Terminal Effects between 75gr Hornady, 77gr Noslers and 77gr SMK?

[friendlyfireisnt]

I've already selected a good primary defensive load for my carbines (Federal Fusion, for it's accuracy, terminal effect, and that it's factory ammo), and have been stocking up on that for a while. Have several hundred rounds stashed at this point, and that's what's in most of my carbines.

But I am looking to stock up on a secondary supply of hand loads. These are also going to be primary target fodder for my 18" precision oriented rig and 16" lwt precision rig.

I'm using MarkM's H322 load, which is giving me solid accuracy. Based on my dope data, I should be right about 2,700 FPS out of my 18" barrel, 2,650 from a 16".

All three bullets are shooting with similar accuracy, with a test yesterday showing a slight preference for the 75gr Hornady's over the 77gr Noslers (didn't load any SMKs for that outing.)

Of the three, which has the best terminal ballistics, taking into account distance as a factor.

[markm]

First... thanks for the load use. ;) (you can go hotter with the H322, but we keep it at 21.6-21.8)

Anyway, I think they all offer great frag. But it's been reported (and my unscientific water jug tests showed the same) that the Noslers have a slightly thinner jacket, and frag more dramatically.

Combine that with the price difference, Nosler is a no brainer. I'd shoot/stock up on ANY of the bullets with the price being the determining factor.

[friendlyfireisnt]

First... thanks for the load use. ;) (you can go hotter with the H322, but we keep it at 21.6-21.8)

You got it. You came up with a solid load with that one, would never had thought to use that with heavies. Wish I had some wolf primers to try, but for now the BR4 are doing well.

BTW, do my velocities match up with what you are seeing. I don't have a chrono, so I am doing the JBM calculations (2,000 pressure Altitude, 60f, etc), a 16" barrel I am getting 1.3mil @ 300 yards, 2.4mil @ 400 yards with the 77gr Noslers. 18" I am getting 2.2mil @ 400y.


Anyway, I think they all offer great frag. But it's been reported (and my unscientific water jug tests showed the same) that the Noslers have a slightly thinner jacket, and frag more dramatically.

Combine that with the price difference, Nosler is a no brainer. I'd shoot/stock up on ANY of the bullets with the price being the determining factor.

I've read about the Noslers having a thinner jacket and fragging better than the SMK's. Also heard the same about the Hornady's though too.

[friendlyfireisnt]

Well, a little more digging, and I found some info from BTAmmo labs that was posted on TOS. They did some tests on the Hornady 75gr OTM's and the Nosler 77gr loads. Velocities were a bit lower, in the 2550-2650 range, and both performed well.

To quote them:

"These rounds will fragment at MUCH lower velocities than standard M193 or M855 ammunition will, making them suitable for shorter barreled rifles, or for longer distance shots. Both faired very well, and are just about equals to each other, and definitely outperformed our previous M193 experiments and the M855 data that we've seen. However, we both think that the 77gr Nosler has a larger temporary wound cavity than the 75gr Hornady. However, this could have been due to the slightly increased velocity. However, given that the Nosler *slightly* outperformed the Hornady, we would choose the Hornady over the Nosler due to the possible setback issues inherent in non-cannelured rounds."

Looks like I will be loading up the Noslers I have on hand.

[ubet]

I keep the noslers in my 6920. I'll tell you one thing, they are hell on coyotes, porcupines and prairie dogs. I was going to shoot my deer with them this year, but because of extenuating circumstances I needed my precision bolt gun.

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[markm]

You got it. You came up with a solid load with that one, would never had thought to use that with heavies. Wish I had some wolf primers to try, but for now the BR4 are doing well.

Interesting. BR4s shot the biggest groups for me.


BTW, do my velocities match up with what you are seeing. I don't have a chrono, so I am doing the JBM calculations (2,000 pressure Altitude, 60f, etc), a 16" barrel I am getting 1.3mil @ 300 yards, 2.4mil @ 400 yards with the 77gr Noslers. 18" I am getting 2.2mil @ 400y.

I don't have a 400 come up. We just don't happen to have a steel at 400 right now. I know that out of a 20", we get 3.5 mils. At 300 yards, I just hold favor high.

[C-grunt]

I know a M262 out of a 20 inch barrel will still fragment at 410 (+/- 5) meters. Had a dude shot at that range just below the belly button and had two exit wound in his lower back.

[markm]

I know a M262 out of a 20 inch barrel will still fragment at 410 (+/- 5) meters. Had a dude shot at that range just below the belly button and had two exit wound in his lower back.

WTF??? Damn.

By the way. 77 gr TMKs frag like crazy too. Up there with Nosler.

[friendlyfireisnt]

Interesting. BR4s shot the biggest groups for me.


They are right under an inch for me, pretty consistently. The BR4's RL15 and 77SMK's do better, but as you know, the temp sensitivity is an issue. I still want to try the Wolf primers, I just haven't found any nearby to test out.




I don't have a 400 come up. We just don't happen to have a steel at 400 right now. I know that out of a 20", we get 3.5 mils. At 300 yards, I just hold favor high.

I'm hoping that's at 500 yards that you are getting 3.5 mils. According to JBM, 3.5 mils @ 500 yards would be about 2,700 FPS muzzle velocity, at least in my neck of the woods (appox 2,000' PA & 60 degrees F).

[friendlyfireisnt]

I know a M262 out of a 20 inch barrel will still fragment at 410 (+/- 5) meters. Had a dude shot at that range just below the belly button and had two exit wound in his lower back.

Wow, nice. Hopefully that was a bad guy that took the round, and if so, hopefully the gut shot hurt a lot.

[markm]

I'm hoping that's at 500 yards that you are getting 3.5 mils.

Yep. 500.

[friendlyfireisnt]

Yep. 500.

Just making sure.

[ace4059]

The noslers seemed a little more explosive than the smk on animals. That combined with the noslers costing less sealed the deal. I run them hot at around 2800 fps out of my 20"