View Full Version : AG split with FBI Director
platoonDaddy
06-16-16, 17:33
The AG wants to disclose classified terrorism investigations through using Terrorist Watch Lists as another check on gun purchases. She overruled the Director of the FBI on this issue. This proposed law would not have blocked the Orlando shooter from buying his guns because he was not on the any list when he purchased his guns.
If this law passes, a person suspecting that the FBI might be investigating them, could merely go to a gun store, purport to buy a gun, and have the store run the federal check for him. Absolutely absurd. Police do not have access to this list unless they get a TS clearance and are working on an FBI Task Force under an FBI SA Supervisor. Let’s throw all that away and give the terrorist a means to check and see if their name is on the list. This law will give the terrorists a means to determine if they are being investigated.
http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2016-06-16/justice-department-sides-with-democrats-on-gun-control
I am a proponent of breaking down that barrier if there's no PC that a crime has actually been committed. The secrecy to date has actually hindered the prevention of these attacks, not prevented them. If they want to in any way restrict watch listed persons from their 2nd Amendment rights, loss of secrecy is the price they must pay.
I am a proponent of breaking down that barrier if there's no PC that a crime has actually been committed. The secrecy to date has actually hindered the prevention of these attacks, not prevented them. If they want to in any way restrict watch listed persons from their 2nd Amendment rights, loss of secrecy is the price they must pay.
Absolutely! Any Due Process caveats to allow someone mistakenly put on the list to clear themselves will necessitate the feds to divulge why they're on the list in the first place. A simple "You're on the list but we can't tell you why" ain't gonna cut it.
I also have an issue with exactly what criteria are used to determine who gets placed on the list. In this upside-down bizzaro country we live in at some point in the future you could see someone who hasn't turned over the Evil Assault Weapons 4473's say they have be put on the list if for no other reason than to fvck with them and make their lives difficult. If you suggest that's tinfoil material then you can wad it up and shove it in the space your head currently occupies. Shit is getting unbelievable in this country really quick.
She is doing this simply because she KNOWS no real terror investigations will be hindered by the secret list loonacy. Those folks will be quickly removed form the secret list and put on the double secret list. Only her political targets will remain on the secret list. Good luck getting off of it. Wanna bet it will be like asset forfeiture and a LOOOOOOOOOONG, costly legal battle with redacted letters going missing and servers being wiped.
SomeOtherGuy
06-16-16, 20:31
The "no fly list" is constitutionally defective and should have been permanently suspended the day after it was created. Extending it to guns does not remedy the complete failure of due process and constitutional validity.
Some of the supporters may mean well, but it's no more legitimate than an EO or agency action declaring one exclusive national religion, or allowing for warrant-free searches anywhere, any time, without any reason.
She is doing this simply because she KNOWS no real terror investigations will be hindered by the secret list loonacy. Those folks will be quickly removed form the secret list and put on the double secret list. Only her political targets will remain on the secret list. Good luck getting off of it. Wanna bet it will be like asset forfeiture and a LOOOOOOOOOONG, costly legal battle with redacted letters going missing and servers being wiped.
This also. This regime certainly knows all the sleazy, unethical and illegal tricks to play.
Wasn't The Patriot Act supposed to make all of this completely unnecessary in the first place? Isn't that the justification for NSA recording everything sent wholesale? Why are they tracking my cell calls, texts and emails when a guy who has been investigated by the FBI TWICE can keep flying under the radar?
Why were my rights to privacy sacrificed if we can't even stop a guy who brags about ties to terrorist groups and openly supports them? The SPLC did a better job tracking white supremacist groups and members and they are nothing more than a law firm with a website.
Here is how great the "no fly list" is...there are active AIRLINE PILOTS ON IT.
Here is how great the "no fly list" is...there are active AIRLINE PILOTS ON IT.
They aren't "active" if they're on the list. I say that with certainty on this subject.
Outlander Systems
06-17-16, 07:27
Money.
Go to the YouTubes. Type in, "William Binney."
Money, my good man. Can't justify tremendous spending if you're only using effective, targeted surveillence.
Wasn't The Patriot Act supposed to make all of this completely unnecessary in the first place? Isn't that the justification for NSA recording everything sent wholesale? Why are they tracking my cell calls, texts and emails when a guy who has been investigated by the FBI TWICE can keep flying under the radar?
Why were my rights to privacy sacrificed if we can't even stop a guy who brags about ties to terrorist groups and openly supports them? The SPLC did a better job tracking white supremacist groups and members and they are nothing more than a law firm with a website.
It is very simple.
No Fly list equals no guns.
President Clinton orders the FBI to identify every gun forum member, upon identification your placed on the no fly list for being a subversive.
If you still can't bring yourself to vote for Trump, I don't know what to say.
The AG wants to disclose classified terrorism investigations through using Terrorist Watch Lists as another check on gun purchases. She overruled the Director of the FBI on this issue. This proposed law would not have blocked the Orlando shooter from buying his guns because he was not on the any list when he purchased his guns.
If this law passes, a person suspecting that the FBI might be investigating them, could merely go to a gun store, purport to buy a gun, and have the store run the federal check for him. Absolutely absurd. Police do not have access to this list unless they get a TS clearance and are working on an FBI Task Force under an FBI SA Supervisor. Let’s throw all that away and give the terrorist a means to check and see if their name is on the list. This law will give the terrorists a means to determine if they are being investigated.
http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2016-06-16/justice-department-sides-with-democrats-on-gun-control
This is further proof that the political arm of the administration is far more interested in gun control than stopping terrorism.
I can't imagine what it must be like to be a LE Professional, and not only understand that this is the case, but as a matter of process know that you comply or resign.
Because, politics.
ETA...
And I think it should be noted, that Gitmo, the thing they claim is against our values, is nothing more than the physical manifestation of their precious list.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
It is very simple.
No Fly list equals no guns.
President Clinton orders the FBI to identify every gun forum member, upon identification your placed on the no fly list for being a subversive.
If you still can't bring yourself to vote for Trump, I don't know what to say.
Well put and on point.
FromMyColdDeadHand
06-17-16, 11:16
It is very simple.
No Fly list equals no guns.
President Clinton orders the FBI to identify every gun forum member, upon identification your placed on the no fly list for being a subversive.
If you still can't bring yourself to vote for Trump, I don't know what to say.
Nope, not all. Just the most vocal. That way to subvert the others to silence.
On the No-buy list busting the investigations into people, wouldn't the same thing happen when they try to buy an airline ticket, which could be cheaper than buying a gun? What is so particular about a gun buy versus an airline ticket. It isn't the issue of time, since the overseas flights don't release the manifests till right before flight time, right?
Nope, not all. Just the most vocal. That way to subvert the others to silence.
On the No-buy list busting the investigations into people, wouldn't the same thing happen when they try to buy an airline ticket, which could be cheaper than buying a gun? What is so particular about a gun buy versus an airline ticket. It isn't the issue of time, since the overseas flights don't release the manifests till right before flight time, right?
Or they scan all the 4473's and see you have bought a number of Evil Assault Weapons over the years and you deny having them anymore, they search your house but don't find any, they suspect (but can't prove) you have them hidden somewhere......viola, No-Fly/No-Buy list for you just to make life more difficult until you come around to see things their way.
It is very simple.
No Fly list equals no guns.
President Clinton orders the FBI to identify every gun forum member, upon identification your placed on the no fly list for being a subversive.
If you still can't bring yourself to vote for Trump, I don't know what to say.
But Trump agrees with the no fly/no buy list. In Hitlery's words directed at Trump, "welcome to the struggle" or something like that. In the lesser of two evils dichotomy, he seems to be harder and harder to discern.
ColtSeavers
06-17-16, 16:53
She is doing this simply because she KNOWS no real terror investigations will be hindered by the secret list loonacy. Those folks will be quickly removed form the secret list and put on the double secret list. Only her political targets will remain on the secret list. Good luck getting off of it. Wanna bet it will be like asset forfeiture and a LOOOOOOOOOONG, costly legal battle with redacted letters going missing and servers being wiped.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0cF2piwjYQ
If the government wants no fly/no buy and they install due process into the system. That works for me at this point in time.
If the NSA would narrow the focus of the intercepts they do and target only muslims. Then use this information gained to help make a no fly/ no buy list based on a person visiting terrorist web pages or emailing terrorist or madrases over seas . Then I think we might have a situation where the country is made safer.
However... they will never due so cause it isnt PC
They aren't "active" if they're on the list. I say that with certainty on this subject.
Yup. That's another problem I have with it. I'm a commercial pilot. If I wind up on this list, am I going to lose my ability to work? Craziness!
Outlander Systems
06-17-16, 18:04
For those with concerns about being on the list; simply convert to Islam, and they'll take you right off.
ColtSeavers
06-17-16, 18:35
For those with concerns about being on the list; simply convert to Islam, and they'll take you right off.
Twice if necessary!
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