mil-spec buffer tubes [Archive] - M4Carbine.net Forums

johes

08-21-08, 15:37

There seems to be a wide difference in prices for mil-spec buffer tubes. They range from approx. $20 on up. Is there that much difference in quality or is it a "pay for the name" deal. Thanks

markm

08-21-08, 15:56

I don't know. I'd get a CMT or LMT or something that you know is going to be properly extruded. I think most corner cutting is going to be done on non mil spec tubes anyway.

I'd get a good brand though. It's kind of an important part. ;)

LOKNLOD

08-21-08, 15:59

Going off G&R's website, CMT $40, LMT $45, Vltor $44.95...any of those would be great, and all close to the same price. BravoCompany has a kit for $55.95, that would be a good choice as well if you needed more than just the receiver extension.

I'm not sure of any reason to spend more than that, and I don't see many offerings for less than that, either. If you're interested in a specific item from a specific vendor, feel free to ask and there's probably someone here with firsthand experience with it to say "yay" or "nay".

28_days

08-21-08, 18:38

This is the cheapest one I've seen to date: http://www.dsarms.com/prodinfo.asp?number=MAM4BFR

I have no first hand knowledge of its quality though.

PRGGodfather

08-21-08, 18:47

The DS Arms receiver extensions work just fine...

Be sure to get a high quality castle nut, though, like LMT or Colt, so it can be properly staked. Some castle nuts do not have have any cut outs on the receiver plate side for proper staking.

rob_s

08-21-08, 18:58

Interesting. I hadn't seen a milspec tube as cheap as that DSA. They are definitely a company I trust though.

G-lock

08-21-08, 19:43

Oriontacticalgear.com has the Stag/CMT tube, for 39.99 as of 8/21, find something to make 50.00 and it ships for free.

Jeff

RD62

08-21-08, 20:30

PRGGodfather

08-21-08, 20:34

True. For information, the High Standard receiver plate works well, but the castle nut is missing the cut-outs. For a couple of dollars more, buy a Colt or an LMT for the standard receiver plates.

The DD's and Vltor sling attachment plates stake well, too.

Boltgun

08-21-08, 21:52

I would be curious to see how many "mil-spec" receiver extensions are "completely" mil-spec. I would think that most are dimensionally mil-spec for where the stock slides onto. But does anyone know if they are all mil-spec at the threads also? I have used Diemaco, LMT and Vltor and so far I lean towards the Vltor as I am partial to their numbered extensions (I suggested to Eric about 4.5 years and I am not sure if he started doing it on my suggestion alone but it is there regardless). :D

Boltgun

C4IGrant

08-22-08, 09:39

There seems to be a wide difference in prices for mil-spec buffer tubes. They range from approx. $20 on up. Is there that much difference in quality or is it a "pay for the name" deal. Thanks

You will never find a FORGED, MIL-SPEC RE for $20. You get what you pay for in RE's.

C4

stormblue

08-22-08, 10:42

I'm sure I can't assume that any $40 plus extension is forged.
Are LMT, CMT and VLTOR extensions forged?

The only place that I've seen extruded/forged called out in the product description is on SA's Colt parts list page.

C4IGrant

08-22-08, 11:02

rob_s

08-22-08, 11:07

So if CMT and DSA both offer extruded REs and one is $20 and the other is $40...

;)

C4IGrant

08-22-08, 11:09

So if CMT and DSA both offer extruded REs and one is $20 and the other is $40...

;)

Just because two items are extruded, does not mean that both parts are equal.

Let me do some digging on the DSA RE's.

C4

C4IGrant

08-22-08, 12:47

Ok, I have finished my research on RE's.

The TDP does NOT require a forging, but does specifically say that that it needs to be an "impact" extrusion made out of 7071.

Companies that do impact extrusion and make their RE's out of 7071:

LMT
CMT
Colt (who buys their RE's from CMT)

DSA RE's are 6061 (not the mil-spec 7071).

C4

P.S thank you EK for your technical knowledge on this subject.

rob_s

08-22-08, 12:57

Interesting that DSA doesn't use LMT REs. As I understand it DSA lowers are just LMTs with the DSA logo. You'd think they'd use the REs too.

Wonder who else is using the DSA version.

Stickman

08-22-08, 13:23

P.S thank you EK for your technical knowledge on this subject.

Good source of info, and a good guy.

PRGGodfather

08-22-08, 14:21

Good pick! So, DSA's RE's are "MILSPEC" in SIZE ONLY. That's downright irritating. IMHO, they should not be able to call it MILSPEC unless it actually is...

From a technical angle, what are the impact differences between 6061 and 7071? For people who don't do "mortaring drills" will the 6061 extruded RE's work?

If anyone knows for sure, that would be great...

Thanks, Grant.

Ok, I have finished my research on RE's.

The TDP does NOT require a forging, but does specifically say that that it needs to be an "impact" extrusion made out of 7071.

Companies that do impact extrusion and make their RE's out of 7071:

LMT
CMT
Colt (who buys their RE's from CMT)

DSA RE's are 6061 (not the mil-spec 7071).

C4

P.S thank you EK for your technical knowledge on this subject.

C4IGrant

08-22-08, 14:24

Good pick! So, DSA's RE's are "MILSPEC" in SIZE ONLY. That's downright irritating. IMHO, they should not be able to call it MILSPEC unless it actually is...

From a technical angle, what are the impact differences between 6061 and 7071? For people who don't do "mortaring drills" will the 6061 extruded RE's work?

If anyone knows for sure, that would be great...

Thanks, Grant.

Most every Tier 3 AR manufacturer passes their AR's off as "mil-spec." I like to think of them as nothing better than a used car salesman.

6061 would be acceptable for most people uses I imagine.

C4

stormblue

08-22-08, 18:28

So does a CMT A2 RE cost $25 because it cheaper to make than a carbine RE or because it's not 7071?
I ask because I hate to assume anything and I need one. :)

Col_Crocs

08-22-08, 18:37

Has anyone done any research on the PK firearms RE on their Improved 6pos stock? I think the stock istelf is pretty good but am unsure about the RE.

C4IGrant

08-23-08, 09:54

So does a CMT A2 RE cost $25 because it cheaper to make than a carbine RE or because it's not 7071?
I ask because I hate to assume anything and I need one. :)

Don't know for certain on the CMT A2. I would say that it is NOT an impact extrusion.

C4

markm

08-23-08, 12:09

Good Lord. This is the deepest that I've seen the RE milspec talk go as far as specs and manufacturing.

When it came to REs, I didn't know all this.... I just trusted my common sense and knew was I wasn't going to buy based on price. The part is too important to price shop.

C4IGrant

08-23-08, 12:15

This is the deepest that I've seen the RE milspec talk go as far as specs and manufacturing.

Isn't this why you come to M4C? You can go to any buble gun forums for discussions on "color or cost", but you come to M4C for TECHNICAL info.

C4

markm

08-23-08, 12:31

Why am I still learning? I should know everything by now! (like the guys on TOS) :D

C4IGrant

08-23-08, 12:37

Why am I still learning? I should know everything by now! (like the guys on TOS) :D

Aren't we all still learning? I work in this industry day in and day out and learn something new everyday. If there is a day that I didn't learn anything, I just call someone like Vickers or EK and get educated on something I had no idea about. :)

C4

GONIF

08-23-08, 13:07

I have been getting my CMT mil spec M4 buffer tubes from a vendor I have dealt with for years and trust for $35.00. I was in the dark at how they were made and bought on price,just dumb luck . :D

VLODPG

08-23-08, 14:27

Isn't this why you come to M4C? You can go to any buble gun forums for discussions on "color or cost", but you come to M4C for TECHNICAL info.

C4

Yep!

What I didn't know or read in a tech manual, I have benn fortunate to find those in the know here.

chadbag

08-23-08, 15:32

So does a CMT A2 RE cost $25 because it cheaper to make than a carbine RE or because it's not 7071?
I ask because I hate to assume anything and I need one. :)

Rifle RE are also a much simpler geometry and hence easier to make. I don't know how they make theirs but just wanted to state something that is obvious to me but probably often gets overlooked. The simpler the geometry, the cheaper to make.

tiger seven

08-23-08, 17:22

Has anyone done any research on the PK firearms RE on their Improved 6pos stock? I think the stock istelf is pretty good but am unsure about the RE.

I have one of the mil-spec RE's from PK Firearms. I also have mil-spec RE's from LMT, VLTOR and CMT. My unscientific analysis (based largely on "feel") is that the RE from PK Firearms is much more like the CMT one than either of the others. Still, it's a nice RE and has worked just fine.

Hope that helps.

I agree that this is an interesting thread and it's always great to learn these sort of little details. :)

Derek

BravoGolf59

08-23-08, 18:47

Isn't this why you come to M4C? You can go to any buble gun forums for discussions on "color or cost", but you come to M4C for TECHNICAL info.

C4

This is exactly why I joined here and not any others. :cool:

C4IGrant

08-23-08, 20:33

This is exactly why I joined here and not any others. :cool:

Right there with ya.

C4

Broadway

08-23-08, 23:02

Count one more vote in the "I just learned something too" category.

M1A2_Tanker

08-23-08, 23:58

I see it as "Damn something else to worry about geeze!". : pulls hair out : :D
Just kidding

coltm4223

08-25-08, 12:02

Any markings on a RE to indicate who made it?

markm

08-25-08, 12:32

Any markings on a RE to indicate who made it?

I've never seen any markings on any of the REs I've owned.

b_saan

08-25-08, 17:30

Any markings on a RE to indicate who made it?

Vltor imprints their logo on the end of their tubes.

dilligaffrn

08-27-08, 16:32

http://global-tactical.com/milspeccarbinerectubespringandbuffer.aspx

...just mil-spec dimensions or dimensions and materials???

Anyone know?

TIA

Dill :)

OOPS, looks like all I needed was to look...

http://www.magpul.com/pdfs/buffertube-Milspec-M4.pdf

7075-T6 Forgings, is that better than Companies that do impact extrusion and make their RE's out of 7071

LMT
CMT
Colt (who buys their RE's from CMT)

???

chadbag

08-27-08, 16:36

http://global-tactical.com/milspeccarbinerectubespringandbuffer.aspx

...just mil-spec dimensions or dimensions and materials???

Anyone know?

TIA

Dill :)

Btw, those are not actually made by Magpul as stated on that page (AFAIK). They just bought them from someone else and resold them. That is what they told me last year. I had some of them in last year. Don't have any anymore so cannot say how they were marked or anything.

dilligaffrn

08-27-08, 16:46

Btw, those are not actually made by Magpul as stated on that page (AFAIK). They just bought them from someone else and resold them. That is what they told me last year. I had some of them in last year. Don't have any anymore so cannot say how they were marked or anything.

I just got off the phone with Denny, he said they were CMT.

So now I (we) know, LOL!

joe_sun

08-30-08, 17:10

RD62

08-30-08, 20:33

I just got off the phone with Denny, he said they were CMT.

So now I (we) know, LOL!

So am I following this right? The RE included with the Magpul CTR Mil-spec complete kit is a CMT? I got mine as part of the kit, and didn't give it much thought.

-RD62

chadbag

08-30-08, 20:43

So am I following this right? The RE included with the Magpul CTR Mil-spec complete kit is a CMT? I got mine as part of the kit, and didn't give it much thought.

-RD62

I would think that depends on where you got it from. Magpul does not sell such a kit with CTR and tube etc all packaged together. Vendors do the packaging themselves. Magpul does/did have a RET and stuff that they sold separately and Denny seems to be selling that as a separate item.

Recently I have been selling VLTOR tubes with CTR when people ask for a kit, for example.

skipper49

09-01-08, 19:30

Do all Colts have the Mil-spec RE, or just the ones from Colt Defense ?

Skip

markm

09-02-08, 08:42

Do all Colts have the Mil-spec RE, or just the ones from Colt Defense ?

Skip

All have the correct REs.

joe_sun

09-02-08, 09:17

Great Info! Now I'm wondering about my "milspec" stock

I bought one from Armalite and it's listed as a "milspec tube" for $56.00 for the whole kit.

http://www.armalite.com/ItemForm.aspx?Item=15702302

Anyone know if this is mil-spec 7071?

I got a reply from Armalite, their buffer is made from 6061 aluminum.

It's already been shipped so I can't cancel the order. I'll take a look at the rest of the kit and if it's worthwhile I'll just get a new Receiver Extension from Grant.. otherwise the whole thing will go for sale up on TOS.

jhova98040

09-08-08, 14:39

I assume that the BCM kit is good to go... Any one know?

C4IGrant

09-08-08, 14:56

I assume that the BCM kit is good to go... Any one know?

They are good.

C4

wmb556

09-08-08, 21:47

Grant, any idea which manufacturer makes the BCM buffer tube and whether it's impact extruded and 7071?

joe_sun

09-08-08, 23:30

I got a reply from Armalite, their buffer is made from 6061 aluminum.

It's already been shipped so I can't cancel the order. I'll take a look at the rest of the kit and if it's worthwhile I'll just get a new Receiver Extension from Grant.. otherwise the whole thing will go for sale up on TOS.

Okay got it in today and this is what I found.

The receiver tube looks nice but we all know otherwise now. The M4 stock that came with it is commercial. It has to because of all the sloppy slop rattle rattle in all positions.

The receiver end plate looks really nice as does the castle nut and buffer but the spring looks too short by maybe an inch compared to pics on the BCM website.

I put it up for sale on TOS and sold it in less than 5 min. I'm going to eat about $10.00 on this thing but hey I figure that's my punishment for trying to save a buck instead of getting a proven product.

C4IGrant

09-09-08, 08:48

Grant, any idea which manufacturer makes the BCM buffer tube and whether it's impact extruded and 7071?

I do not know, but do know that they are 7071 and high quality.

C4

Shihan

09-10-08, 02:28

1. How about someone making 'A List" on the RE's that has been following this closer than I have :p

2. I prefer the LMT RE's with their enhancements anyone else?