View Full Version : Walther pistols: P99 vs PPQ
For anyone who has owned/fired both the P99 and PPQ, are the overall handling and accuracy characteristics similar?
Auto-X Fil
04-28-16, 10:11
No. Very different guns. The PPQ is better in every way.
Accuracy is comparable. Grip is similar. The P99 is only available with a paddle mag release (for now...M2 version with button release is rumored). And the P99 and PPQ use the same magazines.
Beyond that, they're completely different. The P99 is a SA/DA pistol with decocker. PPQ is a pure single-action with pre-cocked striker. The SA pull on the P99 is pretty good (longer take up with some ratcheting), but it's not as good as the trigger on the PPQ.
The only reason one might choose a P99 over a PPQ is if you would want a single-action/double action trigger with decocker.
P99 with the AS trigger can be set up to have a trigger about identical to a PPQ. I honestly don't see a lot of difference between the guns (P99 vs PPQ M1) in grip, handling or otherwise. They are both outstanding pistols IMO.
Both are striker fired and the AS trigger on the P99 allows it to be set up any way you want it: Short SA, DA/SA, or long SA/SA. The PPQ is only short SA.
That would be great for some. Personally, I have no interest in DA of any flavor, and I definitely don't want a defense pistol where I have to try to remember what mode the trigger was set in. I want my guns to work the same way every single time.
No question the P99 generates a lot of niche fan loyalty. I think it's a great firearm for some people. I personally have no interest in a DA firearm with decocker.
See the Walther Forum. Plenty of 'dual users' there. Recently I started onto DA/SA. I have been carrying a Kahr for a reason, and decided to go that route.
Plenty in the WF who use both say they like the SA on the P99 as good or better. I have handled the PPQ and the trigger, and I see no advantage in SA. Only go P99 if you want the DA/SA.
The grip in the PPQ fills the hand a tad more, and generally seems more comfortable to MOST. With a GLOVE, the P99 might be better - its a tad slimmer.
A DA/SA in a SF pistol is unique. The DA is light and smooth (or at least will get that way over time).
I like the slide release on the P99 WAY more. the PPQ SR is overkill and my support hand gets up underneath it - putting pressure on it - so I avoid the PPQ.
crusader377
04-28-16, 12:42
I recently looked at and shot both pistols though I decided to go another direction. I personally preferred the Walther P99 over the PPQ mainly because of the DA mode. The PPQ does have an outstanding trigger for a shooter but for me I didn't think it was a particularly safe trigger for carry because it was too light (Sort of light carrying a single action pistol without the safety engaged). Yes I know the standard answer is more training but even with trained individuals, bad things happen sometimes. IMO for the average shooter who is planning to carry, I think the P99 is the better choice.
Digital_Damage
04-28-16, 13:33
PPQ is superior in every way. I went from Glock to P99 to PPQ and don't regret the decision at all.
I don't understand the "light trigger" crowd, I suspect most of them came from a DA hammer fired background to make that claim.
That said, neither is a very good choice for every day carry.
They have other offerings that are better suited for that.
JackFanToM
04-28-16, 14:40
I don't get the "light trigger" statement at all. The PPQ is my carry gun and has been for over 3 years now. Yes you have added layers of protection adding slide safeties and DA triggers, but you also have added layers to overcome in a SD situation. Everything is a trade off. Oynx IWB holster and PPQ is the way I went, and my only complaint is that I haven't as of yet gone with a smaller single stack carry gun for certain situations...and that is a complaint about me personally, not the handgun. There are quite a few people that carry a Glock 19 as their carry firearm, and the PPQ is similar in size with better ergo's and smoother out of the box trigger IMO.
Had a 1st Gen P99 a decade ago.
It was....a'ight. It never got shot after while so it got traded. Once you realize you aren't 007, it's just an odd DA/SA striker pistol.
PPQ looks like a hi point, but it feels better and shoots nicer.
Me, personally, I would sooner get the VP9.
They are so similar and while the PPQ was a friend's, I owned a VP9 outright and didn't give it enough time to get over my inglocktrination and stupidly parted with it.
PPQ and VP9 are really, really close.
The P99 is more if you have a Walther collection and it isn't bad just, a product of the 90s.
But if you like traditional thumb mag release get the PPQ.
I don't get the "light trigger" statement at all. The PPQ is my carry gun and has been for over 3 years now. Yes you have added layers of protection adding slide safeties and DA triggers, but you also have added layers to overcome in a SD situation. Everything is a trade off. Oynx IWB holster and PPQ is the way I went, and my only complaint is that I haven't as of yet gone with a smaller single stack carry gun for certain situations...and that is a complaint about me personally, not the handgun. There are quite a few people that carry a Glock 19 as their carry firearm, and the PPQ is similar in size with better ergo's and smoother out of the box trigger IMO.
I have a couple of PPQ Classics and a VP9. I like both guns, generally prefer the VP9 as the trigger ergonomics seem to suit me a little better. I am completely indifferent to a paddle mag release vs a button on those guns. For the last couple of years I've been carrying a Walther PPS with the paddle. Just recently got a PPS M2 with the button release and I like it a lot better. The button on that single stack subcompact works better for me than the lever.
On the PPQ, I don't get the light trigger worries either, but I see other people talk about that so it must be a real concern of some people who carry that class of pistol.
I don't understand the 'I don't understand the light trigger crowd' thing. Some don't want s short light trigger for their first shot. You may disagree cuz you shoot 1000 rds per month snd have total confidence, but it is a valid concern for many today, DA/SA ain't over.
I have owned a PPQ since early after their introduction and just recently picked up a P99 AS.
Attributes of the PPQ are well known: ergos, trigger, accurate, etc. Short of a custom worked 1911, I shoot this weapon better than anything else I have owned (and being a confirmed gun whore, I have owned quite a number).
The P99 AS is in my mind a different animal. In traditional DA mode it is quite good compared to most DA pistols. I had a Sphinx about ten years ago and today have a CZ75 with Cajun Gun Works spring set; both of these have set a high bar in my mind for DA. The P99 DA does not reach that bar but is pretty close. One nice thing about the P99 is the ability to tune the DA by replacing the striker spring with Glock striker springs. Striker springs are relatively cheap (<$5) so I have tried several: Glock Blue (7#), Ghost 6#, and Wolfe 5.5#. Ghost 6# is what I am using and will use for now. It is a snug fit on the striker so there is no room for bind. It has yielded a very smooth steady pull. It has been 100% reliable with Lawman ammo (CCI primers). It has measured a 7# DA and 4.75# SA, which is principally a reduction of DA by about 2# and no measurable difference in SA than stock.
The AS function actually reminds me a little of the HK LEM with a distinct pause. Long, light trigger pull from trigger forward position, then a "click" like a set trigger and you're in SA. AS mode is a viable carry mode in my opinion. Like a Kahr somewhat or more a HK LEM, that long, light "first pull" does provide a measure of restraint or a "speed bump" in a stressful situation that the SA of the PPQ (and similar striker fired) do not.
The SA of the P99 AS is quite good, but the PPQ SA is a just shade better.
I have never shot DA/SA as well as SA; that probably puts me in the company of most folks. I have always understood the advantages of DA/SA in regard to more control in stressful situation (I cannot make myself say "safe" rather than "control" in this context, because it just depends on the shooter). The AS mode is a middle ground that intrigues me. Now that good weather is here, I'll be shooting more and probably before summer is over will figure out if the P99 is better for me that traditional striker fired (e.g. PPQ, P320).
The P99 is a different animal and I can see where for some, or particularly a first timer started with the P99, it could be an optimal pistol solution.
I have owned a PPQ since early after their introduction and just recently picked up a P99 AS.
Attributes of the PPQ are well known: ergos, trigger, accurate, etc. Short of a custom worked 1911, I shoot this weapon better than anything else I have owned (and being a confirmed gun whore, I have owned quite a number).
The P99 AS is in my mind a different animal. In traditional DA mode it is quite good compared to most DA pistols. I had a Sphinx about ten years ago and today have a CZ75 with Cajun Gun Works spring set; both of these have set a high bar in my mind for DA. The P99 DA does not reach that bar but is pretty close. One nice thing about the P99 is the ability to tune the DA by replacing the striker spring with Glock striker springs. Striker springs are relatively cheap (<$5) so I have tried several: Glock Blue (7#), Ghost 6#, and Wolfe 5.5#. Ghost 6# is what I am using and will use for now. It is a snug fit on the striker so there is no room for bind. It has yielded a very smooth steady pull. It has been 100% reliable with Lawman ammo (CCI primers). It has measured a 7# DA and 4.75# SA, which is principally a reduction of DA by about 2# and no measurable difference in SA than stock.
The AS function actually reminds me a little of the HK LEM with a distinct pause. Long, light trigger pull from trigger forward position, then a "click" like a set trigger and you're in SA. AS mode is a viable carry mode in my opinion. Like a Kahr somewhat or more a HK LEM, that long, light "first pull" does provide a measure of restraint or a "speed bump" in a stressful situation that the SA of the PPQ (and similar striker fired) do not.
The SA of the P99 AS is quite good, but the PPQ SA is a just shade better.
I have never shot DA/SA as well as SA; that probably puts me in the company of most folks. I have always understood the advantages of DA/SA in regard to more control in stressful situation (I cannot make myself say "safe" rather than "control" in this context, because it just depends on the shooter). The AS mode is a middle ground that intrigues me. Now that good weather is here, I'll be shooting more and probably before summer is over will figure out if the P99 is better for me that traditional striker fired (e.g. PPQ, P320).
The P99 is a different animal and I can see where for some, or particularly a first timer started with the P99, it could be an optimal pistol solution.
That nailed it nicely!
The P99 is a nice gun, if you're a fan of DA/SA firearms. If Walther does bring out an M2 version with a button mag release, as they have done with the PPQ and the PPS, that will likely breathe some new life into that old platform.
Never fired a P99, but IMHO, the PPQ is everything a Glock ever wanted to be and more.
El Pistolero
05-02-16, 18:33
As a SIG Sauer P226 user I am a big fan of the DA/SA trigger and the Walther P99AS would feel very natural for me, I plan to pick one up sometime. The PPQ has a fantastic trigger but is not as futuristically handsome like the P99.
operator81
05-02-16, 19:15
I have both. As a DA/SA guy, I love the p99 and only kind of like the ppq
I rented both and ended up going with the P99. The trigger on the PPQ is way too light for a self defense pistol with no manual safety. I actually had a unintentional double fire or I guess you could call it a bump fire while shooting it. It only takes one time for your shirt or other misc object to get caught in the trigger guard while holstering and you've shot your self in the ass or leg.
Cosmetically the slide doesn't look as cool either. I'm used to a da/sa trigger and the P99's is pretty good and easy to shoot fast. Love the paddle magazine release also. Very accurate.
For a duty pistol I would pick the PPQ, no questions. But for my usage I like the extra flexibility of having the double action, and the single action is almost as good as the PPQ. As a nightstand, farm work, truck console pistol I find the P99 hard to beat.
No manual safety, intuitive decocker, tactile cocked Indicator, easy transition back to single action if needed.
Be prepared for a zillion hardcore Glock owners to tell you you're a wussy for not just carrying single action
JackFanToM
06-16-16, 10:58
Please indicate that the trigger is too light in your opinion. Many of us carry it daily and have no issue with it. Train with it, and it is not an issue. I don't consider 5.5lbs too light, and if I ever find myself using it to defend my life I consider the time training with it paramount, not the trigger weight.
Be prepared for a zillion hardcore Glock owners to tell you you're a wussy for not just carrying single action
I'm a "hardcore Glock owner" and I still like and want a P99...it's a cool and unique system that's the best of both worlds. Would it replace my Glocks? Nah...parts availability, price, holsters, sights, etc. But I really like the gun itself.
For a self defense pistol, I want it to work exactly the same way every time I pull the trigger. I don't care for the DA/SA trigger pull, nor do I want to have to try to remember how I set the pistol's trigger mode. YMMV.
I carry the PPQ M1 AIWB and I'm a fan.
I, too, had an "accidental" double tap with the 'Q when I first got it, but once you get some more rounds down range, you get the hang of it.
Looking hard at either the PPS M2 or the G43 for the Texas heat, though...
JackFanToM
06-16-16, 11:40
Bad aim - I just relocated to Texas, so I can definitely get behind the need for a single stack carry pistol.
Bad aim - I just relocated to Texas, so I can definitely get behind the need for a single stack carry pistol.
I haven't carried my PPQ for several years, since I got a PPS Classic, more recently a PPS M2. I absolutely agree about a single stack 9mm. Ideal carry gun, for me at least.
For a self defense pistol, I want it to work exactly the same way every time I pull the trigger. I don't care for the DA/SA trigger pull, nor do I want to have to try to remember how I set the pistol's trigger mode. YMMV.
Fair enough, I'll admit it's an acquired taste. I grew up shooting double action revolvers, so it's a muscle memory thing for me.
That said, the P99 has some advantages over traditional DA / SA as the trigger placement is the same in single or double action. The take-up force does change, and it takes some getting used to.
There can also be some muscle memory confusion shooting PPQ and P99 together , however.
mkmckinley
06-17-16, 10:53
Bad aim - I just relocated to Texas, so I can definitely get behind the need for a single stack carry pistol.
Why do you need a single stack specifically for TX?
JackFanToM
06-17-16, 10:58
Not specifically for Texas, but due to heat and light clothing, you need a smaller more concealable firearm.
I haven't carried my PPQ for several years, since I got a PPS Classic, more recently a PPS M2. I absolutely agree about a single stack 9mm. Ideal carry gun, for me at least.
Although I haven't handled the P99, I do own both the PPQ M1 and the classic PPS. The PPS is a great carry piece for the heat. We have very high humidity here in SC, and I'm usually carrying the PPS in summer under a tshirt.
Not specifically for Texas, but due to heat and light clothing, you need a smaller more concealable firearm.
Exactly. Light clothing is key when it's still in the 90's around 10PM with 80%+ humidity. My PPQ does print a bit more than I would like when I start lightening things up.
I follow the whole "dress to your gun" thing to an extent, but I still enjoy getting laid. ;)
mkmckinley
06-17-16, 12:14
Not specifically for Texas, but due to heat and light clothing, you need a smaller more concealable firearm.
Ah got it. I just move to San Antonio and was worried there was yet another wierd legal thing I had to worry about.
JackFanToM
06-17-16, 12:16
Nope just worry about baking in your skin, and over indulging in bbq and Tex-mex [emoji4]
I have a PPQ M1, a PPQ M2 FDE and a P99 AS compact. Some replies have already given good information regarding the differences between these two fine polymer strikers. Others have given their personal preferences which are just that, personal likes. There is no answer to which one is "best", there is only which is best for you. My own preferences are these:
I've owned multiple DA/SA handguns over the decades from Sig, Smith, Beretta and others. Still have three Berettas in my safe that I like a lot. However, I like the P99 AS better than any of those previous DA/SA handguns.
I've owned Glocks for 20 years, including various models and calibers. Currently there are five Glocks in my safe and I like them all. I like both the PPQ and the P99 better than any Glock I have ever owned. The many available after market accessories are often cited for choosing a Glock. Unless you plan to extensively modify your Glock or other gun that is a meaningless reason. Other than changing sights on some of them, I don't need more than a holster and lots of ammo for my own handguns.
I also have the much touted VP9 and I love it. But, not quite as much as my PPQs. It's very close but, every time I go to the range and shoot them side by side I still slightly prefer the PPQ.
Both the PPQ and P99 AS are fine handguns. The only caveat about the P99 is whether Walther will continue to import it. There is speculation both yes and no but it is just that, speculation. The P99 and PPQ M1 both have paddle magazine releases. According to what I read the newly introduced PPQ M2 with the button release is outselling the M1 by a ratio of 10 to 1. The newly released PPS M2 is also button release. Walther seems to have decided the future of American sales lies mainly with a button release handgun. That's just a guess by me and others. I'm not taking chances that Walther will discontinue importing the paddle releases so I've been stocking up on magazines. Also, if you ever decide to sell or trade it I'll speculate that a P99 will not move as fast as a PPQ.
OP, hopefully you will get an opportunity to rent/use both and make your own decision. Good luck with your choice. No bad choices here.
The PPQ is part of the rage for SF guns and is a high form of the art. DA/SA will likely never come back to overtake them. I went SF years ago and avoided the PPQ ONLY because of the huge SS, which I 'knew' would turn out to occasionally cause premature slide lock. Lately I rethought DA/SA and think highly of the SIG SP 2022 and P99. The P99 provides Glock like weight reduction with a fairly light DA first pull and great SA trigger. The decocker is superb. Also the SS is almost perfectly executed. If the PPQ would have had the P99, all my SF guns would be PPQs. While I do really like the p99, the DA of the SP can't be matched. The P99 is very good but stacks a little too much at the end. Just my observation. The most important element of the DA/SA gun is the DA.
Note here the late discussion on concealment. One thing the P99 has in its favor is the compact model.
teutonicpolymer
06-17-16, 17:38
The PPQ has some really dumb features that just kills it for me as much as like other parts of it. The grip texture prevents the use of grit tape, the slide release levers are wat too big, magwell is a little narrow, the bore axis is a bit high (arguable issue), but the thing that makes the least sense to me is that the M2 frame especially has these weird contours that make it uncomfortable.
The PPQ has some really dumb features that just kills it for me as much as like other parts of it. The grip texture prevents the use of grit tape, the slide release levers are wat too big, magwell is a little narrow, the bore axis is a bit high (arguable issue), but the thing that makes the least sense to me is that the M2 frame especially has these weird contours that make it uncomfortable.
I have some Traction Grips on my Q and they fit perfectly and look fine. It took some time getting used to the slide release lever, but they do make reloads pretty dang fast.
I have the M1 and I'm a fan of the paddle release, so I can't speak to the M2.
The PPQ has some really dumb features that just kills it for me as much as like other parts of it. The grip texture prevents the use of grit tape, the slide release levers are wat too big, magwell is a little narrow, the bore axis is a bit high (arguable issue), but the thing that makes the least sense to me is that the M2 frame especially has these weird contours that make it uncomfortable.
Opinions vary, of course. I never use grip tape, the slide release lever is perfect, I've never even noticed a problem with the magwell, I practice a lot so that the bore axis doesn't affect my recoil control, and the "weird contours" are a major positive factor in the gun's ergonomics.
BuzzinSATX
06-17-16, 20:40
Ah got it. I just move to San Antonio and was worried there was yet another wierd legal thing I had to worry about.
OT: Welcome to the South Texas. We got here in 2008 from Japan and now live on the edge of the Hill Country in New Braunfels. Texas definitely has some benefits but also her fair share of quirks, depending on what you are used to.
Do you shoot IDPA? Texas Tactical holds several shoots per month at Cedar Ridge Range. First Saturday is a combined carbine/pistol shoot. lots of fin and a good bunch of folks. It's a lot of fun for $25 and a couple hundred rounds of ammo...
www.texastactical.com www.cerarridgerange.com
JackFanToM
06-17-16, 22:21
The PPQ has some really dumb features that just kills it for me as much as like other parts of it. The grip texture prevents the use of grit tape *Not sure what this about, I can send you my talon grips they fit perfect, but I stippled mine anyway...just works better IMO*, the slide release levers are wat too big *well they are purposefully big, so I'll concede this, although I like mine*, magwell is a little narrow *Narrow...please explain this is the first time anyone has ever made this claim to my knowledge and they feel the same as any Glock, S&W M&P I ever shot*, the bore axis is a bit high (arguable issue)*the PPQ is higher than some, lower than others, but with the amazing trigger most people are back on target faster than they are with other polymer striker fired pistols*, but the thing that makes the least sense to me is that the M2 frame especially has these weird contours that make it uncomfortable *uncomfortable????this one is just plain odd, you must have wierd hands as this is the most comfortable in the hand pistol I have ever felt*.
See comments between *
I have owned a PPQ since early after their introduction and just recently picked up a P99 AS.
I have never shot DA/SA as well as SA; that probably puts me in the company of most folks. I have always understood the advantages of DA/SA in regard to more control in stressful situation (I cannot make myself say "safe" rather than "control" in this context, because it just depends on the shooter). The AS mode is a middle ground that intrigues me. Now that good weather is here, I'll be shooting more and probably before summer is over will figure out if the P99 is better for me that traditional striker fired (e.g. PPQ, P320).
The P99 is a different animal and I can see where for some, or particularly a first timer started with the P99, it could be an optimal pistol solution.
This is postscript to my post above from April. If the following sounds conflicted, it is because it is.
I ended up trading the P99.
I still think it a fine weapon, and I will repeat what I said above about someone starting out or who will own and operate one pistol. If I were going to fully commit to DA/SA, the P99 would be it. After replacing the striker spring (eventually went to the Ghost 6.5# Glock spring) the DA was 7#, 100% reliable, and almost as smooth as a 90's vintage Sphinx I once owned.
But I guess I have been shooting 1911's and striker fired (e.g. PPQ, PPS, P320) too long, I caught myself "jumping" the trigger on my striker fired weapons from having worked at the P99 DA/SA. Matter of time before I made a mistake.
So, with regret, I traded the P99. Nonetheless, it is a fine pistol.
But I guess I have been shooting 1911's and striker fired (e.g. PPQ, PPS, P320) too long, I caught myself "jumping" the trigger on my striker fired weapons from having worked at the P99 DA/SA. Matter of time before I made a mistake.
So, with regret, I traded the P99. Nonetheless, it is a fine pistol.
So, because you aren't all DA/SA, you got rid of the P99, because you believe it ruined you for your SF guns? Did you consider carrying the P99 in AS mode?
I have also tricked out a P99 with a Wolff Glock 6# spring. Had 1 FTF with crap Perfekta ammo. Hundreds of rounds since, and no FTFs. I may try the 6.5 LB Ghost. It DOES make the DA a thing of beauty. I do like the P99. It is very light, comes back on target well because of the grip. On the aesthetics side, it screams Walther - and I think is the best looking poly gun out there. Kinda the BHP of striker guns.
I've never been interested in the P99 because after years with my P229 I decided to move away from DA/SA handguns. No interest whatsoever, likewise no interest in owning a gun where I have to decide or remember what "mode" it's in. I want a gun that I'm carrying to work exactly the same way every single time I pull it from the holster without worrying about what kind of trigger pull I'm going to have. I'm sure the P99 is a fine weapon for many people. Likewise the PPQ, but I think they are different people. Nice to have choices.
With the P99 you practice a mode and that's it. If you want DA/SA you decock and holster like your 229 or Berretta. If you want to commit to something different , you don't decock and use AS, like your Glock/PPQ. You make your choice in training. Choose a method, and drive on.
I have really considered a P2000 LEM lately also. Again, a training issue. Let the trigger out too far and you end up with a 12 LB DA. There it all changes midstream. But for many, it works great. With the P99, you choose your mode up front. But, two years down the road you can choose another path, and have an option.
For me, I consider the PPQ to be too light and with the spring precocked, I'm not comfortable. Many here find it fine and train through it. With the P99 there is a choice with no mod to the gun. Pick the training you want, and use as needed.
I do think the P99 could use better stippling OTB in 'a next gen'. Although, even when your hands are sopping wet there is something about the grip shape that keeps the weapon in position. I also just love the paddle mag release. Its the only one that allows me to keep my hand absolutely in place when changing. I do wish they still fielded the ambi slide release as in Europe - but not a gamestopper.
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