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hk51pdx
09-16-08, 01:46
In my process of determining what i want in my to-be-built precision rifle, i initially assumed .308 WIN would be my choice. However, i am becoming more intrigued with the .300 WSM for its range, additional energy, and hopefully, accuracy. I don't know of any match loads for it yet, but i suspect someone will produce a capable load (if the current premium hunting loads aren't accurate enough).

Both GA Precision and TacticalRifles.net can build them (i plan on having the rifle built on a Remington 700) but i haven't seen a great deal of feedback from end-users on the .300 WSM. I don't doubt the quality of the rifle manufacturing, i'm simply looking for feedback on this caliber in the role as a precision rifle chambering.

Does anyone have one, or have any comments to offer?

Thanks!

Jim

hk51pdx
09-20-08, 19:04
Does anyone here even own/shoot a .300 WSM rifle - regardless of brand, configuration, or purpose?

Jim

REM
09-20-08, 22:50
A good friend of mine was telling me about a test the Army did with the .300 WSM. His brother was the CO of the AMU at the time. They were impressed with the trajectory and ballistics of the round, but the barrel life was extremely low. Most of the barrels did not last 1,000 rounds before they had to be replaced.

If you plan on shooting a lot of ammo through this rifle that could be an issue.

Aray
09-21-08, 00:02
I have a Browning A Bolt Stainless Stalker in 300WSM. I am satisfied with it. It is reasonably accurate for a factory gun, it hits like a truck (deer have no chance), and recoil is managable even in the light configuration I have. I'm using a Vari X III Leupold 3.5-10 optic with Double Dovetail mounts, and the setup has withstood the rigors of Adirondak hunting very well

What else would you like to know?

On edit: I have been using Win Supreme Accubond 180 gr ammo, accuracy is not great but very good for a hunting rifle to 400m. I can tell you that my Winchester Model 70 in .30-06 is more accurate when using Federal Pemium with the Barnes Triple Shock X-bullet. But as far as the inherent accuracy of the 300 WSM round I am not qualified to say.

hk51pdx
09-21-08, 12:53
I KNEW some people around here had to have some thoughts on this!

Some of the more respected precision bolt rifle manufactures offer a .300 WSM version, and they offer some very specific statements about the accuracy of their rifles (generally anything .30 caliber or less). So i would assume the .300 WSM has the potential for great accuracy but i was interested in hearing from anyone who actually bought one of these rifles, in this caliber, to know how happy they are with the decision, etc.

I am a little concerned about REM's comment regarding barrel life - definitely something to bring up with the manufactures as i proceed. Aray, thanks for your info. I would likely use a similar scope, and i like Federal ammo, so that's what i would start out with.

Thanks.

Jim

heijutsu
09-21-08, 20:47
I should be getting my M40-A5 in 300WSM from TacticalRifles in about 2 weeks. You should check out the following link: http://www.tacticalrifles.net/caliber_300_wsm.asp

Aray
09-22-08, 16:49
I KNEW some people around here had to have some thoughts on this!

Some of the more respected precision bolt rifle manufactures offer a .300 WSM version, and they offer some very specific statements about the accuracy of their rifles (generally anything .30 caliber or less). So i would assume the .300 WSM has the potential for great accuracy but i was interested in hearing from anyone who actually bought one of these rifles, in this caliber, to know how happy they are with the decision, etc.

I am a little concerned about REM's comment regarding barrel life - definitely something to bring up with the manufactures as i proceed. Aray, thanks for your info. I would likely use a similar scope, and i like Federal ammo, so that's what i would start out with.

Thanks.

Jim

I have seen graphs of barrel life for a 300wsm somewhere, as I understand it, barrel life will reduce as more powder is burned/pressures go up. So it is the nature of the beast that a Magnum round will consume barrels more quickly than say a .308. This is conjecture only.

Abraxas
09-22-08, 17:29
I have a .300 WSM. It is not any kind of tactical/ combat set up, but it does a hell of a job on the deer that I have shot with it. All in all I am happy with the round.

yrac
09-22-08, 20:29
I have seen graphs of barrel life for a 300wsm somewhere, as I understand it, barrel life will reduce as more powder is burned/pressures go up. So it is the nature of the beast that a Magnum round will consume barrels more quickly than say a .308. This is conjecture only.

Regarding barrel life, let me first qualify my statements... I do not own a precision gun in any of the magnum rounds. I shoot .308 exclusively, and have not put enough rounds through my rifle to cause a degradation in accuracy. (Well into the thousands with a .308.) Having said that, I have spoken to quite a few folks who are in the business of either building precision guns or using them as part of their jobs. The general consensus from these folks seems to be that the barrel of a gun chambered in .308 typically outlasts a .300 Winmag gun by a factor of 3-4 times. I know that this doesn't specifically address the .300 WSM, but it gives a useful comparison of barrel life between a .308 and one of the .300 mags.

I recognize that there are legitimate reasons for stepping up to the .300 mags and larger, so the statements above aren't meant to invite debate as to which is "better." Perhaps someone else has some direct experience and can add to the above information?

hk51pdx
09-22-08, 22:27
Thank you for your information, yrac. It certainly seems that barrel life is a legitimate issue/concern for anyone interested in magnum calibers. I'm a huge fan of the .308 Win as well as the .243 Win and the step up to a magnum is new to me.

However, i am beginning to think that staying with .308 might be my best course of action (i have a hunting .308 and a fast gun .308, but nothing to drive tacks...). I will never shoot enough to wear out the barrel, but the issues raised here point out meaningful differences between magnums and non-magnums.

Thanks to everyone who replied.

Jim

REM
09-23-08, 21:40
hk51pdx,

Please don't let my comments discourage you. The reduced barrel life is part of the nature of the beast. While I don't own a .300 WSM, I do have a .300 Win Mag and used to own a 7mm Rem Mag. I would imagine the WSM would act just like the other mag cartridges. I have seen rifles in the various magnums exhibit major throat erosion, but still shoot to most acceptable accuracy standards.

If you have a burning desire to own the WSM, try handloading it down to a lower pressure level for most of the shooting. Record your scope dope in your data book and just make the adjustments to compensate for the different loads.

I think one of the keys to shooting the more powerful cartridges is to run the rounds over a chronograph at set times. I run my .308 over the chrono about every 300-400 rounds. In my experience this will show the wear on the barrel well before the accuracy begins to drop off.

Remember, the test I mentioned in my first post was performed by the AMU. They probably have much higher standards than the majority of us.

I have seen a lot of .308 rifles come through the sniper classes my agency puts on. Even though a lot of the rifles have high round counts (and pretty low velocities) they still perform to the level needed for the course. I think the .308 is one of the more forgiving rounds in this regard.


Hope this helps.

zac4551
09-24-08, 10:32
I owned a 7mm WSM and nearly bought a FN in 300wsm but the barrel life and recoil made me go with the 308, because I can go and shoot a 100rds in a day at the range and that means I would be replacing the barrel in the WSM every couple of months.

ra2bach
09-24-08, 11:12
a question on the barrel life of the 300WSM. has it been shown that it would be any worse than the .300 WinMag? it uses less powder so it should be easier on a barrel than that, right?

regarding the Mag vs. .308 discussion. the magnum provides a performance advantage over the .308 and sometimes you don't NEED that advantage but sometimes you do.

in that case, the decision to use one should not be made by comparison of barrel life but by the intended application, correct?

however, it is never wrong, IMO, to own a caliber (or firearm) simply because you want to. :D

zac4551
09-24-08, 12:11
I would think that they would be close on barrel wear. I think the WSM will probably wear a little faster compared to the 300 mag.

ra2bach
09-24-08, 13:44
I would think that they would be close on barrel wear. I think the WSM will probably wear a little faster compared to the 300 mag.


why would that be? the WSM uses less powder.

yrac
09-24-08, 19:16
...in that case, the decision to use one should not be made by comparison of barrel life but by the intended application, correct?

Absolutely. I made an assumption (maybe incorrect) that the OP would be using the rifle for general recreational shooting as his only precision gun. In that case, the .308 might be a better choice. However, if there's a need for the enhanced performance of the mag round, if he's already got a .308 or if he just plain wants a .300 WSM, then fire away! Based on my assumption that he does not own many other precision guns, I thought it might be useful to know something about the differences in barrel life. For someone with a hunting rifle who only shoots a few boxes of ammo a year, it's no big deal. As you start getting more into precision shooting and go through a few hundred rounds in the course of a day of shooting, you start getting into potentially costly barrel replacements in relatively short order with the mags compared to the .308. (Of course, if you can afford the cost of that much good precision ammo these days, maybe the cost of a barrel replacement isn't such a big deal...:D)


...however, it is never wrong, IMO, to own a caliber (or firearm) simply because you want to. :D

Never wrong at all!

zac4551
09-26-08, 12:02
With varget and a 168gr buller there is only a .5 grain difference in max load, the 300wsm has a faster velocity than the 300 wm.

ra2bach
09-26-08, 15:21
With varget and a 168gr buller there is only a .5 grain difference in max load, the 300wsm has a faster velocity than the 300 wm.
interesting. I was never aware that the WSM was capable of greater velocity than the original WM.

and I never would have guessed Varget to be an efficient powder in any magnum. the .300Win Mag likes powders starting at 4350 and slower. Varget is somewhat faster than that.

zac4551
09-26-08, 16:11
I liked 4381 in my 7mm WSM.

ra2bach
09-26-08, 17:00
I liked 4381 in my 7mm WSM.

yep, seems like that would work. I like RL 19 in my .280 with bullets up to about 140 gr. and H4831SC with the 154 and 160 gr.

my 7MM Rem Mag loves the old H4831 but I understand I can get a few more fps with a couple of the newer powders. I don't do much with the newer powders as I tend to stick with something if my rifle likes it even if I give up some speed doing so.

My pistols love the Vihta Vouri powders, though...

Ttwwaack
10-13-08, 01:58
The 300 WSM is be used by more bullet manufacturers now to test the heavier bullets because of its inherit accuracy. From what I remember, Nosler is using 308 Win for 150 and below and 300 WSM for 165's on up. They are also using the 338 L for 338 batch testing over the 338 WM/RUM.

The question is how far do you plan on shooting. Once the 308 Win goes subsonic 850-1000 (depending on barrel length) you might as well be throwing rocks. That is where the 30-06 and mags come into play.

Billjennings
10-22-08, 22:46
I find the 300WSM a bit finicky to reload. Full length sizing and bumping back the shoulder one to two thou' each time is hard on the brass. But I suppose the web of the 300WM just above the belt will give you about the same amount of firings.

I'm slinging 175 SMKs @ approx. 3040 fps from my WSM and in my 300WM, 190 SMK loaded to A191 specs.

A ballistic program will tell you that these loads are pretty similar.

Bill

heijutsu
10-24-08, 11:10
Edited by YRAC. Not relevant to the original question about the performance of the .300 WSM in a precision rifle.

Falconry
12-16-08, 00:40
I'm using a Browning A-Bolt Stainless Stalker for hunting, and though I haven't gotten anything with that round it is fairly reliable for what I have to do.

I've started with 165 grain Barnes TSXs and did OK for me after initial break in. I shifted around a little bit because those projoes are pricy. I can get 100 Hornady 165s for price of 50 Barnes or Nosler. Even shifting from the Nosler (which were slightly tighter than the Barnes) I'm able to put 4 shots within 1.00" at 100 yards, gun probably shoots a little better if I were more into bench equipment.

I hear that 180 grain bullets might be better than the 165.

I load the 165 SSTs over 64.4 grains of H414,CCI mag primers and Remington brass. RCBS equipment and then get a little of the lands. I hear that some rifles have different throat configurations so my length won't match anyone else.

Again, I'm happy with 4 shots under an inch without trying too hard. If I get a solid rest and maybe some more tweaking and messin I might get even better. I do need to try IMR 4350 with the next loading cycle, especially if I go up to 180 grain pills.

I think 165 through 200 grain bullets are in the sweet spot. The 200 might be too long for the normal barrel twist and compacted powder loads. 200 grainers put a lot of the bullet into the case's capacity. That might be acceptable with Berger or other VLD bullets.