View Full Version : NEW ARMY SCANDAL
Ft. Hood in Texas is in my region. Local news commentators are talking about a new scandal. Last month the Army began placing females in combat brigades. Unfortunately, a new female addition to a Ft. Hood combat outfit had the living hell beat out of her by some of her male brigade members. The incident occurred at a party and apparently was fueled by too much alcohol consumption. The term beat down was used, and the young lady was apparently severely injured. It is said that the brass between Hood and Washington are suffering embarrassment. The incident was covered on the evening news on 4/6/16. No doubt some are looking for others to blame.
Well....that's bad. Real bad.
Here is a link to an article with more info.
http://www.armytimes.com/story/military/crime/2016/04/06/fort-hood-e-4-charged-assaulting-female-soldier/82719044/
Maybe they shouldn't have slapped her and what not. But to me isn't this much of why people argue woman shouldn't be in fighting units? Sexual relations with other enlisties causes drama?
Is a beat down common among soldiers in their off time? If it is between two men does it matter or do we hear about it? If so, and they take it better, but this female could not, how would she do in combat? If shoe couldn't handle what her male counterparts do are woman really equal?
None of this surprises me. I'd be supportive of all female combat units, that were all volunteer, but I don't agree with mixing woman and men in combat units.
http://patch.com/texas/downtownaustin/female-fort-hood-soldier-reportedly-beaten-male-counterparts
Here is a link to an article with more info.
http://www.armytimes.com/story/military/crime/2016/04/06/fort-hood-e-4-charged-assaulting-female-soldier/82719044/
Maybe they shouldn't have slapped her and what not. But to me isn't this much of why people argue woman shouldn't be in fighting units? Sexual relations with other enlisties causes drama?
Is a beat down common among soldiers in their off time? If it is between two men does it matter or do we hear about it? If so, and they take it better, but this female could not, how would she do in combat? If shoe couldn't handle what her male counterparts do are woman really equal?
None of this surprises me. I'd be supportive of all female combat units, that were all volunteer, but I don't agree with mixing woman and men in combat units.
They shouldn't have touched her, period. As it was off base and off hours it sounds like some drama related to relationships and boyfriend/girlfriend crap. This particular event has nothing to do with the whole women-in-combat-MOS thing, but of course that'll be tossed around as a false flag.
Edited to add, I wouldn't say this is a "scandal." It's very poor judgment by a bunch of drunk troops who let emotions and hormones get in the way of common sense. But I do see the axe of the JAG falling on a bunch of heads.
Averageman
04-07-16, 11:28
Happens every weekend at an Ivy League University, I'm sure.
Scandal, not so much, more like Drunk, Jealous and Horny along with some poor home training by Mom and Dad.
Have to agree with Chuckman on this one. This is not so much an integrated military thing- in this instance-- but a drunk shithead thing.
However, matches and gasoline tend not to have a very good long term relationship. When the time comes when it really is a military thingie, you'll see the brass tripping all over themselves explaining how it wasn't. Much like "workplace violence" at Ft Hood.
Inexcusable.
With that said, would as big a fuss, or even any fuss at all, have been raised over a male getting beaten down?
Women do not belong in ground combat roles, be it co-ed or all-female.
Agree this has little to do with women in combat arms roles and most likely drunk idiots acting like drunk idiots. Wonder if they have some form of retarded fraternity hazing ritual to become one of the crew?
Either way the JAG corps should fry the ****tards. There is no excuse for beating folks who aren't threatening you.
ramairthree
04-07-16, 23:41
Sounds like drunk guy found drunk girlfriend or ex making out with another drunk guy and young, drunk, stupid stuff ensued.
She will be a hero, and he will get hammer of Thor dropped on him.
She will end up in more heated drama episodes.
Very few non repeat offender victims in these cases.
Agree this has little to do with women in combat arms roles and most likely drunk idiots acting like drunk idiots. Wonder if they have some form of retarded fraternity hazing ritual to become one of the crew?
Either way the JAG corps should fry the ****tards. There is no excuse for beating folks who aren't threatening you.
No, JAG doesn't need to be involved (for now).
Local DA will try and get conviction with a jail sentence (hopefully 91 days or more) and then JAG can assist in his exit.
We used to fight for shits and giggles in my old units. We kept boxing gloves at work in my first Company so whenever someone ran their mouth, you could work it out like grown ass men. When we'd get bored, the cherries would roll with each other.
And one of our initiations for new guys involved tons of alcohol and fighting. It's what Infantrymen do.
We used to fight for shits and giggles in my old units. We kept boxing gloves at work in my first Company so whenever someone ran their mouth, you could work it out like grown ass men. When we'd get bored, the cherries would roll with each other.
And one of our initiations for new guys involved tons of alcohol and fighting. It's what Infantrymen do.
I like the idea of getting into a ring. At least then it's semi-controlled. As for booze and fighting and hazing, I have seen some units where is was a huge part of the culture; others, not at all. I don't believe combat effectiveness or unit integrity is increased by participating in that kind of behavior.
We used to fight for shits and giggles in my old units. We kept boxing gloves at work in my first Company so whenever someone ran their mouth, you could work it out like grown ass men. When we'd get bored, the cherries would roll with each other.
And one of our initiations for new guys involved tons of alcohol and fighting. It's what Infantrymen do.
Hazing shit happens cause well stupid happens. As a leader I would NEVER tolerate that kind of crap happening in totally uncontrolled and alcohol induced states. The concept that you need to beet someone, denigrate/humiliate and endanger their life to welcome them into a unit is as retarded as Hillary Clinton. Leaders who tolerate that raise serious questions IMO. There are constructive ways in which a new members mettle can be tested and unit cohesion built. Be that boxing ring, combatives training... whatever. Key word being TRAINING.
Disagreements between members for whatever can also be handled in a controlled environment.
This is generally what happens when children are left unsupervised.
Averageman
04-08-16, 10:21
I like the idea of getting into a ring. At least then it's semi-controlled. As for booze and fighting and hazing, I have seen some units where is was a huge part of the culture; others, not at all. I don't believe combat effectiveness or unit integrity is increased by participating in that kind of behavior.
We had a Company Commander who would set a rope on the ground in a circle and we would go at it two at a time. You tap out, or get thrown outside the rope, you're out and a new guy gets in.
Now the tricky part was that you could call out your opponent, if you had an issue you just worked it out there.
I was 1Sgt there and then and it was a great Tank Company. Battalion finally ended that fun with the XO coming over and complaining about decorum and standards and blah, blah, blah.
I was impressed with our Commander he was a great guy and a real hard charger. He lost a lung to cancer a year later and had to med retire and it eventually took his life.
But I digress;
Look it isn't about the Unit, as lots of guys have stated guys in units fight all of the time. It isn't about integrating females in to the unit, even if she was in another unit She very likely would have been at that or a similar party.
It's about society in general. There are a lot of Dads out there who are MIA, who do these boys then get their training at home from?
Young (under 30) and drinking and members of the opposite sex being together, do you think this doesn't happen in other organizations?
This happened down the road from here, it happens more often than you might think. Who wants to bet this is being used by the media?
Edit to add;
If it were two males, no problem.
If it were two females, no problem, but perhaps fun to watch.
Since it is a Male and Female and they are both Soldiers, National News Media Event!
Primus Pilum
04-08-16, 14:07
I like the idea of getting into a ring. At least then it's semi-controlled. As for booze and fighting and hazing, I have seen some units where is was a huge part of the culture; others, not at all. I don't believe combat effectiveness or unit integrity is increased by participating in that kind of behavior.
Disagree, If you want alphas, dont treat em like betas.
Aggression and competitiveness breeds excellence in combat arms. This shit is common in the special operations community. Not everyone is cut out to be a warrior and those that are, aren't the ones whining about it.
Fighting, hazing and drinking are common in the 75th. Its a right of passage.
Primus Pilum
04-08-16, 14:10
We had a Company Commander who would set a rope on the ground in a circle and we would go at it two at a time. You tap out, or get thrown outside the rope, you're out and a new guy gets in.
Now the tricky part was that you could call out your opponent, if you had an issue you just worked it out there.
I was 1Sgt there and then and it was a great Tank Company. Battalion finally ended that fun with the XO coming over and complaining about decorum and standards and blah, blah, blah.
I was impressed with our Commander he was a great guy and a real hard charger. He lost a lung to cancer a year later and had to med retire and it eventually took his life.
But I digress;
Look it isn't about the Unit, as lots of guys have stated guys in units fight all of the time. It isn't about integrating females in to the unit, even if she was in another unit She very likely would have been at that or a similar party.
It's about society in general. There are a lot of Dads out there who are MIA, who do these boys then get their training at home from?
Young (under 30) and drinking and members of the opposite sex being together, do you think this doesn't happen in other organizations?
This happened down the road from here, it happens more often than you might think. Who wants to bet this is being used by the media?
Edit to add;
If it were two males, no problem.
If it were two females, no problem, but perhaps fun to watch.
Since it is a Male and Female and they are both Soldiers, National News Media Event!
They want to run with the men, then they can be treated like men. The enemy isn't going to call time out because they are a split tail. They volunteered for it, so deal with it.
Disagree, If you want alphas, dont treat em like betas.
Aggression and competitiveness breeds excellence in combat arms. This shit is common in the special operations community. Not everyone is cut out to be a warrior and those that are, aren't the ones whining about it.
Fighting, hazing and drinking are common in the 75th. Its a right of passage.
I dare go to show me a special operation into that condones drunken brawling where some hold a member down while another beats on them. They may settle things like men so to speak but it ain't drunken brawling.
Primus Pilum
04-08-16, 14:20
I dare go to show me a special operation into that condones drunken brawling where some hold a member down while another beats on them. They may settle things like men so to speak but it ain't drunken brawling.
Circia 2004-2006 2/75th everyone got the shit beat out of them upon arrival. Fighting and Drinking were common. Hazing is common.
If you aren't ready to fight then you came to the wrong place.
Personally I want my military to be full of aggressive dogs who want nothing more than to fight and destroy shit. The idea of wiping out another civilization should give you morning wood.
Disagree, If you want alphas, dont treat em like betas.
Aggression and competitiveness breeds excellence in combat arms. This shit is common in the special operations community. Not everyone is cut out to be a warrior and those that are, aren't the ones whining about it.
Fighting, hazing and drinking are common in the 75th. Its a right of passage.
Sorry, I don't buy the whole drinking as an alpha thing. I concede Marine infantry is not The Regiment, but I was in some pretty good units where we DID drink like fish, but it certainly wasn't enforced or even encouraged. Just what we did. And we all know there is difference between hazing, and hazing. Like art, it's hard to define but you know it when you see it.
They shouldn't have touched her, period. As it was off base and off hours it sounds like some drama related to relationships and boyfriend/girlfriend crap. This particular event has nothing to do with the whole women-in-combat-MOS thing, but of course that'll be tossed around as a false flag.
Edited to add, I wouldn't say this is a "scandal." It's very poor judgment by a bunch of drunk troops who let emotions and hormones get in the way of common sense. But I do see the axe of the JAG falling on a bunch of heads.
But but, their professionals. That type of thing does not happen in the mil! doh....
Averageman
04-08-16, 14:51
They want to run with the men, then they can be treated like men. The enemy isn't going to call time out because they are a split tail. They volunteered for it, so deal with it.
I'm not disagreeing with you, but I think at some point a young man needs to learn slapping the crap out of your current or ex isn't going to work out well for you. There aren't many good reasons why you should have to put your hands on a Woman in an aggressive manner, one might hope that this was instilled by Dad at home before puberty kicks in.
Regardless of what she might have been doing, or who she was doing it with, the right thing to do is make a mental note of it walk away and go fish in other waters.
Making this an "Army" issue is taking it out of society as a whole, where it belongs.
If he isn't on extra duty tonight cutting acres and acres of Fort Hood grass, much poorer for the next couple of months and restricted to the Company area all while he possibly awaits a BCD for this, then the Army has seriously dropped the ball.
Whatever happened to Army Fraternization Regulations? I retired in December 1999 so maybe the "New" Army runs differently?
Circia 2004-2006 2/75th everyone got the shit beat out of them upon arrival. Fighting and Drinking were common. Hazing is common.
If you aren't ready to fight then you came to the wrong place.
Personally I want my military to be full of aggressive dogs who want nothing more than to fight and destroy shit. The idea of wiping out another civilization should give you morning wood.
I agree that it happens, but I disagree that it's condoned. Maybe ignored, but that kind of retarded behavior should not be condoned.
Beat the ever living crap out of one another during training in a controlled environment where you're not degrading unit readyness. Hard to be ready to fight with folks busted up and in the hospital.
Drunken brawling is the trademark of a retard not a professional. These guys were retards.
Personally I want my military to be full of aggressive dogs who want nothing more than to fight and destroy shit. The idea of wiping out another civilization should give you morning wood.
I like you. You would've been fun to be a TL with.
platoonDaddy
04-08-16, 17:49
This is a scandal, 12B female combat engineers: http://www.military.com/daily-news/2016/04/06/woman-commander-leads-way-for-new-female-combat-engineers.html
It's Ft Hood....emphasis on the Hood part.
Averageman
04-10-16, 09:59
Currently the way those Engineer Brigades are organized creates a Cluster F' for doing a lot of good stuff.
To say it makes everyone else's job a lot hard is an understatement.
It is a lot more difficult to identify issues when you're working in a chaotic environment.
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