanders.
2016.03.02 Afghanistan Jalalabad 2 19 Four suicide bombers target the Indian consulate, killing two civilians.
2016.03.01 Pakistan Noorshah 2 0 Two women are murdered over 'doubts about their character and lifestyles'.
2016.03.01 Pakistan Peshawar 2 4 Two employees at the US consulate bleed to death following an Islamist bombing.
2016.03.01 Afghanistan Pul-e-Khumri 3 2 Religious extremists hit a house with a rocket, killing three family members.
2016.03.01 Somalia Alamada 5 8 An al-Shabaab bomb produces five dead bodies.
2016.03.01 Egypt al-Arish 2 0 Fundamentalists behead a man and shoot his son to death.
2016.03.01 Iraq Haditha 8 8 Eight Iraqis are blown up by four Fedayeen suicide bombers.
2016.03.01 Philippines Datu Salibo 1 2 Bangsamoro Islamists kill one other person during an ambush.
2016.03.01 Philippines Zamboanga 2 0 An assassination attempt on an anti-ISIS preacher outside a university hall leaves two dead.
2016.03.01 Pakistan Sheikhupura 1 0 An Ahmadi religious minority is stabbed to death for his faith.
2016.02.29 Russia Moscow 1 0 A woman beheads a child, saying that it was revenge for 'spilled Muslim blood' in Syria.
2016.02.29 Afghanistan Farah 3 3 Three children are disassembled by a Taliban IED.
2016.02.29 Afghanistan Uruzgan 4 3 Four locals are shot to death by the Taliban
2016.02.29 Iraq Mosul 24 0 Two dozen Iraqis are rounded up and executed by the Islamic State.
2016.02.29 Iraq Mosul 2 0 Two religious clerics are murdered by their more radical brethren
2016.02.29 Iraq Muqdadiya 40 58 A Fedayeen suicide bomber detonates at a funeral, sending at least forty mourners straight into their own afterlife.
2016.02.29 Iraq Hawija 3 0 Three youth are beheaded for putting up anti-ISIS posters.
2016.02.29 Yemen Aden 4 5 A Shahid suicide bomber snuffs out four other souls.
2016.02.29 DRC Ntombi 13 0 Four women are among thirteen villagers found hacked to pieces by ADF Islamists.
2016.02.29 Nigeria Badarawa 15 22 Suspected Boko Haram surround a group of villagers gathered to watch a video and pour machine gun fire into them, killing at least fifteen.
2016.02.29 Syria Deir ez-Zor 3 0 Three men are crucified by a Sharia court for crimes against Allah.
2016.02.28 Afghanistan Qads 1 0 A tribal elder is tortured to death by religious extremists.
2016.02.28 Iraq Abu Ghraib 24 22 Two dozen Iraqis are shot or blown apart during a Fedayeen suicide attack by ISIS.
2016.02.28 Iraq Baghdad 78 112 Seventy-eight people at a packed market in a Shiite area are exterminated by two Sunni suicide bombers.
2016.02.28 Egypt al-Arish 1 0 A man is shot to death in front of his home by the Islamic State.
2016.02.28 Somalia Baidoa 30 60 At least thirty civilians and first responders are slaughtered by a twin suicide attack near a restaurant.
2016.02.28 Afghanistan Lashkar Gah 3 11 Three souls are snuffed out by an explosive device planted by Sharia proponents.
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/attacks/attacks.aspx?Yr=Last30
KalashniKEV
03-29-16, 08:34
I would have to disagree, I think that they have everything available to do the job, except for the green light to do the job.
There was never a need for GITMO to house anyone, they were either guilty or they were not. Once they have had their trial, disposition of their sentences should have been immediate. Those guilty of War Crimes should have been executed and those not released.
Turning them over to the host nation to serve a "sentence" was simply a losing idea...
ETA: quoted but I forgot to respond.
You give JAG far too much credit. They are not smart people. They are actually completely incompetent.
They don't have a clue about how to proceed (green light what?) and even if you told them they would screw it up.
As far as creating building capable, credible institutions to prosecute those who have done wrong?
It's a necessity. Imperial courts are just kangaroo courts and would never be viewed as legitimate.
Also- as tough as it is to deal with, Truth and Reconciliation is a necessary component to all small, dirty wars. We men who take up arms and fight are the natural decision makers in any society, and killing us off will only lead to retaliation by younger generations.
Some bad dudes are going to need to raise their hand, come to justice, move through the system, get spanked, and come out with a clean record. And that sucks.
If you don't have the stomach for it?? Well then stay home and don't participate in small, dirty wars.
You have to differentiate between insane people who Wrap their actions in the cloak of something...
Yes, indeed.
I'm sure the irony of your statement is lost on you, but we all got it.
;)
I'm still searching but my Google-ful can't seem to turn up the lists for Baptists, Wiccans, Mormons, Taoists, Jainists, et cetera. . .
Good copypaste.
Did you read it?
It doesn't appear that you understood it.
It looks like a lot of those places are suffering from terror that we created when we overthrew the government, empowered the wrong folks, destroyed the economy so no one could have a job or make any money, created governmental institutions of questionable legitimacy, and left in a hurry.
Is anyone surprised that Iraq/Syria fractured along sectarian lines?
If you did the exact same thing in this country- killed 750,000 people, all that stuff above, etc, I believe that this country would fracture along racial lines.
Is anyone surprised that in shitty Africa, the lever that moves the people to violence in the name of their cause is religious?
Was it not tremendously helpful to the cause of Republicanism that we are Catholic and the British are Protestant?
Does any of that have anything to do with anything?
No. Just put this bag where we told you to at the exact time and you'll get money so you can eat. Or don't and we'll kill you.
Plata o Plomo.
(Actually this last one is really a split along socioeconomic lines masked as the "War on Drugs." Funny too that socioeconomic differences are the only thing that make sense, to me, to fight over.)
So none of this terror would be going on had it not been for us invading and killing jihadists and leaving too early?
I admit that leaving too early was a mistake. I admit that taking out leaders that didn't allow as much radicalized terror to occur was a bad idea.
But...it has always been there boiling. The muslim menace was there since their beginning. Destroying all of non-Islam is their goal and their foundation. It was a matter of when, not if, this all happened. ISIS jumped on it. They were waiting for this moment. Not just ISIS but hundreds of millions of others.
Dist. Expert 26
03-29-16, 09:29
Kev, are you referring to our SOF guys when you say they'll have to raise their hand and come to justice? I might be totally misinterpreting what you said here.
Averageman
03-29-16, 12:08
I would think that the Nurnberg trials were handled well, none of those who were found guilty and those who were executed were not needed for some reconciliation or to assist in rebuilding their countries.
I see little difference in the guy who builds and then straps a bomb vest on a young man and the guy who herded people in to a gas chamber and I don't see a moral problem with executing either of them.
We have and more recently France and Belgium have had quiet a few encounters with these types. If they bring Terror on a civilian population with military action, I see no reason for a civil trial, those action were and extension of an ongoing war and sometimes in the name of ISIS. Simply turn them over to the Military, try them and execute them and do it publically. The psychological impact alone would deter someone continuing in this path. Perhaps that is why Saudi Arabia has little direct terror action within their own borders?
Saying that the JAG Corps in each respective branch of our Military couldn't muster enough trial lawyers together to handle the load is a rather easy way out and perhaps a bit biased.
I think within any branch of service the cream of the JAG Corps could be called upon, given the mission and execute it. We don't do that because the lives of these Terrorists becomes a political football when left in the hands of Politicians.
Good copypaste.
Did you read it?
It doesn't appear that you understood it.
It looks like a lot of those places are suffering from terror that we created when we overthrew the government, empowered the wrong folks, destroyed the economy so no one could have a job or make any money, created governmental institutions of questionable legitimacy, and left in a hurry.
Is anyone surprised that Iraq/Syria fractured along sectarian lines?
If you did the exact same thing in this country- killed 750,000 people, all that stuff above, etc, I believe that this country would fracture along racial lines.
Is anyone surprised that in shitty Africa, the lever that moves the people to violence in the name of their cause is religious?
Was it not tremendously helpful to the cause of Republicanism that we are Catholic and the British are Protestant?
Does any of that have anything to do with anything?
No. Just put this bag where we told you to at the exact time and you'll get money so you can eat. Or don't and we'll kill you.
Plata o Plomo.
(Actually this last one is really a split along socioeconomic lines masked as the "War on Drugs." Funny too that socioeconomic differences are the only thing that make sense, to me, to fight over.)
You may argue that it's semantics, but I take significant exception to your turn of phrase "terror we created". We did not "create" terror. We may have enabled it's ability to flourish by removing some obstacles (namely a local government willing to kill the terrorists), but the terror was born, raised, nurtured, fed, trained and set free in the minds and hearts of those committing the terrorist acts. Until we can enter the mind of another at will and take control of their body remotely, every person on the planet is responsible for their own response to stimuli. I reject any other premise as fatally flawed! :)
KalashniKEV
03-29-16, 12:45
So none of this terror would be going on had it not been for us invading and killing jihadists and leaving too early?
It is not commonly disputed that Iraq was a safer, better place with more favorable governance under secular Ba'athist rule.
The actions taken- starting with CPA 1&2 and ending with the failure to obtain a SOFA and withdrawal- all directly lead to the situation we are now in.
But...it has always been there boiling. The muslim menace...
The "Muslim Menace" is neocon bed-wetter talk.
Do you think if they were worshiping Set and Ra that the whole, "We keep your life ****ed up so we can exploit your natural resources" would have played any better?
Try to understand the War a little better.
Kev, are you referring to our SOF guys when you say they'll have to raise their hand and come to justice? I might be totally misinterpreting what you said here.
No, I was talking about armed militants, and the leaders of the various factions at play. This is why we have peace jurgas in Afghanistan and Safwa forces in Iraq.
You must be wiling to accept victory from people who might have crossed you in the past... or accept mission failure as the other option.
I would think that the Nurnberg trials were handled well...
WWII was a color war, homey.
This ain't capture the flag.
This is the GWOT.
Maybe I'm reading you wrong damn you come off as a know-it all, condescending guy Kev. I could be wrong.
This has been happening since the 600s. We have a time where it is flourishing because we planned stupidly and sided with the wrong folks (or any folks for that matter) but Islamic terrorism, brutal violence and hatred has been part of the faith in general. There are other poor countries, of other faiths that don't spread around the world bombing marketplaces and playgrounds and celebrate sending the kuffar to hell, and beat, stone and whip and take limbs off of people for going against minor crimes.
"neocon bed-wetter"? Come on dude. Maybe a little douchie? No?
Their lives were already ****ed up btw. Maybe Hussein kept the terrorists fearful and at bay, but he kept his people, as most ME leaders do, scared to death and poor as shit while he slept in his palace.
KalashniKEV
03-29-16, 14:06
This has been happening since the 600s.
Oh... it's been going on for a lot longer than that!
Alexander came through and got his mother****ing SLAY on in the 300s... and that wasn't anything new.
The history of this region is as old as time itself.
Lots of good points made.
I would like some secularism going on.
I'm not an expert but in retrospect, I think that people really probably did not have much follow through and thought this was going to be like Desert Storm.
I dare say this is worse than the Islamic revolution and there's a lot of confidence that has been lost.
These other countries' governments are going the appeasement route.
This is going to be a hot topic for another decade unless something joint and definitive is done. But that will require leadership that we likely won't have(and haven't had) for 15 more years
Totally agree. Smart points. Should be said out loud in front of more than just these forums.
Averageman
03-29-16, 14:52
Lots of good points made.
I would like some secularism going on.
I'm not an expert but in retrospect, I think that people really probably did not have much follow through and thought this was going to be like Desert Storm.
I dare say this is worse than the Islamic revolution and there's a lot of confidence that has been lost.
These other countries' governments are going the appeasement route.
This is going to be a hot topic for another decade unless something joint and definitive is done. But that will require leadership that we likely won't have(and haven't had) for 15 more years
Appeasement and the need for cheap labor is what brought them a generation of disenfranchised second generation youth who feel fighting for ISIS is better than the nothing ghetto and life they have in it.
So far the killings have been random and based upon the population at large, so the people who created this mess wont be stepping in to it directly. Now if you change the game up a little bit and go from bombing and random shootings to lets say add some kidnapping, the system then will change the way they are dealing with these guys. For the most part you kind of avoid kidnapping those who can't pay a ransom.
Joint and definitive? After 9/11 and the blunders we made reacting to it, it will likely take a near holocaust to get Europe united and off their "White Guilt" a$$es to do something even if it is in regards to their own survival.
The whole white guilt shit is brainwashed into a lot of folks just the same as the entitlement shit is brainwashed into others.
I'm not sorry for anything I haven't done and I don't owe anybody jack shit.
I dunno what's worse: Imperialist Europe or pusscake Europe.
Likely pusscake Europe.
At this point if I wouldn't blame a lot of countries if they started flying Totenkopfs or hammer and sickles and started cruelly and "unfairly" wiping folks out to get them to the point where the whole terrorism spiel starts losing luster.
But then....you got Imperialist Europeans now so...shit.
I mean it's like gangland rules now where you gotta be either a killer, a pusher, a player, or a victim.
KalashniKEV
03-29-16, 15:18
I mean it's like gangland rules now where you gotta be either a killer, a pusher, a player, or a victim.
Welcome to the global battlefield.
If you're not already one of the above, you're likely just a very lucky (or very sheltered) victim.
Chalk up another reason for hating the NYPD. (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/mar/29/william-bratton-nypd-commissioner-our-own-citizens/)
https://westernrifleshooters.files.wordpress.com/2016/03/screen-shot-2016-03-29-at-9-06-50-am.png
See....now that's some bullshit.
It speaks to incompetence if not senility.
Commandant Lassard up in NYC needs to probably retire in Harlem.
ETA That was uncalled for. Commandant Lassard was cool and adopted Punky Brewster.
Commissioner Lemonparty needs to retire, probably in Harlem
Appeasement and the need for cheap labor is what brought them a generation of disenfranchised second generation youth who feel fighting for ISIS is better than the nothing ghetto and life they have in it.
So far the killings have been random and based upon the population at large, so the people who created this mess wont be stepping in to it directly. Now if you change the game up a little bit and go from bombing and random shootings to lets say add some kidnapping, the system then will change the way they are dealing with these guys. For the most part you kind of avoid kidnapping those who can't pay a ransom.
Joint and definitive? After 9/11 and the blunders we made reacting to it, it will likely take a near holocaust to get Europe united and off their "White Guilt" a$$es to do something even if it is in regards to their own survival.
Truer words have never been spoken nor typed.
You'll note anyone who does not agree with peace rallies and appeasement is labelled a right wing hooligan, thug, or Nazi.
That some want to gather to show they are just pissed as hell at what happened/is happening in their country vs rainbow flags and flowers, should not come as a surprise and does not automatically make you as Nazi, etc. The media spin on the peace rally in Brussels speaks volumes to that. They were loud but seemingly peaceful until attacked by riot police from everything I have read/seen, even the media accounts trying to paint the (understandably) angry people who don't wanna hear from dumb ass rainbow peace rally.
There are no perfect analogies, but I no more expect a person born into the Islamic faith to apologize for al Qaeda/ ISIS/ Taliban/ Boko Haram than I would expect a NY Jew to apologize for the crimes of Israel.
You did it AGAIN.
We were talking about members of hateful ideologies, not countries. I wouldn't expect a Muslim to apologize for Saudi Arabia or Iran because they might have nothing to do with either country just as a NY jew has no control over Israel.
But if a NY jew supports the terrorist attacks committed by groups such as the JDL, then you have the direct analogy you claim doesn't exist. And that person is no better than muslims who support ISIS, etc.
And for the record, in case anyone didn't know.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Defense_League#Terrorism_and_other_illegal_activities
In a 1986 study of domestic terrorism, the Department of Energy concluded: "For more than a decade, the Jewish Defense League (JDL) has been one of the most active terrorist groups in the United States.
Granted the JDL doesn't begin to have a body count anywhere near the most amateur Islamic terrorist group and it seems the majority of their actions were directed against the USSR during the cold war, but the example is sufficient to make the point.
ForTehNguyen
03-29-16, 19:18
they are not cheap labor. Most of the migrants are illiterate even in their own language, the average IQ of that region is a lowsy 70-85, whereas europeans are low 100s. None of them speak the language nor probably will. WTF are they going to do? Leftists cant convince people to drink the communism koolaid anymore. Cant win the war of ideas so stack the deck by bringing migrants in that will vote for leftists. Never mind some of these migrants are hostile to the Western way of life. We'll worry about that later, want votes now!
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.