Thought Experiment: what would be the toughest AR configuration?

[The Dumb Gun Collector]

Hey guys,

If you were going to configure an AR for long term durability, how should you do it? You can think of it terms of "doomsday" or Mad Max or "SHTF" or whatever. This would be a personal rifle that would need to function in the maximum number of environments with a focus on realistic portability and EXTREME long term durability.

I'll start....


1. Mil-spec pencil barrel carbine. H buffer. Birdcage.
2. Keep the Carbine or M4 Hand-guards. These things are durable, and they don't get as hot or cold as metal rails. Further,
3. Here is where I will probably be booed...an A1 upper with carry handle. I know Aimpoints last 4-8 years, blah blah. Obviously fixed
4. Maybe a 1.5-3 power ACOG on top of the carry handle.
5. A1 or other fixed stock. Perhaps with trapdoor for cleaning kit.
6. A2 grip. I can't think of a tougher grip.
7. Classic built in sling rings. No QD.
8. Some sort of removable light mount for the front sight post. Maybe the impact weapons Scout mount.


Where did I go wrong?
Should it have a medium contour barrel?

Is there a durable fixed stock?

Perhaps a chromed bolt carrier?

Chrome all steel parts including the exterior of barrel? Maybe nickel?

[Doc Safari]

I would think an ACOG mounted to the receiver rail would make the carry handle unnecessary. Perhaps there could be a way to make the ACOG integral with the upper receiver, and have its own emergency iron sights.

I like the Midwest Industries rail for the FSB to act as a light mount. I use them all the time and they are plenty resistant to impact.

I'm all for iron sights. In fact I keep a carbine in "irons only" and a carbine in "ACOG only" at all times.

I just don't like trying to mount an optic on top of a carry handle. Worst of both worlds.

[Outlander Systems]

Theoretically:

1. SOCOM Barrel - Nitride
2. Geissele MK4/8
3. Booooo. ACOG
4. See above
5. Magpul SL / BCM Gunfighter / Magpul UBR
6. Literally any grip
7. QD.
8. Arisaka

NP3 / NiB / Nitride BCG for corrosion prophylactics.

[Koshinn]

So basically you're almost making an M-16 variant with a mix of A1 and A2 parts, and adding an ACOG on top and light on the FSP.

I was thinking along the same lines when I read your thread title.

But now, I'm basically thinking a SR-15 e3 mod 2 is where I'd start. Add a TA33 ACOG, a Surefire M600AA (because AA batteries), probably a Magpul STR on the back and MOE SL pistol grip. Maybe some light rail guards depending if it's keymod or m-lok.

[Outlander Systems]

RE: QD cups.

If things ever went full Mad Maximum, I would guarandamntee you duck tape will still be available...somewhere.

And, yes, it's duck tape.

[The Dumb Gun Collector]

My thinking with the ACOG is when you finally trash it or drop it and you are concerned about lost zero you can just lanyard it as a monocular. You will still have the A1 sights.

[Pappabear]

Colt or LMT monolithic Upper
LMT SOPMOD stock
built in Offset BUIS
Noveske 14.5 barrel Double CL
ACOG 3.5 X 35
AAC Mini 4
LMT MARS lower
Vltor offset mount for surefire light
SSA trigger
Vltor A5
LMT Enhanced BCG

[Firefly]

My idea:

A C7 Clone.

Rifle gas
A1 Stock
A1 grip
A1 carry handle
govt barrel
A 2-7x scope with TMR
An NP3 BCG
and a Bag full of 20 round mags.

I can do pretty much anything. I want the 'DOS/Command Line Interface' of AR-15s.

Dumb, stupid, simple.

I want rifle gas because it tends to be less wear.

Some may want a shorter gun but if necessary, I could fix a bayonet.

Bammo, instant spear.

ETA and some spraypaint

[Eurodriver]

My idea:
I want the 'DOS/Command Line Interface' of AR-15s.

Dumb, stupid, simple.

I want rifle gas because it tends to be less wear.

Some may want a shorter gun but if necessary, I could fix a bayonet.

Bammo, instant spear.

ETA and some spraypaint

That's not your idea. That's mine!!!

P.S. You're wanted by OS here (https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?182797-Night-Vision-Rig-Assistance-requested&p=2431596#post2431596).

[fallenromeo]

Colt or LMT monolithic Upper
LMT SOPMOD stock
built in Offset BUIS
Noveske 14.5 barrel Double CL
ACOG 3.5 X 35
AAC Mini 4
LMT MARS lower
Vltor offset mount for surefire light
SSA trigger
Vltor A5
LMT Enhanced BCG

Beat me to it. If absolute strength is a factor, can't do much better than a monolithic upper.
As for stock, wouldn't the weakness be in the RE since that is really the part that might break? If I have that right, they should all be pretty much the same, just preference. I would do a Vltor A5 with the new UBR2
Magpul Pro flip up rear and FSB with Aimpoint
Centurion Arms 16" middy CHF barrel
Surefire Socom MB and mini can. (only a pipe dream since I am in CA, but whatever)
BCM lower
SD-C trigger
Raptor Charging handle and Sionics NP3 BCG
Surefire weapon light

That's just how I would do it. I think everyone here has pretty solid ideas as to what works for them.

[Rogue556]

I'd start with a Colt 6920 with a 14.5" SOCOM barrel, and would add the following:

Daniel Defense RIS II FSP rail

Magpul UBR (With Impact Weapons CSAP sling mount for use with HK hooks and other sling mounts)

BFG VCAS padded sling with universal wire loop attachments

Gear Sector loop sling mount

LMT fixed rear sight (chopped carry handle)

Aimpoint Comp M4S in a lower 1/3 American Defense QD mount

Surefire M600 Ultra in a Gear Sector offset mount.

Tango Down stubby VFG

A2 flash hider (or Surefire flash hider if suppressed)

H2 buffer and Sprinco spring (or Geissele Super 42 buffer and spring - H2)

Geissele Trigger

Magpul aluminum trigger guard

BCM mod 3 grip

It would be a heavy setup for sure, but you could beat a rhinoceros to death with it should you run out of ammo.

Sent from my SM-N910P using Tapatalk

[BrigandTwoFour]

It's funny that this came up now, because it's almost exactly what I've been working on. My goal was a stupid simple, lightweight, and functional rifle.

This is what I ended up with:

https://everydaymarksman.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/mockup.jpg

The only trade off I made from the original concept was a flat top upper instead of fixed carry handle with A1 sights. My optics collection, which includes ACOGs, just wouldn't let me preclude them as an option.

Faxon 18" Gunner
Pinned FSB (well...almost, I need to send it off for pinning still)
ALG ACT
Rainier receivers (tightest damn fit I've ever seen)
BCM BCG
Magpul furniture, except for the rubberized grip which is Hogue

[TacMedic556]

Hammer forged Barrel 16" Daniel Defense or BCM. If non CHF - Colt SOCOM
Geissele MK4 Rail or Daniel Defense RIS II Rail
VLTOR MUR Upper Receiver
BCM BCG
Geissele SSA
Trijicon ACOG
KAC Irons
Any Grip
BCM Stock (not picky on stock)

[SeriousStudent]

It's funny that this came up now, because it's almost exactly what I've been working on. My goal was a stupid simple, lightweight, and functional rifle.

This is what I ended up with:

https://everydaymarksman.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/mockup.jpg

The only trade off I made from the original concept was a flat top upper instead of fixed carry handle with A1 sights. My optics collection, which includes ACOGs, just wouldn't let me preclude them as an option.

Faxon 18" Gunner
Pinned FSB (well...almost, I need to send it off for pinning still)
ALG ACT
Rainier receivers (tightest damn fit I've ever seen)
BCM BCG
Magpul furniture, except for the rubberized grip which is Hogue

I actually have something similar to that. A buddy gave me an old Colt 20" barrel he had. I ended up putting the MOE rifle furniture and a carry handle on it, and the silly halberd is a lot of fun to teach iron sights with.

It also attracts former jarheads quicker than cheap whiskey and young redheads.

[markm]

Definitely no skinny barrels or optics AT ALL. A3 SOCOM barreled M4, A3 20" AR-15, or a Dissipater 16" Middy. I guess if you have a quick detach RDS, you can remove it when it gets knocked out of zero or breaks. But a cutdown carry handle is a must if you don't have the full carry handle. Nothing else comes close in durability.

I haven't broken a KAC RAS or an M5 RAS.... so I'd be comfortable with those for light mounting.

[_Stormin_]

This is a tough one for me, because in the name of "toughness" you have to make some trade offs in the rifle being compact and easier to use in a bad scenario.

My ideal SHTF gun is an 11.5 SBR (maybe even a 300 BLK 9") with a can and an Aimpoint PRO, but I plan on the sh!t being cleaned off the fan, and things returning to something close to normal at some point in a couple of weeks or months.

My ideal TEOTWAWKI gun is an A2 configuration rifle, with an NP3 BCG and an ACOG on top of the carry handle. Thing will shoot until I can't find ammo. It's not quite as concealable as an SBR should I need to stash it, and slightly less mobile side to side, but the gas system mitigates some wear, the optic will let me effectively engage targets at distance, and the bayonet mount is still there just in case (firefly had this one nailed). The fixed stock is also a risk mitigator, and there would be a big ol' bottle of lube in the trapdoor.

Thankfully, I have all this covered in my safe right now.

[The Dumb Gun Collector]

What about an 11.5 Colt Commando with an A1 carry handle upper and a DD MK18 RIS 2 Rail? Then you could run a T2 in an offset rail all the way at the back of the rail near the carry handle. If you get lost on a desert island you can eventually take it off. I still vote for a shorty stock to protect the receiver extension as much as possible (and maybe offer some storage for cleaning kit). It would be handy but you would be deaf as Hell if you ever fired it!

[_Stormin_]

What about an 11.5 Colt Commando with an A1 carry handle upper and a DD MK18 RIS 2 Rail? Then you could run a T2 in an offset rail all the way at the back of the rail near the carry handle. If you get lost on a desert island you can eventually take it off. I still vote for a shorty stock to protect the receiver extension as much as possible (and maybe offer some storage for cleaning kit). It would be handy but you would be deaf as Hell if you ever fired it!
Maybe some ear plugs in the grip cavity... :-)

[GrumpyM4]

Problem solved, problem staying solved. (http://soldiersystems.net/2013/03/30/canipe-correspondence-retiring-my-416/)

Only changes I would make would be to use a 14.5 inch barrel version (which is even less harsh on the system then the 10.5 with no vent gas block as the one in the article), a solid A1 length stock (or equivalent magpul offering, etc., as solid stocks are more durable then a collapsible stocks) and those sprinco extra power springs that are supposed to last over 100k rounds. Also stick with the HK style drum and HK front sight are durable as hell and don't have a flip system to cause issues.


If the ultimate goal is longevity, then weight becomes less of an issue as durability becomes the primary focus.

[GrumpyM4]

I haven't broken a KAC RAS or an M5 RAS.... so I'd be comfortable with those for light mounting.

I've seen a lot of these broken.

I'd stick with a very solid one piece free float system. One of the older versions, not one of the newest gen super lightweight types. Yes, more weight, but more durable in the long run.

[BrigandTwoFour]

I didn't post it above, but my favorite rifle is the one that has evolved the most over my shooting "career." It's a 20" gov't BCM upper on an A5 equipped lower. I have a DD Omega 12, but would probably switch to a Centurion C4 for this thought experiment. Rather than the EMOD it's ridden with for the last couple years, I would use the new UBR 2.0 whenever it gets released. Top it with an Acog and call it done.

I get the desire for SBRs, but having never been taught CQB tactics, I tend more towards "rifleman" territory and much prefer the ballistic advantages offered by longer barrels.

[Nightstalker865]

Hammer forged Barrel 16" Daniel Defense or BCM. If non CHF - Colt SOCOM
Geissele MK4 Rail or Daniel Defense RIS II Rail
VLTOR MUR Upper Receiver
BCM BCG
Geissele SSA
Trijicon ACOG
KAC Irons
Any Grip
BCM Stock (not picky on stock)

Ding ding. We have a winner.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Kain]

First, I like these threads. Gets the mind turning.

Secondly, when you posted the toughest, I think my thought was initially until I opened it as the toughest to build. Don't as me why.

Thirdly, actually on topic. I'd go with an Hbar type barrel for the durability and if need be to use as a pipe to club someone with, if we are talking total madmax shit hitting the fan scenario. Either middy 16 or 20 inch rifle for reduced wear. Solid one piece free float, a la Larue since I have on on hand, idea here being that it is harder to jack up than a standard car handguard and if it does get messed up there should be less likelihood of it bending enough to damage the gas tube. Standard FSB. Here is where I am going to throw a wrench in the system, carry handle or cut down carry handle mounted under the rail and an Acog mounted up top. BOOM! best of everything, albeit a little heavier I've got an optic and Irons, if the Optic takes a dump I can change it out or still use it as a monocular, or use it as a monocular and just run irons. Hey, it an option, if weight isn't a major concern you could get stupid and mount other crap up there other than a light, VQ, sling point, and the spare Irons. Either A1 stock or a sturdy collapsible with storage for lube, maybe small tools or parts. Grip doesn't matter. A2 flashhider. Obviously means of mounting lights is easy with a freefloat quad. Trigger could be anything rugged, SSA is nice, but again I'd probably not care that much as long as rugged and serviceable. I would say hard mounted sling would be a serious choice, QD is nice for some things, but usually for me it is QD for me bouncing it between rifles, not mounting positions.

ETA: I've got an TA01NSN with the irons on top. If anyone is thinking of using them as primary irons if the optics goes down, forget it, they are the epitimany of oh shit sights, I have better luck flipping the rifle to a 45 degree cant and point shooting myself.

[Snipe315]

Hey guys,

If you were going to configure an AR for long term durability, how should you do it? You can think of it terms of "doomsday" or Mad Max or "SHTF" or whatever. This would be a personal rifle that would need to function in the maximum number of environments with a focus on realistic portability and EXTREME long term durability.


Op... you are over thinking it.

1. HK 416
2. HK 416
3. HK 416
4. TA31 ACOG in a good QD Mount (Larue, ADM, BoBro, etc.)
5. SOPMOD Stock or the one the HK416 comes with, both are good and will outlast you
6. HK 416
7. QD Slings are fine and will outlast you
8. Surefire Scout in the appropriate mount (QD or fixed)

[markm]

I've seen a lot of these broken.

I'd stick with a very solid one piece free float system. One of the older versions, not one of the newest gen super lightweight types. Yes, more weight, but more durable in the long run.

Interesting. I do like the apparent toughness of my Geissele Mk 4. I broke/smashed a LaRue 10.0 rail (the front was bent/crushed where you'd put a pic mounted front sight) I'd say Geissele for sure if it was a full quad rail... the pic rails at 3, 6, and 9 are painfully short and have idiotic QD sockets eating up rail space on the sides.

[Novak]

Ding ding. We have a winner.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah, I'm going to +2 that.

[BFS]

no carbine or midlength-

For a Mad Max rifle (as in, NEVER again will you have parts to replace) a rifle length gas is the best option.

Lowest temps and pressures at the bolt = bolt longevity

longest dwell time and less necessary extraction tension = extractor longevity

And then I'd go with a heavy barrel profile for maximum heat absorption potential. Chrome lined.

permanent, pinned irons. Geiselle 15" rail.

A2 extension and buffer.


Id say Colt 20" HBAR with fixed carry handle irons, add a Geiselle rail, magpul MOE rifle stock and pistol grip and call it good.

[Doc Safari]

My thinking with the ACOG is when you finally trash it or drop it and you are concerned about lost zero you can just lanyard it as a monocular. You will still have the A1 sights.

I haven't had the opportunity to test this yet, but I'm wondering if you had an ACOG with a dead tritium element, would the reticle pick up enough light from a really bright tactical light mounted on your weapon that technically the tritium is a luxury? And if so, what are the minimum lumens needed on your weaponlight for the ACOG's fiber optic to pick up the light and be usable at night?

[Kain]

I haven't had the opportunity to test this yet, but I'm wondering if you had an ACOG with a dead tritium element, would the reticle pick up enough light from a really bright tactical light mounted on your weapon that technically the tritium is a luxury? And if so, what are the minimum lumens needed on your weaponlight for the ACOG's fiber optic to pick up the light and be usable at night?

Wouldn't that also be a situation where it going to depend on the environment that you are in though? Like small room with light walls opposed to the middle of the forest might need other output levels? However, on that idea though, a small light taped to the top might work as well. After all duck tape. And small of the low output AAA or AA lights are getting pretty crazy run times.

Second thought, if you down to the tritium being dead chances are that batteries are dead too. Unless with illuminating with torches, like literal fire.

[GTF425]

Using a weapon light with an ACOG gives you a black reticle.

In any lighting where you could see your target well enough to shoot it without NODs, the fiber optic will gather enough ambient lighting to be visible.

*ETA: Never used a WML to engage with an ACOG outdoors beyond 50-ish yards. Indoors, the reticle will black out like pistol sights do.

ACOGs have pretty good glass and the reticle in TA31s was never hard to find even after BNT and not using a weaponlight.

[MSparks909]

I'd buy a 16" KAC SR-15 Mod 2 and throw an Elcan 1-4x on there and call it good. And I'd buy about 20 PMag G3s and ~20,000 rounds. Done.

[GrumpyM4]

Interesting. I do like the apparent toughness of my Geissele Mk 4. I broke/smashed a LaRue 10.0 rail (the front was bent/crushed where you'd put a pic mounted front sight) I'd say Geissele for sure if it was a full quad rail... the pic rails at 3, 6, and 9 are painfully short and have idiotic QD sockets eating up rail space on the sides.

Geisseles aren't exactly super lightweight, much less light weight to begin with. Their 416 rail without any rails is barely lighter then the actual 416 rail and once rail are added for lights, etc, it's just as heavy.

Not sure how that translates into their non 416 rails though.

Regarding broken M4 and M5 RAS handguards, I spent the last 3.5 years in the ME working on mil guns, so yea, I've seen lots of stuff broken that most won't ever see. I'm sure IG has seen similar.

[hypno02]

I'm going with the KISS method on this one. A 6920 with magpul furniture or a Daniel V1 if you need rails. Geissele for a replacement trigger. For a rear iron I'm going with a DD or LMT. Optic's gotta be a comp m4S or MRO.

[C-grunt]

20 inch mid weight barrel with pinned FSB
A1 upper
fixed stock (A1, A2, or Magpul)
Geissele rail
TA33 on the carry handle.

[WS6]

Hey guys,

If you were going to configure an AR for long term durability, how should you do it? You can think of it terms of "doomsday" or Mad Max or "SHTF" or whatever. This would be a personal rifle that would need to function in the maximum number of environments with a focus on realistic portability and EXTREME long term durability.

I'll start....


1. Mil-spec pencil barrel carbine. H buffer. Birdcage.
2. Keep the Carbine or M4 Hand-guards. These things are durable, and they don't get as hot or cold as metal rails. Further,
3. Here is where I will probably be booed...an A1 upper with carry handle. I know Aimpoints last 4-8 years, blah blah. Obviously fixed
4. Maybe a 1.5-3 power ACOG on top of the carry handle.
5. A1 or other fixed stock. Perhaps with trapdoor for cleaning kit.
6. A2 grip. I can't think of a tougher grip.
7. Classic built in sling rings. No QD.
8. Some sort of removable light mount for the front sight post. Maybe the impact weapons Scout mount.


Where did I go wrong?
Should it have a medium contour barrel?

Is there a durable fixed stock?

Perhaps a chromed bolt carrier?

Chrome all steel parts including the exterior of barrel? Maybe nickel?

I kind of did this.

I went with (muzzle to buttstock):

Surefire socom mini suppressor
Surefire closed tine war comp
Constant taper chf barrel made of a steel I'm unable to remember, 14.5, chrome lined, pinned war comp
Magpul mbus pros
4140 nitride gas block
V7 inconel gas tube
Hodge defense wedge lock with a surefire m300 mounted to it.
Hodge defense aluminum lithium forged upper and lower
Leupold mk6 in a geissele mount
Azimuth qpq bcg with a colt ejector spring and jp 1 piece gas ring and Ken Elmoor extractor spring
LaRue s7 tool steel trigger (I hate that man but I love his triggers. Dumped geissele for it, group size vs my super v g trigger dropped 0.25moa)
Ti forward assist, ambitious safety, grip screw, end plate, castle nut, badger barstock bolt catch,
Magpul moe k pg
Norgon ambitious mag catch
Magpul m110 buffer tube and moe sls stock housing a sprinco green spring and a5 buffer
Haley strategic sling with the stupid 1 point adapter removed because I value my testicles.

Anyway, it should hold up pretty well, and was one helluva journey building!

*some may question how I set up my bcg. I didn't just throw random shit at it. Those parts are parts I have plenty of abuse on in other systems and they are the best I've found for the job. It wasn't some misguided search for Gucci bcg accouterments. Note the planejane colt ejector spring. I even t&ed the hk braided ejector. Colt faced better, so it's what I used. Could left the 3 strand hk wunderspring in if cool points was the goal.

Feed it with Gen 3 pmags and .223 gold dot.

Some choices, like mid over rifle gas, and Leupold mk6 over irons, do sacrifice durability, but in a mad max scenario, this is a sacrifice I'm 100% OK with, given the benefits, and the mbus pros are still there...

[Serious Account]

-16 in mid length
-Medium contour CHF Nitrided barrel
-Nitrided pinned gas block
-Nitrided gas tube
-Hodge/Mega Arms rail
-Geissele trigger
-VLTOR A5H1
-Springco green spring
-HK's extended castle nut with steel endplate & staked two spots.
-NP3 Carrier
-LMT enhanced bolt (I'm surprise no one here has mentioned this?)
-Surefire Scoutlight
-ELCAN DR 1-4x
-Troy Battle Sight


If piston is allowed then I'd just pick the HK 416A5 and done!

[Coal Dragger]

I'll play although my opinions are worth what all of you are paying to read them.... not very damn much. So many good off the shelf part solutions have been mentioned that I will go out on more of a theoretical mental exercise limb here where costs are not going to be considered at all.

1.) 18" or 20" medium contour (think M4A1 type contour to the gas block journal), rifle length gas. Cold hammer forged of 9310H steel. Salt bath nitrided and then the bore and chamber shall additionally be chrome lined to M249 specifications. Both salt bath and chrome lining will take place after the gas port has been drilled and after the gas block pins have been fitted. Additional care shall be taken to ensure the gas port is placed perfectly in a grove and not on a land in an attempt to limit the negative affects of gas port erosion on barrel performance. Rifling shall be 5R with a 1:8" twist, chamber in 5.56mm NATO. This should theoretically (in the mind of a non metallurgist or materials scientist) provide for a very tough barrel with good heat handling capabilities and very high resistance to barrel degradation from throat erosion, corrosion, lack of maintenance, and other factors. The rifle length gas system is going to help make for a smoother shooting rifle that is easier on other critical components. On the muzzle I would mount a closed tine Surefire Warcomp or the open tine model, which ever was more effective.

2.) Upper: Monolithic with a few twists that would make it really tough and easy to maintain, but prohibitively expensive to be commercially successful. First of all I would like the fore end of the this monolithic upper to be 15" long and have the whole piece made from a forging of the new Alcoa 2099 Aluminum-Lithium alloy. I will just go ahead and rip off the LMT barrel mounting solution to the upper since it is well proven and works.

Mounting interface 1913 Pic rail on top and on the other 3 sides near the end of the rail for the last 3" or so with the rest in between being M-Loc for more comfortable user interface with the option to still mount stuff, or be covered with gripping surfaces. To improve the durability of the iron sighting arrangement on this this piece the iron sights will be directly incorporated into the upper by machining an integral base for the front and rear sights to mount in. Imagine your favorite flip up rear sight, now just imagine if instead of screwing it onto the upper in a 1913 slot, that the base is literally part of the upper. The rear sight will be a KAC style 100-600M sight with elevation and windage integrated into the rear of the upper where there is normally no 1913 rail slots anyway, and will have provision to be locked in the up or down position. Material will be good quality steel, finish will be salt bath nitride. The front sight will be adjustable for elevation to zero the rear sight elevation wheel, again made of good quality steel, also salt bath nitrided, and able to be locked up or down.

3.) Knights Armament style SR-15 bolt and carrier, with NP3 coating.

4.) Inconel gas block and gas tube, both salt bath nitrided. Gas block pinned in place on the barrel.

5.) Stock will be a fixed A1, A2, or Magpul MOE fixed rifle stock, take your pick based on shooter preference. Rifle buffer with a Geissele Super 42 style braided wire spring for a rifle length extension and buffer.

6.) Grip can be whatever, I'd go for a BCM most likely but take your pick.

7.) Lower receiver forged from Alcoa 2099 and machined with an integral trigger guard large enough to accommodate a gloved hand. I'd spec salt bath nitrided lower parts kit for this and insist again on high quality tool steels. Trigger will be a Geissele SD-C or SSA depending on shooter preference.

8.) Optics would be a tough call on this one. Suitably tough and not dependent on batteries is a must, so a Nightforce NXS 1-4X24 with FC-3G reticle would work, any of the Trijicon ACOG's would be a good choice, as would any of the Elcan optics, and the Trijicon VCOG. For mounting any of these I would eschew QD mounts to try to eliminate complexity and stick with 1/2 nut type mounts from Nightforce or Geissele depending on the optic.

Well there is my unobtanium unicorn rifle. Feel free to pick it apart.

[Outlander Systems]

@WS6 I'm currently gathering parts for my first "from scratch" build.

I've been eying those inconel gas blocks HARD.

[Outlander Systems]

Serious question.

If we're going for no-holds barred, one-and-done, maximum chaos builds here...

Why not go whole hog and Cryo the barrel, bolt, cam pin, BCG, and FCG?

[markm]

Geisseles aren't exactly super lightweight, much less light weight to begin with. Their 416 rail without any rails is barely lighter then the actual 416 rail and once rail are added for lights, etc, it's just as heavy.

Not sure how that translates into their non 416 rails though.

Regarding broken M4 and M5 RAS handguards, I spent the last 3.5 years in the ME working on mil guns, so yea, I've seen lots of stuff broken that most won't ever see. I'm sure IG has seen similar.

Yep. The Geissele isn't classified as light weight to me. But it strikes me that the long barrel nut and beefy hand guard would hold up to decent abuse.

I've broken a LOT of AR stuff, but have yet to bust a RAS. I run them on a lot of guns. I do believe your observations to be true.

[markm]

@WS6 I'm currently gathering parts for my first "from scratch" build.

I've been eying those inconel gas blocks HARD.

What is the appeal? Gas blocks are not hard wear/use items in my experience.

[Bubba FAL]

Pretty much stick with my Colt Match HBAR. Take the Jewell trigger out, put the stock Colt FCG back in, and take the lead out of the buttstock. It's got a pinned FSB on the (replacement) barrel.

I can duct tape a light to the handguard if needed. I've shot matches out to 600 yds with the irons. The Turner M1907 sling is pretty indestructible, too.

It's heavy, but I could buttstroke someone with it without worrying about breaking off the RE.

I've got lighter ARs, but I doubt they'd hold up to abuse like the Colt will.

[turnburglar]

I know it's not some ultra sexy parts list-

But if I wanted my rifle to last 'forever' I'd just make sure I had a spare bolt in my bcm grip, and a cut tooth brush with a 1oz dropper with some motor oil. Same thing I did in Afghanistan. Never had a problem to begin with.


I just don't think society collapsing is gonna be some rolling fulluja style gun fight just to get water for the day.

[WS6]

@WS6 I'm currently gathering parts for my first "from scratch" build.

I've been eying those inconel gas blocks HARD.

I've never seen an inconel gas block. That said, I don't think inconel would benefit a gas-block at all. Just a good quality steel one with QPQ is fine. The QPQ is for rust prevention, mainly.

[WS6]

Serious question.

If we're going for no-holds barred, one-and-done, maximum chaos builds here...

Why not go whole hog and Cryo the barrel, bolt, cam pin, BCG, and FCG?


Cryo of these parts has been shown to work, at least regarding the Bolt. I spoke at length with Joel @ V7 (formerly Noveske) about the trials they did with them, and was very impressed.

The barrel, I would rather not cryo unless it can be done before the barrel extension is placed.

[WS6]

Yep. The Geissele isn't classified as light weight to me. But it strikes me that the long barrel nut and beefy hand guard would hold up to decent abuse.

I've broken a LOT of AR stuff, but have yet to bust a RAS. I run them on a lot of guns. I do believe your observations to be true.

The M5 RAS is not a FF rail, which means that the bolt life will be compromised. I worry more about a bolt than a rail.

[jstalford]

What is the appeal? Gas blocks are not hard wear/use items in my experience.

I feel like he meant tube.

[WS6]

I feel like he meant tube.

In that case, I'd say go for it. I like the fact that inconel is a bit harder than the 304SS tubes I've had, and is ionbonded to boot in the case of V7's tubes. It will keep it from wearing out nearly as fast as my DD gas tube did, and I run the V7 in that gun now, myself. It's worth it not to have the "mushroom" disappear ever 5K rounds or so. Taking off a DDM4 Lite rail is a pain in the dick, IMO

[Todd00000]

I know it's not some ultra sexy parts list-

But if I wanted my rifle to last 'forever' I'd just make sure I had a spare bolt in my bcm grip, and a cut tooth brush with a 1oz dropper with some motor oil. Same thing I did in Afghanistan. Never had a problem to begin with.


I just don't think society collapsing is gonna be some rolling fulluja style gun fight just to get water for the day.

Almost what I was going to say, have a spare BCG and barrel, and the Knights Armament hand guard is very tough, I've seen M4s split apart in IED blast but the hand guard stayed intact. Also know a Soldier who had the rear of his bolt bent in an IED blast, his barrel was resting on the floor board between his legs like most of us do in the TC position.

[Outlander Systems]

Writing is fundamental.

I meant tube.


I've never seen an inconel gas block. That said, I don't think inconel would benefit a gas-block at all. Just a good quality steel one with QPQ is fine. The QPQ is for rust prevention, mainly.

[Outlander Systems]

Roger that. A local company does cryo for all manner of stuff, mostly automotive.

I had dropped off some car parts to get sand blasted, and found out they did cryogenic work as well. At the time I thought about bringing a spare bolt and having them do it just for the giggles and grins.


Cryo of these parts has been shown to work, at least regarding the Bolt. I spoke at length with Joel @ V7 (formerly Noveske) about the trials they did with them, and was very impressed.

The barrel, I would rather not cryo unless it can be done before the barrel extension is placed.

[Eurodriver]

Roger that. A local company does cryo for all manner of stuff, mostly automotive.

I had dropped off some car parts to get sand blasted, and found out they did cryogenic work as well. At the time I thought about bringing a spare bolt and having them do it just for the giggles and grins.

http://www.cherrypoint.marines.mil/News/Article/525524/cryogenics-marines-supply-2nd-maw-with-oxygen-nitrogen/

[feraldog]

greg pretty much described it in the first post

it was my main AR for many years (1981-1996): Colt SP1 Carbine "Commando" w/ 4x ACOG TA01

simple, solid, lightweight, dependable, flexible, functional ultility tool.

even the high-head mount wasn't a problem (with this outfit, i once went ten for ten on 14x16" plate at 600yds standing)

no matter how many fancier ARs i've had since, this is still the one i'd grab first


.

[Outlander Systems]

That's awesome.


http://www.cherrypoint.marines.mil/News/Article/525524/cryogenics-marines-supply-2nd-maw-with-oxygen-nitrogen/

[lysander]

Roger that. A local company does cryo for all manner of stuff, mostly automotive.

I had dropped off some car parts to get sand blasted, and found out they did cryogenic work as well. At the time I thought about bringing a spare bolt and having them do it just for the giggles and grins.
http://www.cherrypoint.marines.mil/News/Article/525524/cryogenics-marines-supply-2nd-maw-with-oxygen-nitrogen/
You do realize there is more the cryogenic treatments than just sticking the part in liquid nitrogen for a few minutes?

You have to cycle between high and low temperatures, if you get the temperatures wrong, there are two possibilities, you do nothing, or you ruin the part.

As to the original question....Just start with a Colt M4, and stay there.....

[Outlander Systems]

I do.

The company I got the sandblasting from performs a 72-hour process on the part being cryo'd.


You do realize there is more the cryogenic treatments than just sticking the part in liquid nitrogen for a few minutes?

You have to cycle between high and low temperatures, if you get the temperatures wrong, there are two possibilities, you do nothing, or you ruin the part.

As to the original question....Just start with a Colt M4, and stay there.....

[Scrubber3]

A simple Colt M4 (or equivalent) with Carry handle and a good ol flashlight. Done.

I do think that the best Rifle for this set up would be the SCAR Platform with an aluminum lower receiver and a sturdier stock. Throw an ACOG or a T-1 on it with a light.

Lots of good ideas going through this thread BTW...

[MistWolf]

What is the appeal? Gas blocks are not hard wear/use items in my experience.

Inconel gas blocks gives the bearer +2 Protection from Undead and causes 5 points of damage per round to any undead creatures within 30 feet, important features to have during the Zombie Apocalypse

[markm]

The M5 RAS is not a FF rail, which means that the bolt life will be compromised. I worry more about a bolt than a rail.

I think the bolt life on FF vs. Non FF is negligible. I think that properly gas porting the weapon is monumentally more beneficial to parts wear, including bolt life.

The only bolt failure I've experienced could be directly blamed on that silly NiB finish.

[MOLON AABE]

• MK 18 upper with FSB.
• FSB Cutout FFH.
• SureFire Mini Socom .30 cal
• Surefire P3X 1,000 Lumen.
• Magpul Pro Rear BUIS.
• Trijicon 1-6X VCOG.
• Colt/BCM/DD/Aero Lower with USGI LPK.
• A5 RE with Tubbs flatwire spring and H-2/3 Buffer.
• Magpul SL pistol grip and stock.
• Blue Force Gear 2 point sling.
• Black windowless M3 PMAGS.
• Complete spare BCG, extra light and batteries, and cleaning kit carried in a pack

Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

[Outlander Systems]

*Only if you roll a 15 or higher on a 20-sided dice.


Inconel gas blocks gives the bearer +2 Protection from Undead and causes 5 points of damage per round to any undead creatures within 30 feet, important features to have during the Zombie Apocalypse

[patriot_man]

Chrome the barrel and BCG. A good hard chrome is more durable than nitride. CHF the barrel.

I have Solidworks models of redesigned M4/M16 components that I'd wage would last multiple lifetimes so long as you keep it protected against corrosion and have a few parts on hand. If I had the money I would start pumping them out but alas that is not the case. :(

[WS6]

I think the bolt life on FF vs. Non FF is negligible. I think that properly gas porting the weapon is monumentally more beneficial to parts wear, including bolt life.

The only bolt failure I've experienced could be directly blamed on that silly NiB finish.

Interestingly, the DSL lubricant that is being tested shows massive increase in bolt life. It is my opinion that if you can remove the axial stresses on the rear "root" of the bolt lugs, the life will significantly increase. This is part of why I like QPQ finished bolts. QPQ produces a measurably lower coefficient of friction against steel, which is to say, a QPQ'ed bolt that is dry, will slide easier against a barrel extension during unlocking, than will a non-QPQ bolt, as the lubricant on these surfaces is quickly displaced by blow-back down the bore, etc. In fact, I am unaware of a single Azimuth QPQ bolt that has broken, and I know of a few with 50k+ rounds on them in everything from 10.3's to 16" carbines. I am aware of them running 10K+ rounds of M855A1 (for those of you who feel like it kills things...). The QPQ bolt, IMO, is a great advancement until the specific DSL that Pic. is playing with is made open source.

[WS6]

Chrome the barrel and BCG. A good hard chrome is more durable than nitride. CHF the barrel.

I have Solidworks models of redesigned M4/M16 components that I'd wage would last multiple lifetimes so long as you keep it protected against corrosion and have a few parts on hand. If I had the money I would start pumping them out but alas that is not the case. :(

This was not my experience with chrome cam pins, which quickly wore through the chrome surfaces, while my QPQ cam-pins with many tens the times of rounds on them still look great, albeit shiny in some areas. Also, chrome on chrome when not lubricated/when lube comes off, has an EXTREMELY HIGH coefficient of friction compared even to an untreated steel on steel interface.

[vicious_cb]

Interestingly, the DSL lubricant that is being tested shows massive increase in bolt life. It is my opinion that if you can remove the axial stresses on the rear "root" of the bolt lugs, the life will significantly increase. This is part of why I like QPQ finished bolts. QPQ produces a measurably lower coefficient of friction against steel, which is to say, a QPQ'ed bolt that is dry, will slide easier against a barrel extension during unlocking, than will a non-QPQ bolt, as the lubricant on these surfaces is quickly displaced by blow-back down the bore, etc. In fact, I am unaware of a single Azimuth QPQ bolt that has broken, and I know of a few with 50k+ rounds on them in everything from 10.3's to 16" carbines. I am aware of them running 10K+ rounds of M855A1 (for those of you who feel like it kills things...). The QPQ bolt, IMO, is a great advancement until the specific DSL that Pic. is playing with is made open source.

Its not exactly top secret information.


http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a587279.pdf

http://homepages.rpi.edu/~galld/publications/PDF-files/Gall-42.pdf

http://homepages.rpi.edu/~galld/publications/PDF-files/Gall-84.pdf

http://homepages.rpi.edu/~galld/publications/PDF-files/Gall-88.pdf

[WS6]

Its not exactly top secret information.


http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a587279.pdf

http://homepages.rpi.edu/~galld/publications/PDF-files/Gall-42.pdf

http://homepages.rpi.edu/~galld/publications/PDF-files/Gall-84.pdf

http://homepages.rpi.edu/~galld/publications/PDF-files/Gall-88.pdf

Interesting. I was not sure it was open source, as I'd not stumbled across it out in the open yet. Good post! I wonder when we will see this on BCG's commercially available.

[lysander]

Chrome the barrel and BCG. A good hard chrome is more durable than nitride. CHF the barrel.

I have Solidworks models of redesigned M4/M16 components that I'd wage would last multiple lifetimes so long as you keep it protected against corrosion and have a few parts on hand. If I had the money I would start pumping them out but alas that is not the case. :(
Ahhhh, no.

Chrome plating is the last thing you what on a fatigue life part like a bolt. One of the reasons the Army stopped chrome plating bolts and carriers

Chrome plating is not conducive to good fatigue life. Chrome plating, by its very nature of application, has micro-cracks in the surface, these are just multiple crack initiation points.

If you really want to improve bolt life, without redesigning the lug geometry, change the heat treatment to use a nitro-carburized surface for better corrosion resistance. Corrosion pitting is the major cause of fatigue crack initiation.

[MistWolf]

*Only if you roll a 15 or higher on a 20-sided dice.

They always find a way to make it difficult to use

[Outlander Systems]

Someone recommend a good:

QPQ/Nitro BCG
QPQ/Nitro SOCOM Middy

[Iraqgunz]

In a perfect world assuming that the item(s) are available.

1. Kino 12.5" length upper with a correctly sized Geissele MLOK rail and MUR upper.

2. NP3 BCG and ambi charging handle (BCM, Geissele, Raptor)

3. Complete lower with FCD options, Norgon ambi-catch, Geissele SSA-E trigger, Vltor A5H4, SOPMOD stock.

4. TA01 ACOG w/ Magpul PRO sights.

5. Silencerco Specwar K with B.E Meyers M249F suppressor mount.

[Averageman]

In a perfect world assuming that the item(s) are available.

1. Kino 12.5" length upper with a correctly sized Geissele MLOK rail and MUR upper.

2. NP3 BCG and ambi charging handle (BCM, Geissele, Raptor)

3. Complete lower with FCD options, Norgon ambi-catch, Geissele SSA-E trigger, Vltor A5H4, SOPMOD stock.

4. TA01 ACOG w/ Magpul PRO sights.

5. Silencerco Specwar K with B.E Meyers M249F suppressor mount.

I think I need a cigarette and a nap now.
That's a sweet sounding carbine.

[Iraqgunz]

I essentially have it, minus the Geissele rail.


I think I need a cigarette and a nap now.
That's a sweet sounding carbine.

[BrigandTwoFour]

I essentially have it, minus the Geissele rail.

Out of curiosity, why the kino? I've long thought that I would go the 12.5" route if I ever wanted to do an SBR, but I have waffled back and forth on the kino vs standard fsb or low pro. I had a hard time justifying the extra weight for any reason other than longer sight radius, which would be less important with a magnified optic on top.

[Furbyballer]

I essentially have it, minus the Geissele rail.
I want to know when sionics will do a rgb 12.5 for my kino build? My centurion will do fine while i wait. I went with the hodge over the geissele and the mark6 over the acog.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[Iraqgunz]

Because I like the additional rail space available that you can't get with an 11.5" carbine set up. The weight is minimal in my book.


Out of curiosity, why the kino? I've long thought that I would go the 12.5" route if I ever wanted to do an SBR, but I have waffled back and forth on the kino vs standard fsb or low pro. I had a hard time justifying the extra weight for any reason other than longer sight radius, which would be less important with a magnified optic on top.

[Turnkey11]

I would think an ACOG mounted to the receiver rail would make the carry handle unnecessary. Perhaps there could be a way to make the ACOG integral with the upper receiver, and have its own emergency iron sights.

I like the Midwest Industries rail for the FSB to act as a light mount. I use them all the time and they are plenty resistant to impact.

I'm all for iron sights. In fact I keep a carbine in "irons only" and a carbine in "ACOG only" at all times.

I just don't like trying to mount an optic on top of a carry handle. Worst of both worlds.

When ACOGs came out in the 90s, they were designed to be mounted to M16A2 carry handles. A sight picture can still be had through the rifles iron sights, through the tunnel in the mount. Not ideal by today's standards, but world's better than the other options we had back then on a fixed carry handle rifle.

For the thread, I'd go with a Colt AR15A4 or 6921 with carry handle and call it a day.

[Firefly]

My Redacted Mad Max gun Mk. II:

I was thinking that an A1 will always have a place but the fixed carry handle seems equally as limiting as it does helpful.

I was thinking that optics of any kind can come and go. So....

18" Noveske with Rifle gas
MUR upper receiver
A1 style Lower with ambi safety/mag
Geissele 15"
UBR
A1 or MOE grip
NP3 BCG
Whatever optic I happen upon but my mainstay will be those Daniel Defense A1s but in an offset, but also able to be mounted normally.

Not too short, not too big.
I still stand by my original but I may need a torch somewhere.

Also a red dot will be quicker than irons.

I lose the bayonet but I pick up more versatility with optics. I would prefer to keep distance if possible.

I'm thinking Book of Eli "This is not your fight" type of maneuvering.

I could go super simple or streamlined.

[feraldog]

When ACOGs came out in the 90s.....

i believe i bought my first one in '87 (has low three-digit serial number and still works perfectly)

[Iraqgunz]

1987 sounds correct.


i believe i bought my first one in '87 (has low three-digit serial number and still works perfectly)

[Turnkey11]

i believe i bought my first one in '87 (has low three-digit serial number and still works perfectly)

Wow, whats the model number on it, TA01 or something different?

[Iraqgunz]

TA01 4x32 was the first one introduced as I recall.


Wow, whats the model number on it, TA01 or something different?

[Biggy]

[QUOTE=Greg Bell;2431581]Hey guys,

If you were going to configure an AR for long term durability, how should you do it? You can think of it terms of "doomsday" or Mad Max or "SHTF" or whatever.



I would probably just get a Hodge Defense Mod 2 carbine (when they become available) and call it a day.

[feraldog]

Wow, whats the model number on it, TA01 or something different?

yep, TA01 was the first, and only ACOG, at the time (but isn't marked on it, just on the box). nice gray/green color, full red crosshairs to 800yds. didn't have a picatinny mount available because picatinny hadn't been invented yet. 123 is the serial number.

[markm]

I would probably just get a Hodge Defense Mod 2 carbine (when they become available) and call it a day.

Ha! I hadn't heard that name in a LONG time.

[Eurodriver]

Ha! I hadn't heard that name in a LONG time.
Me either. Has anyone actually bought one of their rifles?

[Biggy]

Me either. Has anyone actually bought one of their rifles?

Yeah, still vaporware and another year goes by. They are going somewhere, probably has big orders to special ops and law enforcement. Not the be all end all, but they really are built like a brick shithouse. I will probably be in diapers in a rocking chair before they become available.

[eodinert]

What is this 'thought experiment' rifle supposed to be durable for, shooting, or dropping in the rocks? What environment is it supposed to be used in? At what range? An infantryman's rifle, or an IAR (or both?).

I'd build a durable rifle for shooting, pseudo IAR. I'd shoot the hell out of it, see what failed first, then focus my attention there. I would pick a reliable magazine, I would test the shit out of it with my set up. It probably wouldn't be a GI mag. I would determine what ammo I was going to use, and tune the rifle to that ammo. Modern military hardware is not fragile, we don't need to re-invent rifles from 30 years ago.

Mine would probably end up looking like this:

-Barrel: Chrome lined, HF barrel, mid length, 16-ish inches, heavier than an gov profile, lighter than a SOCOM profile, full length tapered.
-Inconel (or other heat resistant) gas tube
-Bolt carrier with optimized cam profile and gas vents
-Bolt with strength enhancements
-A strong rail (with an eye on weight), 11-ish inches in length, probably M-lok, with rail down the top.
-Carbine stock, COTS, military grade, light-ish. LMT SOPMOD perhaps
-The rest of the parts would be military grade COTS with an eye on weight.
-Optics, dot or magnified as needed
-Back Up Sights: Small, simple, light, and folding

[dramabeats]

Me either. Has anyone actually bought one of their rifles?

Yup, a lot of people have. A lot more will when FN releases their Hodge collab.

[MountainRaven]

On a related note: Anyone know if the HK416A5 castle nut is available by itself? It seems to be a commonly overlooked part and something that H&K deemed necessary while developing the -A5 for the KSK.

[The Dumb Gun Collector]

I have no idea which one this is...just found it https://www.hkparts.net/shop/pc/HK416-MR556-Castle-Nut-134p15230.htm


But I think this is what you are really looking for, but I doubt it will fit. https://www.hkparts.net/shop/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=16763

[thebadness]

asking this question so you can further steal peoples ideas for new products huh..

i guess you have to since i'm not saying anything for anyone to steal them from me anymore.

[JSantoro]

Nuh-uh

[SeriousStudent]

asking this question so you can further steal peoples ideas for new products huh..

i guess you have to since i'm not saying anything for anyone to steal them from me anymore.

Dude, if you are going to set up a second account so you can troll, at least make it somewhat different from the account that we just banned.

Now we just perma-ban both accounts.

[MOLON AABE]

Someone recommend a good:

QPQ/Nitro BCG
QPQ/Nitro SOCOM Middy
This...x 1,000.

Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

[Serious Account]

Have a quick question about "Nitriding" the BCG... Since Nitride is a process that change and harden the metal, would a Nitrided BCG puts more wear and tear on the softer aluminum receiver?

[Outlander Systems]

Negative.

A standard carrier has a higher HRc than the aluminum receiver. Once the initial wear is established, the HRc of the carrier should make zero difference.


Have a quick question about "Nitriding" the BCG... Since Nitride is a process that change and harden the metal, would a Nitrided BCG puts more wear and tear on the softer aluminum receiver?

[Outlander Systems]

Relevant reading regarding stocks:

https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?96312-GearScout-Grinder-Buttstock-Bashfest

[TacticalMark]

Have a quick question about "Nitriding" the BCG... Since Nitride is a process that change and harden the metal, would a Nitrided BCG puts more wear and tear on the softer aluminum receiver?

No, with in-spec parts upper receiver wear is minimal regardless of carrier finish.

[TacticalMark]

Back on Topic
14.5" Mid BHF with FSB
Centurion C4 Mid Cutout
SOPMOD Stock
Vltor A5, Sprinco Green
Aimpoint or ACOG
MBUS Pro
VCAS Padded
Surfire or Inforce WML
GemTech Halo

[graffex]

Vltor MUR
Geissele 13" SMR MK8
16" BCM Middy BHF
STR Stock
S&B Short dot
Troy BUS
Vickers sling

[JoshNC]

- Colt 694x pattern midlength handguard upper
- Medium weight CHF chrome lined midlength barrel
- Standard front sight base/gasblock
- KAC E3 bolt
- UBR2 stock with A5 buffer/spring
- ACOG or some yet to be made bulletproof variable optic

[Torquetard]

Lmt mrp (di)
Razor 1-6x in geissele mount
SSA
Underbarrel fleshlight
Offset magpul pros

[SpeedRacer]

As boring as it sounds, and the complete opposite of anything I own...if durability was the one and only primary goal:

Colt 6920 Magpul
DD Omega Rail 7"
H2 Buffer
Aimpoint T2 in Larue Mount
Troy Fixed Rear Sight
Surefire M300 Scout
And a bucket full of spare barrels and bolts.

[TexasAggie2005]

Underbarrel fleshlight

For those lonely nights on the bug out trail? :cool:

[MegademiC]

For those lonely nights on the bug out trail? :cool:

He loves that rifle.

[QuickStrike]

If I were to build a practical AR with high round count usage as 1st priority:

Medium weight CHF chrome lined barrel, mid-length gas port.

Colt BCG

A5 buffer system, maybe with the A5H1 buffer weight.

Standard mil spec upper and lower. Maybe Vltor MUR upper if I wanna get fancy.

I have a centurion barrel with the above specs and a colt BCG, going to build a general purpose carbine with them one day. Maybe with a nice 1-4x or 1-6x.

[og556]

- Medium weight CHF, chrome lined, barrel with mid length gas system with tapered profile
- Colt BCG
- Forged upper and lower
- Mega arms wedge lock rail system

The only issue with this is the only company I know that makes a barrel that is CHF and medium contour is Noveske. Who else makes a CHF barrel with a contour like this ?

[JG007]

Since the bolt is what will fail-

#1 is a KAC SR15 upper (although I would like to use the Geissele MK1 rail, best rail ever!)
#2 is a standard upper with LMT enhanced BCG, maybe the MUR upper

On a Vltor A5 lower (since the BCM doesn't come with the correct buffer weight), although a Geissele SSA would be nice

= ultimate AR

* the new alloy options from companies like V7 could change the choice of receivers and rail, time will tell

[markm]

I don't understand this ridiculous fixation on bolt failure. This thread is bordering on Arftardery with that... and the waterfall of fragile, grabasstic excuses for durable sight systems.

There simply is NOT ONE SINGLE sight system that comes within a mile of the durability of the A2 field sight. NOT ONE.

[JG007]

Since the bolt will probably be the #1 part that determines long term durability, isn't that the first thing that must be addressed?

[MOLON AABE]

Geissele just announced their partnership with a company doing the Army DSL based coatings. Pretty impressive wear characteristics. Rockwell 82 hardness level.

https://youtu.be/YQKBBDWJzx8

Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

[ScottsBad]

Hey guys,

If you were going to configure an AR for long term durability, how should you do it? You can think of it terms of "doomsday" or Mad Max or "SHTF" or whatever. This would be a personal rifle that would need to function in the maximum number of environments with a focus on realistic portability and EXTREME long term durability.........



I'd just take my SCAR 16 out of the safe.

But if it had to be an AR:

1. Vltor upper receiver MUR 1A

2. BCM EMW (Medium weight barrel) 16' mid-length (could use Noveske medium steel barrel which is HF)

3. Noveske Gen 2 lower receiver (forged) because I have a couple of these and they are stout.

4. Colt LPK, ALG trigger, a grip

5. BCM BCG and spare BCM bolt

6. Vltor A5 RE, A5H2 buffer weight, Sprinco Green spring, UBR stock

7. Geissele rail.

8 ACOG

9. Surefire Scout

10. Magpul pro sights

11. Good flash hider

12. Cleaning kit and spare parts kit with FCG springs, hammer, gas rings, extractor springs, extractor and pin, firing pin, ejector and spring, cam pin, firing pin retaining pin, extra complete bolt.

[jstalford]

Could an 18" barrel with fsb be adapted to work with a rifle length LMT MRP upper?


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