M4 vs C8 question

[Macca1982]

Hi folks. I am new to the forum but as a bit military special forces buff (nerd), I've a question that has been bugging me for sometime. While the M4 is the standard weapon of both the US conventional and special forces, British special forces use the Colt Canada (formerly Diemaco) C8, (with their conventional forces using a non-AR, bull-pup system, I believe.) But why did their SF units opt for the C8 when they could have used the M4. Does the C8 have any known benefits over the M4? If they had used M4 carbines (http://www.used.forsale/m4-carbines) it would have standardized their weapon system with US SF (with whom they operate in conjunction with regularly). That would have made more sense in my eyes. (Just my 2 cents worth). But to cut to the chase, I guess my question is whether there are any pros or cons to the M4 over the C8, and vice versa. Any insights greatly appreciated.

[Eurodriver]

I've got no experience with a C8, but I know enough about military logistics to say that a pretty high-on-the-list reason they adopted their own variant is because some bureaucrat wanted to make a lot of money designing it.

[mildot]

Off the "top of my head" the only thing that comes to mind is that the C8 has a "cold hammer forged barrel" I'm no SME, and I'm not certain if the M4 has the same?

[scooter22]

Off the "top of my head" the only thing that comes to mind is that the C8 has a "cold hammer forged barrel" I'm no SME, and I'm not certain if the M4 has the same?

Colt M4's do not have CHF. Not sure about FN...

[KalashniKEV]

But why did their SF units opt for the C8 when they could have used the M4.

The answer is the C7.

Canadians saw the changes that were made going from M16A1 to M16A2 and knew that some were good (like the brass deflector) and some were stupid (like the unlocked knobs). They started doing their own thing from back then kept on with it.

There is an argument to be made for their unique pieces (collapsible stock on the C7, Simon Sleeve on the C8, FSB mounted rails) against their American counterparts.

[Koshinn]

Isn't the rail on the upper receiver different too?

[Macca1982]

Hi folks. I am new to the forum but as a bit military special forces buff (nerd), I've a question that has been bugging me for sometime. While the M4 is the standard weapon of both the US conventional and special forces, British special forces use the Colt Canada (formerly Diemaco) C8, (with their conventional forces using a non-AR, bull-pup system, I believe.) But why did their SF units opt for the C8 when they could have used the M4. Does the C8 have any known benefits over the M4? If they had opted for M4 carbines it would have standardized their weapon system with US SF (with whom they operate in conjunction with regularly). That would have made more sense in my eyes. (Just my 2 cents worth). But to cut to the chase, I guess my question is whether there are any pros or cons to the M4 over the C8, and vice versa. Any insights greatly appreciated.


Off the "top of my head" the only thing that comes to mind is that the C8 has a "cold hammer forged barrel" I'm no SME, and I'm not certain if the M4 has the same?


The answer is the C7.

Canadians saw the changes that were made going from M16A1 to M16A2 and knew that some were good (like the brass deflector) and some were stupid (like the unlocked knobs). They started doing their own thing from back then kept on with it.

There is an argument to be made for their unique pieces (collapsible stock on the C7, Simon Sleeve on the C8, FSB mounted rails) against their American counterparts.

Thanks guys. These answers make the most sense to me and pretty much answer my question.


I've got no experience with a C8, but I know enough about military logistics to say that a pretty high-on-the-list reason they adopted their own variant is because some bureaucrat wanted to make a lot of money designing it.

Eurodriver, although I would normally agree with your theory (especially as far as conventional forces are concerned) my research has lead me to believe that SF (British in particular) pretty much get whatever they ask for, which is what lead me to believe that there must be a specific reason that they opted for the C8. Just my thoughts.

[Macca1982]

Hi folks. I am new to the forum but as a bit military special forces buff (nerd), I've a question that has been bugging me for sometime. While the M4 is the standard weapon of both the US conventional and special forces, British special forces use the Colt Canada (formerly Diemaco) C8, (with their conventional forces using a non-AR, bull-pup system, I believe.) But why did their SF units opt for the C8 when they could have used the M4. Does the C8 have any known benefits over the M4? If they had opted for M4 carbines it would have standardized their weapon system with US SF (with whom they operate in conjunction with regularly). That would have made more sense in my eyes. (Just my 2 cents worth). But to cut to the chase, I guess my question is whether there are any pros or cons to the M4 over the C8, and vice versa. Any insights greatly appreciated.

Just as an added bit of interest, it seems the UK SF C8 fleet has recently undergone a mid-life upgrade:

40456 40457

[Macca1982]

Just as an added bit of interest, it seems the UK SF C8 fleet has recently undergone a mid-life upgrade:

40456 40457

Here's the article I found about it if anybody is interested. I find it very interesting to comparing pre and post upgrade: http://www.thinkdefence.co.uk/2014/06/l119a2-colt-canada-c8-upgrade/