View Full Version : First AR--what all do I need?
OK. I'm deploying to Afghanistan for a year starting in Jul next year and will be issued a M4. In consideration of this deployment along with other factors, I decided to purchase a similar weapon for home defense/fun/familiarization. I've basically decided to go with a Noveske low profile N4.
As my first AR, what else do I need? Case, magazines, cleaning supplies, etc?
Also, what about its trigger? It's set b/n 5 to 8 lbs whereas others are set around 3lbs. Should that concern me?
Thnx!
OK. I'm deploying to Afghanistan for a year starting in Jul next year and will be issued a M4. In consideration of this deployment along with other factors, I decided to purchase a similar weapon for home defense/fun/familiarization. I've basically decided to go with a Noveske low profile N4.
As my first AR, what else do I need? Case, magazines, cleaning supplies, etc?
Also, what about its trigger? It's set b/n 5 to 8 lbs whereas others are set around 3lbs. Should that concern me?
Thnx!
Welcome to the forum. The Noveske AR is a good choice.
Things to get:
1. Flashlight
2. Sling (BFG Vickers)
3. Mags (Magpul PMAG)
4. Cleaning kit
5. Lube (machine gunners lube and or weapon shield)
6. Ammunition
7. Optic (Aimpoint, EOTech, Trijicon)
8. Training
Combat triggers should generally either be single stage (5-8lbs) or QUALITY two stage (around 4-5LBS). You do not want 3LBS single stage triggers on a combat weapon.
C4
Welcome to the forum. The Noveske AR is a good choice.
Things to get:
1. Flashlight
2. Sling (BFG Vickers)
3. Mags (Magpul PMAG)
4. Cleaning kit
5. Lube (machine gunners lube and or weapon shield)
6. Ammunition
7. Optic (Aimpoint, EOTech, Trijicon)
8. Training
Combat triggers should generally either be single stage (5-8lbs) or QUALITY two stage (around 4-5LBS). You do not want 3LBS single stage triggers on a combat weapon.
C4
Thank you. I actually left a message at your # to call me back earlier today in reference to this purchase. I forgot to add that I'll likely be going with a Comp M2 or M3 Aimpoint--not sure of what base to go with...maybe the AMD? Oh, and I'll be getting military training...
I'd strongly recommend ammo & professional training from the likes of Larry Vickers or Pat Rogers. Good luck.
parker7777
09-13-08, 18:39
ammo and lots of mags ----- p-mags, usgi,
Parabellum9x19mm
09-13-08, 21:21
did you just enlist or something? buying a Noveske is a good way to spend some of that signing bonus money :D
i'd hold off on an optic until you are sure exactly what kind of optic you want and until you have and are already well stocked up on magazines and ammo.
the most important pieces of gear you need to get are:
MAGAZINES!!!!! PMags or *quality* USGI mags (Labelle, D&H, DSG)
Ammo (PRVI M193 & 75 Match HPBT make great practice ammo)
a sling (VTAC, VCAS, Urban ERT, Gear Sector)
No, I've been in for a while but my career didn't demand front-line type involvement until these last couple yrs. Due to events, the demand for my type outside the wire has developed.
The Aimpoint will be similar to what I'll be issued.
Where can I order an inexpensive case of ammo? I shoot factory reloads for my pistols...
consider a rail and VFG setup also. +1 on the classes...you will get to know what you do/don't like and what works/doesn't work for you.
Boltgun
magazines (http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/AR-15-Magazines-p/magazines%20dh%20gt30mf%20100%20pack.htm)
sling (http://blueforcegear.com/product.cfm?type=cat&cat_id=5&prod_id=105)
Then I'd add the red dot sight (RDS) and light of your choosing. The Aimpoint T-1 (http://www.aimpoint.com/products/aimpoint_product_lines/aimpoint_micro_t-1) (on a riser like the Larue (http://stores.homestead.com/Laruetactical/Detail.bok?no=150) or the ADM (http://www.americandefensemanufacturing.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=32)) is popular right now, as is the Surefire X300 (http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main/co_disp/displ/carfnbr/313/prrfnbr/24462/X300-LED-WeaponLight). If you're going with the Recce N4 then I'd look at the Aimpoint M4s (http://www.aimpoint.com/products/aimpoint_product_lines/aimpoint_compm4_and_compm4s) and the new Surefire Scout (http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main/co_disp/displ/carfnbr/345/prrfnbr/24559/Scout-Lightsupandreg-sup).
As for ammo, I'm cheap and shoot Wolf without issue.
consider a rail and VFG setup also. +1 on the classes...you will get to know what you do/don't like and what works/doesn't work for you.
Boltgun
The N4 low profile comes with a rail ;)
Thank you for your service to your country and all of us in the USA.
Blue Force Gear VCAS Sling (padded)
Quality teflon coated USGI mags w/added Magpul Ranger 'plates like these http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/AR15-Magazines-p/magazines%20dh%20bt30mf%2010pack.htm
Aimpoint M3 in LaRue Tactical mount. Compatible w/NVD.
Surefire 6P w/Malkoff M60 LED drop in, in a Larue LT-606 mount.
Trigger - Optional. Timney is a 4lb drop in for AR rifles.
Training - I'm assuming you will receive training from the Army. No need to spend your own money on this.
Here's ammo - http://www.the-armory.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/223_ammunition.html
Good luck and Godspeed.
grimklott,
I would stick with the standard trigger just like the one that your issue weapon will have. For deployment get some personal PMAGS and good mags for your sidearm (if issued). I wouldn't worry too much about the HSLD gear and would really focus on some good trigger time. Though you may not think that you will be on the "front lines" the shit is getting hotter there and you need to be as prepared as possible in the event that you get into the shit unexpectedly.
Get some good instruction on maintenance (what works as opposed to what doesn't) and seek out the advice of those who have actually been to A'stan and outside the wire as opposed to a Bagram FOBbit.
Failure2Stop
09-17-08, 07:27
I built a clone of my work M4A1s for training continuity when not able to access a work gun. I wanted it to be as close as possible to the issued item to ensure "plug and play" compatability. I made one mistake though- I had a PWS FSC556 permanently attached to bring the barrel length to 16"- the problem is that it is so effective as a comp I can get lazy behind the gun and not run it quite like I do with an A2 comp equipped M4.
Anyway, I put on a Knight's RAS like the issued item. That's pretty-much irrelevant to you since you are getting a quality rail system with the gun.
If you know what optic you will be issued, you will benefit from picking one up immediately to begin your personal quest toward excellence. It is also worth it to pick up an identical BUIS to whatever you are issued.
Get a good 2-point sling. My vote is for the Blue Force Gear VCAS (http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=VCAS&reference=/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi%3Fsearch%3Daction%26keywords%3Dsling%20not%20mount%26searchstart%3D0%26template%3DPDGCommTemplates/FullNav/SearchResult.html). The VTAC is also nice, and there are other many other good options, however I personally prefer the VCAS over them all.
I also highly recommend getting a rail-mounted sling attachment of some flavor for the M4. I personally prefer low-profile types like the CQD forward sling mount (http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=FSM&reference=/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi%3Fsearch%3Daction%26keywords%3Dsling%20and%20mount%26searchstart%3D0%26template%3DPDGCommTemplates/FullNav/SearchResult.html). The placement of the QD on the Noveske is good, and if you want to keep QD caipability you can easily go with the Daniel Defense QD rail mounted sling mount (http://www.danieldefense.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=4) for the issued gun in the same place.
Along with the front sling mount a rear attachment point at the rear of the receiver is way better than attaching it to the buttstock. Since replacing the end-plate is generally verboten the PR-4 (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=1129) is an excellent clamp-on adaptor that you can readily remove in case of idiocy that does not alter the base configuration of the weapon.
You need a light. Easiest answer is the VLTOR offset light mount (http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=SM-OCG) with a SureFire G2 (http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=G2&reference=/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi%3Fsearch%3Daction%26keywords%3Dflashlight%20not%20mount%26searchstart%3D9%26template%3DPDGCommTemplates/FullNav/SearchResult.html). The VLTOR absolutely reeks of quality and the G2 is a proven, tough light that is easily replacable (everyone should deploy with at least 2 of these IMHO).
Don't forget about other pieces that might be on your work gun (such as PEQ-2s or 15s) and account for them when planning your lay-out on your personal gun. It makes little sense to train with your light in a position that will conflict with your laser, only to realize it too late. FWIW- though my adaptation of and around the system I have found that having the laser module mounted a 3 oclock and the light at 1030ish works the best for me. If you are using a VFG and a full-hand grip (chicken-choker) you may find that 12 oclock for the laser and 5 oclock for the light will work best. Make your crap work for you, don't let a first-impression mounting position dictate your use unless constrained for some reason.
Get some good lubricant for your gun. Carry a small bottle on your gear with a larger reservoir in your third-line. I am a recent convert to Weapons Shield- it's good stuff. Avoid grease for operational use unless you spread it very thin and follow with liquid lube; then again, for the effort, you could just apply a decent liquid and be done with it.
Quality training is worth it, and price is relative. Cost is a mindset issue. Every dollar you spend with a quality instructor (Vickers, Rogers (both), Awerbuck and Gonzales spring to mind) will directly transfer to increased skill and knowledge. It's your life, take accountability for your training. I have been in several open-enrollment courses that included active-duty guys that get some of the best training within the military. If they are attending these courses on their own dime you can bet the instruction is worth it (once agin I am speaking about top-level courses, not "Uncle Ned's Advanced Bump-Firing Course"). Do not waste your money on a course that does not have an AAR from a knowledgable shooter. A low-light course should be at the top of your list. Dean Caputo's operator class is awesome for learning how to keep a good gun running, easily giving you 5 years of direct experience in 2 days.
And of course magazines and more magazines.
Certainly I agree with everything said above, I think it's important to emphasize a lot of practice with iron sights. So much so you may not want to mount your optic till after you're really used to shooting with irons. You may or may not get the optic of your choice upon deployment, but you will get irons. Irons are also the sight that has the lowest probability of failure, and when you're out in afg for weeks at a time that's of real value. That's going to be one heck of a first AR btw.
grimloktt,
some of the gear you buy can be mounted on your issue weapon, i.e., slings, lights, grips... So if your unit will not buy it for you, just get it yourself and it's yours to keep when you redeploy.
Many of us over in the sandbox are carrying PMAGS that we purchased out of pocket. Some units are now starting to buy them for their troops, so check with supply or your commander. GWOT funds help with the decision, it really doesn't cost the unit anything. Again, if you buy your own, than they stay with you for your personal weapon.
Take advantage of the small arms ranges on the base and shoot as much as you can when you get an opportunity outside the wire. I try to make sure my troops shoot every time we go outside the wire, which is every damn day.
Good luck in Afghanistan and good hunting.
SeriousStudent
09-17-08, 22:42
I just wish to echo the other posters wishes for a safe tour, and a speedy return home. Thank you for your service.
And a big plus one on the PMags and Blue Force Gear.
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