View Full Version : The ATF Is Illegally Hoarding American Gun Owners’ Personal Information
platoonDaddy
08-02-16, 15:42
Nah, they certainly wouldn’t do this:
A government report discovered the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) illegally stockpiles gun owners’ personal information.
The U.S. Government Accountability Office (GAO), the go-to federal oversight agency, conducted an audit of ATF and found it does not remove certain identifiable information, despite the law explicitly mandating it do so. GAO conducted reviews for four data systems, and concluded at least two of ATF’s systems violated official protocols.
http://dailycaller.com/2016/08/02/the-atf-is-illegally-hoarding-american-gun-owners-personal-information/
Nah, they certainly wouldn’t do this:
A government report discovered the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) illegally stockpiles gun owners’ personal information.
The U.S. Government Accountability Office (GAO), the go-to federal oversight agency, conducted an audit of ATF and found it does not remove certain identifiable information, despite the law explicitly mandating it do so. GAO conducted reviews for four data systems, and concluded at least two of ATF’s systems violated federal law.
http://dailycaller.com/2016/08/02/the-atf-is-illegally-hoarding-american-gun-owners-personal-information/
Fixed it for them. :(
this day and age everything and everything
come on anyone who thinks they are not is silly in the head !
just look at how corrupt our system is anymore and look at even google strengths and you think they don't have EVERYTHING on you with easy access etc...
So what will be done about this illegal anti-American activity? Will the info be removed? Will the responsible parties be fired? Will charges be filed?
Or will the FBI investigate them, discover they did it, and then refuse to charge them for the crimes they committed?
Averageman
08-02-16, 16:58
As Texans said long ago "Come and Take it".
I have a feeling that numerous States and Texas specifically are waiting to tell these guy to "Go ahead, ride that one on in".
I have a feeling the feelings that get hurt really bad aren't going to be in the fly over States. Send the Director of the ATF personally to come take some weapons and send him and his buddies door to door without State or Local Back-up.
So they have time for this but no time for immigration enforcement or keeping tabs on the "Syrians" they insist on dumping in America wholesale despite nobody wanting them here?
They aren't going to "come and take" your weapons. They'll incrementalize it. They'll make possession illegal and confiscate the gun if and when they catch you using it. They'll de-weaponize America over a period of decades, not weeks or months.
ColtSeavers
08-02-16, 17:03
So they have time for this but no time for immigration enforcement or keeping tabs on the "Syrians" they insist on dumping in America wholesale despite nobody wanting them here?
Only because law abiding citizens were 'kind' enough to provide personal information on government paperwork for them to neatly and 'accidentally' collect via 4473s and NFA. Illegal aliens and refugees simply don't do that sort of thing, which would require work to actually find out and even verify, versus doing a database search.
This agency is completely out of control. And it has been a joke for a long time. Anyone ever watch the documentaries on how they infiltrate the "outlaw biker" clubs? The RIDICULOUS amount of time, money, and effort wasted to get a few pissant gun transactions, and a bunch of failures to convict for any actual crimes??? Complete retardation.
Doc Safari
08-02-16, 17:23
Don't tell anybody....but there's no Santa Claus or Easter Bunny, either.
Seriously, did anybody believe that when the law forbade them to hold onto data that they would actually comply?
Dorothy, wake up....
Averageman
08-02-16, 17:30
http://www.vice.com/read/some-of-the-biggest-names-in-us-law-enforcement-just-told-congress-to-fix-the-system-vgtrn
Between 1980 and 2014, America's federal prison population exploded by 790 percent, even though crime rates fell for much of that same period. Nearly half of those locked behind federal prison bars are there for nonviolent drug offenses, and the duration of the average prison stay is up, too—by 36 percent since 1990.
"Mass incarceration makes our country worse off, and we need to do something about it," President Obama told the NAACP back in July of last year.
So if I sell some dope we're good, if I exersize a Constitutional right; well, not so much?
Doc Safari
08-02-16, 17:33
http://www.vice.com/read/some-of-the-biggest-names-in-us-law-enforcement-just-told-congress-to-fix-the-system-vgtrn
Between 1980 and 2014, America's federal prison population exploded by 790 percent, even though crime rates fell for much of that same period. Nearly half of those locked behind federal prison bars are there for nonviolent drug offenses, and the duration of the average prison stay is up, too—by 36 percent since 1990.
"Mass incarceration makes our country worse off, and we need to do something about it," President Obama told the NAACP back in July of last year.
So if I sell some dope we're good, if I exersize a Constitutional right; well, not so much?
Really? You think you live in a country that has justice, fairness, the rule of law, and an actual Constitution that is in full force and effect?
Don't make me laugh.
We live in a giant bureaucracy where laws have been piled upon laws until literally almost anyone could be incarcerated for something. Stop living in fantasyland and realize that you are not free, and you never were free, and you are not likely to be free in the forseeable future.
So does this mean that F-Troop will lose their regulation licensing since they willfully violated stated policies? Are the key parties going to be arrested, fined, imprisoned and barred from working in law enforcement or government regulation for the rest of their lives?
Outlander Systems
08-02-16, 18:24
****ing gospel.
Anyone arguing otherwise needs to grow up.
Really? You think you live in a country that has justice, fairness, the rule of law, and an actual Constitution that is in full force and effect?
Don't make me laugh.
We live in a giant bureaucracy where laws have been piled upon laws until literally almost anyone could be incarcerated for something. Stop living in fantasyland and realize that you are not free, and you never were free, and you are not likely to be free in the forseeable future.
So, the server farm is in Martinsburg, WV. When does this illegal data stored go bye bye? How many bitcoins would it take for a Russian hacker to drop off a virus? I sense a group buy in the making...
Dist. Expert 26
08-02-16, 19:23
I don't even care. This whole election cycle has shown just how unequivocally f***ed we are as a nation. Voting isn't going to change anything and the government isn't going to fix itself.
So I'm done stressing about it. When things finally fall apart you can find me up on my mountain.
They aren't going to "come and take" your weapons. They'll incrementalize it. They'll make possession illegal and confiscate the gun if and when they catch you using it. They'll de-weaponize America over a period of decades, not weeks or months.
The scenario you lay out is the most likely to occur. Could the extreme happen? Sure, but most likely it will be a jilted ex, nosey neighbor, or jealous/vindictive "friend" or family member who will drop a dime on you. No doubt there would be large swaths of the country (namely out in the "sticks") where firearms and their use will continue for another generation or more. Like OH58 likes to say, similar to Prohibition.
I don't even care. This whole election cycle has shown just how unequivocally f***ed we are as a nation. Voting isn't going to change anything and the government isn't going to fix itself.
So I'm done stressing about it. When things finally fall apart you can find me up on my mountain.
Kinda how I feel. I'll just hang out behind a haji shop in the inner city, shoot dice, drink OJ and vodka all day wearing sweat clothes and slippers.
So, the server farm is in Martinsburg, WV. When does this illegal data stored go bye bye? How many bitcoins would it take for a Russian hacker to drop off a virus? I sense a group buy in the making...
Ha! The cloud backup service they use is named PutinBox.ru - - they would just call and have him restore it. What do you think Barry meant when he told Putin to hold on until he got elected again?
So, the server farm is in Martinsburg, WV. When does this illegal data stored go bye bye? How many bitcoins would it take for a Russian hacker to drop off a virus? I sense a group buy in the making...
I read YEARS ago (pre-9/11) about the ATF logging in those "unique identifying numbers" at their (then) new facility in Martinsburg. Now this is despite the letter of the Brady Law which created NICS. It was supposed to be destroyed in 24 hours, then it got extended to maybe 6 months? Of course the extensions were ostensibly for "audit" purposes.
They can eat shit.
I like your line of thinking there about the bitcoins! Hack the fvck out of it!
Doc Safari
08-02-16, 19:54
The thing is, though, the gummunt would have all the information it wants on your gun ownership even without the BATFreaks collecting more.
Ever bought a gun, ammo, gun part, or something gun-related on a credit card?
You're on the list.
Maybe not how many firearms of what type you bought, but....you're on the list.
That's the 'RED' list, by the way....you know...the 'terrorist' list.
Pretty soon all those AR's you bought will get you on the no-fly list.
Then when you go to the doctor, he'll ask you under penalty of perjury if you own any guns just before he prescribes you some Xanax.
And you'll either be lucky enough to get that 'courtesy' knock on the door by the sheriff before the ATF demands you come out and let them have your guns.....OR.....you will get that sort of "insistent" knock from a battering ram at 2 am where they decided it wasn't necessary to greet you before they charge in and take everything.
Outlander Systems
08-02-16, 19:57
Doc, no way. This is 'Merica. 'Cause, freedom.
When the law keepers ignore and break the law with impunity, and the law givers look the other way because none of them want to uphold justice... there is no law...
Doc Safari
08-02-16, 21:34
Doc, no way. This is 'Merica. 'Cause, freedom.
This is the most dangerous time in our history since 1776. Even World War 2 and the Cold War did not threaten our freedom from within like current conditions do.
This is the most dangerous time in our history since 1776. Even World War 2 and the Cold War did not threaten our freedom from within like current conditions do.
Still not sure we have gotten as bad as the 1930s. When was the last time you heard of somebody being forcibly sterilized because they were declared indigent? When was the last time a group of protesting vets were attacked by Army forces and the homeless members of the group burned out of their encampments at the US capitol?
Still not sure we have gotten as bad as the 1930s. When was the last time you heard of somebody being forcibly sterilized because they were declared indigent? When was the last time a group of protesting vets were attacked by Army forces and the homeless members of the group burned out of their encampments at the US capitol?
That is the point....... You would not hear about it because the media is part of the problem.
Collegefour
08-02-16, 22:55
This is the most dangerous time in our history since 1865. Even World War 2 and the Cold War did not threaten our freedom from within like current conditions do.
Fixed that for ya.
That is the point....... You would not hear about it because the media is part of the problem.
While I agree with your point about the MSM, to the best of my knowledge we don't currently have a eugenics program. We have a preferential, race based system of benefits and rewards but that is still a far cry from an actual eugenics program where you can be forcibly sterilized because a court decided you aren't suitable to reproduce.
And I'm sure there have been plenty of instances where a veterans group has been treated poorly, like recent VA scandals which thankfully did get some press. But we have never seen anything in our lifetimes where a sitting President ordered the US military to actually attack a group of protesting war veterans like we saw with the Bonus Army March in 1932.
I personally think that one was the worst thing a US president ever did and it should have resulted in the resignations of MacArthur, Patton, William Mitchell and Dwight Eisenhower. MacAarthur then should have been charged and sentenced to death.
Moose-Knuckle
08-03-16, 04:11
"If you like your personal information you can keep your personal information."
Reminds me of a member here who had BATFE agents come to his house with photo copies of 4473s during the Fast & Furious debacle.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?60158-So-the-ole-ATF-stopped-by
Averageman
08-03-16, 07:00
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/atf-head-our-job-is-not-to-take-away-peoples-guns/
Brandon also says his agency is hampered by not having the necessary technology. Congress has imposed constraints on ATF, such as prohibiting the agency from creating a computerized database of gun purchases.
"I think we ought to get rid of the ATF," says Rep. James Sensenbrenner (R-Wis.). Sensenbrenner opposes the AFT having a searchable database of gun manufacturing and gun sales because, he says, it amounts to "de facto gun registration."
Yet, Brandon says, not having the database hurts. Indeed, after the San Bernardino shootings, it took 12 hours to find out who owned the guns used in the attack. He says a computer database would have helped, and adds that not having one simply doesn't make sense.
Deputy Director, Head Thomas Brandon tells CBS' "Sunday Morning" that the agency's job is not to take away firearms from people, but to regulate weapons that can be misused.
Hmmm now that's rather telling in some ways, but in others?
What weapon can't be MISUSED?
The_War_Wagon
08-03-16, 07:11
The BATmen are breaking the law?! Pshaw, you say! :rolleyes:
Whiskey_Bravo
08-03-16, 07:28
They aren't going to "come and take" your weapons. They'll incrementalize it. They'll make possession illegal and confiscate the gun if and when they catch you using it. They'll de-weaponize America over a period of decades, not weeks or months.
this.
Well, one thing for sure... need to re-think that Bitcoin idea....
http://www.msn.com/en-us/money/technology/bitcoin-worth-dollar72-million-stolen-from-bitfinex-exchange-in-hong-kong/ar-BBvbKcC?ocid=ansmsnmoney11
Doc Safari
08-03-16, 10:27
They aren't going to "come and take" your weapons. They'll incrementalize it. They'll make possession illegal and confiscate the gun if and when they catch you using it. They'll de-weaponize America over a period of decades, not weeks or months.
Hillary Clinton and the Democrat party are openly advocating Australian-style confiscation. It may have been true at one time that they would settle for incrementalism, but we are in a brave new world where they are no longer skirting the issue that they want the guns picked up or turned in.
To my mind, this time they will not allow even pre-existing weapons to be grandfathered. This time people will be forced to comply or will go to jail.
Of course, they will have to either get Congress to pass that law, or they will openly break the law themselves trying to implement it solely through executive action. I would not put it past them to simply decide to attempt a confiscation without any kind of authorization from Congress. Just look at how lawless they are on immigration: even after the Supreme Court shot down Obama's amnesty, the administration simply proceeded to continue what they were doing anyway.
The NRA and the courts will be powerless to stop this one. People might actually have to put up or shut up to keep their guns this time.
Straight Shooter
08-03-16, 11:24
It baffles me, that at this point, with all the absolute proof we have from their own words and records, from the latest antics out of Kali & Mass Two Shits and others, that there are still members of this forum and the gun world who really still believe they wont & aren't "coming to get" YOUR/MY guns.
THEY ARE.
Many on the left openly advocate this. From initial "voluntary" turn-ins & buy- backs, to full on registration of already owned weapons, then eventual confiscation. When SCOUTUS rules that "common sense" gun control is legal..thatll be their cue. We WERE one vote away...now, we aren't. When Hildebeast is POTUS, as she is going to be, itll bring us THAT MUCH closer.
Gentlemen, pull your heads out of the sand on this one. They want it, the WORLD wants it, they'll get it legalized, they will do it, or attempt to do it. And, WHATEVER the "last word" will be, we will have it, in whatever, if any, form it takes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6nlhQafsx3o&feature=youtu.be
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6nlhQafsx3o&feature=youtu.be
They run to do evil and never rest.
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