I want to build a battlebelt and would like some advice

[Rattler5]

I currently only have 1 firearm a Daniel Defense V11.

The belt will be for training and range time. Possibly with me on a hike. The rifle will be turned into more of an SPR type rifle in the future, but for now it is for training is is running slick with just iron sights. Sling is soon in its future.

For the belt I am thinking about the condor one with its suspenders. I am trying to make it a budget one, but that is not lacking in toughness.

I want to be able to carry 6-7 magazines total in pouches that do not have velcro. I currently have 4 30-rnd NATO mags (these are going to be my primary magazines and I want to get more of them), 3 30-rnd pmags, 1 20-rnd pmag and 1 32-rnd DD mag.

I am thinking about the dark angel trauma kit as another denizen of this forum spoke highly of them. I know it is cheaper to make your own kits, but I work in the oil and petroleum industry so my free time is rather short. Should I get a tourniquet? Other suggestions for a medical/trauma pouch?

I will be getting a pistol in the future and want to be able to carry 3 mags for it (1 in the weapon and 2 in pouches on the belt.). The pistol will likely be a Walther PPQ Navy. Possibly suppressed in the future I hope.

Dump pouch suggestions?

I am trying to keep the total cost for the belt with accessories under $300-400 dollars (is that a reasonable limit?).

Any other suggestions for me?

Thanks guys and gals and I hope that you all have a great day!

[Eurodriver]

Suggestions? Buy a sling immediately.

Hillary will be elected in like 3 weeks. Do you remember the Crime Bill of 1994? You have nine magazines, and no one is going to be banning battle belts. Buy more magazines with your sling order. How much ammo do you have?

What made you choose a Walther PPQ? Do you shoot it better than say, a Sig P320 or a G19? I can find a Glock 19 Magazine at my grocery store if I look hard enough, where are PPQ mags and what are they going for?

Have you ever tried to carry seven loaded 30rd 5.56 Magazines and 2 loaded pistol magazines and a dump pouch and an IFAK on a belt? I haven't, because 2x2 is already heavy enough. Those are plate carrier/chest rig amounts.

You work in the petroleum industry - is there a pressing need to carry 210 rounds of ammo for your rifle with an IFAK? That is a USMC Grunt loadout in Afghanistan. What are you trying to do with this belt? Even the most intense training classes will not require more than 4 spare magazines.

[Defaultmp3]

Any particular reason you want everything on the belt? I would think a war belt coupled with a chest rig would be a better solution, as trying to carry 6 rifle mags on the belt won't be easy, if you're also planning to carry pistol mags, IFAKs, pistols, etc. on the same belt, and still be able to grab the magazines.

Condor in general is junk; I've never heard any serious user consider them to be durable.

Yes, get a TQ; most of the larger DARKs will come with one anyway. I'll note that getting an IFAK without learning how to use the contents is a terrible plan. It'd be like buying a gun for self-defense, but never actually opening the box up to even touch the gun, except to load the magazine. You'll not know what to do with the components, and you'll be stuck there with what might be exactly what's needed, but with no knowledge on how to use it. FWIW, the TQ is used for any major bleeding of the extremities, so they are a vital part of any FAK, even those that aren't oriented around treating GSWs.

The ATS War Belt is a classic, and not very expensive; however, you'll still need an inner duty belt for it. For magazines, the HSGI Tacos are a popular option; I've used to use ITW FastMags, but have moved away from them due to their incompatibility with Gen3 PMags. If you don't use Gen3 PMags, they are an excellent options. These days, I use the Esstac KYWI on my belt. The BFG TenSpeed pouches are also an interesting option, though they are not as suited for training, due to their all elastic construction, which makes putting mags back in one-handed somewhat difficult. All of those options also have pistol variants.

[B Cart]

Having run multiple battle belt set ups in many classes etc over the years, I would highly discourage trying to run 7 AR mags and 3 pistol mags on a belt. That will be way to heavy and cumbersome, and just isn't necessary for 99.9% of situations you will most likely encounter. Personally, I think 2 AR mags and 2 pistol mags on your belt is plenty (I prefer ITW Fast Mags). I like having a dump pouch to toss empty mags, gloves, etc, and I also carry a handheld flashlight and fixed blade on my belt. I put together a small gunshot specific trauma kit with SOF tourniquet that doesn't take up much space. I would also stay away from condor if you can afford it. I like the VTAC Brokos belt, and it won't break the bank.

One last important note: Once you set up your belt how you want it, I would suggest you run a half mile and do some push ups/sit ups etc with your gear on to make sure nothing falls out and everything is squared away. You'd be surprised how many guys show up to a class with a bunch of gear, and the minute they run more than 5 feet, shit starts falling out or coming off. Doing a little PT with your gear on will let you know pretty quickly what you need/don't need, and what you can arrange better etc. Just my .02

[tgizzard]

Don't buy anything condor if you have plans on using it in the real world. I second Eurodriver in asking, why do you want to put 7 AR mags plus pistol mags all on this one belt? If you are looking to take some classes what you want to run is extreme overkill. Again it's been said but it's sound advice ... buy a good sling and more mags / ammo. The prices on those two items have the potential to absolutely skyrocket and be perpetually out of stock in the next couple of months. With your proposed budget of $300 - $400 you can get a decent amount of ammo, a few mags, and you might be able to slip that sling in as well that was mentioned. That would be (in my opinion) a much better use of that money right now.

Nice rifle by the way!

[Rattler5]

I will probably drop it down to 4 mags then, with 3 on the belt and 1 in the rifle. With 2 pistol mag pouches. Thanks for the feedback.

Also, I see a lot of belts showing a riggers belt, what should I look for in one of those?

As for the Walther I shot it better than the glock and I did not like how the glock handled. I have not shot a sig 320.

[ggammell]

I will probably drop it down to 4 mags then, with 3 on the belt and 1 in the rifle. With 2 pistol mag pouches. Thanks for the feedback.

Also, I see a lot of belts showing a riggers belt, what should I look for in one of those?

As for the Walther I shot it better than the glock and I did not like how the glock handled. I have not shot a sig 320.

Look for a riggers belt that is stiff due to the material, not stiff due to the use of a stiffener. I am pleased with my HSGI.

[BrigandTwoFour]

I'm going to go against the grain a bit. It is possible to do that many rifle mags on the belt, but you are going to need an H-harness, and you will have to think about weight distribution. Stacking eight pounds of mags on one side of the belt can be very imbalanced.

For dump pouches, I've always liked Emdom USA. But I've gotten away from dump pouches in favor of a utility pouch (ATS medium upright). I also have an HSGI bleeder kit, but I think it's too small. The DARK is a good option. I've been leaning towards switching the HSGI out for a Chinook Medical TMK pouch.

Also, as far as noise goes- don't overthink it. If you're going for a reload, then noisy velcro probably isn't very high on your priority list. I've used an HSGI taco for the first reload, and then TT mag pouches for the rest.

[Rattler5]

I'm going to go against the grain a bit. It is possible to do that many rifle mags on the belt, but you are going to need an H-harness, and you will have to think about weight distribution. Stacking eight pounds of mags on one side of the belt can be very imbalanced.

For dump pouches, I've always liked Emdom USA. But I've gotten away from dump pouches in favor of a utility pouch (ATS medium upright). I also have an HSGI bleeder kit, but I think it's too small. The DARK is a good option. I've been leaning towards switching the HSGI out for a Chinook Medical TMK pouch.

Also, as far as noise goes- don't overthink it. If you're going for a reload, then noisy velcro probably isn't very high on your priority list. I've used an HSGI taco for the first reload, and then TT mag pouches for the rest.

I am not going to put that many mags on it. I do not like velcro as it picks up everything and makes noise. How securely do the tacos keep the mags in place of you fall?

I am going to be putting an H-harness on the vest. An ATS with H-harness and one of their belts. Which puts it at just over a hundred, so then it is on to magazine pouches, trauma kit, and dump pouch. Also I need to attach a knife to it also. And of course a sling and attachment point for it.

[themonk]

Good place to start as you can see what others are doing - https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?214-First-line-belts

There is a TON of info on the site about this topic - https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=battle+belt+site:m4carbine.net&cad=h

[sevenhelmet]

What I learned making a "battle belt" (range belt) is that a belt is just one piece of gear, not an entire loadout. FWIW, I started with 6 mag pouches on my padded belt, but have reduced that 2, with 2 pistol mags. If I ever need more than that (why?) then I hope I'm wearing my PC, which has room for 3 more mags for a total of 6. I can also use two of my "equipment" pouches for pistol mags as an option. Normally those carry a flashlight and a multi-tool. In addition, I have a dump pouch, DARK IFAK, pistol holster, and a soft "taco" for a water bottle, monocular range finder, 2 more mags, or whatever else I can dream up. IIRC, the belt weighs 13 pounds fully loaded, and I don't think it needs anything else. Knife? That goes in a pocket. I don't need a big-ass survival knife on my belt.

Another lesson I learned: suspenders do nothing for me. If the belt is so heavy I need suspenders, it will bounce around when I run anyway, or be so tight it's uncomfortable for more than a few minutes of wear. If I'm going with that heavy of a loadout, I'll just wear my PC, which gives me armor and room for 3 additional mags.

Finally, I recommend HSGI as a good basis for your gear. It costs real money to be sure, but it will hold up under hard use and the MOLLE is to spec. A lot of Condor stuff won't and isn't. I use HSGI for just about everything on my belt (dump pouch is Maxpedition IIRC, and the med kit is DARK, which I also highly recommend.)

[the automator]

I am not going to put that many mags on it. I do not like velcro as it picks up everything and makes noise. I think the 30 rounds of 5.56 is going to make more noise than the velcro on your reload. I always thought the noise argument for velcro is silly, especially in a normal guy context.

[BrigandTwoFour]

I understand the concern about picking up "junk," but I've read this same debate over and over at Light Fighter with dudes who do this for a living. Even they say they aren't all that concerned about noise and picking up gunk in the velcro. That said, Tactical Tailor does make a decent looking pouch that gives you the option of fastex buckle or velcro.

http://www.tacticaltailor.com/akm16magpouch.aspx

MLRC was also working on a design as well
http://soldiersystems.net/2016/07/29/sneak-peek-jungle-m4-mag-pouch/

My only concern, if any, is that I've gotten accustomed to pouches that have shock cord on them to contract the pouch around contained mags. I don't like things rattling around.

[Defaultmp3]

I do not like velcro as it picks up everything and makes noise. How securely do the tacos keep the mags in place of you fall?Retention on the Tacos is adjustable with the shock cords. You can also add bungee tabs on top for extra retention if needed. The main weak point of the Tacos is also their source of greatness: the bungee retention. It allows for it to adapt to many different magazines, but it also wears out, and fails when exposed to fire (the latter isn't a concern for us normal folks using it in training, but it is a very real issue if used in combat).

Running 3 mags is pretty reasonable if you're going to eschew a chest rig or PC. As for the whole hook & loop thing, I don't mind the sound, but I do hate it catching shit when doing admin shit with my gear and wearing it out when you get dirt/sand in it.

I've used the EGL Loppy Dump Pouch, which I quite liked; however, it does have hook and loop on the opening to help keep it closed if you want it to be; it's not super sticky, so I wouldn't be too worried about it. I've moved away from it because I haven't found too much use for such a structured dump pouch, and moved on to the BFG Ultralight dump pouch; I was only using my dump pouch to carry my notebook and pen during class, so there wasn't much point in having a large, heavy-duty dump pouch like the Loppy. The Ultralight is not the greatest if you plan on actually regularly putting magazines in it, IMO, because it has no structure.

[the automator]

I understand the concern about picking up "junk," but I've read this same debate over and over at Light Fighter with dudes who do this for a living. Even they say they aren't all that concerned about noise and picking up gunk in the velcro. That said, Tactical Tailor does make a decent looking pouch that gives you the option of fastex buckle or velcro.

http://www.tacticaltailor.com/akm16magpouch.aspx

MLRC was also working on a design as well
http://soldiersystems.net/2016/07/29/sneak-peek-jungle-m4-mag-pouch/

My only concern, if any, is that I've gotten accustomed to pouches that have shock cord on them to contract the pouch around contained mags. I don't like things rattling around.

Yeah, I get the crap being picked up. Some of my velcro I've had for a really long time has dirt and thread and crap in it, but it's easily fixed by picking it out and besides that it still works. I don't think one trip in the woods is going to gum it up enough for it to effect function (especially since if it's in use it should be attached together), but you never know I guess.

The noise thing always kills me because it's always some guy playing with gear in a class or in the woods. That full mag you just ripped off is going to do more to give your location away than a little *rip* noise.

Oh, for what it's worth, I really like the ESSTAC Kywi pouches.

[Vandal]

OP, I just went through the build process and it took me a while to figure out what I wanted. The idea for me was a range/ training belt that in the event of the North Koreans invading my town from the air could be put on along with my PC. Here is what I have.

Belt and Inner Belt: HSGI Sure-Grip with HSGI 1.75" rigger belt.
Mag Pouches: 2x HSGI Pistol Tacos, 2x HSGI Rifle Tacos on my left side. I run a Singe HGSI pistol taco for my flashlight on the right front of the belt along with a Nite-Ize Large Figure 9 Carabiner.

Holster: Safariland ALS for Glock 21 with X300U located at 3:00 with a Dark Angel DARK kit right behind it.

When loaded down it all balances very well. I do have a spot open for a radio behind my rifle pouches and a Benchmade SOC-P will hide inside the left side of my belt, lashed to my inner belt.

As you can see I really like HSGI stuff. I also have their rifle Tacos on my PC. I have yet to lose a mag out of one. As Joe Citizens we likely won't use our mag pouches etc enough to wear out the shock cords. The ITW FastMags are also a very good option if you want to stay with open top. I've also seen some people running Raven Concealment or similar style kydex pistol and rifle pouches on their belts.

Don't worry about noise. That all goes out the window as soon as you step on something crunchy.

[Eurodriver]

Interesting that the Tacos are so popular here.

I strongly prefer the Esstac KYWI. Why do you guys like the tacos so much over the KYWI?

[BrigandTwoFour]

Interesting that the Tacos are so popular here.

I strongly prefer the Esstac KYWI. Why do you guys like the tacos so much over the KYWI?

For me, it's a practicality thing. My mid-weight battle belt is meant to be a "jack of all trades" to support my AR-15, AR-15, or M1A. The taco, as well as all the other mag pouches on my belt, can accommodate all three.

My chest rig uses KYWI, though, since I keep my chest rig more weapon specific.

[BuzzinSATX]

Interesting that the Tacos are so popular here.

I strongly prefer the Esstac KYWI. Why do you guys like the tacos so much over the KYWI?

Are the KYWI pistol mag pouches adjustable or have elasticity? Basically, can I use the same mag pouches for double stack Glock 9MM mags and Glock .45 mags (I.e. G19 and G30 mags)? Thanks!


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[themonk]

Interesting that the Tacos are so popular here.

I strongly prefer the Esstac KYWI. Why do you guys like the tacos so much over the KYWI?

Can run both ar and ak mags without any changes

[Defaultmp3]

Are the KYWI pistol mag pouches adjustable or have elasticity? Basically, can I use the same mag pouches for double stack Glock 9MM mags and Glock .45 mags (I.e. G19 and G30 mags)? Thanks!They use a Kydex insert. SKD states that they retain .45 ACP Glock mags fine, and are the limit of the magazine, actually.

Made to fit most common 9/40 double stack pistol magazines, the Pistol KYWI pouch will hold up to a Glock 21 magazine, but will NOT retain a single stack 1911 mag.

[scooter22]

KYWI > Taco

[BuzzinSATX]

They use a Kydex insert. SKD states that they retain .45 ACP Glock mags fine, and are the limit of the magazine, actually.

Thanks much for that info. I was wanting something like these I could use for both G19/17 mags and PPQ .45 mags, which are relatively similar to the G21 mags.

[Rattler5]

Please define PC.

Thanks for your feedback guys.

[rfairman]

Please define PC.

Thanks for your feedback guys.

Pc = plate carrier


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[Eurodriver]

My mid-weight battle belt is meant to be a "jack of all trades" to support my AR-15, AR-15, or M1A. The taco, as well as all the other mag pouches on my belt, can accommodate all three.


Can run both ar and ak mags without any changes

That explains it. I only own 5.56mm AR15s. The KYWI seems much more robust and simplistic than the Taco which is why I went that route. No cords or anything to deal with, and the kydex inserts will last forever. However, if I had multiple platforms I now know I would run the tacos for sure. Thanks

[Defaultmp3]

That explains it. I only own 5.56mm AR15s. The KYWI seems much more robust and simplistic than the Taco which is why I went that route. No cords or anything to deal with, and the kydex inserts will last forever. However, if I had multiple platforms I now know I would run the tacos for sure. ThanksWell, Haley has his little inserts that are kinda like the KYWIs that allow for multiple types of magazines without having to deal with shock cord: http://www.haleystrategic.com/mp2-single

Tyr has two products like the Taco, but cleaner, as the shock cord is mostly hidden, rather than being all exposed like the Taco. One version is straight shock cord (http://www.tyrtactical.com/products/details/magazine-rifle/tyr-tactical-combat-adjustable-pouch/), the other utilizes both the shock cord and an insert (http://www.tyrtactical.com/products/details/magazine-rifle/combat-adjustable-happy-rifle-mag/).

[mtdawg169]

Well, Haley has his little inserts that are kinda like the KYWIs that allow for multiple types of magazines without having to deal with shock cord: http://www.haleystrategic.com/mp2-single

Tyr has two products like the Taco, but cleaner, as the shock cord is mostly hidden, rather than being all exposed like the Taco. One version is straight shock cord (http://www.tyrtactical.com/products/details/magazine-rifle/tyr-tactical-combat-adjustable-pouch/), the other utilizes both the shock cord and an insert (http://www.tyrtactical.com/products/details/magazine-rifle/combat-adjustable-happy-rifle-mag/).
I've used the Kywis and the Haley Strategic inserts. The Kywi is much more secure.

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[scooter22]

Just FYI: I haven't had great success with some of Haley's other products. I don't think I will ever purchase any of his gear again.

[HMM]

I've got two of the TYR Tactical Gunfighter Belts. One has 2 pistol tacos, 2 rifle tacos and a dump pouch. The other one I run with my plate carrier and it has 2 pistol tacos and 1 rifle taco. I use the Uncle Mike's reflex holster system the quick disconnect system (basically allows you to drop the holster down a little further but not a drop leg. And I can swap out other reflex holsters since the 3 pistols we use mostly all have the adapter plates on the holsters. I've been happy with my choices for the classes I've used them in.

[Benito]

I have gone through a lot of mag pouches, and the HSGI TACOs and the Tyr Tactical Combat Adjustable Pouches are as good as it gets.

[steyrman13]

Just FYI: I haven't had great success with some of Haley's other products. I don't think I will ever purchase any of his gear again.

Out of curiosity which ones? I was looking at his flatpack and possibly incog rifle bag

[scooter22]

Out of curiosity which ones? I was looking at his flatpack and possibly incog rifle bag

The sling and the SF MIL620 mount.

I purchased the sling because it is low profile and simplistic. The sling came twisted/tangled. The metal triglides seemed to influence the sling to fold over on itself when passing through.

The MIL620 mount is just a crappy design IMO.

The flatpack looks nice, but idk.

YMMV

[Mr. Goodtimes]

I think the battle belt gets way over done by a lot of people. For the non LEO average joe, I would stick to side arm, spare rifle mag, spare pistol mag and fixed blade knife if that's your taste.

The thing I like about having a belt is I can remove a chest rig or PC and still have 31 rds of pistol and 60 rds of rifle on me.


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[BrigandTwoFour]

I think the battle belt gets way over done by a lot of people. For the non LEO average joe, I would stick to side arm, spare rifle mag, spare pistol mag and fixed blade knife if that's your taste.

The thing I like about having a belt is I can remove a chest rig or PC and still have 31 rds of pistol and 60 rds of rifle on me.


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I think there is definitely a philosophy component to it. Load carriage is still a relatively personal thing. Huge battle belts with no chest rigs have a hint of tradition about them, since it is well known that carrying weight about the hips has always been (and still is) the best way to carry heavy loads over distance and terrain when on foot. The rise of the chest rig, while not new, has a lot to do with a corresponding rise in mounted operations with vehicles. I'm already seeing a returning emphasis on updated versions of LCE due to a resurgence in dismounted jungle warfare preparation.

In any case, as you pointed out, there is a utility to having a "minimum capability" belt that can be worn independently of a main chest rig/fighting load. Such a belt provides the wearer a basic capability of fighting with rifle or pistol, first aid, and utility without large amounts of weight.

I think a fixed blade on the belt is a great asset. The question I keep coming back to, though, is what kind of knife? I've been keeping a fighting knife blade- but Walter Mitty aside, I think some form of fixed blade utility knife is probably more practical for day to day tasks.

[Rattler5]

Fixed blades are simpler, finding a good one can be hard though.

I am leaning towards ATS as their prices seem pretty good, but will the belt hold up to use in the field?