View Full Version : wolf ammo gouges my feed ramp
found a stach of some 6 year old Wolf 223 in the garage ,so I take a ride out to the desert and feed it to a new build BCM middy upper .Ameetec lower ,RRA 2 stage,milspec magpul crt stock . after about 2 mags I get a stopage ,there is a round jamed in the chamber not all the way in and the bolt wont close all the way . so I get a fiberglass rod and beat it out. now i see a gouge in the right feed ramp at the very bottom of the upper that wasn't there B4. small but nasty and now without black finish . the weapon functions fine (I shot 6 mags of Fed XM193 ) after ,and no problem and was keeping it in 3 inchs at 100 yards with a Troy BUIS. that is the last time I shoot that steel cased Wolf shit in any of my AR's . :mad: this happened to me B4 about 2 or 3 years ago on a LMT with the same ammo . I should have tossed that ammo then . just goe's to show you how cheap and stupid I can be .
found a stach of some 6 year old Wolf 223 in the garage ,so I take a ride out to the desert and feed it to a new build BCM middy upper .Ameetec lower ,RRA 2 stage,milspec magpul crt stock . after about 2 mags I get a stopage ,there is a round jamed in the chamber not all the way in and the bolt wont close all the way . so I get a fiberglass rod and beat it out. now i see a gouge in the right feed ramp at the very bottom of the upper that wasn't there B4. small but nasty and now without black finish . the weapon functions fine (I shot 6 mags of Fed XM193 ) after ,and no problem and was keeping it in 3 inchs at 100 yards with a Troy BUIS. that is the last time I shoot that steel cased Wolf shit in any of my AR's . :mad: this happened to me B4 about 2 or 3 years ago on a LMT with the same ammo . I should have tossed that ammo then . just goe's to show you how cheap and stupid I can be .
:p wolf is nasty stuff... The steel cased cheap stuff anyway. I learned a simular lesson with the 1st AR I owned. I bought it used from a pawn shop and the guy threw in a case of 500 wolf for free. I thought I was making out good until I drove to the desert, had a jam on round 3 and had no tools to extract the stuck shell. Spent alot of time and gas on a valuable lesson, "don't buy wolf in .223."
I have an AK47 and I am considering running wolf in it being that it has more tolerance for bad ammo. I'm not sure yet though, at 1/5 the price it is very tempting; even after what I have been through and hearing your story :o
Jay Cunningham
09-15-08, 13:06
So far I have run 14 magazines of Russian corrosive 5.45x39mm steel cased corrosive ammo through my S&W upper with nary a hitch. I am waiting for the evil steel case ammo to not work in my upper. Of course the 5.45 has the super HSLD tapered round to ease extraction...
If it:
-breaks my extractor
-chokes on laquer and corrosive salts
-gouges my feedramps
-kills a busload of nuns and orphans
I'll about it post here.
I drove to the desert, had a jam on round 3 and had no tools to extract the stuck shell. Spent alot of time and gas on a valuable lesson, "don't buy wolf in .223."
You should keep a cleaning rod (even just a USGI sectional type) in your gear even if you don't shoot wolf.
A chamber brush really comes in handy if you get a separated brass case. I had a gun go down after only 12 rounds cuz I didn't have a chamber brush to get the other half of a separated case out of my gun.
bullitt5172
09-15-08, 13:27
found a stach of some 6 year old Wolf 223 in the garage ,so I take a ride out to the desert and feed it to a new build BCM middy upper .Ameetec lower ,RRA 2 stage,milspec magpul crt stock . after about 2 mags I get a stopage ,there is a round jamed in the chamber not all the way in and the bolt wont close all the way . so I get a fiberglass rod and beat it out. now i see a gouge in the right feed ramp at the very bottom of the upper that wasn't there B4. small but nasty and now without black finish . the weapon functions fine (I shot 6 mags of Fed XM193 ) after ,and no problem and was keeping it in 3 inchs at 100 yards with a Troy BUIS. that is the last time I shoot that steel cased Wolf shit in any of my AR's . :mad: this happened to me B4 about 2 or 3 years ago on a LMT with the same ammo . I should have tossed that ammo then . just goe's to show you how cheap and stupid I can be .
I doubt the Wolf ammo scratched your feed ramp. Send your Wolf to me, my Colts have fired over 5,000rds of it over the years and I haven't had a single issue. I don't shoot near as much as a buddy of mine (Steve on this site) and he had never had an issue either. Lot's of people shoot Wolf, it's dirty but it works.
Littlelebowski
09-15-08, 13:31
My steel cased 5.45 killed several nuns this weekend but no orphans.
Seriously though, I run steel cased ammo through my 5.45 and 5.56 with no problems. Seems like very soft steel.
I always carry a ( aprox.223 cal ) fiber glass rod for just such emergencys ,I find fiberglass cant hurt the rifleing so that's what I use . I don't know if the old Wolf was bad or I just got a bad batch ,but I will never use steel cased ammo in an AR again .
this was a brand new upper and the gouge was not there B4 the Wolf round got jamed ..
I doubt the Wolf ammo scratched your feed ramp. Send your Wolf to me, my Colts have fired over 5,000rds of it over the years and I haven't had a single issue. I don't shoot near as much as a buddy of mine (Steve on this site) and he had never had an issue either. Lot's of people shoot Wolf, it's dirty but it works.
after reading in the "kaboom"thread that steel cased ammo leaves stuff in the chamber, none for me. i also had never heard of a "carbon ring" in front of the chamber, but, the guys i always shot with were service rifle shooters and we used 69-77 smk's. i still have 1500 rounds of 69smk loaded, mostly with varget, some imr 4895, some aa2520. i was a tad bit leary of shooting this in a carbine [no cannelure], but now i will before i shoot any el-cheapo deluxe.
I doubt the Wolf ammo scratched your feed ramp. Send your Wolf to me, my Colts have fired over 5,000rds of it over the years and I haven't had a single issue. I don't shoot near as much as a buddy of mine (Steve on this site) and he had never had an issue either. Lot's of people shoot Wolf, it's dirty but it works.
ive fed all of my dozen or so ARs that i have built over the years a 95% diet of steel cased wolf to the tune of probably about 45K rounds.........
never once seen a gouged feed ramp.
this was a brand new upper and the gouge was not there B4 the Wolf round got jamed ..
something is out of spec with your set up, or your mags. a properly spec'd AR will never let any part of the cartridge touch the aluminum portion of the ramps.
new Labell mag that worked with XM193 ,upper was brand new BCM middy and after being cleared of the jam functions perfectly with the same mag and FedXM193 . the bullet was set back on the wolf ,but pushing it out could have done that . and the feed ramp was perfect B4 the wolf . :mad: It was with out a doubt the ammo ,there is absolutely no question about it . the rifle and mag are perfectly in spec ,it was the Shitty Wolf ammo . it is 6 years old and the new stuff may be ok but this batch is bad ,I should have dumped it a couple of years ago when it jamed up my LMT.
HolyRoller
09-15-08, 21:19
I have an AK47 and I am considering running wolf in it being that it has more tolerance for bad ammo. I'm not sure yet though, at 1/5 the price it is very tempting; even after what I have been through and hearing your story :o
That's like saying "I have a diesel truck and I'm considering running diesel fuel in it because it has more tolerance for bad fuel." Diesel fuel is GOOD fuel, for diesel engines. What does the Russian army issue for its troops? (I dunno, really, but I'd guess it's steel case.) Could it be the Russians know what actually works in AKs? Could it be that AKs were designed and developed around steel cases? Has ANYbody ever heard of steel cases causing any problems in AKs?
Blankwaffe
09-15-08, 21:25
Was the Wolf ammo in question Hollow points and copper washed steel jacketed bullets by chance?
Has anyone try these out yet? These seem to work well for me.
http://www.ammoman.com/images3/223R55FMJ-2.jpg
RogerinTPA
09-16-08, 17:51
I've fired all the Wolf and Barnaul out there (approx 9K through 2 rifles). No problems except one stuck case, and that was due to a worn extractor, for more than 2K with wolf between cleanings (initially, i thought it was due to lack of cleaning).
Is it possible the feed ramps on your upper were cut at the wrong angle to cause bullet set back and gouging?
Are others with this middy experiencing this with any ammo?
Are the mags Mil Spec or hi enough? (Different than other mags, a defect in that mag, etc...in some way?)
IT IS A BAD BATCH OF AMMO ,simple as that . rifle and mag are fine . :mad:
bullitt5172
09-16-08, 19:11
Has anyone try these out yet? These seem to work well for me.
http://www.ammoman.com/images3/223R55FMJ-2.jpg
Good stuff, it's the same as the black box nowadays....works 100% for me.
Blankwaffe
09-16-08, 19:17
IT IS A BAD BATCH OF AMMO ,simple as that . rifle and mag are fine . :mad:
Just curious ,is the bullet copper jacketed or bi-metal/steel copper wash on the wolf you have?
If you have a bunch of the ammo on hand call Wolf and tell them to pick the remaining ammo up and to give you a refund.
I had a bad case of 7.62x39 that was so weak it would not cycle the AK's bolt at all.Called wolf and they sent a call tag and a check.
Ive not had any problems with the older Wolf 223 Rem I have...but my experience has only been with the older lacquer cased 62gr. FMJ from around 2001.Ive still gota couple cases of that remaining.That ammo uses actual copper jacketed bullets(excellent quality bullets IMHO) and no red case mouth sealer. Has been 100% so far and pretty darn accurate.
Do I plan to buy any of the newer stuff? NO.
The new polymer coated cases and the reintroduction of the bi-metal/steel jacket bullets and the red case mouth sealer are deal breakers for me.IMHO the Wolf ammo has gotten even cheaper than it was in quality with these features.
My last ammo order was Fed. XM193C from midways sept sale,and Im sticking with it and my favorite Black Hills.
"...there is absolutely no question about it . the rifle and mag are perfectly in spec...
OK, what are 'specs'? I'm not defending Wolf ammo - far from it. But, since we're about facts here, help us out. Some of us would like to know the 'specs' that led to this, be it on the weapon or ammo. Be specific - give us some measurements. If you knew the ammo was a problem, why use it? Ship the ammo to one of us; we'll be glad to shoot it & report back. Thanks.
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