View Full Version : Why does buying a new car always suck?
Eurodriver
08-30-16, 06:40
I thought I was the ideal customer. I knew what I wanted. I checked online, and went to a dealer that had it.
I walked in and saw a salesman, and told him I wanted a 2016 Tacoma 4x4 4 door. He pulls around in a 2016 4x2 Tundra. I was like what are you doing? That's not what I want.
"Just drive it around. You'll like it! It's nice. They don't make Tacoma 4x4s anymore there was an earthquake in Japan."
What. The. ****? What other business lets you blatantly lie to people's faces like that? I explained to him that I love Japan, I've been there, and he's totally lying. I should have left right then, but as we walked back out magically a 4x4 Tacoma was parked right in the "Customer Express Lane". He actually said "Wow, oh man, what is this? It must be new! We got the last one!"
I test drove it, but didn't really like it. The ride was terrible, and there was surprisingly little room inside for a 4 door. However, if they could get the price down I would be a buyer despite the games.
Then they hit me with a $500 trade in for my 2010 Mercedes C300. What bothered me most was that they could have simply said "Hey man, used car manager doesn't want your car." and I would've said ok and taken it to Carmax. But he said "Hey, we got you a good deal on your trade in." as he sat down.
I got my keys back and left. I called a buddy who put me in touch with a good guy at a different dealer, and walked out of there with a 4x4 4Runner and TRD wheels for less money than that dealer wanted for their Tacoma. I guess I am no longer Eurodriver...
Because I am a spiteful person, I drove back to the original dealership and talked to the General Manager and explained what happened. He said the salesman probably didn't take me seriously, or he needs more training. I said no, he's a ****ing liar and a dirtbag. He acted upset, but it could have been just an act. Still, I can't imagine him being happy at lost revenue.
As I was walking out I ran into the sales guy and he actually said "Hey man!" with a big smile "Do you wanna look at the Tacoma again?". I replied, "Do you wanna look at my 4Runner?" and his smile evaporated.
What in the actual **** is up with car dealers? Is my experience normal??
http://i1328.photobucket.com/albums/w521/6234987u02/IMG_0962_zpsmlrr2a2i.jpg
Outlander Systems
08-30-16, 07:10
Yes, your experience is normal.
They are all snakes.
It's not just cars either, as I had a similar experience dealing with "motorsports" vehicle salesmen at several locations.
"Why is this vehicle $3,000 more than what it's listed at on the website?"
"It's a 2016, that one is a 2015"
"Deuces"
"Wait, let me check. Oh, it's a 2015"
"Let's do this"
"There's a $1,700 freight charge, as well as a $900 dealer prep fee."
"Toodles."
NoveskeFan
08-30-16, 07:10
Sweet 4Runner! I drove two hours to a dealer last year because they had a truck on the lot I wanted. They wouldn't tell me the financing APR, just kept throwing payments at me. The sales guy would go back to his manager to find out the APR and come back with a lower payment quote. They finally got serious after I asked them to give back my keys for the car I was thinking of trading in. Glad you were able to find a decent salesman.
There are two types of salespeople.
1. Transactional
2. Consultative
One just wants a sale and doesn't give a crap if it was right for you.
The other wants to help you through the sales process so you get exactly what you want / need.
Deception is part of vehicle sales. Some deception is more subdued. You would have run across a salesman like the first one you encountered if you were trying to buy a horse 200 years ago.
I would like a 4Runner, but recently bought a 2016 Tacoma. I frequently have to deal with mud and grunge on range equipment and it's easier to clean it off at the local pressure wash with a pickup truck.
The first dealership had what I wanted, but they had "No Concealed Carry" signs posted. Needless to say I purchased the vehicle from another dealership.
I would say your experience is NOT normal. Ive worked in dealerships new and used and never have I seen any salesman show something different than what the customer asked for. The only time I've seen a different style offered was when we didn't have that exact model.
"Sorry sir, we don't have a 4x4 Tacoma in red with leather and navigation. But we have a white 4x4 with cloth .....youre welcome to test drive it to see if you like the car in general. If you like it we can always order you the one you want"
That's the only time I've seen something different from what the customer wanted. Often that worked just fine. The vehicle they drove gave them an idea if they'd even like it to begin with.
$500 for your trade is also retarded. They are either completely incompetent or fools. Any customer looking to trade their car is going to know the value, even if it's just a ballpark figure. Who has ever heard of a running, driving 2010 Benz for $500? They don't even sell that cheap at salvage auctions. Again....you want to make the sale. They look at what auction brings and go from there. If your car is a all wheel drive and has around 70k miles the auction price is around $13k +/- depending on condition. How low they offer you is up to them but it's not $500. It should be north of $5k if it has good mileage, clean title and good condition. Probably closer to $7. They can send it to the auction and expect to get around $13 or put it for sale on the lot for around $19k
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The_War_Wagon
08-30-16, 07:36
What in the actual **** is up with car dealers? Is my experience normal??
Yes.
Be glad you WEREN'T upside down on your LAST vehicle, when your wife totaled it (http://www.dodgetalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=618066) (after 2 earlier accidents, so you couldn't AFFORD to declare it on your insurance - when she manages to total it in a one vehicle accident, while traveling in a straight line on a highway! :confused:), and you had no choice but to bend over at the dealership and scream - THANK YOU SIR - MAY I HAVE ANOTHER?! :fie:
It's just that sinking feeling, that, after all is said & done (payments, maintenance, gas, insurance, etc.), you're watching your wife & daughter drive off the lot, in what will BE... a quarter million dollar MINIVAN... :suicide:
http://i212.photobucket.com/albums/cc305/The_War_Wagon/Wheelin/100_2228_zps69uhxdnx.jpg
Whiskey_Bravo
08-30-16, 07:45
Look for the old Edmund's article that I think was titled "confessions of a car salesman" or something like that. Basically guy went undercover at a few different dealerships over the course of a few months and saw how it all really worked.
My suggestion for everyone buying a car is do your research on everything first, and start the process with the "internet manager/salesman" by email. You can get invoice cost online at a few different locations and even find out basically what the dealerships should make if sold at invoice or near it. With this info in hand there is no dicking around with the salesman going back and forth(part of their game which is explained in the mentioned article) to his manager to get a new price approved. Try to get most of the pricing out of the way by email before you go since you know what the invoice price is.
Also, it's more work but always take your trade in to Carmax or similar first to get them to appraise your car. Then you have a good baseline on your trade so the dealership can't screw with you on it. If they do take your trade in to carmax to sell it.
I got pissed a few years ago car shopping. I'd bought three Chevy Crew Cabs over the course of ten years. From the same place. The wife had a Traverse. She filed for divorce and I quickly realized I need to downsize vehicle expenses so I could buy my own place. We traded her Traverse for a leased Equinox That was pretty painless and straightforward. My adventure sucked. The games they play is aggravating. I was also a soup sandwich over the divorce.
I wanted to throat punch the guy at the Toyota dealership when I nicely asked for my keys for the third time. He kept stalling. Intone him at theaters I was not buying today but looking at cars and pricing. I wanted to test drive some cars. I finally stood up held out my hand and said give me my keys now! There were prob a few choice words added for flavor. My keys showed up quickly.
I will never step foot in that dealership again. Every place offered me about the same for my trade but they played huge games with their discounts. I especially hate the $3,000 minimum trade allowance push, pull or tow it in! That's on the radio all the time in my area. They then tell me oh we're discounting this car by $3,5000 just for you. Ahh no you took off $500. They really think people are stupid. Maybey most are. I also hate the what do you want your payment to be line.
2 years ago the lease was unwinding down on my Nissan Z. I sent "request for quote" on a new one to 5 Nissan dealers in a 120 mile radius. I had pricing and availability from all but one of them within 48 hours. The dealer I ultimately went with not only gave the best pricing, he offered to buy out the last 6 months of my lease. I took the deal. I was going to drive the 90 miles down there to make the swap, but a snowstorm rendered the car undrivable so the dealer delivered the new one to my driveway on a flatbed and hauled the old one away. We did the paperwork in my kitchen. It was the most seamless car buying experience ever. It was like ordering a pizza.
Selecting the right dealer is key. They aren't all ignorant scumbags.
The_War_Wagon
08-30-16, 08:42
Selecting the right dealer is key. They aren't all ignorant scumbags.
Ya' know though... because of the bailouts a few years ago, it was revealed that the UN-approved Republican-owned GM & Chrysler dealerships, are the ones that got shut down in the bailouts. That left the pro-Obama owned dealers as the survivors. And I know the dealer I dealt with BEFORE the bailout (which got shuttered), was better than the one I've dealt with since... :(
Eurodriver
08-30-16, 08:46
Selecting the right dealer is key. They aren't all ignorant scumbags.
No doubt, as evidenced by the dealer I bought my 4Runner from. Great guys, and I will go back for a Camry Hybrid when I am old.
But there is still something to be said about a car salesman saying an earthquake in Japan eliminated all Tacoma manufacturing. Imagine going to your grocery store and the clerk telling you they don't sell milk anymore because all the cows are dead.
I would say your experience is NOT normal.
You're probably right, but it still happened. Why is that?
I have found this works: 1) decide what you want; 2) do some research and decide what you are willing to pay; 3) get that amount, plus tax, in checking; 4) find one, set down with salesman, tell them, 'look, I don't want to waste your time, this is what we are willing to pay, I don't care how you structure it, in the end this amount, can you do that?' 5) Tell the guy in a nice way, you understand that he has to do the dance with the sales manager, but he needs to understand he only gets one trip. 6) Be ready to walk - be pleasant and shake hands either way.
I may not get the best deal that I could have, but I get the deal I'm satisfied with and without heartburn.
We buy a new car every 3 to 4 years, taking turns, so the vehicle being replaced is 6 to 8 years old - we don't trade-in, we get rid of them ourselves.
ETA: I have not found a way to ease the pain of setting down with the finance guy to do the final paperwork - I just nicely tell them that we aren't buying any extended warranties, etc. They still try, I just ask where to initial that I don't want it.
You're probably right, but it still happened. Why is that?
It just is. I had a similar experience many years ago. Around 2000 I wanted to trade my old beat 6cyl Camaro for a new Wrangler. The ad said min $2000 for a trade as long as it runs. My car ran good but looked ugly and had a lot of mileage. They test drove and said I would get the $2k trade. When it came time to talk to the finance manager the numbers he was throwing at me seemed to high. So we went over each item and it turned out I was getting $500 for my car. He called in the sales manager who stormed in, threw my keys on the table and declared "fine, give him $2000". I grabbed my keys and said thanks but I'm done now
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I thought I was the ideal customer. I knew what I wanted. I checked online, and went to a dealer that had it.
I walked in and saw a salesman, and told him I wanted a 2016 Tacoma 4x4 4 door. He pulls around in a 2016 4x2 Tundra. I was like what are you doing? That's not what I want.
"Just drive it around. You'll like it! It's nice. They don't make Tacoma 4x4s anymore there was an earthquake in Japan."
What. The. ****? What other business lets you blatantly lie to people's faces like that? I explained to him that I love Japan, I've been there, and he's totally lying. I should have left right then, but as we walked back out magically a 4x4 Tacoma was parked right in the "Customer Express Lane". He actually said "Wow, oh man, what is this? It must be new! We got the last one!"
I test drove it, but didn't really like it. The ride was terrible, and there was surprisingly little room inside for a 4 door. However, if they could get the price down I would be a buyer despite the games.
Then they hit me with a $500 trade in for my 2010 Mercedes C300. What bothered me most was that they could have simply said "Hey man, used car manager doesn't want your car." and I would've said ok and taken it to Carmax. But he said "Hey, we got you a good deal on your trade in." as he sat down.
I got my keys back and left. I called a buddy who put me in touch with a good guy at a different dealer, and walked out of there with a 4x4 4Runner and TRD wheels for less money than that dealer wanted for their Tacoma. I guess I am no longer Eurodriver...
Because I am a spiteful person, I drove back to the original dealership and talked to the General Manager and explained what happened. He said the salesman probably didn't take me seriously, or he needs more training. I said no, he's a ****ing liar and a dirtbag. He acted upset, but it could have been just an act. Still, I can't imagine him being happy at lost revenue.
As I was walking out I ran into the sales guy and he actually said "Hey man!" with a big smile "Do you wanna look at the Tacoma again?". I replied, "Do you wanna look at my 4Runner?" and his smile evaporated.
What in the actual **** is up with car dealers? Is my experience normal??
I was in car sales for two months and couldn't take it. There are dealerships that do things right, but they are the exception.
He probably brought the other truck around because they had a "spiff" on it. Older inventory gets priority, and salesmen make more money if they move it.
Also..
Always negotiate the price before offering a trade. That way you minimize the games they play by showing more for it, but asking more for theirs.
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You're probably right, but it still happened. Why is that?
Maybe it was a guy driven into car sales by the job market. In that case he may be just marking time and not too concerned about building a clientele.
Over the years I have known several guys that sold cars for a living. They all had several customers that they could count on to trade-in every year, or every other year. They treated them well, not taking advantage. It was a long-term relationship. My Grandfather was a MoPar guy, he had bought from the same dealership for as long as I was aware. It wasn't unusual for them to call him and ask 'Punk, are you about ready to trade? We have a guy here who is interested in your truck.'
It doesn't that way anymore.
We purchased a fully loaded 2013 mitsi outlander sport. The salesman pointed out it didn't have the basic spare but a rimmed toyo as the others. I thought that was cool. Well after a few service calls, oil changes etc I discovered the tire was switched out to a basic spare at the same dealership. What the hell else did they do.. It wasn't on the tag so I had no proof of the switch. I ran into the sales guy, who for one is straight up, not on him. For a time he went into financing then back to sales. He said he couldn't do the financing in good conscience, it really bothered him. I guess they approve sales knowing the new owners can't afford.
We paid cash for a Honda civic sedan in the 80s. The sales guy said he always tells the customer he will never high pressure, then he high pressures the sale. Sleasy.
This is another reason why I love BMW. I've never been to a BMW dealership and had the "shark attack" parking lot rush, high pressure sales tactics, or any crap that I've experienced at other dealerships.
When my wife got her last X5 she cross shopped Audi and Porsche and had great dealership experiences there too. She was hesitant to go alone due to her previous Saturn/Chevy/Pontiac dealership visits but I was very busy at work then and for the first time in our marriage she was retired so I left it all up to her to get what she wanted and it went very well.
I see you were trading in a Mercedes---how did their dealerships treat you? In my experience "premium" brands just have a much different way of dealing with customers that I vastly prefer (well, maybe sometimes they suck up a bit too much) over "pedestrian" brands.
I've had my eye on the 4Runner TRD. Nice choice.
But there is still something to be said about a car salesman saying an earthquake in Japan eliminated all Tacoma manufacturing. Imagine going to your grocery store and the clerk telling you they don't sell milk anymore because all the cows are dead.
Agreed. Your experience was pretty blatant.
Some car dealers still go for the underhanded shit, and likely will continue to do so as long as they can rely on the fact the the typical car buyer really really really wants to buy that car, and right now. The buyer who is perfectly willing to do a lot of shopping and/or is perfectly willing to walk away from the negotiation is relatively rare in car dealer world. I have a friend (sort of) that owns the local Chevy/Cadillac/Hyundai dealership. I see him occasionally for a few drinks when I run into him at a restaurant we both frequent. My son used to work for him. His view of his typical customer is disrespectful and demeaning. To him, even in this enlightened consumer era, his customers are more "marks" than customers, and I've heard him refer to them as such. I haven't bought a car from him in 15 years. It pisses him off a little bit, and I'm OK with that.
wildcard600
08-30-16, 10:16
I think there is some kind of law that says buying a new car should be a shitty an experience as possible.
I had a horrible experience at the local Jeep dealer and almost walked multiple times, but the service team there is pretty good. The local Toyota dealer was okay, the salesman needed some prodding, but the finance guy was no bullshit and a pleasure to work with.
To catch up:
I currently have 4 cars in the driveway. MB S430, MB E350 bluetec, Audi A8 and a Dodge diesel. Beyond that, I've had a myriad of other cars running the gamut. From T-birds to 300zx to Jag XJS to vettes to subarus and Toyotas (and a Nissan when it was still Datsun... but the vehicle was still a Nissan.)
The premium dealers can be just like the others. It really depends on the individual dealer. The Benz dealer here is closer to the top of what we all want. Great sales experience until the paper signing. They then push the high $ options. Not too hard, but just enough to make one sigh. My best experiences so far have been at Carmax, both buying and selling. And one Toyota dealership in particular was good. In and out in 1.25 hours.
The worst has always been the domestics... Ford in particular. (5 purchases- different dealers each time) Chevy next (5 purchases- again different dealers) then Dodge (2). The one Subaru purchase really sucked too.
Eurodriver
08-30-16, 11:14
Agreed. Your experience was pretty blatant.
Some car dealers still go for the underhanded shit, and likely will continue to do so as long as they can rely on the fact the the typical car buyer really really really wants to buy that car, and right now. The buyer who is perfectly willing to do a lot of shopping and/or is perfectly willing to walk away from the negotiation is relatively rare in car dealer world. I have a friend (sort of) that owns the local Chevy/Cadillac/Hyundai dealership. I see him occasionally for a few drinks when I run into him at a restaurant we both frequent. My son used to work for him. His view of his typical customer is disrespectful and demeaning. To him, even in this enlightened consumer era, his customers are more "marks" than customers, and I've heard him refer to them as such. I haven't bought a car from him in 15 years. It pisses him off a little bit, and I'm OK with that.
That's incredible. Who spends $30k+ without doing their homework? I wanted a 4Runner because it's the last of the breed of big SUVs that is an actual SUV and not a unibodied car with a tall ceiling and AWD. A Jeep was a close second, but I've BTDT and I can't be taking professionals to lunch in a bro truck. I know that 4Runners in 4x4 are pretty rare in my AO and that dealers are willing to let people walk because they sell so well.
Even still, if a dealer gave me a stupid price or played games despite having the only 4Runner on the planet for sale I would leave and wait until another one popped up someplace else.
Way too much money to deal with that BS, but as your buddy proves there must be a lot of them.
I see you were trading in a Mercedes---how did their dealerships treat you? In my experience "premium" brands just have a much different way of dealing with customers that I vastly prefer (well, maybe sometimes they suck up a bit too much) over "pedestrian" brands.
MB Dealers weren't too bad, both in HI and FL. I just felt it was a pretty similar gig, but with nicer amenities.
You can get bent over by a Victoria Secret model who calls you sir and hands you Mercedes branded drinking water beforehand, or you can get bent over by Bubba in the state prison. Either way, you're still getting bent over.
That's incredible. Who spends $30k+ without doing their homework?
I don't think you fully appreciate the uniqueness of your personality among the general run of consumers out there.
I don't think you fully appreciate the uniqueness of your personality among the general run of consumers out there.
After all, you are referring to the smartest guy in FL.
brickboy240
08-30-16, 11:51
I don't know about "premium dealers" being better. My two BMW experiences cemented the fact that I will NEVER own a BMW ever again. That and the repair costs of said vehicles.
BMW stands for Broken Money Waster! LOL
I have looked at Tacomas a few times than always went back and bought another GMC or Chevy full size truck. The Tacos were expensive, had tiny beds and interiors, could not pull very much and did not get much better mileage than a V8 GMC or Chevy....so why bother? They look cool and hold their value, but that is where it ended with me...sorry.
I had a well thought out couple of paragraphs from someone who is an Internet Sales Manager at a corporate run store in the Northwest. Then I remembered no one give a sh!t because car salesmen are the devil.
brickboy240
08-30-16, 11:59
Some are...some are not. I have had good and bad experiences with them...just like gun store counter people.
We have had good luck with a few dealers in my area, but they are all part of the same company and put the vehicle price on the vehicle. They don't deviate from that price and the only haggling you have is if they go real low on a trade in, normally they are in the ballpark and you can haggle for other goodies like a bed liner or free maintenance or better tires.
Your experience is pretty typical with a high push sales dealer. I spoke with a salesman that my family know and his wife used to watch our kids. in speaking with him he said basically if its a high pressure or pushy place just steer clear. If the sales people are more friendly and get to know your use for the vehicle and can recommend something are the best people to deal with. Also he explained the sales staff he works with are not pressured and he might sell 4 to 10 cars a month and they are fine with that if more then that's fine too.
My last experience was ok... not great but we were dealing on a tundra and it had a few cosmetic issues and I was not real happy with my trade in on a sequoia. While we were sitting there they had a trade in come in on a 2012 tundra crewmax platinum. They wanted to move it and I only paid 2 grand more for the 2012 that had 20,000 less miles 2 years newer and a loaded over base interior. Still didn't get what I wanted in trade but it covered what we owed and the taxes on the new one so it turned out pretty good. But I also found out that the saleman I was working with was from their salaried dealership where they don't make commission on every vehicle they sell. They get a bonus if the dealership as a whole does well.
First off, I'm glad you're posting again. You were missed.
Second, that's just life. I buy used, take cash and say "Either you want this money or you don't. I know what I'm spending today, but you know every lease is a gamble. " If they try to gyp me, I just walk. I even had a manager type chase me out to the parking lot shouting "Wait, wait! He is still new, we can do business!" I just said "No, we can't."
I always pay cash. And I've walked off a lot just on attitude alone. I said "I'm the one potentially spending money today. You are the one on commission. I'm doing YOU the favor, not the other way around."
ramairthree
08-30-16, 12:51
My closest Toyota place lost any chance for me as a customer.
I was going to look at 4runners.
I pulled in,
Was looking at a row of trucks trying to see where the 4runners were.
Salesman comes out,
Asks if he can help.
I say yes,
I would like to see what you have for trail or trail premium 4runners.
He has no idea what a 4Runner is from the look on his face. They only sell what, like 80k of them a year or so?
Says I will be happy to check, be right back.
I spot the 4runners and start walking that way.
He catches up and says he will take me to them they have some.
We get there and none of the 4 runners are even 4wd.
I say none of these are trails.
He says sorry, will get the cart and take me to them they must be on the back lot.
Manager looking type meets us and says come on in, I will look up right where they are.
Apologizes, says it is sale guys first day.
Gets on computer and says he is not sure where they have them, can he get my name.
I say tell me you have a trail model, or not.
He says he is going to do an inventory search and wants to be sure I am in the system.
I get up and say I'm heading elsewhere.
He says is there a problem?
I say this is not how I buy a car.
He asks what I was expecting.
I said I expected you to know if you had any trail models and take me to them.
I expected if you did not you would say something like we have a pro or a 4wd sr5 would I like to test drive them.
Then you make a copy of my license and I go on a test drive.
While I am on the test drive with the genius Toyota salesman that does not know what a 4Runner is you do a credit search without my permission or knowledge, figure I paid enough in federal ****ing income taxes alone last year to buy three or four 4 runners,
And if I don't want one of The other 4wd models you all of a sudden found a trail in inventory on the back lot here or if not you have already checked and have one in one of your other two locations in exactly the color I want with the kdss and a bunch of expensive options and I say I will take it, and someone drives it over and I do some paperwork and drive it home.
What you seem to have expected is I was going to spend hours here getting talked into some piece of shit 2wd I don't want, haggle over some bullshit how much do I want my payments crap, and think I would buy from you now. You expected wrong.
Unfortunately,
They must make a ton from people that put up with that crap to offset the losses from those of us that do not.
On a side note,
If the next dealer experience starts that way I will just see what the new gen model is going to look like, or if the new defender 90 will be cool, or if it is true the Nissan patrol will be available here soon instead of just in the infinity version.
Those were cool overseas. At least the old gens.
I am very impulsive with cars.
If it is there before my eyes and I really like it,
I will jump instead of waiting for next years model or the competitor version.
If the dealership pisses me off, I will pop smoke and break contact.
We may all have some deathbed regrets in life,
But wishing I had been nicer to shady scumbags at a car dealership trying to screw me over will never be one of them.
Edit,
On the other side of the house,
A salesman will call me when he has something he knows I will be interested in comes in.
Stuff like,
We got in a 6.4 shaker RT, it is not the red interior, the interior you want will be six more weeks if you would rather wait,
Or,
The new blacked out 2500 rams just came.
Did you want to put in your own gooseneck or do you want to look at the one with the factory tow package?
That model I suspect generates a lot more repeat business.
I'll throw this in here too:
I am surprised at how much sexism still exists in car buying. Meaning that many sales types (to include women as well) are still gratuitous and condescending to women purchasers. There are those still trying to take advantage of the female thinking "she can't know much".
I watched this happen to my wife while getting her new car last year. Now my wife is an engineer, with a masters and has her MBA as well. She's no dummy. But certain sales staff are. We ended up with that Bluetec for her when we found the right dealer. (Local MB dealer)
Eurodriver
08-30-16, 12:56
Every time ramairthree posts it is sig worthy.
I watched this happen to my wife while getting her new car last year. Now my wife is an engineer, with a masters and has her MBA as well. She's no dummy. But certain sales staff are. We ended up with that Bluetec for her when we found the right dealer. (Local MB dealer)
No kidding. I know the CFE of a worldwide bank (earning 8 figures annually) and the stories she has of Audi and BMW dealers blows my mind. She's also a CPA, CFE, CVA, blah blah blah and can do present value calcs in her head but still has to bring her (stay at home) husband to buy a car to avoid the bullshit.
Well, my story isn't as lavish as most here, but I won.
Couple years back, was looking for an suv type vehicle. Specifically, I was interested in the Ford Escape. Yeah, there are better, and, it's not a real suv, but I have two full-size broncos now, but an 80 mile round trip to work, so I want something smaller. More room than a car, and will still go out in reasonably bad conditions. Plus, me and cars don't end well, especially for the car. Let's just say the trade in value is never part of the deal.
So, my wife finds one online, in a neighboring city. These things bring a premium around here (the word suv), it was just reduced, to 7k from 8k. She found some other, similar vehicles, as it's what I want, but it's a run around, so it's not mandatory.
We drove over, went to several places, ending up where the escape is. Young kid comes out, he's selling, I ask how much. He says 6k. Really? It's 6k? Yes. I ask a third time, same answer. We drive it. They are a wholesaler, but have a lot. I say fine, we will be back in the morning with 6k, you take checks?
Next morning, the kid is there, with an older guy. We sit down, just about to start, when he says the kid made a mistake, he's gonna need 7k.
Sorry, we didn't bring 7k. I asked him 3 times, that was the time to change it, and that time has passed.
He says it's 7k, or its not selling.
No problem. We get up to leave. He's like, but wait, don't you want it?
Yeah, at 6k.
We leave, wife is like, what now? Let's get breakfast. This road the place is on, is known locally as "car alley". About 3 miles of dealerships, many next door to each other. So we're eating, she's like now what? He will call. The older guy isn't the boss either, when the boss shows, and finds out a check just walked out the door, he will call. Wife had looked it up the night before with the Vin. They'd been sitting on it about 6 months, they want it gone.
Sure enough, about 20 min later, my phones ringing. You still around, ready to come get the vehicle? Yep, for 6k. No, it's gotta be 7k. Sorry, can't do that, he says. Then, so what are you going to do now?
Well, we're just finishing breakfast, my wife has her phone out, and we're building a new shopping list. After all, we are in car alley, and I still got this 6k check in my pocket. I bet somebody wants it bad enough to give what I want. Then I hung up on him.
Five minutes later, my phones ringing again. Ok, 6k it is, you can come get it.
The big Boss was there, and he was clearly not pleased.
Oh, well, it's not my job to please him.
I know he got it for a song, he still made money, just not as much as he wanted.
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I guess I am no longer Eurodriver...
You could always start wearing continental bikini briefs to keep the "Euro" part
we bought a white trail 4runner this year ;) hahahah
yeah experience sucked beyond belief !!!!!!
The Toyota dealership that I have been dealing with for 20 years got a new sales manger and they tried the same garbage with me. They had a ton of last year's Tundras and the new model year was due out. I wanted a 4 door Tacoma TRD that I had seen on their website. I showed the sale guy the truck on my phone and he takes me over to the Tundras. They fooled around with me for a bit and I toughed it out thinking that they would finally give me numbers on the truck I wanted when they realized I was serious. Never happened. I gave up after battling with the salesman and sales manager.
I wave at both the salesman and sales manager from my Power Wagon every time I pick up or drop off my wife for service on her Highlander. Once the complementary service runs out on her car they won't see us again.
I just bought the 2016 off road version of the Tacoma. Man, I love the thing. Love how it drives on and off road. Totally happy with the truck. My wife is the 4Runner fan. That is next.
I went looking at several dealers near me and got the same BS from all of them. The new Tacos are selling as fast as they can get them in, so they were all adding 5K to the MSRP. I said, "No way. I'm not paying that". They replied, "Okay. No problem. Someone else will." And people were. I saw the new trucks driving around town with the dealer plates on them. I went through Costco. They put me in touch with the fleet manger at a dealership that was around 100 miles away. Told him exactly what I wanted, he told me exactly what it would cost. I had to wait for the next production run to be made, but it came in, and there was no extra BS. I paid the invoice price and that was that. Best part? They delivered it to my house and I never had to drive to that dealership. Signed the forms and everything right on my kitchen table. Could not have been easier or better. I'm so happy with that dealer that I'm keeping his license plate holders on my truck for a while. I want people in my area to see where they should be buying. I just kept waiting for the guy to try to run the BS on me and he just answered my questions frankly and honestly.
When I first walked into the dealership nearest my house, the sales guy there had no idea what all the new features were or which features were on which models. He'd never heard of the crawl feature. I told him the I spent 10 minutes watching videos on YouTube before the truck even came out, and I knew more than he did… He was a nice guy though and since I didn't need him to know anything, we proceeded to talk to the sales manager about what kind of deal I could get and how long it would take to get in the model and color I wanted. That's when he dropped the 5k bomb on me. And he was snotty about it too. Rico Suave with his greased back hair and cubic zirc cufflinks. Asked me what I wanted to pay per month. I said, "Nothing. I'll be paying for it up front". He looked me up and down in my "work uniform" of shorts and a t-shirt, and I could see the contempt in his eyes. I stood up, said thanks anyways, but I'll be buying my truck elsewhere. The salesman was ignorant and clueless and the manager was a total jackass. Everyone I know says the same thing about that dealership too. At least they didn't tell me they didn't have what I wanted because of a Japanese earthquake. I just looked it up. The new Tacomas are made in BC Mexico, and either Fremont CA or San Antonio, TX. It must have been an awfully big Japanese earthquake to have stopped production all the way over here. Surprised I didn't hear about it on the news. Or feel it...
A few days after purchase, Toyota emails and wants me to do a survey. I answered all their question honestly and gave the dealer who sold me the truck the excellent review that he and his staff earned. Then the survey wanted to know why I didn't buy from a local dealer that was much closer. Man did I have a good time giving my local Rico Suave sales manger the awful review that he and his staff had earned.
I can't wait to go into that local dealer with my out of town dealer plates when the first service is due… I hope they ask me about it...
WOW, Earthquake in Japan?? Funny since most are made in Texas, Some in Mexico.
The wife and just bought a brand new Tacoma 4x4 4door.
I would say the most hassle free experience in my life, in and out of dealer in about 45 min. Smooth as butter.
Kept waiting for that moment buy it never came.
ramairthree
08-30-16, 20:23
I know that sleazy guy!
I was stationed in a very affluent area for 4 years in the 90s.
I had a 4Runner,
My wife had my eagle talon turbo,
With a manual transmission and it was starting to need a lot of work although only 5 years old. (My third gen Z28 was a dying POS by five years also)
Anyways,
She decides she wants either a Camry or an accord.
At the Honda place our salesman is the greasy black hair, short, swarthy guy, in an overkill suit that is like that actor you see whenever the script calls for a shady ass, arrogant, Italian, Jewish, Arabic, Greek, indeterminate, etc dude. We are so turned off we leave even before the test drive. Basically that SNL that's the ticket guy.
We go to the Toyota place. They had an awesome one year old maxed option Camry we called to ask to look at. We get there and the used car manager is using it as his personal vehicle and has left town for the weekend knowing we were coming to see it and the dealership overall has the same arrogance.
Oddly enough, I went with a buddy to get his Acura and they were nice there, and they were very nice at the Land Rover dealership when I was a year out from buying a defender and picking up brochures. (Sadly, no more defenders when that time came and prices went nuts.)
We did some reading and the Nissan Maxima for that year, 1995 or whatever,
Was rated as a killer buy against the accord and Camry. We went there and the Nissan place was great.
By the time we were getting rid of the maxima, the Nissan place had really gone downhill though. Not arrogant like the Honda and Toyota place, but circuit city style low rent like everyone walking in was desperate and only concerned with getting approved no matter the rate and would get the luxury package for only 8 more dollars a month.
I hate wasting time and getting jacked around.
It's at the point where the next time I am asked what I want,
I will simply say I want X with y and z, if you match Costco or USAA pricing, I will qualify for the advertised financing, I am not trading anything in, and I would like to be out of here in one to two hours. Just let me know right now if those are unreasonable expectations.
I have paid sticker on a new challenger when they were brand new and hard to find one and I did not want to wait.
I have paid below invoice on a Mustang GT convertible that had been on the lot all summer and October was here.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
08-30-16, 20:41
My friend, (27 yr old w/tattoos and goatee, former Marine, very well off HVAC company manager) went to our local Toyota dealership to buy a Tundra TRD Pro. He couldn't get a salesman to take him seriously, despite repeated attempts to GIVE them his business. He left, drove to the Dodge dealership, and dropped 60k on a Ram Rebel because they treated him like a big boy.
Eurodriver
08-30-16, 20:54
former Marine
Interesting....
Rico Suave with his greased back hair and cubic zirc cufflinks. Asked me what I wanted to pay per month. I said, "Nothing. I'll be paying for it up front". He looked me up and down in my "work uniform" of shorts and a t-shirt, and I could see the contempt in his eyes. I stood up, said thanks anyways, but I'll be buying my truck elsewhere.
I hate that part. I always finance through the dealer even if paying cash - I've heard (but got no evidence) that they give beater deals because they expect returns on interest on the back end. Also, I was able to get a few rebates by financing with Toyota. I wonder what the finance guy will do when he sees that I paid it off next week?
fallenromeo
08-30-16, 21:04
Yes, your experience is normal.
They are all snakes.
It's not just cars either, as I had a similar experience dealing with "motorsports" vehicle salesmen at several locations.
"Why is this vehicle $3,000 more than what it's listed at on the website?"
"It's a 2016, that one is a 2015"
"Deuces"
"Wait, let me check. Oh, it's a 2015"
"Let's do this"
"There's a $1,700 freight charge, as well as a $900 dealer prep fee."
"Toodles."
Why is it that car/boat/truck/toy dealers are the only places that try this BS? Where do they get the balls to try and charge me a freight charge when it is already on the lot? That is your problem. If I special order, fine. Then I would expect to pay a freight charge, but right off the lot? If I go shopping at target, I don't pay shipping. Why do they think they will get away with that at dealerships?
Even worse if you try to buy a used car from a dealer. The only exception seems to be Carmax.
Long gone are the days where you buy a car for "about what it's worth." Dealers just aren't happy until they feel like they've screwed you as hard as possible. Last time I bought a car I spent about two hours (no joke) on negotiations. They really didn't seem to grasp that I wasn't going to spend more than "X amount" on the car I was interested in and they tried to give me "fuzzy math" details hoping I was stupid.
So as I was getting up to leave they said "Man you are tough on prices" and conceded to agree to the deal. I was a bit surprised but if we actually come to an agreement I'll keep my end no matter how annoyed I happen to be.
So as I go to finalize things I notice the paperwork is $1,000 higher than the price we agreed to and I was informed it was a "service charge." I guess that is what they call it when they spend two hours trying to see if you are incredibly stupid.
Didn't say a word, just turned around and walked out. Later that week I went through the local auto trader and found a slightly better car than I was looking at for a better price. Had my mechanic check it out and ended up saving about $2,500 at the end of the day.
I think in FL they believe everyone places a great deal of their personal self worth in the car they drive, and as a result the more they pay, the more important they can feel they are. I actually feel better about myself when I save money and just pay something close to "Blue book + reasonable operating costs", but seems that is asking too much.
Why is it that car/boat/truck/toy dealers are the only places that try this BS? Where do they get the balls to try and charge me a freight charge when it is already on the lot? That is your problem. If I special order, fine. Then I would expect to pay a freight charge, but right off the lot? If I go shopping at target, I don't pay shipping. Why do they think they will get away with that at dealerships?
if you go to target, you pay shipping, it is just rolled into the price.
How do you think it got on the lot, it didn't did it by magic. Someone transported from the Port to dealer.
MSRP is the same, but shipping to different dealers will very widely .
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firefighter37
08-30-16, 21:29
if you go to target, you pay shipping, it is just rolled into the price.
How do you think it got on the lot, it didn't did it by magic. Someone transported from the Port to dealer.
MSRP is the same, but shipping to different dealers will very widely .
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Not my problem, if you want to sell something, you have to have it. It's the cost of doing business.
1_click_off
08-30-16, 22:11
I used to have my own business at several high volume dealers detailing all the trade-in's and new car washes. Man, you would not believe the stuff people leave in their cars when trading it in.
I knew just about all the tricks they do in the negotiations and financing areas.
I have had such bad dealings with the local dealership I skip them, had a real bad experience with the next dealership one town over. I now pass both of those up and deal only with the new car manager in the next town. He was a salesman when I purchased my first vehicle from that location.
I call him up and let him know what I am looking at locally and tell him the deal. He beats it over the phone every time. He knows I know the game and he just does an employee deal for me.
My in-laws and family always want me to work the deal for them, but say they want to crawl under the table when I start up. Not a jerk by any means, but I overturn the nutshell with the 'gotcha' in it every time.
Want to know what the equivalent to the APR is on a lease? Ask them what the money factor is. Take that number and multiply it by 2400. That is how much they are "financing" your lease for. Example: a money factor of .0027 is equal to about 6.48%.
GAP insurance. This is pro rated. If you want to cover the GAP for a little while until you make some principal payments, do it. You can cancel it later and get part of your money back. I never get GAP.
Make sure you ask for any loyalty discounts or promotions when financing. These may be worth half a percent.
Check the trade allowance and selling price. They will try to bump up the selling price if you have them increase your trade value.
I started going to my local dealer to get the free service since it was in my town. I blew through that free service rather quickly and decided I liked not changing oil anymore. So I kept going and paying for the service. I had to drop my skid plate to install my road armor bumper and noticed how clean the skid plate was. Not a drop of oil on it. I was due for an oil change and decided to pull the canister filter out, clipped a pleat off and reinstalled it. Took it to the dealer for the change. Brought it home, pulled the filter and what did I find...... My filter with the clipped pleats basking in new oil!!!!
Took the filter back up to them while it was still warm. It was the weekend so nobody there had any authority. Waited til Monday and had a talk with the service and shop manager. Got a refund and I now change my own oil....again.
You have to work hard to avoid shitty dealerships and don't forget that their service departments can scam too. I won't bore you with war stories except to say that I recently witnessed an Acura service rep attempt to sell a $20 air filter to two different clients for $150, and yes I got in their business and hare lipped the service manager, whom I had just finished reaming for trying to scam me with his plan B oil change that costs $175. Before I left, I was guilty of using profanity, calling a white employee the N word, and telling an Arab owner that he was full of shit. I regret sharing this experience because I'm trying to model desirable behavior for the wayward Eurodriver and wish to inspire Fly man to lighten up and get his groove back.
I have found that buying from a dealership that does business the right way, straight forward and clean matters most. Do your research, put in an Internet price quote request to secure pricing and check Yelp reviews helps to narrow down the dealership and improve the experience. Got no problems with them making 'fair' money as long as I'm paying the fair market price and treated well. It's better to have them as friends than sworn enemies, you'll get more from the experience and transaction (sales and service) doing it this way. No matter how much you read or think you know, they do this for a living. Next to a home, the car is the next big thing - I'd rather work with them than against.
Moose-Knuckle
08-31-16, 04:45
http://i1328.photobucket.com/albums/w521/6234987u02/IMG_0962_zpsmlrr2a2i.jpg
That's tits Euro, congrats man! I love the TRD Pro models . . . and yes all dealerships are pretty much the same unless you have an in with someone like your buddy.
Mr. Goodtimes
08-31-16, 05:13
I thought I was the ideal customer. I knew what I wanted. I checked online, and went to a dealer that had it.
I walked in and saw a salesman, and told him I wanted a 2016 Tacoma 4x4 4 door. He pulls around in a 2016 4x2 Tundra. I was like what are you doing? That's not what I want.
"Just drive it around. You'll like it! It's nice. They don't make Tacoma 4x4s anymore there was an earthquake in Japan."
What. The. ****? What other business lets you blatantly lie to people's faces like that? I explained to him that I love Japan, I've been there, and he's totally lying. I should have left right then, but as we walked back out magically a 4x4 Tacoma was parked right in the "Customer Express Lane". He actually said "Wow, oh man, what is this? It must be new! We got the last one!"
I test drove it, but didn't really like it. The ride was terrible, and there was surprisingly little room inside for a 4 door. However, if they could get the price down I would be a buyer despite the games.
Then they hit me with a $500 trade in for my 2010 Mercedes C300. What bothered me most was that they could have simply said "Hey man, used car manager doesn't want your car." and I would've said ok and taken it to Carmax. But he said "Hey, we got you a good deal on your trade in." as he sat down.
I got my keys back and left. I called a buddy who put me in touch with a good guy at a different dealer, and walked out of there with a 4x4 4Runner and TRD wheels for less money than that dealer wanted for their Tacoma. I guess I am no longer Eurodriver...
Because I am a spiteful person, I drove back to the original dealership and talked to the General Manager and explained what happened. He said the salesman probably didn't take me seriously, or he needs more training. I said no, he's a ****ing liar and a dirtbag. He acted upset, but it could have been just an act. Still, I can't imagine him being happy at lost revenue.
As I was walking out I ran into the sales guy and he actually said "Hey man!" with a big smile "Do you wanna look at the Tacoma again?". I replied, "Do you wanna look at my 4Runner?" and his smile evaporated.
What in the actual **** is up with car dealers? Is my experience normal??
http://i1328.photobucket.com/albums/w521/6234987u02/IMG_0962_zpsmlrr2a2i.jpg
Sweet 4 runner man and good call on white. I never thought id own a white truck till I bought my 16 Tacoma. Car dealers ****ing suck, the experience of buying my new truck was literally so ****ing awful I really wasn't even that excited to pick it up. I just wanted to be done with the whole process.
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Ive had two really bad shopping experiences and two really good ones. Funny that one of each came from the same dealer.
In 2011 I went to buy my G37 from the same Acura dealer that I bought my 2006 WRX from back in 2007. I had a great experience back in 2007. The salesman was a retired mil officer and basically just did the job for a little side money and something to do. He actually printed out a sheet with all the used cars and what cost the dealer had in to them. With absolutely no haggling what so ever, he cut nearly 6k off the sticker price on my WRX and gave me a more than fair trade on my Saturn right from the start.
Fast forward to 2011 and I find a nice 2010 G37 at the same place. Unfortunately the same salesman no longer worked there. I look at the car and tell the salesman Im going down the road to look at another car. I do so and a few hours later call the salesman back and tell him I want the Infiniti. I come back to the dealer and the salesman tells me he already has it getting detailed out back. Im like sweet. I start the paperwork, we agree on a price, etc.... everytime I ask to see the car so I can show my wife, the salesman has some reason why I can't see it. Its still in detail, They took it to get gas... Finally after all the paperwork is done I find out that the managers wife had taken it for a loaner while hers was getting worked on.
I should have just walked away there but they gave me a loaner G37 and told me my car would be back in the morning. Well it didn't show back up for 3 days. I was going to cancel the deal but the manager agreed to tint the windows and give me 1000 dollars credit in the maintenance department. To me that made up for the mishap. It was bullshit and the salesman was a lying shit, but they made it right. And if that's how the story ended I would still go there. But unfortunately that's not the case. So I start going to the dealer for service. After my second oil change the service rep tells me I owe him like 80 bucks. I tell him no and explain the situation. Well somehow my 1000 dollar service credit magically vanished from their system. It took a lot of bitching but luckily one of the assistant managers in sales was an honest man and confirmed I had to 1000 dollars credit. Though after that the oil changes suddenly jumped in price to over 90 bucks. The last 400 dollars was spent on a 60k mile service and transmission flush that my personal mechanic friend later told me they didn't actually do.
The second one was a few years ago. I went car shopping with my brother in law. My sister is almost 9 years younger than me so she and her husband ask me for advice often. My brother in law was 22 years old, a gas station clerk and had just started the paperwork to enlist in the Army. He needed a new car but not something expensive. We go to a local Honda dealer and start looking at cars around 15k dollars as my BIL had a small down payment and wanted a payment of around 300 bucks. So the salesman tells him they just got in a couple year old Civic Si and it hasnt been priced yet. I tell him there is no way that car is 15k but the salesman says it probably is and convinces my BIL to take it for a test drive. He falls in love with the car. Fun, quick and had nav and a sun roof.
We get back to the dealer and they bust out a price of 24k. I tell him to quit wasting our time. The salesman looks at me and says "why dont you let him make his decisions". I politely told him that's not how this works... Should have been a lot more rude but that's not my style most of the time. He then turns to my BIL and asks if he should start the financing paperwork. My BIL tells him that he could only afford 300 dollars a month. The salesman says "That's a cell phone payment, get real".
We got up and walked out. The manager stops us and asks what the problem was. We told him that his salesman is lucky we didnt beat the shit out of him.
My best car buying experience was my Tundra I bought late last year. My best friend's in laws pretty much run the financing department for a major car sales chain here in Az. They hooked me up with the online guy and told him to treat me well. He called me and asked what I was looking for and told me he'd call em right back. About 20 minutes later he calls up and tells me he has a 2013 Tundra TRD Crewmax 4x4 with the 5.7 and has 15k miles on it. He then quotes me a price that was 7500 dollars less than their listed price and about 4k less than what KBB listed the value as. He gave me a fair trade in quote on the G37 based on the description I gave.
I drove to the dealer and the truck was waiting for me. Took it for a test drive and signed the paperwork within an hour. The guy called me at noon timeframe and I had the truck in my driveway by dinner time. That included a 50 minute drive each way.
Last truck I bought, the dealership bought me a hotel room, lunch, dinner, and probably $60 worth of jack and coke that night.
When I showed up to test drive, he handed me a big handful of Keys....... WTF??? Your not going with me?? Chuck..."lol...... F no..."
This is the truck I saved for you and I'm pretty sure you'll want, but drive the others anyway.
So I did. Test drive all day. He was right, the one he saved was the one I wanted because it has an nv5600 instead of the new unproven g56.
Guy must have sold 15 cars and truck that day.
Get him to say yeah I'll take that one. He says "are you sure?"
"Yes......?" More wtf.....it's almost like I'm in the twilight zone now, since this is nothing like any other experience I've had before. "He then says "i really want you to be satisfied. If you not 100% sure, I really don't want to sell it to you......" I can only imagine how dumb my facial expression must have been.
They gave me 5000 more for my trade. And the new one cost 5000 less than the other local dealers. Only dealer close was Dave smith, 13 hrs away....for 600 less... F THAT.
Sadly,I hear that Chuck is no longer there. Which is too bad. That was the most painless transaction I've ever had. Plus him and one of the owners wines and dined me one of the best places in town....... Never asked for dinner or drinks or nothing. Just told him I was headed to the nook for some food and "scenery" All said and done, my tab doesn't find it way to me, he gets his??? So I ask the hottie little blonde where's mine? You don't have one, Chuck got it......?
Quality motors salmon idaho......hell of good peeps. Least they used to be 10 years ago.
"I think...they believe everyone places a great deal of their personal self worth in the car they drive, and as a result the more they pay, the more important they can feel they are."
Is that a nice way of saying that the average car/truck buyer is just putty in the salesman's hands?
What in the actual **** is up with car dealers? Is my experience normal??
A dealer issue mostly. Takes some time to find a solid dealership and once you do, I stick with them. Two, I always worked with the same sales guy. If they do right by me, I do right by them. I tell them I will pay X% above their invoice, and done. My deals usually take 15 minutes or so. If they say no, or start playing stupid games, I walk. Like any biz, 1 out f 10 run by quality people. Don't be married to one brand, be willing to travel a bit, find the dealership who wants to work with you. The Subaru dealership I worked with before leaving MA was great, and I leased 7 cars with them, and brought in 3 people who purchased cars over the years. They made my deals easy as chit and I got what I wanted at the price I wanted.
I got our last couple cars at Carmax. So far I am batting 1,000 for experiences and quality. I freaking hate car dealers.
cougar_guy04
08-31-16, 11:27
My first real experience buying a car came last year. Previously I’d bought one from my dad’s coworker and the other two were from a dealer in my small hometown that my family had deal with for years (and I also worked for them in high school washing cars).
I’ll start with the final deal. After decided on a 2011+ Explorer AWD w/ Tow Package, I went to the local Ford dealer. They didn’t have what I wanted and I told them, “If you find [this car] with X, Y, Z and under 70,000 miles for $XX,XXX or less I will buy it. I won’t even argue on price.” That never happened, so I looked towards a “No-haggle” dealer in Florida who just took a 2011 Limited w/ Tow Package (but no 4WD) for a price well under what I was looking to pay. Contacted the internet sales department and we started conducting the deal. Paperwork was done via UPS Next Day Air and for $400 bucks they put it on a truck and delivered it to me. There were a few things that I wish I’d done differently but it didn’t sour me on the experience and the salesman I dealt with was great (if you’re looking for a Ford in the Orlando area, PM me and I’ll get you his name/contact info). The service manager at that place though was a complete dick and I’m glad I don’t have to go to them to get my car worked on. A couple friends said that the guy is a known issue at that dealer and they just go elsewhere for service on their Fords.
The process was about as pain free as I could have asked for, short of an “Amazon Prime” for car purchases. The worst part about it was dealing with the local tax collector for registration and sales tax. In the future, I’m either going back to the dealer I bought this one from or Carmax. I’ll gladly pay a small premium not to have to deal with the mind-screw games that some dealerships like to play.
Before I ended up with the Explorer, I was looking to replace my Vic (against my will, might I add) with either an F-150 or 4-Runner. Looked around for a while for an F-150 and ended up dealing with 3 dealerships along the way before ending up with the Explorer I’ve got now.
· Dealership 1: Local Chevy dealer. Salesman was a good guy, no pressure and easy to deal with. Since I was looking at Fords, he didn’t have too much to add as far as vehicles but when I talked to him through the time he appreciated the discussion about the differences between the Ford and Chevy pickups I was looking at (Engineer by trade, I research things to a fault and can recite option packages and be able to spot a tow package vehicle vs. non-tow package at 50 feet). I probably would have bought from him if the trucks I was looking at hadn’t sold before I made it back to the dealership.
· Dealership 2: Local Ford dealer. The salesman was a pleasure to deal with. His sales manager, meh. Went back and forth on a truck I looked at, actually found an identical truck for $6k less 2 states north and tried to get them to match the price. That truck would be in the driveway if not for the wife deciding she didn’t like the trucks and wanted me to look at an Explorer instead (I've since been told that she likes the idea of a truck, so I'm gonna shop for a nice used F-150 or Tundra in a couple years)
· Dealership 3: Local Dodge dealer, and this one was a doozy. Even though a Durango R/T is on the list to replace my Explorer in the next few years (if I don’t get a truck), I’ll be damned if I’ll cross their threshold ever again. I’ll go to the dealers in Athens or Decatur if I go to a Dodge dealer at all. Show up and want to see 2 F-150 XLTs and a 4Runner that they have. There is another truck that I ask about because it was listed as “ask price”. That truck ended up being about $15k over budget so I said “Skip it” and asked them to see the 4Runner and 2 F-150s.
They have to go to the other lot down the street to bring the one truck and end up bringing back the one F-150 XLT and the Lariat that I said not to bother with. Look at the vehicles; discount one straightaway because the interior is completely trashed. So it’s the 4Runner and F-150 are it. We step back into the dealership real quick because it was hot and the wife was not loving it (7 months pregnant at this point). The salesman starts asking about what I’d be looking to pay for the vehicles and if there’d be a trade, etc., etc. At that point I tell them “I’m just here to look, I’m not impulse buying a $26,000 SUV or truck. Most that’s happening is a test drive and maybe preliminary discussion about prices.”
Sales manager comes over and they start double teaming me and pushing the sale and keeps pushing for numbers, asking for “some basic information” (address, phone number) and then rolls in to asking all the stuff you’d need for a credit check. At that point I start get up and say, “I think we’re going to check out some other dealers. Thanks for your time.” They try everything in the book to keep me there and I finally just tell them, “Unless you’re going to give me $10k off that F-150 on top of $5k for my trade, we’re done here. You’re pushing for a sale and trying to run a credit check without my consent or knowledge without even offering to get the keys for a test drive. If this is how you do business, I want no part of it. Even if you had what I wanted for the price I wanted at this point, I’ll go next door just to not deal with a bunch of shady, pushy hucksters.”
Guy called next day and asked if I was still interested . . . I laughed and told him that unless they wanted to behave like professionals and not jerk me around, I was no longer interested in doing business with them and would advise my friends to do the same. Never heard back from him.
Funny thing, a lot of the Dodges and Ram trucks that I see in my lot at work have stickers from the Dodge dealer one town over. Wonder why that is . . .
Ive bought and sold around 20 or 21 cars and im only 34. I get bored with stuff easily.
I have a number that is good for me and fair for the dealer(usually at invoice +-1%, I dont beat them up over hold back, etc...) so I know they will usually end up there, some faster than others. I also know where I want to be with a trade(if I have one). My last 3 purchases have had no trade and I will be doing a 4th with no trade this fall when VW buys back my TDI. I typically use my credit union unless the manufacturer has special financing. Dealers make their money on financing and depending on what they end up at they have agreements with their banks to tack on some % that the bank cuts them back money for. So you got to be careful when financing with a dealer because they will cut you a deal on the car that doesnt make sense(as I am reading a few people on here who couldnt believe the deal they got) then they tack on 1% to the APR and make their money back that they "lost" on the sale.
Ive had deals that took an hour in and out and ive had deals that took 4-5 hours that I have almost walked away from multiple times. Haggled over a 40k dollar jeep because of 500 bucks we were off on the trade. I finally said "I am out of here, you guys are going to let a 40k dollar deal walk because of 500 bucks I want in the trade, I dont care where you give it to me, but were 500 bucks off, this 50 dollars here and there is ridiculous, im out of here". manager chased me into the lot said "were done" and I said "so youve found the 500 bucks" and he said "yea, were done".
My current car buying with my VW buy back has been a pain in the ass. I want to order a 2017 Mazda 3 with specific color and options for delivery in November or December. 5 or 6 dealers around DFW metroplex. 3 refused to order me a car, I walked, they didnt understand why I didnt want to wait and buy something off the lot. I said "can you guarantee me you will have exactly what I told you I wanted on the lot in november/december" "well, no, but" see ya. One dealer said "we got no problem ordering, order window opens late Aug, early Sept, 3-4 months to get a car, 10-15% off MSRP, etc..." Sales person calls me up ~2 weeks ago and says "order window is open, but no pricing, its just dealer stock orders, come in and we will get your car ordered in that order". So car is ordered, in fact they ordered 2 cars to my specification but different exterior colors because one color is new and I can pick when it gets there, no money down, etc... Pretty happy with said dealership experience thus far.
4 runners are still made in Japan though :)
WOW, Earthquake in Japan?? Funny since most are made in Texas, Some in Mexico.
The wife and just bought a brand new Tacoma 4x4 4door.
I would say the most hassle free experience in my life, in and out of dealer in about 45 min. Smooth as butter.
Kept waiting for that moment buy it never came.
buying a car on Maui is the worst cause most folks dont want to wait and get one shipped from Oahu or Mainland !!!
all but the lexus dealer sucked there and they were great on used cars to :)
I do think its purely the business model of salesman as they all float to dif dealers
did buy one vehicle from Costco and am going to do that again if I buy a new car
my car buddy said costco follows up on each sale and if the dealer tries to mess around costco will yank the sales from that dealer !!!!
and I tested that theory bought a new FJC in 2007 went in haggled for price and no way could they do less etc... then said well this is the one I want and gave them the costco paper and got hooked up with the fleet guy the other guys were pissed and I told them well you were not honest you could have gone lower etc..
but I only buy new toyota 4x4 so not to often do I have to buy new everything else I have owned is used :) the toyota hold value so insane that a 3 year old with 30K is close to a new one so why bother
Euro, I forgot to say nice new ride. Looks great. Hope you get many years/miles of enjoyment out of it.
I started going to my local dealer to get the free service since it was in my town. I blew through that free service rather quickly and decided I liked not changing oil anymore. So I kept going and paying for the service. I had to drop my skid plate to install my road armor bumper and noticed how clean the skid plate was. Not a drop of oil on it. I was due for an oil change and decided to pull the canister filter out, clipped a pleat off and reinstalled it. Took it to the dealer for the change. Brought it home, pulled the filter and what did I find...... My filter with the clipped pleats basking in new oil!!!!
Took the filter back up to them while it was still warm. It was the weekend so nobody there had any authority. Waited til Monday and had a talk with the service and shop manager. Got a refund and I now change my own oil....again.
I'd bet you drive a Tundra?
Same thing here, bought a new Tundra at one dealership and was getting my Toyota care at a dealership closer to my house. First trip, I put torque seal on the bolts of the skid pan. I picked up the truck, sure enough, the skid pan hadn't been removed. Without removing the skid pan, you can't get to the canister filter. Talked to the service manager. He apologized and called it a training error. A training error and offered a "free" oil change? WTF?! your techs can't do an oil change? And a free oil change? Yeah, you goons aren't touching my shit. I'll never use them again, contacted Toyota North America and left them bad reviews on every website I could find.
I had a well thought out couple of paragraphs from someone who is an Internet Sales Manager at a corporate run store in the Northwest. Then I remembered no one give a sh!t because car salesmen are the devil.
Awww.... Come on....what kind of attitude is that?
Go on, finish your story[emoji1]
The last new car we bought was in 2008 when Chrysler was having a ton of trouble. We buy mini-vans and use the piss out of them. Living 60 miles from the city and the grocery store does that. Chrysler offered a lifetime power train warranty on them that year because they couldn't sell anything. They were so hungry we got 1% financing and $5000 off of MSRP without even haggling. I think the whole thing took an hour.
$100 deductible for a transmission or engine seemed like a good deal. The only thing we've managed to break in 125,000 miles is a front axle. The damn thing won't die. I am keeping it for my teenage daughter just on principle, I want to walk into the dealer in 2028 and say "new engine and trans time".. here's a $100. We keep up on the required fluid changes so they can't deny us. It's hilarious, we get monthly offers from them to trade our car in. I think they want all the lifetime warranty rigs off the road and I can't blame them.
My truck was simple. I told the owner of a Chevy dealership what I was looking for and what I was willing to pay while shooting with him at an archery tournament. A week later I get a call from his sales manager with a truck just like I was looking for. Sent them the money and flew down to pick it up a month later. Painless. Too bad he sold the dealership or we'd do the same thing.
I detest haggling on cars and trucks. I buy semi's and heavy equipment without nearly the hassle, why can't a personal use vehicle be the same way?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2LLB9CGfLs
This has been par for the course in a lot of my dealings.
so true !
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2LLB9CGfLs
This has been par for the course in a lot of my dealings.
Awww.... Come on....what kind of attitude is that?
Go on, finish your story[emoji1]
I'm on my popcorn break.
https://youtu.be/af9tTLzuJp8
Congrats on the Runner got one as well. 41242
I'm on my popcorn break.
https://youtu.be/af9tTLzuJp8
The popcorn break was the best... That was funny as hell.
Coal Dragger
09-02-16, 01:55
The last new car we bought was in 2008 when Chrysler was having a ton of trouble. We buy mini-vans and use the piss out of them. Living 60 miles from the city and the grocery store does that. Chrysler offered a lifetime power train warranty on them that year because they couldn't sell anything. They were so hungry we got 1% financing and $5000 off of MSRP without even haggling. I think the whole thing took an hour.
$100 deductible for a transmission or engine seemed like a good deal. The only thing we've managed to break in 125,000 miles is a front axle. The damn thing won't die. I am keeping it for my teenage daughter just on principle, I want to walk into the dealer in 2028 and say "new engine and trans time".. here's a $100. We keep up on the required fluid changes so they can't deny us. It's hilarious, we get monthly offers from them to trade our car in. I think they want all the lifetime warranty rigs off the road and I can't blame them.
My truck was simple. I told the owner of a Chevy dealership what I was looking for and what I was willing to pay while shooting with him at an archery tournament. A week later I get a call from his sales manager with a truck just like I was looking for. Sent them the money and flew down to pick it up a month later. Painless. Too bad he sold the dealership or we'd do the same thing.
I detest haggling on cars and trucks. I buy semi's and heavy equipment without nearly the hassle, why can't a personal use vehicle be the same way?
I would be towing with that mini-van, and abusing the heck out of it. See how many new engines and transmissions you can get them for.
I like Costco prices and no hassle for buying new or leasing. I would suggest getting a price on your trade-in at CarMax prior to going to a dealership. CarMax is 2 for 2 on beating trade-in prices at dealerships for me.
I've worked at a Toyota/Ford dealer as a tech for about 10 years now. Lots of hacks come and go, but there are good people, in sales and in service. Just like some gun owners give everyone and bad name, it's the same for dealers. We're not all bad. Enjoy the 4Runner, they are awesome trucks. Very few issues with them, one will likely be the wife's next vehicle.
Averageman
09-02-16, 10:28
I used to work with a young guy that sold cars as soon as he finished his Military enlistment.
He told me every time he got paid they tried to short change him on his sales for the month. I would guess there are good dealerships and bad ones. The bad ones make it so hard to work there that some of these guys are stuck and willing to do about anything to make a sale.
That is pretty sad, the young man I'm speaking of left and went in to another line of work.
Don Robison
09-02-16, 11:19
If they blatantly lie or try to sell me something I didn't ask for I leave; I always make sure to let the manager know why I'm leaving.
I love Toyota's (I'm on my 3rd FJ cruiser). The girl I trade with has always been great. Last month I seriously considered trading for a 4 runner trd trail model, but changed my mind as I only have about 14K on the FJ (resale value is great on this thing and so it is with the 4 runner too!http://blog.caranddriver.com/which-vehicles-hold-their-value-best-and-which-are-total-depreciation-disasters/). Those 4 runners rock!
fallenromeo
09-02-16, 16:27
I'm on my popcorn break.
https://youtu.be/af9tTLzuJp8
Popcorn break was amazing. I also liked:
Badger: This car is a chick magnet. You like chicks?
Customer: Actually I've been happily married for 42 years.
Badger: hmm. Sorry to hear that.
When I bought my wife's Volvo C70 (she just had to have it :rolleyes:) I had a very bad experience. The salesman was nice, but he wasn't the one negotiating. I had to deal with the business manager. I told him what I was willing to pay, which was fair, and he wouldn't do it. I was back in there a few times and then told him to pound sand. He called me and said he was sorry we could not get the deal done, I said, so was I, and I told him to have a nice day and hung up. An hour later he calls back and says he will meet my price. That's the games they play.
ramairthree
09-02-16, 19:28
I love Toyota's (I'm on my 3rd FJ cruiser). The girl I trade with has always been great. Last month I seriously considered trading for a 4 runner trd trail model, but changed my mind as I only have about 14K on the FJ (resale value is great on this thing and so it is with the 4 runner too!http://blog.caranddriver.com/which-vehicles-hold-their-value-best-and-which-are-total-depreciation-disasters/). Those 4 runners rock!
Yes, they hold value pretty well.
FJ is a little beyond what it was because there are no ones.
Not as bad as when the Defender 90s ended, they went to over 100%.
But a good 20% increase in resale value at three years that it had been previously for the FJs.
Eurodriver
10-01-16, 18:52
Car salesmen are evil. I went with a friend today for her to look at Ford Fusions. (She wanted what she wanted - I was just tagging along) They had an incredible price on a 2016 Titanium. Brand new. She said she'll take it, and we sit down at the salesman's desk.
There is a BIG ASS $27,049 number hanging from the rear view with a stock number and "Dealership price". Along with some "Last year's model - must go!" shit. $27,049 + 6.5% sales tax + $699 dealer fee + $220~ title = OTD price should have been ~$29,800
Nah. They added $1,400 for "paint protection" and a $500 price increase for paying cash. I've never even heard such a thing. Total price was over $32k.
I'm not the type to stick up for a lady - it's 2016 and she can handle her own business but I did politely mention that he could have a really easy sale by letting her pay full asking price and getting you a certified check in about ten minutes or we would just leave and buy a car someplace else.
We ended up leaving. She has a new Camry. Aren't there laws against that sort of thing? Dealerships must make a **** ton of money off people financing, and a **** ton of people must be financing because they literally did everything they could not to accept her check. Would have been the easiest sale in the world. She had already test drove Fusions so she knew what she wanted. Walked in, said she wants that car. Here's the money....and no.
Yea, they always try to get you on the add ons.
It's difficult to buy a new car with zero add-ons, although by being ornery and cranky I've been lucky. I've never known of a worthwhile add-on. Those at $1000 may have cost the dealer $15. Women, young people, and minorities are considered sucker bait at dealerships. Ethical violations are not necessarily illegal. Funeral homes are almost as bad as car dealers. Crooked retail establishments will do what they can get away with. The older I get, the more I see people with no shame.
While we are talking about shady practices, I encourage all to avoid using third party ticket sellers like at Branson, Missouri and other places--especially for room reservations. When buying a ticket on the phone to see a famous has been, I was so impressed with the nice young girl with a rural accent that I went ahead and let her handle the hotel reservations. Yesterday, a slick guy called me at home to remind me that I first had to come by their office to pick up my hotel voucher. I learned that I couldn't go straight to the hotel, and if I was late and didn't go by and see them, then I was stuck out. Pressing him against the wall in the figurative sense, he admitted that he wanted me and my wife to attend a 90 minute session with people selling time shares. I cancelled the hotel reservation and paid a 25% penalty. My plan is to dispute these charges later. At the same time I will complain at BBB.
These people didn't break any laws but were guilty of not being up front with me. The process was seamless and took me in, and had not the slick young man call me, I would not have known the score until I got to Branson. Even if I have to pay the 25%, my new reservation at Marriott was cheaper so the hurt won't be as bad.
I can afford to cancel and pay the penalty. Many can't so that one way they get to people. I'm not rich by any means--just tight and thus had the extra funds to justify the cancelling step.
I dunno if I have said as much (probably so) but if I am buying anything; I am not afraid to tell folks to "kiss my ass, bye."
You either want to sell or not. And extra charge for paying cash? I woulda literally pointed, laughed in his face, and said "Keep dreaming, Alice."
Fly man, you and I share a similar outlook. Maybe we both should travel to Florida and seek an audience with the famous etiquette guru with the club foot. We could improve our social skills and learn how to walk around and grin. Which bus line do you prefer? I'm not picky so just send me a ticket. :D
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